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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.10.04 10:16:00 -
[121]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Good to see progress. The speed changes are great if the missile problem gets balanced. Lets hope it gets resolved soon so we can get rid of the nano-win-button.
The problem is not speed or nano it is that a lot of missile users and gunnery users want i-win missile/gunnery spams to become the norm in pvp. Screw needing to tackle or do anything other than hit f1-f8 and watch ships go pop from alpha or dps.
Removing nano is removing the need to use team work and skill in roaming gang pvp and to combat it, it only servers skilless blobbers and carebears who want to fight in pve setups.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.05 03:09:00 -
[122]
Originally by: lebrata
The problem is not speed or nano it is that a lot of missile users and gunnery users want i-win missile/gunnery spams to become the norm in pvp. Screw needing to tackle or do anything other than hit f1-f8 and watch ships go pop from alpha or dps.
Removing nano is removing the need to use team work and skill in roaming gang pvp and to combat it, it only servers skilless blobbers and carebears who want to fight in pve setups.
Nope, that's not how it works at all. Nano ... skill in same sentense. Don't make me laugh. ----------------------------------------- [Video] Support Barrage |
lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.10.05 09:15:00 -
[123]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: lebrata
The problem is not speed or nano it is that a lot of missile users and gunnery users want i-win missile/gunnery spams to become the norm in pvp. Screw needing to tackle or do anything other than hit f1-f8 and watch ships go pop from alpha or dps.
Removing nano is removing the need to use team work and skill in roaming gang pvp and to combat it, it only servers skilless blobbers and carebears who want to fight in pve setups.
Nope, that's not how it works at all. Nano ... skill in same sentence. Don't make me laugh.
You know nothing about roaming gangs or pvp if you do not understand how much skill gang vs gang fights need with nano ships involved.
The need to actually tackle a ship to kill it produces the most skill and teamwork intensive pvp in the game, as both sides bring tacklers and then logistics and ewar to defend the tacklers.
Im sure you feel its unfair that your ratting ship cannot beat a bunch of fully spec'd combat fitted ships but you know nothing about pvp if you think that removing nano so f1-f8 is all you need to pop a ship is a good idea.
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DeadDuck
Amarr Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.05 10:41:00 -
[124]
Any updates on these changes ? I have a Pilgrim ready to undock
________________ God is my Wingman |
darkmancer
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Posted - 2008.10.05 13:06:00 -
[125]
Just a thought: why not base missile damage on agility?
In that way missile damages applies to ships size, extreme speed will have nothing to do with it, nano's can fit Istabs to reduce damage (sig rad penalty might need changing).
Then maybe add an agility penalty to target painters & webbers.
--------------------------------- There's a simple solution to every problem. It is always invariably wrong |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.05 16:37:00 -
[126]
Originally by: darkmancer Just a thought: why not base missile damage on agility?
Or ppl could just start bringing tacklers and a versatile gang to fight instead of ratting setups.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2008.10.05 17:28:00 -
[127]
Originally by: DeadDuck Any updates on these changes ? I have a Pilgrim ready to undock
Maybe start flying it? My pilgrim works pretty good and tbh i prefer it over nanocurse atm.
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DeadDuck
Amarr Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.05 17:39:00 -
[128]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: DeadDuck Any updates on these changes ? I have a Pilgrim ready to undock
Maybe start flying it? My pilgrim works pretty good and tbh i prefer it over nanocurse atm.
Good at what ? dying ? or Hiding ? Maybe hauling
________________ God is my Wingman |
Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2008.10.05 19:52:00 -
[129]
Originally by: DeadDuck
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: DeadDuck Any updates on these changes ? I have a Pilgrim ready to undock
Maybe start flying it? My pilgrim works pretty good and tbh i prefer it over nanocurse atm.
