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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:05:00 -
[1]
I've gleaned this much information from playing around in Singularity so far:
There is only one T3 ship for each race. Each ship consists of a core infrastructure, on which the five components are mounted. The core itself appears to be generic with basic stats, no slots, only hull and low armor hitpoints with 10% resists, no weapons, no bonuses. The components affect the high-mid-low slot layout, launcher and turret hardpoints, the hitpoints, and other basic stats like speed, scan strength, etc.
What this means is, while doing exotic things like turning your cruiser into a Cerberus where it was once an Eagle, the components just modify a ship's stats the way a normal module or rig does.
There appear to be no % bonuses to weapons, tank, speed, etc for T3 ships or components yet, if there ever will be. I'd personally like to see a bonus for each module equalling half the strength of a t1 or t2 bonus (2.5% bonus to shield resists or weapon damage per level, etc) but I don't see that happening.
So perhaps these ships will not be the crazy unpredictable wildcards we all want and dread. You won't see a T3 ship that has ewar capabilities of a recon. They'll be good fighting ships, but if all they can do is tank and spank, then it will be no different to flying or shooting at a hac. |
Khemul Zula
Amarr Keisen Trade League
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:08:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Khemul Zula on 11/02/2009 05:08:03 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Smiley is never wrong. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Minmatar MasterBlasters Inc. CORPVS DELICTI
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:10:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Khemul Zula Edited by: Khemul Zula on 11/02/2009 05:08:03 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Smiley is never wrong.
We doomed!!! |
James Malice
Gallente Coalition Of Resolution
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:11:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Surfin's PlunderBunny
Originally by: Khemul Zula Edited by: Khemul Zula on 11/02/2009 05:08:03 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Smiley is never wrong.
We doomed!!!
ADAPT OR DIE!
/thread :D |
Etria Issen
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:11:00 -
[5]
Everything new in MMOs is always thought it will break the game. Nothing new. |
Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:16:00 -
[6]
I hope I'm wrong. I hope CCP makes T3 ships so each component has a bonus and you can choose say, three out of five possible bonuses. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:17:00 -
[7]
also note that the ships are not finalized and whatnot |
bff Jill
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:19:00 -
[8]
They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them. |
Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:24:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton also note that the ships are not finalized and whatnot
But the basic mechanics of how they work have been finalized. Each ship has a core structure that you start with. Components are added like modules and they affect basic stats and appearance. The modifiable slot layout is the biggest benefit, but even that is meaningless if you can fly another ship that does the same job better. |
Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:27:00 -
[10]
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
This may be intentional on CCP's part, but on singularity, the component skills are all rank 1 and you only need level 1 in each skill to use all components. Get blown up with level 5 skills in all? That's 15-20 days of training to get them all back to level 5. Get blown up with level 3 skills? That's 15 hours to get back to where you were. Doesn't seem too painful to me. -- Eventus stultorum magister. |
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Khemul Zula
Amarr Keisen Trade League
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:27:00 -
[11]
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
Hand over the drugs now. You obviously can not handle them yourself.
------ I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:29:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton also note that the ships are not finalized and whatnot
But the basic mechanics of how they work have been finalized. Each ship has a core structure that you start with. Components are added like modules and they affect basic stats and appearance. The modifiable slot layout is the biggest benefit, but even that is meaningless if you can fly another ship that does the same job better.
maybe, but you don't know that, so your point is meh.
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bff Jill
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:30:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
This may be intentional on CCP's part, but on singularity, the component skills are all rank 1 and you only need level 1 in each skill to use all components. Get blown up with level 5 skills in all? That's 15-20 days of training to get them all back to level 5. Get blown up with level 3 skills? That's 15 hours to get back to where you were. Doesn't seem too painful to me.
If they have created a system where training the applicable skills to 5 HURTS your character and leaving them at 3 is a better idea, then its broken already.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:31:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
This may be intentional on CCP's part, but on singularity, the component skills are all rank 1 and you only need level 1 in each skill to use all components. Get blown up with level 5 skills in all? That's 15-20 days of training to get them all back to level 5. Get blown up with level 3 skills? That's 15 hours to get back to where you were. Doesn't seem too painful to me.
it was my impression that you lost 1 skill, so that is 4ish days with all at 5.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:32:00 -
[15]
Originally by: bff Jill
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
This may be intentional on CCP's part, but on singularity, the component skills are all rank 1 and you only need level 1 in each skill to use all components. Get blown up with level 5 skills in all? That's 15-20 days of training to get them all back to level 5. Get blown up with level 3 skills? That's 15 hours to get back to where you were. Doesn't seem too painful to me.
If they have created a system where training the applicable skills to 5 HURTS your character and leaving them at 3 is a better idea, then its broken already.
