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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Liu
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Posted - 2008.12.09 19:06:00 -
[5761]
Originally by: Forino Ovoli Absolutely NO sympathy for anyone whining about this decision (fix) to the mechanics. Shame on CCP for allowing it to go on this long.
As someone that pays annually for several subscriptions, and has done so for years now, I was never happy that others could cheat the system and train while not playing.
so, how do you feel about rested experience on WoW or LoTRO? is it also unfair for those playing 24/7?
anyway, you missed the point of the mourning by a long shot.
Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
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Galea Wildfang
Inebriated Consortium Enterprises Inc.
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Posted - 2008.12.09 19:15:00 -
[5762]
Originally by: Jamburasca
I don't think it's funny at all. I'm dead serious. I am sick of players who stomp their feet and demand to not pay for the product they use. Do you think it is good customer service to let them do that? Do you think any business can survive by giving their product away? Try that with your bank, telephone company or gas station. (...)
Let's see ...
If I register with my gas station, I get a refund for every little bit I fuel my motorcycle. So with your words, they must be close to shut their doors.
I threatened my phone company as I was unhappy with a couple of their changes, so the backpedaled and I am where I was before.
Secondly, no one can use or play his character, while he's unsubscribed. He can only train a skill for whatever reason. Those people don't use up bandwith, they aren't lagging the server, they aren't even doing anything to the database. All they do is comming back and reactivate their account for another 30 or 60 days, most likely do nothing but changing skills, and that's about it. And the arguement about the server statistics isn't saying anything either, as those ghost training people do so on their alts usually, while playing their mains.
The main thing is though, if CCP did come forward with something like: 'recently sold a Titan V Pilot on the forum for close to 80 billion, and since then we see a large increase in people ghost training their alts and we wish that to stop.' would have been understandable. But the way they did it looks like they want to squeeze some more cash out of their customers and that's about it.
I don't think it makes any difference for their wallet, as some people will quit while others keep their alts alive. So in the end, it doesn't do anything beside losing some customers. And that's probably the worst thing, any company can do. I saw alot of companies fail or get close to shut down their biz just because they didn't care for their customers much.
Flamming leads to anger, anger leads to pain, pain leads to suffering, and suffering leads to teh Dark Side !
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Galea Wildfang
Inebriated Consortium Enterprises Inc.
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Posted - 2008.12.09 19:20:00 -
[5763]
Edited by: Galea Wildfang on 09/12/2008 19:21:40
Originally by: Forino Ovoli Absolutely NO sympathy for anyone whining about this decision (fix) to the mechanics. Shame on CCP for allowing it to go on this long.
As someone that pays annually for several subscriptions, and has done so for years now, I was never happy that others could cheat the system and train while not playing.
Absolutely no sympathy to anyone paying anually. As someone living on GTC's, I demand everyone paying close to 20 Ç per month ....
:p
Flamming leads to anger, anger leads to pain, pain leads to suffering, and suffering leads to teh Dark Side !
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fried eggs
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.09 20:21:00 -
[5764]
Originally by: Forino Ovoli Absolutely NO sympathy for anyone whining about this decision (fix) to the mechanics.
The "mechanics" were never broken. CCP incorrectly (IMO) perceived a way to squeeze more money out of their customers and rendered a former "Feature" unusable.
Originally by: Forino Ovoli Shame on CCP for allowing it to go on this long.
Shame on CCP for allowing their customers to use an advertised "FEATURE" for so long? Please.
Originally by: Forino Ovoli As someone that pays annually for several subscriptions, and has done so for years now, I was never happy that others could cheat the system and train while not playing.
If you have proof that someone has "cheated", petition it. Otherwise, keep your allegations to yourself. BTW...do you by chance remember the T20 incident? What's your position on playing a game where dev's that are exposed as cheaters are left on staff? If that doesn't bother you, but someone that utilizes a documented feature of the same game does, I don't think we have any common ground to reach.
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Kaptain Kruncher
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Posted - 2008.12.09 20:39:00 -
[5765]
You can argue and whine all you want, you had a free ride for awhile and now it's over.
Ghost training is done. You lose. Argue that.
Besides fried eggs, I thought you said you were gonna quit.
You sound like a dissatisfied customer- you should quit.
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Air Xonix
Minmatar Ping 127.0.0.1 R.I.S.K
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Posted - 2008.12.09 20:47:00 -
[5766]
Unfortunately CCP disabled this feature when i was started to learn long skill on main character but i hope CCP knows what they do.
