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Naomi Knight
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.11.27 14:46:00 -
[1]
So zealot became so overpowered due to speed nerf it is not fun playing this game against a zealot. It needs to be inline with other hac-s, so remowe 1 low or med slots + change optimal bonus to apoc's bonuse 7.5%/lvl. Also lower its powergrid so it has to use fitting mods if it wants to fit 5 heavy beams + anything else.
Also it's too fast to be a sniper hac copared it to deimos,which a close range hac it is 261m/s against 219m/s without fitting or compare dmg 5*heavy beams on zealot 264dps with multi vs 5*250mm rails on deimos 213dps without dmg mods and zealot has better optimal.
Everybody says this ship is too good so pls bring it in line ccp.
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Hardtail
Ever Flow Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2008.11.27 14:48:00 -
[2]
or they could make the deimos ..uh...you know
not suck.
that would work too
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Home 0f Bored Occultists
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Posted - 2008.11.27 14:50:00 -
[3]
Troll. ----------------------------------------- [Video] The Cruise |
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2008.11.27 14:55:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Naomi Knight ...Everybody says this ship is too good so pls bring it in line ccp.
You do realise that the voices you hear are not actually real people, right?
The Beam Zealot is extremely limited as tracking is a huge issue, even the Pulse setup has some nasty tracking issues at times. Bother versions rarely have any tank to speak of .. perfect Amarrian glass cannons!
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bldyannoyed
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:01:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
Originally by: Naomi Knight ...Everybody says this ship is too good so pls bring it in line ccp.
You do realise that the voices you hear are not actually real people, right?
The Beam Zealot is extremely limited as tracking is a huge issue, even the Pulse setup has some nasty tracking issues at times. Bother versions rarely have any tank to speak of .. perfect Amarrian glass cannons!
Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuh.
Not that I support a Zealot nerf in anyway, but the Zealot has probably the best effective tracking at it's optimal range of any HAC in the game, with the exception of the Cerberus.
The problem with the Zealot is that, unlike some HAC's (Muninn and Deimos), it functions perfectly in it's intended role. It's a gunboat. It has 4 gunnery bonuses. All it's high slots are turret slots. It's the perfectly designed laser cannon.
The same can't be said of some other HAC's making them suck, and making the Zealot SEEM unbalanced by comparision.
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Garia666
Amarr T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:21:00 -
[6]
You should be nerfed out of this game.. go play WOW.
www.garia.net |
Szent AdamKiraly
Glauxian Brothers
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:25:00 -
[7]
die.
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fac3hunter
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:26:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Garia666 You should be nerfed out of this game.. go play WOW.
sounds like the average whine poster on blizzard forums.
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Caffeine Junkie
2 Guys In Motherships
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:27:00 -
[9]
Leave the Zealot alone, its absolutely spot on the way it is.
I think the Deimos is pretty good to (minority opinion) the main problem with it is that a Brutix can do everything it can do too for a lot less isk.
There are many places in this game where battles are fought and won, EFT isn't one of them. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:53:00 -
[10]
The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:58:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP.
True but it also highlights a problem with the Deimos as it should be at least of slight use with the long range weapon system of its race if not as good as other more specialized ship like the eagle.
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FU22
Maximum Yarrage
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:58:00 -
[12]
post with your main and people might listen
If that is your main then get out the noob corp its been a year dam it
Also leave the zealot alone its fine, its the others that are "broken"
and last time i checked a couple corpies are flying sniper deimos, they don't have a problem with it
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Solar Chase
Agony Unleashed
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:59:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP.
Zealot is powerful, but not overpowered. Put two Tracking Disruptors on it and watch it floating helpless.
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Rhadamantine
Game Community
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:59:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Troll.
Oh the irony.
Regards. Rhadamantine. |
Bronson Hughes
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
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Posted - 2008.11.27 15:59:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP.
This. Deimos makes a lousy sniper compared to a Zealot or an Eagle. The Deimos is designed to work as a blaster ship and all of its bonuses are oriented towards that role. Nerfing the Zealot to make make it on par with the Deimos as a sniper makes as much sense as nerfing the Ishtar to make it on par with the Eagle as a drone ship. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:00:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Caffeine Junkie Leave the Zealot alone, its absolutely spot on the way it is.
