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Alcaeus Cetsuun
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2012.03.28 19:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
This is a huge issue for me and probably prospective players in general but I don't feel like going on and on right now so here it is nice and simple..
Combat is over way to quickly When you see advertisements for EVE you think big nasty epic battles in space. But all you get is....pop
New players want to get into combat and old 0.0 players want people to come in so they can blow them up but the game right now outright discourages players from participating. Especially newer players
Why? Because combat right now consists of toggling on all the things asap then something blows up...in seconds. It is devastatingly underwhelming. Even pvp videos on youtube are just pop..pop....pop. PVE is over before it starts too.
There is no time to make use of half the stuff you can fit on your ships No time to attempt to use maneuvering to get an advantage No time to appreciate whether or not what you fit on your ship is even helping or hurting It never even feels like you're in combat. There literally isn't even time to give it ****
Let's contrast the current combat vs. what it should be in my mind
Current Player1 enters lowsec looking for trouble, gets lucky and starts a 1v1 vs Player2 in same ship class. Player1 blows up 60(If lucky?) seconds later. Player 1 is unhappy and devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that Player2 is glad he won but also devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that
How it should be Player1 blows up after a several minute fight in which he had time to do things and stuff while getting into the fight receiving a nice adrenalin rush. Player1 is sad he lost but was entertained and has some plans for the next fight based on what he just saw Player2 is pumped because he just won a drawn out BATTLE decided on the battlefield as opposed to popping a little bubble in space in 60 seconds in a situation where the outcome was decided before the fight started
Fix? Ships need more hit points. All the way up to battleships. A 1v1 battleship fight should be 10min+ in my mind. Battleships should be "tanked" by default Frigates feel more like fighters right now. It's a mess.
I am not entertained. I just want real, drawn out and strategic fights. Not sometimes or in special circumstances.. all the time.
I actually just watched part of the presentation from the fanfest and saw previews of ship damage and shield effects. The sad thing is my immediate thought was you'll never get to enjoy those in game because those clips were actually longer than a fight lasts in EVE 90% of the time. |
Smiling Menace
Star Nebulae Holdings Inc.
230
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Posted - 2012.03.28 21:34:00 -
[2] - Quote
Alcaeus Cetsuun wrote:This is a huge issue for me and probably prospective players in general but I don't feel like going on and on right now so here it is nice and simple..
Combat is over way to quickly When you see advertisements for EVE you think big nasty epic battles in space. But all you get is....pop
New players want to get into combat and old 0.0 players want people to come in so they can blow them up but the game right now outright discourages players from participating. Especially newer players
Why? Because combat right now consists of toggling on all the things asap then something blows up...in seconds. It is devastatingly underwhelming. Even pvp videos on youtube are just pop..pop....pop. PVE is over before it starts too.
There is no time to make use of half the stuff you can fit on your ships No time to attempt to use maneuvering to get an advantage No time to appreciate whether or not what you fit on your ship is even helping or hurting It never even feels like you're in combat. There literally isn't even time to give it ****
Let's contrast the current combat vs. what it should be in my mind
Current Player1 enters lowsec looking for trouble, gets lucky and starts a 1v1 vs Player2 in same ship class. Player1 blows up 60(If lucky?) seconds later. Player 1 is unhappy and devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that Player2 is glad he won but also devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that
How it should be Player1 blows up after a several minute fight in which he had time to do things and stuff while getting into the fight receiving a nice adrenalin rush. Player1 is sad he lost but was entertained and has some plans for the next fight based on what he just saw Player2 is pumped because he just won a drawn out BATTLE decided on the battlefield as opposed to popping a little bubble in space in 60 seconds in a situation where the outcome was decided before the fight started
Fix? Ships need more hit points. All the way up to battleships. A 1v1 battleship fight should be 10min+ in my mind. Battleships should be "tanked" by default Frigates feel more like fighters right now. It's a mess.
I am not entertained. I just want real, drawn out and strategic fights. Not sometimes or in special circumstances.. all the time.
I actually just watched part of the presentation from the fanfest and saw previews of ship damage and shield effects. The sad thing is my immediate thought was you'll never get to enjoy those in game because those clips were actually longer than a fight lasts in EVE 90% of the time.
Frigate fights tend to be very short and very brutal but fights with larger ships do tend to take awhile to come to a conclusion so I am guessing you've been on the wrong end of a gank or two?
Also, people need to kill fast in EVE. The reason for this is that the guy you are shooting and beating has probably got a billion buddies burning to you so it's never really a good idea to hang around especially in low sec.
I've always rather enjoyed fights in frigates. It would be boring as hell if you gave everything a million HP and had to spend an hour grinding down a frigate.
I think you should learn a bit more about the game before you make proposals that aren't needed or wanted as the sub capital ships are fine for the most part. |
Zircon Dasher
93
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Posted - 2012.03.28 23:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alcaeus Cetsuun wrote: Fix? Ships need more hit points. All the way up to battleships.
In the begining there were ships. These ships had few EHP's and Alpha ruled the fledgling universe.
But the people cried out to thier Creator in despair: "Fights are over too fast! Whole gangs blink out of existence from the resounding boom of artillery!" The Creator smiled and told his children: "I will buff your EHP. No longer shall you fear of instantaneous explosion."
There were many thanks and, for awhile, the Creator's children were as happy as thier miserable existences would allow.
But after many years the people cried out in despair again: "Projectile Weapons are teh suck! Artillery users are laughed at in fleets!" The Creator smiled and told his children: "I will buff your Projectiles. They will make jelly all other weapon platforms. Alpha will be king."
