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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:18:00 -
[361]
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
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Xevan Templar
7th Batavian Squadron
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:19:00 -
[362]
Originally by: Sniper Kalahari I like how the biggest change is a one liner at the bottom of the dev blog! FFS CCP I'm sure it deserves more than one sentence.
I'm not suicide ganker, but i'm thinking of the times when someone accidently shoots somebody else in a mission, or smarties a station in space, or does any number of things which result in accidental concordokken.....
If you can seperate the intentional from the un-intentional then do it, but there will be shedloads of unintended consequences from this.
Seems hastily thought through and not very bright IMHO.
If you just use these words you get what you are actualy saying
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:23:00 -
[363]
I sense goons alts....
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The Economist
Logically Consistent
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:29:00 -
[364]
I don't disagree with most of the blog (though i have my own ideas on concord response times, the idiocy of the gankees and that insurance shouldn't be modified); however, I am a little concerned with the focus of the last few blogs/nerfs since it seems to be focusing on ameliorating the suffering of the weak and stupid by tweaking the game to get more fluffy by small increments.
I just hope this isn't going to be a continuing trend.
Come to think of it though, there is one statement i totally disagree with:
"It is too easy to gain back lost standing, taking only a few days to erase all the damage done by ganking."
Are you serious? In principle...maybe; in practice it's mind-numbingly boring and takes ages (especially if you've gone very low); the only way it could take a few days to fix is if you happen to enjoy watching paint dry while npc'ing 24-7....and of the type of players that typically trash their sec status I think you'll probably find that the majority share this view. Tbh it's only too easy for mission *****s, npc'ers and carebears in general since it involves doing what they already do constantly. (now that'd be a funny twist; if the increase in sec hits and time it takes to recoup sec loss discouraged pvpers from suicide ganking, only to have their place taken by the erstwhile mission *****s that start to alternate between gank and 10 missions lol)
CSM: This so called council got elected by 5.7% of the player base! (12678 votes)
Who the hell are they going to represent??? |
Ranger 1
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:29:00 -
[365]
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 15:31:02
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
"Sigh"
I don't disagree with most of what is in this proposed patch. I don't disagree with most of what is in the proposed nano-nerf patch.
That is irrelevant. The point is, your point of view carries no weight, whether I or anyone else happens to agree with it or not.
When a main posts, you can get some idea of whether or not they have any significan't level of experience with the matter they are voicing their opinion on.
When an alt posts, you can only assume their experience is zip and are only posting to see themselves in print.
That is the reality of the situation on this particular board. Your agreeing or disagreeing with it doesn't change that one wit.
Truthfully, these things are coming to pass DESPITE your posts in favor of them. In other words, your not helping your cause.
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Zora
Gallente Community for Justice Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:31:00 -
[366]
this thread has teh kitties? sweet :)
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Mire Stoude
Cash Money Brothers R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:35:00 -
[367]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter? Stupidity is not limited to one particular play style. Abusing faulty game mechanics does not make you smarter or better. It's like claiming your car is the fastest car on the freeway because you are willing to drive 110 and are passing everyone.
Have a cookie, everything will be right as rain when you've finished, I promise.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:42:00 -
[368]
Originally by: Mire Stoude
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter? Stupidity is not limited to one particular play style. Abusing faulty game mechanics does not make you smarter or better. It's like claiming your car is the fastest car on the freeway because you are willing to drive 110 and are passing everyone.
Have a cookie, everything will be right as rain when you've finished, I promise.
Because everyone haul stuff around, even pirates. And while some of us manage to always keep our hauler intact others apparently "dies every time they undock". Vote against the nano nerf! |
Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:44:00 -
[369]
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 15:31:02
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
"Sigh"
I don't disagree with most of what is in this proposed patch. I don't disagree with most of what is in the proposed nano-nerf patch.
That is irrelevant. The point is, your point of view carries no weight, whether I or anyone else happens to agree with it or not.
When a main posts, you can get some idea of whether or not they have any significan't level of experience with the matter they are voicing their opinion on.
When an alt posts, you can only assume their experience is zip and are only posting to see themselves in print.
That is the reality of the situation on this particular board. Your agreeing or disagreeing with it doesn't change that one wit.
Truthfully, these things are coming to pass DESPITE your posts in favor of them. In other words, your not helping your cause.
