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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2060
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 03:11:40 -
[961] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:
you could fly a MWD merlin almost straight at that Tornado and it would miss each and every time (apart from wrecking obviously). Versus a MWD Caracal you'd easily lose about 30% applied damage if he'd approach at ~10 degree angle, get it to 20 degrees and the applied damage becomes negligible. And it's not like those ships are the fastest & low sig representatives of their ship class.
http://imgur.com/lQiERIX
Tornado firing 1400mm at a MWD merlin in a straight line with Quake L and no other mods fitted. |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 03:58:36 -
[962] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:You'll notice his corp is "Say No to Features".
That set aside. What in the actual F#CK???
If you fly a Merlin straight at a Tornado, you will be blasted into Oblivion. If that Merlin is also running MWD, you might as well eject, because that Tornado will 1 shot you off the field.
As far as his suggestion of "non-realistic" scenarios. I have blasted frigs off the field with an Tach fitted Oracle several times. I can counter tracking issues by countering traversal, I can catch them on alignment, and I can catch them on a turn. All of this without tracking mods.
Sniper fits rely HEAVILY on catching the target out of traversal. Not too long back, just about everyone had a Tornado with 1400s sitting 200km off the gate blasting ships as soon as they came out of cloak... If you came at them, they'd warp to another Snip position and blast you from there.
I would Like Tiberius Heth to name me one time where he has seen a missile boat used for sniping. If he can, the I'll call him a flat out liar.
So in your hyperbole you forget to actually read. I said ALMOST straight and it's true. A frigate lolling about with some transversal is almost never going to get hit by 1400s at any range (again bar wrecking shots). |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 03:59:54 -
[963] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Tiberius Heth wrote:
you could fly a MWD merlin almost straight at that Tornado and it would miss each and every time (apart from wrecking obviously). Versus a MWD Caracal you'd easily lose about 30% applied damage if he'd approach at ~10 degree angle, get it to 20 degrees and the applied damage becomes negligible. And it's not like those ships are the fastest & low sig representatives of their ship class.
http://imgur.com/lQiERIX Tornado firing 1400mm at a MWD merlin in a straight line with Quake L and no other mods fitted.
Which part of "almost" don't you get. Give it some angle, show us the results. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
884
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 04:44:14 -
[964] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Joe Risalo wrote:You'll notice his corp is "Say No to Features".
That set aside. What in the actual F#CK???
If you fly a Merlin straight at a Tornado, you will be blasted into Oblivion. If that Merlin is also running MWD, you might as well eject, because that Tornado will 1 shot you off the field.
As far as his suggestion of "non-realistic" scenarios. I have blasted frigs off the field with an Tach fitted Oracle several times. I can counter tracking issues by countering traversal, I can catch them on alignment, and I can catch them on a turn. All of this without tracking mods.
Sniper fits rely HEAVILY on catching the target out of traversal. Not too long back, just about everyone had a Tornado with 1400s sitting 200km off the gate blasting ships as soon as they came out of cloak... If you came at them, they'd warp to another Snip position and blast you from there.
I would Like Tiberius Heth to name me one time where he has seen a missile boat used for sniping. If he can, the I'll call him a flat out liar. So in your hyperbole you forget to actually read. I said ALMOST straight and it's true. A frigate lolling about with some transversal is almost never going to get hit by 1400s at any range (again bar wrecking shots).
Frig is flying slightly towards my right... i'll go right as well to cut traversal.
Either way, you have a LOT better chance of getting a kill shot on that frig than a cruise missile does. Cruise might hit it, but they'll need to hit it 20 times to kill it. One shot from your 1400s, and it's gone. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2060
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 04:59:44 -
[965] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Tiberius Heth wrote:
you could fly a MWD merlin almost straight at that Tornado and it would miss each and every time (apart from wrecking obviously). Versus a MWD Caracal you'd easily lose about 30% applied damage if he'd approach at ~10 degree angle, get it to 20 degrees and the applied damage becomes negligible. And it's not like those ships are the fastest & low sig representatives of their ship class.
http://imgur.com/lQiERIX Tornado firing 1400mm at a MWD merlin in a straight line with Quake L and no other mods fitted. Which part of "almost" don't you get. Give it some angle, show us the results.
http://imgur.com/ktJAvV1
Merlin with an actual fit instead of naked and 1 tracking comp on the nado.
is 10 degree almost enough? |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 05:14:15 -
[966] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Frig is flying slightly towards my right... i'll go right as well to cut traversal.
