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Skill training queue system wanted!

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Vicky Steel	Posted - 2007.06.04 15:08:00 - [1] Am I the only one tired of loging in just to discover i forgot to set a new skill for traing? I wich there was a queue system for skills to be trained, so u could set 5 skills and sleep good at night or if your computer brakes and are gone for a week u still know it,s ok since the last skills is a long one that you dont need right now. Or atlest that the skill u was training just contineu with the next level on the same skill would be a relife. /Vicky S
Elhina Novae Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.06.04 15:45:00 - [2] the problem with a queue is character farming... that people set up a big queue and start farming characters for free for months. Imo you could have a skill queue that gets de-activated when pay time's out. Somebody set up us the bomb
Dyavn Ryyre Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.06.04 21:11:00 - [3] I like the continuing to the next level idea. ________________________________________________ Originally by: "Alumion" Welcome to EVE, where many wars are started over forum posts.
BOBHOPE Black Omega Security GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.06.04 21:19:00 - [4] this has been requested to death in the last 4 years. dont hold your breath.......
lyrenna Caldari	Posted - 2007.06.05 01:36:00 - [5] a dual queue with stop training after payment expire can make eve experience much much better. ============================ when you armor tank a raven god kills a kitten. Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria!!! "sig hijack!" ============================
Esu Nahalas RONA Midgard Academy	Posted - 2007.06.05 16:33:00 - [6] Originally by: Elhina Novae the problem with a queue is character farming... that people set up a big queue and start farming characters for free for months. Yeah, instead of calling it a "skill training queue," you could call it "easy button for character-sellers on E-bay."
Bahk Naar	Posted - 2007.06.06 17:21:00 - [7] The arguments of "character farming" are completely ridiculous. That would ONLY be true if the system were designed by a complete moron. Being able to queue up 1 SKILL would not create a mass influx of character farmers. Nor would it be the "easy button" for selling toons on ebay. The only thing this would do is GREATLY ENHANCE THE PLAYER EXPERIENCE FOR EVERYONE and it would do so at virtually no risk. It's honestly ridiculous that this hasn't been done. The only reasons I can see for this not being done are either: - Fussing over different options and not being able to actually decide what's "best" (in which case, pick something and test it) or - Devs are completely put off by what are completely erroneous risks Either way, I think this should be prioritized. In a persistent game world with a training system such as this, queuing up 1 skill seems like a beyond reasonable thing to implement.... even an expected thing to have. I love eve and am quite happy with the game, but I have yet to hear a convincing argument as to why this isn't done. The "character farming" argument is just silly.
Taran Summers The Merovingians	Posted - 2007.06.06 19:46:00 - [8] Edited by: Taran Summers on 06/06/2007 19:46:38 If account = paid then advance to next skill in queue else stop. There, problem solved with character farming. Queue pleze!
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.06.07 05:47:00 - [9] Not again Eve is lucky enough to HAVE an offline training mode... however, we are supposed to log in every now and again... it encourages game immersion, forming bonds and CARING about your character separately from whether training Advanced Spaceship Command to 5 has finished yet. Just play the game; why else do you pay the monthly fee? Accept that sometimes a skill will have finished off before you log in... it's not like you have stepped on your nephew's head and watched his brains ooze out.... or would you rather have to go collect 200 Nerfed Gamezes Hides to go up a tenth of a level? Count your blessings, m8. We can't and don't always get what we want. Be glad in Eve we get what we (perhaps) deserve.
Esu Nahalas RONA Midgard Academy	Posted - 2007.06.07 16:48:00 - [10] Originally by: Bahk Naar The arguments of "character farming" are completely ridiculous. That would ONLY be true if the system were designed by a complete moron. Being able to queue up 1 SKILL would not create a mass influx of character farmers. Nor would it be the "easy button" for selling toons on ebay. That's not what the op requested, now was it?

Zeonos Amarr Fairtrade Syndicate	Posted - 2007.06.17 19:37:00 - [11] this is just another example of why farmers ruin the game for all others. :( all the nerfing done, the things not coming, just because it would make farmers life easier.. hate it. Image gallery with some of the new ship models.
Temult	Posted - 2007.06.18 04:53:00 - [12] Edited by: Temult on 18/06/2007 04:51:47 The "char farmers" argument is rather weak to be honest. I'm new to Eve but I guarantee the sellers already macro it. The skill setup in Eve is quite literally macro 101. Absolutely no RTT. All that is required is a pixel check and a couple static clicks. In my humble opinion, queuing at least one skill should absolutely be enabled.
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.06.21 00:58:00 - [13] This is a funny thread... #1 Eve = Eaiset game for traing, ever #2 Lazy people get lazier #3 Char farming is terriable for EVE game play #4 Gold/char farrmers will simply by 90 day GTC #1 Eve is easy for skills Eve is FAAR, most and i stress it... THE EASIET GAME ONLINE TO to deal with training skills. THERE IS NO GRINDING SKILLS INVOLED. Just need to log in every so offten, click a button and look at where your skill are at... #2 Lazy people... Only people that are complaing there is no Skills Que, or somthing like it. Are the most disqusting people in game. OMG, just move the mouse over your char info sheet and check... Ok once a day is fine to checek on most skills... Once you get pass lvl 2 or 3 on most skills, (depends on implants and learning curve), most skills starts turning into days to train... I will be 4 days away from able to use a hulk, but, took me 7 weeks to get it... #3 Gold farms are a problem already Look gold farming is already a problem. Does everyone want Char farming a problem to. I left a game once b/c bots ruined a great game, char and gold farming bots just brings down the ecomeny, game play and most imporantly, human interaction. I would hate to see a year from now, every tom ** haryy, jane doe having titans, star bases and all other high lvl stuff, b/c they just bought it from joe blow that farm the heck out of one char then sold it. #4 Game time cards, (GTC), and gold farmers Well hell, some of you complain about skills que should be in lay, (you lazy S.O.Bs), Another person suggest to simply turn off the skill when the account is not paid for, Brovo... great idea, fantasitc... but you forget one thing... A person that has billions of isk can just turn and simply by enough GTC for a year with isk... Who has billions and billions of isk to do this? Gold Farmers... Look as far as skills goes, EVE has the most simple system ever, i think its brilght that eve make the palyer responable to keep an eye on their own skills. It takes no time at all to log in, check your skills once a day. for those short skills, the one only takes a few hours, o darn, your playing already, (RIGHT )**, so its easy to keep an eye on those skills that only take a few hours. In most MMORPGs you need to grind the hell out of skills to get the lvl of it... Here you just sit and wait. I use to play a game called SilkRoad Online, a great game, smooth graphics. Then the Bot invasion came. Char and gold Farmers came and everyone had 100 million, everyone had a lvl 60+ char... all b/c of bots... not b/c of players actully grinding... Many many many players left this game, now its bot infested, game play sucks, ecomeny sucks and cant find a real player to save my life. So in light of that, do you want everyone running around with hulks, titans, freights and having billions and billions of isk, when you are the only player still trying to learn lvl 5 indy? Brat
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.06.21 09:12:00 - [14] I wouldn't mind a queue for the next skill only to automatically start training, just so we don't have to lose time or switch to another halfway because a skill will complete during downtime or when we're not home.
Blagozahath	Posted - 2007.06.21 09:57:00 - [15] Skill queue has nothing to do with lasiness, ppl sometimes just don't have time or the possibility to log on and switch skillz... some have their jobs so it's impossible to switch skills when u are at work, isn't it? 1 skill in queue would be just fine,...
co li	Posted - 2007.06.21 10:59:00 - [16] its annoying to train all the 2 3 4 5 h skills if u can just come online for 2 hours a day in the evening so a queue would be great
Spider Iarus	Posted - 2007.06.21 11:08:00 - [17] I'll add my vote to the 'yes' column. Take away the ability to train while unsubscribed (seriously) and instead let us queue a skill to default to if the first one finished. For players with ... ya know, silly things like jobs and sleeping schedules it would really, really make things nicer. As far as character sellers go...uh, what? How is being able to queue a single long-term skill going to help them? I hate it when a skill I want ASAP is in the 6 hour range - to long for a play session, to short to queue before work/sleep/etc without scheduling life around EVE. One of the great things EVE has going for it is the ability to play on limited time due to real life responsibilities - this would really, really help with that.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.21 12:20:00 - [18] Originally by: Spider Iarus I'll add my vote to the 'yes' column. Take away the ability to train while unsubscribed (seriously) and instead let us queue a skill to default to if the first one finished. For players with ... ya know, silly things like jobs and sleeping schedules it would really, really make things nicer. As far as character sellers go...uh, what? How is being able to queue a single long-term skill going to help them? I hate it when a skill I want ASAP is in the 6 hour range - to long for a play session, to short to queue before work/sleep/etc without scheduling life around EVE. One of the great things EVE has going for it is the ability to play on limited time due to real life responsibilities - this would really, really help with that. /Signed. Set one skill as "background"; when no other skill is being trained, then skillpoints go to this one. 2-4H play sessions vs 6H skills = considerable annoyance.
Liquid Glass	Posted - 2007.06.21 15:38:00 - [19] Edited by: Liquid Glass on 21/06/2007 15:38:37 This thread is just full of complete BS. Allowing a queue system for one or more skills would not enable farmers to any significant degree. If they do not already have a macro system constructed (which I am quite sure they do), they are still least likely to benefit as they may be managing multiple accounts and are easily online to change skills. In contrast, those of us who play, and actually have a real life involving commitments, would benefit greatly. There would be no more missing skill time due to forgetting to change. There would be no more, damn this skill is slightly too long to finish during one session - I'll have to wait until after work to do the 2 hours more it requires - too bad it won't be ready when I get home and want to pvp. Oh, and to the even bigger idiots: It has nothing to do with laziness. Nor would it have any affect on how much anyone logs in to actually play . As it stands now, many people log in just to change a skill. Nor would it change how we think about the game. It might promote people to plan their skill training out more (for those who don't use evemon). Quote: I use to play a game called SilkRoad Online, a great game, smooth graphics. Then the Bot invasion came. Char and gold Farmers came and everyone had 100 million, everyone had a lvl 60+ char... all b/c of bots... not b/c of players actully grinding... Many many many players left this game, now its bot infested, game play sucks, ecomeny sucks and cant find a real player to save my life. So in light of that, do you want everyone running around with hulks, titans, freights and having billions and billions of isk, when you are the only player still trying to learn lvl 5 indy? Complete and utter BS.
WhitePhantom Gallente Edenists	Posted - 2007.06.21 17:52:00 - [20] Before I see a skill queue I have decided I want to see the need of "training of a skill without an active subscription" its like downloading an anti-virus update after your subscription is ended

rrolfe	Posted - 2007.06.21 19:06:00 - [21] i have seen so many threads about this. i think it breaks down into pros and cons: pros - you don't lose training time if you cant get to your pc to login and train skill - less stress on the cluster of people loging in for 1 min to change a skill. - new players can progress faster, no lost training time cons: - people might character farm - people wont login and play until the character is skilled up. the pros make sense to me, but the cons ? lets take an example of character farming. So even if you could queue up all your skills ans walk away until there done its still going to take ages. i have been playing for 8 months or more and still am way off the vital skills in eve. i would imagine it would take at least a year of sold training or more to get a charecter you could sell. so for yeah one of them them your looking at a years subscription or loads of eve time codes. 4 x 90 time codes you looking down the barrel of 1480 mil isk or the cash equivalent. now multiple that by the amount of accounts. i just don't see how there could possibly be money in character farming given the amount time taken. i really think they should make a proposal and put it to a vote or trial the system and see if it gets abused. i dont think it can be badly abused, because skills are going to take as long as they take there is no shortcut
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.06.21 20:00:00 - [22] Edited by: KidBrat on 21/06/2007 20:03:44 Originally by: rrolfe i have seen so many threads about this. i think it breaks down into pros and cons: pros - you don't lose training time if you cant get to your pc to login and train skill - less stress on the cluster of people loging in for 1 min to change a skill. - new players can progress faster, no lost training time cons: - people might character farm - people wont login and play until the character is skilled up. the pros make sense to me, but the cons ? lets take an example of character farming. So even if you could queue up all your skills ans walk away until there done its still going to take ages. i have been playing for 8 months or more and still am way off the vital skills in eve. i would imagine it would take at least a year of sold training or more to get a charecter you could sell. so for yeah one of them them your looking at a years subscription or loads of eve time codes. 4 x 90 time codes you looking down the barrel of 1480 mil isk or the cash equivalent. now multiple that by the amount of accounts. i just don't see how there could possibly be money in character farming given the amount time taken. i really think they should make a proposal and put it to a vote or trial the system and see if it gets abused. i dont think it can be badly abused, because skills are going to take as long as they take there is no shortcut Well pros are nice, i hate to lose time in skills traings... but it falls back to, its the players responablity... And I hope it will never change... The cons, those are pretty bad cons. Think of this, i had played this game about three years ago. I loved it, but it turn into a minning sim. Now that i came back after all that time, there has been so many changes, that eve is enjoyable agin to play. But i only had been back for 8 weeks, I am already able to fly a hulk minning barge, and I am also 15 days away from flying a freighter... I made an alt acount and she is able to fly a battship with in a couple of weeks with decent gunnery... Not yet for a heavy pvp but does very nicly agist them rats... And out of all this, i lost one day of skill trining. shrugs, a day... But in 15 days, this char will have an account that is worth 2 to 5 billion isk, without ships or with ships an easy 5 billion or more... So in less than 2 and half months i have somthing that is worthy of selling on ebay... but heck no, i have sites on a space station. My point is, if i look at the skills more closly, i bet i will be able to cut that time down real fast... for one, implants, I did not even think about those to help with learning. it was nice to see to cut off 8 days for hulk when i put in the right implants. That is just one example for minning char farming... What if there was a pvp char farmer... Yal are just not thinking for the game, your thinking of your selfish lazy needs O and funny thing about this quote: Quote: i really think they should make a proposal and put it to a vote or trial the system and see if it gets abused. Of course it will be aboused... You dont get a giant jar of cookies and put in in the middle of a preschool class room and tell everyone they can only have one, then walk away from the jar of cookies. If you do that, you are just invting everyone to take alll of the cookies... Same here your invting char farmers. Belive me folks, i had played great MMORPGs and they fell b/c they did nothing to farmers... botters or afk macro users...
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.06.21 23:34:00 - [23] Edited by: Dimagus on 21/06/2007 23:34:06 The difference between no queue and 1 skill queued is only convenience. 2 or 3 would be pushing it, anything more than that could definitely lead to abuse. - Currently with no queue, three things can happen. 1) Be online the moment it finishes and set the next one, 2) Be online mid-training and switch to a new skill if the finish time isn't convenient, or 3) Not be online until after it's finished and have time wasted. - Adding in a next-to-be-trained queue, two things can happen. 1) Be online at any-time mid training to set the next skill, or 2) Not be online until after they're finished and have time wasted. That's a very important difference, instead of the player having a forced point in time to be online (which can be delayed/prevented by many different factors), the player comes online to set the next skill at any point of the training duration. For either case it's still required to be online to set each and every skill, it's simply a dictated moment vs. a chosen moment in the range of training time. There's a reason POSes go into reinforced with a timer, and that players have control over that timer. It is unreasonable to expect players to be available and online at every point 23/7, and for at least one hour each day, it's guaranteed impossible.
IlluminatedOne Amarr	Posted - 2007.06.22 02:25:00 - [24] Edited by: IlluminatedOne on 22/06/2007 02:24:56 I'm strongly against the idea of (unlimited) skill queue, KidBrat said it nice, but Dimagus's idea is great. -------------------------------------------------- Listen up! "Teamwork" means staying out of my way!
FissioNius F.R.E.E. Explorer EVE Animal Control	Posted - 2007.06.22 02:43:00 - [25] I'm strongly in favor of a skill queue If I get sent on a 6-12 month deployment within the next year, and there's no skill queue system yet, what then? Implement a queue, and I maintain a paying account even when I'm gone and cannot access Eve for months. Fail to do so, and I cancel my account, and then have to consider whether or not to reactivate it when I get home. guaranteed money for CCP, imo BUT WHAT ABOUT CHARACTER FARMING!!!#@1212
Hohenheim OfLight Pegasus Mining and Securities R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.06.22 14:03:00 - [26] I am not lazy but i do ahve an actual life which means that i often end up doing other things than playing eve, there is not always a skill to fit the amoutn of time i will be away, or i can be away for longer than i expected, in both these cases simple carring on with the next lvl would be enuth. At the end of teh day the skill que should only be one of two things carrier on with the next lvl or pick one more skill to que. Nothing more nothing less. That is all that is reall need and all that is asked for. If you ahve the time to set you watches and get up int eh middle of the night then you are obivousley under 20 and dont have a full time job. I have played for two years now and i would guess that i am close to having missed a month of skill time due to rl issues that have kept me away from eve for longer than expected. ---------------------------------------------- Is mining for a hel mad? or just ambishus?
Andrymeda	Posted - 2007.06.22 15:10:00 - [27] Originally by: Vicky Steel Edited by: Vicky Steel on 05/06/2007 03:36:42 Am I the only one tired of loging in just to discover i forgot to set a new skill for traing? I wich there was a queue system for skills to be trained, so u could set 5 skills and sleep good at night or if your computer brakes and are gone for a week u still know it,s ok since the last skills is a long one that you dont need right now. Or atlest that the skill u was training just contineu with the next level on the same skill would be a relife. /Vicky S Ah I c the problem, but if they set a queue of 2 and only 1 skill can be lev 5 that should limit farmers but yet give serius players what we want and maby rice the payment for 1 mounth so it would not be ekonomical to farmers, could this work? /Vicky S Search for Eve Mon in this forum and use it. You can set it up to warn you a skill is about to complete as well as plan your next skills. It will handle your wishes. But you always MUST log in to the game to actually change them, no utility will change them out of game (and its not allowed anyway).
Rialtor	Posted - 2007.06.22 16:03:00 - [28] A queue would be nice, although I'd take a web interface for changing skills over that. if I'm at work, I don't want to have to install a game client, I'd rather log into that char viewer to change skills.
Caios Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.06.22 18:06:00 - [29] CCP said they were working on something like this a while back. expect it SOON ™
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.06.22 20:35:00 - [30] Edited by: KidBrat on 22/06/2007 20:38:31 Edited by: KidBrat on 22/06/2007 20:37:07 Folks your not getting it... You give somone one tiny antometer, they will take the entire solar system... Belive me when i say this... I HAD WATCH GREAT MMORPGS FALL, B/c that game, (silkroad online), decide to give an inch. Its imposable for pvp, b/c everyone has lvl 70++ char. Its imposable for a newb to gain a foot hold in the game, b/c monster drop so little, and gear is so dam exspenive. The ecomney just sucks... Its imposable to log in on Silkroad. It was once a great game. Now, its filled with gold, bot and char farmers... Even one que happens it will change the game play. Its up to the player responablity, not matter if the account is paid or not. OMG YOU ARE JUST A LAZY WHINNY BUNCH... Goto other mmorpgs, you have to actully grind your skills into place... So players that can play 24/7 are futher ahead than everone esle. At lease in eve, you have your skill gain in time, not actul grinding... FissioNius I dont want to sound cold or mean, but that is not ccp or the players fault... that is just life... ANd your just wanting to invite them char farmers in, for what? your selfish needs... Think about the game play, game dynamics... Think when you come back from deployment, and everyone in game has titans, freighters, minning barges and all the best gear, b/c they where able to char farm... your sad... real sad, and very selfish Dimagus Ok idea, but ill just goahead and take a day or two, to make all skills up to lvl 3 or so, or about... then start lining up two lvl 4 skills up at one time. in two weeks, Ill have somthing nice. then do the same skills and in a month maybe two, (dpends the cahr skil in train), and ill have somthing very decnt... You give someone just one anometter and they will take the solar system. Keep it to solely the player responsablity. Hohenheim OfLight So everyone dont have a life uh I have two jobs, i goto school and i live on my own, on my days off, i lvl up fast skills.. when alseep or off to work. I deal with somthing that is more than 8 hours. If my timming is right, i que a diffrent skill that is in the right amount of timming. All I have to say to you, and i said it b4... Play another MMORPG, and all you do is actully grinding, you actully got to do this thing called work at your skills... must kill 1000 monsters b4 you can lvl a new lvl... God your just another selfish whinny thoughtless person, that lives in your own tinny world... and think of the game, over all game play and game dynamics.... not your selfish needs. ******** BTW i just do just fine with all that i got goin on in my life... notice i am only able to log in once a day on forums... Anyways, talk about real life, i got to go to my job.

Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.06.23 11:53:00 - [31] ^^^ This is the most obvious attempt at disgruntled flamebait that I've seen in a long time. I would suggest keeping your life and personal world to yourself, and attempting to force your own personal beliefs on everyone else is not any bit constructive. Maybe going with a little less sky-is-falling doomsday preaching, then dropping the irrelevant other game bashing, personal insults, and holier than thou attitude would be a start. We're discussing possible improvements to the skill training UI for players. We're not starting a witch hunt and proclaiming "FARMERS EVIL!" at every suggested change that comes by.
damo atso	Posted - 2007.06.23 17:18:00 - [32] i just alt tab'd to make a topic on this so nice to see somone else had the same idea SIGNED...................
Crimm TrahmPeur	Posted - 2007.06.23 17:43:00 - [33] As far as real life commitments, I think its quite reasonable to expect everyone to change their skills over to a longer or shorter skill depending on the next time they will be available to sit down at their computer. I tend to plan and organize most things that I do in my life, so I think its only right that EVE skill changeovers should be planned as well. This isn't to say that EVE skill changeovers are as important as real life events, but that they can easily be scheduled in the same way. I like the current system and I am not dying for a new queue system, but if one were to be put into place, I have a proposal of my own. That said, I would be in favor of a 1 skill queue that could be activated upon the last hour of the current skill's completion. I believe that a 1 skill queue could save that second or minute between the time it takes to right click and start a new skill. Lost training time due to lag and other aspects tends to add up. Basically, I don't think that special accomidations should be made for people who can't plan their skill finishing times around their real life committments. My proposal would be a 1 skill queue system that could be activated in the last hour of a current skill's completion. That way, you never have to perform the actual changeover, and you can keep those valuable seconds/minutes of waiting for the moment a skill completes. Also, you wouldnt have to wait in station for a skill to finish to switch it over. This method would prevent against character farmers, because they would still need to log on just as much with only an expanded 1 hour window. I think this is the method that would allow for the most appropriate skill queuing system that wouldnt be exploited. These are just my thoughts on the issue. And to address the "deployment" point made by a previous poster -- If you really want to train skills and pay for your eve account for 9-12 months while away from your computer instead of suspending your account, you should just hire someone to make the appropriate changeovers. A 9-12 month queue would completley annihalate gameplay via character farmers, and though your intentions are honest, the ammount of character farmers and decreased interest in gameplay would outweigh the amount of people in your particular situation. If a skill queue system of this length were implemented, I myself would probably leave the eve universe. That's my two cents. --Crimm
Spider Iarus	Posted - 2007.06.24 11:42:00 - [34] Well, there's the thing MOST people can agree on. 1 skill queue = not exploitable, not bad. Several skill queue = welcome to CharFarm Online. I'm not asking for a long-term queue. I'm asking for the ability to say 'you know, I just got Battleship 1 trained and I'd like to have three tomorrow so that I can play when I get home from work, so I'll queue it and be good to go' rather than '****. 4 hours to two...that's what, 2am? Nah, better do half of Heavy Drones to 3, switch to it tomorrow, and end up using it three days later.' The current system makes things EASIER, not harder, on character farmers. Unlike the rest of us playing EVE is their job. They are on 24/7/365. That's an advantage I won't have because, ya know, I'm one guy rather than twenty. They can have a 100% optimal schedule, the rest of us have to work around real life.
Rosur Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.24 20:33:00 - [35] How about when the skill finshes it starts tranning the next level of the skill u where tranning unless it was a lvl 5 skill where it won't train anything else. Before it starts tranning the next level it will check to see if ure account is paied for. This will stop people just tranning big level 5 skills like BS 5 and then switching to another big skill.
Dentad Einherjar Rising	Posted - 2007.06.29 06:02:00 - [36] Originally by: Blagozahath Skill queue has nothing to do with lasiness, ppl sometimes just don't have time or the possibility to log on and switch skillz... some have their jobs so it's impossible to switch skills when u are at work, isn't it? 1 skill in queue would be just fine,... QFT
Eleana Gyrian	Posted - 2007.06.29 07:47:00 - [37] +1 with limited queueing system, let's say one skill queue as stated before. As far as I'm concerned, I can connect on average 2 hours in the evening, which makes it quite difficult for me to set up properly skills. I have so many ongoing but unfinished skills because of that, it almost becomes funny... As for connecting during the day, tried that. corp firewall didn't like! I don't think it's laziness. Not having a limited skill queue on the contrary is frustration. As an alternative, I'd like the idea of having the possibility to change skills via eve website. It would allow more flexibility to manage one's char...
Viral Effect	Posted - 2007.06.29 11:30:00 - [38] A skill training que would be a good idea.
Ed Anger	Posted - 2007.06.29 14:19:00 - [39] Edited by: Ed Anger on 29/06/2007 14:19:52 Edited by: Ed Anger on 29/06/2007 14:18:00 i'm facinated that people's biggest worry about a skill queue is farmers. check out the article in the nytimes on gold farmers, in china they have people on 24-hour shifts playing characters. i'm sure they're not missing their skill transitions. it's only the more casual players that get screwed, by being unable to micro their skill advancement (some of us have jobs and RL). yes to a queue.
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.06.29 14:37:00 - [40] Personally I'd prefer something simple, like right clicking on a skill and selecting "Queue For Training" with a simple tagline at the top "Next Skill to be Trained: Cybernetics V" They can add in another new little book icon for the queued skill, and we'll still squint to see the difference :D But after a skill completion, the queued skill starts training, queue resets to None, and we have to log in to queue the next skill when it's convenient.

Granmethedon III High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.29 14:49:00 - [41] I have to say, I like the way it is. Not because I'm able to get on all the time either - I rarely get on at weekends, so it's long skill time, messes up my schedule etc and I've lost training time beforehand and it ****ed me right off; but that's down to me, not the game. Not becaused of any reason to do with character farmers and such either - I couldn't give a monkeys either way on that topic; I personally think it's a bit sad but, hey ho. The bottom line to me, is that it's a game, and in order to progress in the game you gotta play it. One of the ways the game is played is by having to manually change the skills and so becomes part of the game's features; like it or lump it you have to play by it's rules.
Dsnakes	Posted - 2007.06.29 15:14:00 - [42] /Signed 3-5hours skill are a pain, and much more for "new" players
Sneeze100	Posted - 2007.06.29 16:46:00 - [43] Devs please read I think That a system of programing skills would be good reasons being 1. you have a fairly stong forces presents playing eve 2. we go away for months at a time if your wife will not do it you are stuck 3. we also pay subscription as well so why should we fall behind just cuz our job conflicts i hope you will take this into consideration it is not all out of lazyness of changing skills but a need to be able to do em when away on deployment thanks for your time
Archo X Caldari	Posted - 2007.06.29 18:20:00 - [44] No. A queue is bad. Someone tried to relate the training queue to POS fuel. Well if my POS runs out of fuel it does not roll over to the corp hanger array to get fuel. I need to refuel it. So instead of waiting for DED mails I keep a note of when the POS was fueled and when it needs more I head back to fuel it. I treat skills the same way. Right now I have 4 accounts I am running. With the help of Eve-Mon I can keep an eye on when skills are ending. If one ends when I'm asleep, at work, in school, during DT, or any other time I can't log in then I switch to the next one. When I am able to be online I set short skills or ones that only have a little time left. If I have a skill I really, really want to get done, but it ends two hours before I get home from work then I need to decide if losing 2 hours training time is worth getting the skill. I agree that the current system sucks for n00bs, but once you train a rank 5+ skill to level 5 you realize that a couple missed hours aren't the end of the world. I have about 36m SPs and I have probably missed a weeks worth of training since I started Eve. That adds up to about 294,000 SPs, not even 1% of my total. In closing, I think people need to accept that a skill queue is not #1 on CCPs to do list. Hopefully it's not in their top 50 (more copy slots in mobile labs and new drone UI should be though). So schedule your skills, put reminders on your calendar if need be, and decide what's more important, a full night's sleep or swapping a skill. Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty - Cortes Do not discuss moderation in your signature - Kreul Intentions Double nerf
Jalenar Frost CryoCycle	Posted - 2007.06.29 21:07:00 - [45] Edited by: Jalenar Frost on 29/06/2007 21:11:41 Edited by: Jalenar Frost on 29/06/2007 21:07:08 Originally by: Sneeze100 Devs please read I think That a system of programing skills would be good reasons being 1. you have a fairly stong forces presents playing eve 2. we go away for months at a time if your wife will not do it you are stuck 3. we also pay subscription as well so why should we fall behind just cuz our job conflicts i hope you will take this into consideration it is not all out of lazyness of changing skills but a need to be able to do em when away on deployment thanks for your time Here it is. Point number 3 the most. A sense of entitlement. This is like going into WoW and saying "I can't play for a month, but if I was here, I would have my level 1 at level 70, it's not fair that you punish me because I'm not here to do the work myself". In the case of eve, the 'work' is logging in and changing the skill instead of hours of grinding. Be happy that eve is set up the way it is and you can train while not playing. But just because you can, does NOT mean you are entitled to progress at the same rate as all other players. If you can log in and change the skills, voila, you progress. If not, sorry RL or down time got in the way, but it's not CCP's issue any more than that level 1 character not getting to 70 is Blizzard's issue. Of course, It's all about me.
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.06.29 21:10:00 - [46] Edited by: Dimagus on 29/06/2007 21:12:15 Originally by: Archo X A queue is bad. Someone tried to relate the training queue to POS fuel. Well if my POS runs out of fuel it does not roll over to the corp hanger array to get fuel. I need to refuel it. So instead of waiting for DED mails I keep a note of when the POS was fueled and when it needs more I head back to fuel it. This wasn't exactly the initial comparsion that was made to POS fueling. However, this argument is actually another strong point IN FAVOR of a skill queue. The flaw is that people only think of the start condition, not when either the training/fueling is in mid-cycle. POSes do not just refuel themselves, you have to do it and refuel the POS. With a one slot skill queue, you have to do it and requeue the next skill. The key here is that you can refuel the POS at any time before it runs out. But what would happen if you could only refuel a POS after it runs out? You would be required to be online at that exact moment and would still have a brief period of vulnerability. Luckily POSes aren't like that, but unfortunately skills currently are. You're required to be online at the exact moment the skill finishes and still have a brief period of no training. This is under optimal circumstances for both case, anything going on with the game server, your internet, job, personal life, etc could fubar it and cost valuable time for training/researching. A skill queue would making skill training more like POS fueling. As each skill is completed and the queue becomes empty, you have the duration of the skill's training time to requeue another skill. For a POS as the fuel starts consuming, you have the duration that the fuel last to refuel the POS. This is a good thing. You still can't train any faster than before, and can't skip queueing a skill any more than you can skip refueling. When we train a skill that takes 20 days, we want that skill and should be able to have it in 20 days. But because the system is not user friendly it could take 21 or 22 days, because we had to switch to another skill or two we didn't need or even want yet simply because the finish time "wasn't convenient". It is ridiculous to expect people to be available 23/7, and not much else in the game does. That's why POSes go into reinforced, because we aren't online 23/7 and so we get some measure of control to when we have to defend it.
Selene Le'Cotiere Amarr Dark Oracle Enterprises	Posted - 2007.06.30 01:51:00 - [47] /Signed I, myself, would really like to see this one implemented - even if it was skill based off the learning skill tree (allowing you extra skill to be in que). Other considerations would be: No still que for trail accounts Skill do not continue on the que if account is not active.
dadar The Return FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.30 02:33:00 - [48] i would vote for this would let me pay my sub for the next year then go back to playing funner games till i get the 20 million skill points needed to be competive in this one.
dadar The Return FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.30 02:36:00 - [49] o ya on a side note the farmers don't care about que there job is being around to change skills thats were they get there pay check. were the rest of us have to actualy go to a job for 8 to 12 hours a day and can't be here to switch skills every 3 to 5 hours. they sponsor eve mon which has great skill planner why can't game allow you to upload you skill plan from eve mon and use it as long as you pay your subcription.
Atius Tirawa Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.06.30 16:05:00 - [50] if there is a queue, it should be limited to skills after they reach a certain point. So you can't set a queue for a skill that is 30 days long. But once that skill is within say, 24 hours, then you have an option to queue. But in the end, I just put a longer skill on and regulate multiple skills down to 1 hour or so (unless I know I will be on) and wipe them all off when I am on for an op or some such. It just takes some managment, and the threat is too great.

