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Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.06.17 07:51:00 -
[1]
No mater what we do, drones still freakin kill us in a mater of seconds. No escape but to hit warp and pray you get out in time.
The changes are awesome, frigates are now more survivable and a very real threat. But now all an opponent does it let loose 3-10 drones and the fights over.
A freaken thorax with *5* mining lasers and has a few wasps completely wins because of drones. Hell they dont even have to target us, drones auto attack.
Also drones still continue to fire no mater how far away you get.
Please, please, please, fix this. Just quick fix, one small patch. Anything.
Please.
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Kalki Nibiru
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Posted - 2004.06.17 08:10:00 -
[2]
I see how you are upset, but really changing heavy drones doesnt really make that much of a difference. The pilot will just deploy light drones en masse and you will still get your ass kicked because you will have drones that can keep up with you.
Taken from the May 29th 2003 Devchat at EveGate . <Muaddid> Q: When will sentry gun and station and similar construction pods be introduced on the market? <Hellmar> we have various player owned entities already implemented. Sentry guns, power/shield generators, field repair mini-stations, mobile refineries. We are still working out the last tidbits of how they can be over taken, what is the penalty of having a sentry gun kill a n00b etc. and we have been a bit busy with plugging the holes that people have found.I would say that you'd start to see these items on the market in about 2-3 weeks, very expensive to begin with |
Nightfang
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Posted - 2004.06.17 08:15:00 -
[3]
Wrong. Small drones don't move fast enough, but they are a bigger threat, yeah.
Agreed with Lansfear. So totally agreed.
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Serilla
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Posted - 2004.06.17 08:19:00 -
[4]
Signed. Would like to make sure this, and the missile flight changes get put in.
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nikek notlad
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:08:00 -
[5]
why should a guy in a frigate be able to take on a guy in a cruiser? You pay 200K for a ship you can afford to loose - the other guy pays 6 mil? You should get your ass kicked
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Nightfang
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:11:00 -
[6]
Idiot. Go post in a relevant thread.
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Jim Steele
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:12:00 -
[7]
Originally by: nikek notlad why should a guy in a frigate be able to take on a guy in a cruiser? You pay 200K for a ship you can afford to loose - the other guy pays 6 mil? You should get your ass kicked
i couldnt put it better myself
Death to the Galante |
Mirvnillith
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:12:00 -
[8]
It's not a matter of winning over the cruisers, it's a matter of surviving. I think the excessive firing range of the drones should be enough so that a frigate and dip in-and-out to take pot shots (defendable against using shield boosting etc.). The fight won't be won by a single frigate, but the survival rate (especially if the cruiser is the aggressor) will be higher. --- Implement forum search already!!! |
shakaZ XIV
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:26:00 -
[9]
they just have to fix the ****ing range bug, thats all..
if thats fixed the frig that is targeted by the drones can simply speed off into the distance while the drones chase him? leaving the target free to be pwned for your mates. (i dont believe drones "give up" and go for the next target quickly?)
Oh well. They spend so much time balancing frigates etc, but such a bug is allowed to stay around for ages (last i heard it wasnt a "big priority")
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Gunstar Zero
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Posted - 2004.06.17 09:52:00 -
[10]
Originally by: nikek notlad why should a guy in a frigate be able to take on a guy in a cruiser? You pay 200K for a ship you can afford to loose - the other guy pays 6 mil? You should get your ass kicked
teamwork and good setups should allow a frigate / several frigates to have a fair fight vs a cruiser - as it is drones can beat down swathes of frigs before they can blast any of the drones.
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.06.17 10:42:00 -
[11]
The drones need to be fixed asap. It is absurd that they continue to shoot for infinite range !
I was 300k away and they were still shooting me last night !! LOL.
This should be TOP priority.
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Mitram
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Posted - 2004.06.17 11:25:00 -
[12]
While talking about drone bugs:
- After all threads are dead your drones wander off and attack stargates or asteroids or what ever is there. Tbat is quite dangerous especially in empire space when you were fighting against someone you are at war with.