Either way, you have a LOT better chance of getting a kill shot on that frig than a cruise missile does. Cruise might hit it, but they'll need to hit it 20 times to kill it. One shot from your 1400s, and it's gone.
Here's some graphs
0 angle, a bit of angle and some 30 degree angle. max dps with fit (is an incomplete fit but that doesn't change anything in this regard) is 691. I even use Quake to increase the chances of success.
With a little bit of angle only 110 dps remains which is about 16%, so on average about every 6 volleys that's going to hit. Cycle time is just over 16 seconds resulting in one single hit every 103 seconds (resulting in a kill). In the mean time the Merlin could have covered close to 3k km.
With 30 degrees of angle only 28 dps remains. [math happens]... once every 410 seconds, on average.
And with small angles having THAT much of an impact, the chance of your amazing piloting skills making up for it all resulting in anywhere decent chance to hit is... still the same. VERY low. |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 05:17:33 -
[967] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:RNI and Ratle shoot the correct missiles (caldari navy because rage would be stupid...) and of course since I proabbly "cheated" by using a tracaking comp on teh nado, I put a guidance computer II on both missile ships with precision script.
Nono, remove both:) Their statement was that turrets don't need tracking modules. I already agreed to the fact that the guidance mods aren't up to par and need rebalancing.
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2060
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 05:49:44 -
[968] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:RNI and Ratle shoot the correct missiles (caldari navy because rage would be stupid...) and of course since I proabbly "cheated" by using a tracaking comp on teh nado, I put a guidance computer II on both missile ships with precision script. Nono, remove both:) Their statement was that turrets don't need tracking modules. I already agreed to the fact that the guidance mods aren't up to par and need rebalancing.
What's the fudge factor on piloting skill? I'm pretty sure you could reduce the angular velocity to nothing if the merlin is far enough at a slight angle but there is no way in hell to really account for that in a graph.
no comp at all and 15 degree...
http://imgur.com/9g0dtbM
or 20...
http://imgur.com/YC3SMyD
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Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 06:09:28 -
[969] - Quote
Fairly similar to my numbers as yours is a fitted merlin while mine is an empty one as it's a decent average for all the other frigs.
Simply put: that merlin could fly around for a LONG time before it would finally get hit and this whole "turrets don't need tracking modules, see how OP they are. Please buff missiles so they have 100% application" is silly nonsense. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
884
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 15:34:18 -
[970] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Fairly similar to my numbers as yours is a fitted merlin while mine is an empty one as it's a decent average for all the other frigs.
Simply put: that merlin could fly around for a LONG time before it would finally get hit and this whole "turrets don't need tracking modules, see how OP they are. Please buff missiles so they have 100% application" is silly nonsense.
No one said or suggested any of that... If they did, that person is wrong.
We are simply stating that it is possible to have an effective turret boat without the use of tracking bonuses or Modules.
However, a missile as any range will always require at least one application mod to apply full damage. The only time this doesn't apply is when the ship is a larger class than the missiles are intended for. |
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Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 15:54:15 -
[971] - Quote
Yes, they did. It's just that most of it got deleted. Here's some of the stuff that's still there.
elitatwo wrote:Let's put it this way, you don't need to put any kind of application module on any turret boat and can still hit stuff. Missile ships HAVE to put at least two of those on to do any considerable amount of damage if any.
Poking things with one hitpoint cannot be considered as 'they always hit'.
elitatwo wrote:Thank you, akfalt. Actually I meant my Confessor which kills ships just fine without application mods or heat sinks, so my lasers hit just fine and even in a ship like a Nightmare you just need to position yourself in a way that lowers your transversal and even the smallest ships go boom.
This hilarious post
And this one
This one is also great
So, how about people stop making overly exaggerated claims and obviously construed scenarios to act as basis for silly changes that make no sense whatsoever. And instead focus on realistic, balanced and workable ideas and solutions.
- diminish the target speed factor in the whole damage calculation, not to zero (I'm looking at you e2) but lower it to a point where it works fine. This is to counteract the loss of application due to the rigor/flare rig stacking penalty changes
- do so slightly more for HML
- up the stats on the application bonus of the guidance modules, leave range alone
- then decide to leave HML as is or drop range by a bit allowing for a slight flat dps buff. I'm talking small numbers here, 5% or so
Suddenly missiles work better where an MGC is a viable module for some situations (but obviously not all). Will that counter the Petes? No it won't because they're Petes for a reason: difficult to counter. You don't balance by bringing other stuff up to the same lvl as hilariously overpowered nonsense, you do it by nuking that nonsense's capabilities which in this case are medium rails, T3 nonsense and gang links. |
elitatwo
Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team
759
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 17:42:11 -
[972] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:some stuff and keeps attacking me..
