EVE Search - Why Must I Use a Mic?

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Why Must I Use a Mic?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 :: [one page]
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:17:00 - [1] why do i have to use a mic? why cant i just listen in? this has been my issue since the beginning of EVE. after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" the convo went on for about 15 minutes, and it was all him trying to convince me. I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. i did anyway, but it didnt end so well. i renew my account, try to get into another corp, and same BS. my first question is this: why cant i play WITH, and not play with in order to BE? my thing is...i dont want to get to know you. i dont particularly like speaking to people whose faces i dont know over the phone. this is why im not a telemarketer. i certainly dont want to have to sell myself by allowing others to "get to know me" in order to enjoy this game in its full entirety. for me, this isnt a conduit through which i will form meaningful and/or lasting connections. i want to play. my second question: what if i was a mute, or deaf? the people that i speak to like to say that im shy...but this isnt the case; i work in a very social profession. in addition, i went through all the normal developmental processes, and have what you may consider a normal life for a young adult. but what if I couldnt hear or speak? sometimes I wish people assumed this about me, for the purposes of playing this game. the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's.
Graelyn Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:21:00 - [2] Enjoy solo play then. o/
Tridik Caldari the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:22:00 - [3] Go back to WoW.
brinelan Caldari Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:25:00 - [4] Voice chat is becoming the norm in all online games, so you will have to accept that fact if you want to continue to play any type of game online because it is becoming more and more expected that you also use voice. Some days you're the bug, some days you're the windshield.
Azia Burgi Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:27:00 - [5] I agree with you. My last experience of TS was of various indistinguishable Americans swearing a lot. It just wasn't a pleasant experience. That coupled with the fact I work in a call centre. I have to wear a headset for a job, I don't want to come home and have to wear one to enjoy my eve time. Azia Burgi http://azia.geekandproud.co.uk BP Profit Calculator EVE Cemetery
Gunnanmon Gallente UNITED STAR SYNDICATE	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:27:00 - [6] Find a corp that doesn't require it. I guess you're not interested in the rantings of imbeciles, either. The Ghost-training vote thread
Ha'Uler GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:28:00 - [7] It's really weird that you don't want to get to know people you'll spend many hours with over the course of months or even years. EVE is a hobby like every other one, and unless you want to do it alone you're forced to meet and get to know new people. Why should people fly with you if you just want to be a recluse? For everyone I know, PVP is about the people they fly with, not who or what they actually kill. You're obviously an exception to that, but you need to realize that you don't fit into the usual corps then.
Tu Pham Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:28:00 - [8] Because, to many of the social misfits who play this game, EVE is their main venue for forming personal relationships. It's the same in most MMOs, though EVE seems to attract a particularly low quality of player. Just looks around in this forum for five minutes...
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:29:00 - [9] im not expecting anyone to relate to me, per se. and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion.
Dirk Magnum Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:30:00 - [10] Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 30/12/2008 20:36:18 Both nullsec entities I was a part of required mic use. Guess who always had an excuse not to use one? edit: well not literally but I did have an aversion to them. They are really useful though for coordination since you can keep your hands at the controls instead of using them for typing stuff in comms channels. Also in a corp where the directors and established members and such have a long history together, as the core of RHN does, you hear some pretty lolful things coming over the mic.
Billy Sastard Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:31:00 - [11] You are not alone. I really dislike using voice comms for non-essential communications as well. I always make it clear to people that I fly with that, yes I will get on comms for essential ops where it is needed, but I don't talk much if at all. I really started feeling this way when the corp I was in at the time tried to force a rule of 'if you are in game you have to be on coms'. Well I told the CEO flat out that it was BS. There is no reason to be forced into using voice comms when they aren't necessary. For me the main contributing factor to this is that when I am playing eve, I am also chatting with my wife and keeping an eye on my kids and such, and putting on the headset creates a situation of isolation where I am paying more attention to what is going on in the coms than in real life around me. In addition to this, I just really don't like/feel comfortable with speaking to people I don't know/will never know IRL. I worked about 6 years doing telephone support for various companies and this more than anything helped to reinforce my dislike of this type of situation. But in short, I agree with the OP. Voice comms has its place in pvp combat situations, it is in no way essential for all other aspects of the game however, and it should be left to players to decide wether they want to spend all their time 'plugged in' to comms or not, and CEO's should respect this. <-------------------------------------------------> "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." -Albert Einstein
Belladona Grimm Raven's Heart	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:31:00 - [12] Edited by: Belladona Grimm on 30/12/2008 20:32:17 I to, have had 'the talk'. But at least my CEO at the time wasn't a tool and didn't care if I just listened in. TBH, I've never done that, and the first time I"m told I need to is the same 10second block that I hit quit corp in. I don't care if its 'the norm' or whatever, it is not and should not be a requirement. Thats like saying its the norm to to eat at McDonalds on Tuesday, so on Tuesday you haveto eat at McDonalds. If they want to get to know you, let their fingers do the talking.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:33:00 - [13] As a CEO of a corporation I can understand where the OP is coming from. I urge all my members to have mics as it is easier to speak something than to type it. However there are a few circumstances where a mic is not possible to have/use. I have someone in my corporation who is mute and can't use a mic, but she gets in vent and listens in and talks back in corp chat/fleet chat whatever. Another member does not have a mic and has a fried sound card, so I'm not going to force them to go get a new sound card just so they can be in the corp. At the end of the day it's all about where your goals are. If your goals are to have fun, then everyone should be having fun without needing to go "The extra mile" to fit in. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:34:00 - [14] Originally by: Billy Sastard There is no reason to be forced into using voice comms when they aren't necessary. For me the main contributing factor to this is that when I am playing eve, I am also chatting with my wife and keeping an eye on my kids and such, and putting on the headset creates a situation of isolation where I am paying more attention to what is going on in the coms than in real life around me. Thanks, this is my exact same situation. I dont want to isolate myself from people at home.
Khemul Zula Amarr Keisen Trade League	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:34:00 - [15] That was philosophical? If you are handicap then no one will fault you for not being able to use a mic. Saying "I don't want to use it!" is not even in the same ball park. No one can force you to use one, but many people do use TS/Vent to interact and they'll probably be wondering why you keep refusing to use it. Just find a corp that doesn't use it as the primary social tool. ------ I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.
Billy Sastard Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:41:00 - [16] I find the whole 'its easier to speak something than type it' argument extremely irritating. How lazy can you be that typing a few words is that much of an effort? I can see in a fast paced combat situation how voice communications is definitely easier. However it has been my experience that when things get exciting everyone (or at least 2 or 3 people) start jabbering at once and it would actually be simpler and clearer to have one person typing commands in fleet chat. <-------------------------------------------------> "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." -Albert Einstein
Ralarina Caldari Vivicide	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:41:00 - [17] Originally by: UMEE im not expecting anyone to relate to me, per se. and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion. and yet Originally by: UMEE I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. So what you doing then? If you want that sort of discussion, it's better moved to Out of Pod, this isn't eve-related per se, it's about your RL psyche. --
MooKids Caldari Dark Echo Engineering	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:42:00 - [18] I give you two scenarios, one with someone who uses a mic and one who decides to type. w/ mic and voice chat "Help, I'm under attack, need assistance!" w/o mic and typing "Help, I'm undwwwwwwwwww11234434dasawda" "Dammit, they killed me while I was typing!" A mic allows for speedy communications and gets people's attention, while typing does not. -------------------------------- CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity.
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 20:47:00 - [19] Originally by: Ralarina Originally by: UMEE im not expecting anyone to relate to me, per se. and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion. and yet Originally by: UMEE I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. So what you doing then? If you want that sort of discussion, it's better moved to Out of Pod, this isn't eve-related per se, it's about your RL psyche. i dont understand what youre saying. with that im asking: why do i have to justify my values to play this game to its full extent? it's a game, not a political campaign. notice how in the next sentence i said i justified my values to him anyways. this is EVE related because it's an issue preventing me from enjoying the game. rather, it's a mass-effect. so if i dont conform, i dont play. im asking why is this the case. my RL psyche is merely an example of a VALUE. point is i need to have a "correct" value to play the game I enjoy, and what would you call that?
Alowishus the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:06:00 - [20] Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the ****ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned.
Grek Forto Truth And Rage	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:06:00 - [21] Using voice comms are very good because it allows you to stress certain points you wanna make. For example if you are a Fleet Commander. I don't see why you write all this on this particular forum but I can see that you don't wanna use voice comms and that is your own choice. Just don't expect people to put up with it at all times.
AleRiperKilt	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:07:00 - [22] So you are joining PvP corps and whining they want you to have a mic? Join a carebear corp, they don't care but they won't PvP either. PvP ops without a mic are suicide. Some time ago an experienced pvper joined our corp. Hostiles showed up so we asked him to FC for defense gang, first thing he did was kick out fleet members without mic. --- "I live in Los Angeles, where driving is non-consensual pvp" - Arric Rohr
Rana Ash Minmatar Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:08:00 - [23] I have been in 2 corps where mike was urged but not nessesary. If i could listen in to orders given that was ok, and then to type out a quick ok or roger. Was not a problem, i know it's quite useful in combat ops. But i see where the OP is comming from, i have no desire to hear the people. Especially if the female turns out to have a really dark voice . It breaks the immersion for me lyret dedreen
Von Druid Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:09:00 - [24] Edited by: Von Druid on 30/12/2008 21:10:45 Originally by: UMEE Originally by: Ralarina Originally by: UMEE im not expecting anyone to relate to me, per se. and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion. and yet Originally by: UMEE I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. So what you doing then? If you want that sort of discussion, it's better moved to Out of Pod, this isn't eve-related per se, it's about your RL psyche. i dont understand what youre saying. with that im asking: why do i have to justify my values to play this game to its full extent? it's a game, not a political campaign. notice how in the next sentence i said i justified my values to him anyways. this is EVE related because it's an issue preventing me from enjoying the game. rather, it's a mass-effect. so if i dont conform, i dont play. im asking why is this the case. my RL psyche is merely an example of a VALUE. point is i need to have a "correct" value to play the game I enjoy, and what would you call that? Just because your current corp requires you to be on voice at all times doesn't mean that all corps are like that. You joined a corp and don't respect its "values", but there are thousands of other ones to join, or you could even create your own one. You have a problem with your current CEO but you shouldn't judge the whole game based on interaction with a single person or group of persons.
Ralarina Caldari Vivicide	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:11:00 - [25] Originally by: UMEE Originally by: Ralarina Originally by: UMEE im not expecting anyone to relate to me, per se. and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion. and yet Originally by: UMEE I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. So what you doing then? If you want that sort of discussion, it's better moved to Out of Pod, this isn't eve-related per se, it's about your RL psyche. i dont understand what youre saying. with that im asking: why do i have to justify my values to play this game to its full extent? it's a game, not a political campaign. notice how in the next sentence i said i justified my values to him anyways. this is EVE related because it's an issue preventing me from enjoying the game. rather, it's a mass-effect. so if i dont conform, i dont play. im asking why is this the case. my RL psyche is merely an example of a VALUE. point is i need to have a "correct" value to play the game I enjoy, and what would you call that? There is no big philosophical disussion to be had. Most serious corps in the game require you to have team speak or vent or some sort of voice comms because when you're engaged in combat, everyone needs to be able to give info to the FC immediately; they dont have time for you to type it out and them to read it. If you're not willing to accept that, then join a corp that does not require it. This is not solely eve online; most raiding guilds in WoW require it, X=Box Live and wahtever sony do for the PS3, their Halo etc games in co-op mode almost universally require it if they're serious; certainly clans do. That's just the way it is and that's your answer. There's nothing more to it. --
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:16:00 - [26] Originally by: UMEE Why Must I Use a Mic? Because it's better than using a Mac ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Crumplecorn Contact the CSM about it, voting themselves into disbandment wouldn't be pushing the boundaries of absurdity for them.
Straight Chillen Gallente Solar Wind	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:18:00 - [27] Because EVE isnt something you can excell at solo. I for one started using voice servers about a month or so after i started playing. It makes you feel like your more involved with the team and closer with your fellow corp/alliance m8's. Really it depends on weither you want be known and involved, or just another nameless face. But mainly it comes down to PVP. And when **** get hot and heavy, There simply isnt time to type it down. When peoples e-lives are in the balance information need to be exchanged fluidly. I dont care how fast of a typer you are, There is no way you will be able to write down a list of 100 hostile ship types in the same span it would take you to simply say it on TS or Vent. Simply put, You not having a mic, Not only puts you at greater risk, but everyone in your gang/fleet Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Furb Killer Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:25:00 - [28] Quote: Because EVE isnt something you can excell at solo. Some people play to have fun... For pvp i fully agree you should be listening on voice. The FC should have a mic and scouts should have a mic. Besides that it is nice if you got one, but really doesnt add that much. I have a mic, and often i dont say a word in fleet. Not to mention i have seen FCs who go completely emo when someone else talks (and no there was nothing else going on which was a threat). --------------------------------------------- Originally by: Neth'Rae Military experts are calling this a troll.
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:26:00 - [29] "There is no big philosophical disussion to be had." - there is always a philosophical discussion to be had "Most serious corps in the game require you to have team speak or vent or some sort of voice comms because when you're engaged in combat, everyone needs to be able to give info to the FC immediately; they dont have time for you to type it out and them to read it." - I've been in many "serious" corps, as this is merely my alt. typing intel has been an accepted means. perhaps we're all gettin a little too lazy to read nowadays. overall, there is this prevalent enforcement of mic usage for individuals' own convenience, without any regard for the convenience of the person on the other side of this exchange. listening in, and/or typing intel have been acceptable in the past. if they are not now, then why not? "If you're not willing to accept that, then join a corp that does not require it." - this is becoming extremely difficult, hence my post. "This is not solely eve online;" - right, but we're not talking about other games. just because it is the norm, it doesnt mean that you can ignore people's individual experiences, i.e. being unable to get on mic for whatever reason - this reason does not need to be justified because this is a game. "most raiding guilds in WoW require it" - absolutely not true. been playing WoW for a long time now. "That's just the way it is and that's your answer. There's nothing more to it." - what is the way it is? and if that which you speak of is the way it is, then why is that the case?
Yuri VanKaer	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:26:00 - [30] OP: I agree with you 100%. For myself, I am a 100+ wpm typist, so I gain nothing by speaking over typing, as far as speed of communication. As well, I always listen to music while I play online games, and having to listen/talk to ppl voice disturbs my sense of serenity. I listen/talk to ppl all day long in the course of my workday, I want to be able to relax when I get home. Hence, I'll never be in a corp that requires it. The reason that voice comms are becoming mandatory: ppl are too lazy to learn to type properly. "Why shouldn't I type with only one finger, since I can just say what I want?" And of course, we must not forget the fapping to killmails crowd...
Berious Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:26:00 - [31] Originally by: UMEE 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. So basically you don't want to deal with people online or make any e-pals. Don't join a corp then, problem solved.
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:31:00 - [32] "You joined a corp and don't respect its "values", but there are thousands of other ones to join, or you could even create your own one." - i very much respect their values. i showed this by joining TS, and listening in during OPs. them pressuring me to get on mic on the basis of "getting to know me better" is what made me uncomfortable. simply because i was willing to compromise, while they were not.
Joe Starbreaker Starbreaker Frigateers	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:33:00 - [33] You don't need it if you're in a low-stress PVE or industrial corporation, but for PVP if competitive voice chat is nearly a necessity. Even then, you should be able to get away with just listening and not speaking, though you obviously won't be able to serve as fleet commander or as scout. I don't think a mic is a necessity. If you do get a mic and want to keep your privacy, look into one of the voice-changing software packages that can make you sound like a robot, or a woman, or whatever. Then the LOLs will be yours. ............. Now recruiting like-minded pilots.
Davlos Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:37:00 - [34] These are called "philosophical questions"? I appreciate my Nietzsche as much as the next guy, but this isn't infringing upon "your values", mate. This is yourself having a gyroscope-like self-centeredness. If you really want to talk about this "philosophically", UMEE, you might want to read on more philosophers before spouting more verbal diarrhoea. Any philosopher worth his salt that any person attempting to enter a new enclave or community has to align him- or herself to its rules within it. Christianity/Juadism demands this of its followers, to abide by the law of the land. Titus 3:1 ==> "Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good," Buddhism also says this. I don't have the exact quote from the sutras on hand but it mentions the wise man to abide by the laws of any strange land he settles down in. There're a myriad reasons why almost any other activity online these days has their communities that have the increasing usage of VOIP communication. It's not confined to games. Skype has been becoming a very popular free VOIP phone service for business. And there's nothing wrong with forming bonds with "people you don't intend to meet". Playing MMOs is all about social interaction and forming of said bonds. If you don't wish to have that, the MMO genre isn't for you if you wish to reap the most enjoyment out of it. --- Originally by: Revan Neferis Scientific category of gravitation fields and velocity is force....
Alowishus the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:38:00 - [35] Originally by: Yuri VanKaer OP: I agree with you 100%. For myself, I am a 100+ wpm typist, so I gain nothing by speaking over typing, as far as speed of communication. In other words: "I've never done group PvP," otherwise you'd know the speed with which you type means absolutely nothing when you're in a battle that's going to last 45-90 seconds and you are managing targets (friendly and hostile), drones and your modules. Anyone who says they're just as capable without a mic obviously doesn't have much experience. Or you have four hands.
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:38:00 - [36] Originally by: Berious Originally by: UMEE 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. So basically you don't want to deal with people online or make any e-pals. Don't join a corp then, problem solved. dealing with people online is not what the discussion is about. i can deal with people online by typing to them. the discussion is about mic enforcement on people who cannot, or will not use one. there are alternatives, but few are willing to compromise. this leads me to believe that people are pursuing only that which is most convenient for them, and the e-relationship is not their goal to begin with. like me, most probably just want to play the game. "the getting to know you" is perhaps a euphemism for "get on mic so it's easier for me", or "get on mic so that my own mic-ness is acknowledged and my values are not debated" no, i dont want to make any e-pals, i want to play the game. if an e-relationship is formed, then all the better. but dont make it a requisite. individuals are imposing this.
