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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Tasko Pal
Heron Corporation
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:24:00 -
[991]
Having read a number of posts, I have a few things to say. First, I favor this proposed change especially if it is in conjunction with a skill queue. A year ago, I lost two months of skill training time on a paid for account because I couldn't log in for that time. I don't think it's fair that paid for accounts can lose training time while others are gaming the system via ghost training without paying. Nobody cared about my whining then and I sure don't care about the whining now. Must admit that making this change right after the "power of two" advertising is pretty shifty though.
Second, having said that, I see 37+ pages of comments, of which all but a slim minority support ghost training. That's strong incentive to keep the status quo. Wish it'd be otherwise, but looks to me like ghost training is here to stay.
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Wirrtuell
Caldari Nova Research
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:24:00 -
[992]
I've read to Page 5 and last Page... CCP, thats a good move WHEN ... Yes, when you apply Skill-Queue and when you divide the training-Time with factor 10 or more. How much time take it from Creating a Character to fly a Cap or Titan? I dont know, i think about 2 Years.
How long takes it to Cap a charakter in WoW (sorry) to Level 70 or 80? 2 or 3 Month? In Neocron it takes 1 Week to Cap a Char (Spy with Drones).
Please correct me when i am wrong with this dates how long it takes in other Games.
Greets
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Mora Makur
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:24:00 -
[993]
Originally by: Lutiae I spend my last 3 hours with looking for my next game. It will be Jumpgate Evolution once it goes online. I hope I will meet you guys there.
I hope they have ghost training there for your sake. |
MenanceWhite
Amarr Red Light Navy
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:26:00 -
[994]
w w w what? What's going on here? Did EA buy EVE-Online from CCP? ---
Originally by: Torfi There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses
Originally by: Oveur
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Miriyaka
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[995]
Edited by: Miriyaka on 13/10/2008 21:28:12
Originally by: Tizoca If the above is true, then could you PLEASE explain why you and everyone else are having massive fits? You aren't able to save all that much, and CCP is just tightening down to the exact same level as every other game on the market. So WHY are people acting like this is the end of the world? Because maybe once a year, you are no longer going to be able to not pay for 10-20 days? Face it - the ability to actually do a lot with "ghost training" (without paying with CC) vanished with the 30-day cards. This is just round two of the same thing. You have to pay to gain in the game after the 15th, just like every other MMO out there. You still don't have to be logged in, just paying for your account, for pity's sake!
Because I'm not always around to play eve. Because CCP's subscription system is so terrible that even on auto-subscribe, it still interrupts the subscription for up to a day (which would cancel your skill in training if you were away). Because I can't afford three accounts 100% of the time, but I can afford three accounts 75% of the time, which is a lot more than the one account 100% of the time that they'll be getting if this goes through. Because I burn the **** out on this game quite often even barring real-life obstacles, and find myself not caring much about it until a skill completes and I have a reason to return. Because it's a unique feature and a great courtesy to loyal returning customers. Because it makes training up a new alt far, far less painful.
Are those good enough reasons for you, or are you so such a simpering apologist for this crazy company that you can't think for yourself anymore?
Yeah, just like every other MMO out there. Take another look at that MMO subscription graph and ask yourself why Eve would want the rollercoaster subscription curve that flavor-of-the-month fantasy PVE pieces of crap have?
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chotaire
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[996]
Fictionary Dev Blog Post from ccp whoever:
Dear players, due to recent financing issues related to national problems we had to decide to disable ghost training for a limited amount of time. Due to our local banks unable to give us the necessary loans to expand our network and hire more programmers to implement the features you people desire, we saw no other chance doing so.
But please be asured this is only a temporary change, as we will rethink our priority list and reward everyone of you with a great new feature in return to be implemented before christmas:
Skill queueing goes in effect with the next major patch in the second week of December, at the same time ghost training will be back available to everyone. However skill queueing will only work if you have an active subscription.
We sincelery hope you understand this decision as we are forced to refinance immediate investments necessary to implement new features that CSM has requested to see available soon, as much as improving our network, hardware and database concept to cope with lag on fleet battles.
Furthermore, we will bring back 30 day time codes sometime next year. We hope this is a good compromise for all of us and we are looking forward to your feedback to discuss this matter before it goes into effect sometime soon.
Best Regards CCP whoever
CCP, if you did like that, I would say thumbs up. But most likely my reply is:
-4 accounts. Epic fail!
