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Soulspatch
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:26:00 -
[1]
Why is the AbaddonÆs Capacitor and Powergrid performance so crappy compared to other T3 battleships? And it's the most cap reliant BS of the four!!! The comparisons are done on EFT, first with no skills and then all at L5. All guns are T2.
Ship Cap Guns Duration
Maelstrom 6,000 û 5x1400mm Limited by ammo
Rokh 6,000 û 5x425mm 16 minutes 1 second
Abaddon 6,375 û 5xTackyon 3 minutes 40 seconds
Hyperion 7,500 û 6x425mm 12 minutes 16 seconds
Maelstrom 6,000 û 8x1400mm Limited by ammo
Rokh 6,000 û 7x425mm 26 minutes 48 second
Abaddon 6,375 û 7xTackyon 3 minutes 32 seconds
Hyperion 7,500 û 8x425mm 16 minutes 51 seconds
This only to demonstrates that the Abaddon is not inline with the other three T3 battleships. It's cap needs to be adjusted so it has at least a similar performance of 25 minutes endurance with 7 guns. And unlike the Maelstrom and Hyperion T3 BS, the Abaddon cannot fit 8 guns without additional fitting, the Rokh is only 150 Powergrid short from fitting an 8th gun, the Abaddon is short 3,450 for an 8th gun. I'm not as concerned about the number of guns, but the Cap really needs looking at. A little extra in the Powergrid would be nice too, ideally 1,500-2,000.
No I don't want an ubber ship and I am not complaining about the normally crappy Amarr capacitor on cap reliant ships. I just want it brought into line with the other T3 battleships. Please look into this Dev Team. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:28:00 -
[2]
obvious troll |
Soulspatch
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:33:00 -
[3]
Go kill someone elses thread idiot. |
Mikael Mechka
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:46:00 -
[4]
I disagree with your view on the Abaddon.
While I have never flown it myself, I have flown alongside people who have. They have never once complained that the Abaddon lacks capacitor power.
Also, you are using Tach's as the basis for comparison? What for? For pve? The Apoc seems to be the formost mission runner among the Amarr ships anyway.
For pvp, why oh why would you be using long range weapons? Typical pvp fit has the Abaddon fit with a mean armour buffer and short range pulse lasers I believe. Pvp doesn't last very long, so the cap lasting more than 2 minutes isn't a big issue as most people with a lot of skillpoints devoted to pvp will no doubt tell you: overheating can't be done for a long time.
(For reference: I do not fly Amarr battleships [I still like my Harbinger], neither do I overheat my modules [haven't bothered to train it yet]) |
Strill
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:48:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Soulspatch
Go kill someone elses thread idiot.
You talk about the "normally crappy" capacitor capacity of amarr ships, and use an amarr ship with no bonus cap reduction to its guns as an example of how amarr is weak in capacitor? What do you expect? |
Soulspatch
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Posted - 2008.10.28 07:57:00 -
[6]
I used those weapon fits to demonstrate the short fall in performance compared to other T3 BS. It's the basic's nothing more. It is not about how good or bad the Abaddon is in PvP or PvE. If I apply cap bonus to the Abaddon to "make it work", then I would also have to apply that bonus to all the other ships, and that is not what this post is about. It is to highlight the base performance of the ship. |
Strill
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Posted - 2008.10.28 08:05:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Soulspatch
I used those weapon fits to demonstrate the short fall in performance compared to other T3 BS. It's the basic's nothing more. It is not about how good or bad the Abaddon is in PvP or PvE. If I apply cap bonus to the Abaddon to "make it work", then I would also have to apply that bonus to all the other ships
And you would find that the abaddon's and the other ships' net recharge rates are closer than in the OP.
Quote:
, and that is not what this post is about. It is to highlight the base performance of the ship.
And how is that applicable to anything? Balancing the base stats might very well lead to an imbalance in the end result. And in that case how can you tell whether it'll make things balanced or not?
And for your point on the abaddon needing more powergrid. Just about all ships can't fit anything decent with no fitting skills. The Abaddon is probably short so much more powergrid because it has comparatively more powergrid, and its guns take up comparatively more powergrid. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.28 08:11:00 -
[8]
1) Cap injector. I suggest you research what it does.
