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Terron Kerrix
Osiris Mineral Exploration Inc. Unitary Enterprises
11
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Posted - 2013.01.15 17:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
In terms of the Charon and Orca. Specific
I would like to suggest the terms on insurance cover a year time.
The amount of percentage asked for insurance at the levels for a three month term is unacceptable.
Example: Charon for a premium coverage asks for 380mill for a three month term with a pay out. If you do not lose your ship in 9 months, you have basically payed for another Charon.
Same for an Orca. The ratio for cost of paying insurance and the short term needs to change.
I suggest, it you CCP are to leave the pricing alone then change the term of coverage for a year on ships
If you do not want to change the time of coverage, then reduce the cost of coverage by 70%.
Either way, The current insurance plan is fleecing the players.
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sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
592
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Posted - 2013.01.15 17:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Terron Kerrix wrote: In terms of the Charon and Orca. Specific
I would like to suggest the terms on insurance cover a year time.
The amount of percentage asked for insurance at the levels for a three month term is unacceptable.
Example: Charon for a premium coverage asks for 380mill for a three month term with a pay out. If you do not lose your ship in 9 months, you have basically payed for another Charon.
Same for an Orca. The ratio for cost of paying insurance and the short term needs to change.
I suggest, it you CCP are to leave the pricing alone then change the term of coverage for a year on ships
If you do not want to change the time of coverage, then reduce the cost of coverage by 70%.
Either way, The current insurance plan is fleecing the players.
+1
Encourage insurance coverage for people who don't normally lose boats = isk sink.
Right now, "insurance" is a silly excuse for isk faucet for ppl that lose their boat within the next half hour after buying, at the expense of Eve's economy. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
631
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Posted - 2013.01.15 17:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
If you don't like the insurance cost or duration and you think you don't need it because of that then uhm.... don't insure? f you're seriously asking for longer insurance duration while not paying more for it you you effectively want insurance to be cheaper... to have your cake and eat it. And in that case, I want 2 Ferrari's, a couple of houses on Malibu and a 17 inch ****.
Insurance cost is based on a portion of the mineral value to build the ship, deal with it. It's not meant to be cost effective, it's meant to lower the blow of losing your ship. Amat victoria curam. Excellence in everything.
Some guides that may be useful to you: http://www.youtube.com/user/OrdoArdish |
Terron Kerrix
Osiris Mineral Exploration Inc. Unitary Enterprises
12
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Posted - 2013.01.15 17:37:00 -
[4] - Quote
Vilnius Zar wrote:If you don't like the insurance cost or duration and you think you don't need it because of that then uhm.... don't insure? f you're seriously asking for longer insurance duration while not paying more for it you you effectively want insurance to be cheaper... to have your cake and eat it. And in that case, I want 2 Ferrari's, a couple of houses on Malibu and a 17 inch ****.
Insurance cost is based on a portion of the mineral value to build the ship, deal with it. It's not meant to be cost effective, it's meant to lower the blow of losing your ship.
You have completely missed the point. |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
631
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Posted - 2013.01.15 17:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Nope, I got it just right. You feel that insurance is too expensive to cover only 3 months so you want the same cost for the insurance but a prolonged duration. So instead of making the rational choice of either accepting the cost vs duration thing and insure OR concluding that it's just not worth it as you don't tend to lose your ship every 3 months and don't insure, you start whining on the forum how you want a longer insurance duration at the same cost (making it cheaper), you want to have your cake, and eat it... in caps.
Technically it's just a rant. Amat victoria curam. Excellence in everything.
Some guides that may be useful to you: http://www.youtube.com/user/OrdoArdish |
Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
281
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Posted - 2013.01.15 18:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
a more dynamic insurance would be nice but i doubt that it is gonna happen.
I dont lose ships anymore. I am a a jita price check/forum warrior alt. why is my insurance rate the same as the dessy ganker alts?
Why is this noncombat ship (freighter/orca/industrial) have the same insurance cost % as any other combat ship? and why shouldnt the players loss rates influence how much it costs to insure?
because of how the power creep has evolved concerning smaller ships and ehp buffers, the lack of added tankability of freighters (dcu II can work on titans but not on freighters?) means that its easier to kill them then before.
The ingame insurance is really geared towards pvp action and supporting that playstyle in isk at the expense of all the logistics that are necessary for supporting it in materials.
also to that other guy, unless you got a really good heart and a lot more muscle mass then you probably have now, you dont want a 17 inch thing, its hard to get hard and a 17 inch floppy pleases no one. you dont want the house(s) in Malibu, you want mansions and pick other locations too. the Ferrari s are your choice. personally id go with vehicles that are awesome and useful. Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.
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Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
2640
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Posted - 2013.01.15 18:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
So don't insure it.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Terron Kerrix
Osiris Mineral Exploration Inc. Unitary Enterprises
12
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Posted - 2013.01.15 18:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:So don't insure it.
-Liang
Thanks for that input. That was difficult for me to figure out. |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
631
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Posted - 2013.01.15 18:25:00 -
[9] - Quote
Terron Kerrix wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:So don't insure it.