Q: does the risk of having the skill at 5 and maybe losing a few days of training time outweigh the benefits gained over only having level 3 skills?
A: we don't know, because it isn't finalized!
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:37:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton Q: does the risk of having the skill at 5 and maybe losing a few days of training time outweigh the benefits gained over only having level 3 skills?
A: we don't know, because it isn't finalized!
You're a little obsessed with finality, y'know that? Don't forget the post-patch nerfs or buffs, then the nerfs/buffs a year from now, and.. oh. Nothing is ever finalized. Shit. |
rValdez5987
Amarr 32nd Amarrian Imperial Navy Regiment.
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:41:00 -
[17]
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
Sorry but having to retrain a rank 1 skill a single level is no big deal. The isk cost isnt a big deal either, as ill be substituting my time making the ships for the isk cost.
Ill be flying them.
You can enjoy dying to me repeatedly and continue blabbering about how eve is broken and no one will fly T3. |
Khemul Zula
Amarr Keisen Trade League
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:43:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Khemul Zula on 11/02/2009 05:43:37
Originally by: rValdez5987
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
Sorry but having to retrain a rank 1 skill a single level is no big deal. The isk cost isnt a big deal either, as ill be substituting my time making the ships for the isk cost.
Ill be flying them.
You can enjoy dying to me repeatedly and continue blabbering about how eve is broken and no one will fly T3.
I was more wondering how they'll break the game if no one will be flying them.
But that works too. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:44:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton Q: does the risk of having the skill at 5 and maybe losing a few days of training time outweigh the benefits gained over only having level 3 skills?
A: we don't know, because it isn't finalized*!
You're a little obsessed with finality, y'know that? Don't forget the post-patch nerfs or buffs, then the nerfs/buffs a year from now, and.. oh. Nothing is ever finalized. Shit.
*where finalized specifically applies until the next patch when stats are free to be altered, by ccp and its affiliates. as defined by interstellar law: book 6, chapter 12, part 3, subsection 4, page 8, paragraph 2, line 4.
happy? |
Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:50:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
*where finalized specifically applies until the next patch when stats are free to be altered, by ccp and its affiliates. as defined by interstellar law: book 6, chapter 12, part 3, subsection 4, page 8, paragraph 2, line 4.
happy?
You forgot to add:
"It's all there, black and white, clear as crystal. You lose! Good day sir!" -- Eventus stultorum magister. |
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bff Jill
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:52:00 -
[21]
Originally by: rValdez5987
Originally by: bff Jill They will break the game.
As ive been saying all along, there is no point to risk SP loss to use them, therefore nobody will pvp with them, therefore t3 market will not exist, therefore w-space will be a failure.
Remove SP loss pentalty and people will use them sometimes instead of their hacs. Cruiser hulls are good for pvp so im sure people would find a use for them.
Sorry but having to retrain a rank 1 skill a single level is no big deal. The isk cost isnt a big deal either, as ill be substituting my time making the ships for the isk cost.
Ill be flying them.
You can enjoy dying to me repeatedly and continue blabbering about how eve is broken and no one will fly T3.
Losing it once is not a 'big deal'.
But if you are convinced that you will die one time only flying around in a t3 ship, you either only play a couple hours a day or your idea of eve pvp is camping a gate with 20 guys and falcon alts. In which case a cruiser hull is not the weapon of choice anyway.
Good job CCP, now people are even less willing to fight unless they know in advance they will win with out any losses.
Oh well. m10 is a carebear buff patch. Ive deleted all my characters and will be making a small army of miners, so i can play with myself.
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bff Jill
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Posted - 2009.02.11 05:54:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton Q: does the risk of having the skill at 5 and maybe losing a few days of training time outweigh the benefits gained over only having level 3 skills?
A: we don't know, because it isn't finalized*!
You're a little obsessed with finality, y'know that? Don't forget the post-patch nerfs or buffs, then the nerfs/buffs a year from now, and.. oh. Nothing is ever finalized. Shit.
*where finalized specifically applies until the next patch when stats are free to be altered, by ccp and its affiliates. as defined by interstellar law: book 6, chapter 12, part 3, subsection 4, page 8, paragraph 2, line 4.
happy?
I have never once in my 11 years of playing mmorpgs seen a bad idea in a patch not get pushed through to live. Once the devs release patch notes they are more or less satisfied with their patch and are getting ready to push it through. Once a beta is released its even more set in stone.
None of this matters to me. I am a happy space miner now. Boy i love me some hulk!
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.02.11 06:15:00 -
[23]
T3 ships can't possibly break the game. Even if they would be sporting above-battleship-level firepower and tanks (which they won't) with frigate-like agility and speed (not really) and recon-like ewar and cloaking abilities (nope, not that either), they STILL wouldn't break the game. Why ? Insane pricetags. If you look at the manufacture process and at expected material "incomes", you can only conclude they'll be selling at nearly capital ship levels in their finished form.