Listen, kid, only my friends are allowed to call me e2 and you are not one of them. IF you need to talk to me my first name is 'your majesty' and no, I do not make jokes - puns sometimes or sarcasm but I do not make jokes.
With that out of the way, how in the Empress name can you even talk about high level weapon balance with 2 days of skill training? Have you even ever flown a ship?
When I read from Kagura or baltec1 or James and many others I know that they have and that they can steer a discussion into a proper direction. What Nevyn proposed sounds worth my while and I can very safely say that he knows what he is talking about, so will listen what each and all of them have to say. We may or not agree on anything but that is fine. That doesn't mean that either of us is wrong or right.
That tornado example was meant for Lloyd Roses in response to his question. Rest assured, I know he is a very capable pilot and even though I don't use minmatar tech, he knowns that I know my turrets.
This totally ignored feedback thread is about missile application mods that are not worth the slot they want us to put them in and just like that Incarna debacle they didn't listen.
I have been around here for nine years. In any company I would be senior executive something by now. Wether or not CCP finds it amusing or listens what I say, people tend to give you the benefit of a doubt with that much experience and listen to me. What I don't want is for everyone to like me or vanity, nor do I seek attention. But I can ask that my fellow capsuleer show me at least some kind of respect.
You do not.
Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
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Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
44
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 18:09:42 -
[973] - Quote
And you've just outed yourself to be a clown, well done.
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ISD Decoy
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
848
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 00:53:08 -
[974] - Quote
I've removed an off-topic post.
Quote:27. Off-topic posting is prohibited.
Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued to the off-topic poster.
ISD Decoy
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
197
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 02:14:42 -
[975] - Quote
finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
886
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 04:30:40 -
[976] - Quote
Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective.
May I ask what you're flying in?
I fly a Golem and have tried them with both Torps and cruise. In both cases, 3 TPs or 2tps and a web always performed better.
I don't need the range for cruise, and if I try to use them to add range to Torps, then I lose application. That said, my max lock range is 118km, and my TPs seem to still be more effective at that range, dispite being well out of optimal.
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
197
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 05:19:32 -
[977] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective. May I ask what you're flying in? I fly a Golem and have tried them with both Torps and cruise. In both cases, 3 TPs or 2tps and a web always performed better. I don't need the range for cruise, and if I try to use them to add range to Torps, then I lose application. That said, my max lock range is 118km, and my TPs seem to still be more effective at that range, dispite being well out of optimal.
purifier, max lock range of 97 navy torps to 96.5 with range script 87 with no script and 81km off or with precision script. really wanted to get to 100-110km range so I would always be in range when I land and the old set up did this with javs (boo lower dps) or 87km with navy torps. On the new one javs are pointless so most of the range is lost cause of lock range and the loss of dps from javs is more than the couple of seconds to get in range of target.
so i don't have many lows or mids to put into application. they replaced a sensor booster and a co-pro and a missile range rig for 1 low slot, 1 mid slot and a targeting range rig, now needs implants but I don't mind giving up the slot in my head to make it fit.
also before commenting this is for missions in FW which are all single kill ones or 6 targets (don't does these) |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
46
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 06:49:06 -
[978] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective. May I ask what you're flying in? I fly a Golem and have tried them with both Torps and cruise. In both cases, 3 TPs or 2tps and a web always performed better. I don't need the range for cruise, and if I try to use them to add range to Torps, then I lose application. That said, my max lock range is 118km, and my TPs seem to still be more effective at that range, dispite being well out of optimal.
Again, the Golem gets bonused TP so you're never EVER going to see a reason to fit them there, unless you want the range. Also TP is binary, they either will work or they don't and at 100km they have a bout a 50% chance to apply (assuming maxed TP skills). |
Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
46
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 06:52:55 -
[979] - Quote
Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective.
Previously it made the most sense to fit 2 rigors (being a T2 ship), now it makes more sense to fit 1 rigor and 1 flare and even with a precision script MGC you will perform LESS than before the changes when you'd just use rigs. That's the big gripe, the actual problem: due to the stacking changes you're now forced to waste a mid slot while still doing worse than before. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
886
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 07:16:52 -
[980] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Joe Risalo wrote:Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective. May I ask what you're flying in? I fly a Golem and have tried them with both Torps and cruise. In both cases, 3 TPs or 2tps and a web always performed better. I don't need the range for cruise, and if I try to use them to add range to Torps, then I lose application. That said, my max lock range is 118km, and my TPs seem to still be more effective at that range, dispite being well out of optimal. Again, the Golem gets bonused TP so you're never EVER going to see a reason to fit them there, unless you want the range. Also TP is binary, they either will work or they don't and at 100km they have a bout a 50% chance to apply (assuming maxed TP skills).
