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Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.29 17:47:00 -
[1]
I think I've finally gotten enough capital to fund a supply business for my and another alliance. I want to do this because, jita has been getting much to laggy to trade in anymore, jita competition has gotten out of hand and requires too much logging in and playing the .01 isk game, and because everything I have done till now that has involved me in 0.0 has been to make money for me and I finally want to do something substantial for my alliance.
Here is my current condition. From the choke point of a .5 system and 0.0, Agil is 3 jumps out, Amarr is 12, and Jita is 22. there is a JB network linking two stations directly to the choke point killing about 7 or so jumps I would have to make without them. The JB's and stations are both not owned by my alliance but by a very large blue alliance.
Also, I can fly a freighter(obelisk) and iteron V's but cannot fly transport ships.
And I also have a budget of 1.5bn isk.
My current questions are...
Can I expect better advice for this method of trade on these forums, seeing as I'm not putting myself in direct competition with anyone except fellow alliance memebers?
I arrived to my decision about supplying 0.0 by reasoning that I would not have to spend nearly as much time with the .01 isk game, and that I could make some decent profit off it, am I wrong?
Based from your experience, what items are generally hot demand in 0.0? (So far I've thought of trading in fleet bs modules and nanoship modules , since in 0.0 these ships are the most likely to be destroyed and in need of replacement)
Should I purchase a freighter and use it so supply ships, instead of modules?
Should I put my alliance in a higher priority than our larger blue alliance(although my alliance has not stations to it's name (yet))?
Should I sell my goods at one of the two stations linked to the choke, or both?
Should I sell my goods at all of the blue's alliance stations? (including those that are blue to the blue alliance that we reside with)
How do I get demand to increase for 0.0 dwellers while having them pay prices higher that what they would have to pay at the nearest trade hub, when there is very little risk in going to a trade hub since we control the choke point and have a JB network deep into 0.0.? (basically , how do I get them to by my slightly higher then hub prices shit?)
And finally, should I just keep to empire trading?
Please add more to my thoughts and try to answer my questions as best you can while keeping your own tricks to the trade that you wish to keep secret, hidden.
And also add any of your thoughts that I have not addressed with these questions if y'all wouldn't mind.
..one last question, if you can't give me significant advice on a public forum, where is a place that I can get the advice, or who is willing to personally help me out?
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Teh Moniez
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Posted - 2008.09.29 18:13:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Teh Moniez on 29/09/2008 18:14:55
Originally by: Sodium Chloride I(...), seeing as I'm not putting myself in direct competition with anyone except fellow alliance memebers?
This is incorrect. You will be "stealing" customers from traders in other hubs. All though to be fair you do say "direct competition".
No ofense, but if you have a bit of 0.0 experience and a modi****of market sense than you should be able to figure out all of the questions you asked for yourself. Most of them have pretty obvious answers.
Originally by: Sodium Chloride How do I get demand to increase for 0.0 dwellers while having them pay prices higher that what they would have to pay at the nearest trade hub, when there is very little risk in going to a trade hub since we control the choke point and have a JB network deep into 0.0.? (basically , how do I get them to by my slightly higher then hub prices shit?)
Test it. Put stuff up on the market and see how low you have to go to convince folks that the extra they are paying is worth the time it would take to get to the hub.
There is alot more that could be said about this topic...but...this is MD...
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Sodium Carbonate
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Posted - 2008.09.29 18:25:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Sodium Carbonate on 29/09/2008 18:25:39 damned alt. |
Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.29 18:26:00 -
[4]
Yeah, I guess I am shouting at the statue for it to speak.
I guess I would be stealing customers from somewhere else, but hell it can't be that many. And I was guessing that those that could provide advice would be those that are supplying other alliances and could give me a few pointers rather than empire traders that I might steal customers from.
Yeah I already know most of the answers to the questions, but I might not have thought them all through and it'd be nice to get a healthy discussion going so that other wannabe lords of war can pick up and feul some conflict in 0.0 . (but then again this is the internet) |
Teh Moniez
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Posted - 2008.09.29 18:32:00 -
[5]
Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see a discussion about 0.0 supply and market shenanigans (might actualy be a thread out there if one looked properly). But saying "Can you please help me make ISK" (I know I'm exagerating) is a no-no.
