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Stetson Eagle
ROC Academy The ROC
12
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Posted - 2012.03.14 21:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
When dust is released, there will probably be a player base spike of dusties willing to test the MMO. Will Eve, with the refined politics and culture, incaptivate the newcomers? Or will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?
It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. Currently the game feels to be polarizing into less players using more alt pilots. How will eve attract and keep new players? Could previously "young" players get dragged into the slow pace of Eve?
A new shard would practically kill the current tranquility and it would undermine the usage of PLEX. But is it the only option at some point? Will there be eve 2.0 - Another New Genesis? I for one would love a reset even if it would mean the new server lasts a few years only. All the friends of mine who would not join a MMO in progress would hop right in and start the race for the galaxy. |
Gilbaron
Free-Space-Ranger Ev0ke
159
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Posted - 2012.03.14 23:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
dafuq ? |
Ai Shun
364
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Posted - 2012.03.14 23:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Stetson Eagle wrote:It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out.
CCP wrote:The meeting ended with some fun data about subscribers GÇô apparently if a user has been subscribed to EVE for three years or more, that user is very unlikely to leave EVE. EVE players are very loyal customers and the time has come for CCP to properly recognize this
Also, in general, fish don't climb trees. The odd one does though. I think. |
Herping yourDerp
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
413
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Posted - 2012.03.15 00:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
stealth console immaturity thread? console players work to be the best, i been here since 09 or so, the skillpoint thing didn't bug me as much as the hurdles of getting in a decent corp when i was new. back ground checks, questions, how many sps do you have, what do you want to do in eve? new people probably don't even know scamming is allowed in the game, heck some might not even know that if you die you lose your stuff.
anyways my guess is many people will try it out, dust is basically free advertising. but i don't think it will be many in terms of amount of PS3's owned. guessing TOPS 200k people will try eve because they saw dust ( assuming its good) 50k or so might sub for at least a month 10k of that will continue to play after. |
Cipher Jones
356
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Posted - 2012.03.15 00:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Every MMO that has been released is aging by definition.
04:25:37 Notify Cipher Jones, criminals are not welcome here. Leave now or be destroyed. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
3430
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Posted - 2012.03.15 00:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Skill point gap is a lie!
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Obsidian Dagger
Nitrus Nine
30
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Posted - 2012.03.15 00:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ai Shun wrote:Stetson Eagle wrote:It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. CCP wrote:The meeting ended with some fun data about subscribers GÇô apparently if a user has been subscribed to EVE for three years or more, that user is very unlikely to leave EVE. EVE players are very loyal customers and the time has come for CCP to properly recognize this Also, in general, fish don't climb trees. The odd one does though. I think.
Case in point: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-488193/The-fish-survive-months-tree.html |
JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
71
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Posted - 2012.03.15 01:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
Obsidian Dagger wrote:Ai Shun wrote:Stetson Eagle wrote:It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. CCP wrote:The meeting ended with some fun data about subscribers GÇô apparently if a user has been subscribed to EVE for three years or more, that user is very unlikely to leave EVE. EVE players are very loyal customers and the time has come for CCP to properly recognize this Also, in general, fish don't climb trees. The odd one does though. I think. Case in point: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-488193/The-fish-survive-months-tree.html
Quote: ...snip... Adaptable: The killifish can alter the way it breathes ...snip... Although the cracks inside logs make a perfect hiding place, conditions can be cramped. The fish - which are usually fiercely territorial - are forced to curb their aggression. ...snip...
Guess it's official then; capsuleers are the killfish of MMO players - although the extent of "adaptable" can be questioned when change's ugly face pokes into existance on the horizon
I suppose that makes hisec the inside of mangoove roots... Glad I live in w-space
I think the real question, is whether we'll be getting much in terms of Dust-mite tears once we start the orbital bombardmints.
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Ganagati
Perkone Caldari State
82
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Posted - 2012.03.15 01:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dust will bring in FPS players. FPS players in EVE probably won't last long. This isn't newbie friendly, is extremely slow paced with no real control over the speed of progression of your character, is blob combat only where individual skill doesn't matter that much and has a very complicated control scheme. We'll end up seeing a spike of "dafuq is this?" messages on forums for a little while and then it'll go back to normal. Proof Titans are rare (just another null battle): http://i.imgur.com/CY6x4.jpg-áBattles in EVE can look kinda silly sometimes, huh? |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
5
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Posted - 2012.03.15 02:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ganagati wrote:Dust will bring in FPS players. FPS players in EVE probably won't last long. This isn't newbie friendly, is extremely slow paced with no real control over the speed of progression of your character, is blob combat only where individual skill doesn't matter that much and has a very complicated control scheme. We'll end up seeing a spike of "dafuq is this?" messages on forums for a little while and then it'll go back to normal.
