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Hijara
Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2008.06.20 12:48:00 -
[1]
Why does EVERY ship have to be nanoed? Seems like i am the only one who pvp's with a zealot going only 256m/s. What happened to large alpha, or good tanks?
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ChalSto
LOCKDOWN.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 12:51:00 -
[2]
Its a good thing. Since everyone nanos their ishtars, zealots, sacrileges, deimos, and munnins IŠve got a salvager in the 6th high-slot of my vaga....
Originally by: Agmar ----------------------------------------------- "The North is so ghey that even the NPCs fly ravens." |
The Tzar
Malicious Intentions Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:11:00 -
[3]
Because nano's are the only ships that can get away from the all too common hotdropping these days.
Introduce mobile cynojammers for HIC's and watch EvE go back to damage dealing rather than trying to avoid combat as a ships primary purpose. __________________________________________
'Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear intelligent until they speak' __________________________________________ |
Ecky X
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:17:00 -
[4]
I smile every time I catch a non-nano ship off a station or gate.
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Suitonia
interimo Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:18:00 -
[5]
Originally by: The Tzar Because nano's are the only ships that can get away from the all too common hotdropping these days.
Introduce mobile cynojammers for HIC's and watch EvE go back to damage dealing rather than trying to avoid combat as a ships primary purpose.
Nice idea. I'd like to see mobile cynojammers, similar to mobile bubbles, anchor it and it prevents caps from cynoing in your grid. ---
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Dalek Commander
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:21:00 -
[6]
Because you can outrun missiles, and make tracking nearly useless when you go fast enough. Combat has broken down to either nano, or blob (remote reppers) in Eve. So gate camps = blob, and roaming gangs = nano.
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Lord WarATron
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:21:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Lord WarATron on 20/06/2008 13:21:53
Originally by: Hijara Why does EVERY ship have to be nanoed? Seems like i am the only one who pvp's with a zealot going only 256m/s. What happened to large alpha, or good tanks?
Because ever since the WCS nerf, people have been looking for a way to PVP while minimising the risk. Currently, a fast nanoship is pretty much invincible if boarded by a competent pilot.
Some extreme nano setups are expensive, but on the other hand, they pay for themselves though reduced shiploss.
--
Billion Isk Mission |
Tenuo
Native Freshfood
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Posted - 2008.06.20 13:24:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 13:24:29
Originally by: Dalek Commander Because you can outrun missiles, and make tracking nearly useless when you go fast enough. Combat has broken down to either nano, or blob (remote reppers) in Eve. So gate camps = blob, and roaming gangs = nano.
I found your clue, you seem to have lost it.
Yes, they can outrun missiles, this is broken, therefore MISSILES should be fixed. I'm a fan of buffing, buffing does not **** people off, it does not screw with months of training and it does not make millions or billions of isk useless.
Second, I think you should go learn about TRACKING and how signature radius affects this. ______________________________________________ Euriti - I'll continue my nerd forum rage! |
Crackzilla
The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.20 14:24:00 -
[9]
Originally by: The Tzar from the all too common hotdropping these days.
Hotdropping isn't that common.
The issue is that nanos are by far the best way to reduce risk. The nano blob is the new blob.
If HICs had mobile cynojammers that would be a massive buff to nano gangs. I would expect to see very large nano gangs with a token HIC for the cynojammer.
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Shigsy
D00M.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 14:34:00 -
[10]
Maybe because its actually slightly fun instead of going 50j in a slow bs gang to find out no one will fight you or just hotdrop you with titans.
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Boz Well
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:11:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tenuo Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 13:24:29
Originally by: Dalek Commander Because you can outrun missiles, and make tracking nearly useless when you go fast enough. Combat has broken down to either nano, or blob (remote reppers) in Eve. So gate camps = blob, and roaming gangs = nano.
I found your clue, you seem to have lost it.
Yes, they can outrun missiles, this is broken, therefore MISSILES should be fixed. I'm a fan of buffing, buffing does not **** people off, it does not screw with months of training and it does not make millions or billions of isk useless.
Second, I think you should go learn about TRACKING and how signature radius affects this.
Sig radius matters, but transversal/distance matters more I think, and nano lets you increase these.
