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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
Since PVP knowledge alludes most miners (and greed seems to permeate all of you more then sensibility) I have elected to post a decent "Hulk Fit" for this age of EVE's evolution. ATM, do to hulkageddon, Minmatar's stupid high alpha and a blaster buff, everything is dieing in record numbers. Empire is no longer just "Not Safe" there are gankers online 23/7 in every market hub, and they will scan every ship and every shuttle as they fly by. If your mining in a hulk, unless you are in a deep dark system somewhere... some ganker is pretty much on his way.
So... Here is what a PVP guy has learned about mining in a fairly short amount of time.
The Tanked Hulk (that you should all be flying now)
Stats: 33,776 EHP Resists: 71.7 % EM, 85.8% Thermal, 83% Kinetic, 84% Explosive.
[Hulk, Tanked] Damage Control II Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Thermic Dissipation Amplifier II Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Commentary On Build
The resists in the Kin, Therm and explosive range is key. +80% puts this build's resistance right up there with a mission drake, only with 1/2 the EHP. That means ALLOT when you're taking volley hits before concord shows up. Trust me. Your yield is 1,695with Orca bonus, and 1,209 without. So minus two mining laser upgrades, you are losing only 200 per cycle without an orca, and 300 with one. Now if you do the math, yes that sucks a little bit... but the ISK you and your corporation saves in Hulks will equal itself out in the end.
As it turns out, you can do the same thing with Tech I Industrial ships as well. This version is an Iteron Mark V. Its resists are 75.9, 77.2, 72.8, 77.4. It has 26,724 EHP and a passive regen of 114
It can also still carry 15,545 M3's which is more then enough for most practical purposes.
[Iteron Mark V, Tank] Damage Control II Micro Auxiliary Power Core II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II EM Ward Field II Thermic Dissipation Amplifier II Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
[empty high slot] [empty high slot]
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Truth be told, ganking in Empire may be getting out of hand when Jita becomes a practical no fly zone for freighters, industrials and ore ships. But that does not mean that you have to fly glass ships and except being fodder for the masses. There is a big diff between two idiots tearing you down with little not no effort while you're on auto pilot, and it requiring a small, coordinated fleet to do the same thing. You have been notified.
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Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
How about a Dominix that can carry 3,286 units? But still has the EHP of a Drake?
[Dominix, Industrial Domi] Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II
Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
[empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot]
Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Core Defense Field Extender I
You can pretty much do this with any battleship or battlecruiser if you do not need to haul anything substantial at one time. Most gankers will not even bother scanning a domi named "Neut *****" when it's flying around.
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Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
Where do scanner and MLU modules go? Or are you saying that they have been made obsolete by PvPers? |
Danny John-Peter
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
79
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Pretty much exactly what my answer to all the QQ has been all about has been a similar hulk fit, alternatively for the Discerning miner.
[Rokh, Mining] Mining Laser Upgrade II Mining Laser Upgrade II Mining Laser Upgrade II Co-Processor II Co-Processor II
Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Survey Scanner II Large Shield Extender II
Miner II Miner II Miner II Miner II Miner II Miner II Miner II Miner II
Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Core Defense Field Extender I Large Core Defense Field Extender I
Mining Drone II x5
1284 Yield
133k EHP
Awesome
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Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
You can do this, but I'd prefer having the higher thermal resists to stem blaster volleys myself.
Quote:[Hulk, Tanked] Damage Control II Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Rock-Scanning Sensor Array I Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
IMO Danny John-Peter's recommendation is crap because it requires either an Orca or can mining. The Hulk can at least stand alone as a decent mining ship pulling ore.
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Alara IonStorm
1977
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Wouldn't that Hulk Fit would be considered crap by PvP standards because it lacks the equivalent of Industrial Tackle (Sruvey Scanner) and Industrial Damage Mods (MLU).
It's not that Hulks can't tank, it's that they can't do anything else besides tank unlike PvP Ships that get a mix of everything do to generous fitting and slot layout.
Hulk lacks utility not tank. According to most it is expected to make sacrifices like PvP Ships yet I happen to use T2 Guns, EWAR, Tank, Tackle, Speed Mods and Dmg Mods on my PvP Ships. On a Hulk I have to go tank only? |
July Oumis
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
scanner goes on the Orca and the MLU stays at home, simple as that. |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Wouldn't that Hulk Fit would be considered crap by PvP standards because it lacks the equivalent of Industrial Tackle (Sruvey Scanner) and Industrial Damage Mods (MLU).
