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xxxak
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Posted - 2009.01.21 21:49:00 -
[1]
It has been a while since we have visited the Ishkur for PvP, esp since various speed/nano/MWD changes.
Anyone want to give it a shot? I will edit this post with the best info. |
AZN Steve
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Posted - 2009.01.21 22:09:00 -
[2]
3 light Ion blasters II - CN antimatter Small 'knave' nos
AB II Warp Scram II Small cap booster II
Energised reactive membrane II DC II SAR II
5 hobgoblins II 5 warriors II
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Sarkiss
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.01.21 23:05:00 -
[3]
[Ishkur, PvP] Amarr Navy Small Armor Repairer Energized Reactive Membrane II Damage Control II
1MN Afterburner II Domination Warp Scrambler Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 50
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Small 'Knave' I Energy Drain
Hybrid Burst Aerator I Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Hobgoblin II x5 Warrior II x5
Fit is a beast. Kills anything Cruiser or below with ease. Can take on certain BC's and even beat on BS's. No reason not to rig this ship imo, and the faction fittings are just to make it that extra bit special, especially the scrambler, which gets a 13.2KM range to shutdown MWD's. Takes a 3% implant, or 1% with perfect fitting skills.
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Prometheus Exenthal
Genos Occidere
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Posted - 2009.01.21 23:23:00 -
[4]
Sarkiss has the right idea, but I would use a micro booster over a small, and an active explosive hardener. The reason for the active explosive is that you only need those resists for drones really, so overheating really comes into play. - LATEST VIDEO |
Sarkiss
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.01.21 23:26:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal Sarkiss has the right idea, but I would use a micro booster over a small, and an active explosive hardener. The reason for the active explosive is that you only need those resists for drones really, so overheating really comes into play.
Gawd ofcourse, too used to fitting plates to frigs, well there's an improvement to my fit, but why the micro booster? You can still fit a small one fine..
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Fifi LeFume
No Trademark Notoriety Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.21 23:38:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sarkiss
Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal Sarkiss has the right idea, but I would use a micro booster over a small, and an active explosive hardener. The reason for the active explosive is that you only need those resists for drones really, so overheating really comes into play.
Gawd ofcourse, too used to fitting plates to frigs, well there's an improvement to my fit, but why the micro booster? You can still fit a small one fine..
You can upgrade to neutrons, offline the nos to act as a heatsink and get more dps. You've got a booster and frig cap regens pretty fast so i dont think you need the nos |
AZN Steve
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Posted - 2009.01.21 23:55:00 -
[7]
nos helps scrambler stay on when neuted tho
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eXtas
Atomic Battle Penguins
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Posted - 2009.01.22 00:13:00 -
[8]
best setup I seen:
[Ishkur, dual tank] 400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Fleeting Progressive Warp Scrambler I Pithi B-Type Small Shield Booster
Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S 'Upir' Small Nosferatu I
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Hobgoblin II x5
230 dps overloaded 130 dps tank 12500 ehp before implants :)))
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Dr Sheepbringer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.22 08:00:00 -
[9]
Originally by: eXtas best setup I seen:
[Ishkur, dual tank] 400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Fleeting Progressive Warp Scrambler I Pithi B-Type Small Shield Booster
Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S 'Upir' Small Nosferatu I
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Hobgoblin II x5
230 dps overloaded 130 dps tank 12500 ehp before implants :)))
I usually laugh at mixing shield into armor tubs, but this...this looks...interesting :) A lot of ehp and still wields a tank that's a good size. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.22 08:41:00 -
[10]
Originally by: AZN Steve 3 light Ion blasters II - CN antimatter Small 'knave' nos
AB II Warp Scram II Small cap booster II
Energised reactive membrane II DC II SAR II
5 hobgoblins II 5 warriors II
Switch cap booster for a web (you want it against other AB AFs), and i personally prefer to switch reactive membrane for explosive hardener, because one of the largest problems are warrior drones. |
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Xol'tan
Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2009.01.22 11:33:00 -
[11]
Nutters stick faction on a AF and if you have ever been kited outside blaster range and saw all your drones die you will wish you had rails.
[Ishkur, New Setup 1] Armor Explosive Hardener II Damage Control II Small Armor Repairer II
Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Warp Scrambler II Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 100
125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S 125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S 125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S [empty high slot]
[empty rig slot] [empty rig slot]
Warrior II x5 Acolyte EV-300 x5
Thats right 5 Neut drones. |
Deviant Pixelus
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Posted - 2009.01.22 18:44:00 -
[12]
does one even stay within neutron range when ab is on....
