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ru43ht9uh438h54t8hy5
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Posted - 2008.09.05 03:17:00 -
[1]
For assisting BSs in a small fleet battle....
Capital Armor Repairer I Capital Armor Repairer I Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Damage Control II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Capital Remote Armor Repair System I Capital Remote Armor Repair System I Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I Amarr Navy Large EMP Smartbomb
Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Templar x3 Dragonfly x2 Firbolg x2 Einherji x2 |
Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.09.05 03:22:00 -
[2]
Fitting a sensor booster would be a huge help to the battleships. I've seen so many times when the carriers couldn't get a lock before the primary went pop.
-Liang -- I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent. -- Mahatma Gandhi |
forum mematar
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.09.05 03:28:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Liang Nuren Fitting a sensor booster would be a huge help to the battleships. I've seen so many times when the carriers couldn't get a lock before the primary went pop.
-Liang
We dont use Sensor Boosters on our Carriers. If they cant get lock fast enough than the one requiring the reps deserved to die anyway. We haven't had anyone die yet because of the Carrier's lack of Sensor Boosters.
Drop one repper for another EANM II and you are good. ---
http://stige.pingtimeout.net/evevids/ |
BiggestT
Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana
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Posted - 2008.09.05 03:34:00 -
[4]
hi ru43ht9uh438h54t8hy5 can i call you ruhuhuhhyt for short? Alt posting ftl :P
Proudly annoying FC's since 2007 Remove m for manditory in mwd! |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.05 08:25:00 -
[5]
Originally by: ru43ht9uh438h54t8hy5 For assisting BSs in a small fleet battle....
Capital Armor Repairer I Capital Armor Repairer I Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Damage Control II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Capital Remote Armor Repair System I Capital Remote Armor Repair System I Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I Amarr Navy Large EMP Smartbomb
Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Templar x3 Dragonfly x2 Firbolg x2 Einherji x2
terrrible setup - terrible to the extreme.
1) your lows should be a full tank - no matter what the situation 2x cap armor repairer 2x EANM 1x therm, ken, explosive hardener
Damage controls are good for Minmatar and Gallente - for Amarr and Caldari - working with your primary tank is better.
2) Mids, the cap rechargers are fine, and the ECCM is best replaced with a sensor booster or another cap recharger.
3) Drones, you should be able to field T1 and T2 heavy, mid and light drones as well as some ECM, armor and shield rep drones in addition to your fighters.
The fact that you put CPRs in your lows makes me wonder if you really should be flying the ship at all. ----
GO BLUE!! |
Irvin
Cygnus Alpha Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.09.05 08:28:00 -
[6]
Agreed with Felix
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Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 08:46:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
terrrible setup - terrible to the extreme.
How is he gonna run his reps then? The only error i see in his fititng is that 1) he needs to ditch one capital rep for a second EANM, and 2) he needs a third rr. --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 08:47:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
The fact that you put CPRs in your lows makes me wonder if you really should be flying the ship at all.
And the fact that you question that fact makes me wonder..wait nvm it just shows you underestimate the importance of capacitor to carriers. --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.05 09:29:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Evanade
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
terrrible setup - terrible to the extreme.
How is he gonna run his reps then? The only error i see in his fititng is that 1) he needs to ditch one capital rep for a second EANM, and 2) he needs a third rr.
Now now Sok, no need for the smack. . .I cannot understand why you are defending this setup even though I understand your defending the 'logic' of the RR setup - I still think its done wrong.
Lets try this:
3x capital remote armor rep.
5x cap recharger
1x CPR 1x EANM 1x Ken, Therm, Expl. hardener 2x capital armor rep
3x CCC
-- perma run 2 capital armor reps, 3 capital armor reps run for 6+ mins. . .
that seems like a more viable setup being that it has a halfway decent personal tank (perma run 2 capital armor rep), has okish resists (one EANM missing - so not terrible), it runs 2 remote reppers perrmanantly which should be enough considering you will have other caps, and 3 in emergancy situations for 6+ mins (which is an eternity in combat).
I suppose my issue with the setup posted above is that it sacrifices too much of the archons high resists, its too cap heavy and ultimatly, its too EFT driven in terms of seeking 'perma-run' setups. . .