Qaedus	Posted - 2007.07.01 06:55:00 - [51] A simple solution that should prevent abuse is to limit the amount of time and number of skills that can be queued up. How about a max of five skills or one day - whichever comes first will prevent additional skills from being added to the list. That should handle the case of multiple short skills that need to be trained yet still prevent skill farmers from doing anything more that they already can do today.
Ines Sastre	Posted - 2007.07.02 14:20:00 - [52] Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 29/06/2007 21:12:15 Originally by: Archo X A queue is bad. Someone tried to relate the training queue to POS fuel. Well if my POS runs out of fuel it does not roll over to the corp hanger array to get fuel. I need to refuel it. So instead of waiting for DED mails I keep a note of when the POS was fueled and when it needs more I head back to fuel it. This wasn't exactly the initial comparsion that was made to POS fueling. However, this argument is actually another strong point IN FAVOR of a skill queue. The flaw is that people only think of the start condition, not when either the training/fueling is in mid-cycle. POSes do not just refuel themselves, you have to do it and refuel the POS. With a one slot skill queue, you have to do it and requeue the next skill. The key here is that you can refuel the POS at any time before it runs out. But what would happen if you could only refuel a POS after it runs out? You would be required to be online at that exact moment and would still have a brief period of vulnerability. Luckily POSes aren't like that, but unfortunately skills currently are. You're required to be online at the exact moment the skill finishes and still have a brief period of no training. This is under optimal circumstances for both case, anything going on with the game server, your internet, job, personal life, etc could fubar it and cost valuable time for training/researching. A skill queue would making skill training more like POS fueling. As each skill is completed and the queue becomes empty, you have the duration of the skill's training time to requeue another skill. For a POS as the fuel starts consuming, you have the duration that the fuel last to refuel the POS. This is a good thing. You still can't train any faster than before, and can't skip queueing a skill any more than you can skip refueling. When we train a skill that takes 20 days, we want that skill and should be able to have it in 20 days. But because the system is not user friendly it could take 21 or 22 days, because we had to switch to another skill or two we didn't need or even want yet simply because the finish time "wasn't convenient". It is ridiculous to expect people to be available 23/7, and not much else in the game does. That's why POSes go into reinforced, because we aren't online 23/7 and so we get some measure of control to when we have to defend it. Dimagus strikes perfectly on Archo X leaving him clueless
Wrathstack	Posted - 2007.07.02 14:34:00 - [53] It would be nice to be able to have 1 queue slot and no more BUT after a year or two people would whine that they should get 2 slots or that there should be a skill to raise your amount of queueable(is this even a word?) skills. No POS's dont refuel themselves BUT you can choose to let it run out OR refill it when you are on, skills are a choice of either making sure that you can log in RIGHT when the skill ends, losing time while you are dealing with RL in some form(work, sleep, etc) or choosing a different skill since you know that you will be unable to login at 4am to change up.
Wyehr Shadow Of The Light R i s e	Posted - 2007.07.02 18:01:00 - [54] Solution to the character farming "problem": Set a cap on the total queue time, like 24 or 48 hours. Just long enough to let people train up midlevels without having to log in several times during the day. People would still need to set long running skills for extended breaks. [ 2007.03.18 18:45:59 ] (notify) Typhoon belonging to Gandolf self-destructs.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.02 19:54:00 - [55] I too want a skill-queue - Disable queue when account is not active.
Johraiken Fenris LiveTech	Posted - 2007.07.02 20:41:00 - [56] As there is no grind for XP/SP in Eve, and how the skill system is set up, your EUR/$ 15,- should give you 30*24hrs of skill training. I feel CCP should give you reasonable tools to fully utilise that time. As many people have mentioned, you often cannot log in to change a skill (work, and recently I missed a couple of hours due to the server reboots and consequently being down for hours). The requirement of you being online to change the skill when it's finished is not a reasonable tool in my opinion. Therfore: [/signed] Johr
Loraen	Posted - 2007.07.02 22:39:00 - [57] I have a reasonable amount of free time and I'm pretty dedicated to microing my skill advancement. It does get annoying at times, especially when there's a bunch of skills I'd want "tomorrow" and can't pick any of them because they'll finish in the middle of the night. "Train this skill next" would be a nice feature addition. As a nerf, this option would only appear when you have less than, say, 24 hours remaining on the currently training skill. PS. They really should fix the system to disable skill training on inactive accounts.
Granmethedon III High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.03 11:26:00 - [58] Originally by: Johraiken Fenris As there is no grind for XP/SP in Eve, and how the skill system is set up, your EUR/$ 15,- should give you 30*24hrs of skill training. I feel CCP should give you reasonable tools to fully utilise that time. As many people have mentioned, you often cannot log in to change a skill (work, and recently I missed a couple of hours due to the server reboots and consequently being down for hours). The requirement of you being online to change the skill when it's finished is not a reasonable tool in my opinion. Therfore: [/signed] Johr No, there's a completely different way of managing skills which still has a part that means you have to be online to change your skill over; it's a KEY part of the game. Skill management and training is one of the things that makes EVE great; you have to plan ahead and ensure that you get the most out of your training time. Your subscription fee doesn't entitle you to any skills whatsoever, it simply entitles you to play the game.
Jared Lighthawk Silver Aria	Posted - 2007.07.03 15:09:00 - [59] I would love to have a 1 skill queue. That way those times when you are away or whatnot you could line up two long skills or something. Or if you need to goto work but need 2 4hr skills trained you could line up 1 additional next skill. Maybe put a rare skill out there to add more to the queue or something ( or tie to to # of skill points earned. 5mil +1 slot, etc).
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.05 19:56:00 - [60] I would really like this implemented SOON ! BEFORE things like walking around space stations...

Warlord o'Dragons	Posted - 2007.07.05 20:30:00 - [61] Hi there, this Char is only 13 days old, just bought a 30 D GTC. I already learn most of my leraning skills to lvl 3's 4's and one 5... Look folks, im KidBrat a few post b4 this one... I wanted to prove a point and make this char up... I have two jobs, goto school and only get to log in the morning and at night... On my days off like today, i work on those easy fast skills... So for a person like me that has like maybe half hour at in the morning b4 school, (MAYBE, Just maybe), 10 to 20 minuts in the afternoon, then i for sure check again at night before i goto sleep. This Char already has a decent learning curve, i bought +3 implants and hell, I put in maybe a total of an hour a day into just hceking skills... And when i have more time, i actully hunt, mine or whatever. I have such limted time with my crazy schedule. I still mange to bring up skills. I think i might have lost 2 hours... BIG FU.CKING DEAL... This game is sooooo easy on skills gain... as far as skills goes, eve online is the lazy players dream, or a bussy one. So to put any, i do mean any skill gue... You are welcoming people to char farming... Look into a game called SilkRoad Online, use to be a great game, then the gm's got lazy and stop banning bots, char farmers and now its about the worse game out there, b/c they have char/gold/bot farmers welcome sign out. You give just one nanno metter and people will take the solar system... Say no to skills gue. Say Yes to players actully have to play, and log in and check thier skills... For those that wants skills que, i just have to say, you are just lazy, selfish or just plain dont care about game mechanics... And so what if you cant login and check your skills... that is not my fault, ccp or anyoner thing that may happen... that is just life... And for the idot that say i have no life, screw you i got way to much going on in my life and i still able to build a char in 13 days with decent learning skills... KidBrat
Kwint Sommer Incoherent Inc Otaku Invasion	Posted - 2007.07.05 20:32:00 - [62] /signed Queue me up!
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.07.05 20:32:00 - [63] Edited by: KidBrat on 05/07/2007 20:33:18 Edited by: KidBrat on 05/07/2007 20:32:06 Warlord o'Dragons ditto It litterly takes only seconds to login and check skills then even lesss time to log out
Bug OnWindshield Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.07.05 20:58:00 - [64] +1 skill queue has a great ring to - especially as I've lost a considerable amount of training time lately because of the delayed restarts after dt.. The laziness argument of course holds validity but there are certainly greater gains by implementing a simple queuing system to whatever downsides have been presented previously in this thread! My 2 isk on the matter.. /Agges Sting like a butterfly, fly like a bee.. (when u see meh riffie)
Saietor Blackgreen	Posted - 2007.07.06 07:27:00 - [65] Edited by: Saietor Blackgreen on 06/07/2007 07:28:07 Originally by: Warlord o'Dragons Hi there, Say no to skills gue. Say Yes to players actully have to play, and log in and check thier skills... KidBrat That Bots example really gets annoying. People've been over this million times, all arguments said, AND DEVS HAVE IT ON DRAWINGBOARD: 1) Skill queue in Eve has NOTHING to do with bots. Forget the word BOT already. As you, Kidbrat, state yourself, even a busy player doesnt lose too much training time without it, so WHAT BENEFIT CAN CHAR FARMERS GET from it? Nada. 2) Skill queue doesnt need to be long. It can be just a background skill, that starts training when current skill is done. So you can do one of short skills everytime you, Kidbrat, leave your house, and your char will autoswitch to that Gunnery 5 when its done. Thus, your char progression strategy will not be crippled by your school and two jobs. This will definitely decrease your stress and increase your chances to avoid ulcer and heart attack thus keeping you ingame, which we all hope for. 3) This system states that char training on non-payed account should be removed, which was a very strange feature in the first place, as it is obvious money loss for CCP AND actually is something that benefits char farmers. While be of absolutely no use to active players. To recap: Queue pros: - More appeal for casual players Eve is highly focused on - more player satisfaction - larger playerbase. - No more non-payed training - more money for CCP. - No more non-payed training - less passive char farming. Queue cons: Apart from irrelevant Bots examle from "experience points-based" MMOs, nothing constructive was ever said. And for the holy, please, forget that absolutely irreleevant SilkRoad example! Use it when talking of macromining, but what on earth it has to do with skill queueing? Did SilkRoad fate traumatized you so much? Or maybe you ARE char farmer, and you are woriied that non-payed training will be removed?
Doomba Minge Confederation of Red Miners Red Moon Federation	Posted - 2007.07.06 08:04:00 - [66] yes
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.07.06 08:46:00 - [67] Edited by: KidBrat on 06/07/2007 09:03:24 Originally by: Saietor Blackgreen That Bots example really gets annoying. People've been over this million times, all arguments said, AND DEVS HAVE IT ON DRAWINGBOARD: 1) Skill queue in Eve has NOTHING to do with bots. Forget the word BOT already. As you, Kidbrat, state yourself, even a busy player doesnt lose too much training time without it, so WHAT BENEFIT CAN CHAR FARMERS GET from it? Nada. 2) Skill queue doesnt need to be long. It can be just a background skill, that starts training when current skill is done. So you can do one of short skills everytime you, Kidbrat, leave your house, and your char will autoswitch to that Gunnery 5 when its done. Thus, your char progression strategy will not be crippled by your school and two jobs. This will definitely decrease your stress and increase your chances to avoid ulcer and heart attack thus keeping you ingame, which we all hope for. 3) This system states that char training on non-payed account should be removed, which was a very strange feature in the first place, as it is obvious money loss for CCP AND actually is something that benefits char farmers. While be of absolutely no use to active players. To recap: Queue pros: - More appeal for casual players Eve is highly focused on - more player satisfaction - larger playerbase. - No more non-payed training - more money for CCP. - No more non-payed training - less passive char farming. Queue cons: Apart from irrelevant Bots examle from "experience points-based" MMOs, nothing constructive was ever said. And for the holy, please, forget that absolutely irreleevant SilkRoad example! Use it when talking of macromining, but what on earth it has to do with skill queueing? Did SilkRoad fate traumatized you so much? Or maybe you ARE char farmer, and you are woriied that non-payed training will be removed? wow amazing, i will just ocmpletly forget the whole thing... But wait, you complety miss intrupted in what i said... The whole thing from silkroad online, (SRO), was used as an example as to what CHAR FARMING DOES... 1. char farming kills the pvp, in SRO everyone must be lvl 70+ to even try thier hand at pvp, in the old day b4 bots, (ops, i ment char farming), one was able to pvp another player that was at your lvl... not anymore 2.Personaly I really like the idea of people needing to log in once in awhile to look at thier own char... After all this is a MMORPG, we all should be playing, not waiting for the next skill gain 3. This is the only game on the net, where you dont have to actully grin for skills. Dont need to go out and kill 10k worth of rats to gain a lvl... And o this char had gotten a hulk just shy of 70's days. My new char goal is 60 days or less for a hulk... And you know what that char is doing in the mean time... nothing, nothing at all... not even grinding, not even leaving the school where are all the pretty books are... just going to sit there till she gets her hulk... So really this is the only game on the net where you dont neeeed to grind for skills... and the current system of skills gain is just fine... BTW, ill have lvl industry lvl 5 in two days, and i have lvl 3 astrogeology already... this is day 14 for my new char... There is no grinding for skills... any que, even for one que, is just allowing things like astrogeology lvl 5 then minning barge lvl 5 to be back to back and that person dont need to even need to log in for that time... Here is another one, battle ship lvl 5 and cruiser lvl 5 back to back, that person dont need to even log in for almost 6 weeks or more, depends on skills and implants... So really, yal is just complaing about the eaiset game on the net for skills grind... b/c there is no skill grinding shakes head, lazy lazy people
Warlord o'Dragons	Posted - 2007.07.06 09:17:00 - [68] Edited by: Warlord o''Dragons on 06/07/2007 09:22:54 and o one last point about skills grinding Eve-Online, everyone gain skill at the same time. In Eve you wont see somone in a titan or a carrier in a week b/c they grind the heck out of the right skills nonstop, day and night till they got it... Why so??? B/c in games like SRO, Ever Quest, LineageII, Ultima Online, WoW or in MMORPGs where a player can grind 10+ hours a day to gain skills. A player that can invest 10++ hours a day to a game, are much further ahead than everone else... And yes, bots helps those type of players... here bots has nothing at all to do with char farming... But skill gue will, even one skill que will contribute to char farming... Really hate to see a player not play for 60 days or less b/c they are just waiting to get a hulk... At lease with them players taht are skill grinding, are out in the world... Grinding grinding and more grinding... thankfully in eve you dont need to grind, just wait.
Warlord o'Dragons	Posted - 2007.07.06 09:29:00 - [69] Originally by: Warlord o'Dragons even one skill que will contribute to char farming... Really hate to see a player not play for 60 days or less b/c they are just waiting to get a hulk... Ops forgot to mention, once i get to astro lvl 5 and mineing barge 5... If there was a skill gue, (even just one), I would not need to log in that char for many many many days at a time.
Bunyip Greeneye	Posted - 2007.07.06 12:44:00 - [70] Originally by: Wyehr Solution to the character farming "problem": Set a cap on the total queue time, like 24 or 48 hours. Just long enough to let people train up midlevels without having to log in several times during the day. People would still need to set long running skills for extended breaks. I think this solution is workable, I'd imagine most people play once a day. I'd like this. The problem I can see is those skills with 3-5 hour durations.