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Tenuo
Native Freshfood
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:16:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 15:16:18
Originally by: Boz Well
Originally by: Tenuo Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 13:24:29
Originally by: Dalek Commander Because you can outrun missiles, and make tracking nearly useless when you go fast enough. Combat has broken down to either nano, or blob (remote reppers) in Eve. So gate camps = blob, and roaming gangs = nano.
I found your clue, you seem to have lost it.
Yes, they can outrun missiles, this is broken, therefore MISSILES should be fixed. I'm a fan of buffing, buffing does not **** people off, it does not screw with months of training and it does not make millions or billions of isk useless.
Second, I think you should go learn about TRACKING and how signature radius affects this.
Sig radius matters, but transversal/distance matters more I think, and nano lets you increase these.
Yes, but you'll light up at a sig radius over 3 time a battleship, about any medium turret will track you and 44% of a megathrons "on paper dps" will hit you when you go 4200m/s with 1300 sig radius, assuming megathron has null loaded. This at 22km. ______________________________________________ Euriti - I'll continue my nerd forum rage! |
TidPow
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:23:00 -
[13]
I'm a noob, could one of you please explain what you mean by "nanoed"?
Thanks, and sorry for sounding stupid.
Tid
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Gavin Darklighter
THE FINAL STAND
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:26:00 -
[14]
We just need a ship with a good tank that can web at range and nano-blobs will no longer be a guaranteed win.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:31:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Shigsy Maybe because its actually slightly fun instead of going 50j in a slow bs gang to find out no one will fight you or just hotdrop you with titans.
This, sadly..
I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them. |
Tenuo
Native Freshfood
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:42:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Gavin Darklighter We just need a ship with a good tank that can web at range and nano-blobs will no longer be a guaranteed win.
they have never been guaranteed win
they aren't
they never will. ______________________________________________ Euriti - I'll continue my nerd forum rage! |
Hannobaal
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:42:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Boz Well Sig radius matters, but transversal/distance matters more I think, and nano lets you increase these.
Actually, sig radius matters exactly as much as tranveersal does. Say you get 50% larger sig radius and 50% higher transversal. It would mean no change to tracking. They just cancel each other out.
As for distance, increasing distance makes it easier to track you (unless you're outside of optimal range).
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:47:00 -
[18]
Originally by: TidPow please explain what you mean by "nanoed"?
Speed tank. Usually a hac/recon cruiser or support with speed related lows, implants (not common), rigs, and a nice mwd. Nano refers to nanofibers which started this craze. If you're not shooting at a pos or running missions *everyone* should be flying nanos by now.
Go faster than 4-5km/s and you'll start to avoid damage. A nano might fly 7-8km/s or 15km/s+ (uncommon, maybe a pimped ceptor). Even flying at a normal 4-5km/s you can avoid most damage and mostly be threatened by another nano or a Rapier/Huginn (also likely nano'd).
Speed is life. Speed is more important than tanking or dps. The goal is to use speed to attack at will, avoid damage, control range, and escape when threatened.
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TidPow
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Posted - 2008.06.20 15:54:00 -
[19]
Edited by: TidPow on 20/06/2008 15:54:38 Wow, thanks for the great response *****zilla.
Speed is life, ok that makes sense.
Now what If I'm in something I want to try to avoid battles in?
Like a Industrial ship, like a mammoth or iteron?
Could I nano that to help me make escape a likelyhood?
Thank you again.
Tid
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Xaen
Caritas.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:02:00 -
[20]
Because it's fun as hell and provides a role for T2 HACs. Plus you can usually get away when it turns into Capitals Ships Online.
Battlecruisers already tank and DPS better than HACs while being cheaper. Take away nano, and you nerf the whole class of ships and the end up in the same boat as assault frigates. Useless except for missions and ratting. - Support fixing the UI|Suggest Jita fixes|Compact logs |
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Call'Da Poleece
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:07:00 -
[21]
Originally by: TidPow Edited by: TidPow on 20/06/2008 15:54:38 Wow, thanks for the great response *****zilla.
Speed is life, ok that makes sense.
Now what If I'm in something I want to try to avoid battles in?
Like a Industrial ship, like a mammoth or iteron?
Could I nano that to help me make escape a likelyhood?
Thank you again.
Tid
On a bog standard T1 industrial (iteron, bestower badger etc) there is no possibility of going fast enough to avoid damnage .... usually people use Blockade Runners as they have +2 warp strength and wehn fitted with istabs, nanos etc can get into warp fairly quick |
Corduroy Rab
Digital Fury Corporation Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:07:00 -
[22]
Its because everyone cool is doing it, you wanna be cool don't you?