Hit me up in game if you like, I may have some useful data for you area. Perhaps we can come to some kind of arangment. But not the kind of thing I'd throw around in a public forum. |
Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.29 19:27:00 -
[6]
That'd actually be a kind of cool thing to do when I get outta class. Typin this on the iPhone. I guess I do sound like a beggar, but hey can't hide my thirst for knowledge on the subject. is there any general advice that anyone is willing to share that's MD safe?
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Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.30 00:16:00 -
[7]
Guess that's how this cookie crumbles, time to get back to feeding the dogs of war!
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Clair Bear
Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.09.30 03:19:00 -
[8]
My limited 0.0 experience shows markets there to behave a bit... differently than you would first expect.
The obviously demanded stuff like t2 PvP fittings and expendables don't sell as well as you'd imagine -- alliances have their own logistics wings, and are self-sufficient. It's far better than relying on the market, doubly so when you figure in roaming remote market manipulators.
To echo other sentiments there's no substitute for experience. Try flying around and looking at volumes before you decide on a 0.0 trading strategy. |
CornerStoner
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Posted - 2008.09.30 03:32:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Clair Bear My limited 0.0 experience shows markets there to behave a bit... differently than you would first expect.
The obviously demanded stuff like t2 PvP fittings and expendables don't sell as well as you'd imagine -- alliances have their own logistics wings, and are self-sufficient. It's far better than relying on the market, doubly so when you figure in roaming remote market manipulators.
To echo other sentiments there's no substitute for experience. Try flying around and looking at volumes before you decide on a 0.0 trading strategy.
^this^
Alliances either manufacture everything they need or jump it in on a carrier etc. They also usually have a "limit" on the prices...i.e. 20% above jita so that member corps aren't gouging the other alliance members. So if you plan on doing this you need to speak to their logistics director etc. Most 0.0 space is NBSI anyways...so plan on losing ships and inventory.
One thing a guy does out here is this: He snuck a jump clone out to an outpost. Then he buys some of the stock and marks it up for a good margin, waits a day, then jumps to the next alliance market. Rinse n repeat.
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c4 t
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Posted - 2008.09.30 11:08:00 -
[10]
Originally by: CornerStoner
Originally by: Clair Bear My limited 0.0 experience shows markets there to behave a bit... differently than you would first expect.
The obviously demanded stuff like t2 PvP fittings and expendables don't sell as well as you'd imagine -- alliances have their own logistics wings, and are self-sufficient. It's far better than relying on the market, doubly so when you figure in roaming remote market manipulators.
To echo other sentiments there's no substitute for experience. Try flying around and looking at volumes before you decide on a 0.0 trading strategy.
^this^
Alliances either manufacture everything they need or jump it in on a carrier etc. They also usually have a "limit" on the prices...i.e. 20% above jita so that member corps aren't gouging the other alliance members. So if you plan on doing this you need to speak to their logistics director etc. Most 0.0 space is NBSI anyways...so plan on losing ships and inventory.
One thing a guy does out here is this: He snuck a jump clone out to an outpost. Then he buys some of the stock and marks it up for a good margin, waits a day, then jumps to the next alliance market. Rinse n repeat.
sorry for the noob question, but how does one sneak a jump clone in? |
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Achuni
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Posted - 2008.09.30 11:23:00 -
[11]
I have made a good bit selling ammo for damage specific against the rats in that area. I was reselling cruise missles for 500 P/U on a regular base. However, we where 30 odd jumps to empire, as you are closer people may just fly into empire and buy it.
On a side note:
Transports are now able to be caught by HIC, aka a Heavy Indirector. So, if you are going to buy a transport ship watch for them. |
Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.30 14:56:00 -
[12]
Yeah, my first challenge is to convince my potential customers and alliance mates that buying from the local market is easier than jumping out and going to the nearest hub.