Somehow I have the feeling most Dust players will actually just be EVE players that happen to have a Playstation. |
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Ai Shun
364
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Posted - 2012.03.15 02:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Heh. Nice find. Glad I did the sane thing and give myself a loophole |
Skydell
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
177
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Posted - 2012.03.15 02:36:00 -
[12] - Quote
As a free game, the population won't be clear.
Alot of it will rely on PUG mechanics. Console games work better if the people playing them can jump in to the thick of it on login. |
Fredfredbug4
Kings of Kill EVE Animal Control
89
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Posted - 2012.03.15 02:46:00 -
[13] - Quote
No matter what happens to DUST 514, whether it fails or succeeds, it will definitely increase people's awareness about the game. |
Jet Aeon
Two Smoking Barrels
8
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Posted - 2012.03.15 04:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ganagati wrote:Dust will bring in FPS players. FPS players in EVE probably won't last long. This isn't newbie friendly, is extremely slow paced with no real control over the speed of progression of your character, is blob combat only where individual skill doesn't matter that much and has a very complicated control scheme. We'll end up seeing a spike of "dafuq is this?" messages on forums for a little while and then it'll go back to normal. How long has it been since these forums were "normal"?
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Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
77
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Posted - 2012.03.15 06:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Jet Aeon wrote:How long has it been since these forums were "normal"?
Like never ?
Dunno about you guys but I'm planning to buy a PS3 just for the DUST and well .... because I don't own a console or blue-ray player yet. |
Bad Messenger
draketrain Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
117
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Posted - 2012.03.15 06:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
Stetson Eagle wrote:When dust is released, there will probably be a player base spike of dusties willing to test the MMO. Will Eve, with the refined politics and culture, incaptivate the newcomers? Or will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?
It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. Currently the game feels to be polarizing into less players using more alt pilots. How will eve attract and keep new players? Could previously "young" players get dragged into the slow pace of Eve?
A new shard would practically kill the current tranquility and it would undermine the usage of PLEX. But is it the only option at some point? Will there be eve 2.0 - Another New Genesis? I for one would love a reset even if it would mean the new server lasts a few years only. All the friends of mine who would not join a MMO in progress would hop right in and start the race for the galaxy.
I do not see that new players have any problems to beat guys like you who have no clue how games work.
Example new shard does not change anything, same to players from current EVE would just rule in there too, knowledge is power not skill points. |
Grumpy Owly
326
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Posted - 2012.03.15 06:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
My crystal ball says that new players will be injected into the community as a result of Dust 514. It's a bit cloudy on how many and for how long however. If you cross my palm with ISK I will attempt to divine with improved concentration proportional to those contributions.
I won't generalise for the majority of players here, but I do find it amusing that some players want to kill off Dust before its even hit the shelves. Such wonderfull optimism and a view to actually invest some effort into potentially making it work and helping newer players with knowledge so as to enrich the EvE Universe overall.
Dust is pioneering stuff in terms of linking different MMOs platforms together, as such I'm not naieve that there may be problems to overcome or lessons to be learned from attempting such a project. Also people may have certain views as to what makes a successful FPS, which are also valid points to consider.
I don't want to chastise people for what might be rational restraint towards this development or simply being Devils advocate towards a game they are passionate about as a result. My main point I wish to make however is wouldn't it be better to try and work towards and devote energies to try and make Dust a success so as to make the EvE experience even better for all concerned? Surely that would be a better investment of time than filling it under "bin" mentally beforehand? Bounty Hunting for CSM 7
Stop EvE Apathy |
Shogun Archer
Phoenix Rise Industries
9
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Posted - 2012.03.15 07:25:00 -
[18] - Quote
" will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?"
"to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out."
See how these kinda cancel eachother out completely? |
Akirei Scytale
Test Alliance Please Ignore
962
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Posted - 2012.03.15 07:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ai Shun wrote:
Also, in general, fish don't climb trees. The odd one does though. I think.
You lie! A vote for Akirei is a vote for Awesome! |
Alexei Orlov
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2012.03.15 07:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
Seems to me that CCP has presented DUST 514 as a new market, not really as a draw to get new people to play EVE proper.