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Tasty Bit
Gallente UNITED STAR SYNDICATE
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Posted - 2008.12.09 20:48:00 -
[5767]
Originally by: fried eggs The "mechanics" were never broken. CCP incorrectly (IMO) perceived a way to squeeze more money out of their customers and rendered a former "Feature" unusable.
Nothing more. Nothing less.
No bug (they already said ages ago they wouldnt be removing it from TQ when they removed the feature from the Chinese server). It wasn't a bug then, it's not a bug now.
No "cheaters"; quite how someone would accomplish this baffles me. Nobody playing the game for free.
More cash. Period. Gimme gimme gimme. Back and fire spring to mind.
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fried eggs
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.09 20:51:00 -
[5768]
Originally by: Kaptain Kruncher You can argue and whine all you want, you had a free ride for awhile and now it's over.
Ghost training is done. You lose. Argue that.
Besides fried eggs, I thought you said you were gonna quit.
You sound like a dissatisfied customer- you should quit.
Let me guess, you are an alt of someone that got their silly arguments crushed. Well, don't feel bad. In one respect you are right. We probably will lose. CCP probably will not reinstate Un-subbed training, nor bring the cost of the 60-day GTC back into line, nor make 30 and/or 90 day GTC available again, nor etc... So, in the end, those of us that are true to our words will be gone (just because you cancel your account does not mean you lose access to the time you have already paid for genius). There will be some people that forgive and forget no doubt. I however, will not be one of them. As someone said earlier (maybe even me) "Enjoy your version of EVE, it will be alot different from the one I played".
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Kaptain Kruncher
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Posted - 2008.12.09 21:15:00 -
[5769]
Yawn.
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Squirrrel
Gallente Squirrrel Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.09 21:24:00 -
[5770]
Originally by: Kaptain Kruncher Yawn.
You just re-read your own post right?
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Squirrrel
Gallente Squirrrel Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.09 21:25:00 -
[5771]
Look, when are all you whiners - harping on about how CCP obviously don't give a damn about their customers - going to realise that CCP don't give a damn how you feel about this change, nor retaining you as customers?
When will you realise that rational business sense is for them to make this change regardless of how you feel because they can and because it's unfair on their bottom line. They don't give a damn if you all stop subscribing and just leave the game, spending your stupid a$$ whiner-money somewhere else, and making you pay for your previously free lunch at the same time? Do you not understand profit margins? Sheeesh.. None of you understand what it's like to run a business. You all act like you've never played Theme Park.
When will you realise that their reasoning for stating ghost training was too much of a load on their DB was to protect those people who DO pay, and because you're too stupid to understand the simplicity of the fact that too many alts are ghost trained for selling on and that maximising money is the only corporate aim? It was a white lie. The good kind. To protect you.
How many of you maggots sat staring at the login screen for hours on end, getting your free lunch and EveFix when your sub ran out; whilst you were laming it up abusing the ghost training bug?
So what if this used to be classed as a feature? They play the game too, they don't have time to iron out all the stupid things you want changed or what the game needs to have changed. It was only 5 years. You expect them to fix bugs when YOU want them to? Be thankful they give you free patches, let alone expansions. Eve isn't the same as any other game you know, they could easily get away with **** like that as this is the best internet spaceship game there is, if not best MMO.
Just pay, play and shut the hell up and roll with it. Only kids stamp their feet and complain. Adults suck it up or just leave. No one needs your so-called essential feedback. No one cares you're leaving. No one will care you're gone.
You just can't get stuff for free, the real world isn't like that, Eve isn't like that - even if you knew T20.
Seriously, you lot make me sick. I hope you all leave so I can enjoy this game in peace.
Adapt or die ftw phailers... etc.
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Kaptain Kruncher
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Posted - 2008.12.09 21:39:00 -
[5772]
Quote: You all act like you've never played Theme Park.
Singlehandedly THE best comment ever.
If you were running for CSM and I wasted the time to vote for a CSM, You would have my vote.
I tip my empathy implant to you Squirrel
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Squirrrel
Gallente Squirrrel Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.09 22:09:00 -
[5773]
Originally by: Kaptain Kruncher
Quote: You all act like you've never played Theme Park.
Singlehandedly THE best comment ever.
If you were running for CSM and I wasted the time to vote for a CSM, You would have my vote.