Good at what ? dying ? or Hiding ? Maybe hauling
Killing stuff. Classic "think outside of a box" and its quite solid ship.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.05 22:23:00 -
[130]
Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 05/10/2008 22:26:37 Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 05/10/2008 22:23:52
Originally by: lebrata
You know nothing about roaming gangs or pvp if you do not understand how much skill gang vs gang fights need with nano ships involved.
The need to actually tackle a ship to kill it produces the most skill and teamwork intensive pvp in the game, as both sides bring tacklers and then logistics and ewar to defend the tacklers.
Im sure you feel its unfair that your ratting ship cannot beat a bunch of fully spec'd combat fitted ships but you know nothing about pvp if you think that removing nano so f1-f8 is all you need to pop a ship is a good idea.
Wth are you on about? Ive been living in 0.0 for years, since day one. I've abused nano ships for longer then I can remember. I know what a nano ship does and I know how a nano fleet is flown. The truth is that nano ships are NOT hard to fly at all. Nano fleets are easy to command because you can make mistakes and not wipe your whole fleet. Sure you might lose a couple ships but its never a wipe if you make a mistake. Truth is nano fleets are in the long run easier to run, cheaper to run and very kill/death ratio efficient even with half the fleet being noobs or retrds. The only thing you need is to be able to fit t2 basically and a t2 nano fleet is all you need. There are too many noobs and that is why people fly nano fleets, not because it is harder but because it is EASIER. You suck if you think nano fleets/ships are "hard" to fly. They are not. Its just as easy as any other ship.
In fact why dont you bring your nano ship to the forge and Ill 1vs1 you in my nano ship and we'll see who the person is that doesnt understand nano's. ----------------------------------------- [Video] Support Barrage |
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Dianeces
The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.10.06 00:19:00 -
[131]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 05/10/2008 22:26:37 Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 05/10/2008 22:23:52
Originally by: lebrata
You know nothing about roaming gangs or pvp if you do not understand how much skill gang vs gang fights need with nano ships involved.
The need to actually tackle a ship to kill it produces the most skill and teamwork intensive pvp in the game, as both sides bring tacklers and then logistics and ewar to defend the tacklers.
Im sure you feel its unfair that your ratting ship cannot beat a bunch of fully spec'd combat fitted ships but you know nothing about pvp if you think that removing nano so f1-f8 is all you need to pop a ship is a good idea.
Wth are you on about? Ive been living in 0.0 for years, since day one. I've abused nano ships for longer then I can remember. I know what a nano ship does and I know how a nano fleet is flown. The truth is that nano ships are NOT hard to fly at all. Nano fleets are easy to command because you can make mistakes and not wipe your whole fleet. Sure you might lose a couple ships but its never a wipe if you make a mistake. Truth is nano fleets are in the long run easier to run, cheaper to run and very kill/death ratio efficient even with half the fleet being noobs or retrds. The only thing you need is to be able to fit t2 basically and a t2 nano fleet is all you need. There are too many noobs and that is why people fly nano fleets, not because it is harder but because it is EASIER. You suck if you think nano fleets/ships are "hard" to fly. They are not. Its just as easy as any other ship.
In fact why dont you bring your nano ship to the forge and Ill 1vs1 you in my nano ship and we'll see who the person is that doesnt understand nano's.
How the shit did you manage to make it into DNA?
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Menerai Entaro
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Posted - 2008.10.06 02:06:00 -
[132]
Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 05/10/2008 17:59:33
Originally by: darkmancer Just a thought: why not base missile damage on agility?
Or you could just start bringing tacklers and a versatile gang to fight with instead of ratting setups.
Murina, we get it. You don't want anything to change. Try reading the Op. Read it a couple of times even. Now think what are the devs asking for. What has gang setup got to do with the Op?
Please, wow us with a formula for missiles that meets the requirements in the Op... come up with something that allows gameplay to remain as it is - just with lower speeds.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.06 09:20:00 -
[133]
Edited by: Murina on 06/10/2008 09:23:26
Originally by: Menerai Entaro
Try reading the Op.