- When you start to warp you loose immediately control over all of your deployed drones. The drones still attack everything (even if there is no thread. In my case they were around the stargate and attacking it). When you hit stop and you didn't really warped away it is almost impossible to get the drones back because they are moving. I had to warp away and back and then the drones were idle. So its a bug of the UI that closes the drone window when starting to warp but not yet warping.
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whodidat
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Posted - 2004.06.17 13:13:00 -
[13]
Having been involved in a recent battle in which an armour tanked megthron was attacked, he had a mix praetor and other drones deployed.
The attacking force consisted of 8 frigates 2 cruisers in the 1st instance.
result round 1. lose 1 cruiser 4 frigates. Then a scorpion joined us and also attacked (mixed battle fleet just as ccp want).
End result loss = 1 bs 1 cruiser all eight frigates last cruiser got away just before dying.
Now you could say that the megathron pilot was brilliant pvp player however he never fired his guns once all the damage was caused by the deployed drones.
Now i have to ask the question are drones to powerful ?
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Pehma Hess
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Posted - 2004.06.17 13:46:00 -
[14]
Are these drones doing this damage on the test server? The NPC cruisers I come against on Tranquility are quite resistant to my 8 mixed heavy drones.
Drones should be quite deadly to frigates, especially in mass. Granted, they shouldn't be able to hit you from 400k out. Base damage from a drone is 15-20 points of damage (then add player bonuses), multiplied by the number of attacking drones on one frigate should be very short work.
I don't think you should water down the damage of the drones too much, there needs to be a counter-balance for those missile barrages the missile boats bring to the game. Those missiles keep hitting even after the firing ship is destoryed, unlike drones.
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Minsc
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Posted - 2004.06.17 14:00:00 -
[15]
Originally by: whodidat Having been involved in a recent battle in which an armour tanked megthron was attacked, he had a mix praetor and other drones deployed.
The attacking force consisted of 8 frigates 2 cruisers in the 1st instance.
result round 1. lose 1 cruiser 4 frigates. Then a scorpion joined us and also attacked (mixed battle fleet just as ccp want).
End result loss = 1 bs 1 cruiser all eight frigates last cruiser got away just before dying.
Now you could say that the megathron pilot was brilliant pvp player however he never fired his guns once all the damage was caused by the deployed drones.
Now i have to ask the question are drones to powerful ?
Hmmm...a scorpion battleship got owned by drones....and he wasn't afk? Something is not right here. if the mega was using light drones to take out the frigates, they would have done too little damage to be a real threat to the scorpion. And if the mega was using heavy drones, they wouldn't have been able to take out the frigates very easily.
So either that guy is ubah at pvp or you guys aren't
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Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.06.17 16:12:00 -
[16]
Originally by: nikek notlad why should a guy in a frigate be able to take on a guy in a cruiser? You pay 200K for a ship you can afford to loose - the other guy pays 6 mil? You should get your ass kicked
No, i agree, one frigate pilot should get raped.
But 5 should always win if the right tactics are used.
But heres the truth. You can have the enemy *completely* locked down and all they have to to is deploy drones and let one frigate attack them. The drones will then auto fire and cycle through every opponent until all 5 frigates have been completely destroyed.
All I'm asking is give us a chance to destroy the drones before we are completely wiped out.
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whodidat
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Posted - 2004.06.17 16:32:00 -
[17]
Just as a little rider the bs was warp scrambled x3 sensor dampened x 10 , webified and tracking disrupted the frigates were 8 kestrels. The scorpion was armour tanked.
seems to me most powerful cruiser is now a thorax and any bs without drones isnt worth owning.
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whodidat
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Posted - 2004.06.17 16:37:00 -
[18]
So either that guy is ubah at pvp or you guys aren't
The corps is a well known pvp corps most players have 10-12 months playing time. We were checking out the new changes in pvp.
were as surpised as you are
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Veneth
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Posted - 2004.06.17 16:57:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Veneth on 17/06/2004 16:58:44 I think Heavy drones should blast frigates apart they're the anti-frigate weapon when on a cruiser or battleship. heavy drones cost me about 50k a piece your ship cost what? 100k? 250k for the top end. get shredded
But yes they fire way to far once a target is leaving :)
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Vigilant
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Posted - 2004.06.17 17:15:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Minsc
Originally by: whodidat Having been involved in a recent battle in which an armour tanked megthron was attacked, he had a mix praetor and other drones deployed.