Humwawa	Posted - 2007.07.06 17:03:00 - [71] Originally by: Warlord o'Dragons Edited by: Warlord o''Dragons on 06/07/2007 09:22:54 and o one last point about skills grinding Eve-Online, everyone gain skill at the same time. In Eve you wont see somone in a titan or a carrier in a week b/c they grind the heck out of the right skills nonstop, day and night till they got it... Why so??? B/c in games like SRO, Ever Quest, LineageII, Ultima Online, WoW or in MMORPGs where a player can grind 10+ hours a day to gain skills. A player that can invest 10++ hours a day to a game, are much further ahead than everone else... And yes, bots helps those type of players... here bots has nothing at all to do with char farming... But skill gue will, even one skill que will contribute to char farming... Really hate to see a player not play for 60 days or less b/c they are just waiting to get a hulk... At lease with them players taht are skill grinding, are out in the world... Grinding grinding and more grinding... thankfully in eve you dont need to grind, just wait. DONT put UO into the same line as games like WOW and the rest of the rubbish copycat-games... !!!! In UO you have 360¦ gamaeplay/skillgain - no stupid grinding like in WoW etc... I like the system eve has where skill gains over time, but I really think aslong as I am payingfor the account - ergo the account is active it should be my decisionhow much I play or if I am only training skills for a few months !! I am taking an eve-break atm (over summer)(account is active - I am paying for it !!! ) and its REALLY getting on my nerves to have to change skills the whole time. I dont want to nerved about a game I am aiming to return to in autuum...
Rialtor	Posted - 2007.07.06 17:33:00 - [72] Originally by: Warlord o'Dragons Originally by: Warlord o'Dragons even one skill que will contribute to char farming... Really hate to see a player not play for 60 days or less b/c they are just waiting to get a hulk... Ops forgot to mention, once i get to astro lvl 5 and mineing barge 5... If there was a skill gue, (even just one), I would not need to log in that char for many many many days at a time. This makes very little sense...given the skill system is at it is, it's not a big deal to someone training some level 5 skills, drone interfacing V is gonna take me 23 days. The big deal is for new players entering the game, they are required to be stationed at their computers to get their base skills up (15 minutes here, 2 hours there, 3 hours there, it all Adds up to a long long time). Why would you force people to log into the game, when a whole gimmick to Eve is that your character progresses without you being in-game. Requiring all these needless logins is actually bad for the game, cause it's better for the server if people, stay off when they don't really want to play the active game. That doesn't mean they're still not playing the game mind you, because playing the game constitutes the forums, even messing around in Eve-Mon. CCP is just making themselves look bad by not having this already IMO. If the so called down-side is farming, then you're misunderstanding the nature of a farmer. A farmer is a hardcore player. Hardcore players are gonna find a way to maximize their skilling trees. It's not even so bad, you set up eve-mon, sit at your com, do whatever it is you're doing, when it dings, go back in the game. Again this is creating needless logins by the farmer. which creates needless network traffic. Maybe once in a while a farmer loses a few hours, cause he actually had something to do IRL. So instead of 100% he's like at 95% on his 3-4 accounts. What % you think a casual gamer is at in this game? 60%-80% maybe? The only one who gets hurt here is Joe, the casual gamer. He plays for 2-3 hours a day when he gets home from a long days work to unwind. He decided to get this game cause he heard it was unique, and he didn't have to play hardcore for his character to progress. But look the joke is on Joe, cause unlike most other MMOs, you have to now schedule your whole day around changing skills (mostly new people training base skills, it's not a good intro to the game). Joe likes the game but he's frustrated that he can't keep up his skilling like he should be able to do, because of incompetent tools. So now Joe finds himself in the same predicament that he's always in when it comes to MMO. The hardcore player is doing vastly better, just cause they have more time to spend. And Joe thought Eve wasn't suppose to be just about Time. The sad thing is that this wouldn't be the case if CCP understood the situation, and programmed some useful tools. And being a developer it's beyond me why they can't. This is like a week long project, simple DB structure, simple interface. Just as an aside, I'm not Joe, I'm just empathizing with people that are in that situation. I have no real life of my own, so I don't really care. I just hate to see people quit because this "everyone trains equally" thing is a failure because of poor implementation. It actually takes up more time than just grinding (at least with grinding, you grind whenever you get a chance). With this game you gotta make a plan, then schedule your whole time around this game, to start off anyway.
Gigantorr	Posted - 2007.07.06 18:52:00 - [73] Great discussion so far, I think this idea has been tossed around almost since the inception of EVE. The holdup on this idea mainly is the conflict between convenience and abuse. It would be convenient for active players to have the queue system and it also gives character farmers more of an incentive to abuse the queue system. The ultimate question is if players really care about character farmers with the argument being that farmers cheapen the effort of legitimate and active players. One counter argument might be that character farmers could conceivably only affect the economy of the EVE universe minimally if they only mine or run npc missions to afford purchasing higher skills and the time they would spend training higher level skills (3,4, and 5's) would keep them only logging in for a few minutes every few days or weeks. Another might be that character farming doesn't really affect any other player and the people who do buy these farmed characters have missed out on the wealth of information gained by playing a character for months or years. Personally, I think that EVE is a unique MMO in that there is not a level cap like in other MMO's (Lineage 2, WoW, etc) and character farming is nothing that those kind of people are interested in undertaking anytime soon. ____________________ Mining is like a Search & Destroy mission.
KidBrat	Posted - 2007.07.06 18:53:00 - [74] Edited by: KidBrat on 06/07/2007 19:01:07 Originally by: Humwawa DONT put UO into the same line as games like WOW and the rest of the rubbish copycat-games... !!!! In UO you have 360¦ gamaeplay/skillgain - no stupid grinding like in WoW etc... I like the system eve has where skill gains over time, but I really think aslong as I am payingfor the account - ergo the account is active it should be my decisionhow much I play or if I am only training skills for a few months !! I am taking an eve-break atm (over summer)(account is active - I am paying for it !!! ) and its REALLY getting on my nerves to have to change skills the whole time. I dont want to nerved about a game I am aiming to return to in autuum... BTW Im a 7 year vet from UO, MRS X of pacific... AND THERE IS A FAIR AMOUNT OF GRINDING, want to be a black smith, you must sit at your computer hours on end just making amor, want to be a bard, you must play the same dam song for hours on end, (yet grinding agin), to be able to tame a dragon, if you grind for a week st8 on bard, you can get your self a White Wyreven... UO even has a third party aproved macro software caled UO Assit... I use it to help make recall scrolls... Look, as another player said, it anoying to wait for 15 minutes, an hour or 3 to 5 hours... Well, its anoying to sit at the computer grinding, the same monster for 8 hours for .1 skill gain. Its alot better to wait, 15 minutes, heck you can go do homework, (go figure, that is what i do), or go get a beer veg out in front of the TV, surf the net for news etc... in games like UO you dont have that option, you neeeed to man the key board for hours on end to gain very little skill, in UO GMs are allways checking if players ar AFK or AT keyboard... WoW has the same basic idea UO, LineageII, ever Quest, Starwar galxy, and many more MMORPG... They all have the same grinding for monsters, scrolls, potions for skills... In Eveall you got to do is log in and change skill and wait for new skill... AND AS IT SHOULD BE, IN A MMORPG, for god sakes this is a game where players have to interact in the universe. Eve-Online can just simply change the skill gain, to where we have to grind for skills, not wait. Dont know about you i like the idea of wait for skill than grind for skill Main reason why I played EVE is b/c of the skill gain, I can get my homework done, eat or goto work and come back i have a lvl 3,4 or 5 of somthing and i had to do nothing but, LOG IN, CHECK SKILLS AND MAKE NEW SKILLS.... God sooo anoying to log in a game you people say you enjoy...
Rialtor	Posted - 2007.07.06 19:31:00 - [75] Originally by: KidBrat Edited by: KidBrat on 06/07/2007 19:01:07 Originally by: Humwawa DONT put UO into the same line as games like WOW and the rest of the rubbish copycat-games... !!!! In UO you have 360¦ gamaeplay/skillgain - no stupid grinding like in WoW etc... I like the system eve has where skill gains over time, but I really think aslong as I am payingfor the account - ergo the account is active it should be my decisionhow much I play or if I am only training skills for a few months !! I am taking an eve-break atm (over summer)(account is active - I am paying for it !!! ) and its REALLY getting on my nerves to have to change skills the whole time. I dont want to nerved about a game I am aiming to return to in autuum... BTW Im a 7 year vet from UO, MRS X of pacific... AND THERE IS A FAIR AMOUNT OF GRINDING, want to be a black smith, you must sit at your computer hours on end just making amor, want to be a bard, you must play the same dam song for hours on end, (yet grinding agin), to be able to tame a dragon, if you grind for a week st8 on bard, you can get your self a White Wyreven... UO even has a third party aproved macro software caled UO Assit... I use it to help make recall scrolls... Look, as another player said, it anoying to wait for 15 minutes, an hour or 3 to 5 hours... Well, its anoying to sit at the computer grinding, the same monster for 8 hours for .1 skill gain. Its alot better to wait, 15 minutes, heck you can go do homework, (go figure, that is what i do), or go get a beer veg out in front of the TV, surf the net for news etc... in games like UO you dont have that option, you neeeed to man the key board for hours on end to gain very little skill, in UO GMs are allways checking if players ar AFK or AT keyboard... WoW has the same basic idea UO, LineageII, ever Quest, Starwar galxy, and many more MMORPG... They all have the same grinding for monsters, scrolls, potions for skills... In Eveall you got to do is log in and change skill and wait for new skill... AND AS IT SHOULD BE, IN A MMORPG, for god sakes this is a game where players have to interact in the universe. Eve-Online can just simply change the skill gain, to where we have to grind for skills, not wait. Dont know about you i like the idea of wait for skill than grind for skill Main reason why I played EVE is b/c of the skill gain, I can get my homework done, eat or goto work and come back i have a lvl 3,4 or 5 of somthing and i had to do nothing but, LOG IN, CHECK SKILLS AND MAKE NEW SKILLS.... God sooo anoying to log in a game you people say you enjoy... The problem with comparing those games skilling system to this one is that in those games, the grinding time is what the developers used to balance the game's flow. I've just been playing this game for 2-3 months, but it seems in this game that you're meant to be skilling 24/7. That's not the case in other MMOs, you're not meant to be playing 24/7 (although some people do to a huge advantage). But games are based around a casual player usually, not the hardcore player. The way the skilling system tool's work gives the farmers an advantage over the casual player when this clearly doesn't need to be the case. There's no way to fight "farming" other than to ban based on IP usuage, along with same cardholder info, but that wouldn't go off very well. Farmers will find a way to farm, and farmers have all the time in the world to farm under the current system, so I don't see why that's even an issue...You think if a queuing system is setup a casual player will then want to farm? And who's to say anyone is asking for any sort of Long term skill queuing, the things suggested in this thread sound reasonable. Ability to setup a 24 hour queue, or just queue up 1 skill. So what you make starting out farming easier, I doubt that the number of farmers would change given either of those solutions.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.12 03:09:00 - [76] Any ETA when skillqueue will be implemented?
Ishbuanium	Posted - 2007.07.12 13:17:00 - [77] Ishbuanium's Thoughts on this Matter
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.13 08:48:00 - [78] Edited by: Zachstar on 13/07/2007 08:50:02 Originally by: Belmarduk Any ETA when skillqueue will be implemented? Wow this is flat out disgusting! So I guess you consider these points useless to your want? #1 How you don't have to grind in EVE saving you MANY hours of your life where otherwise you'd have to blast rats and PVP over and over again to get your level up. #2 How other games were quickly ruined by even simple automation. #3 How in EVE you can be good to go in most respects in under half a year. This is disgusting, I can't believe what some of you are asking the developers to do. If you want this to be the case that badly!... Then EVE needs to stop right now and become a server based battle simulator without any economy or RPG points to it. YES yall are going RIGHT down that slope. Counter-Strike in space. This has been the most shocking rumored feature I have seen yet! This is a game ruiner in my view as even a +1 cue will lead to vast amounts of LV 4-5 farming. CCP I have been playing EVE for a small bit here and I have enjoyed it greatly so far. Yet I am still deciding on if it is a good idea to continue on to get to a point where I like my character. A process that demands the ability to think, or waste lots of time on unneeded skills. This going into effect for even a +1 will most likely cause me to abort all that and terminate my account before I end up wasting on my time on a game that will end up on the short road to ruin. Infinity: Quest for Earth looks interesting. But I highly doubt it will be able to match the ability of EVE for many years to come. I will be forced to wait on Vega Strike to get anywhere near playable. Even a +1 system will cader to the cell phone age crowd where lazyness and rudity rules and thinking and actually needing to plan something way out in advance goes right out the window. I have NO intention on following suit. CCP do the right thing and keep the skills system the way it is and install better systems to throw off marco farmers. I can expect you know the consequences of this as well and I hope you will decide that this feature is a NO-GO now or ever! Say NO to any skill queue!
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.13 08:49:00 - [79] Edited by: Zachstar on 13/07/2007 08:49:04 duplicate post
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.13 11:09:00 - [80] Originally by: Gigantorr Great discussion so far, I think this idea has been tossed around almost since the inception of EVE. The holdup on this idea mainly is the conflict between convenience and abuse. It would be convenient for active players to have the queue system and it also gives character farmers more of an incentive to abuse the queue system. The ultimate question is if players really care about character farmers with the argument being that farmers cheapen the effort of legitimate and active players. One counter argument might be that character farmers could conceivably only affect the economy of the EVE universe minimally if they only mine or run npc missions to afford purchasing higher skills and the time they would spend training higher level skills (3,4, and 5's) would keep them only logging in for a few minutes every few days or weeks. Another might be that character farming doesn't really affect any other player and the people who do buy these farmed characters have missed out on the wealth of information gained by playing a character for months or years. Personally, I think that EVE is a unique MMO in that there is not a level cap like in other MMO's (Lineage 2, WoW, etc) and character farming is nothing that those kind of people are interested in undertaking anytime soon. If it's easier to train characters, then people have LESS incentive to buy characters from farmers. Any time you deliberately make some game activity more inconvenient than it has to be, you are incentivising people not to do that activity. Allowing a skill to keep training until it finishes level V only adds 25% to the maximum time a character can train unsupervised. Do you really think that will instantly incentivise thousands of players to start buying characters? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.

