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Peter Raptor
Plutonian Army
57
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
This 24 hr waiting period is utterly pointless. Why are you torturing your innocent players with 24 hr delays between jumps
Please implement in ESCALATION . Thank you and have a nice day!!!! |
Deuse Apol
Kicking Smurfs The Skeleton Crew
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
/Agree! |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
477
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
Your gross assumption that ALL players want something is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. |
Lexmana
Imperial Stout
367
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
No we don't. |
Kindred Wolf
Future's Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
/signed |
Peter Raptor
Plutonian Army
57
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station.
Surely you cant be serious
|
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
155
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
How dare you speak for me ? No I don't want 12 hour JC's, and I would apreciate the end of misguided threads of altruist people thinking they're speaking in my behalf.... |
Serene Repose
Perkone Caldari State
621
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Don't change my clone! You'll have to pry my clone from my cold, dead han....ah...hmmm. I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility toward every form of tyranny over the mind of man.-á |
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
127
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
24H - Other Region 12H - Same Region 6H - Same constellation 2H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around. |
Peter Raptor
Plutonian Army
57
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump?? |
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Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
480
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious
Iam dead serious. The problem with JCs and especially with 0.0 is it makes things too easy to control large areas of space. It also allows groups go on a offensive on the other side of the universe then be able to instantly jump back to their home and defend. This hinders the idea of a counter invasion. It also makes it so there's no possible way to bleed the enemy dry when it comes to a defending, since the attacker can just JC home and rat and go back. There are more examples but I'm feeling lazy and I'm pretty sure you get the idea. |
Nirnias Stirrum
Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.
80
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 09:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
I actually found the perfect solution to this rather than having a certain clone that has particular implants in it like my +5 set of attribute implants and those power ones and CPU one for my pew pew being in only one clone, i decided to put them on all my clones.
And then you ask but my clones are spread out and i dont want to wait 24 hours to jump to another destiation.. I have the perfect solution to this also, what i did was this:
I opened my ship hanger, right clicked a ship and clicked "Make Active" this then put me into that ship so i was using it, i then clicked the undock button and flew manually to my destination avoiding those nasty blinky red things that for some reason appeared randomly throughout my journey.
**** me some people are lazy bloody gits! |
Peter Raptor
Plutonian Army
57
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious Iam dead serious. The problem with JCs and especially with 0.0 is it makes things too easy to control large areas of space. It also allows groups go on a offensive on the other side of the universe then be able to instantly jump back to their home and defend. This hinders the idea of a counter invasion. It also makes it so there's no possible way to bleed the enemy dry when it comes to a defending, since the attacker can just JC home and rat and go back. There are more examples but I'm feeling lazy and I'm pretty sure you get the idea.
I see so when I said reduce to 12 hrs, you interpret that as reduce to 0 hrs?? Amazing
|
Vyktor Abyss
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
116
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:02:00 -
[14] - Quote
I used to like jumpclones but now I'm not a fan.
People with ISK (including myself) basically switch out between fancy implant sets and locations with zero effort.
Implant sets pre-jump clones were a difficult choice, but now you can almost assume every BS you fight has some slave/crystal set and Legion/Loki/Tengu boosts.
People never actually have to travel in Null anymore and it all has become way too ghey.
Convenience - yes ; better game - no. So more jumpclone functionality? **** no. |
YuuKnow
204
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:05:00 -
[15] - Quote
Nope. Nothing in the game says that insta-traveling is a necessity of gameplay. Also, if its a point of loosing implants, then your just going to have to pvp with your implants, don't buy them, or wait the extra day of training without them. |
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
127
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:06:00 -
[16] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump??
I want to call troll, but I think some people are actually this stupid
Why do you want to have to pay for ships?
Why do you want to have to train skills?
Why do you want to wait for manufacturing jobs?
It brings balance to the game. Just to clarify I have 5 JCs of which 3 are pirate, so I'm hardly calling 'I cant use this so it must need nerfing'. |
Francisco Bizzaro
27
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:07:00 -
[17] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious Why not. Decisions have consequences, and all that. Jumpclones are a pretty powerful mechanic for avoiding decisions about where on the map you want to operate, or which implants to stick in your head.
In another thread, someone suggested a 22 hour time limit rather than 24. This would be an improvement (or N-days minus an hour or two if you think the jump clone mechanic is OP), as it would allow players to do their jumps within their usual game sessions, without gradually creeping out of their time-zone. And for people who play a couple of hours a day, this would be effectively equivalent to the 12-hour suggestion. |
Zarere
Team Pizza Viro Mors Non Est
18
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
24 hour cooldowns are fine.
OP please stop talking out your ass and assuming that everyone in eve agrees with you, kthnx. |
Holo Bagza
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:13:00 -
[19] - Quote
I don't care. I do care, however, about someone trying to talk in my name without being asked. |
Mark Androcius
34
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
I would say 6 hours even. Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
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Peter Raptor
Plutonian Army
58
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:21:00 -
[21] - Quote
Reducing to 12 hrs would not alter the balance of the game at all, after all picking 24 hr cooldown in the first place, was just a case of picking an arbitrary number of hours outta thin air, theres no REAL logic to it . |
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:24:00 -
[22] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Reducing to 12 hrs would not alter the balance of the game at all, after all picking 24 hr cooldown in the first place, was just a case of picking an arbitrary number of hours outta thin air, theres no REAL logic to it .
hurr durr |
Joran Dravius
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:27:00 -
[23] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. I am one of them. Remove jumpclones and jump bridges in escalation is what I want them to do.
Edit: And jump freighters. Basically anything with 'jump' in the name. |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
484
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Reducing to 12 hrs would not alter the balance of the game at all, after all picking 24 hr cooldown in the first place, was just a case of picking an arbitrary number of hours outta thin air, theres no REAL logic to it .
If you don't understand how fast travel can negatively effect a PVP sandbox game, then there's no hope for you.
Though I'm starting to believe you are trolling. |
Xpaulusx
V I R I I Ineluctable.
40
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
I don't see a problem with reducing it to 12 hours although i have no problem with the way it is now. This is a rather peddy & minor issue compared to other things in the game right now. |
Joran Dravius
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump?? Because I don't like the idea of people being able to instantly bypass my gate camp with a 100% chance of success, for one. Same reason I don't like jump freighters. Jump bridges encourage blobbing. |
Linda Shadowborn
Dark Steel Industries
101
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:32:00 -
[27] - Quote
Nope, dont want that at all. For reasons stated above, EVE has become to small with JF, titans, bridges etc so you can now zip around from one end to the other in no time. |
Hroya
35
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 10:37:00 -
[28] - Quote
The use of ALL in the topic pretty much sealed the faith of this proposal.
You go your corridor but. |
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
230
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:03:00 -
[29] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious Iam dead serious. The problem with JCs and especially with 0.0 is it makes things too easy to control large areas of space. It also allows groups go on a offensive on the other side of the universe then be able to instantly jump back to their home and defend. This hinders the idea of a counter invasion. It also makes it so there's no possible way to bleed the enemy dry when it comes to a defending, since the attacker can just JC home and rat and go back. There are more examples but I'm feeling lazy and I'm pretty sure you get the idea.
Very true, not the lazy part |
c4 t
Push Pharmaceuticals Push Interstellar Network
22
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:04:00 -
[30] - Quote
I don't. Don't cave CCP! |
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Ione Hawke
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:05:00 -
[31] - Quote
Dont presume to speak for me please. |
Rek Seven
Probe Patrol Project Wildfire
269
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:07:00 -
[32] - Quote
signed |
Dasola
Rookies Empire Rookie Empire
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:08:00 -
[33] - Quote
To op i disagree with you, i want 48 hours delay between jumpclones. Should make power projection bit more difficult and add some chances for conflight. [Insert something funny or smart here] |
Oxandrolone
Bite Me inc Exhale.
24
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:11:00 -
[34] - Quote
try the features and ideas forum if you dont want to look like and idiot? |
Gonada
Dark Club
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:14:00 -
[35] - Quote
Reminds me of people crying about not being able to insta port across WoW.
24 hrs is fine, having the ability to recall at a whim is ridiculous here ,vast distances are involved.
Instant gratification is not the way to go. |
Ione Hawke
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:15:00 -
[36] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Reducing to 12 hrs would not alter the balance of the game at all, after all picking 24 hr cooldown in the first place, was just a case of picking an arbitrary number of hours outta thin air, theres no REAL logic to it .
Totally agree with you there, the number of hours in a day is pretty arbitrary indeed. I propose we change the number of hours in a day to 12, but please leave the JC delay at 24, thanks. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
6195
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:16:00 -
[37] - Quote
Lexmana wrote:No we don't. I want it to be 23 hours, for instance, so it becomes a once-a-day thing. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Vauss Dutan
Alea Iacta Est Universal Test Alliance Please Ignore
27
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:31:00 -
[38] - Quote
24 hour cooldowns are a design nogo anyhow. It results in creep that causes some people to have to lose an additional day to bring the cooldown back to thier usual playtime.
