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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Verunae Caseti
Viziam Amarr Empire
158
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:03:00 -
[61] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote: Same item from NEX store: Bypass everything and is created on the market. From nowhere. No gameplay related to it.
Right. That's the WHOLE POINT.
It's specifically designed to exist entirely outside the system and have no impact on or involvement in the economy. If it became an economic commodity, then it is no longer just a vanity store.
Nothing bought with AUT will ever change what a player is capable of in gameplay terms, and that is how it should be and remain. This is the very essence of vanity systems. They are for aesthetics ONLY. Never more. |
Marianne Pollard
Everyone's Irrelevant
82
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:07:00 -
[62] - Quote
Aurum tokens ensure that NEX items are a part of the player driven economy. Don't want red heels? Don't buy them.
Now, pipe down, or I'll have Plex removed from the game.
Wait, what? You don't want Plex removed because it allows you to pay for things?
*snigger* Mocking the afflicted since 2013. |
Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:12:00 -
[63] - Quote
Marianne Pollard wrote:Aurum tokens ensure that NEX items are a part of the player driven economy. Don't want red heels? Don't buy them.
Now, pipe down, or I'll have Plex removed from the game.
Wait, what? You don't want Plex removed because it allows you to pay for things?
*snigger*
Actually I would like both removed from the game, removing Plex means a lot less multiboxing madness.
This is about Aurum though. |
Spurty
912
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:14:00 -
[64] - Quote
Send me your arum. --- GÇ£If you think this Universe is bad, you should see some of the others.GÇ¥ GÇò Philip K. **** |
baltec1
Bat Country
7358
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:17:00 -
[65] - Quote
I forgot this was even in the game |
Verunae Caseti
Viziam Amarr Empire
161
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:26:00 -
[66] - Quote
Tristan Evernes wrote: Actually I would like both removed from the game, removing Plex means a lot less multiboxing madness.
...and a lot less demand for products due to fewer pilots. ...and less dense population so less PvP. ...and significantly less revenue for CCP. ...so, less content and fewer expansions. ...ultimately, less lifespan for EVE.
But, totally worth it 'cause, like, multiboxers and stuff. |
Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:34:00 -
[67] - Quote
So, you're opinion is that real money is fine untill it impact gameplay.
Now, tell me that isk don't affect gameplay, let me lol at you :D
Stealth pay2win is fine since is stealth uh? |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4398
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:47:00 -
[68] - Quote
Tristan Everness wrote:So, your opinion is that real money is fine untill it impact gameplay.
Now, tell me that isk don't affect gameplay, let me lol at you :D
Stealth pay2win is fine since is stealth uh?
Money to CCP = Better EvE? Are you sure? What about Dust? What about WoD? Well, to be honest, pay to win doesn't enter the picture in any way what so ever.
Pay to win is when an in game advantage can ONLY be purchased with cash, and cannot be obtained thru in game means. For example the way you used to only be able to pay for "Gold Ammo" in World of Tanks with real currency (before they came to their senses).
There is nothing in EVE (or that has been proposed for EVE) that fits that description.
Also EVE, DUST and WOD = CCP... and anything that benefits them in the long run benefits EVE. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
537
|
Posted - 2013.07.25 19:49:00 -
[69] - Quote
Verunae Caseti wrote:Sura Sadiva wrote: Same item from NEX store: Bypass everything and is created on the market. From nowhere. No gameplay related to it.
Right. That's the WHOLE POINT.
Yes. But in that post I was answering to someone else stating that after all also gold ammo sold in the Nex store would be the same. I was saying that even if the ammo were identical to the ones bought with ISK was not the same, not at all.
Anything bypassying gameplay and player driven economy is against EVE core design and philosphy. This is why NEX store and AUR should be removed too, and their items moved as a new layer of industry gameplay.
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Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:51:00 -
[70] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Tristan Everness wrote:So, your opinion is that real money is fine untill it impact gameplay.
Now, tell me that isk don't affect gameplay, let me lol at you :D
Stealth pay2win is fine since is stealth uh?
Money to CCP = Better EvE? Are you sure? What about Dust? What about WoD? Well, to be honest, pay to win doesn't enter the picture in any way what so ever. Pay to win is when an in game advantage can ONLY be purchased with cash, and cannot be obtained thru in game means. For example the way you used to only be able to pay for "Gold Ammo" in World of Tanks with real currency (before they came to their senses). There is nothing in EVE (or that has been proposed for EVE) that fits that description.
Wrong, pay2win is about have an advantage by paying with real money. Well, Pay2BeAdvantaged if it makes you feel better :) |
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4398
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:51:00 -
[71] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Verunae Caseti wrote:Sura Sadiva wrote: Same item from NEX store: Bypass everything and is created on the market. From nowhere. No gameplay related to it.
Right. That's the WHOLE POINT. Yes. But in that post I was answering to someone else stating that after all also gold ammo sold in the Nex store would be the same. I was saying that even if the ammo were identical to the ones bought with ISK was not the same, not at all. Anything bypassying gameplay and player driven economy is against EVE core design and philosphy. This is why NEX store and AUR should be removed too, and their items moved as a new layer of industry gameplay. Misunderstanding what Pay to Win means aside, I agree it's always better to include these items in the EVE economy/industrial base.
