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iudex
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.11.17 05:12:00 -
[1]
A little, almost unnoticed change of a certain item with the QR expansion now allows to do level 5 missions considerably faster. Most of them are now doable in less than 1 hour, for examle i did the mission Rogue Spy (1 of 3) today, it was 01:43 when i warped in and 02:25 when the mission was finished. The reward of that missions were 67343 loyalty points, which leads to the following problem: it's just a matter of time, untill the tactics and modules i was using will be used by a huge ammount of players which will then result in a massive devaluation of loyalty points.
Current lp prices for caldari empire corps are around 700 isk / lp. For example if someone cashes in lps with CN Juggernaut torpedos and puts them for the price of the lowest sell-order (~2100 isk), he'll get 654 isk / lp, if he does this with CN scourge heavy missiles it's ~ 715 isk /lp. Ammunition is currently the lp store item that is offered in big ammounts, some of the other lp store items are offered for a higher price level, but that is because the lp store market is not a "perfect market", and the items with a smaller trade volume will follow that price level sooner or later.
I wonder what's an acceptable minimum lp value level, how far are the devs willing to let the lp price drop ? Currently i don't see there a bottom, but it's obvious that it will drop considerably, if more and more people start to do level 5 missions. I hope CCP is monitoring the lp prices and will stabilize it with a "rescue package" such as new items that require huge ammount of lps ?
_________________________________________ Faction Standings: Serpentis +7.81 // Angel Cartel +7.60 // Minmatar Republic -8.68 // Gallente Federation -9.88
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Mr Friendly
The Lost and The Damned
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Posted - 2008.11.17 05:24:00 -
[2]
CCP removed npc purchases of the Nexus chips (and thus an npc minimum price for lps), so I doubt they'll be interested in bailing out a crashed player driven market, if indeed that happens. |
Bloody Rabbit
Jita Miners
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Posted - 2008.11.17 05:31:00 -
[3]
Its a self correcting issue,
its called free market....LP for Caldari falls to 200isk/lp players stop running missions for Caldari and move on. WOW its shocking I know.
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2008.11.17 06:07:00 -
[4]
So whats his uber leet mission running scret? |
Deggins
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Posted - 2008.11.17 06:24:00 -
[5]
Turns out all the BS rats in that mission aren't DD tanked, effing nubs. |
Shadowsword
COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.11.17 06:33:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Bloody Rabbit Its a self correcting issue,
its called free market....LP for Caldari falls to 200isk/lp players stop running missions for Caldari and move on. WOW its shocking I know.
I think you're overestimating the IQ of the average caldari mission-runner. After all, a lot of them kept lagging in Motsu for a long time while there were scores of more profitable, lagless spots... ------------------------------------------
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2008.11.17 06:53:00 -
[7]
It takes you an hour? |
Rivqua
Caldari Omega Wing R.E.P.O.
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Posted - 2008.11.17 06:58:00 -
[8]
The LP aren't supposed to have a value, they are there for you to get stuff from your chosen cooporation, primarily for yourself.
Now if you resell the stuff, it's up to you to put a price on it, but there is no reason CCP would ever want to uphold any minimum kind of value on it. The more LP stuff comes into the game, the more ISK leaves the system, which is positive for us all around, ie, the economy benefits.
So, no. For most people, especially non-mission grinders, the goal is for LP:ISK to be a 1:1 ratio, and that will never happen, so there is no worry :)
/Riv |
Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:05:00 -
[9]
LP will continue to be devalued until there is almost nothing left of it. This is due to the absolute greed of all carebear mission runners. It is inevitable.
Witness Navy Megathrons for 260m or less on contracts. Until CCP moves *all* L4s into low sec and makes missions a little more difficult, this will be the case. |
iudex
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:06:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ghoest So whats his uber leet mission running scret?
The secret is to do the missions allone so you don't have to share the reward. There are only very vew ships that can do them allone because of the neut towers. If you then check some modules used by one of that ships, you'll see an important buff. It's nothing special actually, but i don't like to give any details, the number of people using this ships for level 5s will grow fast enough.
In the end it's balanced in term of risk vs reward imho, since a big part of the missions are in lowsec, but it will jumble the whole lp system. The market for lp items was already over-saturated on the suply side, even before lvl 5s got buffed few months ago, now things will get even worse if we don't get new items for the lp store. I pity the level 2 or 3 missionrunner, who works hard for his 300 lp per mission. Hopefully ccp learns from rl and will stabilize the market before they crash; items like +6 or +7 implants, faction capital ships or other things that require huge ammounts of lp would easily solve the problem.