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Soporo
Caldari The Graduates Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.02.11 07:07:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Soporo on 11/02/2009 07:11:54
Originally by: Akita T T3 ships can't possibly break the game. Even if they would be sporting above-battleship-level firepower and tanks (which they won't) with frigate-like agility and speed (not really) and recon-like ewar and cloaking abilities (nope, not that either), they STILL wouldn't break the game. Why ? Insane pricetags. If you look at the manufacture process and at expected material "incomes", you can only conclude they'll be selling at nearly capital ship levels in their finished form.
All this.
Stuff from Gas clouds in extremely hostile and hard to access space that freekin moves around? POS reactions in probably hostile space too?
Sure they will be great/new/shiny/flashy/oooh! but it sounds like T3 will end up like all the other high isk ships: relegated to Tourney and maybe lvl 4's barring a very very few super rich crazy asses.
Expensive as f**k = almost never used for pvp. Expensive as f**k + uninsureable = lol screw that. Expensive as f**k + uninsureable + lolSPloss = ROFL! edit: talking sub-caps here naturally.
I hope I'm proven wrong, I really really do but....
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John Hollow
Minmatar Afterisk
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Posted - 2009.02.11 09:08:00 -
[25]
A little off-topic, but where are you getting all this info? As in that you loose skillpoints when you loose a T3 ship...also heard people talking about new abilities to redo skill training. I look through the dev blogs every day for new info, but haven't found this. I'd like to keep up to date :).
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.02.11 09:26:00 -
[26]
Originally by: John Hollow A little off-topic, but where are you getting all this info? As in that you loose skillpoints when you loose a T3 ship...also heard people talking about new abilities to redo skill training. I look through the dev blogs every day for new info, but haven't found this. I'd like to keep up to date :).
It's on the test server |
Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2009.02.11 09:44:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn I've gleaned this much information from playing around in Singularity so far:
There is only one T3 ship for each race. Each ship consists of a core infrastructure, on which the five components are mounted. The core itself appears to be generic with basic stats, no slots, only hull and low armor hitpoints with 10% resists, no weapons, no bonuses. The components affect the high-mid-low slot layout, launcher and turret hardpoints, the hitpoints, and other basic stats like speed, scan strength, etc.
What this means is, while doing exotic things like turning your cruiser into a Cerberus where it was once an Eagle, the components just modify a ship's stats the way a normal module or rig does.
There appear to be no % bonuses to weapons, tank, speed, etc for T3 ships or components yet, if there ever will be. I'd personally like to see a bonus for each module equalling half the strength of a t1 or t2 bonus (2.5% bonus to shield resists or weapon damage per level, etc) but I don't see that happening.
So perhaps these ships will not be the crazy unpredictable wildcards we all want and dread. You won't see a T3 ship that has ewar capabilities of a recon. They'll be good fighting ships, but if all they can do is tank and spank, then it will be no different to flying or shooting at a hac.
Big mistake making assumptions based on what is able to be observed from the current info on SISI. That's all I'm saying.
This part:
Quote: So perhaps these ships will not be the crazy unpredictable wildcards we all want and dread. You won't see a T3 ship that has ewar capabilities of a recon.
I think you'll be seeing that, and more.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam.
Death of Virtue is Recruiting
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Sade Onyx
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Posted - 2009.02.11 10:58:00 -
[28]
The problem will be that they are underpowered and not worth the risk.
It will be like level 5 missions all over again.
Judging from the reports of how insane the new NPC race are the issue will be wether or not T3 ships are worth all the bother.
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Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
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Posted - 2009.02.11 11:07:00 -
[29]
I will hold my judgement on T3 until it goes live; having lived through addition of all t2 ships but interceptor I have serious concerns that CCP will screw up and make their base stats uber. And if theyre uber in the same sense that t2 is over t1, then the pricetag will only determine how exclusive the godmode button will be. If that happens, and they're as rare as the sisi data would suggest then Eve is doomed--everyone who's not a 4+ year vet will either quit or carebear it in empire.
That being said, aside from the SP issues I like that they're customizable, but not totally insano hardcore base stats. Hopefully itll work out well. One thing though, I'd love if the models had a bit more alien look to them to emphasize how they're hybrid technology, not stock from one of the four races. _________________ [IMAGE REMOVED] -- aka Cpt Bogus -- Is that my torped sig cloaking your base?
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kor anon
Amarr The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.02.11 11:28:00 -
[30]
Lol look at all these fools whining about t3, when its not even finalized. Amazing how many people know better than a successful gaming company
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