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False numbers and world records. CCP and concurrent users.

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Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:19:00 - [1] Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 07/02/2009 23:19:49 Alot of times CCP has boasted to have 200000+ subscribers, 45000 something concurrent users. This statement is entirely false. Why you ask? Secondary and tertiary accounts. Due to the one character training limit. Alot of people have purchased two or more accounts. My friend I know counts for 5 people in the subscriber base. While i do not know the ratio it seems a common thing to have 2 or more accounts among higher end players, And with those who have more than two their might be as little as 100000 "real" people playing eve. What i wish to discuss in this post is what that exact ratio is. I have nothing but respect for CCP but i wish to know how many people actually play.
Sniper Wolf18 Gallente A Pretty Pony Princess	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:22:00 - [2] Edited by: Sniper Wolf18 on 07/02/2009 23:22:38 EDIT: (didnt see the end of your post) Probably about 100,000 people
Graisse	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:24:00 - [3] Are u a comedian?
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:24:00 - [4] Originally by: Kytanos Termek Alot of times CCP has boasted to have 200000+ subscribers, 45000 something concurrent users. This statement is entirely false? 200k+ subscribers are real. Or do you think that alt accounts don't have to pay? It doesn't matter if one guy pays for 5 accounts or 5 people pay each for 1 account. The money income for CCP is the same. Same with 48k concurrent users. Doesn't matter if those are all alts or not. The demand of the hardware is all the same. So ...
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:27:00 - [5] The concurrent users is solely based on number of clients accessing the server, the load on the server doesn't decrease because multiple clients hook up from the same IP. In that light, the claim is valid enough. Would be nice to know what the average character count per subscriber is though, are we all alts or is there some legitimate new players out there?
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:28:00 - [6] Who cares ? It's accounts logged in. Might as well be separate users. Not like any OTHER MMO counts same-user-separate-accounts as a SINGLE user. By the way, an estimated of around 70-80% users are single accounts. Why estimated ? Because some people pay with GTCs exclusively, so you can't know for sure. And IP-based methods of determining individual users aren't quite exact either (if one friend of mine that plays EVE ever logs in from my machine, should he be considered "me" ? or what if I have the same "outside-visible" IP as some other EVE players, some ISPs do that too ? and so on and so forth).
Mr Sugar	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:28:00 - [7] I want to be an alt when I grow up.
Benedic The Aftermath	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:28:00 - [8] There's only like 4 people that actually play. I am not one of them.
bff Jill	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:28:00 - [9] It doesn't count because alts aren't real people, they are objects.
Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:37:00 - [10] It would just be nice to get a good number of how many real players. I love eve and am ecstatic to see it grow so big from his lil form back in the day. But if i am not curious. :-)

Gieron Middleton and Mercer LLP Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:43:00 - [11] I have heard that the number is 1.27 accounts per person. No idea where I heard this number, or if I just made it up right now. But this is what my brain tells me.
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:54:00 - [12] Originally by: Kytanos Termek Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 07/02/2009 23:19:49 Alot of times CCP has boasted to have 200000+ subscribers, 45000 something concurrent users. This statement is entirely false. Why you ask? Secondary and tertiary accounts. Due to the one character training limit. Alot of people have purchased two or more accounts. My friend I know counts for 5 people in the subscriber base. While i do not know the ratio it seems a common thing to have 2 or more accounts among higher end players, And with those who have more than two their might be as little as 100000 "real" people playing eve. What i wish to discuss in this post is what that exact ratio is. I have nothing but respect for CCP but i wish to know how many people actually play. For a while back I read about someone who had 35 accounts in WoW.. So I guess WoW dont hae 11 million subscribers either, but maybe 1 million? The fact is its the number of subscribers that is important. because that is the number of paying customers! Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2009.02.07 23:56:00 - [13] WoW has more subscribed account than EVE EVE has more actual players than WoW Face it, every WoW Player has at least 40 More Accounts to raid alone. ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Crumplecorn Contact the CSM about it, voting themselves into disbandment wouldn't be pushing the boundaries of absurdity for them.
Chaos Winds	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:04:00 - [14] Every MMO has players with multiple accounts, so CCP's numbers are as valid as anyone's.
Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:09:00 - [15] Ive played wow for a long time. Ill tell ya mufti account users are much rarer than in eve. Mainly because having multiple accounts offers next to no benefit in wow. Those 35 account people are very very rare. However in eve it offer's significant benefits. Hell 2 account people are rare. Take it from me. I was one of the ingame top end raiders when i quit. Ive been playing it since release. Mrr?
Genya Arikaido	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:26:00 - [16] Edited by: Genya Arikaido on 08/02/2009 00:29:32 Originally by: Kytanos Termek Ive played wow for a long time. Ill tell ya mufti account users are much rarer than in eve. http://www.geekologie.com/2008/10/guy_plays_36_world_of_warcraft.php Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. You Fail[/url]
Undeniable Existence Questionable Practices	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:28:00 - [17] Originally by: Kytanos Termek Ive played wow for a long time. Ill tell ya mufti account users are much rarer than in eve. Mainly because having multiple accounts offers next to no benefit in wow. Those 35 account people are very very rare. However in eve it offer's significant benefits. Hell 2 account people are rare. Take it from me. I was one of the ingame top end raiders when i quit. Ive been playing it since release. Can i have your.... oh, wait..
Akor Flandres	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:29:00 - [18] You know, whether its alt accounts or not, when 48000 characters are logged on to the server, that's still 48000 characters the servers are supporting at the same time, it's still a great achievement.
Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:30:00 - [19] Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:33:11 Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:31:59 Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:31:45 Now now we know their are exceptions to every rule. I do admit people like that exist. Especially with so many people playing it. But they are the minority. However in any minority you find your freaks. :-D I was just speaking from what I personally experienced and know. If you have been in a guild where a significant percentage of you were multi account users. Please speak up and add to the conversation. I am interested to see where this thread leads. :-D As for eve. Technologically it's a great achievement. I just cant wait until it hits higher numbers of players. The game already has great nation states in the form of alliances and power blocks.
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:33:00 - [20] Originally by: Kytanos Termek Now now we know their are exceptions to every rule. I do admit people like that exist. Especially with so many people playing it. But they are the minority. However in any minority you find your freaks. :-D Fact: 5/8 Of all WoW Players have more than an account Fact: Of that 5/8, 1/3 has more than 4 accounts. Fact: You Fail Source: Same as Kytanos's

Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:35:00 - [21] Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:36:08 Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:35:25 Wow. I'd like to be in your guild. I am just saying. Thats what I experienced. Out of curiosity, I never had two wow accounts. Whats it like? Currently the only benefits i saw was playing both sides on a pvp server. My server was shadow council
Genya Arikaido	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:36:00 - [22] Oh, and a WoW server dies after ~3-4K users are logged in.
Aganithil	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:41:00 - [23] This is a very good post and the insight of the OP is refreshing to say the least. And now on to his question. I myself have 199,999 accounts and today alone I logged on to 44,998 of my accounts (on one computer mind you)at the same time. But right after I logged on to my 44,998th account I had to log off to do homework. So I was only able to train 'learning 2' on 1 of my characters. I still think it was a fruitful day however. More later. Aggy
Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:41:00 - [24] Actually it locks people out and there is a line to get in. Mrr?
Taylor timenenzi	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:56:00 - [25] Edited by: Taylor timenenzi on 08/02/2009 00:57:59 Originally by: Kytanos Termek Hell 2 account people are rare. Take it from me. I was one of the ingame top end raiders when i quit. Ive been playing it since release. Yes everyone in WoW is in a top raiding guild, has cleared all the raids, has full whatever the top tier set is at the time, a 2200+ arena team, and has been there since release. Also everyone everywhere has beta tested everygame and done everything in them.
CyberGh0st Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:57:00 - [26] They way the OP brings his point is pure troll imho The subscriber numbers are 100% legit, and semi industry standard, so you have a way to compare with other mmo's. All mmo's have mains and alts and multiple accounts, some, like DAoC and EVE Online have more multiple accounts then others, but that does not invalidate the numbers and the growth of EVE Online. When I go to Rens I see that the active population has increased, it is a fact. Same goes for the concurrent users, the only competition, Second Life ( with 70k+ PCU ) , does not differentiate between mains or alts either, and they have alot more players that don't pay a subscription. So comming here and telling they dont have 250k subs and dont have 45k+ PCU, is just pure trolling. Now if you would have said that those numbers contain alts, I would agree, and if you would then have asked what the ratio could be, we would have been able to have a discussion. But you didnt, you just trolled and BS'd, and said that the statements are false. Cyberwiz aka CyberGh0st aka Mentakh Active @ EvE Online Favorites : DAoC-SI/SWG Pre CU-NGE/Ryzom Retired @ WoW/LOTRO/WAR/Planetside/Entropia/UO/Lineage/GW/EQ/Jumpgate/Dofus/AoC
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:58:00 - [27] Originally by: Kytanos Termek Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 07/02/2009 23:19:49 Alot of times CCP has boasted to have 200000+ subscribers, 45000 something concurrent users. This statement is entirely false. Why you ask? Secondary and tertiary accounts. Due to the one character training limit. Alot of people have purchased two or more accounts. My friend I know counts for 5 people in the subscriber base. While i do not know the ratio it seems a common thing to have 2 or more accounts among higher end players, And with those who have more than two their might be as little as 100000 "real" people playing eve. What i wish to discuss in this post is what that exact ratio is. I have nothing but respect for CCP but i wish to know how many people actually play. 200000+ *paying* subscribers. So your point is moot. And nobody cares if someone have alts anyways.
Kytanos Termek Caldari Darkstorm Command Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.08 00:58:00 - [28] Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 08/02/2009 00:59:15 Oh sorry. Trolling not intended. I just had some thoughts on it want wondered what others peoples opinions are. I am not very experianced on forums :-( . Ill erase my posts on this topic if you want. Mrr?
Ydyp Ieva Caldari Amarrian Retribution	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:30:00 - [29] Last time I checked I effectively pay 2 subscriptions, so yes the number of subs they give are correct. It isn't that they say that they got 200000+ individual customers. The concurrent users is a bit trickier, but there goes 1 client connected = 1 user. Each client uses bandwith and CPU of the server, and as stated before doesn't matter if it mutlitple clients connects from the same IP.
Aricaan Gallente Playboy Enterprises Dark Taboo	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:35:00 - [30] Dead horse is Dead.



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