2) Lol at complaining that you need fitting skills to fit the Abaddon. Get used to it, EVERY ship needs high fitting skills to fit a decent setup.
3) The Abaddon is designed to have cap problems. In exchange for awesome dps and tank, it needs a cap injector to run everything for very long... I think it's a fair trade.
4) 1/10 for effort on the troll.
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Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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Burn Mac
Minmatar
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2008.10.28 08:11:00 -
[9]
Lol it uses lasers ofc its cap reliant your whine shoul be about lasers cap usage.
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Andracin
Free Galactic Enterprises
Violent-Tendencies
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Posted - 2008.10.28 08:21:00 -
[10]
You, OP, are the reason EVE is running quicly towards having multiple models of the same ship. Instead of looking for things the Abaddon does well, like short range weapons with an un-rivaled buffer tank you want it to be a sniper. Why not ask that falcon's get a web range bonus because the rapier has one?....no each ship of each race is different, if not for stratigic use in fleets, then for flavor. Think outside the box...if tach's don't work out so well, try another gun size, change for short ranges, try a diffrent sniper boat, fit a cap booster (which has been jokingly refered to as amarr ammo since I started in 2005), or cross train to one of the other races that has a ship you like. Don't demand that the game change ships to do things they were not designed for, adapt and be creative.
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TimMc
Gallente
The Motley Crew
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Posted - 2008.10.28 08:25:00 -
[11]
OP needs to die in a fire.
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Kerdrak
3B Legio IX
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.28 09:08:00 -
[12]
Learn to play.
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Soulspatch
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Posted - 2008.10.28 09:08:00 -
[13]
And I would repeat again, this is not about ship fits, if you want to talk about that go find another thread. If thats what I wanted to talk about, that's what I would have started this thread as.
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Gneeznow
Minmatar
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.10.28 09:13:00 -
[14]
if you put 8 tach's on an abaddon, you need to inject to keep up with the amount of cap they drain, your gonna be down to 30% cap after 6 or so shots of your tach's, while I would like to fly this ship with tach's it doesnt seem practical, overall the apoc is ofc the better sniper because of range and capacitor, abaddon is better off as a mega pulse boat where the cap use is not as pronounced. |
Taradis
Amarr
The Imperial Assassins
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Posted - 2008.10.28 09:46:00 -
[15]
I fly an adaddon I like it but yea it does run out of cap rather quickly so you just have to stay on top of that cap try fitting 4x T2 cap rechargers and CCC rig (if u run missions) and tachy beams suck the cap right out but they pwn megabeams. I should know I have 5 of em and a cruise launcher on mine when I run missions plus it has a hell of a nice tank and damn good DPS I myself hit over 1k think my highest was round 1512 and thats with the tachy anode particle streams tachy modulated just to damned pricey atm can't wait to get those T2 Lg guns. |
Cautet
Celestial Apocalypse
Resurgency
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Posted - 2008.10.28 10:10:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Cautet on 28/10/2008 10:11:51
You haven't properly fit the ships and you complain about the performance of the ships?
They don't even have all their guns fit????
The Rokh for example you haven't put all the guns on it!
Every ship in eve is different. Some do low dps. Some low tank. Some low cap. Some are low on PG. Some are low on CPU. You overcome these with FITTINGS and skills.
This thread makes no sense. Ships without fittings do not work is all this thread proves.
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Ishina Fel
Caldari
Synergy.
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.10.28 11:12:00 -
[17]
The Abaddon has the two strongest bonuses of any of the Amarr battleships, and in fact among the strongest of all battleships.
The downside is its cap drain. There's nothing broken in this. You just fly with a cap injector instead of a cap recharger.
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Chronospin
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.10.28 11:25:00 -
[18]
another noob eft warrior. |
Nexus Kinnon
Neo Spartans
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Posted - 2008.10.28 12:00:00 -
[19]
stop sucking
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EYEDOLL
Amarr
Eve University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.10.28 13:44:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Ishina Fel
There's nothing broken in this. You just fly with a cap injector instead of a cap recharger.