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:40:00 - [37] Originally by: Davlos These are called "philosophical questions"? I appreciate my Nietzsche as much as the next guy, but this isn't infringing upon "your values", mate. This is yourself having a gyroscope-like self-centeredness. If you really want to talk about this "philosophically", UMEE, you might want to read on more philosophers before spouting more verbal diarrhoea. Any philosopher worth his salt that any person attempting to enter a new enclave or community has to align him- or herself to its rules within it. Christianity/Juadism demands this of its followers, to abide by the law of the land. Titus 3:1 ==> "Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good," Buddhism also says this. I don't have the exact quote from the sutras on hand but it mentions the wise man to abide by the laws of any strange land he settles down in. There're a myriad reasons why almost any other activity online these days has their communities that have the increasing usage of VOIP communication. It's not confined to games. Skype has been becoming a very popular free VOIP phone service for business. And there's nothing wrong with forming bonds with "people you don't intend to meet". Playing MMOs is all about social interaction and forming of said bonds. If you don't wish to have that, the MMO genre isn't for you if you wish to reap the most enjoyment out of it. you should really read my initial post. and i think you have your philosophy and religion mixed up. i didnt ground my debate in metaphysics, so Nietzsche has little to do with it all.
Alowishus the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:40:00 - [38] Originally by: UMEE made me uncomfortable. This is the Internet. Sack up.
Yuri VanKaer	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:49:00 - [39] Edited by: Yuri VanKaer on 30/12/2008 21:53:23 Originally by: Alowishus Originally by: Yuri VanKaer OP: I agree with you 100%. For myself, I am a 100+ wpm typist, so I gain nothing by speaking over typing, as far as speed of communication. In other words: "I've never done group PvP," otherwise you'd know the speed with which you type means absolutely nothing when you're in a battle that's going to last 45-90 seconds and you are managing targets (friendly and hostile), drones and your modules. Anyone who says they're just as capable without a mic obviously doesn't have much experience. Or you have four hands. Yes, because it's sooo necessary to write a novel in the midst of combat. As if anything (worthwhile) is said during fleet voice comms that can't be typed in one word? Or for that matter...have you never noticed those little buttons for fleet comms? Just because you have a hard time doing anything but bash your head into the keyboard, doesn't mean the rest of us do. p.s. If you're having that much trouble managing things, get a controller like a Nostromo. Seriously.
Davlos Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:52:00 - [40] Edited by: Davlos on 30/12/2008 21:55:19 Originally by: UMEE Originally by: Davlos These are called "philosophical questions"? I appreciate my Nietzsche as much as the next guy, but this isn't infringing upon "your values", mate. This is yourself having a gyroscope-like self-centeredness. If you really want to talk about this "philosophically", UMEE, you might want to read on more philosophers before spouting more verbal diarrhoea. Any philosopher worth his salt that any person attempting to enter a new enclave or community has to align him- or herself to its rules within it. Christianity/Juadism demands this of its followers, to abide by the law of the land. Titus 3:1 ==> "Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good," Buddhism also says this. I don't have the exact quote from the sutras on hand but it mentions the wise man to abide by the laws of any strange land he settles down in. There're a myriad reasons why almost any other activity online these days has their communities that have the increasing usage of VOIP communication. It's not confined to games. Skype has been becoming a very popular free VOIP phone service for business. And there's nothing wrong with forming bonds with "people you don't intend to meet". Playing MMOs is all about social interaction and forming of said bonds. If you don't wish to have that, the MMO genre isn't for you if you wish to reap the most enjoyment out of it. you should really read my initial post. and i think you have your philosophy and religion mixed up. i didnt ground my debate in metaphysics, so Nietzsche has little to do with it all. Nietzsche == metaphysical? That's news to me. I'm probably one of the most non-religious people around here. Didn't wish to throw out my disclaimer without offending plenty of people, but religion to me is a pair of rose/fecal-tinted lens that clouds any sort of judgement. You yourself have been the one mixing up philosophy and religion to begin with. I threw out the instructions from the religions first, because they're the most commonly-known and you'll probably understand them best. Perhaps you may want to read the last paragraph of the previous post about how interconnected the world has become. The world is about to leave behind individuals like you, and I'm looking forward to having my children being served by your children in a restaurant in Dubai. Here's from Asia, to you, at wherever you are. Probably America, looking at the gyroscope-like self-centeredness you've been displaying, or attempting to justify. But if I wanted to formulate a simplistic explanation of what you've been spouting so far, it would be, "I am a huge hairy bloke recently released from prison, and I do not use a mike because I wish you all to think I am a woman like my avatar." Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. --- Originally by: Revan Neferis Scientific category of gravitation fields and velocity is force....
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.12.30 21:59:00 - [41] Personally, I don't have anything against voice chat, but I like to control when I bother to do it. After talking with people all day in the office and meetings and conferences and bug councils... the last thing I want to do is spend all of my free time "relaxing" by chatting by voice with a bunch of people online. Then again, sometimes I don't mind it either. -- What's your EVE New Year's Resolution for 2009?
Gonada Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:02:00 - [42] Edited by: Gonada on 30/12/2008 22:03:28 plain and simple, voice is faster. so, if you pvp alot with others, use a mic. decent corps have a minimun of crapchat in corp, and on roams, or ops, the fc's usually keep a tight reign on chat while grouped. if you dont like using voice, then like others said, go join a carebear corp, cause if you cant see the benefits you suck, plain and simple. Please, jump into traffic
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:03:00 - [43] It's not a question of values, it's a question of efficiency. Voice chat is simply much more effective for PvP than trying to run things by text. And no, you can't just listen in, because PvP is a two-way thing. You need to listen to your FC's orders, but you *also* need to pass on any information you have, and you can not do that by text. Obviously people can be reasonable and make exceptions (such as a sleeping roommate, hardware problems, etc), but if your entire reason is "I just don't want to", don't be surprised when you're kicked from the corp, as you deserve it for being a selfish moron. Outside of PvP, who cares. I'll often end up chatting over voice (usually in quiet periods between fights, just to kill time), but I've never been in or associated with a corp where social chat was mandatory. -----------
UMEE	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:05:00 - [44] Edited by: UMEE on 30/12/2008 22:10:43 Originally by: Davlos Nietzsche == metaphysical? That's news to me. I'm probably one of the most non-religious people around here. Didn't wish to throw out my disclaimer without offending plenty of people, but religion to me is a pair of rose/fecal-tinted lens that clouds any sort of judgement. You yourself have been the one mixing up philosophy and religion to begin with. I threw out the instructions from the religions first, because they're the most commonly-known and you'll probably understand them best. Perhaps you may want to read the last paragraph of the previous post about how interconnected the world has become. The world is about to leave behind individuals like you, and I'm looking forward to having my children being served by your children in a restaurant in Dubai. Here's from Asia, to you, at wherever you are. Probably America, looking at the gyroscope-like self-centeredness you've been displaying, or attempting to justify. But if I wanted to formulate a simplistic explanation of what you've been spouting so far, it would be, "I am a huge hairy bloke recently released from prison, and I do not use a mike because I wish you all to think I am a woman like my avatar." Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. i have a lot of respect for you because despite your AS, you are a strong and social individual. we all have plenty to learn from each other. i would just like to say that Nietzsche grounded most of his work in metaphysics in an attempt to explain reality and being, but could not because, in simplistic terms, he disassociated being from the physical world and the lived experience. these things in part make us who we are, so you can see why he struggled. maybe you can see why im struggling...im willing to take my immersion in this virtual world only so far. somehow getting to know people over TS is not quite the same as getting to know them in person. for some, it is! and i respect this. for me, it is not...and i sort of expect people to understand my side of it as well. im not american, and i dont quite understand why my child will be working in Dubai, but anyway, let's get back to our topic!
Sol'Kanar Minmatar SRIUS BISNIS	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:06:00 - [45] Originally by: Davlos Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. Asperger's is AWESOME. Do you pop and tick and carry a wooden cigarette like that dude on Boston Legal? I could watch that **** for hours. :)
Janu Hull Caldari Terra Incognita Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:11:00 - [46] The only viable reasons I've ever had from people not using mics for voicecommsduring ops are two guys in my corp with newborns at home. In those two cases, I can buy into it. At the same time, I'm pretty sure there are some FCs out there who don't mind the idea of having only him and his scouts capable of chatter during combat ops. In the event of an emergency, my ego may be used as a floatation device.
Sebea Bottomfeeders Science and Research	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:16:00 - [47] Originally by: Yuri VanKaer Yes, because it's sooo necessary to write a novel in the midst of combat. As if anything (worthwhile) is said during fleet voice comms that can't be typed in one word? Or for that matter...have you never noticed those little buttons for fleet comms? Just because you have a hard time doing anything but bash your head into the keyboard, doesn't mean the rest of us do. p.s. If you're having that much trouble managing things, get a controller like a Nostromo. Seriously. so what you're saying is that you HAVE been in large scale battles, but because you typed out all your commands, and only used those handy fleet order buttons, you got curb stomped. your undeniably and idiot for even trying to justify fleet combat through text, and more so, I'm calling you out, you gather your fleet, and you set it up, so you type your commands out. i'll get some friends, hop on a TS server, and hand you your ass on a silver platter as you try to spit out 100 wpm orders to a group of guys that are dead before your first command hits the text window.
Ankhesentapemkah	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:20:00 - [48] I really, really hate voice comms. First I have trouble speaking, and can't play and speak at the same time because the speech messes up my head somehow. Same with sound. If there's people talking or loud music or whatever, it messes with my head as well and I can't play. Too bad it's a bit of a standard with all those MMO's, I got kicked repeatedly for not wanting to use Vent in Guild Wars. --- NEW MOVIE!
Nyack hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:21:00 - [49] i cant stand the philosophy "its my game i can do what i want with my play time, no corp or ceo can tell me what to do.." if you have joined a corp or an alliance you have commited to be a part of that corp, to contribute and play by the rules the corp/alliance has setup. if you dont like the rules or the corp just do every one the favour and leave.. there are tons of other corp out there that will suit your playstyle, go join them instead! in pvp, a mic is more or less a mandatory, as you are putting your own and your whole gang at risk by not using it. -a good example is a titan warping in on your gang, you are the first to see it on overview the seconds it will take you to type that down and every one in gang to see that is the second they will need to whipe of your whole gang out. most gangs are killed by mistakes that are done in split seconds, not having a mic is putting your whole gang at risk.
Rendeera	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:28:00 - [50] Originally by: Yuri VanKaer Yes, because it's sooo necessary to write a novel in the midst of combat. As if anything (worthwhile) is said during fleet voice comms that can't be typed in one word? Or for that matter...have you never noticed those little buttons for fleet comms? Just because you have a hard time doing anything but bash your head into the keyboard, doesn't mean the rest of us do. p.s. If you're having that much trouble managing things, get a controller like a Nostromo. Seriously. This really proves their point. It's not that you are so uber you can type while multitasking, i'ts the inconvenience you are imposting upon your fleet-mates. You expect them to take their eyes off their targets, their overviews, their weapons, and notice a little scrawly wiggle of text? If you had been there this line would've made sense to you , " you'd know the speed with which you type means absolutely nothing when you're in a battle that's going to last 45-90 seconds and you are managing targets (friendly and hostile), drones and your modules ". Go pvp for a month or two and then read that again more slowly. cheers
Tobias Sjodin Ore Mongers	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:31:00 - [51] To me it's simple. I don't like voice communication sometimes either, I sometimes prefer to listen to music and not play EVE actively. Like log on to EVE, chat a bit with the corpmates on text, talk on the phone, or with the girlfriend. I prefer to use voice-comms when I am actively focusing on playing EVE (usually this is when there's an op going on). But at the same time, most ops that aren't scheduled start on voice-comms, and those who arent on comms don't join up because the op started via voice (not seldomly these people tend to complain about 'nothing's happening'). In essence if you want to play the social game, which all corporations are involved in you have to use a microphone. If you don't like it, then start your own corporation and invite people who agree with you. If you don't want to start one then tough luck. Corporations aren't about the "me me me me", it's about a community - and if you don't want to join it then don't. You can't both have the cookie and eat it.
brakespear Minmatar Heaven Up Here	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:35:00 - [52] Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah I really, really hate voice comms. First I have trouble speaking, and can't play and speak at the same time because the speech messes up my head somehow. Same with sound. If there's people talking or loud music or whatever, it messes with my head as well and I can't play. Too bad it's a bit of a standard with all those MMO's, I got kicked repeatedly for not wanting to use Vent in Guild Wars. This, plus the other person earlier who mentioned not wishing to be isolated from family with special addition a partner who is deaf is a post so you'd hear nothing but the bloody TV anyway -------------------------------------------------- 'people will always be tempted to wipe their feet on anything with 'welcome' written on it.'
Cade Morrigan Caldari	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:43:00 - [53] I can see requiring a mic for pvp ops, but no other reason. Most of the non-combat chatter on voice is just too stupid to keep the brain tuned into; you're not that interesting, so don't try to force people to listen to your verbal ****ing. ;) Seriously though, I play the game to play the game, not to make friends. If teaming up and voicing up means winning, i'm for it, but otherwise feh.
Visceroth Minmatar The Athiest Syndicate	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:50:00 - [54] Damn I don't know who you all fly with but when I'm on comms, it is usually a fun time. I'm not CEO but I know in my corp, if you don't have a mic and you need help, don't expect it to come running as our chat windows are usually on local. We don't pay attention to the blinky chat windows. I type pretty fast, but I find it's easier to say "some dude, x is in y ship at belt z". Should it be a REQUIREMENT? No. Should it be expected? No. But should you expect help to come running? No. I know that wasn't the OP's point and I feel for you not wanting to get on comms. I defend those that don't want to get mics and talk. But I just usually say don't expect help right away and expect lonely chats to yourself when we're on comms.
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.30 22:56:00 - [55] I think most people feel a bit awkward when first using a mic when playing a game, but once you get over the initial ooh im using a headset and chatting like an idiot, it gets easier . Having said that I can see why for PVP a lot of corps like it. The solution seems pretty simple, join a corp where people have the same play style you do. If the corp you are in likes to get to know each other and chat over voice and you dont like that, find a corp that doesnt want to make e-relationships or whatver.
Rilwar 22nd Black Rise Defensive Unit	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:02:00 - [56] Edited by: Rilwar on 30/12/2008 23:04:06 I've mostly browsed over the majority of this, but I want to make the point if it's not already been made, or stress it if it has. Also I don't endorse forced VOIP communication, but having co-led a rather large EQ2 PvP/Raid Guild, so my opinion here comes from the player's, and the leader's point of view. The chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. While you can achieve a near-equal level of communication efficiency typing vs. VOIP, there are a few counterpoints that must be addressed. Typing can possibly slow your input TO the gang. I acknowledge that you have stated you are willing to use VOIP when it's necessary, so this point is moot. Typing forces everyone else in your gang/fleet to be constantly monitoring a chat window. This chat window is most probably in their way on the screen, and I for one like to have as much strategical information on my screen as there can possibly be at once. Most importantly it forces them to divert attention away from what they may be doing currently when it starts to blink. They have to operate under the assumption that whatever you just typed is life or death, because they've no way to verify/deny this. This detracts from the overall efficiency of the gang. -EDIT- Also want to air my personal opinion. Forced Voice Comms for anything that is corp/gang/fleet: Yes. Forced Voice Comms for general bull***ting around and chat: No. If there are mitigating circumstances that don't allow a user to talk, that's fine and dandy. But either get your ass on vent to listen or you're not going on the raid, 83 Epic ^^^ mobs. ---O-H--S-H--T---
Manipulator General o.0	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:10:00 - [57] Originally by: Ha'Uler It's really weird that you don't want to get to know people you'll spend many hours with over the course of months or even years. EVE is a hobby like every other one, and unless you want to do it alone you're forced to meet and get to know new people. Why should people fly with you if you just want to be a recluse? For everyone I know, PVP is about the people they fly with, not who or what they actually kill. You're obviously an exception to that, but you need to realize that you don't fit into the usual corps then. Aye, cos you can't get to know people via text. k
Shakari Sween freelancers inc KenZoku	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:10:00 - [58] Mic is def needed for all in smallish gangs of around 4-15 or so. After that the more people with mics can actually be a detriment to the fleet. It just depends on what situation your in. For blob fests there should only be 5 or so people able to talk and bark out orders. Intel can be passed in diff ts channels or using the channel commander function in ts(is you only talk to x persons). Most fc's will have a convo window open with their scouts just in case something important is going on on ts at the same time that they are getting intel. Not to mention that there are times that ts/vent goes down unexpected. Basically the co-ordination of a big fleet requires less people with mics than a smaller gang. One person out of a 10 man gang, with no mic, will not effect the outcome as much as some people will try and push. Immaturity also does come into it. While eve is generally a reasonably mature game player base wise the addition of voice comes tends to take 10 years of most peoples maturity, which can effect quite a few peoples perception of those people as well as spoil their time playing it, this is also more prevalent in smaller gangs as there doesn't have to be as much control over voice comms as the bigger fleets require. Like the op I'm not a fan of using a mic, I'm not the best speaker out there(I'm a kiwi who speaks quicker than most can understand and sometimes stutter a little), Often I have to repeat myself which would be the equivalent of typing it out anyway(not to mention that ts lags more than text in eve). Basically the op has a valid point, but because of the general perception and misconceptions that are out there(like lcd is better than plasma, Evolution is a theory(its been proved) etc etc) it is viewed that the op is either lazy, has something to hide, or just plain anti social(playing an mmo) Humans tend to not accept other peoples opinions or views if they are not similar, religion is case and point. The people who want the op to get a mic DO have a valid point though, everyone getting along and knowing each other better can create bonds as well as getting to know how each other plays can help in tight pvp situations. It can mean you play to each other strengths as well as lessen each others weakness's. That being said it should not be forced on anyone, but there are advantages to it.
Crackuji Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:18:00 - [59] I hate mic requirement for corps also. I don't want to hear drunken people singing on vent either. This is not fun, it's totally CRINGEWORTHY. You're right, it's a game not an opportunity to make friends because you may have few in real life. The whole talking to randoms online thing puts me off Eve and I've never seen another MMO that seems to require it so much.
Jericho thePure Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:19:00 - [60] Meta gaming spy's exist in EVE. Other then that MMO is not just a game its a community so maybe that's why they want to get to know you. Like everyone has said it is a must for PVP and if your not using voice coms for PVP your doing it wrong. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig "All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..."