Done
Originally by: Menerai Entaro Read it a couple of times even.
Done done.
Originally by: Menerai Entaro Now think what are the devs asking for.
A way to FIX solo missile ship ratting setups cos the proposed speed nerf makes them more effective at pvp than a fully spec'd pvp fitted ship.
Also a way to make cruiser sized ships worth flying if the moronic nerf goes through as they will be worthless death traps.
Originally by: Menerai Entaro What has gang setup got to do with the Op?
Cause and effect pal if you change something as fundamental as say small ships (like cruisers and below) ability to tank you remove their ability to survive and be useful in gang pvp.
The speed nerf will do this and now ccp are asking for a fix.....ok heres one..LEAVE SPEED ALONE ITS FINE PPL JUST NEED TO LEARN HOW TO WORK AS A TEAM AND TACKLE..
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.10.06 09:42:00 -
[134]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Wth are you on about? Ive been living in 0.0 for years, since day one. I've abused nano ships for longer then I can remember. I know what a nano ship does and I know how a nano fleet is flown.
Only 771 kills on BC for all those years work and all that nano abuse lol your a joke.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer The truth is that nano ships are NOT hard to fly at all.
NANO ships are not hard to fly against idiots would be more accurate but if you and you guys wanna try flying onto PL held space im sure you will get a education in how to kill nano gangs with well balanced versatile squads,
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Nano fleets are easy to command because you can make mistakes and not wipe your whole fleet. Sure you might lose a couple ships but its never a wipe if you make a mistake.
Any gang can burn back to a gate and jump or station/pos hug so that if things go bad they can bail with few losses. Stop blaming nano for you incompetence and get better at gang combat.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Truth is nano fleets are in the long run easier to run, cheaper to run and very kill/death ratio efficient even with half the fleet being noobs or retrds.
Easier against solo ships or idiots. Cheaper than insured BC or BS?????, are you kidding???? 200 mil per loss versus what 10mil for a BC and 20-30mil for a BS?.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer The only thing you need is to be able to fit t2 basically and a t2 nano fleet is all you need.
For what??? ganking solo ratter cos if you wanna take on reasonably skilled gangs you need ewar and logistic support pal.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer In fact why dont you bring your nano ship to the forge and Ill 1vs1 you in my nano ship and we'll see who the person is that doesnt understand nano's.
1 I am not flying all the way to forge just to kick your ass. 2. 1 v 1 is pointless as eve is not a 1 v 1 game so basing stats and nerfs on it is stupid.
But if you wanna name a time and date il speak to some of the dudes in PL and we can get a couple of teams together as it seems you need a few lessons in how to kill and combat nano ships.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.06 16:23:00 -
[135]
Originally by: lebrata ....
Well that's the thing isn't it? Generally you don't fight fleets with a majority of skilled players. That is not your standard fleet. We all know what happens to fleets facing REAL resistance. A skilled fleet can kick ass with conventional fleets. Nano'ing your fleet is a shortcut to effectiveness when your fleet members skill just doesn't cut it. You're trying to make it look like that it is the people that can't fight the nano's that are unskilled when infact it is the nano pilots that are the skilless ones.
You should also try to READ. I said that nano's are cheaper to RUN. I didn't say the nano ships are cheaper then t1 BCs. Right? Oh and nano's rarely fight equally sized fleets generally. The general kills of nano fleets are getting blobbed. So yeah, generally that is all you need to be "skilled" to do with your nano ship. ----------------------------------------- [Video] Support Barrage |
lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.10.06 17:13:00 -
[136]
Edited by: lebrata on 06/10/2008 17:25:40
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Well that's the thing isn't it? Generally you don't fight fleets with a majority of skilled players. That is not your standard fleet. We all know what happens to fleets facing REAL resistance. A skilled fleet can kick ass with conventional fleets.