I skipped an op because i couldnt get out of my implanted clone due to cooldown. Since implants are tied to training time, im not risking it. Too costly. You could say i have more isk in my head than i can afford to lose and thats the problem. I would argue that since implants are tied to training you should always have a body with the best inplants you can possibly buy. It would be nice if training times werent tied to implants.
Implants shouldnt be looked at like ships are. They are not a consumable that you burn through and the prices reflect this.
Its a bad mechanic when someone doesnt have the option to leave a half a billion isk body in the hangar. Instant clone transfers in the same station would fix this.
We should always have te option to jump into **** ships and crappy clones and participate in the game any time. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
727
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:35:00 -
[39] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious
He is serious, and stop calling him Shirley. Here's your sign... |
RaTTuS
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
186
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:35:00 -
[40] - Quote
a pri charisma skill to drop the time by 1hour each level would be the best way IMO
http://eveboard.com/ub/419190933-134.png
|
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Arklan1
Dunedain Rangers WUT ALLIANCE
18
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:38:00 -
[41] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote:24 hour cooldowns are a design nogo anyhow. It results in creep that causes some people to have to lose an additional day to bring the cooldown back to thier usual playtime.
I skipped an op because i couldnt get out of my implanted clone due to cooldown. Since implants are tied to training time, im not risking it. Too costly. You could say i have more isk in my head than i can afford to lose and thats the problem. I would argue that since implants are tied to training you should always have a body with the best inplants you can possibly buy. It would be nice if training times werent tied to implants.
Implants shouldnt be looked at like ships are. They are not a consumable that you burn through and the prices reflect this.
Its a bad mechanic when someone doesnt have the option to leave a half a billion isk body in the hangar. Instant clone transfers in the same station would fix this.
We should always have te option to jump into **** ships and crappy clones and participate in the game any time.
absolutely agree. if it wasn't a risk of my training time, i wouldn't care. and yea, i don't need to jump to another location, just a different clone that's not worth a billion isk in implants. |
malcovas Henderson
Smoking Minerals Syndicate Cannabis Legionis
23
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:39:00 -
[42] - Quote
I played WoW for 6 yrs, before playing this game.
The CD time of the Hearthstone was gradually reduced, until it became once every 15 minutes. It made the world very small indeed. It meant you put very little effort into travelling, and removed a lot of the consequences of going places.
The JC is like the Hearthstone. By reducing the time you are removing consequences of your decisions. I mine, and PvP in two different places. I use my JC's on a regular basis. Reduction in their CD time would allow me to bail out of a bad PvP session or Jump into a fight, much more quickly.
The Idea of once you have JC'd, you have to live with it for one day, I think is very EVE indeedy. Be thankful it's not a week long CD
o7 |
Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
605
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:41:00 -
[43] - Quote
Make it a high level skill. - [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
221
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:42:00 -
[44] - Quote
NO
Jumpclones are one of the main contributing factors to blobbing and enormously decrease the 'size' of EVE.
WHICH IS BAD!!! And decreasing the cool-down time would make it even worse. It also allows players to put their heads full with billions worth of implants without forcing players to make choices, nor making it a big risk: ALSO BAD!!!
CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Ira Infernus
Praetorium Illegitimus The.Alliance
14
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:44:00 -
[45] - Quote
I agree with this 12 hour proposal. Hell, I would go as long as 18 hours.
Some people have work/school that they need to go to, and would like to be able to jump back from their slave/snake etc clone to their +5 clone while they are there.
Might encourage more pvp as I remember one of the biggest issue with getting people to do things is getting them beyond that jump clone issue. |
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
845
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:44:00 -
[46] - Quote
RaTTuS wrote:a pri charisma skill to drop the time by 1hour each level would be the best way IMO
Only if it's rank 20 . Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Francisco Bizzaro
27
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:52:00 -
[47] - Quote
RaTTuS wrote:a pri charisma skill to drop the time by 1hour each level would be the best way IMO
But what happens when CHA is removed as an attribute? That's probably the next "improvement" that will be suggested by the people trying to remove all inconvenience from the game. |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
222
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 11:52:00 -
[48] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote:24 hour cooldowns are a design nogo anyhow. It results in creep that causes some people to have to lose an additional day to bring the cooldown back to thier usual playtime.
I skipped an op because i couldnt get out of my implanted clone due to cooldown. Since implants are tied to training time, im not risking it. Too costly. You could say i have more isk in my head than i can afford to lose and thats the problem. I would argue that since implants are tied to training you should always have a body with the best inplants you can possibly buy. It would be nice if training times werent tied to implants.
Implants shouldnt be looked at like ships are. They are not a consumable that you burn through and the prices reflect this.
Its a bad mechanic when someone doesnt have the option to leave a half a billion isk body in the hangar. Instant clone transfers in the same station would fix this.
We should always have te option to jump into **** ships and crappy clones and participate in the game any time.
Ohnoes!!! The game forces you to make choices?! What idiot ever came up with that stupid concept of Risk vs Reward?!
As for not being able to join the op, that's what you get for hanging around at a different part of the galaxy far away from your buddies. Should make sense, I think. CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Francisco Bizzaro
29
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:00:00 -
[49] - Quote
Arklan1 wrote:Vauss Dutan wrote:24 hour cooldowns are a design nogo anyhow. It results in creep that causes some people to have to lose an additional day to bring the cooldown back to thier usual playtime.
I skipped an op because i couldnt get out of my implanted clone due to cooldown. Since implants are tied to training time, im not risking it. Too costly. You could say i have more isk in my head than i can afford to lose and thats the problem. I would argue that since implants are tied to training you should always have a body with the best inplants you can possibly buy. It would be nice if training times werent tied to implants.
Implants shouldnt be looked at like ships are. They are not a consumable that you burn through and the prices reflect this.
Its a bad mechanic when someone doesnt have the option to leave a half a billion isk body in the hangar. Instant clone transfers in the same station would fix this.
We should always have te option to jump into **** ships and crappy clones and participate in the game any time. absolutely agree. if it wasn't a risk of my training time, i wouldn't care. and yea, i don't need to jump to another location, just a different clone that's not worth a billion isk in implants. Sounds like you should just forget about the billion isk implants. Without them, you will train a couple of percent slower, but gain 100% flexibility to do the things you want. No need to change the rules to accommodate people who refuse to make compromises. |
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
100
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:05:00 -
[50] - Quote
They should nerf the JC timer to 47 hours. |
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Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
495
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:06:00 -
[51] - Quote
The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem. |
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
231
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:06:00 -
[52] - Quote
Francisco Bizzaro wrote: Sounds like you should just forget about the billion isk implants. Without them, you will train a couple of percent slower, but gain 100% flexibility to do the things you want. No need to change the rules to accommodate people who refuse to make compromises.
Agree totally, I'm in high-sec with 4x +3s and a +1 plugged in it's not optimal training but do I care, not one bit. |
Estrogenia
Arctic Productions
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:07:00 -
[53] - Quote
I am going to reply to your "CCP We ALL want 12 hr Jump Clone delays not 24 hr" statement with an equally intelligent statement:
"We all think you are a moron!"
Thank you. Have a nice day. |
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
461
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:15:00 -
[54] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem.
+1
100% Agree with the above.
The universe is an ancient desert, a vast wasteland with only occasional habitable planets as oases. We Fremen, comfortable with deserts, shall now venture into another. - STILGAR, From the Sietch to the Stars. |
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
181
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:36:00 -
[55] - Quote
If you don't think jump clones should be removed, you are playing what used to be the wrong game. [img]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sig.php?r=*rnd*[/img] Desusigs can be seen on the terribad new forums using bbcode enabling script (scroll down to my post for sig rotation) |
Jame Jarl Retief
Corps Diplomatique Terrestrienne
32
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:42:00 -
[56] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump??
It's sort of like death penalty. For some of us, losing is humbling enough by itself, and winning is a reward in itself. No artificial rewards or penalties needed. But some others won't be happy until a mechanized spiked steel-toe boot comes out of their PC and kicks them in the groin when they lose. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
545
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:43:00 -
[57] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious
STOP calling him Shirley. There isn't anything left for you to do to Carebears. -áGo, kill them some more. They're like fungus or bacteria, they won't die and they won't stop. All you have to show for years of organized harassment campaigns against them is ... nothing. |
Black Panpher
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:47:00 -
[58] - Quote
I disagree, each jump clone should have its own individual 24 hour timer. |
DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
1102
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:48:00 -
[59] - Quote
I imagine more people would be willing to PVP if they could clone-jump with no time penalty, as long as their clone is in the same station. |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1132
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:49:00 -
[60] - Quote
+1 for 12h or less delay, far too much stuff is tedious for no reason.
|
|
Just Alter
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 12:57:00 -
[61] - Quote
Remove jump clones entirely.