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:19:00 - [61] headsets are great for pvping. mics are less important, although when everyone else is talking I often miss stuff said in chat windows. that and the headset/mic is great for all the random stuff that happens when not fighting. chat works okay, but I prefer the mic.
Kazang Gallente Arbitrary Freedom	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:26:00 - [62] No one is forcing you to use a mic. Its your loss if you dont want to talk to people, i prefer using a mic because it easier than typing, takes less effort and its faster etc. Thats just from a social point of view, you don't have to be social if you dont want to be, but then begs the question why are you playing an mmo if you dont want to be social? If you dont like the social aspect of EVE, then X3 is a much better space sim. Ive made some really good friends on the internet from playing other games, and those are people i made an effort to get to know better and have subsequently gone on to meet in real life. If you don't want to talk to people and get to know them fine whatever, no sensible person is going to force you to talk to them. If you didn't want to talk to me, i would say fine, i wouldn't take it personally. But im not going to talk to you either if i can help it. The only other thing i will say is that not having a mic in a pvp fleet means your a liability, you cant relay info to the rest of your gang quick enough to be of any use. In small scale combat anyway you have to use voice comms if you expect to win, for massive fleets you don't need one but thats another thing all together. In any fleet i run everyone has to be on vent, if you don't say much then fine, but you have to be on listening at least, because an FC simply doesn't have time to type orders in chat, and then even more delay as people read chat right away. Dont expect people to want to fly with you though if you refuse to communicate. Just as in real life if you refuse to speak to people they arent going to want to talk to you either. Corps are social entities, dont want to be social? Dont join one! Dont expect people to want you in their corps when you're saying that you dont want to get to know the members. Why would you even want to join a corp if you didnt want to get to know the people in it? Kazang
Chesty McJubblies	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:32:00 - [63] Originally by: Jericho thePure Like everyone has said it is a must for PVP and if your not using voice coms for PVP your doing it wrong. That's everyone told.
Muser Gallente Blue.	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:33:00 - [64] join my TS and we can talk it through.
Alowishus the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:34:00 - [65] Originally by: Yuri VanKaer Edited by: Yuri VanKaer on 30/12/2008 21:53:23 Originally by: Alowishus Originally by: Yuri VanKaer OP: I agree with you 100%. For myself, I am a 100+ wpm typist, so I gain nothing by speaking over typing, as far as speed of communication. In other words: "I've never done group PvP," otherwise you'd know the speed with which you type means absolutely nothing when you're in a battle that's going to last 45-90 seconds and you are managing targets (friendly and hostile), drones and your modules. Anyone who says they're just as capable without a mic obviously doesn't have much experience. Or you have four hands. Stuff So I guess I was pretty correct, that your PvP experience is extremely limited. That's what I thought...
Jericho thePure Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:37:00 - [66] Originally by: Chesty McJubblies Originally by: Jericho thePure Like everyone has said it is a must for PVP and if your not using voice coms for PVP your doing it wrong. That's everyone told. Probably has something to do with it being the truth, hence why everyone is told. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig "All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..."
Glengrant TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:45:00 - [67] UMEE - You don't have to do anything. If you you dont like to use voice comm - then don't. But the same is true for any particular corp. If That corp requires voice then that is their choice and you can take it or leave it. And almost every gang/fleet will require voice for efficiency. That comes with pvp if you want to be successful. Corps can make any rules they want. Requiring voice is the same as requiring at least x million SP - or only pvpers, or only people from Pacific timezones. If you don't like the requirements you can leave the corp - no need to justify yourself. You can play solo, or chat with people in npc corp - or create your own corp and establish your own set of rules (voice comm optional or even forbidden). Appealing to the forum won't be getting you anywhere. You need to find a corp that don't expect its members to use voice and is not serious about pvp. --- Save the forum: Think before you post. ISK BUYER = LOSER EVE TV- Bring it back!
Neddy Fox Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation	Posted - 2008.12.30 23:53:00 - [68] I use voicecomms since 1999 (Roger Wilco), and have met people I consider friends now. You can't compare typing with actual talking with people. If you don't like it : NERD. Go play with yourself. Playing a female and logging on voicecomms talking to the guys is fun, esp. if they really expect a female (had that happen in a RPG game once). ---- [PXIN Recruiter] PXIN Recruitement thread
Cambarus The Baros Syndicate Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:01:00 - [69] Originally by: UMEE "You joined a corp and don't respect its "values", but there are thousands of other ones to join, or you could even create your own one." - i very much respect their values. i showed this by joining TS, and listening in during OPs. them pressuring me to get on mic on the basis of "getting to know me better" is what made me uncomfortable. simply because i was willing to compromise, while they were not. Here's the problem with your statement here: The corp does not need to compromise with you. Your values are not their problem. If they do not match their values, then you should probably find a new corp. The whole reason corps tend to focus on certain aspects of the game is that they want to bring in like-minded people. If you're not willing to conform to the corp rules, then you're probably not welcome in the corp, it's just like any group of people really. As for WHY people push for others to get on vent: It really is as simple as they want to get to know you. I've run a corp that's reformed several times over the last few years, and do you know who the people I've kept in touch with the whole time are? The ones who're always on vent. The guys who don't use vent get forgotten almost instantly. It may be lazy, but the fact of the matter is that no matter how easy typing a couple words may be, most communication is done on vent, and that doesn't just apply to pvp situations. People do most of their talking on vent, and if you're not talking with them then you're missing out on 90% of the conversations that happen.
Teaburner	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:02:00 - [70] I love how a bunch of people who can't make social connections in RL chastise someone for not wanting to do it in an online game. I'll give you a good reason to want to play an mmo bit not want to socialize. Video game AI for the most part sucks. Basically, to be challenging afer the first go-around, you need human opponents. Mmo's provide human opponents. To the OP, I would suggest the compromise of just using your mic for essential fleet op communication, and that's it. If your corp isn't cool with that, I'm sure you can find one that is. Good Luck
Napoleon Bismarck	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:05:00 - [71] GO back to WoW or play Hello Kitty. I would very much like to boot peeps from my corp for not using a mic and for PvP it is just plain idiotic to not use one. Listening in is silly. If you don't get why having voice comms in this game is important, contract all ur stuff to me in game and send me all your ISK then kindly feck off out of EVE.
Asoka Cyrus	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:05:00 - [72] Originally by: Teaburner I love how a bunch of people who can't make social connections in RL chastise someone for not wanting to do it in an online game. I'll give you a good reason to want to play an mmo bit not want to socialize. Video game AI for the most part sucks. Basically, to be challenging afer the first go-around, you need human opponents. Mmo's provide human opponents. To the OP, I would suggest the compromise of just using your mic for essential fleet op communication, and that's it. If your corp isn't cool with that, I'm sure you can find one that is. Good Luck I got plenty of RL mates. Maybe says more for you this statement than it does for us...
Asoka Cyrus	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:08:00 - [73] Originally by: Alowishus Originally by: Yuri VanKaer Edited by: Yuri VanKaer on 30/12/2008 21:53:23 Originally by: Alowishus Originally by: Yuri VanKaer OP: I agree with you 100%. For myself, I am a 100+ wpm typist, so I gain nothing by speaking over typing, as far as speed of communication. In other words: "I've never done group PvP," otherwise you'd know the speed with which you type means absolutely nothing when you're in a battle that's going to last 45-90 seconds and you are managing targets (friendly and hostile), drones and your modules. Anyone who says they're just as capable without a mic obviously doesn't have much experience. Or you have four hands. Stuff So I guess I was pretty correct, that your PvP experience is extremely limited. That's what I thought... Wow, just noticed your lack of PvP experience was being picked up on by a member of the untied. Thats harsh, these guys dont even PvP!
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:12:00 - [74] Originally by: Teaburner I love how a bunch of people who can't make social connections in RL chastise someone for not wanting to do it in an online game. I love how a nameless nobody makes assumptions about people he has never met. No sig for me, thankyouverymuch.
Mr QUE Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:15:00 - [75] just tell them your vocal cord was was injured in a car crash that the other guy had been drinking, Oh and let them know that the guy killed a little kid that was in his car at the time of the crash and was doing 100 mph, and that he came out without a scratch. true story it happens Que Woot
Teaburner	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:18:00 - [76] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Teaburner I love how a bunch of people who can't make social connections in RL chastise someone for not wanting to do it in an online game. I love how a nameless nobody makes assumptions about people he has never met. I actually have a name, and I most certainly am somebody! But seriously, the " OMG my best friends are peeps I met on Vent...", posts are pathetic. Go outside, smile at someone, shake someone's hand when you say Happy New Year. If your best friends are people you met through Vent on some mmo, you need to get a life.
David Miliband Evil Proctologists	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:21:00 - [77] The N4zis used typed communications, they didn't use VOIP; ergo you should use VOIP rather than typing. So, unless you want to be like Hitl3r, you should get a mic and use it.
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:21:00 - [78] Originally by: Teaburner But seriously, the " OMG my best friends are peeps I met on Vent...", posts are pathetic. Go outside, smile at someone, shake someone's hand when you say Happy New Year. If your best friends are people you met through Vent on some mmo, you need to get a life. I love how a nameless nobody makes assumptions about people he has never met. No sig for me, thankyouverymuch.
Franga Gristle Industries	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:25:00 - [79] Originally by: UMEE and in case i wasnt clear, this isnt an "im quitting" post...but notice how im asking specific philosophical questions, hoping for a discussion. No your not. Your complaining about something. If it's such a big deal, don't join a corp and complain about the normal 'this can so be a single player game' things. My corp is generally a 'get on comms if you're online' thing. I'm fine with that, but as one guy said - if it's going to have a negative effect on my family at that particular time I don't do it. I might post about it next time. Also, you want to PVP in any organised fashion with more than 4 people, comms = must. ----------
Haldeeman Minmatar Infusion.	Posted - 2008.12.31 00:38:00 - [80] tl;dr if you dont want to use a mic because you dont want to interact with people then it is called social ******ation I am afraid. If you do not want to use comms, fine. But i would suggest that you find a single player game such as X3 as it will only serve to annoy you and the people that you play with that you dont use comms, hence destroying the purpose of the game. to have fun.
myrddhyn	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:03:00 - [81] I just second what kazang says. No harm done man just go solo. Plenty of room for it in this game.
Hegbard	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:09:00 - [82] Originally by: UMEE im asking: why do i have to justify my values to play this game to its full extent? No, what you're asking is "why do I need to communicate with the people I play with on their terms when I want everyone to conform to the way I want to do things". You're welcome to organize groups that communicate your way. But you can't expect a group of people to conform to your "values" when you're joining as an outsider. You might as well try to make an argument that the people you play with should speak swahili because that's the language you like. It doesn't work that way. And since any group of people is mostly defined by their communication, you can't stay outside that either.
Captain Pompous	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:09:00 - [83] Originally by: Haldeeman tl;dr if you dont want to use a mic because you dont want to interact with people then it is called social ******ation I am afraid. If you do not want to use comms, fine. But i would suggest that you find a single player game such as X3 as it will only serve to annoy you and the people that you play with that you dont use comms, hence destroying the purpose of the game. to have fun. are you serious? the OP is complaining about being forced to talk to people, not necessarily not communicating full stop with them. next time, read the damn thread
Titan Pilot Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:11:00 - [84] I can understand why you dont want to speak. /Rant on But dont expect ppl to trust someone who doesnt want to speak. Billions of isk on the line and you are afraid to say something on comms? Ships and mods in this game take time to acquire. This isnt some random pickup game. Its pretty serious stuff. Try scouting a freighter with a pilot who refuses to talk on comms. First thing that comes to mind is what is this guy hiding and should we risk it with him... NOPE...kick him from gang as he is either a spy, afk or a noob who will get us all killed. /Rant off
Franga Gristle Industries	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:12:00 - [85] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Teaburner But seriously, the " OMG my best friends are peeps I met on Vent...", posts are pathetic. Go outside, smile at someone, shake someone's hand when you say Happy New Year. If your best friends are people you met through Vent on some mmo, you need to get a life. I love how a nameless nobody makes assumptions about people he has never met. Oh, burn. Waaaazzzuuuuuup! But srsly, pwnt. ----------
Scagga Laebetrovo Ammatar Free Corps	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:22:00 - [86] Originally by: Davlos Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. It was worth staying up till about 5:30am to read this gem. To the OP: Pulgor, is that you?
Mei Ree	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:31:00 - [87] What I have gathered from this thread so far: if I want to be a spy, I should get a mic so people will trust me more. What I also have gathered is that the forums are filled with people who think that having 20 people talking at once in Teamspeak is actually adding value to the team. Then there are the manginas who are afraid to speak and break the illusion that they are female. For me, lack of microphone use is simply due to being in a house with other humans who don't like getting only half the conversation - especially when the commentary gets particularly agitated.
Ephemeron Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:33:00 - [88] Originally by: Chesty McJubblies Originally by: Jericho thePure Like everyone has said it is a must for PVP and if your not using voice coms for PVP your doing it wrong. That's everyone told. I'm doing it wrong yet I'm pretty successful
ShardowRhino Caldari Legion 0f The Damned	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:50:00 - [89] hahaha, now if people want to know who the members are, thats their call since it is THEIR CORP. If you were willing to talk in text and just dont like talking over the mic, just like i hate talking over the phone, thats different. IF you want to set up a corp of hermit,mutes that don't know how to read, well then feel free. Its a whopping 2 mil to set up a corp?? NPC corps don't care who you are or if your an anti-social person in a type of game that is built on the premise of a multitude of HUMAN players running around in it. personally i dont like being around people i dont know and want to be shut ins. at a job its one thing but during off hours its just plain weird. go play on the test server.
ShardowRhino Caldari Legion 0f The Damned	Posted - 2008.12.31 01:53:00 - [90] Originally by: Teaburner I love how a bunch of people who can't make social connections in RL chastise someone for not wanting to do it in an online game. Whos to say that because you can not make social connections in RL but you play an MMO means everyone else in the mmo cannot make social connections in RL?
Rodanine Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:14:00 - [91] i log in to voice chat and rarely bother to speak whats the big deal with not talking i can type faster then most people talk and really helps when people try talking over each other on vent/TS/eve voice. and you don't really need to talk during a pvp op unless your the FC anyways they got broadcasts for needing help you know that funny little window that shows up aside from the fleet window when your in a gang. i figure most of you ignore it but its really handy from broadcasting targets and setting primary's plus it shows uup on everyones screen when you use it so you don't really need to be sorting an overview constantly. -- yes this is an alt get over it
Bloody Rabbit Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:15:00 - [92] Edited by: Bloody Rabbit on 31/12/2008 02:20:49 What I don't like about the mic is that forced to listen to the people most of the time I learn that I have joined a group of little boys playing VG in their mommy's basement. I don't mind using the mic but if forced to listen to the crying about homework or tests I get tired of the group very fast, also the childish cursing is just a joke. I don't mind the language its just the use of the language for no real gets to me. For the most part I will plug in the mic and listen to TS if I'm in a battle or in a joint op but if I'm not then I will be listening to the news or music. Edit* if I get a chance to work on my Spanish or chinese then I'm more than happy to talk on TS or vent./edit
An Anarchyyt Gallente Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:26:00 - [93] Originally by: Bloody Rabbit What I don't like about the mic is that forced to listen to the people most of the time I learn that I have joined a group of little boys playing VG in their mommy's basement. We all can't be as mature, cultured and wordly as yourself. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Danae Ori	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:26:00 - [94] Gotta agree with the OP here. Eve is a GAME, and to me immersion is necessary to enjoy it. Listening to some dude complaining about his RL job is a total immersion breaker. Worse are those people who come to you for "advice" or a shoulder to cry on because of RL problems. I suspect this will apply to a vast swathe of the MMORPG crowd, which makes me more hesitant in getting to "know" other players. Who wants to read a ****ing suicidal email or an emo blog that a corpmate sends you? Those people who heavily involve themselves in MMORPGs with a head-set, hardcore guild/corp and a "need" to know their corpmates intimately are sending up red flags as far as I'm concerned. Sure it's possible you can meet some cool people in a game, but unless they live within reasonable travelling distance then what's the point? I reserve RL activity for making friends where you can interact face-to-face. I've met up with people from the internet, and these meet-ups were great. But because of the vast distance involved and the infrequency of these meet-ups, I'd be hard-pressed to call these people "friends". And if you need voice comms to get to "know" your corpmates at an intimate level, there's something really weird going on and you're probably playing too much Eve to make friends or socialise outside the game. I'll use voice comms for PVP and, if I think you're really cool, for social chat. But I play Eve as a game. I want to be detached from RL as much as possible when Eve is on my screen.
Bloody Rabbit Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:27:00 - [95] Originally by: Teaburner But seriously, the " OMG my best friends are peeps I met on Vent...", posts are pathetic. Go outside, smile at someone, shake someone's hand when you say Happy New Year. If your best friends are people you met through Vent on some mmo, you need to get a life. This, unless your RL friends are also your gaming buddies than you need to have a few friends you can go out and do things with. I wouldn't be happy if I didn't have a few friends I could drag out and shoot up at the paintball grounds or drag to the gun range. I'm still working on getting someone to go skydiving with me. But most important is I couldn't do any of that with online friends because they are online.
Bloody Rabbit Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:29:00 - [96] Originally by: An Anarchyyt Originally by: Bloody Rabbit What I don't like about the mic is that forced to listen to the people most of the time I learn that I have joined a group of little boys playing VG in their mommy's basement. We all can't be as mature, cultured and wordly as yourself. I'm sure you know of the groups I'm talking about. The ones that get to use the bad words only when their parents aren't around and just use those words over and over and over and over again for no reason other to use the words. So please don't try and play me as some scholar.