Who said anything about fleets?...i am talking about 15-30 man roaming gangs and i dunno what muppets you fly with by my guys are all skilled pvp pilots.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Nano'ing your fleet is a shortcut to effectiveness when your fleet members skill just doesn't cut it.
Rubbish its a way to roam in hostile space where you can be blobbed and jumped over with bridges, and also a way not to lose untackled ships to alpha strikes from said blobs.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer You're trying to make it look like that it is the people that can't fight the nano's that are unskilled when in fact it is the nano pilots that are the skilless ones.
Skill is relative, lazy players who refuse to fit for pvp and use versatile gangs are the ones who want this nerf cos all you will need is alpha strike to pop anything small like cruisers and below...yea real skill needed for f1-f8 pal.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer You should also try to READ. I said that nano's are cheaper to RUN. I didn't say the nano ships are cheaper then t1 BCs. Right?
Cheaper to run???....so wtf does that mean or are you comparing them to capital ships that need fuel to fly?.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Oh and nano's rarely fight equally sized fleets generally.
Mine do regularly and we also take on much larger gangs but we run ewar and logistics in our gangs and work as a team, i am sure your idea of nano is to gank a ratter and run from his buddies as soon as they respond but some of us are past that level bud. You should try it instead of burying your head in the sand and blaming nano for others incompetance.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer The general kills of nano fleets are getting blobbed. So yeah, generally that is all you need to be "skilled" to do with your nano ship.
See i was right you do have no idea about and no experience in flying with a good versatile and varied roaming gang and have no idea how a good unit operates.
A BC or RR BS gang can blob and kill a solo ship nano has no advantage over them in that regard its the stupid ratters fault for not watching local.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.06 20:05:00 -
[137]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer ignorant drivel
Do you honestly think that the individuals that run at the first sign of resistance are going to stick around now that they are even more vulnerable if this stupid nerf goes through?. The kind of ppl that kill a solo ship and run from anything of close to equal size will still do that in other ships removing nano will not change them in the least. While those that normally stuck around for a fight (and were killable by a good balanced gang) will now not bother because f1-f8 insta pop without even being tackled is not a skill.
This nerf does not increase skilled pvp in eve it reduces it because it removes the need to tackle and as such the need to defend tacklers, not only that but it will reduce gang pvp as a whole because ppl will not want to engage other gangs in the first place when they can be insta popped without even being tackled.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.07 12:01:00 -
[138]
Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 07/10/2008 12:01:16
Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 06/10/2008 20:21:16
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer ignorant drivel
....
Wow, this wins the whole argument. Nice edit.
Sorry but you're wrong. ----------------------------------------- [Video] Support Barrage |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.07 13:02:00 -
[139]
Edited by: Murina on 07/10/2008 13:04:19 Edited by: Murina on 07/10/2008 13:03:42
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer ignorant drivel
Originally by: Murina Do you honestly think that the individuals that gank a solo player run at the first sign of resistance are going to stick around now that they are even more vulnerable if this stupid nerf goes through?.
The kind of ppl that kill a solo ship and run from any gang of close to equal size will still do that in other ships so removing nano will not change them in the least. While those that normally stick around for a fight (and were killable by a good balanced gang) will now not bother because f1-f8 insta pop without even being tackled is not a skill.
This nerf does not increase skilled pvp in eve it reduces it because it removes a lot of the need to tackle and as such the need to defend tacklers, not only that but it will reduce gang pvp as a whole because ppl will not want to engage other gangs in the first place when they can be insta popped without even being tackled.
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Sorry but you're wrong.
WOW you really did not need to go into so much detail with your rebuttal pal....
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Aksimel
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Posted - 2008.10.09 00:44:00 -
[140]
Why do ships have 1 stat "Signature Radius" that seems to function as two stats: "Size" and "Signature Radius"? It seems to me that for locking/ewar/scanning etc the electronic version of "Signature Radius" is one size (certainly affected by MWD on/off etc) and that for Turret resolution, explosion damage, etc. physical "Size" would be much more appropriate (which wouldn't be affected by MWD). Target painters would need to be switched to affect this new stat instead of sig radius, but I think most other modules/skills would use the electronic Signature Radius still.
