Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
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CCP Abraxas
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Posted - 2008.09.01 15:33:00 -
[1]
This is a story about murder, abduction and hard ethical choices. Which is why it's a farce. |
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Aslann
Gallente Win and God
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Posted - 2008.09.01 15:59:00 -
[2]
The MTAC bit is priceless |
Avel Kereka
Amarr The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.09.01 17:31:00 -
[3]
Gallenteans killing children to get at a retired war criminal? It could've done without the obligatory Evil Caldari (TM), but still a step in the right direction I think. |
Jhing Fing
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Posted - 2008.09.01 18:05:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Jhing Fing on 01/09/2008 18:05:20 The General killed the families with his bunkers, he is the murderer. The Gallente soldiers made the decision to complete their mission and are not responsible for those measures put in place by the Caldari general. Also, the general's previous treatment of gallente prisioner's leads me to believe he will feel no remorse for his actions. |
Avel Kereka
Amarr The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.09.01 18:16:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Jhing Fing The Gallente soldiers made the decision to complete their mission and are not responsible for those measures put in place by the Caldari general.
Not quite. The squad leader's initial decision was to withdraw immediately, because he knew even his own government wouldn't approve. Then, he made the choice to kill innocents, simply to get at one man who was no longer a threat.
Still, it's easy to come to the conclusion you did because, well, we've got an Evil Caldari pulling the strings as usual. |
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
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Posted - 2008.09.01 18:26:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Jhing Fing Edited by: Jhing Fing on 01/09/2008 18:05:20 The General killed the families with his bunkers, he is the murderer. The Gallente soldiers made the decision to complete their mission and are not responsible for those measures put in place by the Caldari general. Also, the general's previous treatment of gallente prisioner's leads me to believe he will feel no remorse for his actions.
Sure they aren't . . . and the guards at **** concentration camps were 'just following orders.'
Both they and the general are responsible. Its more a question of which was the lesser of two evils: letting the General get away, or letting the civilians die in order to get the General. Which fits perfectly into the Eve feeling, I think, it's a very gray situation, damned if they do, damned if they don't . . . they're not the only ones responsible, sure, but it just goes to show that in Eve (and war in general), everyone ends up with innocent blood on their hands eventually.
Excellent story, was a great read, and gave a wonderful 'ambigious morality' feeling which I enjoy in Eve, plus revealed info about ground ops in Eve, which I like. |
Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.01 19:42:00 -
[7]
I want an MTAC |
Zenae Maelstrom
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Posted - 2008.09.01 20:50:00 -
[8]
Excellent story, a number of things caught my attention while reading it.
First, the fact that this was a group of Gallente corporation operatives. An nice example of Caldari influence on Gallente.
Second, it occurred to me that the general didn't have to actually put the gas into place in the bunkers. Just the threat and the fact that the Gallente believed he would do it should be enough to stop them. Furthermore, I wouldn't assume the rest of Caldari would never hear about it if there was gas. The story the public would hear would be that the Gallente used it on innocent civilians to get at the General since it's unlikely there would be any survivors of the raiding party to say anything different.
I don't see the neighbors as being bought off by the general. They're living in a lowsec area where they have to rely on themselves and each other. Besides, as fellow Caldari they would have heard the official version of what the General did if they knew anything about him at all. Anything else would have been Gallente propaganda and no easy way for them to learn anything different.
Most importantly, the General was no longer an active military threat, therefore they are not justified in killing civilians just to get revenge. There are times when otherwise unacceptable behavior is necessary to prevent further atrocity. If he were an active threat they could justify killing the human shield to get at him to prevent further action on his part, but there is no evidence this was anything but an attempt at political PR. In that case they would be committing their own war crimes in order to hold the General responsible for his.
Although in the end I don't see how a single guy with a hand gun could break into a hardened bunker at all, let alone fast enough to do it before the General's forces arrive. |
Avtambaram
Gallente Murderous Inc
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Posted - 2008.09.01 22:50:00 -
[9]
I guess they must have killed the general then, right? Or did they pop him out and take him to the extraction point before enemy forces over ran the farms?