The attacking force consisted of 8 frigates 2 cruisers in the 1st instance.
result round 1. lose 1 cruiser 4 frigates. Then a scorpion joined us and also attacked (mixed battle fleet just as ccp want).
End result loss = 1 bs 1 cruiser all eight frigates last cruiser got away just before dying.
Now you could say that the megathron pilot was brilliant pvp player however he never fired his guns once all the damage was caused by the deployed drones.
Now i have to ask the question are drones to powerful ?
Hmmm...a scorpion battleship got owned by drones....and he wasn't afk? Something is not right here. if the mega was using light drones to take out the frigates, they would have done too little damage to be a real threat to the scorpion. And if the mega was using heavy drones, they wouldn't have been able to take out the frigates very easily.
So either that guy is ubah at pvp or you guys aren't
What was the Scorp Armed with? I will bet All LARGE Weaps...Which generally suck up close...Why didn't the Scorp blow up the drones first? Then Kill the Cruiser/Frigate that deployed them? Or did the Cruiser/Frig just fly directly above and start launching drones? ...Sounds like the SCORP Driver didn't shoot at the right target? Destroy the biggest threat (fast moving drones), then destroy the ship....
I don't know I wasn't there...just reading what you wrote..
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Mr nStuff
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Posted - 2004.06.17 17:44:00 -
[21]
Yes.. Make drones useless.. They shouldn't be able to hit anything but asteroids.
5 R&D Agents, 10months, Zero BPO Offers.. Onboard navigational [Planetary Avoidance] computer.
My account will be suspended at the end of the current play period. Expires on 19. September 2004 |
Morikai Acler
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Posted - 2004.06.17 17:49:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Vigilant
Originally by: Minsc
Originally by: whodidat Having been involved in a recent battle in which an armour tanked megthron was attacked, he had a mix praetor and other drones deployed.
The attacking force consisted of 8 frigates 2 cruisers in the 1st instance.
result round 1. lose 1 cruiser 4 frigates. Then a scorpion joined us and also attacked (mixed battle fleet just as ccp want).
End result loss = 1 bs 1 cruiser all eight frigates last cruiser got away just before dying.
Now you could say that the megathron pilot was brilliant pvp player however he never fired his guns once all the damage was caused by the deployed drones.
Now i have to ask the question are drones to powerful ?
Hmmm...a scorpion battleship got owned by drones....and he wasn't afk? Something is not right here. if the mega was using light drones to take out the frigates, they would have done too little damage to be a real threat to the scorpion. And if the mega was using heavy drones, they wouldn't have been able to take out the frigates very easily.
So either that guy is ubah at pvp or you guys aren't
What was the Scorp Armed with? I will bet All LARGE Weaps...Which generally suck up close...Why didn't the Scorp blow up the drones first? Then Kill the Cruiser/Frigate that deployed them? Or did the Cruiser/Frig just fly directly above and start launching drones? ...Sounds like the SCORP Driver didn't shoot at the right target? Destroy the biggest threat (fast moving drones), then destroy the ship....
I don't know I wasn't there...just reading what you wrote..
He Outright said it was the Megathron that was usings the drones. So it wasn't a case of the scorp just being able to blast down the drone carrier. Scorps aren't that heavily armed compared to other BS's, unless they're running a light missile boat/ shield tank setup. Question, why aren't people using ECM bursts if they know they may be encountering drone carriers? Isn't the point of ECM bursts to act as anti drone targeting equipment? Hell I can see the Dominix being used much more in PvP with the buff changes on it.
But yeah, drone changes need to be made. Heavy drones were meant for anti cruiser equipment on BS's. Honestly they shouldn't have the agility and speed to hit a frigate, or at least hit very often. Sort of like how large weapons like 425's and 1400's can't hit them at the moment. Medium and Light drones are the drones meant to be used against frigates, mostly mediums. Though from what I've seen a swarm of lights can be nasty against npc frigates.
And why in gods name are people trying to armor tank a scorp? Especially after the changes to the amount of PG the large armor repairers take. By there buffs, at least the ones I remember, they're obvious shield tanks.