Hopefully that makes sense.
Aks
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Miriyaka
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.10.09 01:48:00 -
[141]
Clearly CCP's balance team has not used the last two and a half months to actually play their game.
Let's change that. I'd like to see Nozh fly his HG-snaked, quintuple-stacking-penalized Vagabond against a normal LSB/Cruise PVE Raven with a heavy neut; no webs, no scrambler, no speed nerf. Have him put his money where his mouth is. If speed and nanoships are so much more powerful than battleships right now, surely the Vagabond cannot lose! Especially when it's going that fast. More speed equals more power, after all.
What do you say, Nozh? This sounds like an easy way to prove that your nerfs are so needed. I'd jump at the chance, if I were you.
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Nayomi
Minmatar Mean Anglo-Danes
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Posted - 2008.10.09 02:50:00 -
[142]
Make the maximum speed a factor based on a ships mass and hull integrity, ships that break this 'balance' would incur hull damage at some rate akin to heat damage. This would keep small ships faster than bigger ships and would still allow bigger ships to be fast at a cost.
This would also make hull modules sell more and be an actual viable component as increasing you hull hp would allow you to achieve higher speeds, at the cost of having a tighter fitting of course.
Or you could just make it so that MWDs only allow you to go in a straight line. Make them destroy your ships agility, something similar to the tunnel thing in standard warp. Make it a 'navigational computer' limitation. Make the MWD a 'travel to' module rather than a fighting module, it would still be useful in getting ships in close fast, but then to maneuver when they arrive they have to shut it off or perhaps fit both MWD and AB, you would even reduce the fitting requirements for MWDs a little to allow for both to be fitted. One to get in close, one to maneuver when you get there.
I also agree that there should be some form of missile and drone ewar. Right now they are kind of 'free' dmg. Maybe changes to defender missiles or some module that makes drones return to their home ship and orbit, or something that scrambles the instructions they are getting from their host, maybe a very small webbing bubble with a radius of like 2km or something. But there does need to be some form of ewar that effects missiles and drones, if not in the same way then at least to the same effect as turrets.
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Christari Zuborov
Amarr Ore Mongers Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.10.09 11:33:00 -
[143]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Edited by: Lyria Skydancer on 07/10/2008 12:01:16
Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 06/10/2008 20:21:16
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer ignorant drivel
....
Wow, this wins the whole argument. Nice edit.
Sorry but you're wrong.
Sorry but YOU'RE wrong. I guess I win now?
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Nuts Nougat
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2008.10.09 21:33:00 -
[144]
Originally by: Nayomi Make the maximum speed a factor based on a ships mass and hull integrity, ships that break this 'balance' would incur hull damage at some rate akin to heat damage. This would keep small ships faster than bigger ships and would still allow bigger ships to be fast at a cost.
Arrrrr! Vagabonds switched from dual LSE to dual hull reppers!! Tbh this would be an awesome sight. ---
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Fullmetal Jackass
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Posted - 2008.10.10 03:03:00 -
[145]
Edited by: Fullmetal Jackass on 10/10/2008 03:04:53 The best way to avoid an incoming missile is fly at an oblique angle to it's incoming flight path and hope you're moving fast enough that it's not agile enough to correct and hit you. Flares or chaff to distract it's guidance system helps too.
Is there a way to give missiles an agility rating so that they miss or hit less directly vs a fast moving object? Agility could decrease as the missile size increases.
I know it's kinda like tracking with guns, but realisticly at the speed missiles fly at, and with the lack of atmosphere for control surfaces to interact with, missiles in space should have a hard time hitting fast moving objects.
It's that or add flares and chaff or point defence mode for turrets.
That's all I got at the moment.