^^^^ this .. nothing wrong with the abaddon |
Gram Hellfire
Smoking Hillbillys
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Posted - 2008.10.28 14:30:00 -
[21]
Please, devs. leave the abaddon's bonuses the same.
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El Yatta
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.10.28 15:10:00 -
[22]
Dont be ridiculous. Base stats mean nothing at all, theres no ship that is flown with base stats, ships are flown, FITTED, with skills and bonuses and thats what needs to be balanced. In addition the abaddon is superb as it is, probably the best tier 3 battleship by far. Its supposed to be cap weak because it has a massive bonus to damage AND to defence. That was in the original design.
_______________________________________________
Mercenary Forces |
Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.10.28 15:42:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Ishina Fel
You just fly with a second cap injector instead of a cap recharger just one.
fixed
__________________________________
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
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Ishina Fel
Caldari
Synergy.
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.10.28 15:48:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Terianna Eri
Originally by: Ishina Fel
You just fly with a second cap injector instead of a cap recharger just one.
fixed
Only if you're toting reps 
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Talsha Talamar
Amarr
Nebula Rasa Holdings
Nebula Rasa
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Posted - 2008.10.28 15:54:00 -
[25]
Quote:
The comparisons are done on EFT,
first with no skills and then all at L5.
All guns are T2.
^^ This :)
A bit more powergrid
would be appreciated though ;)
I raged about the difficulty to
fit Large Beams a while ago.
Aside from that nothing is wrong with my baby.
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Infinity Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.10.28 16:19:00 -
[26]
Abbadon is apulse ship. Sniper is Apoc role. Ammar have the BEST sniper by far. And the best buffer tanked + hell lot of dps ship in game. This second one is the abbadon.
Give you a simple example of how noobish your view is. A typical abbadon setup with 8 MP II will hold LONGER with its capacitor than the typical maesltrom setup. Why because you forget the damm TANK!!!! Abbadon has the best non cap using tank in game.
Abbadon is a freaking powerful battleship if it did not had its Light cap problem then it would be VERY overpowered. And YES i do fly ammar. I have an alt with ammar BS V, Large Pulse Spec IV and pretty much all ammar support skills at 5. And the damm Abbadon works GREAT!
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If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
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Aravel Thon
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Posted - 2008.10.28 16:35:00 -
[27]
op fails
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Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
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Posted - 2008.10.28 16:42:00 -
[28]
I personally don't think the Abaddon needs a lot more grid, but the grid requirements of the guns could use some looking at, Mega Beam IIs are damn hard to fit without fitting mods on any of the Amarr battleships and Tachyons are even worse. (Granted Tachys should be difficult, but most should atleast be able to fit a rack of Mega Beam IIs without having to cram RCUs and such in)
As for the ships cap, an Abaddon is not designed as a sustainable damage platform, it lacks that power consumption bonus for a reason and exchanges it for more tank and sheer punch.
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Lili Lu
Purveyors of Uber Research Valuables and Ships
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Posted - 2008.10.28 18:39:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Lili Lu on 28/10/2008 18:42:08
I have a mission running abaddon that does quite well with 7 tachs. However, you need to have controlled burst 4 trained (5 even better), use best named guns, and something other than mutlifrequecy to get the cap drain to any manageable state.
Have 2 CCC, a PDS, and 2 good CPR and you will be able to fire that way long enough and pulse a LAR in order to kill most level 4 rooms before your cap runs out. ALternate cap regen setups work as well. The Abaddon is a great mission ship against Blood Raiders and Sansha. You do need to invest a great deal in good mods and training though to make it work (unlike Caldari missile boats).
One place where I will agree with you is that lasers do need a slight reduction in cap use as much as Minmatar arty needs a slight RoF and clip size increase. The pre-nerf that CCP applied to each weapon system to discourage fits on non-racial ships was too harsh. |
Yoko Lee
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.10.28 18:49:00 -
[30]
abaddon dont have prolem capa, just dont use activ tank (or 1 lar no more). |
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