Mesper	Posted - 2007.07.13 22:08:00 - [81] Edited by: Mesper on 13/07/2007 22:08:48 I'm amazed at some of the reasons I'm seeing in this thread. Let's recap: You're lazy if you want a queue. Lazy? How does that make you lazy? At the absolute worst case scenario, it will stop a user from logging in one time for every 'skill cycle.' Is logging in such a strain that you feel the need to sneer at the idea? You're greedy if you want a queue. Darn right I'm greedy. I pay for this game, and forgive me if I don't want my skill path interrupted over trivial things. I want to expand into exploration. Unfortunately, I'm going to be away for long hours this week. I, therefore, can't train the 4 and 13 hour skills I need conveniently without losing half or whole days of training time. That means that I'm going to have to train the longer, multi day skills on my secondary path to the Hulk. Am I greedy for being disappointed in how I am forced to push this short term "fun time" goal back days upon days because I'm busy this weekend? That's two ad hominem attacks in a row over something as paltry as a one size queue. I think the game has to be played my way. All other ways are wrong. Claiming that you have to log in and do something, and therefore setting two skills back to back that would take one month to train is a game breaking mechanic. Fortunately, our current system requires you to log in for that one half minute to change skills, completely fixing that problem. Good thing our players aren't lazy and greedy. Game X has a flaw, therefore adding one skill queue would have the same effect here. I don't even know what sort of fallacy this is. It may be several combined. Game X has a mechanic that EVE does not. Therefore, a queue is a bad idea. ... You are disgusting for daring to want a single queue, which will dare help people who want to train a four hour skill as they sleep! How much more disgusting can it get? We hit a third ad hominem. Can we get these out of the way so we can have a real discussion, please? I've yet to see one valid reason for denying a queue, not a single one. A one skill queue will not cause an influx of botters and character farmers. Let's not even bring them up again. This has been debunked several times. A one skill queue will not make people lazy. A one skill queue will not make the game turn into "counter strike in space." A one skill queue will not make space stations explode. A one skill queue will be very convenient for the many, many times a skill ends up finishing training in the middle of the work day or the middle of the night. A one skill queue will allow a player to continue pursuing a skill path, even if a skill training ends at inconvenient times. This will avoid the disappointment in either not having anything train for a long time or simply being unable to train low level skills and push back the schedule several days. A one skill queue will help even established players pushing in a new direction, helping with skills that are a paltry amount of hours to be ready for the next day. A one skill queue will help new players get their skills lined up in the first days. A one skill queue will be a huge convenience for all players.
Max Essen	Posted - 2007.07.13 22:31:00 - [82] For me, personally, a que of skills would probably hurt the Eve community overall. I do travel for work quite often and I will start training on something that will take days to do while I am away. It works for me, however, adding the ability to log into the Eve-Online website to start a new skill training would be benificial as my travelling laptops can NOT play Eve. Thoughts or comments welcome.
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.14 00:21:00 - [83] Time to bust up this load of junk. I will need 2 posts just to get this across. Originally by: Mesper Edited by: Mesper on 13/07/2007 22:08:48 I'm amazed at some of the reasons I'm seeing in this thread. Let's recap: Indeed lets recap and stare into the black hole which is the last 3 or 4 generation's lazyness, apathy, unwillingness to plan, rudeness, and unimaginative main traits. Originally by: Mesper You're lazy if you want a queue. Lazy? How does that make you lazy? At the absolute worst case scenario, it will stop a user from logging in one time for every 'skill cycle.' Is logging in such a strain that you feel the need to sneer at the idea? It makes you lazy by giving you that satisfaction that yet more is being done for you. It feeds this trait and starts a process right down that line of more and more automation. Right now you are forced to do a bit of planning. I can't be up when one of my skills finishes, so I have to set another on that will take longer and finish later. I have to THINK and PLAN ahead which likely sounds like a school setting to much of you pro-queue users. Is it any wonder why (for the United States) we continue to be the laughing stock of education? Alot of it gets fueled on by junk like this. Originally by: Mesper You're greedy if you want a queue. Darn right I'm greedy. I pay for this game, and forgive me if I don't want my skill path interrupted over trivial things. Absolutely no! Your greed needs not aid in breaking this game! You paying dosent entitle you to break it! It means nothing! Originally by: Mesper I want to expand into exploration. Unfortunately, I'm going to be away for long hours this week. I, therefore, can't train the 4 and 13 hour skills I need conveniently without losing half or whole days of training time. That means that I'm going to have to train the longer, multi day skills on my secondary path to the Hulk. Anticipate Plan Act Anticipate: Find out when and how long something will keep you away for. Also rate the chances something will come up and take you away from being able to switch skills. Write them down! Plan: Use EVEmon, the other tools, or simple pencil and paper to make a plan to run skills in a way that will end up with your goal skill complete when things are good for you. Act: Act on the plan and resist temptation to edit it in a way that can harm the final goal skill. These words build character and good traits that help you in the long run and help break these terrible traits that mark these current generations. Or do you rather just go out and blast rats to level up? Originally by: Mesper Am I greedy for being disappointed in how I am forced to push this short term "fun time" goal back days upon days because I'm busy this weekend? Very much so. Isn't it good enough that you don't have to blast rats all day long to gain a level? Originally by: Mesper That's two ad hominem attacks in a row over something as paltry as a one size queue. Glad you think it's so simple. It's not and AGAIN I will note it is a game breaker. Originally by: Mesper I think the game has to be played my way. All other ways are wrong. Claiming that you have to log in and do something, and therefore setting two skills back to back that would take one month to train is a game breaking mechanic. Fortunately, our current system requires you to log in for that one half minute to change skills, completely fixing that problem. Good thing our players aren't lazy and greedy. It is a game breaking trait for many reasons mentioned in this thread.
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.14 00:29:00 - [84] Originally by: Mesper [b]You are disgusting for daring to want a single queue, which will dare help people who want to train a four hour skill as they sleep! How much more disgusting can it get?[b/] We hit a third ad hominem. Your ability to track how many times your feelings are hurt isnt interesting me one bit. It has nothing to do with this conversation and you need to stop with that mess. Originally by: Mesper Can we get these out of the way so we can have a real discussion, please? I've yet to see one valid reason for denying a queue, not a single one. No, no reason to change the way things are going. Again your feelings need not be part of this debate. Any validity of the reasons for denying a queue are quickly shadowed by the traits I mentioned above in this generation. For this reason I have little reason to believe that you will ever see validity in these reasons unless those bad traits vanish quickly. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will not cause an influx of botters and character farmers. Let's not even bring them up again. This has been debunked several times. WRONG: It will allow quick lvls up to 3 and setting to 4-5 resulting in a large numbers of 4-5 farmers. The fact that it takes so long to have to switch now is causing a problem and this will quickly grow that issue. DO NOT start with that " do not bring that up, and debunked " junk. You are in no position to declare a reason debunked and invalid. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will not make people lazy. Again WRONG: It will aid in this generations sinking into more automation and sets the stage for demanding more. A stop must be established here! Before things get really bad. Oh BTW it isnt funny no game ruiner is funny. It seems the lazyness is already here. Cell phone generation. This needs not be fed more. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will not make the game turn into "counter strike in space." You failed to understand the meaning of that post it seems. I encourage you to study the terminology and history behind "slippery-slope" and not respond so wrongly until you understand it completely. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will not make space stations explode. What does this have to do with anything. If you can't think of somthing acceptable to post then it is better to not post it. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will be very convenient for the many, many times a skill ends up finishing training in the middle of the work day or the middle of the night. Anticipate Plan Act Anticipate: Find out when and how long somthing will keep you away for. Also rate the chances somthing will come up and take you away from being able to switch skills. Write them down! Plan: Use EVEmon, the other tools, or simple pencil and paper to make a plan to run skills in a way that will end up with your goal skill complete when things are good for you. Act: Act on the plan and resist temptation to edit it in a way that can harm the final goal skill. These words build character and good traits that help you in the long run and help break these terrible traits that mark these current generations. Or do you rather just go out and blast rats to level up? Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will allow a player to continue pursuing a skill path, even if a skill training ends at inconvenient times. This will avoid the disappointment in either not having anything train for a long time or simply being unable to train low level skills and push back the schedule several days. And aid in 4-5 Farming GREATLY. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will help even established players pushing in a new direction, helping with skills that are a paltry amount of hours to be ready for the next day. Anticipate Plan Act Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will help new players get their skills lined up in the first days. They need to do the same as above. No need to break the game to help newer folks. Originally by: Mesper A one skill queue will be a huge convenience for all players. Including 4-5 farmers. And a game breaker
Mesper	Posted - 2007.07.14 05:22:00 - [85] Originally by: Zachstar Time to bust up this load of junk. I will need 2 posts just to get this across. Indeed lets recap and stare into the black hole which is the last 3 or 4 generation's lazyness, apathy, unwillingness to plan, rudeness, and unimaginative main traits. Do indeed have fun with this. I find it interesting that you characterize me as rude, especially with the replies under your name so far. This promises to be an...interesting reply. Originally by: Zachstar It makes you lazy by giving you that satisfaction that yet more is being done for you. It feeds this trait and starts a process right down that line of more and more automation. That's a huge leap in logic, right there. I go from "I'd like to have this skill in the morning without having to wake up at 3am to do it" to "Well, gee, now I think I want all skills maximized by next week." Sorry, but it doesn't quite work like that. That's like saying, "This nail in my foot hurts. I really wish it weren't there." is equivalent to "Well, gee, I wish my foot was healed, and I demand super power healing while you're at it!" No. Originally by: Zachstar Right now you are forced to do a bit of planning. I can't be up when one of my skills finishes, so I have to set another on that will take longer and finish later. I have to THINK and PLAN ahead which likely sounds like a school setting to much of you pro-queue users. Is it any wonder why (for the United States) we continue to be the laughing stock of education? Alot of it gets fueled on by junk like this. You have a pretty haughty air there, especially for someone calling another rude. I'm quite comfortable in the academic world, thank you very much, and your accusation against U.S. education is both unfounded and just plain wrong. Again, huge jump in accusations here. I can think and plan on my own, thank you very much, hence my statement that I had to halt my temporary path to go for the longer term one. You did pick that up, right? Originally by: Zachstar Absolutely no! Your greed needs not aid in breaking this game! You paying dosent entitle you to break it! It means nothing! Feel better now? Originally by: Zachstar Anticipate Plan Act These words build character and good traits that help you in the long run and help break these terrible traits that mark these current generations. Or do you rather just go out and blast rats to level up? You assume, quite wrongly, that I am not doing the above. I use EVEMon, and I have my plans set. After learning about exploration, I decided to spend a few days away from Astrogeology V to build up these skills and have a little fun between mining trips. Oh, but I'm sorry, that means I'm greedy, and apparently marked by "these current generation [sic]." Are you making a point or ranting? Originally by: Zachstar Very much so. Isn't it good enough that you don't have to blast rats all day long to gain a level? Apples and oranges. Originally by: Zachstar It is a game breaking trait for many reasons mentioned in this thread. Repeating something many times does not make it true.
Mesper	Posted - 2007.07.14 05:26:00 - [86] Edited by: Mesper on 14/07/2007 05:27:06 Originally by: Zachstar Your ability to track how many times your feelings are hurt isnt interesting me one bit. It has nothing to do with this conversation and you need to stop with that mess. Au contrare, my feelings are neither hurt nor relevant to the issue at hand. However, neither are yours. You say to "stop with this mess," yet you have called an innocent bystander "disgusting" and claimed I am, effectively, without education or character while also being a member of a bad and dumb generation. Care to explain how you are not a hypocrite at this moment in time? Originally by: Zachstar No, no reason to change the way things are going. Again your feelings need not be part of this debate. The only constant is change, don't you know? And, again, please keep your emotions and rants from this. Originally by: Zachstar Any validity of the reasons for denying a queue are quickly shadowed by the traits I mentioned above in this generation. For this reason I have little reason to believe that you will ever see validity in these reasons unless those bad traits vanish quickly. ...wow. It's the...generation? We're all conspired against you, is that it? Originally by: Zachstar WRONG: It will allow quick lvls up to 3 and setting to 4-5 resulting in a large numbers of 4-5 farmers. The fact that it takes so long to have to switch now is causing a problem and this will quickly grow that issue. Anyone new to the game can quickly do the same. And, even then, is it such a bad thing to have a character easily reach early level skills easily? Would you rather it be insanely hard? Do you think that would stop the underground gold farming? Originally by: Zachstar DO NOT start with that " do not bring that up, and debunked " junk. You are in no position to declare a reason debunked and invalid. At this point, I would say it is you who is in no position to continue down that path. Originally by: Zachstar Again WRONG: It will aid in this generations sinking into more automation and sets the stage for demanding more. A stop must be established here! Before things get really bad. Let me get this straight. According to you...allowing players on EVE-Online a one queue skill will cause the players to en masse demand more? People are always going to demand more. That's almost a non issue in how true it is. Thing is, is it good for the game as a whole? If it is, then it should be implemented. If not, it should not. You have yet to say anything valid to counter why it would be good. I would be more than happy to debate you, but you have no idea how to debate. Here's a free hint for you: starting one off with the phrase "You are disgusting!" is not considered good form. You might want to step away from the claims that I won't understand what you're trying to say because I'm a dumb American from a bad generation, too, but I'd be ecstatic for you if you could at least learn to debate civilly first. Originally by: Zachstar You failed to understand the meaning of that post it seems. I encourage you to study the terminology and history behind "slippery-slope" and not respond so wrongly until you understand it completely. I know very well what slippery slope is, and you have not demonstrated at all that the devs would follow it. This, says you who have employed three man tigers, truthiness fallacies, judgmental language, false premises, ad hominem abusives, and more non sequiturs than you can shake a stick at. The moment you put something with some meat down on the table, I'll engage you. Until then, I consider you a hostile troll and will debate with you no longer. oh, and... Originally by: Zachstar What does this have to do with anything. If you can't think of somthing acceptable to post then it is better to not post it. ...learn to laugh.
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.14 06:13:00 - [87] Well since it seems the 2 hours I spent getting those quote posts to work right failed utterly to break through those traits above I see no reason to continue to debate with you as well. BTW Before you believe otherwise I am an adult American born and raised in Louisiana who has experienced first hand the horrors and errors of the US .gov Educational System and the generations I mentioned. The whole system is broken beyond belief and is so dull and unimaginative that it is quickly falling behind other nations. Thankfully a few teachers tried very hard to break through such idiocy by promoting self research (Not just flat out believing some BS someone tells you) and thinking for oneself instead of being a totally predictable borg in today's society. I think it needs to be made clear that this is a heated issue. As such I encourage all to make their voice heard here. If any action is to be taken it needs to be debated to death and back before anything. Anyway I wish not to continue my earlier points because I feel they are clear and good to go. So let me say this. This current system has really forced me to sit down and think about what I am going to do. I can lightly compare finding out what your goals are in EVE to light goals in real life such as losing a tad bit of weight or learning to fix a part of the car. It is challenging to figure out the timing and other parts of my character which is a HUGE plus for such a game. A game such as EVE ought to cause players to anticipate, plan, act, react, debate, and imagine for once. It needs not to cader to modern deficiencies in modern society but help encourage people to sit down and think for once. To resist constant automation and to maybe show some creativity. In my view it is imperative that the developers say no to this idea of a skill queue once and for all.
Kelestra	Posted - 2007.07.14 07:28:00 - [88] well, this certainly turned ugly rather quickly. basically one side appears to wish for a simple system to moderately ease their training experience within a PAY-PER-MONTH mmo. crazy of them to want to be able to have a proper amount of control over a system that really sets this game apart from all others. now personally i was in the 'auto-train till 5-then stop' camp, but after reading the many (valid and varied) opinions on this subject i now prefer the 'backup-skill training' idea. we should log in to switch skills, it allows us to fully appreciate the game that some appear to take way to seriously. however we should not be forced to slave our lives to an expensive form of make-believe. i actually have several hours in my day to play after work, however EVE IS NOT THE ONLY GAME IN THE WORLD. this is my sleepy, I want to relax game. when i'm hyped i like to roll around in a shooter getting my butt kicked by underage hyperactive people.(either that or i'm getting slow in my "omg 30 getting closer" age) i do not want to plan and organise my experience, this is a form of entertainment, not a blarging career. (i'm already expected to be one-half of the leadership in the technology department of a AA-rated store, more bloody details are the last thing i want right now.) if someone wants to do so, then do so. just don't push your ideals on me. i neither want nor wish for them, they are yours not mine. philisophically and morally speaking, you really have no right to do so. basically the nay-sayers have yet to bring forth a sound and rational argument against this one skill queue system. all i'm seeing is hate and intolerance added to near hysterical paranoia that their favorite experience is going to be ruined. in other words while i am in favor of the '+1 training queue', i'm really ranting against those who are unable to value another's opinion due to their own hubris. we stopped burning witches a long time ago, why not stop hating other concepts indiscriminately as well. In other words: "DON'T GROW UP, EVOLVE!" concept signed and approved by: ~TehDrekk~
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.07.14 09:10:00 - [89] The skill-system as it is now is BAD for casual players. IF there is a skillsystem which learns while offline THEN there should be a QEUEING-SYSTEM.Period. When one gets to the point where one plays less ITS A BIG DIFFERENCE if you keep losing skill-time or can atleast continue skilling during yourPAIDeve-break. If you keep losing time one might at a point think wth I will quit completly (This doesnt apply to me but might apply to MANY players who are semiactive.....)
Rashmika Clavain Gallente Revelation Space	Posted - 2007.07.14 12:05:00 - [90] If you cannoit plan your skill times to complete when your online then you fail at EVE The system is brilliant as it is, and has worked very well for a number of years. I think the Dev's have more important things to do than implement changes for lazy or cack handed people.