Also remove the ability to change the medical clone station remotely.
The only way to move somewhere should be to FLY there, not use JC or change station and suicide your pod. |
Grey Stormshadow
draketrain Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1084
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:04:00 -
[62] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
Yes this is something I've been suggesting before also and what I fully support. Being able to switch clones in same station will not only make it more fun to play, but also increase the amount of PVP in game when ppl are able to get rid of their precious training clones just for 1-2 hour roam with random friends instead of staying out of trouble.
I would also slightly adjust one timer to prevent constant jumping;
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 3H - Same Station
Get |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
546
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:09:00 -
[63] - Quote
Less than 24 hours should be in-station or intRA-regional only.
Too much room for EXPLOITATION here.
goons (I can't capitalize it any longer) just wanna hop across the galaxy in 15 minutes if they could. RISK FREE of course.
That is ALL this is about anyway. There isn't anything left for you to do to Carebears. -áGo, kill them some more. They're like fungus or bacteria, they won't die and they won't stop. All you have to show for years of organized harassment campaigns against them is ... nothing. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
578
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:21:00 -
[64] - Quote
Remove jump clone timer all together.
Instead, when you jump its considered the equivilent of podding and you lose skill points as if it wasn't updated. You can do this as often as you like, there will reach a limit to how often the player behind the avatar willing to risk instant travel for such a high cost and then the other guy might win. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:23:00 -
[65] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem.
What are you talking about? You can do that anyway regardless of JC timers via pod express. Provided you have enough ISK to pay for the replacement clone cover else should you be podded there is consequence.
If you don't like JC thats fair enough and I would probably argue the position is valid. However typing out the garbage you have over the last few posts to justify your position and why you don't like them is contemptible even by your own extremely poor standards.
|
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
692
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:25:00 -
[66] - Quote
In response to title: I don't. I want 13 hours. You're wrong. |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
225
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:25:00 -
[67] - Quote
Grey Stormshadow wrote:IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around. Yes this is something I've been suggesting before also and what I fully support. Being able to switch clones in same station will not only make it more fun to play, but also increase the amount of PVP in game when ppl are able to get rid of their precious training clones just for 1-2 hour roam with random friends instead of staying out of trouble. I would also slightly adjust one timer to prevent constant jumping; 48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 3H - Same Stationm
I disagree. It also takes a lot away from the consequences of your choice of implants. I can already go all slaves, hardwired for energy guns, and easily change to a full crystal set with all missile implants. Like someone mentioned before: you can basically count on most of the richer players always flying around with optimized sets because it (already!) is so easy to swap clones.
If people aren't PvP-ing because they have too expensive implants in their head they can't afford to lose, the game absolutely should not be changed to accommodate their spineless consequence-averse, min-maxing behavior. CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
546
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:29:00 -
[68] - Quote
Nu Tra wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem. What are you talking about? You can do that anyway regardless of JC timers via pod express. Provided you have enough ISK to pay for the replacement clone cover else should you be podded there is consequence. If you don't like JC thatGÇÖs fair enough and I would probably argue the position is valid. However typing out the garbage you have over the last few posts to justify your position and why you don't like them is contemptible even by your own extremely poor standards.
I'm pretty sure Brook's position has to do with moving around the galaxy RISK FREE.
Those two KEY words are often ignored, as they are wrapped up inside the very idea of Clone Jumping itself, by it's very nature. There isn't anything left for you to do to Carebears. -áGo, kill them some more. They're like fungus or bacteria, they won't die and they won't stop. All you have to show for years of organized harassment campaigns against them is ... nothing. |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:34:00 -
[69] - Quote
Nu Tra wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem. What are you talking about? You can do that anyway regardless of JC timers via pod express. Provided you have enough ISK to pay for the replacement clone cover else should you be podded there is consequence. If you don't like JC thatGÇÖs fair enough and I would probably argue the position is valid. However typing out the garbage you have over the last few posts to justify your position and why you don't like them is contemptible even by your own extremely poor standards.
Death cloning is another issue, however this thread is about Jump cloning. |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
690
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:46:00 -
[70] - Quote
I'd be happy with 20.
Effectively the same amount of time ("a day"), but prevents "timer creep" -- when you are jumping fairly regularly, but jump ~5-10 minutes later each time cause of the timer. |
|
Joe Skellington
13th Tribe of Kobol Expeditionary
55
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:57:00 -
[71] - Quote
Alexandra Alt wrote:How dare you speak for me ? No I don't want 12 hour JC's, and I would apreciate the end of misguided threads of altruist people thinking they're speaking in my behalf....
No ****, who the **** gave this OP permission to speak for me as well. -á-á |\__/|-á -á/ @ @ \ -á-á -á( > -¦ < )-á -á`-+-+x-½-½-¦ -á-á / O \ |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
547
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:59:00 -
[72] - Quote
Aqriue wrote:Remove jump clone timer all together.
Instead, when you jump its considered the equivilent of podding and you lose skill points as if it wasn't updated. You can do this as often as you like, there will reach a limit to how often the player behind the avatar willing to risk instant travel for such a high cost and then the other guy might win.
Skill Consequences for THIS and not High Sec Suicide GANKING ? Bad idea. There isn't anything left for you to do to Carebears. -áGo, kill them some more. They're like fungus or bacteria, they won't die and they won't stop. All you have to show for years of organized harassment campaigns against them is ... nothing. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 13:59:00 -
[73] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Nu Tra wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem. What are you talking about? You can do that anyway regardless of JC timers via pod express. Provided you have enough ISK to pay for the replacement clone cover else should you be podded there is consequence. If you don't like JC thatGÇÖs fair enough and I would probably argue the position is valid. However typing out the garbage you have over the last few posts to justify your position and why you don't like them is contemptible even by your own extremely poor standards. I'm pretty sure Brook's position has to do with moving around the galaxy RISK FREE. Those two KEY words are often ignored, as they are wrapped up inside the very idea of Clone Jumping itself, by it's very nature.
Thanks for clarifying the previous posters concerns for me.
Neither activity is risk free. It says so on the tin when you install the JC. The fortress systems seen in 0.0 are an irrelevance after the fact. According to the many Bears here in this forum in numerous threads supporting the posit, anything that incurs a 100% certainty of loss is not a considered a risk (pod express). In addition when installing a clone in a null sec station, the pop up advising of uncertainty, is either a risk or it isn't! We cant just cherry pick when it suits us to call ANY loss or potential loss a risk or not. Yeah thanks your clarity really helped him. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:04:00 -
[74] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Nu Tra wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:The argument of overspending on implants is a poor justification. Like anything in Eve you shouldn't fly around with things you can't afford to lose, same applies to implants. However the issue of switching clones isn't the issue I personally have, its the instantly moving around the galaxy thats the problem. What are you talking about? You can do that anyway regardless of JC timers via pod express. Provided you have enough ISK to pay for the replacement clone cover else should you be podded there is consequence. If you don't like JC thatGÇÖs fair enough and I would probably argue the position is valid. However typing out the garbage you have over the last few posts to justify your position and why you don't like them is contemptible even by your own extremely poor standards. Death cloning is another issue, however this thread is about Jump cloning.
The fact still remains. It is possible to traverse regions at the click of a button. Therefore the concerns you listed can be circumvented without need of a JC. It is only natural to then conclude that the issues raised in your list are not relevant issues at all. |
THE L0CK
Denying You Access
240
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:04:00 -
[75] - Quote
As you brought it upon yourself to automatically include me without my given consent, I must automatically switch my vote to no and add your 12 hours to the current 24 as to request a 36 hour jumpclone just to spite you. Do you smell what the Lock's cooking? |
Real Poison
Aura of Darkness Nulli Secunda
95
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:10:00 -
[76] - Quote
i'd settle for a new skill that subtracts 1 hour of wait time per level. or just go with infomorph psychology so i don't have to train anything new. kthxbai |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:11:00 -
[77] - Quote
Nu Tra wrote:
The fact still remains. It is possible to traverse regions at the click of a button. Therefore the concerns you listed can be circumvented without need of a JC. It is only natural to then conclude that the issues raised in your list are not relevant issues at all.
This argument is pointless, since I find death cloning to be a issue as well. I never brought it up because this thread is about JC. Anything that allows you to move large distances of space instantly is a bad design, this goes for cynos, JBs, titan bridges, JCing, death cloning.
|
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
547
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:11:00 -
[78] - Quote
Nu Tra wrote:Neither activity is risk free. It says so on the tin when you install the JC. The fortress systems seen in 0.0 are an irrelevance after the fact. According to the many Bears here in this forum in numerous threads supporting the posit, anything that incurs a 100% certainty of loss is not a considered a risk (pod express being one example).