Im really not worried about loosing my cargo in 0.0 because my and our blue alliance camp the choke point almost 24/7 with a jb from that choke going to two stations. I'm more worried about getting ganked hauling my stuff from the hub to the choke.
I'll heed the advice of consulting the logistics director about what is a reasonable markup for hauling the goods out to 0.0. |
Kabeil Blackdawn
The Shadow Order Vanguard.
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Posted - 2008.09.30 16:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Sodium Chloride Yeah, my first challenge is to convince my potential customers and alliance mates that buying from the local market is easier than jumping out and going to the nearest hub.
If your other alliance mates have all they need on the market, then most will not want to take the time and risk of getting to a trade hub. If they have stuff for their fitting not on the market, then they will probably just go to the trade hub. Also, if they see that sellers are gouging they will be retisent to buy. Ask corpmate what they have trouble finding on the local market. |
Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.30 17:05:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Kabeil Blackdawn
Originally by: Sodium Chloride Yeah, my first challenge is to convince my potential customers and alliance mates that buying from the local market is easier than jumping out and going to the nearest hub.
If your other alliance mates have all they need on the market, then most will not want to take the time and risk of getting to a trade hub. If they have stuff for their fitting not on the market, then they will probably just go to the trade hub. Also, if they see that sellers are gouging they will be retisent to buy. Ask corpmate what they have trouble finding on the local market.
Yeah I've already posted on our alliance forums asking for popular ship types and modules that my m8s fly. Problem is most of my potential customers are not in my alliance, and I don't have access to their forums.
So I've got to find a way ingame or attain access to their forums to get a better picture of what ships and mods are needed for the pilots in my customer base.
So if I've got a dominix pilot that looks on the local market, and can afford the 10% market increase on expensive mods and 20-30% on cheap mods, but can't find one or two mods and decides to go to a hub instead, it tells me that I need to diversify the mods I'm supplying as much as I can while buying as much volume as I can comfortably afford over that broad spectrum.(I've known this already but posting it for others)
Correct? or other thoughts?
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Lilin
Eye of God Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.09.30 20:16:00 -
[15]
I'd be willing to share my experiences as a starting trader in 0.0 to you ingame, for a little compensation. I'm doing exactly what you propose, and have been at it for about 3 months
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Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.30 21:59:00 -
[16]
Man, it's not EvE if it doesn't involve compensation. I'll send you an eve mail when I log in and we can work something out.
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Clair Bear
Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.09.30 22:20:00 -
[17]
As an aside, I'm utterly in awe of your standings and agent list. Almost my age, and never ran a mission nor shot a rat or player. The amount of additional taxes you must have paid in Jita makes me want to weep...
As a fellow research/manufacturing/trading (ex)-alt I salute you.
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Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.09.30 22:55:00 -
[18]
Yeah, I'm glad to be getting out of jita. I made profit, just took way too much time.
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Arthor Dark
Gallente N.A.S.A. Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.10.01 17:19:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Arthor Dark on 01/10/2008 17:20:04 Shoot me an eve-mail or convo in game. I'm a fellow alliance mate (I think I am ...unless you're the evil peoples in Curse, lol) that's been at it for a while down there and I'm certain I can give you plenty of advice.
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Sodium Chloride
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Posted - 2008.10.02 02:08:00 -
[20]
Man, MD may not be a place to get advice but it sure is a place to find people who can give it.
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Professor Leech
Transmetropolitan
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Posted - 2008.10.02 02:46:00 -
[21]
I will only offer limited advice in this case. Market history is your friend.
Originally by: Crawe DeRaven this thread is obviously going places
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Lubomir Penev
Section XIII Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.10.03 15:11:00 -
[22]
Selling in outposts you can make quite a buck selling NPC items, as in GSCs, nanite repair paste, POS fuel, POS parts... stuff that would make no sense to touch in Empire...
Also t2 supply is usually well covered but meta4 items not dropped by the local rats are not. (think selling good named nosferatus/neutralizers in Angel space for example).
-- I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
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