It's not that Hulks can't tank, it's that they can't do anything else besides tank unlike PvP Ships that get a mix of everything do to generous fitting and slot layout.
Hulk lacks utility not tank. According to most it is expected to make sacrifices like PvP Ships yet I happen to use T2 Guns, EWAR, Tank, Tackle, Speed Mods and Dmg Mods on my PvP Ships at the same time. On a Hulk I have to go tank only?
So what you're saying is, you want more CPU and 1 or 2 more low slots? Not necessarily higher resists and more EHP on the base ship?
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Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:It's not that Hulks can't tank ... No, they cannot tank. It is the reason why we have these threads and the glorious EFT warrior fits. |
Alara IonStorm
1977
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:47:00 -
[10] - Quote
July Oumis wrote:scanner goes on the Orca and the MLU stays at home, simple as that. What Orca?
Am I expected to need Alts or a group to mine like Incursions.
Should they buff Mining Rewards to the same level of Incursions.
Should Hurricane pilots have to leave there Gyro's at home. I got tackled by one once, should he have needed another ship to that. |
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Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:49:00 -
[11] - Quote
July Oumis wrote:scanner goes on the Orca and the MLU stays at home, simple as that. Whose Orca? You mean the miners now shall dock their Hulk at their Orca, scan the belts and then lock on? How is this working?
And what do I do with cargo expanders and mining drone rigs? |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:49:00 -
[12] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Alara IonStorm wrote:It's not that Hulks can't tank ... No, they cannot tank. It is the reason why we have these threads and the glorious EFT warrior fits.
I assure you, this fit can tank. It can also mine pretty well with bonuses.
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July Oumis
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:50:00 -
[13] - Quote
When ther's more than one ship mentioned, some ppl think of alts. I may remind you, that we play an MMO game. |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
587
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:50:00 -
[14] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:July Oumis wrote:scanner goes on the Orca and the MLU stays at home, simple as that. What Orca? Am I expected to need Alts or a group to mine like Incursions. Should they buff Mining Rewards to the same level of Incursions. Should Hurricane pilots have to leave there Gyro's at home. I got tackled by one once, should he have needed another ship to that.
So what you're saying is, you want more CPU and 1 or 2 more low slots? Not necessarily higher resists and more EHP on the base ship?
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Danny John-Peter
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
79
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:50:00 -
[15] - Quote
[Hulk, Less Tanked Hulk MLU] Damage Control II Mining Laser Upgrade II
Limited Adaptive Invulnerability Field I Limited Adaptive Invulnerability Field I Small F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Upgraded EM Ward Amplifier I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
That has a MLU, and still has 24k EHP (26 if you OH the invuls, which of course you will because you will be in front of the Keyboad) |
Alara IonStorm
1977
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:51:00 -
[16] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote: So what you're saying is, you want more CPU and 1 or 2 more low slots? Not necessarily higher resists and more EHP on the base ship?
I would be happy to start flying a Hulk with just 25 Extra Grid and CPU.
[Hulk, New Setup 1] Damage Control II Mining Laser Upgrade II
Medium Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Survey Scanner II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal II Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal II Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal II
Medium Cargohold Optimization I Medium Cargohold Optimization I
Hobgoblin II x5 Mining Drone II x5
But hey throw in a few extra lows if you want. |
Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:52:00 -
[17] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:I assure you, this fit can tank. No. A Rokh can tank, this cannot. One neut and the tank is off. |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
54
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Wouldn't that Hulk Fit would be considered crap by PvP standards because it lacks the equivalent of Industrial Tackle (Sruvey Scanner) and Industrial Damage Mods (MLU). It's not crap, it's a max-tank fit. You also have the choice to go for a compromise: Damage Control and one MLU. Exactly as with a combat ship you can fit on a spectrum from "full tank, crap damage/yield" over "medium tank, medium damage/yield" to "no tank, max damage/yield".
If I fit my combat ship for max dps and no tank, I'm gambling that I won't be the primary. If you fit your hulk for all yield and no tank, you're gambling that you'll not meet gankers today. Winner of elections banned, runner-up demoted by rest of the body, the council controlled by the losers. CSM 7 is illegitimate, CCP should remember when dealing with them. Remember what players voted for. |
July Oumis
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:54:00 -
[19] - Quote
I never suicided any ships, but my urge to skill a Toon for that purpose, rises by the minute reading all these whine threats about Hulks...
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Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
589
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:I assure you, this fit can tank. No. A Rokh can tank, this cannot. One neut and the tank is off.