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Hun Jakuza
Naughty By Nature
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[997]
Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 13/10/2008 21:27:00 Oh wait, the CCP will losing not just alts, but active players too. They will never come back, after a couple months of pause. Might be 10-20% alt will still in game, but 80% of alts will not pay his accounts. I think 6 subscribe (two monts activating need an alt) in one year better then, nothing. CCP guys not enough smart peoples.
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Xankou
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[998]
In my opinion this would make sense if there wasn't such a huge difference in how fast characters train the different groups and if actually playing the game could speed up how fast you gained skill points..... Especially when you claim putting time and energy into the game affects skill training, when in reality this isn't the case.
The difference with EVE has always been grinding for 'in game money' not skill points. Now it's going to be paying 'real money' in exchange for skill points and that is why most people are seeing this as milking their proverbial teats for everything you can
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Willie Lowman
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[999]
Originally by: Mora Makur It will be Jumpgate Evolution once it goes online. I hope I will meet you guys there.
I hope they have ghost training there for your sake.
Does jumpgate have realtime training, or do you actually have to do stuff to advance? There's the difference.
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Yakumo Smith
Gallente When Darkness Falls
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[1000]
I've always plodded through this game, running my schemes, getting stronger, planning for the future. I've always felt confident I had all the time in the workd to plan, that Eve would be there, reliable and steady, letting my take as long as I needed before making my move.
But now twice in less than 2 weeks i've had a brief flash of doubt. Doubt that the game is going to be here in the future. This is what kills games like this, when people start to doubt that it'll be around.
My first flash of doubt was with the banking crisis, but you guys posted and put my concerns to rest.
My second flash came with the way the OP was written, a vailed attempt at making more money by killing off shadow training, claiming it's to protect the silent masses.
I pay for my accounts, I don't shadow train, I don't care that people do it, but twice now you've made me doubt that you'll be around in 3 years time and now i'm forced to consider if playing for another 2 years in this game is worth my while should it disappear down the pan. Your making me think "am I going to regret spending 2 years planning to be left with nothing?"
Congrats CCP Fallout, I really hope someone gave you that script to post as if not you've pretty much destroyed my faith in you guys being around long term.
Yak
I suppose this must be my sig. I'll do something cool with it eventually. |
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Arithron
Gallente Gallente Trade Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[1001]
Looking for Conflagration M BPO's, If you are leaving and have one, contact me.
Ari
Better to be a live dog than a dead lion... |
Gunner
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:27:00 -
[1002]
Originally by: Lestat'de'Lioncort I'm a Marine and I go on deployments obviously, and this is crap.
Finally a Marine turning away from his occupation. *** 2007.10.06 R.I.P. Hatuk my friend.
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Xordan
Caldari Meridian Dynamics Violent-Tendencies
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1003]
lol, I wouldn't mind if we're told the real reason for it.
"This practice upsets the balance of the game, and capsuleers who actively put their time and energy into working on their characters will no longer be unfairly affected by those few who have not."
isn't really true (as probably pointed out 1000x in this thread), because keeping my account active and thus my skill training requires no "time or energy" on my part in EVE.
I'm guessing that you're doing it to try and make more money...
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Jimer Lins
Gallente Noir. Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1004]
Originally by: Tasko Pal Having read a number of posts, I have a few things to say. First, I favor this proposed change especially if it is in conjunction with a skill queue. A year ago, I lost two months of skill training time on a paid for account because I couldn't log in for that time. I don't think it's fair that paid for accounts can lose training time while others are gaming the system via ghost training without paying. Nobody cared about my whining then and I sure don't care about the whining now. Must admit that making this change right after the "power of two" advertising is pretty shifty though.
Second, having said that, I see 37+ pages of comments, of which all but a slim minority support ghost training. That's strong incentive to keep the status quo. Wish it'd be otherwise, but looks to me like ghost training is here to stay.
I don't think they'd make this change without numbers to back it up. My guess is that ghost training is used by a vocal minority, who will make a lot of noise but don't represent a significant enough portion of the subscriber base to represent that kind of incentive to status quo.
Corp and Personal killboard
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AverageR
The Greater Goon GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1005]
Originally by: Inanna Zuni
5. If you don't want to pay then use the "Cancel Subscription" button. It states "Need a break from EVE ? Suspend your account. You can Re-activate at any time" which is entirely correct. It doesn't - contrary to what appears to be the opinion of many here - say that you can carry on getting stuff (like training) for free while you are NOT PAYING.