Comments like that are guaranteed to put on on the "things to nerf" list
Originally by: Caffeine Junkie I think the Deimos is pretty good to (minority opinion) the main problem with it is that a Brutix can do everything it can do too for a lot less isk.
That applies to virtually every hac and relative BC in the game aside from a couple of exceptions, welcome to post patch eve..............
POST NERF PVP SKILLS: "shall we engage?" "hmmm how many ships do they have?" "more than us" "lets not bother then" "WOW great job FC!!!!" "................. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:02:00 -
[17]
Originally by: lebrata
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP.
True but it also highlights a problem with the Deimos as it should be at least of slight use with the long range weapon system of its race if not as good as other more specialized ship like the eagle.
Why should it? The Eagle is a sniper HAC, the Deimos is a gank HAC. Blaster Eagles and rail Deimoses are both comedy setups. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:07:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Originally by: lebrata
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The problem is you are trying to use rails on a Deimos, making your entire effort a hopeless cause. Put those rails on a better ship (an Eagle, for example), and you will no longer fail at PvP.
True but it also highlights a problem with the Deimos as it should be at least of slight use with the long range weapon system of its race if not as good as other more specialized ship like the eagle.
Why should it? The Eagle is a sniper HAC, the Deimos is a gank HAC. Blaster Eagles and rail Deimoses are both comedy setups.
So by that measure your ok with the zealot getting "adjusted" so it either sucks with pulse but is good with beams or visa versa?.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:12:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 27/11/2008 16:12:36
Originally by: lebrata So by that measure your ok with the zealot getting "adjusted" so it either sucks with pulse but is good with beams or visa versa?.
How is this complicated? The Zealot is a mid-range pure dps ship, with pulses or beams it just takes a different area of the middle range between blasters/ACs and rails/missiles. To do this job, it has general dps bonuses, all four of them apply equally well to both beams and pulses, but not exceptionally well to either. In addition, it has absolutely nothing else, its tank sucks, it has no drone bay, no missile/neut slots, etc.
The Eagle and Deimos, on the other hand, are completely focused on their extreme of range. The Eagle has the best long-range bonuses at the cost of all short-range capability, while the Deimos has the best short-range bonuses (including that nice drone bay) at the cost of all long-range capability.
Now, can you possibly understand why a generalist ship would have more roles, but weaker performance in each of them compared to the appropriate specialist? ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:21:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Originally by: lebrata So by that measure your ok with the zealot getting "adjusted" so it either sucks with pulse but is good with beams or visa versa?.
How is this complicated? The Zealot is a mid-range pure dps ship, with pulses or beams it just takes a different area of the middle range between blasters/ACs and rails/missiles. To do this job, it has general dps bonuses, all four of them apply equally well to both beams and pulses, but not exceptionally well to either. In addition, it has absolutely nothing else, its tank sucks, it has no drone bay, no missile/neut slots, etc.
The Eagle and Deimos, on the other hand, are completely focused on their extreme of range. The Eagle has the best long-range bonuses at the cost of all short-range capability, while the Deimos has the best short-range bonuses (including that nice drone bay) at the cost of all long-range capability.
Now, can you possibly understand why a generalist ship would have more roles, but weaker performance in each of them compared to the appropriate specialist?
What makes you think im disagreeing with anything you say, i just asked a simple question and your avoidance of it is answer enough.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:27:00 -
[21]
Originally by: lebrata What makes you think im disagreeing with anything you say, i just asked a simple question and your avoidance of it is answer enough.
Now you're just trolling. It's blindingly obvious from what I wrote there that my answer is "no, it would be incredibly stupid to nerf the Zealot like that". Read it again and see if you can understand. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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The Djego
Minmatar merovinger inc
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:30:00 -
[22]
Actualy the Deimos was a great ship post patch, it chould not kill things it was able to catch(because of not enught gank/tank) or catch things that it was able to kill(because well next to everything was faster) or allready left the building if a Deimos apeered on the scanner.