No, A Rohk can tank like a freakin beast. Better then most other non-capital ships in EVE. The hulk build that I posted still gets these resists when the Invuls are shut down by neuts: 59.6, 81.5, 75.7, 77.4 and a decent 25,320 EHP. The critical elements of high resists in the Kin, therm range are still there.
So you see, you do not know anything about PVP.
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Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
589
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:57:00 -
[21] - Quote
[Hulk, Tanked Passive] Damage Control II Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Thermic Dissipation Amplifier II Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Kinetic Deflection Amplifier II EM Ward Amplifier II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Passive tank. Resists: 70.9, 76.8, 82.6, 69.4 and 26,141 EHP.
Still not bad IMO.
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Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:58:00 -
[22] - Quote
July Oumis wrote:I never suicided any ships, but my urge to skill a Toon for that purpose, rises by the minute reading all these whine threats about Hulks... It is spelled "whine threads", unless you do mean "whine threats". |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
589
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Posted - 2012.04.13 11:59:00 -
[23] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:July Oumis wrote:I never suicided any ships, but my urge to skill a Toon for that purpose, rises by the minute reading all these whine threats about Hulks... It is spelled "whine threads", unless you do mean "whine threats".
Careful, correcting other people's grammer after losing an argument puts you at higher risk of receiving a "U mad bra?" No one likes receiving a U mad bra. Because... no matter how much you say that you're not mad... they know that you really are.
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Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:02:00 -
[24] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:So you see, you do not know anything about PVP. Wrong, I do not know everything about PvP. I would however use EMP against a Hulk and I fail to see why you fit extra heat resistance onto it. |
Alara IonStorm
1977
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:04:00 -
[25] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote: It's not crap, it's a max-tank fit. You also have the choice to go for a compromise: Damage Control and one MLU. Exactly as with a combat ship you can fit on a spectrum from "full tank, crap damage/yield" over "medium tank, medium damage/yield" to "no tank, max damage/yield".
There in lies the issue, you can not tank it without the max tank fit. A Medium Shield Extender and DCU take away the option for even one MLU. Unlike a combat Ship like a Hurricane where you can just throw on extenders, Dmg mods, tackle and top tier guns.
Terrorfrodo wrote: If I fit my combat ship for max dps and no tank, I'm gambling that I won't be the primary. If you fit your hulk for all yield and no tank, you're gambling that you'll not meet gankers today.
I fit mine with Tank, Tackle and DPS because most ships give me that option.
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Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
589
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:04:00 -
[26] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:So you see, you do not know anything about PVP. Wrong, I do not know everything about PvP. I would however use EMP against a Hulk and I fail to see why you fit extra heat resistance onto it.
Kin,therm for blaster catalyst. If your argument is fit EM instead, go ahead. There is CPU to do so, have a party.
But that is now your real argument now is it?
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Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
995
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:04:00 -
[27] - Quote
July Oumis wrote:Scanner goes on the Orca and the MLU stays at home, simple as that.
Since we cry about stuff: I want a 1000 DPS Tengu with 250k ehp... and please T2 fitted.
I'm sure you already enjoy paying your drake 45M when it was only 32M 3 months ago. I can't wait to see you post "OMAGAD ECONOMY SUCKS" when you'll have to start put buy orders at over 55M that will never be covered. Go ahead shoot on your own foot, I'm enjoying each little bit of what's happening and what will come sooner than latter.
I'm spending all my minerals on building a Titan-tears collector, those 8 low slots full of T3 cargo expanders that increase your cargo for 500% each, plus I added Capital T4 cargo rigs that increase your tears by 1000%
Can't wait |
TheBlueMonkey
Natural Progression
124
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
if you mined in a group, in an area of space where you had good intel, you wouldn't have these issues. |
Whitehound
42
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:But that is now your real argument now is it? You mean do I want to argue with a dodgy EFT warrior? Hell no. |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
54
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:13:00 -
[30] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:I'm sure you already enjoy paying your drake 45M when it was only 32M 3 months ago. If prices go up, miners can tank their hulk properly and still earn a lot more ISK/hour than before with a paper hulk, so what's the problem?
There are only so many players willing and able to form dedicated ganking teams. Anyone can train two chars and gank solo whenever he feels like it. Even if you only need one more guy (=a second player) to kill a hulk, the number of gangs around at any one time that can do this will shrink drastically. Also, gangs are always easier to spot and avoid than single attackers. Winner of elections banned, runner-up demoted by rest of the body, the council controlled by the losers. CSM 7 is illegitimate, CCP should remember when dealing with them. Remember what players voted for. |
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