What exactly is "my cause?" I already said i don't care what you think. Need that explained in more detail? I didn't say i supported this or the nano nerf. I said ALTS LIKE MINE have had a lot of say on the subject. Do you really think the devs care what alliance these alts are in? Oh yeah, thats right, they can probably check. So as long as the devs know which corps/alliances we are in, i guess that blows your whole ******ed argument out of the water....doesn't it?
Besides, assuming an alt has zip experience is sort of a negative view isn't it? Wouldn't you think it was 50/50 that the person was an expert on the subject?
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Drunk Driver
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:45:00 -
[370]
Originally by: Pesky LaRue Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 06/08/2008 15:15:35
Originally by: Drunk Driver
Zero risk ganks of unprotected haulers is about as close to Hello-Kitty-Online as you can get.
can you go to the blog and quote the "zero risk" part, i evidently missed that. my reading of it was that they said it would still be possible to gank, you'll just take a harder security hit for it, which seems PERFECTLY reasonable to me.
look at it this way - you want to hang-out in a nasty, dirty, disused part of Kilburn and mug people then go right ahead. chances are that the cops won't get there in time and you'll be fine. your picture might appear on Crimewatch, but you'll get away with it.
however - and this is the part no one seems to get - if you want to go Covent Garden or Leicester Square and mug people then the chances are that there will be more police presence, you'll get arrested and get locked up.
i really don't see why everyone's whining (apart from the fact people LIKE to whine, that it makes them feel good about things they DON'T UNDERSTAND) - Empire Suicide Ganking IS STILL POSSIBLE, it just has consequences to move it out of the realm of "griefer" to "professional ganker"
and i think they're spot on with insurance - suicide ganking in high-sec SHOULD invalidate insurance. there, i said it. if you want to gank in high-sec then you can, but not only should you get a big security hit, you shouldn't get paid for what you do by the insurance company. no insurance company would pay out if you used your car to ram a truck off the side of the road to see what's inside, would they?
now, if you did it in the middle of no where and there were no cameras or witness around, it would be a different story...
Uh....
I was making fun of the OP for his whine about EvE becoming Hello Kitty Online when in fact it already is Hello Kitty Online for empire pirates.
Ganking people in empire should be possible, but a ball buster. Right now it's too easy with little consequence. CCP appears to be trying to fix that.
So you and I are on the same page.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:46:00 -
[371]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Mire Stoude
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter?
Because they are smarter than their victims. It's just a fact. Admitting to being suicide ganked is like admitting that you're an idiot.
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:49:00 -
[372]
I support these changes.
While I think suicide ganking is a fair way to play the game, I also look down on it as the carebear version of PVP. If you want a fight, go fight someone who wants one and can actually defend themselves. Ganking is for wussies.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:49:00 -
[373]
Originally by: Matrix Skye
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
I don't know. Free-thinker?
I'd still call you a ****** though.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:58:00 -
[374]
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I robbed a bank, shot two people, and then police came after me, so I took my car and tried to ran away. They blocked the streets and wrecked my car. I also got arrested..." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the money you stole. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
This, oh this, this, this! Good one, and so true.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:58:00 -
[375]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Matrix Skye
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
I don't know. Free-thinker?
I'd still call you a ****** though.
haha you funny! . given your broad view of what a ****** is i take no offense from your name calling at all. but seriously, have you considered not playing this ******ed game? i mean, isnt it too dumb and idiotic for your high and mighty intellect?
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:03:00 -
[376]
Edited by: Esmenet on 06/08/2008 16:03:48
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I fitted my car with some machine guns and went out hunting the local drugdealers. Eventually they started shooting back and my car got shot full of holes before it blew up." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the guns and drugs you took from the criminals. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
Go go rl comparisons. Vote against the nano nerf! |
Ooyama
Caldari Rastana CMP Motivated and Determined
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:07:00 -
[377]
Originally by: J Kunjeh I support these changes.
While I think suicide ganking is a fair way to play the game, I also look down on it as the carebear version of PVP. If you want a fight, go fight someone who wants one and can actually defend themselves. Ganking is for wussies.
Seconded.
Though hi-sec piracy is a legit piece of game-mechanics, it shouldn't be an easy line of work. This change will assure that pirates/gankers HAVE to actually think, as they now have to really make sure that the cost for them will be in-line with what they get out of each gank.
"Yama".
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Caliwyrm O'Libr
Dark Prophecy Inc. Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:08:00 -
[378]
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Leinad tir suicide gank is moronic.
Filling your untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions in cargo is moronic. Having someone scan out your fittings and cargo then blow you up to take them for themselves is an intended game mechanic thats fun and profitable.