Yuri VanKaer	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:42:00 - [97] Originally by: Mei Ree What I have gathered from this thread so far: if I want to be a spy, I should get a mic so people will trust me more. What I also have gathered is that the forums are filled with people who think that having 20 people talking at once in Teamspeak is actually adding value to the team. Then there are the manginas who are afraid to speak and break the illusion that they are female. For me, lack of microphone use is simply due to being in a house with other humans who don't like getting only half the conversation - especially when the commentary gets particularly agitated. I agree, it's pretty annoying to everyone else to only get half the convo, especially if they're not gamers. And the same goes for the all at once chatter channels. Here's my experiences with voice comms and why I choose not to use them. I keep hearing about these fleets/groups where nobody talks unless it's related to the battle, but I have yet to come across one. Not just talking about EVE here, it's been like this in every MMO I've played. They are usually composed of the following: 1. The jackass who thinks everyone should be subjected to their music choice. Especially those who think Ride of the Valkyries or the Imperial March has to be played at the start of every fight. 2. The wannabe comedian who thinks they're soooo funny, and subjects everyone to an endless string of pathetic jokes, ala Beavis and Butthead. 3. The emo who *****es and moans about getting killed, what they just lost, how much those h4xxx0r dudes are cheating, etc etc. whilst in the middle of a fight; rendering it impossible for everyone else to actually understand what the FC/GL is saying. 4. Ppl who are trying to play in a house full of other folks/children, adding so much background chatter that it's mind numbing. Especially when they are conversing with those other folks/disciplining their children. 5. Those that cannot construct a complete sentence without endless profanities, and feel a need to shout threats at the opposing team...who can't hear them. 6. Everyone else who has tuned out due to the above problems, rendering voice comms pointless. So...I prefer text and broadcasts, I find it more efficient and less distracting. And thankfully this game allows for that still. Those of you who enjoy it, great, good for you. I'm happy that you do. However the fact that I and others don't enjoy it, does not make us less capable players or social cripples.
Kessiaan Minmatar Army of One	Posted - 2008.12.31 02:59:00 - [98] I've never understood "I don't like voice chat" whines, here or elsewhere. If you don't like an FC's rules don't fly with them, don't join their corp, don't try to play with them. "These are the rules" is not a difficult concept - you either agree to them and stop whining, or you don't agree to them and don't sign up for whatever.
Morfane The IMorral MAjority	Posted - 2008.12.31 05:11:00 - [99] To answer the OP, its because its annoying for CEO's to have to pay attention to what is being typed in the chat channel for one guy.
Dulcinea Toboso	Posted - 2008.12.31 06:38:00 - [100] Originally by: UMEE why do i have to use a mic? after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" They wanted to know if you are a girl IRL.
MHayes	Posted - 2008.12.31 06:46:00 - [101] A PVP player that cannot communicate over voice comms is at a disadvantage. You might be able to hear but if you can't speak you are less able to share information. Why have a player that is like this when a ceo could have a real player? Obviously if someone is disabled then it is unfair, but you are not giving a reason other than you don't want to. Why not just say you don't want to play Eve, because Eve needs it if you want to be competitive. Good luck finding a good corp that doesn't use ut.
Mecinea Lua	Posted - 2008.12.31 07:17:00 - [102] There is no real need for voice comms. Indeed especially in larger battles eve voice and other voice comms oftentimes peter out. Using tools in game there is a way to broadcast targets and other things, without the use of voice. Anyone that thinks they're getting to know someone they've never met just by hearing their voice is fooling themselves. The only thing it would clearly indicate is if more than one person used an account since they would sound different. Not all corps require voice comms. Look around OP and I hope you find a new better corp.
Napoleon Bismarck	Posted - 2008.12.31 07:50:00 - [103] Originally by: Mecinea Lua There is no real need for voice comms. Indeed especially in larger battles eve voice and other voice comms oftentimes peter out. Using tools in game there is a way to broadcast targets and other things, without the use of voice. Anyone that thinks they're getting to know someone they've never met just by hearing their voice is fooling themselves. The only thing it would clearly indicate is if more than one person used an account since they would sound different. Not all corps require voice comms. Look around OP and I hope you find a new better corp. Never came across voice comms 'petering' out during a fleet fight. Broadcast tools are just as annoying as typing tbh. Methinks the only fleetfight you have been part of was a fleet of hulks against an army of roids.
Arvald Caldari MasterBlasters Inc. CORPVS DELICTI	Posted - 2008.12.31 07:53:00 - [104] any corp that forces you to use a voice com (or anythign else for that matter) isnt worth joining, play for fun not hwo others tell you to play i edit spelling for no one
JaseNZ	Posted - 2008.12.31 08:01:00 - [105] On my previous Windows install, my mic wouldn't work correctly, so I couldn't use audio. Did a reinstall and now it seems to work, audio is great! :D
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.31 08:02:00 - [106] Originally by: UMEE 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. To add a reason to use a mic as little as possible: my accent is pretty barbaric, I don't see why someone should try to understand me when I can type in chat. Sure for emergency communications a microphone is better, but I am not the Force Commander and don't wish to the one, I am not a sentinel checking the near gates, ecc. So a mic is not required in any way and using voice communications is generally less efficient that typing in chat, at least for conversations, if you aren't english native.
Davina Braben	Posted - 2008.12.31 08:41:00 - [107] Edited by: Davina Braben on 31/12/2008 08:42:29 I'm sure you will be able to find a corp that isn't mic required. I turn my mic off for fleet ops tbh to save accidentally transmitting. I'm not scouting, I'm not tackling, I'm not calling targets. There's exactly zero need for me to be pushing talk. But that said if you don't like the people you're flying with, why are you flying with them? I honestly have to wonder what the point is. To be fair 95% of the people you meet online probably won't end up being more than acquaintances but if you don't get along with your gang-mates well enough to chat to them why are you spending time with them? If the internet spaceships really matter to you, consider that quick communication, rapport and esprit de corps are force multipliers.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.12.31 08:44:00 - [108] Don't fret, just be happy that people are telling you to get a mic instead of "get off the vent Jones!!" My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.12.31 08:53:00 - [109] Edited by: Zeba on 31/12/2008 08:53:42 To the op. Learn to speak with an Irish accent and they will shortly mute you and leave you alone. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Mikal Drey Minmatar Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:04:00 - [110] hey hey We regularly use Vent or TS and I do NOT have a mic. i have many reasons why i dont have one or use one only 1 FC has ever gone crazy about it and i got booted of TS for having my Mic muted :/ some of our spanish pilots never speak on comms and its never been an issue. not having a mic is specific to your corp/alliance so your issues is with them. some corps and alliances have theses rules in place for specific reasons (spies etc) if your having issues from a social perspective and feel your corp mates are asshats who like to drink alot then maybe your in the wrong corp.
Davlos Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:30:00 - [111] Eh, I'm a radioman (yes, the poor sod who always gets to die first in those war movies) outside of this game with six months remaining with the Singaporean army, and I have to memorize bloody codewords for various things like vehicles, platoon, different weapons, helicopters, rivers, hills, etc. If the Battalion Signals Officer is feeling paranoid, he'd rotate codewords for those things every day, and I get my arse chewed out if my messages don't sound coherent or clear when I try to pluck such things out of memory. But the job scope is clear: In modern combat, information is king. Ventrilo/TS, using the voice communications medium is the fastest and clearest form of information transfer provided the users have the discipline to shut up when someone is talking, and are able to transfer information coherently. Anyone who argues against voice communications in PvP are either those who most likely spend their days flipping cans on newbies or have never succeeded much at all at PvP. On the social side, I spent a good amount of time with a bunch of friends in a corp for over a year, and it culminated into myself flying to the UK and spent the most awesome fortnight of my life yet just hanging out with them. Voicecomms is nothing to protest against as long as you find the right people to hang with. --- Originally by: Revan Neferis Scientific category of gravitation fields and velocity is force....
Roymundo Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:48:00 - [112] a certain 0.0 alliance i was in had mic as mandatory. yet, whenever i tried to use it the response was always "STFU NOOB" why would i feel compelled to go and spend my hard earned cash on a mic if i new beforehand that this would be the case?
P'uck	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:49:00 - [113] Edited by: P''uck on 31/12/2008 09:49:30 A lot of fleets would be MORE successful if ONLY the FC had a mic
shamai	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:55:00 - [114] Originally by: UMEE why do i have to use a mic? why cant i just listen in? this has been my issue since the beginning of EVE. after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" the convo went on for about 15 minutes, and it was all him trying to convince me. I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. i did anyway, but it didnt end so well. i renew my account, try to get into another corp, and same BS. my first question is this: why cant i play WITH, and not play with in order to BE? my thing is...i dont want to get to know you. i dont particularly like speaking to people whose faces i dont know over the phone. this is why im not a telemarketer. i certainly dont want to have to sell myself by allowing others to "get to know me" in order to enjoy this game in its full entirety. for me, this isnt a conduit through which i will form meaningful and/or lasting connections. i want to play. my second question: what if i was a mute, or deaf? the people that i speak to like to say that im shy...but this isnt the case; i work in a very social profession. in addition, i went through all the normal developmental processes, and have what you may consider a normal life for a young adult. but what if I couldnt hear or speak? sometimes I wish people assumed this about me, for the purposes of playing this game. the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. While I do acknowledge what your trying to say about the annoyances I would point out that I have met some very good real life friends in other countrys via the miracle of teamspeak/vent. We see each other about once a year and go out on a drunken rampage over a weekend, its a blast Sure, 98% of the people you speak to you will probably not like, not care about and the like, but I doubt you will find any other mechanism that allows you to make foreign friends as easily as this. Also, you might pick up a new language ;)
Yuri VanKaer	Posted - 2008.12.31 09:56:00 - [115] Originally by: P'uck Edited by: P''uck on 31/12/2008 09:49:30 A lot of fleets would be MORE successful if ONLY the FC had a mic Couldn't agree more.
Bumbum George	Posted - 2008.12.31 10:01:00 - [116] Originally by: Roymundo why would i feel compelled to go and spend my hard earned cash on a mic if i new beforehand that this would be the case? So you're telling me there are people on the intertubes playing online multiplayer games who don't own a mic?? STFU NOOB, I don't believe you!
The AEther	Posted - 2008.12.31 10:24:00 - [117] Communication is pretty important in pvp and like other posters have stated if it is going one way your gang is put at a somewhat of a disadvantage. It is difficult for FC to have all his attention turned to what is being said over Vent/TS and at the same time absorb information that is being typed. However, you should not be forced to use Vent/TS to socialize with people in EVE when you do not want to do it. And I agree there are several problems with voice comms - static, accents, people with very loud mics and mics that you can barely hear, and yes, perhaps you don't want to hear four letter words every 20 seconds or you just want to listen to some music while playing EVE. However you can strike a reasonable compromise - let your CEO know that you will be on voice comms when it is important, for pvp for example, but that you are not interested in hanging around for general chat. If he has problems with the later I would say switch corps because there is really no logical reason for him to demand that of you.
PsychoBones Project Nemesis	Posted - 2008.12.31 10:24:00 - [118] Originally by: Tu Pham Because, to many of the social misfits who play this game, EVE is their main venue for forming personal relationships. It's the same in most MMOs, though EVE seems to attract a particularly low quality of player. Just looks around in this forum for five minutes... **** you.
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.31 10:36:00 - [119] Use of voice in PvP: 85% FC 10% Scouts 5% others If you're not an FC or a scout, you can get by without a mic fine. As said before, FCs often yell at fleet members that talk during PvP ops. Voice in PvP is not a social tool, its a tactical tool. Saying voice is required for social bonds is liking saying people couldn't form social bonds in MMO's when voice was not commonplace. As for voice, I don't mind talking, but I tend to play casually, and do other things in between. With chat its simple to catch up on things if you're not at the computer all the time. With voice, I find it plain rude to keep dropping in and out of conversations, or appearing to ignore questions just because you are doing the laundry. Additionally, I simply dislike wearing a headset all the time. There is a reason people nowadays still use chat clients, text messages and the like even though they have easy and free access to voice communications. Think about it. ____ The Illusion of Freedom \| The Truth about Slavery
T'rek	Posted - 2008.12.31 11:57:00 - [120] <generic adapt or die>We probably didn't want to hear your voice anyways and I'm glad I'm not in your corp.</generic adapt or die>
Eve Spair Caldari Black Mesa	Posted - 2008.12.31 12:49:00 - [121] I've read about half the topic and i have to say that most of you either haven't read the OP or totally misunderstood him. what hes saying is that corps are forcing players to use a mic because its more convenient. and that has been pointed out many times. but by using a mic, the op will get much less enjoyment out of the game. so by enforcing a mic you are making the game much less fun and appealing to him. apparently, he has compromised and used a mic to appease the corp but the corp will not compromise so that he can get more fun out of the game.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.12.31 12:51:00 - [122] Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 31/12/2008 12:51:27 Now that i think of it, CCP should fork up some PR goodies and add a "EVE-mic" to the upcoming (re-)boxed EVE It could even be one of those caldari "coming up from "somewhere" mic"s. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
NeoTheo Dark Materials	Posted - 2008.12.31 12:52:00 - [123] listening is mandatory on op's in DAMT. it is not needed to have a mic, its nice, people i find get a better bond with someone once they know there voice; but not needed. if your EU and want a corp that wont give you any ****, look us up. - DAMT - If you dont know, well, you dont know!
Poast Warrior Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.12.31 12:59:00 - [124] Edited by: Poast Warrior on 31/12/2008 13:00:39 Edited by: Poast Warrior on 31/12/2008 13:00:18 Comms are a must. That being said, TS is garbage. I wish the larger alliances would use vent instead, TS makes joint ops painful edit: I are good spellar
Evangeline Vice	Posted - 2008.12.31 13:26:00 - [125] I personaly dont wanna use a mic,yes i was kicked from gang/fellowships for not starting up my comm but hey i found lots of other fun and eventually meet guys/gals like me. We dont need to communicate via voice as the commands we write are short and are very understandable and we are well played together so we can ADAPT to the situations that arises. For those that play the game as a duty is a comm very important same as the best ship,best gear,best stats,biggest POS ... For people that enjoy the game not so much.
Jon Malkovich	Posted - 2008.12.31 13:27:00 - [126] Originally by: Alowishus Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the ****ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned. your officially my god lol......
Par'Gellen Gallente Tres Hombres Sev3rance	Posted - 2008.12.31 13:30:00 - [127] 100% agree with the OP. I don't like using voice chat mainly because it goes like this: silence everyone bursts out talking at once and nobody hears anybody silence everyone bursts out talking at once and nobody hears anybody silence everyone bursts out talking at once and nobody hears anybody silence everyone bursts out talking at once and nobody hears anybody silence everyone bursts out talking at once and nobody hears anybody At least with typed chat you can scroll up if need be. ---
baltec1 R.U.S.T. Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.31 13:38:00 - [128] voice comms are more efficient than typing it all out. Its also nice to actualy talk to pleople.
Rhatar Khurin Minmatar Free Ammatar Aid Organisation	Posted - 2008.12.31 13:50:00 - [129] I prefer not to use any form of speech programs in any game. Mainly because i always have music playing at the same time. Although at a push i will use it rarely. but i don't chat on it, just relay important info (if there is any). People who clog up TS with needless banter get on my nerves.
Deus Letus Chooch Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.31 14:08:00 - [130] Leave the corp and find a new one
Cygnus Scott Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.31 15:00:00 - [131] What about people who cannot use TS/Vent due to their connection but can play most aspects of EVE just fine (aside from major engagements)? There are a lot of people still using dial up due to a lack of broadband availability. Satellite blows for gaming AND anything real-time like VoIP, and the Air Cards have a crappy 5GB cap that sucks if its your main connection. The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
Bart Starr	Posted - 2008.12.31 18:50:00 - [132] There is no big philosophical disussion to be had." - there is always a philosophical discussion to be had "Most serious corps in the game require you to have team speak or vent or some sort of voice comms because when you're engaged in combat, everyone needs to be able to give info to the FC immediately; they dont have time for you to type it out and them to read it." - I've been in many "serious" corps, as this is merely my alt. typing intel has been an accepted means. perhaps we're all gettin a little too lazy to read nowadays. overall, there is this prevalent enforcement of mic usage for individuals' own convenience, without any regard for the convenience of the person on the other side of this exchange. listening in, and/or typing intel have been acceptable in the past. if they are not now, then why not? "If you're not willing to accept that, then join a corp that does not require it." - this is becoming extremely difficult, hence my post. "This is not solely eve online;" - right, but we're not talking about other games. just because it is the norm, it doesnt mean that you can ignore people's individual experiences, i.e. being unable to get on mic for whatever reason - this reason does not need to be justified because this is a game. "most raiding guilds in WoW require it" - absolutely not true. been playing WoW for a long time now. "That's just the way it is and that's your answer. There's nothing more to it." - what is the way it is? and if that which you speak of is the way it is, then why is that the
Turin Caldari Eternity INC.	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:05:00 - [133] Originally by: UMEE why do i have to use a mic? why cant i just listen in? this has been my issue since the beginning of EVE. after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" the convo went on for about 15 minutes, and it was all him trying to convince me. I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. i did anyway, but it didnt end so well. i renew my account, try to get into another corp, and same BS. my first question is this: why cant i play WITH, and not play with in order to BE? my thing is...i dont want to get to know you. i dont particularly like speaking to people whose faces i dont know over the phone. this is why im not a telemarketer. i certainly dont want to have to sell myself by allowing others to "get to know me" in order to enjoy this game in its full entirety. for me, this isnt a conduit through which i will form meaningful and/or lasting connections. i want to play. my second question: what if i was a mute, or deaf? the people that i speak to like to say that im shy...but this isnt the case; i work in a very social profession. in addition, i went through all the normal developmental processes, and have what you may consider a normal life for a young adult. but what if I couldnt hear or speak? sometimes I wish people assumed this about me, for the purposes of playing this game. the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. I understand what you are saying. I am not one who just tends to hang out on Vent/TS just to hang out for no reason. But in some situations, its simply a must. As a PVPer, you will not be able to get around it in group PVP. Choices need to be made much faster than can be typed out. YOUR input will possibly be needed in those choices. Maybe you are the scout? Who knows. The point is, that there will be times you simply cannot avoid it if you want to take part in certain aspects of the game. Im sure your future corp will be happy to know you already think most of them are loosers.
