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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.11.26 18:19:00 -
[1]
64 Alliances will be allowed entry to Alliance Tournament VI. The traditional bracket system tournament will be done away with, in favour of a system that allows a larger number of alliances to compete meaningfully in the same time frame. A slightly modified Swiss System tournament will be used for qualifying, with a single elimination tournament occurring on the final weekend.
Qualifying rounds
The aim of the qualifying rounds is to quickly and fairly cut 64 alliances down to 32 alliances, while still allowing teams a reasonable chance of coming back from a failure. As such, a slightly modified version of a Swiss System tournament will be used. It is not anticipated that qualifying will be a walk-through for any team.
Round 1 (...Fight! )
64 Alliances will be drawn from the ceremonial CCP Tinfoil Hat at random. Based on this, they will be assigned the numbers 1 - 64. This random order decides who fights whom on the first weekend - 1 fights 2, 3 fights 4 and so on.
Teams will then be ranked by their match result (Win or Loss), and then by kill points (see points section).
Round 2
Teams fight in order of rank - 1v2, 3v4 and so on.
Results
Teams are ranked again by match results (Wins & Losses). 16 teams are on 2 wins, 16 teams are on 0 wins, 32 teams are on 1 win / 1 loss. The Top 16 are through, the bottom 16 are cut.
The middle 32 teams are sorted by points - the top 16 are through, the bottom 16 are cut. This leaves us with a total of 32 teams in the final.
Finals
The 32 teams are ranked according to match results and then points scored. Using these rankings as a base, the teams are seeded into a 32 way single elimination. Seeding will be used so that the highest ranked teams are on opposite sides of the elimination tree. It is entirely possible that teams who have fought each other in qualifying may meet again before the final.
A 32 way elimination is then played out over the two days. 16 matches on Day 1 and the remaining matches on Day 2. We end up with a winner, and there is much excitement and rejoicing!
Additional Notes
Points System
As with previous tournaments, teams will be awarded points based on the value of ships killed in each match - regardless of win or loss. The team that wins a match will be awarded a 25% bonus to points scored. The points values for each ship will be available in the rules thread.
Draws
For the purposes of this tournament, a drawn match is considered a loss for both teams involved. It will also hereby be known as a fail.
Rankings
If at any point, teams are level in Win/Loss and also level in points scored, the following will be used in order to resolve this.
1. If the teams disputing rank have fought each other at any point, the winner is higher. 2. The current ranking (W/L, then points) of the last team that you defeated. Higher is better. 3. The current ranking of the last team that defeated you. Again, higher is better.
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.11.27 13:05:00 -
[2]
Reserved. -- |
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DHB WildCat
BURN EDEN Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.11.27 13:50:00 -
[3]
Just checking the date of when we may apply, for no mess ups.
WildCat
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.11.27 13:55:00 -
[4]
As per the dev blog here, we are planning to open signups between the 19th of December and 9th January.
We haven't finalised the exact details of the process, but most likely there will be 8 - 10 slots reserved for alliances that have done well in the last two tournaments. The rest of the slots would be "first come, first served" as before.
I expect to have this finalised and a thread here by early next week. -- |
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Miyamoto Uroki
Caldari Katsu Corporation
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Posted - 2008.11.27 14:34:00 -
[5]
So no spiffy SpiralJunkie coverage on all three weekends? Will we be able to get our hands on live feeds of the two previous weekends?
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Crovan
Body Count Inc.
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:52:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Crovan on 27/11/2008 15:53:56
Originally by: CCP Mindstar A slightly modified Swiss System tournament will be used for qualifying, with a single elimination tournament occurring on the final weekend.
Is two rounds enough for the Swiss System? It seems like it leaves a lot of room open for flukes, not to mention you are invariably going to have a few pretty crap teams get through because they manage to THD an even more crap team, while Team 2 may fight Team 1 to a near-draw, but not make it through because they are 1-1 with a lower points total, when in fact they would be a great choice for the finals.
Then again, I'm not sure that 2 prelims is sufficient for much of a thorough vetting, period. Is this a time constraint thing? I think it would make your lives a lot easier to add at least a third prelim when it came down to paring out who wins and who loses. There is a rather high possibility that you are going to have a large clump of ties at/near 32. More rounds means less chance of this.
Edit: Forfeits can also really throw a spanner into the works . I'm sure things will be fine, after sufficient whinage by people who don't make the cut, but there's got to be a way to make the vetting easier on you guys. |
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CCP Claw
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Crovan
Is two rounds enough for the Swiss System? It seems like it leaves a lot of room open for flukes, not to mention you are invariably going to have a few pretty crap teams get through because they manage to THD an even more crap team, while Team 2 may fight Team 1 to a near-draw, but not make it through because they are 1-1 with a lower points total, when in fact they would be a great choice for the finals.