Oh, well aware. I was just pointing out that well outside of optimal, they still perform significantly better. That said, I had fitted up a Manticore the same way, and had the same general outcome. Regardless of range, the TPs outperformed the MGC 2 with precision script.
While I'm at it, I'd also like to point out a couple things. 1) most systems that would be best served by the range bonus are also the ones that are more reliant on the application bonus. IE, short range missile and HMLs. Long range missiles are less reliant on application and range. So it's a catch 22 for shorts, and redundant for longs.
2) Notice how no one speaks of the MGE... It's useless in all cases. |
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Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
527
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 07:29:44 -
[981] - Quote
I agree that, yes, the divide between TP's and these modules are far less pronounce with cases where you can neither afford to bring a plethora of TP's nor when there are bonused from the hull like the Golem.
Having said that, I agree with Joe on the sentiment that TP's still have a pretty sizable edge over MGC's 1 to 1, bonuses or not. And, we actually have mentioned the MGE once or twice...even if only to state how they do absolutely bubkiss compared to alternative lows.
"Tomahawks?"
"----in' A, right?"
"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."
"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
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Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
46
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 07:38:50 -
[982] - Quote
Sobaan Tali wrote:I agree that, yes, the divide between TP's and these modules are far less pronounce with cases where you can neither afford to bring a plethora of TP's nor when there are bonused from the hull like the Golem.
Having said that, I agree with Joe on the sentiment that TP's still have a pretty sizable edge over MGC's 1 to 1, bonuses or not. And, we actually have mentioned the MGE once or twice...even if only to state how they do absolutely bubkiss compared to alternative lows.
True but MGC have two things in their favour:
1) they don't need to be activated per target. Which ever way you look at it manually painting each and every target is annoying as hell, in pve anyway. 2) they work regardless of range, not really useful when using the short range missiles but when using heavies at their max or better yet Cruise then TP are going to struggle at longer ranges
Doesn't make up for the fact that well fitted ships now perform worse than before the changes but they are useful no matter what. Would MGC/missiles get balanced to where they should be those two will be massive boons. |
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
527
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 08:08:16 -
[983] - Quote
Also true, they are not without their selling points. On top of those abilities, the MGC's can be scripted to focus on either or, too. Personally, though, I don't feel they are quite enough to make up for their shortcomings. Again, personally, mind you. I'm sure others can and will find ways to make them work well enough for them. I do think the fact that missiles in general have not been given an intimate balancing pass only helps to corrode those advantages in my mind and maybe others as well, so perhaps they will in a much better place afterwards. Tough to say until after missiles are tended to more properly.
"Tomahawks?"
"----in' A, right?"
"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."
"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
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Caleb Seremshur
Gladiators of Rage RAZOR Alliance
588
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 08:41:52 -
[984] - Quote
Most missiles are balanced around having bleed on a single-webbed AB target of the same size. At least that's what I see. If you can apply 2 webs to a target then things get exciting (also you no longer have a need for mgc unless the enemy are overloaded on links or oversized AB).
A fairly capable fleet of hml could conceivably consist of a pair of huginns with 1tp 1web and any damage bonused ship with a single mgc in the mid per ship. If you wanted to get really pedantic there are other things you could add but for a basic missile fleet this is functional.
Veteran and solo/small gang PVP advocate.
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
886
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 16:27:03 -
[985] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Most missiles are balanced around having bleed on a single-webbed AB target of the same size. At least that's what I see. If you can apply 2 webs to a target then things get exciting (also you no longer have a need for mgc unless the enemy are overloaded on links or oversized AB).
A fairly capable fleet of hml could conceivably consist of a pair of huginns with 1tp 1web and any damage bonused ship with a single mgc in the mid per ship. If you wanted to get really pedantic there are other things you could add but for a basic missile fleet this is functional.
That's putting a whole lot of faith into a small amount of ships for the application of the entire fleet. You'd be better off dropping the MGC and having everyone fit a TP. |
Caleb Seremshur
Gladiators of Rage RAZOR Alliance
588
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 17:12:56 -
[986] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:Most missiles are balanced around having bleed on a single-webbed AB target of the same size. At least that's what I see. If you can apply 2 webs to a target then things get exciting (also you no longer have a need for mgc unless the enemy are overloaded on links or oversized AB).
