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![Ordeum Ordeum](https://images.evetech.net/characters/567798091/portrait?size=64)
Ordeum
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:27:00 -
[1]
With the current price of a war declaration, an entire PvP alliance can terrorize a small high security space mining corp for just half the payout of an average level 4 mission (10 million isk). I'm not trying to get rid of the war dec system. I just think that a new, dynamic, price system would be more "fair". For example, It would cost more for an alliance to declare war on a corp than the other way around. Therefore, killing another corp/alliance would always be something that the whole group would have to commit too.
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![Sir Substance Sir Substance](https://images.evetech.net/characters/550056828/portrait?size=64)
Sir Substance
Minmatar MagiTech Alliance Inc. MagiTech Corp
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:55:00 -
[2]
its an old idea, and one that desperately needs implementing. supported.
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![Clansworth Clansworth](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1057768543/portrait?size=64)
Clansworth
Good Rock Materials
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:56:00 -
[3]
Well, you could, since the war decs constitute a 'bribe' to concord, base the price on how many people are going to be able to 'skip out' on concords attention, thereby making it based on the numbers of people in the war-dec'ing party.. dunno how that would play out though.
System Influence |
![Robert Caldera Robert Caldera](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1408803754/portrait?size=64)
Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:57:00 -
[4]
mh the other way around offers far more room for abuse since having many careless war targets for shooting at means much more fun/kills than the other way - having a frightened small corp sitting somewhere in the station.
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![Aidan Drake Aidan Drake](https://images.evetech.net/characters/885589757/portrait?size=64)
Aidan Drake
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:32:00 -
[5]
If the wardec costs were implemented as corp or alliance taxes, the cost would scale appropriately no matter how many people are involved.
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![Kahega Amielden Kahega Amielden](https://images.evetech.net/characters/826967717/portrait?size=64)
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2009.04.01 02:32:00 -
[6]
Firstly, the OP is a bit confused. The cost of a corp to corp war is 2 million ISK. For an alliance to dec someone, it costs 50 millions (More if the deccing alliance is already involved in a war).
That said, I like the spirit behind your idea, but all you'd do is encourage people to dump noob alts in their corps to up the dec cost. In practice, it's not a huge issue; a huge PVP alliance isn't going to dec some incredibly tiny mining corp that will just flee and/or dock up and, if they do, they'll get bored fast. They will generally go after larger-sized groups.
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![Mattk50 Mattk50](https://images.evetech.net/characters/512615458/portrait?size=64)
Mattk50
Caldari House Maadiah
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Posted - 2009.04.01 02:36:00 -
[7]
kahega: have you even heard of goonswarm?
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![Sir Substance Sir Substance](https://images.evetech.net/characters/550056828/portrait?size=64)
Sir Substance
Minmatar MagiTech Alliance Inc. MagiTech Corp
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Posted - 2009.04.01 03:49:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Clansworth Well, you could, since the war decs constitute a 'bribe' to concord
no, they dont. they consist of an official, above board declaration of outright war. its not a bribe, its a way of regulating warfare so people wont break the law to settle their differences.
for christs sake, i dont know who started that idea of war decs being a bribe. you cannot bribe an organisation that big.
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![Kahega Amielden Kahega Amielden](https://images.evetech.net/characters/826967717/portrait?size=64)
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2009.04.01 04:15:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 01/04/2009 04:16:28
Originally by: Mattk50 kahega: have you even heard of goonswarm?
Yes, goonswarm is definitely going to waste ISK deccing some 5-man mining corp when they could dec an Empire alliance 2x the size and get 20x the targets.
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![Fullmetal Jackass Fullmetal Jackass](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1265742717/portrait?size=64)
Fullmetal Jackass
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Posted - 2009.04.01 04:28:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Fullmetal Jackass on 01/04/2009 04:29:20 I favor a price modifier based on the difference in the total skill points of all characters in each organization.
Big pvp corp decs a tiny corp of noobs they pay through the nose.