I'm confused. |
Nareth Mordonis
Minmatar GenX Societies Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.01 23:43:00 -
[10]
The ending left it a bit to the imagination. I can only assume that it was meant to give the idea that the Gallente forces found and killed the general instead of taking him back, but I wonder if it wasn't something else?
Obviously the Caldari troops were there and closing in, but was the scream that of the general or did Klar have the wrong bunker and that was his scream as the gas hit him (and the rest of the civilians)? |
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Nareth Mordonis
Minmatar GenX Societies Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.01 23:47:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Avel Kereka
Originally by: Jhing Fing The Gallente soldiers made the decision to complete their mission and are not responsible for those measures put in place by the Caldari general.
Not quite. The squad leader's initial decision was to withdraw immediately, because he knew even his own government wouldn't approve. Then, he made the choice to kill innocents, simply to get at one man who was no longer a threat.
Still, it's easy to come to the conclusion you did because, well, we've got an Evil Caldari pulling the strings as usual.
Also... I would like to add that I believe the squad commander made the choice knowing that the Caldari troops were on the ground and headed for them. So he decided to take the General out since thier lives were forfiet already. |
Zex Maxwell
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.09.02 02:09:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Grimpak I want an MTAC
I like to know as well. I assume its a big gun, or bomb |
Kandrew Dorak
Gallente Eve University Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.09.02 02:18:00 -
[13]
Quote: "I want an MTAC," Klar said. "You're not getting one," the captain and Arek said in unison. The rest of the team looked on, not hiding their grins. "Still want one." The captain said, "This is a top-secret mission that has to be executed with stealth and precision, and you want to bring along a mechanized skeleton that'll thump the ground like god's own hammer." There was silence in the room. Klar said, "MTACs shoot rockets."
An MTAC is a powered exoskeleton. Look it up on Wikipedia. |
Avel Kereka
Amarr The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.09.02 04:50:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Avel Kereka on 02/09/2008 04:54:07 Edited by: Avel Kereka on 02/09/2008 04:53:42
Originally by: Nareth Mordonis Obviously the Caldari troops were there and closing in, but was the scream that of the general or did Klar have the wrong bunker and that was his scream as the gas hit him (and the rest of the civilians)?
Only Klar had a gun so presumably he was the only one who could break through (and trigger all the gas). Because Arek only heard one scream, it was probably Klar killing the general in the basement with the non-gassed bunker. |
Astria Tiphareth
Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.09.02 07:40:00 -
[15]
Great story, nicely done, and suitably ambiguous as to what actually happened in the end.
The only bit that doesn't entirely sit well with me is the letters out on the desks. If the general hadn't been so smug and superior as to actually leave directions out in the open to these bunkers, by the time the raiding operatives had found them, the Caldari backup would have already arrived. By comparison, putting the letters on the bunkers' doors would have bought even more time for the general, which would strike me as the smart thing to do.
Of course that is the author's prerogative, to have the general be overconfident, or the type to put their enemy in a difficult situation and benefit from that - I suppose that just as a matter of personal taste, I'd have been sneakier . However it wouldn't have made as good a story . |
Victor Valka
Caldari Kissaki Corporation
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Posted - 2008.09.02 08:33:00 -
[16]
Quote: Klar said, "MTACs shoot rockets."
I love the guy! |
CaldariAdam
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Posted - 2008.09.02 09:26:00 -
[17]
A strong piece of work. There is no good side in war. |
Jane Retail
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Posted - 2008.09.02 12:23:00 -
[18]
If there ever will be a second EvE Novel.. please let Abraxas to the work |
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
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Posted - 2008.09.02 14:30:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Jane Retail If there ever will be a second EvE Novel.. please let Abraxas to the work
Seconded. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
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CCP Abraxas
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Posted - 2008.09.02 15:25:00 -
[20]
Everyone clearly has a different opinion on this one, which is exactly what I'd hoped for. The MTAC bit was a favourite with my beta readers.
I don't go in for black & white ethics. Everyone has a reason for their actions, some merely less pleasant than others. One of the stories slated for winter publication, called "Under the Sea, the City", is going to heavily reinforce this "bad people doing good things" thing I keep coming back to.