-Liang Thanks for that input. That was difficult for me to figure out.
That's his point, and mine for that matter.
Amat victoria curam. Excellence in everything.
Some guides that may be useful to you: http://www.youtube.com/user/OrdoArdish |
Terron Kerrix
Osiris Mineral Exploration Inc. Unitary Enterprises
12
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Posted - 2013.01.15 19:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
I am glad folks are suggesting on how I should play and go about my eve.
This is a suggestion to CCP.
If you don't agree then just post I do not agree and state a constructive response.
If you agree the post such and a reason why or something you wish to add.
This posting is not about how you play or how you do your stuff or how I should play and make my eve decisions. |
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sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
592
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Posted - 2013.01.15 19:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
Vilnius Zar wrote:Terron Kerrix wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:So don't insure it.
-Liang Thanks for that input. That was difficult for me to figure out. That's his point, and mine for that matter.
Wrong. Boats not insured by ppl who don't lose boats = isk sink not taken advantage of. Eve economy needs less of insta-loss insurance isk faucet and more long term lossless insurance isk sink. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Minerva Zen
Swords of Valor
16
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Posted - 2013.01.15 19:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
Terron Kerrix wrote:I am glad folks are suggesting on how I should play and go about my eve.
And we're glad to help you with that.
Sometimes we get overzealous smacking down an idea because we have memories, either in EVE or elsewhere, of developer time being spent on marginal or outright disappointing gameplay changes. Developer time is, like it or not, a finite resource. And these storied forum pages are a place to fight over them.
As for the insurance question, calling it insurance in the first place is just window dressing over a hull-minerals-replacement-cost algorithm. If a real insurance company was running this, it would be losing money. |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
593
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Posted - 2013.01.15 19:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Minerva Zen wrote:Terron Kerrix wrote:I am glad folks are suggesting on how I should play and go about my eve. And we're glad to help you with that. Sometimes we get overzealous smacking down an idea because we have memories, either in EVE or elsewhere, of developer time being spent on marginal or outright disappointing gameplay changes. Developer time is, like it or not, a finite resource. And these storied forum pages are a place to fight over them. As for the insurance question, calling it insurance in the first place is just window dressing over a hull-minerals-replacement-cost algorithm. If a real insurance company was running this, it would be losing money.
And if a real mmo was running this, it would be fauceting currency and ruining economy. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Maeltstome
Mentally Assured Destruction
269
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Posted - 2013.01.15 20:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Don't buy platinum insurance. Buy 4x cheaper insurance.
There - you just gut 12 months of insurance for the same price as 3. |
Skorpynekomimi
372
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Posted - 2013.01.15 20:56:00 -
[15] - Quote
Yeah. That's why I don't insure any of my ships. I'd rather keep the cost of insurance, and just buy more when they get blown up.
And, frankly, if you rely on one and only one ship for your income that you literally can't afford to replace... Ur doin it rong. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
1819
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Posted - 2013.01.15 21:51:00 -
[16] - Quote
Terron Kerrix wrote:This is a suggestion to CCP. ... which must first be posted on a public section of the forums for all players to see and either state their like or dislike of it.
Terron Kerrix wrote:If you don't agree then just post I do not agree and state a constructive response. I do not agree. Insurance is a PvP mechanism to encourage people to do more risky things with their ships... not an actual insurance system that rewards you for staying out of trouble.
Terron Kerrix wrote:This posting is not about how you play or how you do your stuff or how I should play and make my eve decisions. In a way it is. You are proposing a change to the way the system works because you don't like how the system is "making you play" (see: paying for insurance that lasts only 3 months). So of course some people are going to point out that there are "workarounds" that do not require a change to the system.
Either stop paying for insurance and do less risky things... or suck it up. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Alua Oresson
Demon-War-Lords Fatal Ascension
254
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Posted - 2013.01.15 22:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Terron Kerrix wrote: In terms of the Charon and Orca. Specific
I would like to suggest the terms on insurance cover a year time.
The amount of percentage asked for insurance at the levels for a three month term is unacceptable.
Example: Charon for a premium coverage asks for 380mill for a three month term with a pay out. If you do not lose your ship in 9 months, you have basically payed for another Charon.
Same for an Orca. The ratio for cost of paying insurance and the short term needs to change.
I suggest, it you CCP are to leave the pricing alone then change the term of coverage for a year on ships
If you do not want to change the time of coverage, then reduce the cost of coverage by 70%.
Either way, The current insurance plan is fleecing the players.
Insurance is in place to encourage PVP. It is not meant to be something that is bought for a ship more than once.
Also, you are correct in that if you buy insurance for a ship more than twice you start becoming an isk sink rather than a faucet. To most people this is actually a good thing. We WANT people that don't understand how insurance works to keep the insurance up for years. This gets rid of more isk.