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UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.22 21:51:00 -
[13]
i dont mean to rain on anyone's parade, but all of these close range fits are complete fail in pvp. any half-intelligent player in a T1 cruiser will out-dps you, and destroy you (should you choose to face him).
dont get me wrong, the blaster fits make the ishkur a godly 0.0 ratter (for a frigate). but you've no business in the pvp DPS role. if you choose not to stick mwd, warp disruptor and webifier in your mid slots, then you aint got a tackling role either.
so, if youre not staying at 20+km and tackling, i say you just get a fully T2 fitted vexor for HALF the price, and dps better. Or, go with the blaster setup, but choose your battles very very carefully. |
UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.22 21:59:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sarkiss [Ishkur, PvP] Amarr Navy Small Armor Repairer Energized Reactive Membrane II Damage Control II
1MN Afterburner II Domination Warp Scrambler Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 50
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Small 'Knave' I Energy Drain
Hybrid Burst Aerator I Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Hobgoblin II x5 Warrior II x5
Fit is a beast. Kills anything Cruiser or below with ease. Can take on certain BC's and even beat on BS's. No reason not to rig this ship imo, and the faction fittings are just to make it that extra bit special, especially the scrambler, which gets a 13.2KM range to shutdown MWD's. Takes a 3% implant, or 1% with perfect fitting skills.
your philosophy to fitting an Ishkur for pvp = tasty treat for any pvp'er with half a brain. mmmmmm. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.22 22:43:00 -
[15]
You realise once you got a scram on most cruisers they are pretty much dead? Drone cruisers, cruisers with 5xmed ECM (thorax) and if they fit a med neut and are lucky enough can survive. ---------------------------------------------
Originally by: Neth'Rae Military experts are calling this a troll.
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eXtas
Atomic Battle Penguins
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Posted - 2009.01.22 22:59:00 -
[16]
well yeah the setup I posted needs to start fighting at 0km or there is no point :P and its not for fighting cruisers really or gang work... its for lowsec plexes/fw plexes or canflaging... might change the guns to ac's for easyer fitting or just use named blasters :P and some ecm drones if you get takled outside webb range :) but I run into it and it was the hardest ishkur I ever seen :) |
UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.22 23:06:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Furb Killer You realise once you got a scram on most cruisers they are pretty much dead? Drone cruisers, cruisers with 5xmed ECM (thorax) and if they fit a med neut and are lucky enough can survive.
im not sure what you mean. you will be webbed and neuted so u cant run, then melted by whatever weapons the cruiser has. this usually includes 5 warrior II's and 4-5 small/medium guns. if youre implying that the ishkur will take down the cruiser first, then i gotta tell you i just dont see it happening. cruisers do more dps and have more HP. |
AZN Steve
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Posted - 2009.01.22 23:31:00 -
[18]
Originally by: UMEE
im not sure what you mean. you will be webbed and neuted so u cant run, then melted by whatever weapons the cruiser has. this usually includes 5 warrior II's and 4-5 small/medium guns. if youre implying that the ishkur will take down the cruiser first, then i gotta tell you i just dont see it happening. cruisers do more dps and have more HP.
cruisers cant hit you , even when webbed enemy drones die fast from blasters & drones neuts are a problem , but can be mitigated by small nos & cap booster
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Prometheus Exenthal
Genos Occidere
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Posted - 2009.01.23 02:05:00 -
[19]
I love people like UMEE More kills for me! |
Ka Jolo
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.01.23 05:26:00 -
[20]
Originally by: AZN Steve cruisers cant hit you , even when webbed enemy drones die fast from blasters & drones
Since QR and the proliferation of AF's, I have taken to using what I consider an anti-AF Thorax quite a bit: small neutron blasters, web, and 10x Warrior II's. So far I've killed every AF I've engaged with it. I've done something similar with Vexors.
Not that I'm agreeing with UMEE, of course. Yesterday in my blasters-n-scram Ishkur I tackled a smart-bombing Drake and held it for a good 15 minutes hoping some corp DPS would login. When I saw a spike of unfamiliar names in local, I ended up just letting him go. He never had me worried.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.23 08:20:00 -
[21]
Lets be fair, that was allready the case before QR. And that drake also wasnt worried about you.
But yeah since QR AFs can actually keep transversal up enough to get under cruiser sized guns. |
Dr Sheepbringer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.23 08:52:00 -
[22]
Cruiser with a neut + scram + web isn't a autowin when it comes to ishkur or any other AF.
NOS (saves you from the neut, depending on the skills you might actually one need that) AB (you can laugh at scrams, and a single web doesn't cut it when you have good skills)
But if you go without a NOS and with MWD into scram range...you are screwed (IF he has neut + scram + web). Actually he only needs the Scram and web to kill you.