You are so ignorant I'm at a loss for words. What happens to any character's market orders when their account goes inactive? Or RP stuff and a load of other things? They are not paying for those either, effectively getting free isk. If you believe this has anything to do with balance or righteousness then you are badly deluding yourself.
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ghengis khan2
Shad0wtech
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1006]
all this squriming and writhing,. screaming like the victims you are , "ill cancel my accounts , youve lost tons of customers" blah de blah de blah, your all still here, eve is stronger than ever,. this isnt the first time and wont be the last, that you scream your impotent screams into tha darkness so vast..... [url] |
jack redgrave
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1007]
37 pages and counting... CCP well done.. havent seen a outcry like this since i started june last year.
Copy and paste this: "We needed more money so thats why we removed ghost training"
Btw it wont work as a load of people will stop accounts permanently. Stop breaking a beautiful game. Undo your mistake now.
P.S. People arent stupid .. stop using feeble excuses as well ..
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Hertford
Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1008]
Originally by: CCP Fallout We understand that this is a hot topic amongst players,
Well, to be honest, it was a complete non-issue until you poked it with a stick in the usual CCP hamfisted style we've all grown to hate and hate. |
Kiri Croft
Amarr New World Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:28:00 -
[1009]
Wow, i knew the iceland economy had crashed but this certainly takes the micky by forcing people to continue being sub'd to train skills. i have to say if these changes are made live then id say some of the player base will leave and go play warhammer or even worse WoW , timing could of been a little better i must admit. these changes do seem a tad excessive and poorly timed
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elohllird
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1010]
Money Money Money,
CCP has become what it never wanted to be a big faceless corporation, with no loyalty to the fans who put it where it is today. They become arrogant and only care about the bottom line.
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Ithnolin
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1011]
Originally by: Lutiae I spend my last 3 hours with looking for my next game. It will be Jumpgate Evolution once it goes online. I hope I will meet you guys there.
I spend my last three hours looking for how to speak english...have fun with Jumpgate. Can I have your stuff???
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Jimer Lins
Gallente Noir. Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1012]
Originally by: Hun Jakuza Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 13/10/2008 21:27:00 Oh wait, the CCP will losing not just alts, but active players too. They will never come back, after a couple months of pause. Might be 10-20% alt will still in game, but 80% of alts will not pay his accounts. I think 6 subscribe (two monts activating need an alt) in one year better then, nothing. CCP guys not enough smart peoples.
I'm having a VERY hard time being unhappy about fewer alts.
Corp and Personal killboard
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Rramar Claime
Amarr Task Force Zener Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1013]
Epic fail ccp... AGAIN! Is this really that important, are you really that poor? Hope this is the ***ing reason for the lag in those fleet fights or else you just made a reeaaally stupid decision again...
"I cherish the memories of a question my grandson asked me the other day, when he said; 'Grandpa, were you a hero in the war?' Grandpa said, 'No, but I served in a company of heroes." |
Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1014]
Originally by: Hun Jakuza
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Originally by: Fred Ayurveda
Haha, I didn't namecall, then you call me an idiot?
I'll call you an idiot now, though- get out of your mother's basement and consider why you could possibly be against your fellow players and with the corporation on this.
You're either in CCP, want to fellate them, or...I don't even know.
You are only an idiot if you namecalled. As mentioned!
Also, I am not working with CCP, and dont want to "fellate" with them. I do like them however for their good game, just as much as I liked SOE while they had their pre-cu SWG!
But this is stupid! No other online game on the market allows players to earn ingame stuff while not playing! AND PAYING! And so it should be! If you cant afford playing, thats fine! The game will be waiting for you when you return, and as you left it! That is fair to the PLAYERBASE!!!!! WHO DO PAY! To be honest, it is YOU who dont support the fellow players by letting others earn ingame value while not paying!
So yes, it IS a good move! Its called fairness to those of us who pay 15 dollar a month!
How many MMO game use time basic skill training ? No one. Oh no, or you will playing with Eve 24 year for max skills ? This is just a CCP business politic. They just want more money for long time trough.
How is that unfair that CCP wants to charge players for using their product? As I have allready stated: it is certainly unfair against those of us who pay and play!
Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL |
DigitalCommunist
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:29:00 -
[1015]
This thread will go to 60 pages unless they lock it.
And it won't matter one bit. Injury.. meet insult. :D
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Mr John22ta
Underworld Protection Agency The Crimson Federation
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:30:00 -
[1016]
Well CCP, although I agree with the nano nerf, and to an extent this, I think you really have scored a bit of an own goal with these two announcements so close together.
In the current economic climate, people are cutting back on many "extras", and I'm sure a few are having to consider their Eve subs. By announcing the Nano nerf, the GTC change, and now this, you have ****ed of a decent portion of your player base. This move wont earn you more money, it could very well cost you!
I still love this game, but I'm finding that more and more things are starting to bother me, (seemingly) constant nerfing, boring POS warfare, Blob warfare, lack of 0.0 entry points, this turning into "cap ships online", increased sec status hits for attackng in low sec, changes that are of benefit to carebears whilst leaving PVP'ers in the cold, lack of decent customer support, the community/forums going down the shitter, High/low/null sec balance to name a few. I don't often whinge, and I keep playing this game regardless. However one day I'm sure I'm going to quit due to fail after fail after fail on CCP's part
I just think that whoever is in charge really needs to get a grip, and realise this game is in danger of going the way of star wars galaxies. You really are upsetting alot of the playerbase.
I'm in no danger of quiting yet, but more and more of your longterm players are leaving the game for pastures new, and CCP needs to look at balancing the needs of the company (ie increased revenue), and keeping your playerbase happy.
A lot of not very happy bunnies out there right now, and the more that leave, the less revenue you get, making it a double fail!
C'mon CCP, get it together
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DigitalCommunist
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:31:00 -
[1017]
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker How is that unfair that CCP wants to charge players for using their product? As I have allready stated: it is certainly unfair against those of us who pay and play!
They do charge you for using their product. lol. Its not like you can play EVE when your account is inactive. Your character training != using product/service.
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Ithnolin
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:31:00 -
[1018]
Edited by: Ithnolin on 13/10/2008 21:33:35
Originally by: Miriyaka Edited by: Miriyaka on 13/10/2008 21:28:12
Originally by: Tizoca If the above is true, then could you PLEASE explain why you and everyone else are having massive fits? You aren't able to save all that much, and CCP is just tightening down to the exact same level as every other game on the market. So WHY are people acting like this is the end of the world? Because maybe once a year, you are no longer going to be able to not pay for 10-20 days? Face it - the ability to actually do a lot with "ghost training" (without paying with CC) vanished with the 30-day cards. This is just round two of the same thing. You have to pay to gain in the game after the 15th, just like every other MMO out there. You still don't have to be logged in, just paying for your account, for pity's sake!
Because I'm not always around to play eve. Because CCP's subscription system is so terrible that even on auto-subscribe, it still interrupts the subscription for up to a day (which would cancel your skill in training if you were away).
<<Since when? I have never once had my account suspeneded while on auto-subscribe.>>
Because I can't afford three accounts 100% of the time, but I can afford three accounts 75% of the time, which is a lot more than the one account 100% of the time that they'll be getting if this goes through. Because I burn the **** out on this game quite often even barring real-life obstacles, and find myself not caring much about it until a skill completes and I have a reason to return.
<<Really? That ONE level V skill makes your day? Sad...>>
Because it's a unique feature and a great courtesy to loyal returning customers. Because it makes training up a new alt far, far less painful.
Are those good enough reasons for you, or are you so such a simpering apologist for this crazy company that you can't think for yourself anymore?
Yeah, just like every other MMO out there. Take another look at that MMO subscription graph and ask yourself why Eve would want the rollercoaster subscription curve that flavor-of-the-month fantasy PVE pieces of crap have?
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Sagan
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:31:00 -
[1019]
Well you could keep your skill training while away, you'll just have to pay for it. Its up to you if that's worth it. Maybe a compromise where you get only 30 days of 'ghost training' would work.
Maybe I misunderstood the change. As long as you have a subscription, you can train well offline? Is this how it is going to be?
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Tellnan Matkiel
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.10.13 21:31:00 -
[1020]
Well, personally I am very happy that this is being removed.
Getting on in the game for free - and I mean real-world free - is lame. Why should x character continue to train without paying a subscription when y character continues to pay a subscription? No reason that I can tell.
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