So ya, RR carriers are great, but I think the setup outline above is problematic. ----
GO BLUE!! |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 09:33:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Evanade on 05/09/2008 09:34:59
You started with a semi-smack remark, i build upon it in the same manner, how does that set us apart in any way?
Local tank is irrelevant, get over it. I know a carrier is a prized posession for many but manically trying to get it to tank the most DPS while neglecting it's primary role, logistics, is not helpful to anyone. Dual capital reps are inferior to the extra cap that cpr's give you. Did you notice that a single capital remote rep performs at 75% of a local rep with the added ability of turning it onto any target at will? --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.05 11:45:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Felix Dzerzhinsky on 05/09/2008 11:46:27 within limits yes, and that debate over motherships are not interceptors was a very spacific argument about a very different ship.
If anything (lets see if I can hammer one point home) - local 'active' tank may be irrelevant, but 3 cap powerr relays AND 2 capital armor repairors is. . .poor judgment. If we are really going for the 'local tank is irrelrelavant argument, then it makes sense to sset up the lows:
2x EANM 1x therm, ken, explosive 2x CPR
that way, you have high resists and all your cap is for RR. ---
In the end though Sok, his setup was "For assisting BSs in a small fleet battle...." can you seriously tell me that setup is good for 'small fleet battles?' I find it qutie awful for the above reasons.
also, money says your Wyvern has a cap. shield repper and 2 shield boost amps. . . ----
GO BLUE!! |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 11:52:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
also, money says your Wyvern has a cap. shield repper and 2 shield boost amps. . .
It does but that is quite a different debate ;)
And yes while his setup wasn't ideal for the proposed situation he was on the right track at least. --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.05 12:05:00 -
[13]
glad we got that sorted. . . ----
GO BLUE!! |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 12:06:00 -
[14]
A little cooperation and understanding comes a long way --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Mariana Benn
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.09.05 15:42:00 -
[15]
I'm just about to purchase my first archon so I have no experience with cap ships, but I've been reading up on them and studing several setups. I'm wondering how you guys feel about adding a warfare mod to a logistics setup? Out of the 3, passive defense or damage control seem viable. I've noticed only a few setup include them and it puzzles me why that is?
Thanks for any info.
"Still haven't found that lost cheeseburger" -- Mar --
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Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:08:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Mariana Benn it puzzles me why that is?
Because caps are deployed with CS doing a better job of running ganglinks? -- I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:19:00 -
[17]
carrier doesnt have the slots for them you want 2-3rr, neut/cloak, 1-2x smartbomb --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:20:00 -
[18]
There are far more usefull mods you want in your high slots.
Btw what you were forgetting, is the purpose of his carrier:
Quote: For assisting BSs in a small fleet battle....
Now i dont know how small exactly his fleet is, but he probably cant rely on other carriers for remote reps (that is at least what i think he means). So then you want a decent personal tank.
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Mariana Benn
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:37:00 -
[19]
Assuming one has good skills and a mindlink implant warfare mods are pretty powerful. Isn't giving your fleet 20-25% armor resists across the board, or a similar decrease in cap need for reppers useful? If a carrier has 2 or 3 RR fitted that's a great deal of savings on cap I would imagine.
Also, what about training and fitting a triage module? If you gonna be the solo support carrier and aren't relying on other caps to rep you, would make sense. "Still haven't found that lost cheeseburger" -- Mar --
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Atsuko Ratu
Caldari VSP Corp.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:40:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mariana Benn Assuming one has good skills and a mindlink implant warfare mods are pretty powerful. Isn't giving your fleet 20-25% armor resists across the board, or a similar decrease in cap need for reppers useful? If a carrier has 2 or 3 RR fitted that's a great deal of savings on cap I would imagine.
It is useful, which is why there's an entire class of ship that does this. You'd be better off with another RR, a smartbomb, or a neut instead of the gang link on a carrier, and letting a CS or even a BC run the link.