Now it is still a great ship, only diffrence is you are able to catch allmost anything and you will get killed by allmost anything since you loose tons of needet DPS to Tracking or Range within your Web Range now.
Ofc you can use it to as a Rail sniper in fleets or so called "DPS Support" that take longer to get in range than do damage.
I still like it, it hasnŠt changed at all(yes I killed people with it and got multiple Deimos in the Hangar).
My personal opinion, it might get usefull if Blasters or Webs get fixed. Also the ship simply lacks gank for his playstyle(yes I know it is the HAC with the biggest DPS around) to match his role of a close range suizide Hac that got his 1# on the Primary list for a reason(what it got atm only by the fact that it has not realy a Tank). ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:34:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Now you're just trolling.
Your the one who is missing the point bud.
Originally by: Merin Ryskin my answer is "no, it would be incredibly stupid to nerf the Zealot like that".
By that statement saying that making the zealot like either the deimos or the eagle would not be a good thing in fact you think it would be "incredibly stupid" and that pretty much shows what you think of both those ships and how much better you think the zealot is.
The eagle hardly ever gets used nor does the deimos but the zealot is highly popular due to its versatility, and versatility is why nano got nerfed.
Get it?, got it? good.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:34:00 -
[24]
The problem with the Deimos is not blasters, it's the Brutix. Unlike the other HACs, the Deimos isn't really able to use its superior range or speed, since it has to get within point-blank range to do anything. At that range, all that matters is dps and tank, and the Brutix has more of both. And just to deal the final blow to the Deimos, the Brutix is much cheaper, a very important factor when you're talking about a ship with zero ability to disengage if things go badly. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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Silva Krell
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:39:00 -
[25]
Wow, so this is what it felt like to be an overpowered Caldari before the pacth.
I kinda like it. Oh and did I mention Amarr rule ;)
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:39:00 -
[26]
Originally by: lebrata By that statement saying that making the zealot like either the deimos or the eagle would not be a good thing in fact you think it would be "incredibly stupid" and that pretty much shows what you think of both those ships and how much better you think the zealot is.
No, it says that:
1) Amarr are not Caldari or Gallente. Making an Amarr ship into a Caldari or Gallente clone is just stupid, the races are supposed to be different. Amarr get the best mid-range ships, Gallente get the best close-range, Caldari get the best snipers.
2) We already have the Deimos and Eagle. Why would any sane person want to trade an extremely useful third ship for a Deimos/Eagle with shiny gold paint?
Quote: The eagle hardly ever gets used nor does the deimos but the zealot is highly popular due to its versatility, and versatility is why nano got nerfed.
Thanks for admitting you have no clue what you're talking about. The Eagle sees plenty of use in its appropriate role (fleet anti-support sniper), and the problem with the Deimos is the Brutix, not the Zealot. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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Gnomes Rock
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:42:00 -
[27]
Why would nerfing the Zealot do anything to help the Deimos not suck?
Do people even think before whining anymore? |
lebrata
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:50:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The Eagle sees plenty of use in its appropriate role (fleet anti-support sniper), and the problem with the Deimos is the Brutix, not the Zealot.
The eagle is not used as a anti support ship as much as the zealot nos is it as good at the role, and i never said the zealot was the problem with the deimos just that their was a problem with the deimos that needed sorting.
Do you honestly think that if the zealot was like the eagle or the Deimos that it would be so popular?...if you say yes your a liar btw.
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Kiviar
Caldari Bloodmoney Incorporated
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:51:00 -
[29]
Judging by how many "How 2 fit zealot plz?" posts there have been in the past two weeks, It doesn't seem like anyone knows how to fit a zealot. Making this argument moot. =P ---
Certified elite hull tanker. |
Miss Rumpelstilzchen
Minmatar Black Horizon Ltd
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Posted - 2008.11.27 16:53:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Gnomes Rock Why would nerfing the Zealot do anything to help the Deimos not suck?
Do people even think before whining anymore?
no they dont .. sadly ....
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