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Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.02 15:34:00 -
[21]
Please add a "Seargent Klar" Action Toy with a MTAC Expansion package to the EVE Store (Caldari Blood not included, you have to collect by yourself).
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Juan Chance
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Posted - 2008.09.02 16:07:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Jane Retail If there ever will be a second EvE Novel.. please let Abraxas to the work
That is a very good idea would be a great read.
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Victua
Minmatar Selectus Pravus Lupus
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Posted - 2008.09.02 16:22:00 -
[23]
Great work. Especialy since operators here on Terra have had (and will contintue) to make much the same set of choices in much the same situations. Albeit not as technical.
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Hamish Grayson
Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
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Posted - 2008.09.02 17:26:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Zenae Maelstrom An nice example of Caldari influence on Gallente. Quote:
I would disagree with this. Take a look at compilation of the Caldari and Gallente timelines.
22463 û The Gallenteans spot the Caldari on Caldari Prime but are unable to establish contact. 22517 û First Contact between the Caldari and Gallenteans. 22588 û The Gallenteans build their first stargate. 22631 û The Cultural Deliverance Society (CDS) arrives on Caldari. 22684 û Isuuaya, The first Caldari corporation is established.
The first Caldari Megacorp was formed after the Gallente made contact and the Caldari didn't even know another civilization lived in their solar system until the Gallente landed. This means that when the Gallente landed, the Caldari were probably very similar, from a technological stand point, to earth in the late 1800s. I doubt that at this point that they had shaken off feudalism.
The present day Federation is dominated by huge megacorps, and is extremely capitalistic. One can infer from that, that the early Gallente were also extremely capitalistic during the era of first contact.
I suspect that the Caldari learned ultra-capitalism from the Gallente û they just decided to not use the Gallente corporations method of ruling through proxies like sentors, judges etc.
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It is said the warrior's is the twofold way of pen and sword |
Miyamoto Uroki
Caldari KuhSchubsKlan
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Posted - 2008.09.02 17:34:00 -
[25]
The MTAC part heavily reminds me of the Serenity movie. Am I right? ^^
Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.02 19:02:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Zex Maxwell
Originally by: Grimpak I want an MTAC
I like to know as well. I assume its a big gun, or bomb
I'm imaginating a rocket-shooting exoskeleton, or even a mech. |
Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.02 19:49:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Deviana Sevidon on 02/09/2008 19:51:17 Edit:
MTAC Thread
MTAC are a bit smaller then the Battlemechs.
Industry MTAC are a bit like the Power Loader Ripley used in the Aliens ll Movie. While Combat MTAC would be a bit like the Wolverine Mechs from Command and Conquer 2 and 3. |
MarVAqN
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Posted - 2008.09.02 21:11:00 -
[28]
We are all of us , faced with etchical choices when in the theater of war. There is no right or wrong , just right then and there , and what is left behind. Damn the implications , objective complete.
We must do what we must for the completion of a mission , for the completion of a cause however we must go beyond. sometimes that step into the abyss is a moral step into a Chasm , sometimes its a leg up.
In this instance, this general is evil not the Caldari people or military, His would be captors choose to sully themselves and risk the judegment of man and eternity for bringing to JUstice (no matter how corporeal) this monster, one so vile he was allowed to live in pasture away from his Beloved Caldari.
Definately getting verry verry dark here
Way to go Abraxas
do you take user submissions
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SoftRevolution
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Posted - 2008.09.03 01:36:00 -
[29]
There wasn't really a choice to be made there.
Commit a war crime to apprehend a war criminal?
I guess it's plausible if they were amoral company spooks. I hope they lose their bonus
EVE RELATED CONTENT |
Elise Masutra
Tleilex Manufacturing
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Posted - 2008.09.03 21:05:00 -
[30]
a really good story, with a lot of implications and room for speculation. and a Abraxas novel would be kickass! don't get me wrong, the TonyG one was a good read, but the dark and twisted things from Abraxas intrigue me more |
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