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DjLowballer
Amarr FLASHTROOPER CORP
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Posted - 2008.12.03 13:28:00 -
[1]
Hello EvE!
I am thinking of training to fly a Force Recon ship. For most of my career I have flown frigs(covops/Bombers/interceptors) and I am looking to move up a hull class.
I am about 11 days from Gallente Cruiser V, 24 from Caldari cruiser V and I am unsure of which ship I would rather play as.
From the looks on EvE mon and reading it seems that the Arazu is for holding a ship in place and a Falcon is for making a ship never able to shoot.
It also seems like the Arazu packs more of a punch.
I am planning to support a friend who flies BS/HAC so I want to be as useful as possible. Any pilots of both want to give me a breakdown? I might end up training both to V eventually since its only a month and gives me freedom of choice, but for now I want to get decent with one type.
Please Vote DjLowballer as your delegate to the CSM! |
CrayC
Gallente CrayC Inc.
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Posted - 2008.12.03 13:31:00 -
[2]
The Falcon is believed to be the overpowered one of those two. As for the Arazu holding a ship in place..... Not so much, but it's still useful. However, if you're not going solo, Falcon is the ship for you. Your buddy can gankfit while you jam the hell out of anyone and let him do the shooting...
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DjLowballer
Amarr FLASHTROOPER CORP
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Posted - 2008.12.03 13:33:00 -
[3]
What is the Arazu used for then. By hold in place I meant keep the ship from warping out.
Please Vote DjLowballer as your delegate to the CSM! |
Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.12.03 13:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: DjLowballer What is the Arazu used for then.
Cannon fodder.
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TimMc
Gallente Brutal Deliverance OWN Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.03 14:10:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: DjLowballer What is the Arazu used for then.
Cannon fodder.
It damps the falcon alts, instantly making it the primary of enemy gang.
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Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.12.03 14:49:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: DjLowballer What is the Arazu used for then.
Cannon fodder.
The arazu is an awesome ship, don't listen to this guy.
TBH I'd say start off with a razu, just because it's quicker to train for. The rook and falcon are notably better in gang fights where someone else can get a point on, but the arazu is just as useful if used properly.
The idea is that you go in, alone, with your buddy a jump or 2 out, and you warp around cloaked until you find a nice target. Once you've found something you decloak, scramble and damp it from 40km away, and wait for your buddy to show up to kill him. |
Bloody Rabbit
Jita Miners
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Posted - 2008.12.03 15:56:00 -
[7]
Originally by: CrayC The Falcon is believed to be the overpowered one of those two. As for the Arazu holding a ship in place..... Not so much, but it's still useful. However, if you're not going solo, Falcon is the ship for you. Your buddy can gankfit while you jam the hell out of anyone and let him do the shooting...
The Arazu is 100% guarnteed to reduce the target locking range, the Falcon is change based. The Falcon has a hard time to lock down a target because the mid slots are used for ECM where the Arazu has room to fit tackle and damp gear to hold and reduce locking range. Plus Arazu has a drone bay and can use guns where the falcon has missile hardpoints but no drone bay.
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Afale II
Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2008.12.03 16:05:00 -
[8]
Use a Pilgrim
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Davina Braben
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Posted - 2008.12.03 16:40:00 -
[9]
The thing with the Arazu is the shortest lock range you can reduce the target too isn't short enough for close range DPS ships to operate outside of.
What I'd do is run some numbers and see if your damage dealer ship can still put decent DPS on target from outside the range you can reduce their lock-on range too.
Alternatively you could go try locking time scripts and ECM drones. This would result in their lock being broken and then taking forever to reacquire.
A combination of a locking time script and range scripts would possibly let you tackle them, be unlockable and give them a really hard time locking on to your drones.
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kor anon
Amarr The Tuskers
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Posted - 2008.12.03 16:41:00 -
[10]
Originally by: DjLowballer What is the Arazu used for then.
maller meat. if flown like a moron that is
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VoiceInTheDesert
Gallente Diplomatic Disruption
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Posted - 2008.12.03 16:55:00 -
[11]
Edited by: VoiceInTheDesert on 03/12/2008 16:54:45 Arazu is good for shutting off MWD at range (16ish with good skills)
Falcon is better at everything else.
Get a falcon
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Katy Karkinoff
Minmatar Psycho Chicks
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Posted - 2008.12.03 17:30:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Bloody Rabbit
Originally by: CrayC The Falcon is believed to be the overpowered one of those two. As for the Arazu holding a ship in place..... Not so much, but it's still useful. However, if you're not going solo, Falcon is the ship for you. Your buddy can gankfit while you jam the hell out of anyone and let him do the shooting...
The Arazu is 100% guarnteed to reduce the target locking range, the Falcon is change based. The Falcon has a hard time to lock down a target because the mid slots are used for ECM where the Arazu has room to fit tackle and damp gear to hold and reduce locking range. Plus Arazu has a drone bay and can use guns where the falcon has missile hardpoints but no drone bay.
100% guaranteed my ass. The optimal is 45km. If you're 45km away from the fight you're going to get wtf fried in seconds. If you're farther out then rsd's have a chance to fail... just like you.
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Galliana Foresta
Armada.
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Posted - 2008.12.03 17:34:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Katy Karkinoff
Originally by: Bloody Rabbit
Originally by: CrayC The Falcon is believed to be the overpowered one of those two. As for the Arazu holding a ship in place..... Not so much, but it's still useful. However, if you're not going solo, Falcon is the ship for you. Your buddy can gankfit while you jam the hell out of anyone and let him do the shooting...