Assuming you're not using a faction/officer fitted ship, how would no insurance payout stop people from making a profit killing an "untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions of cargo"? =======
Talk is cheap because supply always outweighs demand.. |
Stab Wounds
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:11:00 -
[379]
Originally by: Drunk Driver
If you suck at PvP and are afraid to go into 0.0 then these changes will make you angry.
QFT
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Traidor Disloyal
NightCrew
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:16:00 -
[380]
It's more then likely been wrote already; I can live with these changes if the DEVs kick players out of non-wardecable NPC corps after the characters age hits 3 months and place em into wardecable NPC corporations. That will make me happy.
You want to smack talk me in local? You want to mission run in my system? There needs to be consequences for ones actions in game.
--------------------------------------------- Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot |
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Pithecanthropus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:21:00 -
[381]
Originally by: Traidor Disloyal
You want to smack talk me in local? You want to mission run in my system? There needs to be consequences for ones actions in game.
No there doesn't. I can do what I want. If you don't like my local chat, don't listen to me... block me. If you you don't want me to run missions in your system... well find another one. The system is NOT yours anyway. Maybe I'm claiming the system. Maybe it's mine... so blah.
If you are sitting there playing Eve and all ****y about players in NPC corps doing their OWN thing, then I think the real problem is YOU... and YOU finding something better to do then worry about someone else's preferred game style. Sheesh. Who are you to say what I can do? --------------------------------- Pithecanthropus erectus, a name derived from Greek and Latin roots meaning upright ape-man. |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:25:00 -
[382]
From the dev blog:
Quote: We are increasing the security penalties throughout high-security space. It will be a gradual change, from 1.0 down to 0.1, where the security level of the system will dictate how much penalty you receive for illegal actions against a fellow capsuleer. This means that 1.0 will now be the safest of places, where aggressions and kills will be severely penalized and can quickly outlaw the aggressor from higher security levels. Conversely, 0.1, 0.2, and 0.3 will see a decrease in penalty, but not a big step down. This should move most ganking to the lower security areas where it belongs.
Alt characters means no penalty is ever going to be effective. You might as well permakill the characters doing this and it wont make a difference at all.
Quote: This is, of course, a major change in the landscape of EVE, but we are confident that these changes and the future plans will make EVE a better experience for everyone.
No they wont change anything at all.
Quote: In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future.
I have no idea why you didnt just do this, since it will solve the problem on its own.
---
Originally by: Roguehalo Can you nano Titans?
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:28:00 -
[383]
Get a grip, folks. This change will not stop suicide ganking for profit (piracy, a totally acceptable trade in Eve). This change will only stop suicide ganking just for giggles (arguably griefing, and CCP seem to have landed on that side of the fence).
If folks want to run level 4 missions all day in high-sec in an npc corp to minimize risk to the extreme...then they have their reward in full already, because that's a pretty pointless Eve existence. Preying on those kinds of people just to do it was also a fairly pointless Eve existence.
Fit a scanner, find the haulers with the phat l00tz, suicide your ship(s), write off the losses as "cost of operating," and roll in the net profit. Pretty simple, really.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:35:00 -
[384]
Originally by: Garreck Get a grip, folks. This change will not stop suicide ganking for profit (piracy, a totally acceptable trade in Eve). This change will only stop suicide ganking just for giggles (arguably griefing, and CCP seem to have landed on that side of the fence).
If folks want to run level 4 missions all day in high-sec in an npc corp to minimize risk to the extreme...then they have their reward in full already, because that's a pretty pointless Eve existence. Preying on those kinds of people just to do it was also a fairly pointless Eve existence.
Fit a scanner, find the haulers with the phat l00tz, suicide your ship(s), write off the losses as "cost of operating," and roll in the net profit. Pretty simple, really.
To get a bit serious for a while, I don't think most of us are actually whining about the changes themselves. What we - or at least I - are upset about is that the general focus of the game is being changed from a hard core dog-eat-dog environment where the devs don't give handouts and where players make their own justice and get to live with the consequences of their actions, to a casual-friendly mainstream online experience. I joined up to play the first game. If I wanted to play the second game I would have joined WoW, because that game does it much better.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:40:00 -
[385]
Edited by: Garreck on 06/08/2008 16:40:53
Originally by: Ki An
To get a bit serious for a while, I don't think most of us are actually whining about the changes themselves. What we - or at least I - are upset about is that the general focus of the game is being changed from a hard core dog-eat-dog environment where the devs don't give handouts and where players make their own justice and get to live with the consequences of their actions, to a casual-friendly mainstream online experience. I joined up to play the first game. If I wanted to play the second game I would have joined WoW, because that game does it much better.