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.10 10:23:00 -
[146]
This is all that is needed:-
1. MWD killing scram. (great idea btw)
2. Several scripts for webs that give extra web range for less web str (to boost webbing in general and keep the programmers happy)
3. Nuets that take effect at the start of a cycle so the ships using them kill the mwd before the fast ships gets way out of range.
These additions would be a benefit to combat in eve and leave killing fast ships up to player skill and teamwork instead of just screwing over the entire game so f1-f8 ratting ships in static slug fests are the rule. |
Miriyaka
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.10.10 11:49:00 -
[147]
Originally by: Murina 1. MWD killing scram. (great idea btw)
Affecting, yes. Killing, no. Even without reduced strength webs, it means that a scrambler becomes too many slots worth of effectiveness in one slot with almost no fitting or cap issues and a mere 10% range sacrifice vs webs.
Originally by: Murina 2. Several scripts/ammo for webs that give extra web range for less web str (to boost webbing in general and keep the programmers happy as ammo has range to dmg ratio, web scripts can have str to range ratios so should be easy to program).
I am all for this idea. I'd love to be able to hit to 15km @ 50% (or something similar) with a T2 web, but still retain 10km @ 90% functionality if I'm in a blaster ship. The ability to switch to closer-range, higher-strength web capability with the risk of your target getting away while you're switching scripts is really cool too.
Originally by: Murina 3. Nuets that take effect at the start of a cycle so the ships using them kill the mwd before the fast ships gets way out of range.
Neuts already take effect immediately. The reason fast ships can sometimes get away is that microwarpdrives run in 10-second cycles, and if they're in the middle of a cycle when the target's cap is zeroed out, the MWD still operates until it needs to take cap again. This isn't a problem, and making scramblers reduce MWD boost (and possibly reduce mass addition as well, to reduce inertia/coasting) by 30-60% would fill the niche of slowing a ship more quickly with the tradeoff of shorter range.
Originally by: Murina These additions would be a benefit to combat in eve and leave killing fast ships up to player skill and teamwork instead of just screwing over the entire game so f1-f8 ratting ships in static slug fests are the rule.
Pretty much.
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destroyer555
Trioptimum Violent-Tendencies
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Posted - 2008.10.10 15:45:00 -
[148]
Heavy assault ship....
ie not meant to go at ridiculous speeds, doesnt matter if this hampers the nano***s experience, alot of work goes into making it relatively realistic with various ships for various roles....
I just plain dont see how a HEAVY assault ship was meant to do what it does right now, speednerf ftw, learn to use ships for at least close to their intended purpose
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lecrotta
lecrotta Corp
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Posted - 2008.10.10 15:52:00 -
[149]
Originally by: destroyer555 Heavy assault ship....
ie not meant to go at ridiculous speeds, doesnt matter if this hampers the nano***s experience, alot of work goes into making it relatively realistic with various ships for various roles....
I just plain dont see how a HEAVY assault ship was meant to do what it does right now, speednerf ftw, learn to use ships for at least close to their intended purpose
Yea lets ignore how much this nerf screws gang pvp and focus on a irrelevant word that could apply to dmg or be relative to its smaller and faster (when fitted the same) cousins.
Players define the purpose of the ships in eve or we may as well throw away all the fitting options and buy pre fitted ships with no options for variation.
SAVE NANO!!!!!!....only needing f1-f8 to kill is not a skilled style of combat.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2008.10.10 19:31:00 -
[150]
Originally by: lecrotta
Yea lets ignore how much this nerf screws gang pvp and focus on a irrelevant word that could apply to dmg or be relative to its smaller and faster (when fitted the same) cousins.
Players define the purpose of the ships in eve or we may as well throw away all the fitting options and buy pre fitted ships.
Play with words all you like, you still cant convince us that hacs going at interceptor speeds with relative cheap fittings are fine or normal or expected behaviour of that shipclass. ----------------------------------------- [Video] Support Barrage |
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