Oh, so you speak NOT from experience, but from crap posted by lying idiots in the Forums.
Great. There isn't anything left for you to do to Carebears. -áGo, kill them some more. They're like fungus or bacteria, they won't die and they won't stop. All you have to show for years of organized harassment campaigns against them is ... nothing. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:28:00 -
[79] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Nu Tra wrote:
The fact still remains. It is possible to traverse regions at the click of a button. Therefore the concerns you listed can be circumvented without need of a JC. It is only natural to then conclude that the issues raised in your list are not relevant issues at all.
This argument is pointless, since I find death cloning to be a issue as well. I never brought it up because this thread is about JC. Anything that allows you to move large distances of space instantly is a bad design, this goes for cynos, JBs, titan bridges, JCing, death cloning.
Now... This is a completely different position entirely and has little to do with JC per se'. Don't get me wrong, I understand the position you have taken, you may find I could be in agreement, however with reference to your previous post, this thread is about Jump Clones ONLY. As such the arguments you list against ONLY JC can be circumvented by other means rendering your listed arguments irrelevant. Again I'll reiterate that is not to say you have no argument against quick regional travel just that it is slightly misplaced in this particular thread. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Nu Tra wrote:Neither activity is risk free. It says so on the tin when you install the JC. The fortress systems seen in 0.0 are an irrelevance after the fact. According to the many Bears here in this forum in numerous threads supporting the posit, anything that incurs a 100% certainty of loss is not a considered a risk (pod express being one example). Oh, so you speak NOT from experience, but from crap posted by lying idiots in the Forums. Great.
I don't think you quite got the point of including that line in the post. For reference there is a thread here in GD where the poster 'Tippia' has been arguing a perfectly valid point on the subject of RISK. Not to worry though I'll just file your latest blinding insight under 'clarity' much like your previous post. |
|
Sphit Ker
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
94
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:36:00 -
[81] - Quote
It's all good to have only have 12 hours delays on jump clones but then people will start to ask for 6.. then 3 and then.. and then... and then... right? go ahead and tell me I am wrong :D |
XIRUSPHERE
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
238
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:39:00 -
[82] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
Fully support, if someone wants to do clone swaps and is willing to do it in the system with their clones they should be able to, I can understand limiting the ability to project yourself all over new eden with no effort or flying but for ffs let me get in a crap clone so I can go on a null roam instead of saying "sorry guys im not taking this clone out".
Yeah it's going to allow people with a multitude of fancy clones to swap them at will if they are in the system with them, and what exactly is the problem? You don't like it then pod them and get that fancy podmail, hell you might even get multiple expensive podmails if they go swap to another and come back for more. The advantage of a bad memory is that one can enjoy the same good things for the first time several times.
One will rarely err if extreme actions be ascribed to vanity, ordinary actions to habit, and mean actions to fear. |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:52:00 -
[83] - Quote
Sphit Ker wrote:It's all good to have only have 12 hours delays on jump clones but then people will start to ask for 6.. then 3 and then.. and then... and then... right? go ahead and tell me I am wrong :D
Well it's obvious really isn't it? There's already a game mechanic in place that's very near instant give or take 2 minutes and with no limit on the number of times you can do it. |
Vauss Dutan
Alea Iacta Est Universal Test Alliance Please Ignore
28
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 14:59:00 -
[84] - Quote
Tobiaz wrote:Vauss Dutan wrote:24 hour cooldowns are a design nogo anyhow. It results in creep that causes some people to have to lose an additional day to bring the cooldown back to thier usual playtime.
I skipped an op because i couldnt get out of my implanted clone due to cooldown. Since implants are tied to training time, im not risking it. Too costly. You could say i have more isk in my head than i can afford to lose and thats the problem. I would argue that since implants are tied to training you should always have a body with the best inplants you can possibly buy. It would be nice if training times werent tied to implants.
Implants shouldnt be looked at like ships are. They are not a consumable that you burn through and the prices reflect this.
Its a bad mechanic when someone doesnt have the option to leave a half a billion isk body in the hangar. Instant clone transfers in the same station would fix this.
We should always have te option to jump into **** ships and crappy clones and participate in the game any time. Ohnoes!!! The game forces you to make choices?! What idiot ever came up with that stupid concept of Risk vs Reward?! As for not being able to join the op, that's what you get for hanging around at a different part of the galaxy far away from your buddies. Should make sense, I think.
Read my message again. Ill sum up my important points.
I would like instant clone swapping in the SAME station. This lets me swap clones like i swap ships. It would suck ass to have a 24 cooldown for swapping ships when youre stuck in your 1 bill isk mission runner.
I agree with the choices. I can dock my pricey ship and fly a **** ship and have fun. I cant do this with my clone for 24 hours after a jump. Im ok with the cool down for a jump (although it shoud be 23 hours to stop the 24 hour cycle creep) its the same station clone instant swap i would like, not instant no cooldown system jumps.
Fyi I was in the station where the op was staging out of. I was in my training clone and it also is a station i have a jump clone. I was ready to got but I saw the 10 hour timer so i did some pi and logged off.
The timer and or lack of same station clone swapping was a barrier to me undocking and participating in ops with my corp. |
mechtech
Ice Liberation Army
164
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:01:00 -
[85] - Quote
No we don't |
Bane Necran
322
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:03:00 -
[86] - Quote
Maybe a new skill that reduces JC time by 2 hours for each level?
Would be 14 hours at lvl5, which is close enough to 12. |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1136
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:07:00 -
[87] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Less than 24 hours should be in-station or intRA-regional only.
Too much room for EXPLOITATION here.
Like what?
Quote:goons (I can't capitalize it any longer) just wanna hop across the galaxy in 15 minutes if they could. RISK FREE of course.
That is ALL this is about anyway.
I think they must have enough JB's in their alliance to already do 1/4th of all eve quite fast so I don't understand what are you opposed to, like if Eve was all about goonswarm rats and rifters...
It's not a matter of travelling faster, you can blow your jump clone at distance "x" already without being there then JC to another point of your choice.
On the other hand for small to large corps, if players can jump from a pve toon to a pvp toon faster or from a pirate implanted/+5 clone to a cheaper clone to pvp then I'm quite sure there would be more players willing to pvp rather than log off because they have "swimming pool" or their actual clone has expensive implants, and who the hell can be that disturbed and wants to spend hours travelling ???? |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E. Comic Mischief
582
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:11:00 -
[88] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump??
Its not that I want to wait, I want my ENEMY to have to wait. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Francisco Bizzaro
32
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:12:00 -
[89] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote:Fyi I was in the station where the op was staging out of. I was in my training clone and it also is a station i have a jump clone. I was ready to got but I saw the 10 hour timer so i did some pi and logged off.
The timer and or lack of same station clone swapping was a barrier to me undocking and participating in ops with my corp. The JC timer doesn't lock the station exit, so we have to assume something else was the barrier to you undocking and participating in ops. |
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
231
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:20:00 -
[90] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Less than 24 hours should be in-station or intRA-regional only.
Too much room for EXPLOITATION here. Like what? Quote:goons (I can't capitalize it any longer) just wanna hop across the galaxy in 15 minutes if they could. RISK FREE of course.
That is ALL this is about anyway. I think they must have enough JB's in their alliance to already do 1/4th of all eve quite fast so I don't understand what are you opposed to, like if Eve was all about goonswarm rats and rifters... It's not a matter of travelling faster, you can blow your jump clone at distance "x" already without being there then JC to another point of your choice. On the other hand for small to large corps, if players can jump from a pve toon to a pvp toon faster or from a pirate implanted/+5 clone to a cheaper clone to pvp then I'm quite sure there would be more players willing to pvp rather than log off because they have "swimming pool" or their actual clone has expensive implants, and who the hell can be that disturbed and wants to spend hours travelling ????