Tiny pvp corp of newer players dec's a giant bloated corp full of alts, they pay less.
I'm thinking base price should be around 25 mil, corp vs corp with the same skill point total.
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![BlyTwo BlyTwo](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1145520712/portrait?size=64)
BlyTwo
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Posted - 2009.04.01 05:30:00 -
[11]
Edited by: BlyTwo on 01/04/2009 05:30:42 I think that wars should have to be accepted by both sides, because with CONCORD not allowing you to shoot anyone, just paying some simple isk to be able to shoot them is kind of defeating half of CONCORD's purpose... Because there are some corps that will find any reason to start a war, just because they feel like killing people. But the overall idea of large pvp corps fighting helpless small corps needs to be addressed.
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![Lear Hepburn Lear Hepburn](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1461034332/portrait?size=64)
Lear Hepburn
Caldari Ascendant Strategies Inc. The Transcendent
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Posted - 2009.04.01 08:02:00 -
[12]
How about a price per member of the organisation making the wardec? This makes it cheaper for small corps to make the dec and harder for large corps and could be scaled as such. The size of the target could also affect the price: if the target organisation is half the size of the deccing organisation then the cost is doubled, for example, and if the target is twice the size the cost is halved.
I've not fully thought the idea through, just throwing it out for debate...
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![Fullmetal Jackass Fullmetal Jackass](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1265742717/portrait?size=64)
Fullmetal Jackass
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Posted - 2009.04.01 08:42:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Lear Hepburn How about a price per member of the organisation making the wardec? This makes it cheaper for small corps to make the dec and harder for large corps and could be scaled as such. The size of the target could also affect the price: if the target organisation is half the size of the deccing organisation then the cost is doubled, for example, and if the target is twice the size the cost is halved.
I've not fully thought the idea through, just throwing it out for debate...
It's a possible solution, but I don't think it's ideal. I've had a 5 man pirate corp dec my 0.0 alliance so they could gank haulers in high sec.
Ya get a couple high skill point players in the same tiny corp, with a war dec vs a mixed high sec corp and it's kinda like using a scalpel on an over ripe peach.
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![Kel Nissa Kel Nissa](https://images.evetech.net/characters/552159742/portrait?size=64)
Kel Nissa
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Posted - 2009.04.01 17:33:00 -
[14]
people will abuse this feature idea
wardec while being a 1man corp plenty of pvp players joining the corp next day
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![Lear Hepburn Lear Hepburn](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1461034332/portrait?size=64)
Lear Hepburn
Caldari Ascendant Strategies Inc. The Transcendent
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Posted - 2009.04.01 17:49:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Kel Nissa people will abuse this feature idea
wardec while being a 1man corp plenty of pvp players joining the corp next day
Corp has to pay to allow each man to join at a cost equal to cost per player/time remaining on wardec. That or Concord declares war illegal as soon as someone joins corp.
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![Clain Matta Clain Matta](https://images.evetech.net/characters/552986150/portrait?size=64)
Clain Matta
Gallente Veteran's Department
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Posted - 2009.04.01 17:56:00 -
[16]
Better yet, get rid of concord, but provide sheltered systems for new players. All water should be shark infested except for those few safe islands.
Am I wrong?
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![Tobias Sjodin Tobias Sjodin](https://images.evetech.net/characters/680015770/portrait?size=64)
Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2009.04.01 17:56:00 -
[17]
Fair in my EVE? Never.
Go back to elves and rainbows in WoW.
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![Lear Hepburn Lear Hepburn](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1461034332/portrait?size=64)
Lear Hepburn
Caldari Ascendant Strategies Inc. The Transcendent
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Posted - 2009.04.01 17:59:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Clain Matta Better yet, get rid of concord, but provide sheltered systems for new players. All water should be shark infested except for those few safe islands.
Am I wrong?
[sarcasm]And we can call them things like Westfall and maybe one of the systems can be based around a giant tree.[/sarcasm]
Yes, you're wrong.