Max Essen	Posted - 2007.07.14 16:45:00 - [91] Originally by: Rashmika Clavain If you cannoit plan your skill times to complete when your online then you fail at EVE The system is brilliant as it is, and has worked very well for a number of years. I think the Dev's have more important things to do than implement changes for lazy or cack handed people. Well, I am not lazy, but I travel quite often for up to two weeks at a shot. Also, as I have mentioned, my work laptop can not play Eve which is why I mentioned my desire to log into the Eve-Online website to start new skill training. I do not believe this makes me lazy or "cack handed", as you put it, and I seem to be able to plan fairly well in Eve so far.
Rashmika Clavain Gallente Revelation Space	Posted - 2007.07.14 16:53:00 - [92] Well you would appear to be a genuine reason for implementing it, but I feel your situation is unusual. Not that I'd advocate using work related IT kit for non work purposes
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.14 21:10:00 - [93] Originally by: Zachstar Well since it seems the 2 hours I spent getting those quote posts to work right failed utterly to break through those traits above I see no reason to continue to debate with you as well. BTW Before you believe otherwise I am an adult American born and raised in Louisiana who has experienced first hand the horrors and errors of the US .gov Educational System and the generations I mentioned. The whole system is broken beyond belief and is so dull and unimaginative that it is quickly falling behind other nations. Thankfully a few teachers tried very hard to break through such idiocy by promoting self research (Not just flat out believing some BS someone tells you) and thinking for oneself instead of being a totally predictable borg in today's society. I think it needs to be made clear that this is a heated issue. As such I encourage all to make their voice heard here. If any action is to be taken it needs to be debated to death and back before anything. Anyway I wish not to continue my earlier points because I feel they are clear and good to go. So let me say this. This current system has really forced me to sit down and think about what I am going to do. I can lightly compare finding out what your goals are in EVE to light goals in real life such as losing a tad bit of weight or learning to fix a part of the car. It is challenging to figure out the timing and other parts of my character which is a HUGE plus for such a game. A game such as EVE ought to cause players to anticipate, plan, act, react, debate, and imagine for once. It needs not to cader to modern deficiencies in modern society but help encourage people to sit down and think for once. To resist constant automation and to maybe show some creativity. In my view it is imperative that the developers say no to this idea of a skill queue once and for all. I'm sorry you went to a terrible school. Perhaps if you'd gone to a good one you'd be able to put forward a coherent and reasonable explaination of why making it slightly less inconvenient to to train 6H skills will ruin EvE without making bizarre tangents into off-topic subjects and without insulting people. The Slippery slope fallacy is well known and easily refuted (luckily the internet is a fine resource available even to those with deficient educations). Perhaps you'd like to have a glass of cold water and a little fresh air. Then perhaps you could explain how a very modest request (almost everyone here has said they'd be very happy with either a 1-skill queue or for the next level in a skill to automatically start training) will cause an explosion in character farming, the destruction of EvE, the end of civilisation as we know it! I'd also like to add that even if that explosion occurred, farmed characters would still take 2 years to hit 30M SP, just like anyone else. The only benefit that these hypothetical character farmers would receive is in the early stages; so the supply of young "learning skills only" characters might increase. But the economics of selling young characters are already very poor; you have to pay the 20E to create the account, and 20E to trf the chracter, and then of course buy the skills and implants ingame - those are fixed overheads. And in any case, I'm not convinced that having a supply of "learning skills only" characters available is a bad thing. If I wanted to introduce a friend to the game, I would advise him to consider one, to cut a month off the time he'd have to wait before coming out to join me in 0.0 Do you have any evidence that EvE character-farming is widespread and problematic? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.14 21:22:00 - [94] Well that was a flat out insult and I feel no need to respond to any of your points. Again refer to my posts above. You completely failed to understand the post and I see no reason to constantly waste my time on quote posts when it's going to do zero good on yall. I will concentrate my efforts now on my views to the devs. These people are yet again ignoring experience and do not understand what a system like this will do. CCP please say no to a skill queue!
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.07.14 21:45:00 - [95] Edited by: Dimagus on 14/07/2007 21:49:49 Edited by: Dimagus on 14/07/2007 21:48:40 Edited by: Dimagus on 14/07/2007 21:47:33 I've personally lost a bit of training time in recent weeks due to server related issues, with no fault on my end. Being subjected to desyncs, intense server lag, being unable to load character sheets, etc. I was online and running missions when the whole server got fubared the other day, right in the middle of training low time skills on my salvager/industrial alt. When server problems hit, even loading the character sheet becomes problematic, and switching the training skill is unreliable. End up disconnected, can't get past authenticating for 10 minutes, get in far enough to start loading the system, disconnect again, then they take down the server for a reboot. Expecting us to be online at an exact arbitrary moment in time for every skill is a joke. We shouldn't have to be dodging and rescheduling around personal life, ISP/internet conflicts, or even server problems and downtimes. If I had only be able to log in at the appropriate time for switching that skill, and not an hour later when the server came back up, I would have lost far more than an hour of training. If I'm training Drone Interfacing IV and it takes 4 days, I want it to be done in 4 days and then move on to Interfacing V. I don't want to train 7% of some other skill I really don't want/need at the moment to waste 8 hours of micromanaging time availability. Put in a 1 skill queue, so when Interfacing IV is finished it starts up Interfacing V, and I'll still have to log in at some point to set the next one. As to the whole character farmer debate, it doesn't matter either way. The farmers either have a low-salary worker on 23 hours a day to click it, or they're botted and skills change automatically. A queue system isn't going to influence their setup at all, but it will help the honest players.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.14 22:30:00 - [96] Edited by: Malcanis on 14/07/2007 22:31:01 Originally by: Zachstar Edited by: Zachstar on 14/07/2007 21:24:34 Well that was a flat out insult and I feel no need to respond to any of your points. Again refer to my posts above. You completely failed to understand the post and I see no reason to constantly waste my time on quote posts when it's going to do zero good on yall. I will concentrate my efforts on getting my view to the devs here. Instead of this crap why don't yall do the same? Both Anti and Pro Queue start posting YOUR reasons why you think its good or not. These people are yet again ignoring experience and do not understand what a system like this will do. CCP please say no to a skill queue! Well now that you know first-hand how people respond when you gratuitously insult them and their education, perhaps you'd like to reconsider a few of your earlier posts and apologise to the people to whom you directed them? Would you like to discuss this politely now? If so, I will edit my post. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Zachstar	Posted - 2007.07.14 23:31:00 - [97] Originally by: Malcanis Edited by: Malcanis on 14/07/2007 22:31:01 Originally by: Zachstar Edited by: Zachstar on 14/07/2007 21:24:34 Well that was a flat out insult and I feel no need to respond to any of your points. Again refer to my posts above. You completely failed to understand the post and I see no reason to constantly waste my time on quote posts when it's going to do zero good on yall. I will concentrate my efforts on getting my view to the devs here. Instead of this crap why don't yall do the same? Both Anti and Pro Queue start posting YOUR reasons why you think its good or not. These people are yet again ignoring experience and do not understand what a system like this will do. CCP please say no to a skill queue! 1.Well now that you know first-hand how people respond when you gratuitously insult them and their education, 2.perhaps you'd like to reconsider a few of your earlier posts and apologise to the people to whom you directed them? 3.Would you like to discuss this politely now? If so, I will edit my post. #1 No, You fail yet again... I am not seeing first hand of anything because my posts were not insulting. #2 HELL No! Why do I need to apologize for somthing that is not in error? Stop your mess as its wasting my time. #3 I see no reason to discuss anything with you. Stop responding to me, you are simply wasting the time of you, me, and CCP. No need to edit your post as I'm not some crybaby fool who gets his feelings hurt by someone mentioning how bad my nation's education system is. Sorry if that issue hurts people's feelings but maybe it's time to face the facts here.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.15 09:45:00 - [98] Well, thank you for helping us all avoid waste any further time. So.... who would like to discuss this politely? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Fswd	Posted - 2007.07.15 13:48:00 - [99] Originally by: Zachstar Originally by: Malcanis Edited by: Malcanis on 14/07/2007 22:31:01 Originally by: Zachstar Edited by: Zachstar on 14/07/2007 21:24:34 Well that was a flat out insult and I feel no need to respond to any of your points. Again refer to my posts above. You completely failed to understand the post and I see no reason to constantly waste my time on quote posts when it's going to do zero good on yall. I will concentrate my efforts on getting my view to the devs here. Instead of this crap why don't yall do the same? Both Anti and Pro Queue start posting YOUR reasons why you think its good or not. These people are yet again ignoring experience and do not understand what a system like this will do. CCP please say no to a skill queue! 1.Well now that you know first-hand how people respond when you gratuitously insult them and their education, 2.perhaps you'd like to reconsider a few of your earlier posts and apologise to the people to whom you directed them? 3.Would you like to discuss this politely now? If so, I will edit my post. #1 No, You fail yet again... I am not seeing first hand of anything because my posts were not insulting. #2 HELL No! Why do I need to apologize for somthing that is not in error? Stop your mess as its wasting my time. #3 I see no reason to discuss anything with you. Stop responding to me, you are simply wasting the time of you, me, and CCP. No need to edit your post as I'm not some crybaby fool who gets his feelings hurt by someone mentioning how bad my nation's education system is. Sorry if that issue hurts people's feelings but maybe it's time to face the facts here. Ok, now point on the doll where Malcanis touched you --- snip Trolling and discussion of moderation removed - Serathu ([email protected])
Stark Skari	Posted - 2007.07.15 22:41:00 - [100] I recently lost 22.5 hours od training time because a huge storm hit where I live. I'm not particularly mad, it's just annoying. Being able to queue one skill (or advance to the next level) would be a great addition to the game. Perhaps it oculd cost ISK to queue up another skill? I derno.

Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.16 17:27:00 - [101] Quote: When server problems hit, even loading the character sheet becomes problematic, and switching the training skill is unreliable. End up disconnected, can't get past authenticating for 10 minutes, get in far enough to start loading the system, disconnect again, then they take down the server for a reboot. Expecting us to be online at an exact arbitrary moment in time for every skill is a joke. We shouldn't have to be dodging and rescheduling around personal life, ISP/internet conflicts, or even server problems and downtimes. If I had only be able to log in at the appropriate time for switching that skill, and not an hour later when the server came back up, I would have lost far more than an hour of training. If I'm training Drone Interfacing IV and it takes 4 days, I want it to be done in 4 days and then move on to Interfacing V. I don't want to train 7% of some other skill I really don't want/need at the moment to waste 8 hours of micromanaging time availability. Put in a 1 skill queue, so when Interfacing IV is finished it starts up Interfacing V, and I'll still have to log in at some point to set the next one. As to the whole character farmer debate, it doesn't matter either way. The farmers either have a low-salary worker on 23 hours a day to click it, or they're botted and skills change automatically. A queue system isn't going to influence their setup at all, but it will help the honest players. That says it all... CCP PLEASE get the skillqueue from drawing-board into the NEXT build Thankyou yours sincerly
Zxenis Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.07.16 22:00:00 - [102] I vote for at least a 1 skill queue too.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.16 22:43:00 - [103] Originally by: Fswd Originally by: Zachstar Originally by: Malcanis Edited by: Malcanis on 14/07/2007 22:31:01 Originally by: Zachstar Edited by: Zachstar on 14/07/2007 21:24:34 Well that was a flat out insult and I feel no need to respond to any of your points. Again refer to my posts above. You completely failed to understand the post and I see no reason to constantly waste my time on quote posts when it's going to do zero good on yall. I will concentrate my efforts on getting my view to the devs here. Instead of this crap why don't yall do the same? Both Anti and Pro Queue start posting YOUR reasons why you think its good or not. These people are yet again ignoring experience and do not understand what a system like this will do. CCP please say no to a skill queue! 1.Well now that you know first-hand how people respond when you gratuitously insult them and their education, 2.perhaps you'd like to reconsider a few of your earlier posts and apologise to the people to whom you directed them? 3.Would you like to discuss this politely now? If so, I will edit my post. #1 No, You fail yet again... I am not seeing first hand of anything because my posts were not insulting. #2 HELL No! Why do I need to apologize for somthing that is not in error? Stop your mess as its wasting my time. #3 I see no reason to discuss anything with you. Stop responding to me, you are simply wasting the time of you, me, and CCP. No need to edit your post as I'm not some crybaby fool who gets his feelings hurt by someone mentioning how bad my nation's education system is. Sorry if that issue hurts people's feelings but maybe it's time to face the facts here. Ok, now point on the doll where Malcanis touched you That's not a doll; it's my alt... CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Samiches	Posted - 2007.07.17 12:23:00 - [104] Zachstar is such a shining example of hypocrisies and absurdity it is actually funny. The majority (not all) of those against a skill queue have made hostile and fallacious posts. Those for the skill queue on the other hand have all made valid points. Originally I was neutral. When confronted with a raging mad man and a cool headed diplomat however, I tend to side with the diplomat. /signed for +1 skill queue
throbbinnoggin Gallente Eminent Domain	Posted - 2007.07.17 15:43:00 - [105] I don't know how this statement has been a part of "The Drawingboard" but it does give me some hope. Linkage Third paragraph from the bottom and I quote: "Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again." After skimming through these last 4 pages and reading all the arguments against even a simple single skill queue method... there really aren't any plausible arguments but I'll list the 2 main objections along with my rebuttal. 1) The character farmers are going to take advantage of this and destroy EVE argument. Response: Character and isk farmers are online 23 hours a day 365 days a year. That is their job. They keep fine tabs on their multiple accounts and don't lose out, except to the occasional server implosion which can effect us all. A single skill queue method is not going to alter farmers abilities to any significant degree. As far as non-paying accounts are concerned, disable the queue on them. If for some reason this is not possible limit the queued skill to no longer than one week running time. 2) The I work 4 jobs go to 2 schools working on 3 degrees while doing volunteer work for the Salvation Army, Red Cross and the local PTA so what's up with all you lazy (insert additional random insult here) people I can manage skill changes why can't you reason. Response: Irrelevent. This is not a valid reason against having a skill queue method. In summary: A single skill queue will not cause the downfall of EVE. All pitfalls of such have already been rebutted by posters before myself. I'm just adding my point of view. 1) Limit queueing system to only one skill to take over when the current one finishes. 2) Disable queueing for non paying accounts. 3) If number 2 is not possible, or quite frankly even if is is, limit the skill queued to no longer than one week running time. The only, barely valid argument of character farming, would be seriously inhibited by this method. Tis better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt. 'Abraham Lincoln'
Max Essen	Posted - 2007.07.18 16:50:00 - [106] I think I just realized why the "Skill Farm" argument may be invalid. If you have more than one Eve character, only one can train a skill at a time! Kind of makes the Skill Farming a bit unattractive to anyone trying to make money off of it. What do you all think?
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.20 17:06:00 - [107] Originally by: Max Essen I think I just realized why the "Skill Farm" argument may be invalid. If you have more than one Eve character, only one can train a skill at a time! Kind of makes the Skill Farming a bit unattractive to anyone trying to make money off of it. What do you all think? Skillfarmers sit at their computers all day anyway. NOT having a skill-queue ONLY hurts casual gamers. In other mmorpg you skill during gameplay - In this game you skill even offline - It is calculated that the skill runs most of the time even when offline - Here comes the part where casual players are FORCED to go online to change a skill - If they dont you lose an extreme amount of time and whats the bloody point then in playing this game anyway?
Hakiro Murasame Caldari	Posted - 2007.07.20 20:37:00 - [108] LOL @ Brat & Zach. You guys are funny. I loved reading your invalid and poorly constructed arguments. The insults and sickening arrogance was very refreshing for all, I'm sure. I agree with adding a 1-skill queue. It would make the experience much better for those of us who can't predict the future and therefore can't log in to change skills all the time. It would still require some planning on your part as you would have to change skills when the queued one finishes, but it would add flexibility to the whole system, IMO. Ganj is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2007.07.21 01:07:00 - [109] I don't know. I dislike the idea of having a queue system simply because it doesn't feel eveish you know? I mean ya, I can tell that little girl-face-cpu thing to stick in Random Skill 5 into my brain when Random Skill 4 finishes, and it makes total sense that it would work, but I'd feel weird letting some cpu stick something in me while I'm sleeping in my goo... Weirdness aside, I am against the idea for unknown reasons. It would not benefit farmers in any way or form, they will be on anyway getting ISK and character farmers probably have macros set up already, realisticly. I do see why it should be implemented though, for those who have to work for weeks at a time and don't always have a 50-day skill to train, but that's the only realistic issue. If you can only get on for 2 hours a day, that's not CCP's probably to be honest. It takes 3 seconds to log on while you're munching on some breakfast before work, change a skill then. I'm not trying to bash anyone, but seriously. If a skills gonna finish at 3am, change it to the next skill you wanted to train and finish it later. "Getting 7% of a skill you didn't really need/want". I find it hard to believe you have only ONE skill you want in the entire game. I am against it for no real reason. Sorry to the guys who can't achieve that 100% effiency. Sorry to the guys that lose their internet and lose a day or two of training. I see no real benefits to adding a 1 skill queue system, aside from helping the people who arnt going to be on during that fleet op anyway, because they have to work all the time. I like the way it is now, simply because it feels right. Go ahead and bash me and repeat yourselves. If CCP adds this good on them; I'll make use of it regardless of my position.
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.07.21 05:16:00 - [110] My regrets to anyone that had a skill timer finish tonight, and my sincerest sympathy to anyone who couldn't stick around until the (eventual) end of this server fiasco. If only you had a skill queue, you might not be losing this training time :(