It's fine for CCP to have an assortment of items they can make cash directly from, as long as they are integrated into EVE in a healthy way (Blue Prints, Designs, etc.). To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4398
|
Posted - 2013.07.25 19:52:00 -
[72] - Quote
Tristan Everness wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Tristan Everness wrote:So, your opinion is that real money is fine untill it impact gameplay.
Now, tell me that isk don't affect gameplay, let me lol at you :D
Stealth pay2win is fine since is stealth uh?
Money to CCP = Better EvE? Are you sure? What about Dust? What about WoD? Well, to be honest, pay to win doesn't enter the picture in any way what so ever. Pay to win is when an in game advantage can ONLY be purchased with cash, and cannot be obtained thru in game means. For example the way you used to only be able to pay for "Gold Ammo" in World of Tanks with real currency (before they came to their senses). There is nothing in EVE (or that has been proposed for EVE) that fits that description. Wrong, pay2win is about have an advantage by paying with real money. Well, Pay2BeAdvantaged if it makes you feel better :) If you pay real money for that advantage, and I can just as easily pay ISK for that same advantage, then it's not an advantage now is it. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:03:00 -
[73] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:If you pay real money for that advantage, and I can just as easily pay ISK for that same advantage, then it's not an advantage now is it.
How simple to brainwah players :O
Does isk affect gameplay? Yes. Can you pay real money to have isk? Yes. Is there a difference between payin and gain isk in game? Yes, it's time.
And if you accept that someone can have such an advantage, why not introducing Plex for skillpoints? You can obtain skillpoint either you pay or not, isn't it the same? |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4398
|
Posted - 2013.07.25 20:15:00 -
[74] - Quote
Tristan Everness wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:If you pay real money for that advantage, and I can just as easily pay ISK for that same advantage, then it's not an advantage now is it. How simple to brainwash players :O Does isk affect gameplay? Yes. Can you pay real money to have isk? Yes. Is there a difference between payin and gain isk in game? Yes, it's time. And if you accept that someone can have such an advantage, why not introducing Plex for skillpoints? You can obtain skillpoint either you pay or not, isn't it the same? By the way, sorry if it's not clear, English is not my native language. LOL. Understanding the underlying mechanics being discussed does not equal brainwashing.
I can easily pay for something with ISK that would break most peoples personal gaming budget... and the time invested is minimal. I have a very efficient income stream in game.
Feel free to purchase any in game advantage you like with cash, and I'll go grab the same thing with ISK.
By the way, you can already purchase skill points with PLEX. Implants purchased with PLEX, or more directly simply purchasing a highly skill character off of the bazaar. Of course, PLEX can be obtained with either ISK or cash.
Don't worry about the language thing, I understand you (and I'm certainly not trying to get hateful with you). No worries.
Consider this.
I have several accounts and can easily fund all of them with ISK in a trivial amount of time (around an hour or so effort a month).
I choose not to, primarily because I feel EVE is a game I'm willing to support directly with my money.
By your definition, because I pay for my game time with cash instead of spending time in game earning the ISK to do so, I am guilty of Pay to Win.
Do you begin to see the flaws in your definition yet? To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
537
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:25:00 -
[75] - Quote
Tristan Everness wrote:[quote=Ranger 1] Does isk affect gameplay? Yes. Can you pay real money to have isk? Yes.
Is not exactly the he same.
Under the current system you don't buy ISK for real money; you buy Plex that you can trade with another player for ISK.
However those ISK are not created from nowhere by the system. Are created by other player's gameplay and transfered to you. IMO This is still accettable, since does not inject isk or other goods in the system, only move them from a player to another.
Not saying this si good, only that is tollerable and doesn't corrupt the whole system as would be if you paid real money and ISK were created by the system from nowhere.As happens in almost any other MMORPG.
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Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:29:00 -
[76] - Quote
Well, you're just trying to diminish the advantage that someone willing to spend money could have by using the Plex system. That advantage is still there though, i'm glad that people can play without having to spend their money, but I still think it would be a better game without Plexes, Aurum and every macro-micro-transaction that affect the game.
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Obunagawe
195
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:29:00 -
[77] - Quote
Tristan Everness wrote: Actually I would like both removed from the game, removing Plex means a lot less multiboxing madness.
Tristan Everness wrote: WAAAAAH, REMOVE PLEX SO I CAN WIN EVE WITH ALL MY FRIENDS WHO I DONT EVEN LIKE OR TALK TO
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Tristan Everness
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:31:00 -
[78] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:
Is not exactly the he same.
Under the current system you don't buy ISK for real money; you buy Plex that you can trade with another player for ISK.
However those ISK are not created from nowhere by the system. Are created by other player's gameplay and transfered to you. IMO This is still accettable, since does not inject isk or other goods in the system, only move them from a player to another.
Not saying this si good, only that is tollerable and doesn't corrupt the whole system as would be if you paid real money and ISK were created by the system from nowhere.As happens in almost any other MMORPG.
I agree with you, my main problem is with Aurum actually. |
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