Turin Caldari Eternity INC.	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:06:00 - [134] Originally by: Cygnus Scott What about people who cannot use TS/Vent due to their connection but can play most aspects of EVE just fine (aside from major engagements)? There are a lot of people still using dial up due to a lack of broadband availability. Satellite blows for gaming AND anything real-time like VoIP, and the Air Cards have a crappy 5GB cap that sucks if its your main connection. Then those people suck and should move. Or stick to single player games, or stay out of PVP. Anyone on dialup should avoid PVP imo. the deck is already stacked against them due to latency.
kunesa	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:46:00 - [135] Originally by: UMEE I RP a gurl online and when my corp made me get on TS they made fun of my manly voice and kicked me quote] fixd
Ollie Xavier	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:47:00 - [136] Originally by: Turin Originally by: Cygnus Scott What about people who cannot use TS/Vent due to their connection but can play most aspects of EVE just fine (aside from major engagements)? There are a lot of people still using dial up due to a lack of broadband availability. Satellite blows for gaming AND anything real-time like VoIP, and the Air Cards have a crappy 5GB cap that sucks if its your main connection. Then those people suck and should move. Or stick to single player games, or stay out of PVP. Anyone on dialup should avoid PVP imo. the deck is already stacked against them due to latency. Totally agree, if you don't want to be socialble then don't join a gaming community. Plus I have almost always found that those who don't want to use voice in my corp are usually non- English speaking people or the ones who don't take part in the corp yet happily accept all the said corp has to offer. Seriously if you are unwilling to use voice comms then thats fair enough but don't expect to engage in the social aspect i.e. joining corps, fleets etc etc... This is a game that you can only progress in seriously if you join up with others. The OP seems to just want to get on with it and be left alone but joined a corp cos it was the thing to do. Well the OP can quick smartly f*ck off in my book because there are already games for people like him and they aren't MMO's
Scarlet Pimpdaddy	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:53:00 - [137] Originally by: UMEE most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. Hahahaha! EMO ALERT! EMO ALERT! Your values include not wanting to: see, touch, be with, talk to, interact with. This is amazingly sad. Get over it, you nub, or you can expect to loive a life with no nookie and that and EVE are why I keep breathing each day!
Crackzilla The Shadow Order New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:56:00 - [138] Voice is a requirement in group pvp. With lag/disconnects typing doesn't always work. Then you've the issue with folks chatting and pushing orders off the screen. Someone talks on an alt that shouldn't and they can be kicked from voice. Besides, how else can we do a logon/logoffski without voice? Voice is a requirement in many corps. Some of this is trust. Hard to disguise a voice. Many don't trust someone else unless they can hear a voice. This prevents someone with a dozen alts all vouching for each other. If someone rips you off you'll remember their voice for a very long time. Voice is the only thing in game that cannot be changed and stays with someone. Voice is a requirement of being logged on. If you need help and you cannot talk then expect no immediate help. Too many have lost too many ships when someone screams in chat for help and gets everyone else killed. No voice then expect no help at all.
bluebeyond DEATHFUNK Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:58:00 - [139] Originally by: UMEE why do i have to use a mic? why cant i just listen in? this has been my issue since the beginning of EVE. after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" the convo went on for about 15 minutes, and it was all him trying to convince me. I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. i did anyway, but it didnt end so well. i renew my account, try to get into another corp, and same BS. my first question is this: why cant i play WITH, and not play with in order to BE? my thing is...i dont want to get to know you. i dont particularly like speaking to people whose faces i dont know over the phone. this is why im not a telemarketer. i certainly dont want to have to sell myself by allowing others to "get to know me" in order to enjoy this game in its full entirety. for me, this isnt a conduit through which i will form meaningful and/or lasting connections. i want to play. my second question: what if i was a mute, or deaf? the people that i speak to like to say that im shy...but this isnt the case; i work in a very social profession. in addition, i went through all the normal developmental processes, and have what you may consider a normal life for a young adult. but what if I couldnt hear or speak? sometimes I wish people assumed this about me, for the purposes of playing this game. the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. You are fucking weird. What's wrong with talking to people? You scared ro something?
Evarum Kador Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:59:00 - [140] Originally by: UMEE Originally by: Davlos These are called "philosophical questions"? I appreciate my Nietzsche as much as the next guy, but this isn't infringing upon "your values", mate. This is yourself having a gyroscope-like self-centeredness. If you really want to talk about this "philosophically", UMEE, you might want to read on more philosophers before spouting more verbal diarrhoea. Any philosopher worth his salt that any person attempting to enter a new enclave or community has to align him- or herself to its rules within it. Christianity/Juadism demands this of its followers, to abide by the law of the land. Titus 3:1 ==> "Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good," Buddhism also says this. I don't have the exact quote from the sutras on hand but it mentions the wise man to abide by the laws of any strange land he settles down in. There're a myriad reasons why almost any other activity online these days has their communities that have the increasing usage of VOIP communication. It's not confined to games. Skype has been becoming a very popular free VOIP phone service for business. And there's nothing wrong with forming bonds with "people you don't intend to meet". Playing MMOs is all about social interaction and forming of said bonds. If you don't wish to have that, the MMO genre isn't for you if you wish to reap the most enjoyment out of it. you should really read my initial post. and i think you have your philosophy and religion mixed up. philosophy is usually highly critical of mass-effect, whereas religion is a way of using it. in addition, i didnt ground my debate in metaphysics, so Nietzsche has little to do with it all. and finally, Nietzsche's existentialism was an essential stepping stone for today's philosophy, but the guy basically went insane because his thinking could not address the question of being. At no point in time has ANYTHING you've said even BORDERED a discussion of philosophy! Furthermore, neither has your values been discussed at this point. Definately the lol of the day.
Stuart Price Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2008.12.31 20:59:00 - [141] Some of my best moments in Eve have happened on/because of Vent/TS. Such as a former CEO rickrolling the entire bloody channel during a corp meeting. Or the chorus of, "OMG OMG", after I casually announced that I'd ransomed a Dread with an Eagle. To be honest, the 'need' for a mic depends what you do in game and how seriously you and the rest of your corp take it. If you're an industrial corp then you shouldn't NEED a mic. If you're a mission-running corp then you shouldn't NEED a mic. If you're in a corp that does massive fleet ops and you don't care about being FC, a scout or whatever other position of responsibility then you shouldn't NEED a mic. If however, you pvp in smaller groups AT ALL, then NOT having a mic and therefore the ability to speak with a single keypress puts your gang at a disadvantage compared to a gang with complete and well managed comms. It CAN be done without but not as quickly or without distracting as much attention as typing. If the rest of your corp is concerned with actually being able to win, then requiring it's members to have a mic is unfotunately, not really optional. In addition, it's far easier to shout, "HELP! Come save me, I'm being ganked in the top belt by some cruisers!" over vent than it is to type all of that in the correct channel, hoping that everyone has that channel open and reads it in time. In my experience, the typed request for help is followed literally a few seconds later by, "Doesn't matter, I'm dead now. And got podded while typing :(". As for those who can't use a mic for whatever medical reason, then that's unfortunate. This is why these conditions are known as disabilities, handicaps or whatever other politically correct term we're on this year: something that is disadvantageous in some way. Since playing this game with other people is a real world element (other people being real, unless AI is scarily advanced these days) I'll give a real world analogy: Would the marines let someone fly helicopters for them, no matter how clever, dedicated and willing to sacrifice his life, future and the rest, if he only had one leg? It might not be fair, but no-one ever said life would be fair. Putting the 'irate' into 'Pirate'
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:30:00 - [142] Originally by: Glengrant UMEE - You don't have to do anything. If you you dont like to use voice comm - then don't. But the same is true for any particular corp. If That corp requires voice then that is their choice and you can take it or leave it. And almost every gang/fleet will require voice for efficiency. That comes with pvp if you want to be successful. Corps can make any rules they want. Requiring voice is the same as requiring at least x million SP - or only pvpers, or only people from Pacific timezones. If you don't like the requirements you can leave the corp - no need to justify yourself. You can play solo, or chat with people in npc corp - or create your own corp and establish your own set of rules (voice comm optional or even forbidden). Appealing to the forum won't be getting you anywhere. You need to find a corp that don't expect its members to use voice and is not serious about pvp. thanks for your input. not really trying to appeal to the forum, just stating an opinion hoping for some discussion. thats what the forums are for generally. there certainly isnt a consensus on this, as ive been in corps that were anal about mics, and those that werent. ive been gone from the game for a while, and what prompted me to make this post was the prevalence of the mic requirement, and general frowning on refusal of mic usage. in addition, a corp can be serious about pvp and be willing to have some of its members listen in on TS. i dont know why people are assuming that id like to play the scout role.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:31:00 - [143] Originally by: Eve Spair I've read about half the topic and i have to say that most of you either haven't read the OP or totally misunderstood him. what hes saying is that corps are forcing players to use a mic because its more convenient. and that has been pointed out many times. but by using a mic, the op will get much less enjoyment out of the game. so by enforcing a mic you are making the game much less fun and appealing to him. apparently, he has compromised and used a mic to appease the corp but the corp will not compromise so that he can get more fun out of the game. yes, thank you.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:32:00 - [144] "At no point in time has ANYTHING you've said even BORDERED a discussion of philosophy! Furthermore, neither has your values been discussed at this point. Definately the lol of the day." the questioning/discussion of values, and "why" questions IS philosophy. my values are clearly stated, as are the values of many other community members. but lets get back to the topic =)
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:35:00 - [145] Originally by: Jon Malkovich Originally by: Alowishus Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the ****ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned. your officially my god lol...... yeah, i guess we are lepers in the sense that we stand out by not wanting to isolate ourselves from society, IRL. thanks for your opinion.
Dr Cron Northern Lights Number 5	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:36:00 - [146] I know you dont want to hear this but voice comms are mandatory. period.
Minny Sky	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:40:00 - [147] Edited by: Minny Sky on 02/01/2009 02:42:03 You need a mike if you are going to PvP. Stop being a puss Go play some @#$ @#$ single player game otherwise jeez these anti-social people on the internetz ... Did I just get trolled????
Smilla Snow	Posted - 2009.01.02 02:42:00 - [148] If your not in 0.0 and doing some fleet ops, then there is no real reason for voice comunication. And i agree with you, most of the time its hard to understand the pilots when they have to talk in a foreign language. In our Corp its free if you want to use voice or the chat window - both works greate for team ops like mining or lvl 5 missions.
Leneerra Minmatar Kid's	Posted - 2009.01.02 03:17:00 - [149] Personally I dislike voice communications in an RPG like EVE and I love the way eve tries to help us avoid it as much as possible. I hope many more improvements to the client will leed to a reduced need for voice-comms, however I must admit that on certain occations a mike is fairly usefull if not simply mandatory in my opinion: - leading a fleet on a pvp ops - scouting for a fleet pvp ops - and especially as scout: notefying your FC that your eve client crashed for the remainder being able to listen is enough. The (mandatory) use of voice-comms should best be listed as fact as part of their corporation information. Also corps that use voice-comms, especially if used as corp chat, should probebly conduct their final interview using voice as well (avoiding the unpleasantries afterwards as somehow the new member just cannot seem to get it working because of 'whatever lame excuse they come up with').
Trebor Locke Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate	Posted - 2009.01.02 04:36:00 - [150] Edited by: Trebor Locke on 02/01/2009 04:39:26 Double post -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate Your friendly economic management and trade orginization.
Trebor Locke Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate	Posted - 2009.01.02 04:38:00 - [151] Edited by: Trebor Locke on 02/01/2009 04:38:52 Edited by: Trebor Locke on 02/01/2009 04:37:50 Originally by: Davlos Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. Really now? Nice to meet you fellow Aspie (are you on the wrongplanet forum by any chance?) ^_^ I think you're quite right that this person doesn't have a decent reason to reject social bonding in this game. As someone with Asperger's Syndrome, I'm somewhat odd. Made my own corp and helped make an alliance >.> So anyone saying they wish to ignore an important part of any MMO (the social bonding part) because they simply don't want to really just doesn't cut it at all. -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate Your friendly economic management and trade orginization.
Roymundo Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2009.01.02 06:18:00 - [152] Originally by: Bumbum George Originally by: Roymundo why would i feel compelled to go and spend my hard earned cash on a mic if i new beforehand that this would be the case? So you're telling me there are people on the intertubes playing online multiplayer games who don't own a mic?? STFU NOOB, I don't believe you! sny particular reason you need to be nasty? or does acting like a ** make you happy in your nappy? the point i was making is that if i buy a mic to participate in the ops only to be told to ** off then i'd be right to think that it was a waste, and thus i concurr with the op.
CHAOS100 Black Plague. Kraftwerk.	Posted - 2009.01.02 07:11:00 - [153] You are playing an "MMO"RPG. Those first three letters stand for massively multiplayer online, which means you are playing with other people. Voice chat is standard nowadays and comes with the culture of playing online games. I understand maybe you have a real life and don't want to come on and talk to people for some reason or another, and that's fine. Except you are playing a space MMO based on flying spaceships around with each other, so you are associating yourself with the culture. If you don't want to have interaction then go play single player games, or go play more relaxed casual online games. Eve isn't meant to be that kind of game. --------------
Shakari Sween freelancers inc KenZoku	Posted - 2009.01.02 07:55:00 - [154] Ever watched a movie with subtitles on(same language as audio and subtitles)? Basically You can read and understand the text quicker than it is said out loud, as you have to wait for the full thing to be said 1st. The problem is that typing out something take a bit longer. Here is the common misconception, it takes a paragraph to say "belt xx4-12 help" If your in a fleet you can also use the broadcast system which is MUCH quicker than both voice and text, as no typing is needed, just a click. As well as not having to wait for the information to be finished before you can make a decision, not to mention the lag that can happen in both ts and vent(from slow internet, internet connections as well as distance from server). For the broadcast feature to be any use everyone in the fleet/gang needs to have it viewable and not minimized(which alot of people do). There is also a few limitations in that it cant tell you to much info, but it is quicker for alerting people to situations, but still lacks the ability to broadcast ship types and numbers(though you can broadcast multiple times per aggressor). It is interesting the responses that the op has had, in regards to quite a few think that voice coms is the ends all to every solution and scenario. While eve does draw a more mature player base it doesn't mean that the player base suffers from the same prejudices and ignorance that every culture/base of people. Broadcast system is the most efficient and generally best tool to use for both small and big fleets, text CAN be quicker, but is limited if used quickly. Voice while being very close and in a lot of ways equal to broadcast system still suffers from disadvantages.
Vagel	Posted - 2009.01.02 11:22:00 - [155] Edited by: Vagel on 02/01/2009 11:22:01 I agree with the OP. The day I wear a headset, is the day I'm not married anymore, end of story. The people that cannot see why, play too much EVE and have too little RL.
Rivur'Tam the united	Posted - 2009.01.02 11:33:00 - [156] Originally by: Alowishus Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the ****ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned. ^^this I really enjoy the banter with my corp m8's, you wouldn't go to work and ignore your co- workers and go to the pub and ignore your friends. If you are deaf mute etc then you have an excuse. .. ...
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.02 11:37:00 - [157] Originally by: Rivur'Tam you wouldn't go to work and ignore your co- workers and go to the pub and ignore your friends. Most days i don't say two words to my co-workers. Your point? If you want to talk, talk. But don't make it seem like mandatory to say lol over the interwebs over and over at random farts or "pwn" screams. I'll listen to a vent, i'll even participate, but in NO way can anyone say it should be mandatory 'cause we ALL pay to play as we play. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
OffBeaT Caldari KaMiKaZes	Posted - 2009.01.02 12:01:00 - [158] Edited by: OffBeaT on 02/01/2009 12:03:48 Edited by: OffBeaT on 02/01/2009 12:02:23 this is too cute, if you don't wont to use a mic so don't.. i am a loner in eve most times but now i have started to try and work with others so i finely went and started up my corp. so if you can live with my spelling that is you can join my corp and you don't gotta use a mic..
Ze4K DK Gallente Nova-Tek	Posted - 2009.01.02 12:20:00 - [159] Originally by: Vagel Edited by: Vagel on 02/01/2009 11:22:01 I agree with the OP. The day I wear a headset, is the day I'm not married anymore, end of story. The people that cannot see why, play too much EVE and have too little RL. If you're that worried about how you look then something is wrong... You sleep next to the woman FFS... and i don't know about you but i look pretty damn ****ed when i sleep... but then again i always look **ed... lol... Honestly though, i have a real life but i like playing video games... I don't play video games to look cool and frankly i don't give a fk if i look like sh!t when i play... And it's not like i can't take the headset off again when i leave the comp... If you're afraid that people will see you as a geek, i believe that the spaceships on your screen made it pretty obvious man...
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.02 12:22:00 - [160] But the thing is...people use a mic to look cool, to the internets "Yeah i use a mic 'cause of such'n'such!" "you can't pwn without a mic!" "Mic is a norm!" Hell, next people will say owning EVE-fan merchandise is a "norm" in gaming My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
OffBeaT Caldari KaMiKaZes	Posted - 2009.01.02 12:36:00 - [161] some people are just shy in life so let her be who she is.. so what of it!
baltec1 R.U.S.T. Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.02 12:42:00 - [162] Originally by: Vagel Edited by: Vagel on 02/01/2009 11:22:01 I agree with the OP. The day I wear a headset, is the day I'm not married anymore, end of story. The people that cannot see why, play too much EVE and have too little RL. I spend 8 to 12 hours a day at work and see 2 or 3 people, normaly the conversation amounts to good night or good morning. If I get day shift then Ill get to talk with one of the managers about security reports and thats it. For me having a mic is a good thing when playing a game, I get enough silance at work.
Navtiqes Noob Mercs	Posted - 2009.01.02 13:31:00 - [163] Edited by: Navtiqes on 02/01/2009 13:33:00 I've played online for eleven years now and never used a mic part from a few sessions with local friends. You just need to go to extra effort to find people that are able to multitask well enough to both read and type while they play. And as soon as some WoW kid comes along and demands voice comms in your guild you have to set your foot down.
Benco97 Gallente Friendly Archaeology Group of Inder	Posted - 2009.01.02 13:46:00 - [164] My problem with Voice comms is that most people seem find it the absolute pinnacle of humour when someone shouts ..ugh.. "LOL" or "PWNED YOU NUB!" or anything to that effect. I do not give a flying fig what you are wearing, what you did last night, about your latest conquests or whether or not the gas you just released had a particularly flavourful bouquet. I care about EVE related talk, items of conversation pertaining to our current events. I would meet you on some Social Networking website if I wanted to discuss your latest bout of wind as opposed to logging into EVE to talk about it. Voice Comms should be encouraged but not enforced unless you keep strict control of the channel, there will always be loud and obnoxious people ready to sing into their headsets and there will always be people put-off by that. Everyone can get along if someone just tells the idiots to shut up. If you want a personal conversation then enter a private convo with whoever you wish to talk to, do not clog up the Voice Comms. Originally by: P'uck You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
Korizan	Posted - 2009.01.02 14:00:00 - [165] Edited by: Korizan on 02/01/2009 14:02:05 Mic's are basically a PvP requirement. And it is definitely nothing new. I was required to use a mic back when Mech warrior was around. There is also nothing stopping you from picking a vent channel that nobody is on and hanging out there. If you are needed they can come in and tell you. Also PvP ops tend to be business only and no time for playing social. And the odds of you saying more then 2 words in a pvp ops fairly low as for the most part you are required to listen and obey. However I do understand why you wouldn't want to be on comms all the time. I have had my share of listening to "drunken/dumb asshats" in comms. BUT The flat out I am not going to be on comms or I quit is a bit extreme. This game is a MMORG and if you join a corporation then you are going to have to be social. If you have 0 wish to know anybody then I suggest you bin the whole join a corporation idea all together. So you do have a choice. Play by the corporation rules or leave the corporation. or find one that doesn't require vent. It is not a matter of the corporation not respecting your wishes. The corporation has rules and if you don't follow them then you get kicked.