I don't buy the "ganking folks in high-sec makes me/the game tough." The folks that have the most to lose from high sec ganking are still 100% vulnerable. Popping worthless afk haulers for laughs was neither particularly profitable for the ganker nor particularly costly for the dumbass afk-er (nor did it require any skill at all)...so I'm not sure where the hard-core is/was. The hard-core element...the potential loss (or more accurately "transfer" ) of billions for being overly lazy...still exists.
So what's the issue?
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:47:00 -
[386]
Originally by: Garreck
I don't buy the "ganking folks in high-sec makes me/the game tough." The folks that have the most to lose from high sec ganking are still 100% vulnerable. Popping worthless afk haulers for laughs was neither particularly profitable for the ganker nor particularly costly for the dumbass afk-er (nor did it require any skill at all)...so I'm not sure where the hard-core is/was. The hard-core element...the potential loss (or more accurately "transfer" ) of billions for being overly lazy...still exists.
So what's the issue?
Please read my post again. I am worried about the direction the game is taking. The last couple of patches have all been pointing to an increase in security in high sec, and a dumbing down of PvP. An increase in security in high sec, in turn, leads to less incentive to ever leave. In my view, CCP are nerfing the wrong end of the spectrum.
As I like conspiracy theories, here's one I think might actually be true. CCP are working on their WoD MMO. When it goes gold, they don't want to be stuck with EvE. They are now aiming at making maximum amount of profits until the game is pulled. This means getting subscribers from the WoW-crowd, which in turn means dumbing the game down and limiting PvP.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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5pinDizzy
Amarr Umpteenth Podding
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:47:00 -
[387]
Bears can say all day long how Gankers have it easy. There isn't really two sides of the fence, we all have to make a living.
Gankers need to haul stuff all the time too, most likely your stuff. :p They just don't suck royally at it and get blown up every time they undock, and go crying to CCP everytime they die and look for game mechanics to pick faul with to validate their tears.
It's just protection for the weak players who can't adapt. I believe it's just the start of a slippery slope, I personally won't quit over something like this, but if they announce something as bad next week, then sure count me in to the rageemoquitters.
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Laae Aenus
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:56:00 -
[388]
Hey, if someone wants to carebear in high-sec, fine by me. Their loss, the problem with people staying in high-sec and pimping our their CNRs is mostly the fact that they will never experience the interesting parts of EVE, but then again, EVE is what you make of it, so it's kinda stupid to judge, if someone enjoys grinding missions and it relaxes him, why the **** not, back the hell away, besides, if you're backed up by a decent alliance, 0.0 can be just as safe, and well, low-sec is pretty much a pvp zone. The other problem are ISK Farmers that sell it for real cash, but that's not even close to what the subject is about, since we all know, they can't throw out a decent post.
Now, as many people have said it before, the problem with ganking wasn't in the fact that you killed someone, but that people would fit a ship, kill someone, and make profit, no matter what you ganked, and that was in CCPs book a bit stupid, well it's stupid in anyone's book at least if he has half a brain. So what, you'll get an alt, or your main, depends who's ganking, throw him in a cheap frig and throw on a cargo scanner and search for appropriate targets, now is that so hard? Suicide gankers had it too easy since every suicide was profitable.
Ok, I get the point that people are worried EVE is getting waaaay too fluffy and all, but there's really no worries for that, at least not in this devblog, the changes were made to cut down on pointless ganks. Any decent suicide ganker will probably earn a ton more ISK from now on, because he'll be a bit more careful of what targets he plans to suicide.
Yes, this is an alt, a forum alt to be completely precise. No, I will not post with my main. And yes, you can have my stuff.
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Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:56:00 -
[389]
Big chunks of the sky falling all over the forums today.
Most people fear change, most people are only worried about aspects of the game that hurt their chosen playstyle, however broken, most people don't have any alternative ideas on how to improve the game yet all of them have a keyboard handy and the rage to use it.
Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav!
Also Known As |
Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:57:00 -
[390]
Originally by: Ki An
Please read my post again. I am worried about the direction the game is taking.
I read it. Your concern was that Eve is trending towards less hardcore.
I answered that concern directly: this change will not make the game less hardcore...because the hardcore element (extreme transfer of isk by force in defiance of "the law") will still exist.
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