That said, I would expect there to be some number of people trying out EVE due to their experience with DUST, but that seems very much to be incidental (though probably welcome.) Everything I've read from CCP indicates to me that they want DUST to stand on its own, but that the connection to a larger field (EVE) is to be a draw for players to DUST.
Upshot being we may see some new subcriptions due to DUST but the two games are polar opposites. The number of occasions where they will both appeal strongly to a given player seem few. |
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Akirei Scytale
Test Alliance Please Ignore
962
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Posted - 2012.03.15 08:02:00 -
[21] - Quote
Alexei Orlov wrote:Seems to me that CCP has presented DUST 514 as a new market, not really as a draw to get new people to play EVE proper.
That said, I would expect there to be some number of people trying out EVE due to their experience with DUST, but that seems very much to be incidental (though probably welcome.) Everything I've read from CCP indicates to me that they want DUST to stand on its own, but that the connection to a larger field (EVE) is to be a draw for players to DUST.
Upshot being we may see some new subcriptions due to DUST but the two games are polar opposites. The number of occasions where they will both appeal strongly to a given player seem few.
Considering how popular BF3 and Tribes are between TEST and PL... I don't think you're right. If anything, Dust will be populated entirely by bored EVE players and the occasional outsider. A vote for Akirei is a vote for Awesome! |
Raisa Mole
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.03.15 08:15:00 -
[22] - Quote
Bad Messenger wrote:Stetson Eagle wrote:When dust is released, there will probably be a player base spike of dusties willing to test the MMO. Will Eve, with the refined politics and culture, incaptivate the newcomers? Or will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?
It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. Currently the game feels to be polarizing into less players using more alt pilots. How will eve attract and keep new players? Could previously "young" players get dragged into the slow pace of Eve?
A new shard would practically kill the current tranquility and it would undermine the usage of PLEX. But is it the only option at some point? Will there be eve 2.0 - Another New Genesis? I for one would love a reset even if it would mean the new server lasts a few years only. All the friends of mine who would not join a MMO in progress would hop right in and start the race for the galaxy. I do not see that new players have any problems to beat guys like you who have no clue how games work. Example new shard does not change anything, same to players from current EVE would just rule in there too, knowledge is power not skill points.
Yes, but SP gap whiners will never, ever understand that. They are so completely convinced that low SP players can't contribute or compete that the concept that SP doesn't matter is ridiculous to them.
You are 100% right, a new shard would have exactly the same situation it does now. There would be this initial rush to raise isk and claim unclaimed 0.0 space, so there would temporarily be this riot of colors on the map. Then they would all get run out and the map would settle to a similar state that it is now as the people who actually understand how things work finish taking over. |
Stetson Eagle
ROC Academy The ROC
12
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Posted - 2012.03.17 12:32:00 -
[23] - Quote
Raisa Mole wrote:Bad Messenger wrote:Stetson Eagle wrote:When dust is released, there will probably be a player base spike of dusties willing to test the MMO. Will Eve, with the refined politics and culture, incaptivate the newcomers? Or will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?
It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. Currently the game feels to be polarizing into less players using more alt pilots. How will eve attract and keep new players? Could previously "young" players get dragged into the slow pace of Eve?
A new shard would practically kill the current tranquility and it would undermine the usage of PLEX. But is it the only option at some point? Will there be eve 2.0 - Another New Genesis? I for one would love a reset even if it would mean the new server lasts a few years only. All the friends of mine who would not join a MMO in progress would hop right in and start the race for the galaxy. I do not see that new players have any problems to beat guys like you who have no clue how games work. Example new shard does not change anything, same to players from current EVE would just rule in there too, knowledge is power not skill points. Yes, but SP gap whiners will never, ever understand that. They are so completely convinced that low SP players can't contribute or compete that the concept that SP doesn't matter is ridiculous to them. You are 100% right, a new shard would have exactly the same situation it does now. There would be this initial rush to raise isk and claim unclaimed 0.0 space, so there would temporarily be this riot of colors on the map. Then they would all get run out and the map would settle to a similar state that it is now as the people who actually understand how things work finish taking over.
I'm not at any point arguing that the main issue is SP gap. I've personally been the type that flew rifters and punishers at sub 1M skillpoints in pvp with success, and this char got his first solo officer spawn kill in a daredevil under 1M sp.
I'm not at any point arguing that eve would be different than it is now. It just would be a new start and a new goldrush, and that in itself is strong enough intentive for a multitude of potential new players. Analogical example is diablo2, which still goes on because of consistent ladder resets and new starts.