Mundo Cani	Posted - 2009.01.03 02:55:00 - [166] Originally by: Alowishus Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the **ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned. Originally by:** Alowishus This is the Internet. Sack up. Originally by: Napoleon Bismarck GO back to WoW or play Hello Kitty...kindly feck off out of EVE. Originally by: Bumbum George STFU NOOB, I don't believe you! Originally by: bluebeyond You are fucking weird. What's wrong with talking to people? You scared ro something? Yeah, maybe this is the reason I don't use a headset much on EVE. I forget sometimes, but thanks for reminding me.
JoeT Amarr Short Attention Span Paisti Syndicate	Posted - 2009.01.03 02:59:00 - [167] no reason to either way. If someone in my corp doesnt have a mic, then i ask themm to be able to at least be able to get on when your out . It comes to its your money, and if you dont want to buy one, then ok. Another choice is trying to find a new corp that wont mind if you jsut listen in during selecet times. - We are anonymous. We Are legion.
Misanth RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE Black Legion.	Posted - 2009.01.03 03:39:00 - [168] Short answer: * Some corps/alliances demand that you got an access to a mic, usually for security reasons. * Some don't. Longer answer: Now, looking through my corp history (not too long mind you), I only had one corp that demanded it, which was np with me as I knew it before applying. If the OP keeps finding corps who demands it.. you're extremely unlucky. I'd suggest asking this before joining, tbh. There's alot of comments regarding voicecoms (purely mentioning the talking aspect, as you can still benefit from the listening-thing without having a mic); + It's too good in pvp not to be used. + It adds trust to people, in bigger alliances, those who never talks are usually among the first to be suspected to relay/stream voice to enemies. + Works pretty good for bonding. - Simple, not everyone is interested in talking. Some just don't like talking in public, some don't like to talk on phone, and voicecoms is pretty similar. Some just don't like certain environments where people talk. In my case, I talk on vent/ts in MMO's but refuse to talk on Xbox Live because of the pre-pubertal kids who can't control themselves (I listen, but pretend I can't talk). - Some might struggle with hardware/software for voice coms. In my case, EVE voice don't work for me if I run multiple clients, and the mic don't work on my stationary so I have to run my laptop/2nd PC just to talk. Argh. There's more arguments, but either way, the simple answers stands. If you don't want to talk on voicecoms, but want to play in a group of people, then find a group where they don't demand it.. it's pretty simple.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.03 04:27:00 - [169] Originally by: OffBeaT some people are just shy in life so let her be who she is.. so what of it! im a male. i chose the female Achura because the attributes are OP, and the male looks like my girl's father. im not shy though, i mentioned i work in one of the most social professions i can think of, and i love it. my post is about a whole different issue. the underlying question is should our virtual relationships act as replacements for or additions to the relationships we have or dont have IRL. i was hoping a few more would get this hint! thanks for the responses all, keep em comin if u want. i enjoyed reading them all.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.03 04:31:00 - [170] Edited by: UMEE on 03/01/2009 04:35:48 Edited by: UMEE on 03/01/2009 04:34:34 "The flat out I am not going to be on comms or I quit is a bit extreme. This game is a MMORG and if you join a corporation then you are going to have to be social." - if ure referring to me, i never ever said this. im regularly listening in on comms. and im VERY social in text form. "If you have 0 wish to know anybody then I suggest you bin the whole join a corporation idea all together." - but you need a corp to EXPERIENCE the game. i want to play the game. EVE doesnt have pugs, lol. u cant trust people to make one. "It is not a matter of the corporation not respecting your wishes. The corporation has rules and if you don't follow them then you get kicked." - all i ask for is a compromise. the corporation entity in the game doesnt HAVE TO mimic the automated bureaucratic monster of the real. it is a game after all.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.03 04:33:00 - [171] Originally by: Mundo Cani Originally by: Alowishus Maybe all you folks in this thread that are so against voice comms should form a corp together. But you're the **ing lepers of Eve as far as I'm concerned. Originally by:** Alowishus This is the Internet. Sack up. Originally by: Napoleon Bismarck GO back to WoW or play Hello Kitty...kindly feck off out of EVE. Originally by: Bumbum George STFU NOOB, I don't believe you! Originally by: bluebeyond You are fucking weird. What's wrong with talking to people? You scared ro something? Yeah, maybe this is the reason I don't use a headset much on EVE. I forget sometimes, but thanks for reminding me. i lol'd
Liliane Woodhead Intergalactic Charwomen	Posted - 2009.01.03 04:34:00 - [172] You are free to lie, UMEE. Say you are deaf-mutely. If anyone then discriminates you -> Petition. Remember friends: ... and even voice chat doesnt protect you from sickness or lies
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.03 04:41:00 - [173] Originally by: Trebor Locke Edited by: Trebor Locke on 02/01/2009 04:38:52 Edited by: Trebor Locke on 02/01/2009 04:37:50 Originally by: Davlos Edit: Furthermore, I have Asperger's Syndrome. Between you and me, I probably have more cause to justify any sort of anti-social behavior/desire, but I recognize the importance of forming social bonds in this game - you don't. Really now? Nice to meet you fellow Aspie (are you on the wrongplanet forum by any chance?) ^_^ I think you're quite right that this person doesn't have a decent reason to reject social bonding in this game. As someone with Asperger's Syndrome, I'm somewhat odd. Made my own corp and helped make an alliance >.> So anyone saying they wish to ignore an important part of any MMO (the social bonding part) because they simply don't want to really just doesn't cut it at all. i very much respect your desire to form meaningful relationships through this game. i did not say anything against this general process anywhere, and did not attack the people who participate in it. all i did was state my opinion based on the experiences I've had. and the general nature of my post is: why can't everyone be recognized, not just those who want to form relationships over the net. what we all have in common at the very least is that we all want to enjoy the game to its perceivable fullest. so why must i be excluded from corps, and hence the game content, if i do not use a mic for whatever reason? my intent was not to divide the pro-mic and anti-mic people, but to merely voice the experiences from the other side.
soldieroffortune 258 Gallente Trinity Council.	Posted - 2009.01.03 05:07:00 - [174] Originally by: Graelyn Enjoy solo play then. o/ Originally by: soldieroffortune 258 "*Eve is about making yourself richer while making the other guy poorer*"
Trader20	Posted - 2009.01.03 06:46:00 - [175] Because all the nerdy cool kids do it. Nah I know where your coming from. It kills any rp when you here a 30 year old man who sounds like a 12 year old boy screaming obscenities. I just mute everyone except fc and put the headphones on my dogs head. My mic doesnt bother me, it's other ppl speaking into their mics that bothers me.
Basil Yer Gallente Dark World Industries	Posted - 2009.01.03 08:51:00 - [176] Originally by: Trader20 Because all the nerdy cool kids do it. Nah I know where your coming from. It kills any rp when you here a 30 year old man who sounds like a 12 year old boy screaming obscenities. I just mute everyone except fc and put the headphones on my dogs head. My mic doesnt bother me, it's other ppl speaking into their mics that bothers me. /signed
Bumbum George	Posted - 2009.01.03 09:05:00 - [177] Originally by: UMEE why can't everyone be recognized, not just those who want to form relationships over the net... so why must i be excluded from corps, and hence the game content, if i do not use a mic for whatever reason? Short answer: because you're dealing with human beings! You may not like it but folks who socialize will have advantages over loners, not just in nerdy online games.
Laina Delapore Caldari Red Sun Industries	Posted - 2009.01.03 11:22:00 - [178] Originally by: MooKids I give you two scenarios, one with someone who uses a mic and one who decides to type. w/ mic and voice chat "Help, I'm under attack, need assistance!" w/o mic and typing "Help, I'm undwwwwwwwwww11234434dasawda" "Dammit, they killed me while I was typing!" A mic allows for speedy communications and gets people's attention, while typing does not. Yay. Someone screaming for help on VoiP at high volume and STILL not giving their location, enemy numbers or enemy ships. Even better, now I can hear them whine about it for the next hour rather than just turning the blink off in Corp. Frankly - if you get killed while typing out IV - 6 or "VII - 2 under attack" then you're probably dead already. And hey - there's a notepad in game, make yourself some "pre-recorded messages begging for help" and copy/paste them.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.03 11:25:00 - [179] Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 03/01/2009 11:26:38 Originally by: MooKids I give you two scenarios, one with someone who uses a mic and one who decides to type. w/ mic and voice chat "Help, I'm under attack, need assistance!" w/o mic and typing "Help, I'm undwwwwwwwwww11234434dasawda" "Dammit, they killed me while I was typing!" A mic allows for speedy communications and gets people's attention, while typing does not. Look at me! presses "need help" on fleet com quicklinks system in fleet chat I'm faster then both of you! Not to mention, i STILL like the fact that there's almost 50% girls playing this game. ... Shut up. Shut. dons lasers Up My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Illwill Bill Svea Rike	Posted - 2009.01.03 11:26:00 - [180] In the end, it's all about what kind of game you want to play. Personally, I find Vent singing to be an art form. If you don't want to use TS/Vent/EVE voice, then find a corp that doesn't require it. I doubt you are alone. Originally by: CCP Zulupark WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU?
Laina Delapore Caldari Red Sun Industries	Posted - 2009.01.03 11:59:00 - [181] Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 03/01/2009 11:26:38 Look at me! presses "need help" on fleet com quicklinks system in fleet chat And this is why I encourage people in my corp to fleet up in 0.0, whether they're in the same system or not
Evan Batarr	Posted - 2009.01.03 12:16:00 - [182] I'm completely with the OP. While I see TS as a useful tool for PvP I really don't like to talk to people I don't know and will never know. Does that mean I'm anti-social? Or cannot work for a common goal? Or dislike poeple in general? No, no and no. And I know of a lot of Corps/CEOs that don't object if you only join TS for PvP OPs. The only thing you might have to accept is an interview (for most recruters just a time matter 'cause speaking is a lot quicker than typing) before joining. I'm in a (pretty successful ) 0.0 alliance and only a very small minority uses TS for other things than PVP. The rest is chatting in the IG channels and the forums. And that's pretty sufficient. Hell, people don't even get spanked/kicked from fleet if they're not on TS during PVP OPs. There are many reasons why somebody can't be on TS. In the end it's his own problem if he gets killed. It would only be a problem if that would be the rule and not the exception. UMEE - just keep on looking for a corp. Not all of them force people to socialize with virtual characters.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.03 12:19:00 - [183] Originally by: Laina Delapore Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 03/01/2009 11:26:38 Look at me! presses "need help" on fleet com quicklinks system in fleet chat And this is why I encourage people in my corp to fleet up in 0.0, whether they're in the same system or not Not to mention, we all know...real men IRC-scout My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
RaTTuS BIG Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2009.01.03 12:24:00 - [184] mic's should not be mandatory, very useful for fleet ops, handy in some places ... where i play normaly I cannot use a mike as it is much to distracting I've known mute Fc's who are loads better than most . if they say it's mandortory then find a corp that don't mind -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve
Daan Sai Polytrope	Posted - 2009.01.03 14:11:00 - [185] I'm in the don't like voice comms camp, but have used it when required. Basicly: Listening to the FC in a battle is useful. In many ops however, as a scout I find that typing observations in a window has the big advantage that you can scroll back. Messages from a little while back are still accessible, where on vent/TS they are gone unless you add to the chatter endlessly repeating yourself. Comms to other corps is much more efficient by typing/chat as they never have the same voice comms system (EVE voice is an option). Escorting others as a covert guide voice is good for the 'OK jump now' command, but destination/waypoint info is better in chat. * I really don't like sitting in a room talking to my computer, especially as I don't live alone :) * I hate the sound of my own voice, and I'd much rather type. * I agree with the folks that find it spoils 'immersion' a bit too. So, I use voice on specific ops if I have to, mic less often than just listening, but on balance I prefer not to and can perform many operations without it.
d'hofren Queens of the Stone Age Rote Kapelle	Posted - 2009.01.03 15:01:00 - [186] Originally by: Vagel Edited by: Vagel on 02/01/2009 11:22:01 I agree with the OP. The day I wear a headset, is the day I'm not married anymore, end of story. The people that cannot see why, play too much EVE and have too little RL. My wife doesn't mind at all, as long as it isn't all the time and as long as I have spent plenty of Q Time with her recently. In the same way that I don't mind her going out with her mates / shopping / gossiping etc. Eve's a hobby of mine, not a sensible as the gardening / DIY but a lot less damaging to our relationship than going to the pub with the lads every week spending money and getting sh*tfaced.
Arianhod	Posted - 2009.01.03 16:10:00 - [187] Can agree with the op on quite a few levels, having been reclusive most of the time I am simply crap when it comes to talking, more than 10 minutes and it does start to strain my throat Having passed on less than 100 words spoken a day for most of High School I can say I can convey messages typing much better than by speaking it. I realise this is mostly selfish but as a personal preference I am against having to use VOIP if I don't have to. Listening to it, no problems when I can get the accent, there's been more than one occasion when I had to say "I can't understand a word you are saying" and got a "whut?" as a response.... no offence to our American cousins but many of you are hard to understand when speaking to my ears tl;dr - agree with op but will listen in on ops, I have a mic but it is seldom used. Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007. Haruhiists - Supporting Linkification since 2008
Maestro Ulv Phaze-9	Posted - 2009.01.03 16:31:00 - [188] Originally by: MooKids I give you two scenarios, one with someone who uses a mic and one who decides to type. w/ mic and voice chat "Help, I'm under attack, need assistance!" w/o mic and typing "Help, I'm undwwwwwwwwww11234434dasawda" "Dammit, they killed me while I was typing!" A mic allows for speedy communications and gets people's attention, while typing does not. And then you ask where and they... type it, because you cannot say half the names in this game with accuracy or spend time spelling it out when hey, there is a keyboard right next to you. The reasons you gave are as lame as the rest in here. You do not need a mic to play any MMO, if people wish to socialise over the mic then fine, but not all of us play the game in the bedroom whilst ignoring the rest of the people around you. During PVP ops it CAN be helpful to have one but is certainly not a factor in safety of your fellow pod pilots. If you are not the FC or the scout then 99% of the time you shouldn't talk anyway during an active operation. As for socialising with other members, sure some want to, and some don't. Personaly I love talking to my alliance or corp mates but certainly not all the time, I can respect others points of view though, the problem is many playing Eve cannot. Just join a corp that doesn't attempt to force this upon you OP, there are many out there. Ignore the idiots that say you must be on voice at all times when playing EVE, it isn't your fault they have no life and need you to give them one.
Ryuga VonRhaiden Caldari Insurgent New Eden Tribe Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2009.01.03 16:48:00 - [189] Originally by: UMEE the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. It's just a requirement... and it has its uses: - Counter-espionage - Rapid response in combat or other dangerous situations (hostiles coming to your home sys or such) - No need to check 10 chat channels at one time - if something's up having 20-30 people in vocal chat should help, as it's enough that a single person notice it and point others to it - Improve social cohesion: it's harder to be lame with people you use to talk with than doing nasty stuff to anonymous people There are lots of scarcely-cohesive empire-scattered non-focused corps that do not require any kind of vocal contact, just join one of them... Do not try and find the signature... that's impossible. Instead only try to realize the truth... There is no signature.
HTI sucks	Posted - 2009.01.03 16:54:00 - [190] I don't mind using voice comms but there are problems with it. 1. I work a 12 hour night shift with every other weekend off (fiday saturday and sunday) 2. The only way I can use voice comms is if I stay awake during the daytime then switch to staying awake at night for work just so I can use voice comms without waking up the other apartment tenants at night. 3. I've had a lot of bad experiences when people get on Vent, get drunk and start whining about how much they haven't accomplished compared to everyone else in their family... 4. Even if I do use voice comms during the day my fellow apartment tenants give me weird looks like I'm insane because they think I'm talking to myself since the walls are paper thin... Willingness is not my problem, my current situation is just not ideal. And don't say go for a different job because the local job market sucks so much I would have to take a 5 dollar an hour cut in wages therefore end up homeless.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.03 17:02:00 - [191] We haven't addressed the biggest problem here, users and non users alike; Would you, in the heat of battle, when all the chips are down and there's only precious seconds to think about your next move, with the whole empires faith at hand...want to hear: "So, i'm wearing a pink thong now." by yours truly? My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Rocinantae Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.03 17:57:00 - [192] 1. Just as much as you dont want anyone telling you what to do, you cant force them to comply with your values. Find a corp that doesnt care if you use voice. 2. As a leader I would want my people to "bond" together. Its called, "esprit de corps". Theres nothing personal when your just typing. You cant get a feel for who you are as quickly and as personally as hearing someones voice. 3. In small gang pvp typing is to slow. Maybe you can type fast but as an fc i'd rather your hands be on the trigger or looking for targets e.t.c. 4. If someone told me they didnt want to use voice I would be concerned your a spy. Maybe a spy gets into corps then doesnt talk. Why? There on there own corps voice. Or they are someone that is known by people in my corp and dont want to be reconized. 5. I have a wife and kid plus 2 dogs and 2 cats. I make time for eve. If I have responsibilities I take care of them first. If you cant make time for eve and family you shouldnt be playing eve. 6. I know many people with aspergers that use voice and there good people so that excuse dont wash. 7. What your talking about isnt a value its about norms. THe norm in eve is to use voice because it is more efficient and its helps with social interaction. You are going against the nrom which is your right. But you have to accept the concequences. End the end your going to have to be the one to adapt. Again as much as you dont want people forcing ther beliefs on you, you cant do likewise.