A fairly capable fleet of hml could conceivably consist of a pair of huginns with 1tp 1web and any damage bonused ship with a single mgc in the mid per ship. If you wanted to get really pedantic there are other things you could add but for a basic missile fleet this is functional. That's putting a whole lot of faith into a small amount of ships for the application of the entire fleet. You'd be better off dropping the MGC and having everyone fit a TP.
And still get speed tanked once the sigR portion of the formula reaches 1?
Veteran and solo/small gang PVP advocate.
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
886
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 17:37:35 -
[987] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Joe Risalo wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:Most missiles are balanced around having bleed on a single-webbed AB target of the same size. At least that's what I see. If you can apply 2 webs to a target then things get exciting (also you no longer have a need for mgc unless the enemy are overloaded on links or oversized AB).
A fairly capable fleet of hml could conceivably consist of a pair of huginns with 1tp 1web and any damage bonused ship with a single mgc in the mid per ship. If you wanted to get really pedantic there are other things you could add but for a basic missile fleet this is functional. That's putting a whole lot of faith into a small amount of ships for the application of the entire fleet. You'd be better off dropping the MGC and having everyone fit a TP. And still get speed tanked once the sigR portion of the formula reaches 1?
And this is part of why missiles aren't that popular in fleets..
However, you're always going to need tackle, but having a dedicated TP boat, when you can just put 1 TP on each ship, is a waist of a pilot. |
Caleb Seremshur
Gladiators of Rage RAZOR Alliance
588
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 03:55:19 -
[988] - Quote
And that depends entirely on the level of engagement. If we presume this fight takes place in lowsec then every missile ship is fitting a point and a tp. That's 1/3rd of your slots on the generous ships. Prop mod that's either half or 1 slot left.
I'd rather invest in a couple of dedicated boats at that point.
Veteran and solo/small gang PVP advocate.
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Oxide Ammar
208
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 11:37:44 -
[989] - Quote
[Nemesis, Alpha Strike Nemesis]
Missile Guidance Enhancer II Ballistic Control System II
1MN Afterburner II Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Precision Script Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Precision Script Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Inferno Javelin Torpedo Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Inferno Javelin Torpedo Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Inferno Javelin Torpedo Covert Ops Cloaking Device II [Empty High slot]
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Zainou 'Gypsy' CPU Management EE-603 Zainou 'Deadeye' Missile Projection MP-703 Zainou 'Deadeye' Guided Missile Precision GP-803 Zainou 'Deadeye' Target Navigation Prediction TN-903 Crash Booster
7.3k/s torp speed, 186m explosion radius overheated
still torpedoes flight time sucks though, since range is your tank.
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
197
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Posted - 2015.07.27 02:09:46 -
[990] - Quote
Tiberius Heth wrote:Lady Rift wrote:finally got off my butt to log in and fit these mods. I like them for my pve. for the same range i get a sub 300 exp radius and 180 exp vel vs 330 and 160. plus i can get more application if I wanted to get closer. Had to change a rig and use implants for fitting to get a low and a mid to fit.
I'm really curious how strong it would of been prenerf. As i like them currently for my needs. and more range and application can only make my pve more effective. Previously it made the most sense to fit 2 rigors (being a T2 ship), if you now use a MGC it makes more sense to fit 1 rigor and 1 flare and even with a precision script MGC you will perform LESS than before the changes when you'd just use rigs. That's the big gripe, the actual problem: due to the stacking changes you're now forced to waste a mid slot while still doing worse than before.
expect that I don't have the rig slots after range rigs for either flare or rigor. Also only ever shooting at structures and battleships in the mission I do so 337 exp radius and 160m/s exp velocity without implants or drugs gets me enough application most of the time.
Now I can get the range out of other mods and with knowledge of the mission more application if range is already good enough.
Now I could go really bling and start to use faction BCS and then a 3rd BCS one of them makes more sense than the MGE but I still find that a little cost prohibitive.
Well now i see it in EFT I might have to try it.
[Purifier, stupid bling] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Ballistic Control System II
1MN Afterburner II Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Range Script Medium Shield Extender II
Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Polarized Torpedo Launcher, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Covert Ops Cloaking Device II [empty high slot]
Small Ionic Field Projector II Small Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II
can bling out the afterburner also. 794dps with my skills 811 all V. 3rd navy BCS only nets another 10dps. only needs 6% cpu which is geno's + 1% slot 6. targeting range of 97km navy missile range of 89 with range script.
of course once I start feeling/wanting to min-max everything then a 3 link booster will start following me around I think.
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