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Trojanman190
D00M.
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:12:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Trojanman190 on 20/06/2008 16:15:57
Originally by: The Tzar Because nano's are the only ships that can get away from the all too common hotdropping these days.
Introduce mobile cynojammers for HIC's and watch EvE go back to damage dealing rather than trying to avoid combat as a ships primary purpose.
While hotdropping is an issue I think the bigger issue is the huge roaming blobs. Going out with a small gang for a night of roaming is suicide unless you are nanoed. Tank just flat out does not work in those cases, but nanos would let you get out and fight another day.
I agree avoiding fights are always lame, but so is dieing in a fight you cannot possibly win. I'd prefer to avoid the obvious loldeathbyblob.
Originally by: Tenuo ...quotes...
Yes, but you'll light up at a sig radius over 3 time a battleship, about any medium turret will track you and 44% of a megathrons "on paper dps" will hit you when you go 4200m/s with 1300 sig radius, assuming megathron has null loaded. This at 22km.
Thats part of why I think escaping is far more important than 'speed tanking' If you are in a zealot and you take on a mega you ARE better off fitting a tank orbitting at the same distance... with an mwd and no speed mods you can pulse it to stay out of web range and since you have a tank you can easily tank him... and he will hit less since you sig isn't so huge!
You wouldn't tank your zealot but would instead fit nanoes so that you can get the heck out of there when he calls in 10 more friends.
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Kolwrath
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:32:00 -
[24]
Originally by: *****zilla
Originally by: The Tzar from the all too common hotdropping these days.
Hotdropping isn't that common.
The issue is that nanos are by far the best way to reduce risk. The nano blob is the new blob.
Yeah hot drops aren't that common. That isen't the reason.
IMHO: Nanos are popular because if things go bad you can get away, and moving that fast you are very hard to hit with either missles or guns.
Its all about reduced risk, and having the option to disengage.
Originally by: Chaos Space Marines
Do you hear the voices, too?!?!
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supr3m3justic3
ACE'S OVER 8'S The Kano Organisation
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:44:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Gavin Darklighter We just need a ship with a good tank that can web at range and nano-blobs will no longer be a guaranteed win.
!!!!!!rapier!!!!!!
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Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:51:00 -
[26]
Because generally, the faster ship dictates the terms of the fight.
As a side bonus, you're not really sacrificing tank to do it.
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Sidus Isaacs
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:53:00 -
[27]
I am a noob, can someone define "nano" for me?
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Marcus Druallis
Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:58:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Tenuo Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 15:16:18
Originally by: Boz Well
Originally by: Tenuo Edited by: Tenuo on 20/06/2008 13:24:29
Originally by: Dalek Commander Because you can outrun missiles, and make tracking nearly useless when you go fast enough. Combat has broken down to either nano, or blob (remote reppers) in Eve. So gate camps = blob, and roaming gangs = nano.
I found your clue, you seem to have lost it.
Yes, they can outrun missiles, this is broken, therefore MISSILES should be fixed. I'm a fan of buffing, buffing does not **** people off, it does not screw with months of training and it does not make millions or billions of isk useless.
Second, I think you should go learn about TRACKING and how signature radius affects this.
Sig radius matters, but transversal/distance matters more I think, and nano lets you increase these.
Yes, but you'll light up at a sig radius over 3 time a battleship, about any medium turret will track you and 44% of a megathrons "on paper dps" will hit you when you go 4200m/s with 1300 sig radius, assuming megathron has null loaded. This at 22km.
To be fair though, 4200 m/s is a **** nano speed :/ --
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Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.06.20 16:58:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Gimpb on 20/06/2008 17:00:14
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs I am a noob, can someone define "nano" for me?
In general, a T2 cruiser that goes 3k+ m/s.
Sometimes inties are considered nano as well, they of course make that speed easily but play differently.
Some other ships can also perform in simmilar ways, hurricanes and phoons for example.
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Hannobaal
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.06.20 17:01:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Hannobaal on 20/06/2008 17:01:37
Originally by: Marcus Druallis
To be fair though, 4200 m/s is a **** nano speed :/
Yet not many ships can get there without a hefty investment in ISK or some really nice gang bonuses.
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