Soporo Caldari The Graduates Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:04:00 - [193] I'd use a mic but wild animals tore out my tongue when I was a youth. Oh, and the fact that I tripped on my mic cord and snatched it out and fubard up something doesnt have anything to do with it.
SiJira	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:10:00 - [194] voice never was required to play a game well maybe you should make your own corp?
Mme Pinkerton Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:27:00 - [195] Edited by: Mme Pinkerton on 03/01/2009 18:29:50 Edited by: Mme Pinkerton on 03/01/2009 18:28:21 Originally by: UMEE "At no point in time has ANYTHING you've said even BORDERED a discussion of philosophy! Furthermore, neither has your values been discussed at this point. Definately the lol of the day." the questioning/discussion of values, and "why" questions IS philosophy. my values are clearly stated, as are the values of many other community members. but lets get back to the topic =) Originally by: UMEE "At no point in time has ANYTHING you've said even BORDERED a discussion of philosophy! Furthermore, neither has your values been discussed at this point. Definately the lol of the day." the questioning/discussion of values, and "why" questions IS philosophy. my values are clearly stated, as are the values of many other community members. but lets get back to the topic =) .... strange that none of you has touched the real 'philosophical' question the OP implied in his first post. The main argument in this discussion seems to be about how necessary VOIP communications in (small-scale) PvP situations really are. General consensus is somewhere between 'pretty important' and 'lifesaving'. So let's assume voicecom is actually necessary for successful PvP. Now UMEE asks "....and what if I were mute?". The common answer (which appeared a few times in this thread) seems to be "well... that would be something 'different'", meaning this would be a valid excuse. But just how can this be a valid excuse, if voicecom is an absolute necessity? If voicecom were necessary a responsible FC would have to say "i am sorry about you being disabled, but I have to kick you from the fleet to prevent harm to your fleetmates.". Now we face two explanations for the answer mentioned above: either the FC is willing to risk the whole fleet in order to please our disabled teammember, or he previously lied about voicecom being necessary. So it is safe to assume that voicecom is not actually necessary, but rather convenient. This poses the question where the treshold between acceptable and inacceptable reasons for not using voicecom lies. We already have the one extreme (mute) covered and from the previous discussion it would be possible to deduct a few points in-between (family, small children, illness etc.). As we see there is a whole spectrum of reasons, which seem to justify absence from voicecom, the exact scope/width of which is usually determined by the FC's personal preferences. Which poses the question - how is this scheme of reasoning justified? Who should get to decide whether a reason is sound enough to justify absence from voicecom or not? (as seen previously this doesn't depend on the actual situation, else our mute friend would have been banned from said situation, too). And ultimately the question remains, why the OP is not judged competent enough to decide by himself, if he is to use voicecom or not (being mute, having children etc. each these reasons describes a 'state' of the individual not being able to use voicecom. remember we're talking about an online RPG, so no one except the person rectifying himself can know about his current state to the full extent. So who can judge this situation better than he himself?).
SiJira	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:42:00 - [196] stop taking the game so seriously Trashed sig, Shark was here
Yarrmageddon Gallente Aeon Of Strife R.U.R.	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:46:00 - [197] Has the thought ever occured to you that your corp might be uncomfortable having someone amongst them they never get to 'know'? _ _ _
SheriffFruitfly Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.03 18:53:00 - [198] SO start your own corp, where nobody has to talk to anybody. __________________________________________________________
Karath Piki	Posted - 2009.01.03 21:43:00 - [199] Here's the thing: Mics are security. Why? Because betrayal, spying and the metagame are important parts of Eve and any organization has to have a way to limit risk with new players. Most of the people that I have been aware of (after the fact) who were spies or saboteurs were willing to listen in on TS or Vent, but not willing to form those relationships. There are plenty of corps who don't require voice. Most of them are mission-running and industrial only. PVP corporations will require voice because it is needed to coordinate. Other types of corporations require it because those who form those relationships are less likely to betray them. It's a defense against the metagame, and one that you have to accept as a reality in Eve. Like everything else in Eve, you have the choice to play your way, but every choice you make limits your future potential. Those corporations have made a choice as well, eliminating from consideration those who won't be on voice even if they are otherwise superb and loyal members. And I have known people who claim to be mutes in the game. There's no way to verify that, really, and the nature of the game means that either they have to convince a prospective corporation to give them an exemption or get into a different corporation willing to take them on. And there is nothing wrong with that, no more so than requiring members be from a certain country, or speak a certain language, or be active during a certain timezone, or a certain minimum number of hours a week or day.
Sakura Nihil Stimulus Rote Kapelle	Posted - 2009.01.03 21:58:00 - [200] Spyyyyyyyy. Football? Hell yes.
Spurty Caldari Technologic Dance	Posted - 2009.01.03 22:32:00 - [201] Massively Mute Online game .. sounds 'fun'. I used to play Counter Strike with no sound, now there's a game where sound off is actually a boon! Just tell people you are mute. Telling people you just don't want to talk to them is sociopathic and not desirable anywhere 'social' norms are expected. Your issues should not be others problems, ppl like that need to be removed from the gene pool To make a mistake is Human. To make a REALLY BIG mistake, takes a computer
Grendelsbane	Posted - 2009.01.04 06:19:00 - [202] Edited by: Grendelsbane on 04/01/2009 06:21:06 Originally by: UMEE why do i have to use a mic? why cant i just listen in? this has been my issue since the beginning of EVE. after my first month in this one corp, i liked the people and they liked me. one day the CEO convos me and says that "everyone would like to get to know you, why dont you just go out and get yourself a mic, it's only a few bucks?" the convo went on for about 15 minutes, and it was all him trying to convince me. I didnt feel that i had to justify my values, or enter a philosophical discussion. i did anyway, but it didnt end so well. i renew my account, try to get into another corp, and same BS. my first question is this: why cant i play WITH, and not play with in order to BE? my thing is...i dont want to get to know you. i dont particularly like speaking to people whose faces i dont know over the phone. this is why im not a telemarketer. i certainly dont want to have to sell myself by allowing others to "get to know me" in order to enjoy this game in its full entirety. for me, this isnt a conduit through which i will form meaningful and/or lasting connections. i want to play. my second question: what if i was a mute, or deaf? the people that i speak to like to say that im shy...but this isnt the case; i work in a very social profession. in addition, i went through all the normal developmental processes, and have what you may consider a normal life for a young adult. but what if I couldnt hear or speak? sometimes I wish people assumed this about me, for the purposes of playing this game. the thing is, people aren't willing to compromise by at least acknowledging my values. i acknowledge theirs. for pvp ops i say: i'll listen in. i understand that decisions need to be made quickly. but why am i considered a deviant because i dont want to get to know you? ive been on TS before, i HAVE a mic. but 1) i dont want to listen to sad drunken asshats; this is not my idea of a party 2) 70% of the time, i cant make out what people are saying due to static/volume issues 3) i cant understand half the accents out there. 4) most importantly, i dont want to get to know anyone, or make "meaningful" connections with people that i will never meet. this is my value, but no one seems to want to respect that. but I have to respect everyone else's. Your personal value of not wanting to use a mic means that you are of limited, possibly even NEGATIVE, value in a PvP setting. Period. End. Of. Story. People have limited space for text channels, which primarily needs to be used for intel, local, etc. Even when they have room to make the fleet/gang channel large enough for them to read your message in a timely manner, you taking the time to type crap to them and them having to take their eyes off something else to read it is going to cost people ships. If you cannot rapidly acknowledge orders, you are a liablity. This is not about philosophy, it is about what works. Even if it was about philosopy, yours is incredibly stupid because you not having a mic Does Not Work. Fleet voice comms is not about chatter, random banter, and getting to "know" the other pilots. It's for the leaders to issue orders and for most of the rest shutting the hell up unless asked a direct question. I don't care who they are, I don't care who you are, I only give a damn whether or not you're going to scout the gate into XYZ-W and get back. Honestly, voice com during ops in EVE works no different than military radio traffic, which I've done many times. Nobody cares if you have some bizarro-world hang-up about talking to people you can't see. Either grow up or go see a shrink for crying out loud. Mute or deaf? Too bad! Welcome to the real world, where not being able to talk or hear is a liability in a communicative, competitive environment. How about people who are blind, are we going to worry about them too while we're at it? Lastly, if you have a Vent or TS server full of drunken asshats - leave! Find others!
Jahlina Kantar	Posted - 2009.01.04 08:14:00 - [203] I agree somewhat. Gaming is a quiet retreat for me. I'm quite happy to sit down after work, kick back, and enjoy a bit of spaceship goodness. Eve is fairly casual. It's not that hard to play (lets face it. click your mouse button, huge challenge there!) and not too stressful that you need second by second voice comms all the time. In mind bending action games it is a must, but here there's always plenty of time to type. I used voice comms for a while through various fleet ops. It's handy, that's for sure. But outside the important fleet ops I'd rather switch it off. I don't live alone, and sometimes I play late. I hate putting up with people who turn their mike volumes up and the serenity of my household is destroyed by some obnoxious American teenager. Conversely, I hate speaking up so others can hear me, so that my study sounds like a general is barking situation reports from a war room till all hours of the night. Also sometimes it isnt all its cracked up to be. Especially when half a dozen or more people start competing for the channel and it just becomes garbled. Yes, this is where radio discipline comes in, but general gamers are anything but disciplined. Sometimes the commander says "just write it in fleet chat" and all of a sudden everything becomes clear and permanent. You know who is saying what (no more "who said that?"), you don't ever miss what is said because it stays up there for you to read, and you don't have to deal with mispronunciations and really bad accents (just try pronouncing some of the system names. Most people just cant understand!). In some ways, the written language actually works better where you have the time to write it! I totally feel the pain of the Original Poster. I got tired of being hassled to turn the mic on all the time, especially when i wasn't on fleet ops. Was always happy to keep a listening watch on the channel as a minimum, but didn't find it necessary to always turn the mic. Unless, ofcourse, the situation really needed it. I guess I also like to remain anonymous too. That is also an issue. I like to get to know my corp mates. I like talking about our personal lives ect. But I have to admit - I do draw a line. I probably wouldn't purposefully meet them in real life or call them up for phone conversations. So voice comms always straddled that line. Took the personal relationship up a notch, where i was quite happy to just have casual text chats. However I bared with it because of the tactical value, and I got used to it somewhat. Eve definitely changed for me when voice comms became the norm. Especially when it was integrated into the game via Eve Voice. It was no longer easy going and sometimes became uncomfortable and loud. Then there was the day I stepped on my headset and broke the mic. And I've been mic'less ever since. It's been a mixed blessing in a way. I get much more peace and quiet and anonymity. I feel much more casual just kicking back. Though, understandably, I can't be the fleet primary caller or scout anymore. What can I say? I definitely see the issues with voice comms in this game. The OP is not a crazy fool
leung bak Caldari Copperhead Arms	Posted - 2009.01.04 11:47:00 - [204] Originally by: Bloody Rabbit Edited by: Bloody Rabbit on 31/12/2008 02:20:49 What I don't like about the mic is that forced to listen to the people most of the time I learn that I have joined a group of little boys playing VG in their mommy's basement. I would think that in this case having a mic would be to your advantage. You learn much quicker which persons to avoid
Sagacious Z	Posted - 2009.01.06 08:23:00 - [205] You should not have to. I know a very nice member who loves this game that is unable to speak--she wants to have fun also and to communicate also, but can only text. Some members have a spouse who puts up with the long playing time, but goes nuts if their spouse goes vocal also. Some members just are plain obnoxious, even though they are in your gang/corp--hearing them squak is like looking at a fatso in a teeny swimsuit at the beach. Some members multitask while playing EVE and prefer not to add one more task like voice. Some members have a spouse who is sleeping and can hear the noise. On the other hand, some members love to be a comedian and act like they have their own radio show and think they are really funny. Some actually are very funny. In PvP, it can be anywhere from nice to important to crucial to have voice. It is much easier to teach with voice. Sometimes, corp members just want to feel like a team, and voice is more "real" than text. Have fun. If you do not want to use voice, find a corp that does not use it but find a way to have fun and don't feel "forced" about anything--it is just a game.
Jmanis Catharg Caldari Dusk Blade	Posted - 2009.01.06 08:30:00 - [206] Quote: find a way to have fun and don't feel "forced" about anything--it is just a game. That's why I don't join 0.0 alliances. An added bonus is then you really don't need a mic. --- Originally by: CCP Mitnal I went to the forums for special powers and all I got was a dancing padlock and a banhammer.
MHayes	Posted - 2009.01.06 12:44:00 - [207] A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily. This is FACT. it cannot be changed. So why be at a disadvantage when my corp could choose not to be? It is this simple.
Jmanis Catharg Caldari Dusk Blade	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:01:00 - [208] Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 13:03:24 Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Or better yet: Scout: Uhhh, ok........ I seee...... uhhh...... 5 reds...... (other player: What corp) no 6 reds,,, on this gate. Oh wait ones coming through,,, no he's not he's just bouncing off the gate. (Hauler with valuable goods: Man, I'm gonna warp out, don't want to lose this stuff) These guys... uuuh... they're from,,, no wait don't go,, it's safe,, what? If I had a dollar for every situation like that.... --- Originally by: CCP Mitnal I went to the forums for special powers and all I got was a dancing padlock and a banhammer.
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:05:00 - [209] Edited by: Tippia on 06/01/2009 13:07:12 Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Ok, correction: a player without a working mic is simply not as good. Your second example has nothing to do with mic-vs-text, but rather with having a dimwitted scout. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Rennion	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:31:00 - [210] TBH I think if any corp found out that one of its members thought they where all drunken asshats who are not worth socialising with they would kick him/her. MMORPGs are social games, comraderie and group efort is what its all about, I honestly cant see any reason to play one if you don't want to socialise as the gameplay is totally ****ty compared to single player games :S
Dr Fighter	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:34:00 - [211] As long as you can type fast, i dont mind people only listening to vent/ts/eve-voice. doesnt do terribly well to have say a scout wihtout a mic however. This may be a reason some corps gets ****y.
Sidrat Flush Caldari Life is Experience Rally Against Evil	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:38:00 - [212] Not having read all the thread I'm probably going to repeat myself, but it doesn't really matter. If a person doesn't want to listen in on voice chat that's their decision. If they don't want to get to know their fellow corp members, again that's their decision. Before I go on, I feel I must add, that sometimes after a working day spent in a call centre I don't want to go on voice comms either, I'd rather listen to a radio play or a comedy programme, or even (if things are really bad) music. Now as a ceo I WILL join the chat channel and stop what I'm doing to help out and discuss the corp members that do want/need a voice conversation. That's fine, it's the role I've put myself in so I don't mind at all. It's nice to be needed or in fact just kept in the loop. There really are two issues about those that don't want to join voice comms, and those that "can't". The important bit is to discover who really does live in an apartment or a shared house with thin walls and creepy house/apartment neighbours, or is it a spy already talking on their own server. It's not really that important yet but for the corp it will be one day. The ones that don't want to join voice comms while on a mining or mission op, are in my opinion more bizarre. They want the team work and all that it brings, but they don't want the "emotional" ties of bonding online persistant games bring. The question "Why?" springs to mind. Yes eve online is a great game to play and it can be played entirely up to the player themselves, even as a ceo I'm not here to tell others how to play but I can certainly give an opinion on what would be good for their character if they want to hear my opinion. It's not too much to ask I feel that during a mission (about 15 minutes or less for a level 4 mission) or a mining op (a few hours at least) that the corp members get on the voice channel and shoot the breeze, co-ordinate their efforts and of course do that whole "bonding" thing. I feel it does add to the experience that is Eve Online, the sandbox game. The emotional ties that bind players together form the basic worth of any corporation. It doesn't really matter how much ISK the corp and it's members have, it doesn't matter what their ISK turnover is either, what's more important is how each member gets on with everyone else and if you can't be arsed to make a modi****of effort in that regard for so much reward, then I'm afraid your character won't fit in with many corps. This is just my opinion of course, but it is an echo of most of the people who are in succesful (succesful, because they have a team spirit and bond) corporations/alliances. -------------------------- Life is about memories the more the better.
Princess Jodi Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:02:00 - [213] There is validity in demanding that people have a mic in gangs. There is a validity in desiring to not have a mic cuz you want to listen to music, RL issues, sleeping roommates, etc. There is a slight risk of non-mic users being spys passing along ts info, but thats usually a muted mike. The reality is that the FC controls the gang, and can literally do anything they want. You as a grunt have the choice of leaving the gang, but not to redefine it.
Lei Merdeau Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:04:00 - [214] Originally by: Yuri VanKaer I agree, it's pretty annoying to everyone else to only get half the convo, especially if they're not gamers. Solution. Use Headset and speakers, place the speakers behind you so you don't get feed back. Your housemates can then hear everything. Then they can ask you to remove the speakers!
TooNu Caldari State Protectorate Academy	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:19:00 - [215] Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 13:03:24 Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Or better yet: Scout: Uhhh, ok........ I seee...... uhhh...... 5 reds...... (other player: What corp) no 6 reds,,, on this gate. Oh wait ones coming through,,, no he's not he's just bouncing off the gate. (Hauler with valuable goods: Man, I'm gonna warp out, don't want to lose this stuff) These guys... uuuh... they're from,,, no wait don't go,, it's safe,, what? If I had a dollar for every situation like that.... In the words of Yoda "Truth you have written, and well written it is"
Squably Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:42:00 - [216] Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 13:03:24 Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Or better yet: Scout: Uhhh, ok........ I seee...... uhhh...... 5 reds...... (other player: What corp) no 6 reds,,, on this gate. Oh wait ones coming through,,, no he's not he's just bouncing off the gate. (Hauler with valuable goods: Man, I'm gonna warp out, don't want to lose this stuff) These guys... uuuh... they're from,,, no wait don't go,, it's safe,, what? If I had a dollar for every situation like that.... Or you could use a decent scout instead of a complete moron. Really if you use someone like that as a scout you deserve to die Signature removed. Please do not imply profanity in your signature. Navigator
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.01.06 15:10:00 - [217] Trust, thats all there is to it, didn't bother to read the whole topic so sorry if someone already brought it up, but it's just this simple.
adamantinesteel	Posted - 2009.01.06 15:13:00 - [218] There is a simple answer to this... Either you find a corp that does not require it, or you give in and get a mic and get on voice coms. My corp requires Voice coms, not 100% of the time, their are obviously valid reasons not to be on voice coms. But As a corperation we have a right to decide how we want our corperation to work. IF you do not like that, then by all means find another one that fits you better. Most PVP focused corperations will require voice coms pretty much all the time. I am not going to get into the reasons why.... Most Carebear corps do not. So if you want to be a PVPer, but do not want to get on Voice coms, then i wish you luck finding a good group that will allow that. If you are mainly a carebear, there are plenty of corps out there that will not require you to be on voice coms.