I tip my empathy implant to you Squirrel
Well... I ask you, these people have no attention to detail and just see what they want to see right?
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Von Domiki
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Posted - 2008.12.09 23:53:00 -
[5774]
Originally by: Squirrrel
Just pay, play and shut the hell up and roll with it. Only kids stamp their feet and complain. Adults suck it up or just leave. No one needs your so-called essential feedback. No one cares you're leaving. No one will care you're gone.
That's all very reasonable, but what do you say about the issue of people that can't play for RL reasons, but wanting to keep up? Playing just to keep skill training is somewhat irrational. Not only CCP can count money well, some people too.
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Madius
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Posted - 2008.12.10 00:08:00 -
[5775]
Originally by: Von Domiki That's all very reasonable, but what do you say about the issue of people that can't play for RL reasons, but wanting to keep up? Playing just to keep skill training is somewhat irrational. Not only CCP can count money well, some people too.
Too bad for them? They should be happy that they can progress at all while not playing, most MMOs - hell, most games, period - require you to actually be there doing things to progress.
If they don't want to pay, they don't get skill points. It's not rocket science.
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Travyrr
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Posted - 2008.12.10 00:13:00 -
[5776]
Well, I couldn't leave Eve without posting my rant along with the thousands of others here. Yup, you guessed it, another loyal gamer of over 3 years has finally had enough. CCP--you can only screw your players over for so long! Add my two accounts to the long list of people who won't be paying their subscriptions.
I can't help but believe this is a ploy to get rid of all the older players in the game. Let's face it--most of the true fans of this game had multiple accounts, especially the vets. This is a great way to reduce the vets in the game by a factor of two, or three, or five. I guess it will be up to the new players to carry the torch. Hopefully CCP will treat them better than it has treated us.
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Squirrrel
Gallente Squirrrel Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.10 00:13:00 -
[5777]
Originally by: Von Domiki
Originally by: Squirrrel
Just pay, play and shut the hell up and roll with it. Only kids stamp their feet and complain. Adults suck it up or just leave. No one needs your so-called essential feedback. No one cares you're leaving. No one will care you're gone.
That's all very reasonable, but what do you say about the issue of people that can't play for RL reasons, but wanting to keep up? Playing just to keep skill training is somewhat irrational. Not only CCP can count money well, some people too.
My answer would be: Context.
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Darth Gus
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Posted - 2008.12.10 09:23:00 -
[5778]
Edited by: Darth Gus on 10/12/2008 09:25:01
Originally by: Forino Ovoli Absolutely NO sympathy for anyone whining about this decision (fix) to the mechanics. Shame on CCP for allowing it to go on this long.
As someone that pays annually for several subscriptions, and has done so for years now, I was never happy that others could cheat the system and train while not playing.
There's a world of difference between CCP needing the money and telling their players, "We need the money!" and them telling their players, "It was a bug, not a feature. It put an undue load on our database. It wasn't fair to people who got a discount for paying for a full year at a time and actually played the game all year. You were cheating us. This former feature was really a bug. Really. We stealth-edited the manual to say so. Now buy the new and improved bloatedly-priced industry-standard 60 day GTC's or else your skills will stop training!"
Anybody who doesn't see this difference is either a) a selfish asshat, b) a selfish asshat troll, or c) a selfish asshat troll CCP alt handling customer relations by disinformation.
Which are you, sir? And how will you feel when you've paid for your precious year-long subscription and CCP closes the doors the very next day because they ran off the rest of their paying customers, CCP alts aside?
Argue that.
--- Darth Gus One Terribly Dissatisfied Soon to Be Former Customer
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marie blueprint
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Posted - 2008.12.10 12:32:00 -
[5779]
the offline training used to be a selling point that ccp advertised.tbh with this the price hikes killing and jacking gtc and nerf after nerf it's starting to look like ccp wants to close.
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Darth Gus
Amarr Total Holdings Corporation
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Posted - 2008.12.10 13:00:00 -
[5780]
Edited by: Darth Gus on 10/12/2008 13:03:26 This whole topic is making me wish the United States would put a steep tariff on online games provided by other countries. Or maybe specifically Iceland.
Seriously. People should be protected from this kind of dishonesty.
--- Darth Gus One Terribly Dissatisfied Soon to Be Former Customer
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Madius
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Posted - 2008.12.10 14:21:00 -
[5781]
Originally by: marie blueprint the offline training used to be a selling point that ccp advertised.tbh with this the price hikes killing and jacking gtc and nerf after nerf it's starting to look like ccp wants to close.