Then again, I'm not sure that 2 prelims is sufficient for much of a thorough vetting, period. Is this a time constraint thing? I think it would make your lives a lot easier to add at least a third prelim when it came down to paring out who wins and who loses. There is a rather high possibility that you are going to have a large clump of ties at/near 32. More rounds means less chance of this.
Edit: Forfeits can also really throw a spanner into the works . I'm sure things will be fine, after sufficient whinage by people who don't make the cut, but there's got to be a way to make the vetting easier on you guys.
I have years of tournament organising experience, and Mindstar and the GM team have a lot of specific alliance tournament experience; don't worry about us :)
Its a practicality thing, really. At some point you have to say "this is how long we want our tournament to run for" and go with it. Hence the slight modification of an existing system to fit our needs. At or near 32 will be mostly decided by points, making it all important to make sure you're blowing up opponents in your games :)
Also notice that there is no Totalhelldeath rule this time, just a bonus for winning.
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Crovan
Body Count Inc.
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Posted - 2008.11.27 17:20:00 -
[8]
Originally by: CCP Claw
Originally by: Crovan
Is two rounds enough for the Swiss System? It seems like it leaves a lot of room open for flukes, not to mention you are invariably going to have a few pretty crap teams get through because they manage to THD an even more crap team, while Team 2 may fight Team 1 to a near-draw, but not make it through because they are 1-1 with a lower points total, when in fact they would be a great choice for the finals.
Then again, I'm not sure that 2 prelims is sufficient for much of a thorough vetting, period. Is this a time constraint thing? I think it would make your lives a lot easier to add at least a third prelim when it came down to paring out who wins and who loses. There is a rather high possibility that you are going to have a large clump of ties at/near 32. More rounds means less chance of this.
Edit: Forfeits can also really throw a spanner into the works . I'm sure things will be fine, after sufficient whinage by people who don't make the cut, but there's got to be a way to make the vetting easier on you guys.
I have years of tournament organising experience, and Mindstar and the GM team have a lot of specific alliance tournament experience; don't worry about us :)
Its a practicality thing, really. At some point you have to say "this is how long we want our tournament to run for" and go with it. Hence the slight modification of an existing system to fit our needs. At or near 32 will be mostly decided by points, making it all important to make sure you're blowing up opponents in your games :)
Also notice that there is no Totalhelldeath rule this time, just a bonus for winning.
I understand all that, and by no means did I mean to indict yours, or Mindstar's ability to run the tournament. I merely wanted to point out some potential difficulties. I'm sure that a lot of thinking has gone into tiebreakers, but past tournaments have shown us that there will always be something that catches you off guard, f'ex I could see "fails" causing a problem, here, albeit reasonably unlikely.
I mean, it'll work, and make for pretty pew pew on the finals days, but expect to have angry people if there is a tie around 32 and people don't make the cut based on stuff out of their control. It's a fair enough system, but never underestimate the ability of EVE players to complain.
The Drone Bay Podcast
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Ishina Fel
Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.11.27 17:26:00 -
[9]
I just love the part about draw matches!
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.11.27 17:41:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Crovan I understand all that, and by no means did I mean to indict yours, or Mindstar's ability to run the tournament. I merely wanted to point out some potential difficulties. I'm sure that a lot of thinking has gone into tiebreakers, but past tournaments have shown us that there will always be something that catches you off guard, f'ex I could see "fails" causing a problem, here, albeit reasonably unlikely.
I mean, it'll work, and make for pretty pew pew on the finals days, but expect to have angry people if there is a tie around 32 and people don't make the cut based on stuff out of their control. It's a fair enough system, but never underestimate the ability of EVE players to complain.
The key goal is that it is fair, and everyone gets an equal chance. As such, we are going to be as clear as possible about every eventuality. We did discuss a slightly different format with the top 32 playing the bottom 32 for round 2, but we decided against it as it adds extra punishment to those who may have been unlucky on the initial draw.
In the end, we are fully expecting it to be very close around the rank 32/33 mark, and it may well be only a couple of points that decides the finals lineup. This is going to be one of the challenges of this tournament - every team will have the chance to make it to the finals and we aim to be as fair as possible about it.
Coming out of the 5 round bracket stages of the previous alliance tournaments, there have always been close calls for well performing alliances that have gotten in by just a few points, or by a lucky win during the last round. Similarly crowd favourites have been knocked out by virtue of being in a "Group of death". -- |
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Crovan
Body Count Inc.
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Posted - 2008.11.28 15:36:00 -
[11]
Originally by: CCP Mindstar Similarly crowd favourites have been knocked out by virtue of being in a "Group of death".
I flew with MC. Believe me, I understand that.
The Drone Bay Podcast
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Avernus
Gallente Imperium Technologies B.L.A.C.K.
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Posted - 2008.11.29 03:52:00 -
[12]
Hoping to see a lack of highly expensive implants in this years tournament. Even things out for those teams that can't afford the very best in all things.