What I'm arguing is that many potential players are turned off because they don't feel they will impact the sandbox with the same competency as the players who have been developing contacts etc. over the years. A new sandbox would of course require the strategical sense and wisdom of veterans, but it would also be a brilliant chance for newbies to get involved. Imagine a new sandbox and the decisions involved in claiming space: Will our doctrine be drakes, spider domis or alpha maels? Prehaps sansha space for slave implants with abaddons? Or, as a miner, think of the need for minerals to kick start your alliance. As an industrialist, the impact of proper industry! |
Vetrox Satria
Vetrox Technologies
26
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Posted - 2012.03.17 14:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
The people who play dust have a ps3 for a reason...because they dont like/cant afford/cant be arsed to own a pc. So chances are they wont even bother thinking about coming to play eve. |
Valei Khurelem
443
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Posted - 2012.03.17 15:33:00 -
[25] - Quote
I find it amusing that EVE players actually consider themselves more intelligent than other gamers considering the quality of posts here.
"don't get us wrong, we don't want to screw new players, on the contrary. The core problem here is that tech 1 frigates and cruisers should be appealing enough to be viable platforms in both PvE and PvP." -á - CCP Ytterbium |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
884
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Posted - 2012.03.17 15:55:00 -
[26] - Quote
Waiting PC emulator or official PC release to test.
Consoles game....seriously, console? -100 pts on my respectometer. |
JitaPriceChecker2
State War Academy Caldari State
57
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Posted - 2012.03.17 17:45:00 -
[27] - Quote
Valei Khurelem wrote:I find it amusing that EVE players actually consider themselves more intelligent than other gamers considering the quality of posts here.
I find it amusing that you are still here. |
London
Quantum Cats Syndicate
33
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Posted - 2012.03.17 18:29:00 -
[28] - Quote
Specialization kind of makes the whole SP gap a moot point. It doesn't take long to specialize in something that is useful or that you really enjoy and be relatively on par with a vet (ISK being the only favorable factor usually tipped in the vet's favor, although even this is somewhat alleviated through PLEX).
The vets true advantage lies in versatility, that's essentially what high SPs get you.
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Valei Khurelem
444
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Posted - 2012.03.17 18:54:00 -
[29] - Quote
JitaPriceChecker2 wrote:Valei Khurelem wrote:I find it amusing that EVE players actually consider themselves more intelligent than other gamers considering the quality of posts here. I find it amusing that you are still here.
It's nice people enjoy me posting here thanks! ^_^
"don't get us wrong, we don't want to screw new players, on the contrary. The core problem here is that tech 1 frigates and cruisers should be appealing enough to be viable platforms in both PvE and PvP." -á - CCP Ytterbium |
Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
346
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Posted - 2012.03.17 19:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Stetson Eagle wrote: When dust is released, there will probably be a player base spike of dusties willing to test the MMO. Will Eve, with the refined politics and culture, incaptivate the newcomers? Or will the skillpoint gap discourage the console players who want to start on the same line with others?
What skill point gap? The gap between Dust players that will develop over time or the gap between them an Eve?
There really isn't any gap of concern between Dust and Eve since we don't fight in each other's playground, there may be the orbital nuke or ground cannon interaction one day, but I don't see how that matters, Can't imagine CCP will allow the condition to exist where Dusties can't blow up Eve when Eve can blow up Dust.
As far as the gap in Dust, depends on how CCP does things. I suspect that most Dust SP will be what equipment you can use and what bonus that equipment gives to armour, vehicles, dmg mod for weapons. But the real skill in Dust will remain how well one plays an FPS. Experience and competency in the environment will have more value than SP, so long as SP doesn't give some players wildly out of proportion stat bonuses. Of course, CCP can screw that up, so who knows :)
Stetson Eagle wrote: It is elementary that in order to prolong Eve, new players need to flow into the game as veterans are getting out. Currently the game feels to be polarizing into less players using more alt pilots. How will eve attract and keep new players? Could previously "young" players get dragged into the slow pace of Eve?
CCP is a business, and we be can sure they will do a number of cross platform promotions, "Sign up and play Eve too, get a discount and a free quafe flag for your tank!"
Stetson Eagle wrote: A new shard would practically kill the current tranquility and it would undermine the usage of PLEX. But is it the only option at some point? Will there be eve 2.0 - Another New Genesis? I for one would love a reset even if it would mean the new server lasts a few years only. All the friends of mine who would not join a MMO in progress would hop right in and start the race for the galaxy.
I doubt it. One of CCP's most valuable marketing points is the single shared game space, making another, China's legal requirements aside, pretty much defeats one of the main ideas behind Eve. |
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