Instant travel although it's convenient allows for bad military tactics to be used. For instance there's no real penalty for over extending your borders which makes it far easier to hold onto your territory and just turns it into nothing but a numbers game. |
|
Lord Helghast
Intergalactic Syndicate Nulli Secunda
96
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:20:00 -
[91] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
I LOVE THIS IDEA, would greatly improve the ability for those of us that want to have PVE and PVP clones setup in the same system the ability to actually make use of them, as it is its just stupid.... |
Testerxnot Sheepherder
DeadHeads - Question Authority Crew
112
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:21:00 -
[92] - Quote
I don't want it reduced. |
Sphit Ker
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
95
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:26:00 -
[93] - Quote
Nu Tra wrote:Sphit Ker wrote:It's all good to have only have 12 hours delays on jump clones but then people will start to ask for 6.. then 3 and then.. and then... and then... right? go ahead and tell me I am wrong :D Well it's obvious really isn't it? There's already a game mechanic in place that's very near instant give or take 2 minutes and with no limit on the number of times you can do it.
but what about hem all important implants? |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
201
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:30:00 -
[94] - Quote
no we dont. you shouldnt be able to easily hop forth and back from where you are. The JC delay should be raised to multiple days at least. Be where you live, or just deal with the JC cooldown and being out of play eventually.
|
AureoBroker
Natural Inventions Solyaris Chtonium
34
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:33:00 -
[95] - Quote
72h for jumping. Same-station jumping should go to 0, though. |
Bubanni
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
231
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:33:00 -
[96] - Quote
18 hours would be fine, or a skill that reduced the waiting time by either 30 mins or 1 hour per level... :) 12 hours is shorter than it needs to be |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1138
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:35:00 -
[97] - Quote
Sasha Azala wrote:Instant travel although it's convenient allows for bad military tactics to be used. For instance there's no real penalty for over extending your borders which makes it far easier to hold onto your territory and just turns it into nothing but a numbers game.
Eve it's already a numbers game, if you still have doubts about it just move a bit around
There's no military exploit you can do just because you can jump clone to keep safe "IMPLANTS", just makes your game experience better because you don't have to log off knowing your friends would appreciate your help but you can't because you can't afford to loose your implants crap.
If CCP implements something like this OR permanent implants then I would be willing to spend much more time travelling and wouldn't care of a 72h or even a month delay.
|
Tobiaz
Spacerats
227
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:36:00 -
[98] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote:
Read my message again. Ill sum up my important points.
I would like instant clone swapping in the SAME station. This lets me swap clones like i swap ships. It would suck ass to have a 24 cooldown for swapping ships when youre stuck in your 1 bill isk mission runner.
I agree with the choices. I can dock my pricey ship and fly a **** ship and have fun. I cant do this with my clone for 24 hours after a jump. Im ok with the cool down for a jump (although it shoud be 23 hours to stop the 24 hour cycle creep) its the same station clone instant swap i would like, not instant no cooldown system jumps.
Fyi I was in the station where the op was staging out of. I was in my training clone and it also is a station i have a jump clone. I was ready to got but I saw the 10 hour timer so i did some pi and logged off.
The timer and or lack of same station clone swapping was a barrier to me undocking and participating in ops with my corp.
Like I said: it a matter of choices and consequences. Being able to swap clones on a whim, takes a way a ton of that.
You just don't like to be forced to chose between high SP/hour or low wallet-hit on getting podded. Or perhaps you don't like to commit to flying a particular type of ship so you have clones standing by for all possible min-maxed implants sets.
Both are detrimental to this game. Yes perhaps some people won't go PvP when they are in their full +4 set, but why should the game cater to them? If they can't afford to lose it, they should have stayed with a cheaper set.
Or are you still in your crystal set with missile implants because you were running missions in your PvP Tengu, but now you suddenly have a fleet op in Abaddon hellcats and you can't swap into your slave set? Implants should never have turned into something like a pair of shoes you can just swap on a whim, it's ridiculous. CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
845
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:38:00 -
[99] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump?? Its not that I want to wait, I want my ENEMY to have to wait.
This.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
201
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:46:00 -
[100] - Quote
live in 0.0, then jump to highsec for missioning and jumping back to zero shouldnt happen much. Jew where you live so we have targets for roams.
Vote for raising JC delay to >2 days. |
|
IGNATIUS HOOD
Zephyr Corp Black Thorne Alliance
307
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:51:00 -
[101] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump??
Of all things to be annoyed about. This is so far down on my list that its laughable. 'perfer et obdura; dolor hic tibi proderit olim'
Be patient and tough; some day this pain will be useful to you.
~I fly spaceships~ |
TOTALHELLD3ATH
Republic University Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 15:59:00 -
[102] - Quote
Even 22 hours or 23 hours would be a huge improvement. For instance an hour into your usual play time you need to JC for an op. Next day op is done but you are sitting where you jumped waiting an hour before you can get back to where you want to be to do something useful.
I've seen 23 hours used frequently in other games for cooldown to alleviate this problem (kind of like the 24 hour PI setting when it first came out, you get later and later each day resetting until eventually you had to skip a day because it was out of you normal play time). |
MadMuppet
Kerguelen Station
257
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:02:00 -
[103] - Quote
I only want it to go to 23 hours to avoid 'session creep'. Going to 12 hours has some serious potential market issues. I don't always finish my commentary, but when I do |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
65
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:05:00 -
[104] - Quote
Medication stopped working making all the voices come back .. because surely you do not have the audacity to speak for everyone .. then again you might just be a raging megalomaniac with a whopping sense of entitlement for all I know.
I DO NOT WANT A SHORTER JC TIMER!
PS: Why not feed the trolls properly and suggest they sell a JC token in the NeX store .. thread-naught ahoy! |
Gerald Taric
Adamantium Industry
46
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:12:00 -
[105] - Quote
disagreed.
Please keep the 24 hour peroiod!
Otherwise the next time someone claims "We ALL want ..." ... 6h ... 3h ... 1h ... every-time-INSTANT-WARP
Guys and girls ...
learn to manage limited resources.
That's one of the challeges of this game. |
Makenshi Drakonnen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
16
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:17:00 -
[106] - Quote
I'm fine with 24 hour clone jumps if they're in separate systems/stations. I would like a faster timer for changing clone in the same system though.
What I want is not necessarily the best thing for the game so I would hope CCP don't introduce it simply because 1 dude on the forums says "EVERYBODY" wants it |
Vauss Dutan
Alea Iacta Est Universal Test Alliance Please Ignore
28
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:37:00 -
[107] - Quote
Francisco Bizzaro wrote:Vauss Dutan wrote:Fyi I was in the station where the op was staging out of. I was in my training clone and it also is a station i have a jump clone. I was ready to got but I saw the 10 hour timer so i did some pi and logged off.
The timer and or lack of same station clone swapping was a barrier to me undocking and participating in ops with my corp. The JC timer doesn't lock the station exit, so we have to assume something else was the barrier to you undocking and participating in ops.
I dont pick the navy raven to go on frigate roams, i fly a ship i can afford to lose.
I dont do roams in a clone augmented for training, I use a clone with no implants.
I can swap ships in station instantly to fly something i can afford to lose.
I cant swap clones in station instantly when on jump cooldown so i wont go out on roams in a clone i cant afford to lose.
Why have the 24 hour cooldown also prevent same station clone swapping? Whats the downside? Ill still risk my training clone doing stuff around system when things are mostly calm, but im not going to take it in an op. I can choose to, but i only see it as a good thing to allow this and no exploit or downside to same station clone swapping. |
Xixa Nova
Zahav. Black Thorne Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:48:00 -
[108] - Quote
I most definitely DO NOT want to see the JC cooldown timer be reduced.
Instead, CHANGE IT TO 70 HOURS and Bring PvP back to EVE!!! (70 hours to make it three days minus the "session creep" others mention).
However, I would not mind allowing a 1 hour cooldown timer if jumping within SAME STATION ONLY.
But... CCP will likely not change it. |
Vauss Dutan
Alea Iacta Est Universal Test Alliance Please Ignore
28
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:54:00 -
[109] - Quote
TOTALHELLD3ATH wrote:Even 22 hours or 23 hours would be a huge improvement. For instance an hour into your usual play time you need to JC for an op. Next day op is done but you are sitting where you jumped waiting an hour before you can get back to where you want to be to do something useful.
I've seen 23 hours used frequently in other games for cooldown to alleviate this problem (kind of like the 24 hour PI setting when it first came out, you get later and later each day resetting until eventually you had to skip a day because it was out of you normal play time).
Agreed. The 24 hour timer is a depricated mechanic. One day timers should be 22 - 23 hours. |
Drew Solaert
University of Caille Gallente Federation
127
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:59:00 -
[110] - Quote
It'd be nice to have but I'm not going to agree. The Universe does not need to feel any smaller. For every player ship that blows up, the wheels of the economy turn slightly faster. -áDo your bit today. -áGo out and PEW.
|
|
Kieron VonDeux
8
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 16:59:00 -
[111] - Quote
OPs claiming to be speaking for the entire Eve community should be classified as trolling.
|
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1546
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:02:00 -
[112] - Quote
While I could see going to 23 hrs, that's about it.
Movement in EVE needs to be more restricted, not less, for a wide variety of reasons. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
6204
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:06:00 -
[113] - Quote
MadMuppet wrote:I only want it to go to 23 hours to avoid 'session creep'. Going to 12 hours has some serious potential market issues. Pretty much. The 24h timer is a classic fencepost error GÇö thinking that once a day means once every 24h, even though that means it can never be once a day due to the additional delays.