-exerpt from The Holy Chronicals
Have we come full circle so soon? |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
510
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Posted - 2012.03.29 05:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP already did this years ago (as Zircon poetically stated). They raised the HP of ships by 50% and what ended up happening was...
- Buffer tanking became vastly preferred over active tanking (because you had more HP to work with and max out) - "Blobs" got bigger and/or gankier to compensate for all the extra EHP they had to punch through - Active tanking then became almost obsolete outside of solo combat because gangs over a certain size could alpha an active tanked ship FAR more easily than a buffer fit one - People continued to die pretty fast (i.e. none of what was actually intended with the HP buff came true). "Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
586
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Posted - 2012.03.29 06:04:00 -
[5] - Quote
EHP is already high enough, i've had enough of this stupid drake/scimi bullshit just goddamn tank your hulk you ******* |
Damikin
Nehalem Inc. Li3 Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.03.29 06:18:00 -
[6] - Quote
I find battles that last for a few minutes get old really quick. The adrenaline rush of a 10 second quick death frigate dual is amazing! With a fight lasting for a minute or more, i find it falls off pretty quickly (like lasers). |
Arduemont
Malevolent Intentions Ineluctable.
18
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Posted - 2012.03.29 11:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
The OPer obviously doesn't know the first thing about PvP.
Firstly, if you draw PvP out, it will mean that you can't roam looking for trouble, because help will be at hand whenever you attack someone in their home system. Numbers plays too big of a role in PvP as it is. Drawing PvP out would only make it worse
PvP in Eve is similar to how combat is in real life. Its about knowing when to and when not to commit to an engagement. The result of most PvP is decided well before any of the mods are even turned on. Its about information gaining, using your scanner, deception, knowing the ships you'l be fighting and their strength's and weakness, knowing what range to engage at, knowing the environment your fighting in, and knowing when to fight and when to flee.
If you think PvP is about firing your guns and turning your mods on and hoping, then you've missed the point entirely.
I believe that these facts arn't highlighted to newer players well enough. If new players were taught in the tutorial how to navigate low sec space in a "safer" manner, and how to choose engagements then we wouldn't have this issue so much. All the new players I ever talk to spend all their time worrying about how they dont have enough skill points or how they wont be good in PvP because they can't fly a Battleship, and daft notions like these.
Educate people on how to PvP, dont change the PvP. |
Zircon Dasher
101
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Posted - 2012.03.29 16:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Since when are coded tutorial programs really good at dealing with all the vaguery and variability of dynamic player driven content? |
Sephiroth CloneIIV
Vitriol Ventures BLACK-MARK
82
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Posted - 2012.03.30 05:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
PVP can last a while, if you are facing alpha fleet, not so much, but that's only if you primary.
Fleets can last hours, if you go through the timezones you can really play the game like its your life.
I had like 50 people attacking my drake, and it was MWDing away, and it still took like forever to kill, could not escape, but I could not die quickly either.
You don't have to fly glass cannons. |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
647
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Alcaeus Cetsuun wrote:This is a huge issue for me and probably prospective players in general but I don't feel like going on and on right now so here it is nice and simple..
Combat is over way to quickly When you see advertisements for EVE you think big nasty epic battles in space. But all you get is....pop
New players want to get into combat and old 0.0 players want people to come in so they can blow them up but the game right now outright discourages players from participating. Especially newer players
Why? Because combat right now consists of toggling on all the things asap then something blows up...in seconds. It is devastatingly underwhelming. Even pvp videos on youtube are just pop..pop....pop. PVE is over before it starts too.
There is no time to make use of half the stuff you can fit on your ships No time to attempt to use maneuvering to get an advantage No time to appreciate whether or not what you fit on your ship is even helping or hurting It never even feels like you're in combat. There literally isn't even time to give it ****
Let's contrast the current combat vs. what it should be in my mind
Current Player1 enters lowsec looking for trouble, gets lucky and starts a 1v1 vs Player2 in same ship class. Player1 blows up 60(If lucky?) seconds later. Player 1 is unhappy and devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that Player2 is glad he won but also devastatingly underwhelmed. All that making isk, fitting his ship and traveling for that
How it should be Player1 blows up after a several minute fight in which he had time to do things and stuff while getting into the fight receiving a nice adrenalin rush. Player1 is sad he lost but was entertained and has some plans for the next fight based on what he just saw Player2 is pumped because he just won a drawn out BATTLE decided on the battlefield as opposed to popping a little bubble in space in 60 seconds in a situation where the outcome was decided before the fight started
Fix? Ships need more hit points. All the way up to battleships. A 1v1 battleship fight should be 10min+ in my mind. Battleships should be "tanked" by default Frigates feel more like fighters right now. It's a mess.
I am not entertained. I just want real, drawn out and strategic fights. Not sometimes or in special circumstances.. all the time.
I actually just watched part of the presentation from the fanfest and saw previews of ship damage and shield effects. The sad thing is my immediate thought was you'll never get to enjoy those in game because those clips were actually longer than a fight lasts in EVE 90% of the time.
Man i literally can't wait to have to sit through a 5 hour 100 man fleet fight with your stupid vision in place
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Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
497
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Posted - 2012.03.31 14:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
In a small scale fight, having teh battle last longer would be nice, but once into large scale combat the problem is that battles could last a ridiculously long time. The idea of longer lasting small battles is good though. Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing. |
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