The Arazu is 100% guarnteed to reduce the target locking range, the Falcon is change based. The Falcon has a hard time to lock down a target because the mid slots are used for ECM where the Arazu has room to fit tackle and damp gear to hold and reduce locking range. Plus Arazu has a drone bay and can use guns where the falcon has missile hardpoints but no drone bay.
100% guaranteed my ass. The optimal is 45km. If you're 45km away from the fight you're going to get wtf fried in seconds. If you're farther out then rsd's have a chance to fail... just like you.
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Lili Lu
Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.12.03 17:39:00 -
[14]
Lol. OK, Falcon is a way better ship (and CCP will apparently never get around to nerfing it like they have every other recon) and more suited for any type of battle.
However, it appears you have already started training Gallente Cruiser 5. So, you might as well finish it off. I suggest that you then discover the frustration that is the Arazu and train Caldari Cruiser 5.
This way you can at least train for the Ishtar, a decent ship, while also having the Falcon, an overpowered ship.
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Lux Exterior
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.12.03 18:58:00 -
[15]
Hey, I know this one.....
Oh wait a sec, I can only fly an Arazu. Damn it.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
Friedrich Nietzsche |
Max Hardcase
Art of War Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.12.03 19:16:00 -
[16]
Dont count on getting a lock in time with an arazu to be the primary tackler. Its very iffy vs. cruisers.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2008.12.03 19:25:00 -
[17]
Falcons are overpowered at the moment. Train fo them if you like, but don't be too surprised when they get walloped by the nerfbat.
Arazus already have been fairly recently, so it _should_ be safer :) -- 249km locking? |
maralt
Minmatar The seers of truth
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Posted - 2008.12.03 20:18:00 -
[18]
An arazu is a good addition to a recon gang if your gonna go ganking but the so is a falcon so.................
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Diomidis
Amarr Mythos Corp RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.03 20:43:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Max Hardcase Dont count on getting a lock in time with an arazu to be the primary tackler. Its very iffy vs. cruisers.
Yeah - unlike all other T1/T2 cruisers that insta-lock and tackle... Locking speeds are roughly the same for all T2 cruisers according to my experience, and cruisers WILL get away most of the times without a bubble, ceptor or Sensor Boosting (remote or "local")... Join the Biggest Greek Corp! www.Mythos-eve.com - Join Mythos Channel in game! |
Herz Ing
The Fraternity CODE RED ALLIANCE
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Posted - 2008.12.03 20:47:00 -
[20]
The Arazu's dps isn't worth mentioning. Using a disruptor or your damps in optimal will put you within drone range. The Arazu is only useful if someone else has drone aggro or the target doesn't have drones. Or if you're willing to let your damps fail periodically.
For solo this means you can't kill off anything bigger than a frigate and for gangs this means you're less useful than a Falcon.
Other people may disagree. However, for what it's worth I'm planing to cross-train for a Falcon. ( Currently own and fly an Arazu )
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Xori Ruscuv
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Posted - 2008.12.03 21:54:00 -
[21]
As someone who flies an Arazu in gangs that usually have a couple of falcons, I can tell you: TRAIN A FALCON. They're much much better.
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Max Hardcase
Art of War Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.12.03 21:58:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Max Hardcase on 03/12/2008 21:57:46
Originally by: Diomidis
Originally by: Max Hardcase Dont count on getting a lock in time with an arazu to be the primary tackler. Its very iffy vs. cruisers.
Yeah - unlike all other T1/T2 cruisers that insta-lock and tackle... Locking speeds are roughly the same for all T2 cruisers according to my experience, and cruisers WILL get away most of the times without a bubble, ceptor or Sensor Boosting (remote or "local")...
I usually managed to get a lock in time before QR, I made sure of that not really possible after QR though....a damn slug like a BB managed to warp off in time the other day.
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Lilith Velkor
Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.
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Posted - 2008.12.03 22:05:00 -
[23]
If its to support a friend, a falcon will serve you better, unless your friend tends to scare the prey, then arazu
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DjLowballer
Amarr FLASHTROOPER CORP
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Posted - 2008.12.03 22:40:00 -
[24]
Well thanks for all the replies. Honestly was afraid for flames because I even mentioned the F-word.
I think I am going to train the falcon and then just train up gallente Cruiser V in the next few months. it might sound stupid but I like being able to pick and choose ships, and since I spent my early career stuck in frigs training support skills I can bounce around ok.
Please Vote DjLowballer as your delegate to the CSM! |
maralt
Minmatar The seers of truth
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Posted - 2008.12.03 22:45:00 -
[25]
Originally by: DjLowballer Well thanks for all the replies. Honestly was afraid for flames because I even mentioned the F-word.
I think I am going to train the falcon and then just train up gallente Cruiser V in the next few months. it might sound stupid but I like being able to pick and choose ships, and since I spent my early career stuck in frigs training support skills I can bounce around ok.
Falcon is a good cross train if your gallente spec'd as caldari cruiser V will also put you in the eagle if you already have the HAC skill and head you towards the vulture and the rokh.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.03 22:53:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Diomidis Yeah - unlike all other T1/T2 cruisers that insta-lock and tackle... Locking speeds are roughly the same for all T2 cruisers according to my experience, and cruisers WILL get away most of the times without a bubble, ceptor or Sensor Boosting (remote or "local")...
Key difference here: the Arazu gets hit with a 6-second recalibration delay before it can even begin to lock, so unless your target is pretty oblivious (fortunately, many of them are), you'll need something else to tackle.
As for the OP: Arazu if you want a solo ship, Falcon if you don't. The Falcon is simply better as a gang support ship, but it can't solo at all. -----------
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