GǪand once a day is fully sufficient for the kind of convenience a jump clone provides. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
603
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:06:00 -
[114] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:While I could see going to 23 hrs, that's about it.
Movement in EVE needs to be more restricted, not less, for a wide variety of reasons. I totally agree with this. There's way too much 'teleporting' around already. It's bulls*** and it's been screwing up the game. Encouraging more of it fracks up the 'hard' parts of sov warfare (in that huge fleets can just teleport around the whole map) and leaves way too many ships effectively invulnerable. Travel is supposed to be difficult and time consuming.
|
Eve Mione
Eve Industry Unlimited
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:08:00 -
[115] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
I would just make a few changes. To keep in line with having it end before next downtime for some.
47 Hours - Other Region 23 Hours - Same Region 11 Hours - Same constellation 5 Hours - Same System 1 Minute - Same Station
Supported though. This increases JC timers for people jumping out of regions increasing wait times etc. While changing in the same system/station can be done in the same day because their not really travelling far and using Jump Clones for travel.
Edited for Spelling* |
Pandi V
Plantains
10
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:15:00 -
[116] - Quote
No.
Argument for:
It's convenient.
Argument against:
- EVE is a game that rewards using your brain by forcing you to make hard choices. Having to move things around the universe will, to a simple mind, just be "boring", while a person with a basic sense of perspective and a minimum IQ would value it as adding depth to the universe and forcing you to make choices and plan ahead.
- It will make power projection even easier than it is now. Jump Bridges, the epitome of a convenience feature, has already made moving fleets around nullsec waaaay to easy. Making it even easier to move large amounts of pilots across regions will screw things up even more
As always it's a matter of looking beyond what you want, and spend a bare minimum if time thinking about the actual consequences.
I'd prefer the cooldown was increased to 48 hours. CCP Greyscale and Soundwave on power projection: http://youtu.be/_pLi1J9YrkM?t=23m38s |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
266
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:20:00 -
[117] - Quote
It can be argued that everything CCP has done to make logistics easier has made the game worse.
The argument may be unconvincing in some cases, but I suspect it's valid in general terms. |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
230
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:33:00 -
[118] - Quote
Gypsio III wrote:It can be argued that everything CCP has done to make logistics easier has made the game worse. The argument may be unconvincing in some cases, but I suspect it's valid in general terms.
The real 'logistics' that is. Not the stupid misnamed shipclass. CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Sentinel Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:33:00 -
[119] - Quote
I'm fine with the way it is.. you make your choice for that clone, and you live with it.
Don't want to pin someone in a station just to have them jump across the galaxy, and repeat, a few times a day.. screw that. You get your one get our of jail free card a day..
If you need to move around fast, get a clean clone and use the whitelight express. |
Ris Dnalor
Black Rebel Rifter Club
284
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:33:00 -
[120] - Quote
just make jump clones an isk-sink. we need moar isk-sinks, right? ... |
|
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
621
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:41:00 -
[121] - Quote
I'd like something skill based like 24h / level:
Infomorph Psychology 1 = 24h + 1 jumpclone Infomorph Psychology 2 = 12h + 2 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 3 = 8h + 3 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 4 = 6h + 4 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 5 = 4h 48m + 5 jumpclones
|
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
202
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:41:00 -
[122] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote: I dont pick the navy raven to go on frigate roams, i fly a ship i can afford to lose.
what does this have to do with JC? Pick a proper ship.
Vauss Dutan wrote:I dont do roams in a clone augmented for training, I use a clone with no implants. its your choice to put implants into your dumb head. You dont need to. If you do, deal with it. Yo know, eve is working without implants too.
Vauss Dutan wrote:I cant swap clones in station instantly when on jump cooldown so i wont go out on roams in a clone i cant afford to lose. its good that way, I love expensive pod killmails.
Vauss Dutan wrote:Why have the 24 hour cooldown also prevent same station clone swapping? because I like implants on killmails, as many others out there.
Vauss Dutan wrote:Whats the downside? obvious. Me not getting good pod killmails. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 17:54:00 -
[123] - Quote
OP, your idea is bad and you should feel bad. We need less easy mode in Eve, not more.
I used to live in Omist, 50-some jumps away from my Empire assets. The fact that I could get stuff to Omist and get back with about in less than an hour of effort on my part is disgusting. It really ruined the "remote" feeling that a very deep nullsec region should give. It was also horrible that I could go from helping a newbie out in hisec to being in a deep nullsec fleet battle in only a few minutes. Jump [freighters, bridges, clones] may make life in 0.0 "easier", but they ruin a lot of the tactics and dedication that it would otherwise take to live out there. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:01:00 -
[124] - Quote
Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
|
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:03:00 -
[125] - Quote
Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me!
In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours.
I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:04:00 -
[126] - Quote
And you'll find people using dedicated pvp clones with useful implants for your podmails - and fewer people not playin the game because it is counter to long term goals to jump. When the rational decision is not to play, something is wrong with the game |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:05:00 -
[127] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:And you'll find people using dedicated pvp clones with useful implants for your podmails - and fewer people not playin the game because it is counter to long term goals to jump. When the rational decision is not to play, something is wrong with the game
Just remove the jump clone mechanic completely, it never really deserved to exist. It's as rancid as most of the ideas that get shot down in "Features and Ideas" every day. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:05:00 -
[128] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again.
Depends on your choice of coefficient and power - but 72 or even 96 hour timers after long jumps would seem reasonable |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:08:00 -
[129] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Depends on your choice of coefficient and power - but 72 or even 96 hour timers after long jumps would seem reasonable
72 and 96 are wimpy. You should be able to JC once a week at most. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:08:00 -
[130] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. I support this.
Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
|
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:10:00 -
[131] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
That's not exponential anymore. That isn't even geometric growth. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:11:00 -
[132] - Quote
Jump clones help negate the fact that learning implants disproportionately harm nullsec players. Empire dwellers live with almost no risk of bein podded, and as such get to train much faster nd cheaper. Nullsec needs reward to balance risk, and training times are one area where there is nothing given
I spend most my time in +4s or 5s and rarely play with characters who are training. Remove learning implants and I will support the removal of jumpclones |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:14:00 -
[133] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. I support this. Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:14:00 -
[134] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Jump clones help negate the fact that learning implants disproportionately harm nullsec players. Empire dwellers live with almost no risk of bein podded, and as such get to train much faster nd cheaper. Nullsec needs reward to balance risk, and training times are one area where there is nothing given
I spend most my time in +4s or 5s and rarely play with characters who are training. Remove learning implants and I will support the removal of jumpclones
I'd love to see learning implants go to be honest. But no attribute increases, just permanently handicap everyone's training speed Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:17:00 -
[135] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:24:00 -
[136] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Ntrails wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
What crap, everyone knows the game needs more things to make spredsheets for... :) |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
602
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:25:00 -
[137] - Quote
I would support 23 hours but not anything less. I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:27:00 -
[138] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote: People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
I am not bad at math, and those who are can HTFU.
Here's a reasonable formula for making jump clones based on distance.
Cooldown = ( base time ) ^ ( [ jump clone distance from player / pansy handicap ] + 1 )
Some properties:
- A distance of 0ly always yields the base time.
- Exponential growth on longer jumps controlled using the pansy handicap.
- Distance measured in LY just like jump drives.
I would use a base time of 24 hours like we do now and have a handicap that keeps the growth reasonable for however many light years is deemed "Far enough" then starts to rapidly spiral towards impossibleville.
EDIT: For obvious reasons base time > 1. Also, the handicap is an arbitrarily large number that slows the growth (so a handicap of 100 doesn't slow it as much as a handicap of 100,000). Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 18:33:00 -
[139] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote: People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
I am not bad at math, and those who are can HTFU. Here's a reasonable formula for making jump clones based on distance. Cooldown = ( base time ) ^ ( [ jump clone distance from player / pansy handicap ] + 1 ) Some properties:
- A distance of 0ly always yields the base time.
- Exponential growth on longer jumps controlled using the pansy handicap.
- Distance measured in LY just like jump drives.
I would use a base time of 24 hours like we do now and have a handicap that keeps the growth reasonable for however many light years is deemed "Far enough" then starts to rapidly spiral towards impossibleville. EDIT: For obvious reasons base time > 1. Also, the handicap is an arbitrarily large number that slows the growth (so a handicap of 100 doesn't slow it as much as a handicap of 100,000).
Also reasonable, and any sort of change for scaling up JC costs (linear, exponential, logarithmic, or CCPithmic like tracking/damage formulas) would make me a happy camper. The tear tsunami this would cause would also amuse me greatly. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
480
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:05:00 -
[140] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump?? Due to power projection. Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
|
Herping yourDerp
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
517
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:07:00 -
[141] - Quote
i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:15:00 -
[142] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours.....
EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ghoest
332
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:18:00 -
[143] - Quote
12 is not a good idea.
20 or 22 hour timers is a great idea. Wherever You Went - Here You Are |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
602
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:19:00 -
[144] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way ----->
Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier. I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Markus Reese
Debitum Naturae ROMANIAN-LEGION
126
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:39:00 -
[145] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
Really? Sweet, so you are going to freely and safely offer my cynos to my other place of operations 60j away and pay for fuel too? greatly nice of you, will you bear my children?
This is a more lame suggestion than the 12 hour, I would like 12 hour cooldown, means if I make a jump somewhere at end of day, next day I can head back after business is done. 0h samestation is for crybaby anomaly ratters in nullsec who want their slave set ratting carriers, but can hide it away easily for pvp, then switch back for more farming. Flat rate timer, or make it a min same station, of 6 hours, add 2 hrs out of station, constellation, region proactively
|
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:40:00 -
[146] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier.
If I were designing this game we would be unable to warp to zero, have no jump clones, and there would be only nullsec. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Wyke Mossari
Staner Industries
191
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:41:00 -
[147] - Quote
Any reduction should be skill based, but against an increased base line.
e.g. 7 days standard, -1 day per skill level. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
812
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:48:00 -
[148] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Alpheias wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier. If I were designing this game we would be unable to warp to zero, have no jump clones, and there would be only nullsec. Exactly. You're trying to make ganking miners so much easier Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:49:00 -
[149] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Exactly. You're trying to make ganking miners so much easier
More along the lines of making PVP in general far harder to run from. You should remember that I fully support NAPfests and blob warfare. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Shadowsword
The Scope Gallente Federation
125
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:51:00 -
[150] - Quote
If jump clones were completely removed, it would be bothersome for me, but good for the game overall. So I'm in favor of their suppression. A part of what makes Eve a good game is that you have painful choices to makes. |
|
Tobiaz
Spacerats
230
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:57:00 -
[151] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around. Really? Sweet, so you are going to freely and safely offer my cynos to my other place of operations 60j away and pay for fuel too? greatly nice of you, will you bear my children? This is a more lame suggestion than the 12 hour, I would like 12 hour cooldown, means if I make a jump somewhere at end of day, next day I can head back after business is done. 0h samestation is for crybaby anomaly ratters in nullsec who want their slave set ratting carriers, but can hide it away easily for pvp, then switch back for more farming. Flat rate timer, or make it a min same station, of 6 hours, add 2 hrs out of station, constellation, region proactively
The underlined part is the wrong part. Can't you see how ****** up that is? CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323 |
Rixiu
PonyTek
117
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 19:58:00 -
[152] - Quote
No. Increase it to 48 hours already, or remove it completely. |
Welsige
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
48
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 20:16:00 -
[153] - Quote
Supported.
Anythin 23h or bellow would do.
12 hours would be very nice.
6 hours would be awesome.
Maybe i can start using implants again.... ~ 10.058 ~
Free The Mittani |
nubile slave
Furian Necromongers
9
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 20:17:00 -
[154] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station. Surely you cant be serious
Don't call me Shirley?
|
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
304
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 20:21:00 -
[155] - Quote
Nope, JC's already make things far too easy. Storage clones for implants is risiculius. It actually makes avoiding losing expensive implants far too easy.
Plus you can have a clone for shield support and one for armor support.
If anything the JC's should have a far longer period to switch.
|
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
328
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 20:22:00 -
[156] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Nope, JC's already make things far too easy. Storage clones for implants is risiculius. It actually makes avoiding losing expensive implants far too easy.
Plus you can have a clone for shield support and one for armor support.
If anything the JC's should have a far longer period to switch.
This Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
482
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 22:22:00 -
[157] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Your gross assumption that ALL players want the same thing is horribly wrong. Not everyone thinks like you do nor wants 12hour JCs. If anything there are those who think adding JCs in the first place was a mistake. Personally I feel jump clones should be given a 72 hour delay, and be limited to regional stations. The only quick jump you should be able to do is into another clone at the same station.
While I agree that not everyone wants <24 hour jump clones, not putting them in the game would have cost CCP a shitload of subs. Regional jumps would be pointless 90%+ of the time. We now return you to your regularly scheduled **** poast. |
Burseg Sardaukar
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
115
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 22:58:00 -
[158] - Quote
Yes, please. There are many times when I think:
"Man, I'd really like to jump to nullsec and rat for a bit." and then remember that if I want to come back home to Seyllin, I'd have to wait beyond that moment through the next day to actually do it. Pain in the ass that doesn't need to exist if you ask me. We have a blog, it is terrible. How to fix Bounty Hunting |
Holy One
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
184
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:01:00 -
[159] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:This 24 hr waiting period is utterly pointless. Why are you torturing your innocent players with 24 hr delays between jumps Please implement in ESCALATION . Thank you and have a nice day!!!!
2 hrs
+1 anyway
|
Ben Derindar
Dirty Deeds Corp.
8
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:07:00 -
[160] - Quote
This idea is as bad as it is old.
The jump clone timer is one of several mechanics that enable the excess of power projection that has plagued this game for years now. The timer ought to be extended, not reduced. |
|
Maxpie
Metaphysical Utopian Society Explorations
64
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:11:00 -
[161] - Quote
Just make it once per downtime. I think that's perfectly reasonable and avoids "jump creep". |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
582
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:18:00 -
[162] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Aqriue wrote:Remove jump clone timer all together.
Instead, when you jump its considered the equivilent of podding and you lose skill points as if it wasn't updated. You can do this as often as you like, there will reach a limit to how often the player behind the avatar willing to risk instant travel for such a high cost and then the other guy might win. Skill Consequences for THIS and not High Sec Suicide GANKING ? Bad idea. Actually both, skill point loss should be the ultimate risk but it doesn't have to be for ganking (just losing your ship baring a rookie frig in any situation should cause SP loss like a T3 except it doesn't need to be a T3). As its gotten to the point that isk is not a factor (when it comes to some sockpuppeting parrots) but isk can be thrown around for zero risk and high gain...yes skill point loss for destruction of a ship, clone jump or pod would be the ultimate cost. You can't get that back time spent for training, but ship loss and some ultimate fetish to cut yourself by jumping clones would be a huge deciding factor in how much are you willing to risk. |
Kahn Eros
Dark Sacred Night
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:38:00 -
[163] - Quote
Here is a superb reason why jc timers should not exist
I have fairly reasonable leadership skills and am the fc. I have a number of targets I will be leading my group against - one set I know is armor based and the other are ***-assed nano pirates.
If I want to fight both or I get drawn in to fight both, I cannot change out my armor mindlink for my skirmish mindlink because I have to wait 24hrs!!!
UNACCEPTABLE!!!
So all you trolls that say there should be 72hr timers or no jc - look at the whole picture before you go flapping your gums
|
dethleffs
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
31
|
Posted - 2012.04.19 23:57:00 -
[164] - Quote
42 |
Derek Wiildstar
Wolfstar Inc
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:10:00 -
[165] - Quote
As a new player to eve: Get rid of them. They don't add anything to the game. Or add insurance for implants instead. |
stoicfaux
956
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:13:00 -
[166] - Quote
As mentioned in a previous thread, one jump per downtime, i.e. once a day (anytime during the day,) would be swell.
The biggest issue with the 24 hour timer is that it can be difficult/annoying to synch with RL.
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head.
|
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
515
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:35:00 -
[167] - Quote
Kahn Eros wrote:Here is a superb reason why jc timers should not exist
I have fairly reasonable leadership skills and am the fc. I have a number of targets I will be leading my group against - one set I know is armor based and the other are ***-assed nano pirates.
If I want to fight both or I get drawn in to fight both, I cannot change out my armor mindlink for my skirmish mindlink because I have to wait 24hrs!!!
UNACCEPTABLE!!!
So all you trolls that say there should be 72hr timers or no jc - look at the whole picture before you go flapping your gums
Not really a superb reason, its kind of the risk you take when you make specialized setups. However as far as your last statement, I believe its you who doesn't see the whole picture. You are just looking at what will benefit you only not the game as a whole. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Ponies for the Ethical Treatment of Asteroids
1024
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:39:00 -
[168] - Quote
oh yeah, I haz jumpclones |
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
493
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:42:00 -
[169] - Quote
Who are you to presume to speak for me. You're barely literate pubbie filth. |
Kengutsi Akira
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
421
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:53:00 -
[170] - Quote
lol... 30 min Hearthstone.... https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1109909#post1109909
My stance on WiS (updated) |
|
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
485
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 00:58:00 -
[171] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:Who are you to presume to speak for me. You're barely literate pubbie filth.