Reygrimm	Posted - 2007.07.21 05:23:00 - [111] Yes...Skill Queue system would be great for moments like tonight. Just allow me to put 1 in the queue :) Oh well, skill finishes in an hour, I'll be up in 8 or so...lose about 7 hours... life goes on....
James McRen	Posted - 2007.07.21 05:23:00 - [112] Originally by: Dimagus My regrets to anyone that had a skill timer finish tonight, and my sincerest sympathy to anyone who couldn't stick around until the (eventual) end of this server fiasco. If only you had a skill queue, you might not be losing this training time :( Yep, that's me. The skill on one of my character's finished an amazing !7! seconds after I was kicked off the server... Woo hoo... As I sit here I really do hope the severs will be back up when they say it will. (we all know that's very unlikely) To anyone who would say, "well, just do it tomorrow when it's back up - you'll only lose a few hours," I will get up and leave tomorrow during the standard downtime, and won't be back home for a week!
Panch0Villa Caldari AFK	Posted - 2007.07.21 05:59:00 - [113] I was training to a Level II skill. I log off to get a bite to eat, figure I'll be back in an hour, and voila, servers down and I'm wasting skill points. Argument: But the mean mean toon farmers will ruin my wittle game! Counter-argument: Training toons/alts/characters takes TIME, but hey, you can only train one person on a paid account at a time! How could that ever be truly profitable! Besides, it's not like a noob can come in with a purchased pvp toon and kick butt. They will just fork over their loot as fast as that faction-fitted isk-buying 9-year old that got popped the other day. You know which one I'm talkin about. In Eve, the forces of nature will take care of these guys. Argument #2: But you're just a whining whiny wittle whiner! Riposte: I pay for this account. Is it really too much to ask for me to keep my skill points? Especially when I lose a few hours of skills due to some server issues? Patch DL's? Lag? RL? My dog? My gf? It doesn't matter what you say here, because I paid cold hard cash to play. I can't pay, I don't play. Why would anyone say that these SP's don't belong to me just because I don't sit in front of my computer all the time? Argument #3: But then everyone else will have better characters than moi! Retort: No one is going to become pvp king simply because they can queue an extra skill. Do you realize that some people can only check their characters once or twice a week? Or that they don't want to gasp constantly check and recheck their characters skills? There has been/is no convincing argument against this, other than circular logic: We don't because we never had it... etc Argument #4: I don't like you because you are a __________________ who is lazy and therefore undeserving of a little common decency and respect. Comeback: Ok, if you do not agree, fine, I won't argue the point with you. Let's just take a poll and see how many people are for and against. This isn't about who is the most dedicated Eve player at all. This is about what the players want, and I don't think anyone has the right to feel indignant that I want to skill system to be easier on me. It makes no difference to me, sit in front of your computer until your eyes fall out of your head, or have a RL. It doesn't make a difference. And please, no more hostility, that will only get this thread locked. /signed "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Juin Dar	Posted - 2007.07.21 06:47:00 - [114] Something tells me Zack isn't even old enough to vote, let alone make a decision for over 30,000 people. As a democracy (we are right?) I 'vote' not demand, yes to the single queue and/or the backup queue.
Yoshi Horohito	Posted - 2007.07.21 06:53:00 - [115] I disagree with the lazy player post, a skill queue is needed when you factor in this constant server crashing problem. This is the second night in a row where the server crashed for no good reason for more than an hour and many people were caught off guard and were training a short skill. The argument for not having a skill queue is mostly due to the fact that you can train a skill and it continues to train while even if your account is inactive. I feel this should be removed. No other game do you gain advancement while not paying to play. In theory I could start training Titan ships and not ply to play for almost a year then come back in several hundred days and be able to pilot a Titan.
Malcanis High4Life	Posted - 2007.07.21 11:58:00 - [116] Originally by: Yoshi Horohito I disagree with the lazy player post, a skill queue is needed when you factor in this constant server crashing problem. This is the second night in a row where the server crashed for no good reason for more than an hour and many people were caught off guard and were training a short skill. The argument for not having a skill queue is mostly due to the fact that you can train a skill and it continues to train while even if your account is inactive. I feel this should be removed. No other game do you gain advancement while not paying to play. In theory I could start training Titan ships and not ply to play for almost a year then come back in several hundred days and be able to pilot a Titan. Characters continuing to train helps CCP persuade people to return to the game. Titan-capable characters aren't likely to be neglected for so long in any case... CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2007.07.21 20:56:00 - [117] Oh no! I set a queue of two short skills and teh servar crashed! CCP should make the queue longer than just one since they crash LIKE ALL THE TIME.
Renaile Minmatar	Posted - 2007.07.21 22:45:00 - [118] I've only been playing for 3 days, so I don't know how much weight my vote will carry. But this game comes pretty close to sensory overload in the trial period. I would almost assume that a queue of 1 skill and no more, would be a simple non-detrimental change that would be a pretty big draw to a new player exploring the game. Especially when it means it's just one more small thing that you don't have to focus on as intensely while learning to actually play the game. The 3 times I've needed to skill up have been either while I was in the deep sleep portion of my sleep cycle or at work with 110% of my focus on the job at hand. Just knowing that there wasn't a 5 hour period between the completion of my last skill, and the initiation of the next would make the game a lot less frustrating to me. As for isk/character farmers, I have come from lineage II and wow, where the adema farmers completely destroyed the game, and gold farmers in wow have wrecked the economy and have infested almost every area of the internet. After just spending 3 days in the game, I can't imagine that allowing 1 queue would make it any worse than it is. They've already invested in the peon that sits there and clicks 'train,' having 1 queue isn't going to effect that much. /shrug I'd like to see it implimented, I have about a dozen friends that are looking for something else to play, and just simple things like this would make the game twice as appealing to newbies like us. It would be one more pro towards making my final decision to move from trial to paid. I'm not saying that I won't because of it. I'm just still deciding.
Cipher7 OldBastardsPub SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.22 00:52:00 - [119] All for it. CCP said they were working on it. Hopefully sooooon(tm)
Dimagus School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.07.23 21:53:00 - [120] Once again I feel sorry for anyone training a short skill or who has a long skill that finishes around now. Server's down again, no queue = training time lost for you :(

Da'Vide	Posted - 2007.07.24 01:21:00 - [121] Edited by: Da''Vide on 24/07/2007 01:21:52 Why would CCP sell game time for game time? (GTC for ISK).The players base is large enough, and active enough, that they do not need to offer deals for free game time (would consider a game free if I payed for it in fake currency). If this is the mechanic which stands between paying customers getting a que and not getting a que, then simply stop giving your game away and start giving the customers that pay for your servers and bandwidth, etc, what they are asking for. A que with several slots (hey one is nice too) that is locked upon account closure.
Sazkyen	Posted - 2007.07.24 13:06:00 - [122] Yes, Master!!! Please!!!! We really do need such a queue system, quickly!!!
Atius Tirawa Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.07.24 23:22:00 - [123] The more I see this requested, the more I don't like it. 3 years ago, character farming was not a major problem and I would have supported it, hell even a year ago. But now, with a lot of newer players coming into the game and many of them looking for a slight edge in terms of SPs, character farming is becoming a major source of income and has really changed the game. I can't stop character farming, but at least I can make them spend time loging in. I think Eve-Mon is part of this - I know people who have 8+ accounts, and they manage this army through eve-mon - I hate it and I think it ruins the game. But its not my money right?
padraig animal Minmatar Darklite inc INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.07.25 14:47:00 - [124] http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/plannedfeat.asp Quote: Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again.
Mesper	Posted - 2007.07.25 15:12:00 - [125] Originally by: Atius Tirawa I can't stop character farming, but at least I can make them spend time loging in. The question is, how advantageous would it be to make the game less convenient to play? If you make a change or stop from making a change because it "hurts character farmers," how much would it hurt the players as well? I still hold major doubts that this would aid character farmers at all, but let's say that it does for the sake of argument. Lets get hyperbolic so I can make this point easier. CCP decides that, not only will the queue idea go down in flames, but they will add fifty points to the base skillsets (rank 1 skills now need 300 points for level 1 instead of 250). This, of course, propagates all the way down to rank 5's and all further levels. It now takes longer to rank up. Character farmers are now inconvenienced, because it takes much longer to make a character. However, players (ESPECIALLY new ones) are hit hard by the change. What would be the consequences of this? New players that are so inclined would see that it's hard to start off. Really hard. So if they were so inclined, they would buy a character. Heck, even I would buy a character (if I were so inclined to throw away my money...which I'm not). And even better, the farmers would probably be able to RAISE prices. So, now, let's apply this to a skill queue. It may help farmers (a point that we are still merely assuming to be true). It would also help players, mostly the young ones that are skilling up a few 2 and 4 hour skills over night and the vets that are branching into new areas. If it's a little easier to make a character at the beginning, it would follow that fewer people would make characters, and the characters would have to sell for less because of an increase in numbers (still assuming it would help farmers). Not all changes can or should be shot down immediately because they might help the gray market. Chaos theory would be in full effect. Now, if you want to make an argument that it would change game play, and you like the feel of EVE as it is...
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.25 21:22:00 - [126] Originally by: Atius Tirawa The more I see this requested, the more I don't like it. 3 years ago, character farming was not a major problem and I would have supported it, hell even a year ago. But now, with a lot of newer players coming into the game and many of them looking for a slight edge in terms of SPs, character farming is becoming a major source of income and has really changed the game. I can't stop character farming, but at least I can make them spend time loging in. I think Eve-Mon is part of this - I know people who have 8+ accounts, and they manage this army through eve-mon - I hate it and I think it ruins the game. But its not my money right? Do you think having to log as often as they do deters character farmers at present? When you answer, please bear in mind that the server has just gone down AGAIN and I have a character waiting for a skill change right now). CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
OdinWolph Minmatar	Posted - 2007.07.26 10:41:00 - [127] A queued skilltraining system would let people train short time (read: skills with training time less then 4 hours) or such while they are at work. At times it is not always the big +3 day skills that you have a priority with. By adding an extra option in the drop down menu, when you select a skill and right click it, called "Queue skill" or such would be great and probably easiest to put into the game. I am not sure about allowing someone to train 2 skills at once; on a shared training time. It sounds like a complicated thing to program, so it would probably take some time for it to be included. A "simple" skill queue is most welcomed though! ------------------------- "At one time they had a flourishing empire with a level of mechanical excellence never before or since seen anywhere." - Lets bring this era back to our people.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.07.27 03:38:00 - [128] Damnit where is the problem? A skillqueue for queueing ONE skill??? With the servercrashes.... you would not lose anytime anymore. CCP please make a skill-queue BEFORE implementing things like walking around stations...The faster the better - next patch? Greetings Belmarduk
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.07.28 11:50:00 - [129] Being able to queue one skill can hardly be called character farming... Skill-queue PLEASE
Andrymeda	Posted - 2007.07.28 18:19:00 - [130] Originally by: Vicky Steel Edited by: Vicky Steel on 05/06/2007 03:36:42 Am I the only one tired of loging in just to discover i forgot to set a new skill for traing? I wich there was a queue system for skills to be trained, so u could set 5 skills and sleep good at night or if your computer brakes and are gone for a week u still know it,s ok since the last skills is a long one that you dont need right now. Or atlest that the skill u was training just contineu with the next level on the same skill would be a relife. /Vicky S Ah I c the problem, but if they set a queue of 2 and only 1 skill can be lev 5 that should limit farmers but yet give serius players what we want and maby rice the payment for 1 mounth so it would not be ekonomical to farmers, could this work? /Vicky S I'd rather be able to train our alts on the same account at the same time more than an off-line skill queue. ----------- Lame sig