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Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:41:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Mariana Benn
Also, what about training and fitting a triage module? If you gonna be the solo support carrier and aren't relying on other caps to rep you, would make sense.
if yo udo that youre dead anyway --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Bronson Hughes
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:42:00 -
[22]
Module layout has been discussed so I'll leave that for now, but I do have two suggestions:
1. You may want to consider swapping at least one of the CCCs out for SMCs. Your peak recharge goes down a little bit, but you have a bigger buffer against being neuted.
2. Carriers should never carry only fighters; it limits their options far too much. Each fighter takes up as much space as 200 heavies/sentries in your drone bay so drop a fighter or two and load up on things like sentries, lights, and logistics drones and you'll become a far more versatile platform. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:42:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Mariana Benn Also, what about training and fitting a triage module? If you gonna be the solo support carrier and aren't relying on other caps to rep you, would make sense.
No. You can't be RR'ed by the battleships and you're stuck there while every pirate within 25 jumps hears about a tackled carrier on the Evati gate.
-Liang -- I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent. -- Mahatma Gandhi |
Atsuko Ratu
Caldari VSP Corp.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 16:43:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Liang Nuren
No. You can't be RR'ed by the battleships and you're stuck there while every pirate within 25 jumps hears about a tackled carrier on the Evati gate.
-Liang
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Superfailsauce
Neo Spartans
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Posted - 2008.09.05 17:12:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Now i dont know how small exactly his fleet is, but he probably cant rely on other carriers for remote reps (that is at least what i think he means). So then you want a decent personal tank.
Anyone who primaries a carrier before support is a moron. If your support is dead you are dead anyway. ------- Larkonis' Alt, main got banned. |
Kakuremichi
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Posted - 2008.09.05 17:57:00 -
[26]
I have a few fits I am thinking about, the first for hotdropping with a small BS gang, the 2nd for dropping with a larger BS gang
[Archon, fleet fit] Capital Armor Repairer I Capital Armor Repairer I Core B-Type Armor Explosive Hardener Core B-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener Core B-Type Armor Thermic Hardener Core B-Type Armor EM Hardener True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II
Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Large EMP Smartbomb Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Heavy Energy Neutralizer Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defence
Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Garde II x10
[Archon, hotdrop (don't get primaried)] True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay Capital Armor Repairer I Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Damage Control II
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Large EMP Smartbomb Capital Remote Armor Repair System I Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Heavy Energy Neutralizer
Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Garde II x10
Pointers from the knowledgeable?
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Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 18:55:00 -
[27]
Looks good --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Evanade
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.09.05 18:56:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Bronson Hughes
1. You may want to consider swapping at least one of the CCCs out for SMCs. Your peak recharge goes down a little bit, but you have a bigger buffer against being neuted.
That is rather pointless with 50k+ cap. You need the shortest possible recharge while keeping a sensible setup, not buffer. --------------------------- sok alt - main got banzored |
Bronson Hughes
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
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Posted - 2008.09.05 19:11:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Evanade
That is rather pointless with 50k+ cap. You need the shortest possible recharge while keeping a sensible setup, not buffer.
I should have clarified: I'm of the opinion that 1x SMC and 2x CCC is an acceptable compromise for some proetction against neuts as long as it leaves you with enough cap regen to run your local tank and a capital repper or two capital reppers indefintely. If you fit with two CPRs and all CRs in your mids, this usually isn't a problem, but if you fit fewer cap recharge modules, 3x CCC is probably the better choice. OP was fitting a lot of cap recharge modules, so I suggested the SMC.
Clarity FTW. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.06 10:53:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Kakuremichi I have a few fits I am thinking about, the first for hotdropping with a small BS gang, the 2nd for dropping with a larger BS gang
[Archon, fleet fit] Capital Armor Repairer I Capital Armor Repairer I Core B-Type Armor Explosive Hardener Core B-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener Core B-Type Armor Thermic Hardener Core B-Type Armor EM Hardener True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II
Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Large EMP Smartbomb Capital Remote Armor Repair System I True Sansha Heavy Energy Neutralizer Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defence
Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I
Garde II x10
EANM is better then the EM hardener. . .if you have the cash, Amarr Navy or better will serve you fine. Make sure you take your Compensations to 5 - the EANM shines after those skills start to get high. ----
GO BLUE!! |
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