Offline training still exists. What you can't do anymore is train while your account is inactive.
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Feyzir
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:09:00 -
[5782]
Originally by: Madius
Originally by: marie blueprint the offline training used to be a selling point that ccp advertised.tbh with this the price hikes killing and jacking gtc and nerf after nerf it's starting to look like ccp wants to close.
Offline training still exists. What you can't do anymore is train while your account is inactive.
Newb alert: There was a way of changing your skill training without starting up the EVE client? Was there some web service that I was unaware of?
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Sassaniak
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:27:00 -
[5783]
Edited by: Sassaniak on 10/12/2008 15:32:36 Mew? Whining about not wanting to pay? Huh? I must have missed something, If you stop paying for wow or any other game do you still skill train? Is your account even still available for reactivation? (Ive only played this MMORPG) If you pay you still train, If you stop Paying you stop training, online or off, why is this such an issue? are you playing the game if your account is inactive? have you been training your alt to lev 5 on everything through ghost training and now you cant get carriers 5? is that really a thing to whine about? So now you have to pay consistantly for your 10 alts, and the alt to isk ratios is down compaired to buying GTC or even (god forbid) actually use cash,I missed the actual complaints somewhere, "what i cant sell cheap alts anymore?" is that really a valid complaint?
Oh yeah and to answer the above, you are referring to having to pay to switch skills right? how long is carriers 5 or dreads 5 or freighters 5 or even titans 5? a 30 day gtc wont cover all of it so you could get free training time, Or were you referring to having to just log in, to switch skills, which, if you were paying isnt really that big of a deal, and has been debated (skill que) to death. but not fixes,
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Thraile
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:37:00 -
[5784]
That's it. ;)
I will not be resubbing any of my accounts. This is the final nail in the coffin for my Eve career, after 5 years.
A small drop in the ocean you say; perhaps. However, if enough people see how you fare, maybe you will get the point.
If it isn't broken, don't fix it.
Goodbye, and thank you for the good times. Good luck downhill ;)
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fried eggs
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:41:00 -
[5785]
Originally by: Sassaniak stuff...
I realize it's not practical to ask you to read this entire thread, but would it be too hard for you to read a couple of pages? Maybe the first and last 1 or 2? I think that you will find that your complaints about our complaints are off base. If you don't reach that conclusion, read the entire thread. If you still don't get it, well, there is really little else left to say.
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Madius
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:46:00 -
[5786]
Originally by: Thraile That's it. ;)
I will not be resubbing any of my accounts. This is the final nail in the coffin for my Eve career, after 5 years.
A small drop in the ocean you say; perhaps. However, if enough people see how you fare, maybe you will get the point.
If it isn't broken, don't fix it.
Goodbye, and thank you for the good times. Good luck downhill ;)
If a bunch of alt-whoring freeloaders leave, all the better.
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SusanXP
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Posted - 2008.12.10 15:48:00 -
[5787]
Meh. Ghost character training was a win-win situation.
I really hope it will be reenabled again.
I have an account which gets paid via CC every year and another one with GTC and I have to admit the Ghost Char Training was quite useful. Again, hop it gets enabled again. Best regards.
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fried eggs
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.10 16:08:00 -
[5788]
Originally by: Madius If a bunch of alt-whoring freeloaders leave, all the better.
Please define "alt-whoring freeloader" for me.
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Lord Fitz
Project Amargosa
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Posted - 2008.12.10 16:20:00 -
[5789]
You can argue 'fair' all you like, that is a strawman arguement. The real questions are if it actually WILL increase CCP's revenue, which it won't, it will decrease it. And why they feel the need to lie to the playerbase, repeatedly. There are many very smart people playing this game (and the rest), who don't take kindly to being treated like idiots.
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FinrodFelagund
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.12.10 18:14:00 -
[5790]
Hearing this makes me happy and sad. Happy because I didn't activate my other 3 accounts like I was going to, and sad because I reactivated two for the specific purpose of setting long term skills before I come back.
With all the multi-accounting and with skills that can take 3 months to train, this was pretty ill thought out. If you quit now there's not really incentive to come back. It's nice to know you're going to have carrier 5 or whatever finished if you ever do come back to the game.
I'm not really sure I want to come back now. This is nothing but a money grab and if this is to be a new trend in ccp you guys are gonna go down hill faster then SOE.
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