Stop whining. |
UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:03:00 -
[23]
Originally by: AZN Steve
Originally by: UMEE
im not sure what you mean. you will be webbed and neuted so u cant run, then melted by whatever weapons the cruiser has. this usually includes 5 warrior II's and 4-5 small/medium guns. if youre implying that the ishkur will take down the cruiser first, then i gotta tell you i just dont see it happening. cruisers do more dps and have more HP.
cruisers cant hit you , even when webbed enemy drones die fast from blasters & drones neuts are a problem , but can be mitigated by small nos & cap booster
cruisers can hit you just fine. for example, i tend to fit small guns and a very heavy tank on my vexor.
enemy drones dying fast...hm. i tend to load up ~10 warrior II's in my vex. by the time u kill em all, you'll be dead, and you wont do any dps on me. also, i can just keep recalling them while u waste your time re-locking.
neuts ARE a problem. if you fit a nos, you gimp your already questionable dps. if you fit a cap booster, you wont have a tackle. so either way, you dont have a role.
if you're not worrying about isk, and like flying the ishkur for style points, do it by all means. all im saying is T1 cruisers do the dps thing much better. for 1/3 the price. |
UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:05:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal I love people like UMEE More kills for me!
somehow i seriously doubt you've done any pvp. anyone with any experience will agree that properly fitted T1 cruiser > AF, in the dps/ECM role at least. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:06:00 -
[25]
Vexor especially, and arbie next, are just the cruisers you shouldnt be attacking in an ishkur if you got active brain cells.
But medium weapons will NOT be able to hit you when you got a scram on him. And most cruisers use medium sized weapons.
Also 95% of the good ishkur fits either have a nos (you need it anyway for your repper, and it only means you use 3x ions instead of 3x neutrons), or a cap booster. |
UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:07:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Ka Jolo
Originally by: AZN Steve cruisers cant hit you , even when webbed enemy drones die fast from blasters & drones
Since QR and the proliferation of AF's, I have taken to using what I consider an anti-AF Thorax quite a bit: small neutron blasters, web, and 10x Warrior II's. So far I've killed every AF I've engaged with it. I've done something similar with Vexors.
Not that I'm agreeing with UMEE, of course. Yesterday in my blasters-n-scram Ishkur I tackled a smart-bombing Drake and held it for a good 15 minutes hoping some corp DPS would login. When I saw a spike of unfamiliar names in local, I ended up just letting him go. He never had me worried.
well thats exactly what im talking about, in regards to your rax fit. and grats on your drake kill. oh wait...
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UMEE
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:09:00 -
[27]
Edited by: UMEE on 23/01/2009 22:13:21 Edited by: UMEE on 23/01/2009 22:10:07
Originally by: Furb Killer Edited by: Furb Killer on 23/01/2009 22:07:10 Vexor especially, and arbie next, are just the cruisers you shouldnt be attacking in an ishkur if you got active brain cells.
But medium weapons will NOT be able to hit you when you got a scram on him. And most cruisers use medium sized weapons.
Also 95% of the good ishkur fits either have a nos (you need it anyway for your repper, and it only means you use 3x ions instead of 3x neutrons), or a cap booster.
Edit: WUT? You compare an assault frig to a cruiser on ECM? That doesnt make sense?
You still live in nano era, before web nerf, scram changes, AF becoming lighter, medium drones nerfed, etc. All direct boosts to AFs vs cruisers.
by ECM, i meant crowd control things like tracking disruptors, damps, and the like. this is due to cruisers having more midslots. from my experience (i dont know who you fly with), most cruiser pilots fit a heavy tank and small guns.
i dont live in the nano era. i live in an era where T1 cruisers > AF's. AF's shine in a hybrid role, i.e. tackle and dps, but most of these builds im seeing are strictly for dps.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:24:00 -
[28]
Basicly only vexor and arbie do that. Other cruisers barely ever do that. Why? Such a small neutron rax is nice vs an AF. But every other cruiser will easily kill him. ---------------------------------------------
Originally by: Neth'Rae Military experts are calling this a troll.
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AZN Steve
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Posted - 2009.01.23 22:57:00 -
[29]
Originally by: UMEE Edited by: UMEE on 23/01/2009 22:13:21 Edited by: UMEE on 23/01/2009 22:10:07 by ECM, i meant crowd control things like tracking disruptors, damps, and the like. this is due to cruisers having more midslots. from my experience (i dont know who you fly with), most cruiser pilots fit a heavy tank and small guns.
i dont live in the nano era. i live in an era where T1 cruisers > AF's. AF's shine in a hybrid role, i.e. tackle and dps, but most of these builds im seeing are strictly for dps.
nobody ever said it was a solopwn mobile and most people DONT fit undersized guns and oversized plates on their cruisers and fyi Ishkur has same amount of mids as a thorax , vexor , rupture and any other T1 cruiser that's not designed for ew or shield tanking . most of these builds are for dps since it's a dps ship , if you want tackle get an interceptor
you should stop posting as you clearly have no clue what you're talking about
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Psiri
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Posted - 2009.01.23 23:12:00 -
[30]
Here's the cake for those who are willing to eat it,
You build your Ishkur around your propulsion mod, MWD or AB. AB comes with a scrambler and close range armaments like blasters, MWD comes with a disruptor and longe range weaponary like railguns.
If you think you often land within or close to scrambler range of your target, then obviously AB is the better choice for you. The same can be said if you like hunting people in deadspace areas.
If you find yourself using the 'warp to 10' function instead and aren't very worried of people coming within 10 of you, then clearly MWD is the best option.
If you want the benefits of the AB fit but don't wanna get tackled outside of your scrambler range, fit a stab or fly something with a neut or ECM drones - period. |
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