Overall I don't see that this idea actually solves any problems and in fact, creates more problems by turning low turnover ships into more possible isk faucets. http://pvpwannabe.blogspot.com/ |
GreenSeed
155
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Posted - 2013.01.15 22:31:00 -
[18] - Quote
insurance IS for people who die withing minutes of buying it...
if you don't expect to die within the first month, i have two words for you "Self Insurance".
if you call yourself an industrialist (why else would you care about freighter insurance otherwise...) you should know that part of your profit must be a self insurance, if you didn't, then sell all your assets, buy a few thousand rifters, and learn another trade, industry is not yours. |
Kasutra
Tailor Company Hashashin Cartel
124
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Posted - 2013.01.15 22:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:I do not agree. Insurance is a PvP mechanism to encourage people to do more risky things with their ships... not an actual insurance system that rewards you for staying out of trouble. Exactly. EVE Insurance isn't anything like an actual insurance firm. It's a betting bank where the bet of "I bet you won't lose this within 3 months". It's purpose, I'd guess, is to make people go out and get blown up. Making sure you can still feed your family if your Rorqual gets blown up just isn't part of it. |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
250
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Posted - 2013.01.15 23:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
Remove insurance. |
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sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
597
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Posted - 2013.01.16 00:10:00 -
[21] - Quote
Mara Pahrdi wrote:Remove insurance. Edit: I think I'm going to make this my signature .
+1 Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Alua Oresson
Demon-War-Lords Fatal Ascension
254
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Posted - 2013.01.16 11:32:00 -
[22] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:Mara Pahrdi wrote:Remove insurance. Edit: I think I'm going to make this my signature . +1
Indeed, let us penalize newer players by removing a mechanic that allows them to PVP more easily. You won't penalize older players by much doing this. Older players typically will fly the more blingy T2 or T3 ships that have much less of their price covered by insurance anyways. http://pvpwannabe.blogspot.com/ |
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers R O G U E
169
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Posted - 2013.01.16 12:02:00 -
[23] - Quote
Might i Suggest (once again) a "No Claims Bonus" the longer you go on insureing without claiming the less it costs for insureing new ships resetting only when you loose another insured ship. |
Griffin Omanid
Knights of the Zodiac
20
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Posted - 2013.01.16 14:33:00 -
[24] - Quote
ITTigerClawIK wrote:Might i Suggest (once again) a "No Claims Bonus" the longer you go on insureing without claiming the less it costs for insureing new ships resetting only when you loose another insured ship.
You mean you start with 200 % pay in, and with every insurance which runs out without payout it will reduced by 10 % until 50%, and if you loose an ship and you got paid by your insurance, the coast for new Insurances rises by 100 %.
The rise need to be so high to protect a bit before excessive abuse of the insurances. F.e. you could insure 15 cheap frigs over 3 month and then make a cheap insurance for a Capital. Proposal T2 BS Class Juggernaut |
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers R O G U E
172
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Posted - 2013.01.16 16:05:00 -
[25] - Quote
well i was thinking more timed over a longer period rather than per ship you insure. |
elitatwo
Congregatio
60
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Posted - 2013.01.16 17:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
Why not make the insurance an iterating and un-removable thing like your corporation rental fees?
Once you commit to your insurance the only thing that makes the insurance go away is the ship's demise and you start with a monthly fee of 200% of the premium insurance and after 6 months you'll get the monthly lower fee down to 50% and after a year down to 25% at the lowest but it will charge you every month never the less.
And for all you stupid people looking for isk sinks, my wallet is always starving, sponsor the poor and get fights or videos in return.
There you go, you have a sink! |
Tia Arnette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.17 16:30:00 -
[27] - Quote
I think the whole insurance thing is poop anyway, the cover is so small & I really don't know how it's worked out but I'd be suprised if you could buy enough minerals/ore to make a replacement even with l5 skills in everything.
true it helps a little for the starter ships fitted with lowtech cheap ass modules. so okay for those just starting out in the world of eve. But as soon as you so much a sniff faction or tech2 the insurance dosn't cover s*** & is not worth it. In my main chars hanger as an average a 200mill ship with 200mill+ worth of shineys (so 400ish mill) the insurance is roughly 10mill quarterly cost with 20(ish) mill pay out, so I might get a 20mill payout to soften the blow of losing 400mill worth of ship... whoop de do.
I would imagine this would be even more the case for the big industrial ships. Whats the payout for the orca & frieghters v what you can buy / build them for.
I havn't even bothered trying to do the maths on my shiney tengu with deadspace modules.
Dosn't take a genius to realise this really isn't worth it. If your flying rifters in null & getting through them on a daily basis then thats a different story & insurance is a good idea. if your flying a rifter in null for 3 months without losing it then chances are it's been living in your hanger or you don't play eve much. so for me the duration isn't the problem it's the payout.
So my conclusion is I don't fly with insurance & havn't done for awhile. Basically I just try to make more isk than I lose. It's a fine line, when in low sec or null I lose ships more often but the isk making opportunities are much better than high, when in high I rarely lose a ship but I need to grind for much longer.
Swings n roundabouts which I believe is exactly what ccp wanted.
maybe a better way of thinking would be to forget about it being called insurance & instead think of it more as a mate down the pub who says 2 to 1 odds, I bet you 10 mill you lose your ship in the next 3 months & you either say yay or nay.
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