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![Spanner Frew Spanner Frew](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1847413429/portrait?size=64)
Spanner Frew
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Posted - 2009.04.01 18:17:00 -
[19]
I think there should be two methods of declaring war.
1) Just like it is now, same initial price. Each subsequent week the price increases 10 fold, with a certain amount of cooldown time so you can't just let it expire and re-dec at the original price. This discourages griefing while not completely eliminating the mechanic.
2) Declare war with a stated goal, the price is the same as now and remains the same for however long it takes. The goal would be selectable and along the lines of: kill X POSs, kill X ships, kill X pods, kill X isk value (raw material or average market, something). Things like that.
Once the goal is accomplished, the war is invalidated. If appropriate progress toward the goal is not made each week, the war is invalidated. If the defender doesn't undock or otherwise make it possible to make progress to the goal, then the war is still on, and perhaps at a reduced price. Obviously this would require tweaking.
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![Hyveres Hyveres](https://images.evetech.net/characters/802004663/portrait?size=64)
Hyveres
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.04.01 22:22:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Hyveres on 01/04/2009 22:27:25 Well I do agree , my own experience with wardeccing empire corps are kinda.. meh.
Basicly add more risk or more cost to declaring wars , a 10 man corp should not be able to ruin the day for a 200++ corp for weeks on end at no expense to themselves.
Heck basic strategy for more than a few empire warcorps seems to be altbased where alts are used to locate enemies before the main character logs on , warps to alt, ganks then logs off again in order to minimize risk. "Subtlety is a thing for philosophy, not combat. If you're going to kill someone, you might as well kill them a whole lot." - Vulcan Raven, The Last Days Of Foxhound |
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![Sir Substance Sir Substance](https://images.evetech.net/characters/550056828/portrait?size=64)
Sir Substance
Minmatar MagiTech Alliance Inc. MagiTech Corp
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Posted - 2009.04.01 23:47:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Clain Matta Better yet, get rid of concord, but provide sheltered systems for new players. All water should be shark infested except for those few safe islands.
Am I wrong?
yes.
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![Tobias Sjodin Tobias Sjodin](https://images.evetech.net/characters/680015770/portrait?size=64)
Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2009.04.02 22:21:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Ordeum "fair"
... is for fairies.
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![Gonada Gonada](https://images.evetech.net/characters/209423934/portrait?size=64)
Gonada
Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.04.02 22:42:00 -
[23]
stupid idea, due to the fact that right off the bat i can think of 3 ways to get around it.
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![Neesmah Neesmah](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1815850191/portrait?size=64)
Neesmah
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.04.02 23:15:00 -
[24]
Originally by: BlyTwo Edited by: BlyTwo on 01/04/2009 05:30:42 I think that wars should have to be accepted by both sides, because with CONCORD not allowing you to shoot anyone, just paying some simple isk to be able to shoot them is kind of defeating half of CONCORD's purpose... Because there are some corps that will find any reason to start a war, just because they feel like killing people. But the overall idea of large pvp corps fighting helpless small corps needs to be addressed.
I never like the idea of flaming, or making fun of other posts, so ill let his speak for itself, ill just highlight it in case you missed it ![Very Happy](/images/icon_biggrin.gif) Immensea |
![Sagittarius Voidsoul Sagittarius Voidsoul](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1827033112/portrait?size=64)
Sagittarius Voidsoul
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.04.03 03:50:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Sagittarius Voidsoul on 03/04/2009 03:50:34
Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Fair in my EVE? Never.
Go back to elves and rainbows in WoW.
To be fair,I never saw a rainbow in WoW...but plenty of talking cows. Thank starbucks I left THAT monstrosity. ------------------------------------------------ "Memento Mori" Remember you are mortal. |
![Lear Hepburn Lear Hepburn](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1461034332/portrait?size=64)
Lear Hepburn
Caldari Ascendant Strategies Inc. The Transcendent
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Posted - 2009.04.03 14:19:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Gonada stupid idea, due to the fact that right off the bat i can think of 3 ways to get around it.
Such as?
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