Just remember that your mother is a pubbie. We now return you to your regularly scheduled **** poast. |
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
494
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 03:28:00 -
[172] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:Tarsus Zateki wrote:Who are you to presume to speak for me. You're barely literate pubbie filth. Just remember that your mother is a pubbie.
My mom's had an SA account nearly as long as I have, she loves Goons with Spoons and the creative convention. |
Lady Naween
Good Vs. Neutral Stop Exploding You Cowards
19
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 03:36:00 -
[173] - Quote
Kahn Eros wrote:Here is a superb reason why jc timers should not exist
I have fairly reasonable leadership skills and am the fc. I have a number of targets I will be leading my group against - one set I know is armor based and the other are ***-assed nano pirates.
If I want to fight both or I get drawn in to fight both, I cannot change out my armor mindlink for my skirmish mindlink because I have to wait 24hrs!!!
UNACCEPTABLE!!!
So all you trolls that say there should be 72hr timers or no jc - look at the whole picture before you go flapping your gums
I have maxed leadership skills (15.8 million SP) with 4 clones for boosting and no, it isnt a big deal. Its almost never a case of having to change all that often, talk to the peeps in the alliance.. "ok i go skirmish, you go armour..." .. so no i am all for not reducing the timer. EVE is so small these days, that making you being able to clonejump more often will just be bad for the game in my opinion. |
Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
518
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 07:09:00 -
[174] - Quote
Welp looks like CCP killed another good discussion thread by dumping it in F&I section. |
Dream Five
Renegade Pleasure Androids Pleasure Syndicate
157
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 07:50:00 -
[175] - Quote
good idea. |
jagholas kiri
Sons of Retribution Malice Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 07:52:00 -
[176] - Quote
OP cause so much rage.
8/10 |
Ardal Cearul
Analog Folk SRS.
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 07:53:00 -
[177] - Quote
From another thread.
Ardal Cearul wrote:Supported.
Prohibiting jump clones just encourages people not to do things until that 24 hours is up. I believe you would see a significant spike in PvP if JC times were shortened.
|
Bandalon Ominus
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 22:18:00 -
[178] - Quote
I say remove JC's and make the sandbox big again |
Duchess Starbuckington
Starbuckington Manor
170
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 22:25:00 -
[179] - Quote
Dear Op **** you. That's right, no argument, no points to make, just **** you. Nobody speaks for me, and nobody speaks for the entire playerbase. Arrogant little ****. |
S'totan
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.20 22:25:00 -
[180] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:This 24 hr waiting period is utterly pointless. Why are you torturing your innocent players with 24 hr delays between jumps Please implement in ESCALATION . Thank you and have a nice day!!!!
like |
|
Emma Royd
Jupiter Industries C0LD Fusion
109
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 05:52:00 -
[181] - Quote
TLDR
How about an 'emergency' jump clone feature, which can be used but has some drawbacks.
All implants that clone has either don't work for the time you're in that clone up to the 24 hours (very difficult to program though) Random chance that some / all of the implants get destroyed Maybe even some of your skills temporarily drop a couple of levels or so, not ship skills, just stuff like gunnery, or missiles, etc. You can drive drunk, but not drive very well sort of thing.
Basically, yes you could clone jump before the 24 hours but there's a risk that you jump and find your slave set half missing, and you're not as effective at whatever you want to do, be it PvP, Mine or whatever.
|
Aphoxema G
Teraa Matar White-Lotus
278
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 08:19:00 -
[182] - Quote
I think one of the more thoughtful suggestions regarding jump clones I've seen somewhere is instead of jumping once every 24 hours, you can jump twice every 48 hours. This allows someone to jump, get their business done and return home without much effecting the function of JCs as it is. Necromancy ships: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1145308&#post1145308 |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
800
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 08:21:00 -
[183] - Quote
No.
|
LT Alter
Mostly Wrong Decisions
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 09:00:00 -
[184] - Quote
12 hours is perfect, I would love it.
Don't know how many roams I missed cause I was in my slave clone and couldn't jump out... |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
267
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 10:03:00 -
[185] - Quote
Jump clones were a bad idea and should be removed entirely. Return the SP and unplug all the implants.
They are part of the easy force projection that simultaneously creates a small but mostly empty galaxy. They limit the strategic consequences of deployment across the galaxy, which is fundamentally bad for a game that is anchored in the concept of consequences (see CCP's dislike of in-combat refitting). They also unnecessarily favour older, richer players over newbies by allowing them to maintain multiple clones for specific environments.
Attribute implants were also probably a bad idea, they deter people from PVP and leaving highsec. Remove them, and give everyone +4 to their stats. Or +5, it hardly matters I suppose. |
Duchess Starbuckington
Starbuckington Manor
171
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 12:31:00 -
[186] - Quote
Gypsio III wrote:Jump clones were a bad idea and should be removed entirely. Return the SP and unplug all the implants.
They are part of the easy force projection that simultaneously creates a small but mostly empty galaxy. They limit the strategic consequences of deployment across the galaxy, which is fundamentally bad for a game that is anchored in the concept of consequences (see CCP's dislike of in-combat refitting). They also unnecessarily favour older, richer players over newbies by allowing them to maintain multiple clones for specific environments.
Attribute implants were also probably a bad idea, they deter people from PVP and leaving highsec. Remove them, and give everyone +4 to their stats. Or +5, it hardly matters I suppose.
I find myself agreeing with a quite disturbingly large number of your posts. |
Francisco Bizzaro
35
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 12:47:00 -
[187] - Quote
LT Alter wrote:12 hours is perfect, I would love it.
Don't know how many roams I missed cause I was in my slave clone and couldn't jump out... I never realized why they were called "slave" implants until now.
Drop them, and enjoy the freedom to go on your roams. |
Altair Raja
Colonial Marines EVE Division Villore Accords
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.21 12:48:00 -
[188] - Quote
22h and im happy... less would be nice but 22 hours and im happy! AFK cloaking doesn't earn anything, so it needs a buff! |
Kodiii
TalCorp Enterprises Care Factor
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 15:07:00 -
[189] - Quote
I think 12 or 18 hours are a good mix. I like to jump out to null sec and have some pvp with my American and European friends and then hang out with my Australian friend at night time. However, I can't do both in a day, or the next day I will not be able to choose.
If it was 12 hours, I could jump clone to null sec when I'm done in high sec and night and then at day time have some pvp fun, and jump back ready for the night afterwards.
+1 from me. |
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
56
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 18:05:00 -
[190] - Quote
Linda Shadowborn wrote:Nope, dont want that at all. For reasons stated above, EVE has become to small with JF, titans, bridges etc so you can now zip around from one end to the other in no time. You touch my rorqual, I kill you. |
|
Asuka Solo
Stark Fujikawa Stark Enterprises
1428
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 18:36:00 -
[191] - Quote
I have just never had the need to jump clone to the same location within 24 hours, even while PvPing.
I can even go weeks without jump clones.... so I don't know what you people are smoking... |
Katerwaul
The Scope Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 21:11:00 -
[192] - Quote
So.. NO.
That said -- I could see a skill tree that did something along the lines of reducing the total duration of rest needed between jumps w/ the knowledge that if you're podded while in that jump cool-down window you loose skill points in the relevant skill (or skills) similar to what they do for t3 ships. Working with everyone to improve New Eden -- Internet Spaceships Iz Serious Business. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
203
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 10:13:00 -
[193] - Quote
Gypsio III wrote:Jump clones were a bad idea and should be removed entirely. Return the SP and unplug all the implants.
They are part of the easy force projection that simultaneously creates a small but mostly empty galaxy. They limit the strategic consequences of deployment across the galaxy, which is fundamentally bad for a game that is anchored in the concept of consequences (see CCP's dislike of in-combat refitting). They also unnecessarily favour older, richer players over newbies by allowing them to maintain multiple clones for specific environments.
Attribute implants were also probably a bad idea, they deter people from PVP and leaving highsec. Remove them, and give everyone +4 to their stats. Or +5, it hardly matters I suppose.
yeah force projection argument is legit but I dont think we should remove them at all. Just set the JC cooldown to something high value which would prevent JC from regular use.
I think JC should only be used in emergency situations like for the case you have still assets in stations which were taken by enemies and such. Not for just "oh I need ISK so JC myself to high sec for a couple of hours" use. |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.23 11:13:00 -
[194] - Quote
I'm fine with 24h, it creates restrictions which is a GOOD thing. Insta travel makes the universe smaller and removes the effort it takes to make stuff happen and just because something is easier doesn't mean it's better. Also, now you whine about 12H but in a few months someone will step up and go "12, why not 6?" etc etc.
So no, deal with it. Ultimately, I agree with Gypsio. |
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