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Trail Katron
Minmatar Monkey Universe Corporation Monkey Religion
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Posted - 2008.11.29 21:33:00 -
[13]
is there a minimum of Members/corporations an alliance must have. I know the max number of people is 10 for each team
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Cerina Kozu
Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2008.12.01 13:42:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Miyamoto Uroki Will we be able to get our hands on live feeds of the two previous weekends?
Something I'd like to know aswell.
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.12.01 15:28:00 -
[15]
We are working out the best way for us to bring coverage of the Qualifying rounds to you. We haven't decided exactly what we will do just yet, but we will let you all know when we do. -- |
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.
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Posted - 2008.12.01 17:26:00 -
[16]
Cost to enter?
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Lexa Hellfury
Maximum Yarrage
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Posted - 2008.12.01 22:51:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Cost to enter?
Originally by: CCP Claw Entry fee
The entry fee is 500 Million ISK. The fee is returned once the qualifying stage is finished and the team has participated in all of its scheduled fights.
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swallows everything
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Posted - 2008.12.02 07:15:00 -
[18]
wondering what the reward for those who participate and win if there is any since it seems like a fair amount of isk value and time to be invested in a regulated punching match.
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XFreedomX
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Posted - 2008.12.02 22:06:00 -
[19]
Think a tie breaker may be needed in case of draw in the final round / final match etc....
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.12.02 22:26:00 -
[20]
Originally by: swallows everything wondering what the reward for those who participate and win if there is any since it seems like a fair amount of isk value and time to be invested in a regulated punching match.
We are finalizing the exact prizes, and will announce them in this forum when this is done. -- |
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Savage Roar
AMMO INC
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Posted - 2008.12.03 02:59:00 -
[21]
Would be nice to see some more rare things, but not in the sense of state-issue ships... perhaps some really different rewards, like faction versions of the tier3 battleships, but with all their bonuses to mining, or probing, or something else totally weird. And no there wouldn't be any balance issues because there would be too few of the ships ingame for it to matter. Mining-bonus'd Rokh ftw. and yes, this is my sig. IBTL Originally by: CCP Mitnal If I ever need an alligator at 3am, I now know where to find one!
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Botia Macracantha
Minmatar Stealth Operations
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Posted - 2008.12.03 13:13:00 -
[22]
Just a thought on scoring.
What if at the end of round 2, and in any drawn knockout match, that the tie breaker is damage done, not some convoluted count-back system ?
That way, gank wins over unbreakable tank every time (coz the tankers must sacrifice DPS), and the fight is decided only on the performance between the two opponents, and not because one team luckily drew some losers in a previous bout.
You could also consider ONLY using damage dealt to score fights. That way, a gankfest ensues, and you could have a team losing all its ships, but still winning because they went for more gank - maybe.
Just a thought.
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CCP Claw
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Posted - 2008.12.04 15:57:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Botia Macracantha
some convoluted count-back system ?
Its not convoluted, its actually extremely easy to work out. And its a very standard thing in various tournament formats.
As far as measuring damage to work out the winner of a fight goes...I don't really know how to answer that :) Fights where both sides 'bring it' are great, but calculating a winner on DPS alone doesn't exactly provoke interesting setups either.
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Corp Holder1
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Posted - 2008.12.05 22:33:00 -
[24]
have we got the date sorted yet for tourney entry ?
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Zkuvtolcaq
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Posted - 2008.12.18 15:18:00 -
[25]
forgive my ignorance - wot is a PLEX? is it the same as a game time card?
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CCP Mindstar
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Posted - 2008.12.18 16:10:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Zkuvtolcaq
forgive my ignorance - wot is a PLEX? is it the same as a game time card?
PLEX are 30 day Pilot License Extension - the in-game version of a game time card - tradeable on the market.
See here for more info on them. -- |
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Ambo
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.12.18 16:25:00 -
[27]
Well nice prizes if you win them for sure... A bit 'meh' compared to unique ships/mods or whatever but I can understand why that is not a road CCP want to go down. --------------------------------------
Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA |
Eclavaldra
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Posted - 2008.12.18 16:38:00 -
[28]
Indeed - extra days of free play time are a bit "*shrug* so what?" - giving out ships which can't be garnered any other way seems a lot more worthwhile. They wouldn't even need to be excessively over-powered since it's the rarity that leads to maxiumum bragging rights. Hell, if CCP don't want to give out new ships how about allowing winning team members a free 'paint-job' for their ship? These could be standardised to avoid excessive skin-creation and make them more recognisable. Just a thought...
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ElCoCo
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.18 17:09:00 -
[29]
I was hoping for the return of unique stuff tbh
Not just ships, maybe some funky modules like PWNZ0R lazor 1 or something, it's just isk again if you think of it (besides the bragging rights ofc) Boink! |
Tyrrax Thorrk
Amarr Guiding Hand Social Club Otherworld Empire Productions
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Posted - 2008.12.18 17:33:00 -
[30]
Wow that's actually worse than loyalty points as prizes, i'm impressed !
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