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Iracham
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:08:00 -
[11]
Because the horrible horrible consequences of the LP market crashing would be putting thousands of pod pilots out of work.
Oh, wait.
Nevermind. |
Dianeces
The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:10:00 -
[12]
Originally by: iudex items like +6 or +7 implants, faction capital ships or other things that require huge ammounts of lp would easily solve the problem.
They would also be relatively impossible to balance right. Have fun living in your pipe dream. ~~~~~~o7o7o7o7o7o7o7 |
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:21:00 -
[13]
A mission nerf to draw some people away from missions and into other professions (rather than missioning being the be-all end-all profession for easy ISK grinding) would help raise the LP value again. In fact, CCP stated its intentions to do just that (at least with hisec missions).
Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:56:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Kahega Amielden A mission nerf to draw some people away from missions and into other professions (rather than missioning being the be-all end-all profession for easy ISK grinding) would help raise the LP value again. In fact, CCP stated its intentions to do just that (at least with hisec missions).
If there was other professions, sure
For LAW ABIDING citizens that is, not naughty pirates.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Carniflex
Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.11.17 08:10:00 -
[15]
Hmmm ... solo, 67 k LP in around hour. Low sec here I come when I figure out how. Well ok - depends on stuff, but I can always 'fish' for high sec events using low sec agent next to hi sec system. All it takes is enough alts to circumenvent the 4h timer.
For THAT amount of LP I might be even willing to nuke my opposing faction stadnings to the point where they start shooting me. Can always use freighter alt if I need to move stuff afterall. All that assuming that isk/LP relation stays around 1000 isk/LP for the items I cash in. Currently are getting around 20 kLP/hour when dual accounting on hi sec lev 4 missions (plus around 30 mil in isk per hour). With current prices that would be a bit more attractive form me than hi sec lev 4's. Not enough to do missions actually in low sec, but enough to fish for hi sec events next to low sec.
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Blondieonsum
Endless Opportunities
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Posted - 2008.11.17 08:16:00 -
[16]
OP is full of i can do it everyone else fails :P
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Dantes Revenge
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.11.17 08:26:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Blondieonsum OP is full of i can do it everyone else fails :P
And also a bit full of I can bait suckers into lowsec for my ganking pleasure too.
Common saying around these parts - Proof or it didn't happen.
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Joe
Umbra Legion Shadow Empire.
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Posted - 2008.11.17 08:53:00 -
[18]
Lvl 5 Missions arent easily accessable to all players, or the majority of 'empire hugging carebears' that pks commonly refer too.
They're usually camped by pirates, and Low sec is full of Roaming gangs. I don't forsee any rush by PVE pilots that enjoy the carefree and relaxed style of hi Sec Missions. If low sec mission runner numbers increase, so will the low sec Roaming pks, as there prey becomes more common.
Lvl 5s wont make you rich with bounties: LP was specifcly riased by CCP becuase there wasnt any interest in lvl 5s. Its now Attractive to small fleets of Co-op pilots, and all pilots get to walk away with nice Cut.
if your not going to whine pro-lvl 5 boost tho you can try this angle:
LP prices effect NPC loot prices of identical Stat items, classic example: Amarr navy Armour repairer, and True Sansha armour repairer. Think of the 0.0 corps ccp, you nurf them with boosts to pve!
Anyway, have fun with the thread, i thought the 'secret tactics and modules' was a nice touch.
Umbra Legion Is recruiting!
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Artemis Rose
Sileo In Pacis
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Posted - 2008.11.17 09:46:00 -
[19]
Its time to finish maxing those scan probing skills
*** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats |
Carniflex
Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.11.17 12:57:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Artemis Rose Its time to finish maxing those scan probing skills
Max probe skills alone will not put you on the bleeding edge of catching missionrunners. For that you need proper scan spots net for system and some experience of using ship scanner.
Creating that bookmark net is somewhat hassle, but after you have that for the system you can nail anything specific you want in system in less than 5 minutes. Just sitting in space and grinding long range probes will rarely get you the jackpot you are looking for (usually some specific missionrunner who you know to have expensive setup).
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2008.11.17 13:15:00 -
[21]
Whew, thought there was some nefarious thing like attrition of LP over time coming ..
I have been providing my LP to friends and allies at 50-100isk/LP since time immemorial, a "Bring Your Own Tags" type of deal. The LP system is a secondary income source if you loot and salvage everything. I for one don't have the patience to sell tons of ammo/mods continuously just to make money.