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Alidara
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Posted - 2004.06.17 18:11:00 -
[23]
What exactly are u aiming for ??? beeing unbeatable in a frigate ? Have the no-risk-at-all chance to destroy everything in a frigate ? It's already pretty impossible to kill frigates at close range now with any bigger ship and u keep whining u are still not invulnerable.....
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Veneth
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Posted - 2004.06.17 20:14:00 -
[24]
Sing it Alidara. If a group of frigates jump on a thorax they should be able to tear it apart. but if that thorax launchs heavy drones; frigates better run for there lives. the heavy drone IS the anti frigate weapon. they're smaller lighter and should be able to track a frigate without to much of a problem I always consider them my wingmen. medium and scout drones should be used more for frigate on frigate combat as npc "wingmen"
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Celeste Fireo
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Posted - 2004.06.17 20:46:00 -
[25]
Everytime i read a "Nerf drones, because they own frigates" thread i have to shake my head. Drones are designed to be the anti frig weapons. During the Gallente-Caldari war, the caldari were using small fast one man ships that the big gallente ships weps couldn't hit. So the gallente designed drones to counter smallfast moving ships, and the drones owned the 1 man ships.
Now frigs aren't one man ships, but the principle applies, Droens are the anti-frig wep - Now i do admit that they can kill a frig really quickly, which they should be able to- but think that a drone is a flying small gun, small guns do around 10-25 damage per shot, multiply that by 8-10 drones, and the frig will go down quick.
IMO drones should be restricted to classes, Light drones for frigs (still own though) heavy drones for cruiser -just like real turrets can't hit small targets- and what i want is a super big 500m3 bs sized drone
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Meridius
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Posted - 2004.06.17 20:54:00 -
[26]
A scorp lost to 8 heavy drones? That pilot needs to be tossed back into a noob ship.
Lets say 8 drones do an average of 15dmg a hit, thats 60dmg a second. If his tanked scorpion couldn't take that, well thats just freaking sad.
Even if he was taking fire, why the hell didnt he warp out
________________________________________________________
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Kalki Nibiru
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Posted - 2004.06.17 21:31:00 -
[27]
Soon frigate pilots are going to ask for nerfs to FoF Missiles.
Taken from the May 29th 2003 Devchat at EveGate . <Muaddid> Q: When will sentry gun and station and similar construction pods be introduced on the market? <Hellmar> we have various player owned entities already implemented. Sentry guns, power/shield generators, field repair mini-stations, mobile refineries. We are still working out the last tidbits of how they can be over taken, what is the penalty of having a sentry gun kill a n00b etc. and we have been a bit busy with plugging the holes that people have found.I would say that you'd start to see these items on the market in about 2-3 weeks, very expensive to begin with |
Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.06.17 21:46:00 -
[28]
The problem is that drone guns hit every time, have no tracking stats and can continue to hit you even if you are 300km away going 3km/s.
That is the problem.
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Arbenowskee
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Posted - 2004.06.17 22:34:00 -
[29]
Well frist, heavy drones are not designed to kill frigates, but BSs and cruisers. And second, drone hitting a frigate wich is 300 km away, doing 3km/s is just stupid. The problem is in the unlimited range of drones, once they lock on. I am not saying frigate could just move about when 10 wasps are around, but to give it a chance to escape... now it has none, other than warp out the moment drones are deployed. Which is almost imposible, especialy with heavy lag produced when drones are used.
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Koris
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Posted - 2004.06.17 23:16:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Koris on 18/06/2004 01:17:12
Originally by: Lansfear No mater what we do, drones still freakin kill us in a mater of seconds. No escape but to hit warp and pray you get out in time.
The changes are awesome, frigates are now more survivable and a very real threat. But now all an opponent does it let loose 3-10 drones and the fights over.
A freaken thorax with *5* mining lasers and has a few wasps completely wins because of drones. Hell they dont even have to target us, drones auto attack.
Also drones still continue to fire no mater how far away you get.
Please, please, please, fix this. Just quick fix, one small patch. Anything.
Please.
And that is exactly how it should be, you have a speed advantage over heavies use it! Also the Thorax was made to fight frigates as most cruiser so any changes to drones would be for the worst. The only correction that needs to be made is the range issue.
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