Chaos Winds	Posted - 2009.01.06 15:36:00 - [219] Edited by: Chaos Winds on 06/01/2009 15:37:25 I have been gaming for years and have played most of the MMOs out there at one time or another, and I still hate voice chat. If you are a female gamer in Eve, forget it. The first time you talk, half the fleet immediately crashes into the nearest asteroid and the other half immediately goes into Flirt Mode. Then you get a barrage of private convo invites, Eve mails and voice chat requests and wind up playing Block Mania forever after. This is even disruptive to a gang or fleet, because the Guardian isn't gonna rep them if they're blocked from the chat window, lol. Voice or no voice, important info eventually winds up floating by on typed chat, too. Don't get me wrong-- some guys are absolutely fine about having a female around. But there are a whole lot more who can't deal with women on any level other than as dating material, and there seem to be some in every corp and every crowd. It's their own hangup and it has been a drag for years now. And no, I don't "ask for it" in any way, shape or form, I'm just stuck dealing with it because of voice chat. There are a whole lot of female MMOers out there, many more than you might think, but they're plagued with "broken mics" or whatever it takes to keep the harassers off our backs, lol. You can't believe the amount of guys out there who abuse MMOs as a dating service, even if they're already living with girls/married. And it's easy to scoff if you're not the one who has to go through it constantly. The real question of the day here is when CCP is going to put forth its modulated voice system. I've seen it mentioned here or there, but nothing ever comes to fruition. Then the males "faking" playing females with girl avatars can continue to extract twinks from unsuspecting males, rofl, and the true females can hide even further behind a modulated male voice, and nobody will ever really know for sure. I can't wait.
Cygnus Scott Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.06 16:02:00 - [220] Originally by: Turin Originally by: Cygnus Scott What about people who cannot use TS/Vent due to their connection but can play most aspects of EVE just fine (aside from major engagements)? There are a lot of people still using dial up due to a lack of broadband availability. Satellite blows for gaming AND anything real-time like VoIP, and the Air Cards have a crappy 5GB cap that sucks if its your main connection. Then those people suck and should move. Or stick to single player games, or stay out of PVP. Anyone on dialup should avoid PVP imo. the deck is already stacked against them due to latency. Move? In case you haven't noticed the housing market is in the toilet and anyone selling right now that bough in the last 3-5 years would probably lose their ass. But then again what does someone living in their parent's basement or living in a dump with 5 roommates know about owning a home or paying a mortgage? You still win at internet space ships right? You reading comprehension pretty much sucks too since I noted that fleet engagements (teh PVPz0rz) is out of the question. Small gang PVP works if you know WTF your role is and what role is best to play for your particular situation. This game is not really that fast paced compared to PVP in other games and FPS. Large engagements may be slightly different as ships are popping fast and targeting latency plays a larger role. The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
Tekutep	Posted - 2009.01.06 19:03:00 - [221] If I could find a corp where random chattiness is discouraged and ONLY voice for direct, in-game information is encouraged, then that would be the one for me. I don't mind voice for hearing quick commands in battle and so on. But I really, honestly don't give a flying crap about what you're eating, or what music you think is great, or why CCCP screwed the pooch on this or that. In other words, I just don't want to hear the unnecessary chatter. Yet like I said, I do see the great value in voice for information. The desire for quick voice info typically outweighs my distaste for the chatter, so I'll usually just go ahead and join voice. But I'm the type who won't say much if anything besides "Yes, that's nice.. anyway, about that asteroid belt..."
Letrange Minmatar Chaosstorm Corporation Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium	Posted - 2009.01.06 20:16:00 - [222] Audio for combat OPS: necessary. Mic for combat OPS: optional unless you're scout or FC where it is so ****en mandatory it's not funny. Audio & mic for explaining things to newbies: optional but recommended (I find it goes faster) Audio & mic for the rest: optional but useful. As a side note, board meetings pretty much require audio and mic. The amount of typing is otherwise excessive. Also: This is eve. There is always the possibility that if you're not on voice coms it's because you're a spy and you have voice coms active on your other account in order to pass on info scrolling by in chat.
Gambuk	Posted - 2009.01.06 20:39:00 - [223] Okay. When we're running OPS together, and the PVP is intense, and you type "WATCH OUT BEHIND YOU" instead of saying it over Ventrilo. Thats when Im ****ed you dont have a mic.
UMEE	Posted - 2009.01.06 20:57:00 - [224] Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 13:03:24 Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Or better yet: Scout: Uhhh, ok........ I seee...... uhhh...... 5 reds...... (other player: What corp) no 6 reds,,, on this gate. Oh wait ones coming through,,, no he's not he's just bouncing off the gate. (Hauler with valuable goods: Man, I'm gonna warp out, don't want to lose this stuff) These guys... uuuh... they're from,,, no wait don't go,, it's safe,, what? If I had a dollar for every situation like that.... i lol'd, so true man. especially the second example. rock on guys, great posts.
Nifan	Posted - 2009.01.06 21:05:00 - [225] At last, a cleaver post. I understand you very well, just don't connect to TS or whatever if they don't like, screw them.
Korizan	Posted - 2009.01.06 21:42:00 - [226] Edited by: Korizan on 06/01/2009 21:43:32 Originally by: Chaos Winds Edited by: Chaos Winds on 06/01/2009 15:37:25 I have been gaming for years and have played most of the MMOs out there at one time or another, and I still hate voice chat. If you are a female gamer in Eve, forget it. The first time you talk, half the fleet immediately crashes into the nearest asteroid and the other half immediately goes into Flirt Mode. Then you get a barrage of private convo invites, Eve mails and voice chat requests and wind up playing Block Mania forever after. This is even disruptive to a gang or fleet, because the Guardian isn't gonna rep them if they're blocked from the chat window, lol. Voice or no voice, important info eventually winds up floating by on typed chat, too. Don't get me wrong-- some guys are absolutely fine about having a female around. But there are a whole lot more who can't deal with women on any level other than as dating material, and there seem to be some in every corp and every crowd. It's their own hangup and it has been a drag for years now. And no, I don't "ask for it" in any way, shape or form, I'm just stuck dealing with it because of voice chat. There are a whole lot of female MMOers out there, many more than you might think, but they're plagued with "broken mics" or whatever it takes to keep the harassers off our backs, lol. You can't believe the amount of guys out there who abuse MMOs as a dating service, even if they're already living with girls/married. And it's easy to scoff if you're not the one who has to go through it constantly. The real question of the day here is when CCP is going to put forth its modulated voice system. I've seen it mentioned here or there, but nothing ever comes to fruition. Then the males "faking" playing females with girl avatars can continue to extract twinks from unsuspecting males, rofl, and the true females can hide even further behind a modulated male voice, and nobody will ever really know for sure. I can't wait. Actually there are a lot of programs out there that will disguise your voice and eliminate the whole OMG a girl issues. Do a google for "disguise mic input"
Maxpie Cross Roads	Posted - 2009.01.06 22:03:00 - [227] I must agree with the OP, but for different reasons. Voice coms break my immersion and take away from my enjoyment of Eve. I play full screen and enjoy the sounds and sights of Eve. When I get on voice coms, which I will do by the way if they really want me to, it just reduces my fun when I have to hear someone talk about the football game or that he just got Left 4 Dead on Xbox. Worse yet, you sometimes get the idiots who have to play music into their mic or sing/say ridiculous annoying stuff. Bottom line is I just don't enjoy it. Fortunately, it's never been a big issue with any corp I've been with. Just my .02 isk. He put... creatures... in our bodies... to control our minds. He made us... say lies... do things.
waruiushiro	Posted - 2009.01.06 22:08:00 - [228] Originally by: UMEE Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 13:03:24 Quote: A player without a mic is simply not as good, you cannot communicate as quickly and easily Wanna bet? Gang Sitting at the gate: OK, you, go through to scout. Scout: mfmftk (scout jumps) Scout: mmpfh Gang Leader: is it clear? Scout: MMpfh Gang Leader: What? Scout: crackling GL: What?? Scout: (bad fading) Or better yet: Scout: Uhhh, ok........ I seee...... uhhh...... 5 reds...... (other player: What corp) no 6 reds,,, on this gate. Oh wait ones coming through,,, no he's not he's just bouncing off the gate. (Hauler with valuable goods: Man, I'm gonna warp out, don't want to lose this stuff) These guys... uuuh... they're from,,, no wait don't go,, it's safe,, what? If I had a dollar for every situation like that.... i lol'd, so true man. especially the second example. rock on guys, great posts. This is the stupidest thread I've ever read. We need mics because we need to co-ordinate quickly and communicate effectively. That's it. If you can't do it, then you're not suited to a gang that needs to move more quickly than one jump every ten minutes. It's like a man with no arms trying to get a job as a chef. "What's with all this needing to hold a knife and actually work with the food? Is there a philosophical debate we could have about this?" No.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.06 22:20:00 - [229] You need microphones to help dispel the myths that some of your corp-mates are women. Just because someone wears a female avatar ingame doesn't mean they're female in real life. Sheesh, the number of times I've been in groups that have banded around one "woman" then he has spoken on TeamSpeak and the whole group has fallen apart... there really is something wrong with the male brain, isn't there? If you're a mangina, just get on voice chat and let folks deal with their shattered illusions in their own way.
Markizah	Posted - 2009.01.06 22:34:00 - [230] Originally by: Chaos Winds Edited by: Chaos Winds on 06/01/2009 15:37:25 I have been gaming for years and have played most of the MMOs out there at one time or another, and I still hate voice chat. If you are a female gamer in Eve, forget it. The first time you talk, half the fleet immediately crashes into the nearest asteroid and the other half immediately goes into Flirt Mode. Then you get a barrage of private convo invites, Eve mails and voice chat requests and wind up playing Block Mania forever after. This is even disruptive to a gang or fleet, because the Guardian isn't gonna rep them if they're blocked from the chat window, lol. Voice or no voice, important info eventually winds up floating by on typed chat, too. Don't get me wrong-- some guys are absolutely fine about having a female around. But there are a whole lot more who can't deal with women on any level other than as dating material, and there seem to be some in every corp and every crowd. It's their own hangup and it has been a drag for years now. And no, I don't "ask for it" in any way, shape or form, I'm just stuck dealing with it because of voice chat. There are a whole lot of female MMOers out there, many more than you might think, but they're plagued with "broken mics" or whatever it takes to keep the harassers off our backs, lol. You can't believe the amount of guys out there who abuse MMOs as a dating service, even if they're already living with girls/married. And it's easy to scoff if you're not the one who has to go through it constantly. The real question of the day here is when CCP is going to put forth its modulated voice system. I've seen it mentioned here or there, but nothing ever comes to fruition. Then the males "faking" playing females with girl avatars can continue to extract twinks from unsuspecting males, rofl, and the true females can hide even further behind a modulated male voice, and nobody will ever really know for sure. I can't wait. That is quite over-exaggerated. EVE crowd is generally mature about hearing a female voice on Vent at least in my experience. I have no problem joining a new corp and coming on voice comms the same day. When I first started playing MMO games I was a bit apprehensive about comms because I read a lot of posts stating that females in MMOs often get verbally harassed by affection-starved males. But when I started joining corps I found that these statements were blown way out of proportion. May be it was my selection of corps or just my luck, but I have had only one bad experience over the past 2 years playing EVE. I had to leave the corp because of one very rude individual who .. had issues. There was also one stalker, but he was a great guy overall and I did not mind talking to him. Yes, there might be that one or two guys who are happily married yet feel the need to flirt. But they tend to keep it light and don't get serious about it. They even flirt with each other and make homosexual advances, but it is done jokingly and everyone understands that. And when someone flirts with me I also take it as a joke and don't treat is seriously that he is trying to form some sort of relationship over internet spaceships. I have never experienced a barrage of private convos when I would first speak up on voice comms in a new corp, or the need to block somebody right away. No requests for cybersex or anything of the kind. In reality, there is little need to have a 'broken' mic for a female gamer, unless of course you believe all the over-exaggerated forum posts made on the topic.
Jmanis Catharg Caldari Dusk Blade	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:15:00 - [231] Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 23:15:22 Quote: This is the stupidest thread I've ever read. We need mics because we need to co-ordinate quickly and communicate effectively. That's it. If you can't do it, then you're not suited to a gang that needs to move more quickly than one jump every ten minutes. Truth is a great deal of people, particularly teenagers who play the game (due to lack of experience, not just raining hate on teenagers) are not: - Amateur Radio users - Radio communication-savvy whatsoever. I emphasise radio communications because it's essentially what things like TS and Vent are. If you want to talk effectively you need to engage in a fair amount of radio discipline. Enter the realm of the more controlling people who basically tell everyone 'non-essential' to shut up,, where I pull the "It's a game ffs" card. But even in this case, it's not essential to have amic, since you've been told to shut up and listen anyway. Truth is with chat you have a scrolling-back history. With voice comms you don't have any history. If you got told something at the start, unless you wrote everything down you'll have your short-term-memory disabled people asking 'what?' again. Don't get me wrong though, are voice comms useful? Yes. Are they essential and necessarily better in all aspects than text chat? No way. --- Originally by: CCP Mitnal I went to the forums for special powers and all I got was a dancing padlock and a banhammer.
P'xel The Bastards	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:34:00 - [232] Because otherwise you'd have to shout really really loud for everyone to hear you... :/
Chaos Winds	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:41:00 - [233] Edited by: Chaos Winds on 06/01/2009 23:42:39 Markizah, That is awesome that you've had such good luck in your own singular experience, but I myself have not and I know a whole bunch of other female gamers who haven't, either, in various MMORPGs and not just in Eve. Making blanket statements about people, either that most everyone is fine despite what you have seen expressed on forums or what have you (without even knowing the people involved), or that most everyone who disagrees with your view is exaggerating, is sort of ridiculous. Whatever. I wish CCP would go forward with its voice modulation as has been mentioned in the past; it might help not only those who get harassed but also those who are uncomfortable having to share a more personal aspect of themselves with total strangers.
FatBloke	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:47:00 - [234] Originally by: Sakura Nihil Spyyyyyyyy. This.
Sidrat Flush Caldari Life is Experience Rally Against Evil	Posted - 2009.01.07 05:32:00 - [235] Edited by: Sidrat Flush on 07/01/2009 05:34:23 silly double post -------------------------- Life is about memories the more the better.
Sidrat Flush Caldari Life is Experience Rally Against Evil	Posted - 2009.01.07 05:34:00 - [236] Originally by: Jmanis Catharg Edited by: Jmanis Catharg on 06/01/2009 23:15:22 Quote: This is the stupidest thread I've ever read. We need mics because we need to co-ordinate quickly and communicate effectively. That's it. If you can't do it, then you're not suited to a gang that needs to move more quickly than one jump every ten minutes. Truth is a great deal of people, particularly teenagers who play the game (due to lack of experience, not just raining hate on teenagers) are not: - Amateur Radio users - Radio communication-savvy whatsoever. I emphasise radio communications because it's essentially what things like TS and Vent are. If you want to talk effectively you need to engage in a fair amount of radio discipline. Enter the realm of the more controlling people who basically tell everyone 'non-essential' to shut up,, where I pull the "It's a game ffs" card. But even in this case, it's not essential to have amic, since you've been told to shut up and listen anyway. Truth is with chat you have a scrolling-back history. With voice comms you don't have any history. If you got told something at the start, unless you wrote everything down you'll have your short-term-memory disabled people asking 'what?' again. Don't get me wrong though, are voice comms useful? Yes. Are they essential and necessarily better in all aspects than text chat? No way. Then there's the typing and linking that good fc's or even squad leaders should be doing anyway, as they're after all in charge of their nine/ten squad members. Yes it's good to have a text history, but then we've got the broadcast system and that works for everyone in the system on a need to know basis - if you're not in the system you don't see it right? As for some female players not wanting to go on to mic because they're female and might get harassed, well with a manly voice like mine, I know how you feel but in the reverse way. I'm always getting told to get on voice chat. It does make conversation easier, however if you want to do multiple things at once then it's a lot easier in text mode. Saying that though, the people with no mics, but insist on listening in, must be made aware to inform the fleet or gang that he or she is afk and will tell us (in writing of course) when they're back at the keyboard, otherwise bad things may happen. -------------------------- Life is about memories the more the better.
Miniturret Amarr Galactic Junkyard and Reclaimation	Posted - 2009.01.07 14:21:00 - [237] Having not read the entire thread I will simply state my thoughts on use of TS/Vent and the requirement of corpmates to use it. Having been in two different corps that required vent usage both were accommodating to my situation. I live in the middle of no where and thus still play on shudder dailup. Yes it is possible. I logged in once with a mic and have a good laugh everyone accepted the fact that my talking was limited to typing. Even listing was at times hard to hear. It sounded like a bad Cell Phone Reception commercial. "Hey..... can.....he....me?" (ME) "Huh?" "C..... o..... hear.... e?" needless to say it was the same on the other end when i tried to talk back with the corp. Both of them were decent and after a while of flying together voice commands really aren't needed. Not to mention as a few others have stated as well a lot of times there are numerous people talking all at once and trying to pick out one specific person would be like walking into the middle of a high school cafeteria and trying to listen to one person's convo. NOT GONNA HAPPEN. Best I can say is weight the pro's and con's yes it does help with fleet ops and makes it easier but there are also disciplines that to be learned while on those fleet ops about mic usage.
Squably Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2009.01.07 14:29:00 - [238] Mic is required for drunken karaoke! Signature removed. Please do not imply profanity in your signature. Navigator
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.01.07 14:46:00 - [239] Does anyone else ever post in a thread, forget about it completely and come back to find it is still alive 200 posts later and find yourself thinking "what the ****?!" Also, it's always the threads you least suspect that grow to be mammoths.

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.