A sharp drop in isk/Lp ratio will move far larger quantities of navy items so the profit over time will be the same as current high price/low volume, and as a bonus the killboards will swell with pretty colours as more and more and modules become faction |
Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.11.17 13:30:00 -
[22]
Only problem with LP is that, market research feels more like work then play, and I can't make myself go for potentially suboptimal items. So they just sit there, for a while now. Well, only have a couple mil sitting in current corp, but still, bit of a waste.
Wasn't a move to LP rewards instead of isk an attempt to boost L5's at the expense of lower level missions? And one "problem" that not enough people are interested in L5's? So the continued drop in LP value really ends up hurting L5's more the L4's? |
Tiirae
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2008.11.17 15:36:00 -
[23]
Having spent time trying to convince some bears that low sec isn't all that dangerous, I can confidently predict there will be NO sudden rush to L5 agents.
Even if there was, any sudden drop in LP value would result in them scurrying back to high sec, as there would be no reason to expose themselves to the unbearable risk of losing a ship.
Anyway, none of the empire faction LP stores offer items worth a lot; The smart people are doing missions for pirate factions and those are already in low sec or 0.0 anyway. |
iudex
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.11.17 15:40:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Carniflex Hmmm ... solo, 67 k LP in around hour. Low sec here I come when I figure out how. Well ok - depends on stuff, but I can always 'fish' for high sec events using low sec agent next to hi sec system. All it takes is enough alts to circumenvent the 4h timer.
That's an interesting idea. I've been doing them in highsec aswell, since rejecting multiple level 5s within 4 hours gives you the same micro faction standing penalty like rejecting a level 4 or 2 and the old "mission picking" strategy is very helpful here. But you are totally right, one can create an extra account with 3 alts, get their corp standing up so that they can accept the missions, and then do the missions only in highsec almost without delay and without having to accept the missions through faction standing. There are several level 5 agents in neighbour systems, and by a rough estimation they give around 1/5 of the mission in highsec.
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Kunming
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core
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Posted - 2008.11.17 16:02:00 -
[25]
With T3 coming, CCP wants to see much more and cheaper faction equipment and ships or they will become colletors items only.
- Quantum Rise... nerfing the unnerfable! Sponsored by CCP |
Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.11.17 16:16:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus LP will continue to be devalued until there is almost nothing left of it. This is due to the absolute greed of all carebear mission runners. It is inevitable.
"absolute greed"? Naw, just simple supply and demand. Absolute greed would be something like cartels and artificial price hikes.
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Takon Orlani
Caldari Chaos Monkeys
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Posted - 2008.11.17 17:00:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 17/11/2008 06:59:51 It takes you an hour?
Oh and my LPs go to MY stuff.
I don't sell MY loyalty points. Get your own.
Which give me a nasty idea...
How about all items bought from LP stores can't be traded, sold or contracted
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Faife
Noctiscion
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Posted - 2008.11.17 17:11:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Bellum Eternus LP will continue to be devalued until there is almost nothing left of it. This is due to the absolute greed of all carebear mission runners. It is inevitable.
"absolute greed"? Naw, just simple supply and demand. Absolute greed would be something like cartels and artificial price hikes.
truth. absolute greed would be if mission runners actively hunted down and killed other mission runners for their things.
(i see what i did there) --
Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Mitnal |
Cyb3r Thr3at
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.11.17 17:58:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Carniflex Hmmm ... solo, 67 k LP in around hour. Low sec here I come when I figure out how. Well ok - depends on stuff, but I can always 'fish' for high sec events using low sec agent next to hi sec system. All it takes is enough alts to circumenvent the 4h timer.
For THAT amount of LP I might be even willing to nuke my opposing faction stadnings to the point where they start shooting me. Can always use freighter alt if I need to move stuff afterall. All that assuming that isk/LP relation stays around 1000 isk/LP for the items I cash in. Currently are getting around 20 kLP/hour when dual accounting on hi sec lev 4 missions (plus around 30 mil in isk per hour). With current prices that would be a bit more attractive form me than hi sec lev 4's. Not enough to do missions actually in low sec, but enough to fish for hi sec events next to low sec.
Thats right, come get yer 67k lp/hr.. the pirates will be waiting
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ZW Dewitt
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Posted - 2008.11.17 18:30:00 -
[30]
Mission times decrease, LP rewards decrease, problem solved. |
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