Leeluvv Caldari	Posted - 2007.07.29 12:10:00 - [131] Edited by: Leeluvv on 29/07/2007 12:10:07 Don't make a skill queue, but instead, when a skill finishes, just have the game choose another one to start training. This could be a random choice or based on some level of simple intelligence (the next level, or the next skill or the quickest to train, etc). It may not be a skill you need now, but at least you aren't losing SP. lee == Sig to follow
Xynomorphine Gallente Xynomorph Industries	Posted - 2007.07.30 01:01:00 - [132] I'm all for the skill queing idea as long as it is set for the max of say "two" skills per time, as due to the nature of my work i'm away for two weeks of the month with no PC access so it is a bit of a juggle for organising for a 14 day period. this is the way I see it, 1. Max of two skills in the Que 2. Any one skill that is longer than 14 day's cannot be trained on que idea. As this will stop the Farming idea to a degree. 3. Lvl IV & V training cannot use que system. 4. CCP to fix the bug of training whilist account is Suspended (Not Paid). Xynomorph Ind Believe in no one, trust in no one, the truth is really out there, keep your friends and alies close but your enimies even closer.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.30 08:30:00 - [133] "4. CCP to fix the bug of training whilist account is Suspended (Not Paid)." I suspect that this is not a bug, but a deliberate choice. Not like they couldn't have fixed this in a few minutes if they wanted to. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.01 15:33:00 - [134] Originally by: Malcanis "4. CCP to fix the bug of training whilist account is Suspended (Not Paid)." I suspect that this is not a bug, but a deliberate choice. Not like they couldn't have fixed this in a few minutes if they wanted to. Asfaik its been fixed
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.02 12:50:00 - [135] Edited by: Malcanis on 02/08/2007 12:55:19 Aaaaand my skill just completed. Perhaps some of the clever buggers posting in this thread would like to tell me how I should have "managed" my training schedule to avoid being unable to set a new skill? EDT: I got lucky and only lost a couple of minutes. But the point remains. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Haradgrim Caldari The Wild Bunch	Posted - 2007.08.02 20:36:00 - [136] I don't see why you couldnt have 1 skills that takes less then 24hours and one that takes more than 24, that would be a pretty simple fix and wouldnt allow much exploitation - Haradgrim [-WB-] That.which.does.not.bend.breaks
Kathira Gallente Denial of Service Freelancer Coalition	Posted - 2007.08.03 06:24:00 - [137] My playtimes are not really regular. I play when I have time. With the current system my problem is to have several skills unfinished between 5 to 12 hours cause I cant really time my chances of beeing online fast enough or long enough. Often I decided to run a skill knowing that it will be finished hours before I can start a new one. I would like a system in which I could set a skill ( like BC level 5 ) as a backup which will be startet when the normal skill runs out. With this I would do not lost so much skilltime. I do not need a skillchain just one backupskill as a timefiller. Often it goes this way .. evening 10.30 to 11.00 hm skill is running 5 hours .. bleh. Time to take an other one .. hm ... oh here restskilltime 14 hours ... ok remember to start the comp next morning to change the skill cause its too short until I come back ... You see ... in this case I am a slave of the game .. doomed to start my comp the next morning only to change a skill for not loosing time. You may now say .. thats no effort to do ... and youre right in a way ... but here the game try to dictates my life and thats nothing I want a game do to me.
Serj Darek Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises	Posted - 2007.08.03 07:40:00 - [138] Originally by: Andrymeda I'd rather be able to train our alts on the same account at the same time more than an off-line skill queue. I think that would be quite un-economical to CCP. So that will never be implemented imo. First!
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.03 17:13:00 - [139] Originally by: Kathira My playtimes are not really regular. I play when I have time. With the current system my problem is to have several skills unfinished between 5 to 12 hours cause I cant really time my chances of beeing online fast enough or long enough. Often I decided to run a skill knowing that it will be finished hours before I can start a new one. I would like a system in which I could set a skill ( like BC level 5 ) as a backup which will be startet when the normal skill runs out. With this I would do not lost so much skilltime. I do not need a skillchain just one backupskill as a timefiller. Often it goes this way .. evening 10.30 to 11.00 hm skill is running 5 hours .. bleh. Time to take an other one .. hm ... oh here restskilltime 14 hours ... ok remember to start the comp next morning to change the skill cause its too short until I come back ... You see ... in this case I am a slave of the game .. doomed to start my comp the next morning only to change a skill for not loosing time. You may now say .. thats no effort to do ... and youre right in a way ... but here the game try to dictates my life and thats nothing I want a game do to me. This post sums it up very well.... Am trying to get a new player into my corp atm - He was not pleased when he heard about the skill-system without a skill-queue.... :( Lets see..
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.08.07 12:02:00 - [140] It would be nice to hear when it will be implemented

Humwawa	Posted - 2007.08.07 12:02:00 - [141] It would be nice to hear when it will be implemented
Haradgrim Caldari The Wild Bunch	Posted - 2007.08.07 20:22:00 - [142] Originally by: Humwawa It would be nice to hear when it will be implemented Your double post aside, did you even read this thread? - Haradgrim [-WB-] That.which.does.not.bend.breaks
MotoMissles	Posted - 2007.08.08 00:10:00 - [143] YES! I'm not sure if this idea has been brought up, i didn't bother to read the whole thread, but I'd suggest a delay between skills if those skills are queued. For example, Johnny finishes training a 10 hour skill, he has another skill queued, but between them would be a delay of 10% of the first skill (1 hour in this case). Maximum queue length would be 3 skills or something. Or something to that effect. That way, it's like autopilot. Sure you can use it, and it will benefit you if you're on vacation or something, but you'll be slowed a bit.
deepfreeze007 Caldari Swordfish LLD	Posted - 2007.08.09 08:49:00 - [144] I would be in favor of some sort of skill queue although it wouldn't help me in my current situation. I'd definately support being able to log into my account online and have the ability to switch skills there vice in-game. As far as the arguement that it's not that hard/difficult to just manage your training times and simply log in to switch skills, sometimes it's just not that easy or even plausable to be available to do that. Using myself as an example, I'm in the Navy and sometimes my RL commitments don't allow me to simply log into the game and change what skill I'm training. I'm finishing up a 7 1/2 month deployment and haven't had decent internet access this whole time. I've had to rely (i.e. trust) on someone else to log into my accounts and set the skills I'm training according to what plan I had setup in EveMon to keep my characters training. I've been paying this whole time and haven't even had the ability to play. I have no qualms with the way training skills is currently set up, but would certainly invite a new or easier way to maintain my training. If we weren't all about anything new or easier, we'd all still be living in caves and searching for food. I also don't understand this worry about character farmers. Until I read this thread, I hadn't even thought that it was happening in this game, or that anyone thought it was a problem. I've played this game for over a year and a half now and there is no way to "grind" as it was put earlier in this thread. There's no magical formula for creating a shortcut to a higher SP character. Everyone earns SP at about the same basic rate plus or minus whatever your attributes are. Everything we have to go to train skill "X", someone who's farming does too. The fact someone sits a computer 23/7 to do it and someone else only does it 2/3 is irrelevent. This is another tool that will help me maintain my character, just like EveMon, and Quickfit, and any other tool out there that someone made for us, and I'm in support of it. ~deepfreeze007 Hulks, they're like vampires for roids.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 11:50:00 - [145] None of the people who've opposed this with the "ON HO CHARACTER-FARMERS!!!11" argument have responded to my repeated requests for any evidence at all that character farming is widespread, that it would be made viable with a 1-skill queue, or that it would be a problem for the game even if it did occur. But I guess just responding to every request for new feature X with "ON NO, X-FARMERS!!!11" is easier than actually producing evidence. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Marshall Knight Ardent Industrial Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.09 12:11:00 - [146] Im against this idea Reason Why do i play this game i play it to socilise with people to do my pvp or mining or trading whatever i also do it cause i enjoy playing. I dont need no que system so what i miss an hour training now and then hell i reckon i could probably be using a command ship by now with all the training i have missed but does it bother me no. do i have my skills to enjoy the game yes do i have completly uber skills no do i want them yes but is it important in this game no. Just becuase you miss a skill trianing time here and there aint the end of the bloody world. You have tools like eve mon that tell ya when ya skil is going to finish if im away for awhile i swap to a lvl 5 skill when i get back i swap back to what i was training these skils have to be done sometime so just use common sense. Skill queing will just cause issues mainly the fact people will stop interacting. If all you play this game for is to max ya character out then thats a really sad life. This game is about the community the fighting the competiveness the killing the dying its not the be it and end all if ya miss a skill and i think a majority of poeple who want this are just looking for easier way of getting there char maxed quicker with little effort involved and the true amount of people who only get to play for 2 or 3 hours a day are in the minority anyway. This would cause more problems than it would solve and woudl change the way eve is played in my oppinion and its just an oppionion for the worse
Anya Achurii	Posted - 2007.08.10 02:31:00 - [147] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Malcanis "4. CCP to fix the bug of training whilist account is Suspended (Not Paid)." I suspect that this is not a bug, but a deliberate choice. Not like they couldn't have fixed this in a few minutes if they wanted to. Asfaik its been fixed Nope, not unless it was changed in the last month. Pro-tip: It isn't a bug. CCP has disabled unpaid training on their China server, but leaves it on Tranquility to encourage people to resub once they let their subscription lapse. Skill-queue and character farming: Character farming is a non-issue. If you look at sell forums recently average char sale including $20 payout + subscription cost the isk made is roughly equitable to the money you could get by selling GTCs. In short there is every reason to put this is and no reason not to, CCP is just really damn lazy.
Angmar Da'Kirith	Posted - 2007.08.11 14:40:00 - [148] C'mon, let's face the real things: 1) CCP wants to maintain more people in this game so if you can train skills faster you reach a saturation point before peoples that can't train for real life problem 2) every players that complain about queue system are the one that spend more time in eve than the others thinking that more skills gives them an edge over other players that can't spend the same time, it is another form of pvp, the wrong one becouse we are a comunity 3) farmers of any forms stays 23/7 online so queue or not it will be the same 4) please, stop thinking you don't need queue system just becouse you have to connect to the game and be "part of the game". If I have time to play, ok, undock and go, if i have time to just switch skills I will connect and log out, so what's the difference with a queue system? You don't have to chat or make a flight or buy something everytime you switch skill, so why not put skill in queue and don't login if you haven't time? To me any form of queue system makes eve more friendly, so I can spend a monthly fee even if I can't connect for some time and haven't to drive faster to return home for start a training (you can't predic every thing of the life, so why loose time and money for that?). It will be an utility for everyone, let's see so
Rathawk	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:30:00 - [149] Its amazing how heated both sides of this discussion have gotten over the past several days. Both sides are quite polarized (NO QUEUE, EVER and UNLIMITED QUEUE FOR ALL) while neglecting a rather large middleground with a proposed solution that seems to have gone unrefuted while the aforementioned arguement (its beyond debate) continues. People are calling each other lazy, stupid, and resorting to thinly-disguised profanity over this. Its stilly to collectively reduce ourselves to that level. I have yet to see one reason, beyond the overly-general "queues are bad" refrain or "X" game does a form of it and it has destroyed that game. The idea is the one mentioned earlier in this thread, being able to queue a single backup skill that trains when the primary finishes. Its not "laziness" or "failure to plan". Things happen in real life that do not permit us to logon to Eve whenever we need to do so. This is a small added help to us with no significant (as I see it) downside. If you see a downside, please address and discuss it intelligently. Rathawk
Fannatik	Posted - 2007.08.11 20:35:00 - [150] While a queue system "could" be a bad idea if you know anything about isk/gold sellers/farmers that you claim would abuse this you would know: there are already macros for training skills (ebay anyone?). Research is your friend. Basically the only people this would help would be the average joe that can't plan their life around a game they enjoy playing. Adding a system like this "could" contribute to character farming but as mentioned above there are already macros out there that do this. I'm not going to get into a heated discussion about this with anyone simply because i don't care if there is a queue or not i have the time to log in and train a new skill when i need to, But i would love the idea or having more people on a level playing field. Overall it's not a bad idea and should have some serious thought put into it. Your pathetic claims that such and such game was ruined by botters/gold sellers ect is completely bogus here the spammers/farmers/sellers already have ways to mine/24/7 rat/27/7 train/24/7 something like this wouldn't be aiding them it would be aiding the average player that pays their $14 a month to come play a game and have fun.

Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.12 10:43:00 - [151] Originally by: Marshall Knight Im against this idea Reason Why do i play this game i play it to socilise with people to do my pvp or mining or trading whatever i also do it cause i enjoy playing. I dont need no que system so what i miss an hour training now and then hell i reckon i could probably be using a command ship by now with all the training i have missed but does it bother me no. do i have my skills to enjoy the game yes do i have completly uber skills no do i want them yes but is it important in this game no. Just becuase you miss a skill trianing time here and there aint the end of the bloody world. You have tools like eve mon that tell ya when ya skil is going to finish if im away for awhile i swap to a lvl 5 skill when i get back i swap back to what i was training these skils have to be done sometime so just use common sense. Skill queing will just cause issues mainly the fact people will stop interacting. If all you play this game for is to max ya character out then thats a really sad life. This game is about the community the fighting the competiveness the killing the dying its not the be it and end all if ya miss a skill and i think a majority of poeple who want this are just looking for easier way of getting there char maxed quicker with little effort involved and the true amount of people who only get to play for 2 or 3 hours a day are in the minority anyway. This would cause more problems than it would solve and woudl change the way eve is played in my oppinion and its just an oppionion for the worse Marshall - I want the training queue for when I CANT connect to the system Hey, BTW, can you link me to the EvEmon plug in that will schedule your training around unplanned downtimes? You know, the ones that happen every damb week? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Sgt Blade An Eye For An Eye Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.08.12 16:33:00 - [152] i dont see how people are complaining not only do you train while you offline you want to make it so you dont ahve to log in at all for months if you dont want you skills to finish while your unable to get online then put on a longer skill before you go to sleep or work SIMPLE. and if you really really really need to have your skill finish before ou come back online then leave it on and come back. you goin to at most lose a few hours which is nothing. if skill queueing game in right now, i could put on 2 skills and not need to log on for 50 odd days Hypnotic Pelvic Thrusting Level 5
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.12 17:49:00 - [153] Originally by: Sgt Blade i dont see how people are complaining not only do you train while you offline you want to make it so you dont ahve to log in at all for months if you dont want you skills to finish while your unable to get online then put on a longer skill before you go to sleep or work SIMPLE. and if you really really really need to have your skill finish before ou come back online then leave it on and come back. you goin to at most lose a few hours which is nothing. if skill queueing game in right now, i could put on 2 skills and not need to log on for 50 odd days That's real nice for you man. I guess when one has got tens of missions of SP, one can be a little more sanguine about losing a few points, After all, you've got everything you really need. But who's asking for "make it so you dont ahve to log in at all for months"? All I'd want is that if you're training some skill, it carries on to the next level of the same skill. That's adding a maximum of 25% to the time you can train offline. Please tell me how to plan around unplanned server downtimes. Several posters here seem to think it's pretty easy, so I'm clearly missing some obvious technique. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Keitoshi Yamada	Posted - 2007.08.12 20:25:00 - [154] Edited by: Keitoshi Yamada on 12/08/2007 20:26:20 Ok, so I started reading this whole thing, and then gave up since it's people repeating themselves all-day-long with absolutely no input from CCP or anyone else that matters (as I've read so far). You do realize that skills are time-based, anyway, right? I don't see where the hell people bring up the idea that character farmers will take over, I highly doubt this at all. Sure, they can farm the hell out of characters, but the only difference would be that, rather than having down-time where they're offline and not training a skill, they would lose that tiny bit of downtime (which, if they're farmers, they probably are always right there, ready to pick the next skill, or use a macro, anyway). Woo, they still have to wait just as long as all of us to for our skills So on the farming standpoint, that's nixed just on the fact that any farming that would happen AFTER the queue implementation would be EXACTLY the same as it ALREADY is. On to the no off-line training for unpaid member: HELL YEAH!! That would be awesome!!! Sure, they could train while online, they could even queue while online, but the second they go offline, boom, paused training. This would be an ingenious way to do this, and would destroy a large portion of the farming population. *EDIT* BTW, I'm saying that I'm for the SINGLE queued skill, no more than that one, that one will make a huge difference for the players.
Sgt Blade An Eye For An Eye Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.08.13 04:20:00 - [155] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Sgt Blade i dont see how people are complaining not only do you train while you offline you want to make it so you dont ahve to log in at all for months if you dont want you skills to finish while your unable to get online then put on a longer skill before you go to sleep or work SIMPLE. and if you really really really need to have your skill finish before ou come back online then leave it on and come back. you goin to at most lose a few hours which is nothing. if skill queueing game in right now, i could put on 2 skills and not need to log on for 50 odd days That's real nice for you man. I guess when one has got tens of missions of SP, one can be a little more sanguine about losing a few points, After all, you've got everything you really need. But who's asking for "make it so you dont ahve to log in at all for months"? All I'd want is that if you're training some skill, it carries on to the next level of the same skill. That's adding a maximum of 25% to the time you can train offline. Please tell me how to plan around unplanned server downtimes. Several posters here seem to think it's pretty easy, so I'm clearly missing some obvious technique. well generally i think peple who have low sp also dont have much to lose. because thats the thing, we were all noobs once and had to go through that period where we lost sp because of unspecting downtimes and what not. so as it is now, we are generally level imo anyways. and this is about me now but when iwas new to the game, tbh i didnt really care about missing skill time changes and what not at the end of the day there is always somone better then you sp wise (unless your camus ^^) and there isnt anything you can change about it. but also because of how the game works there is no way somone can out SP you a perticular area. for example i myself have pretty decent gunneryskills. i would say taht many many many other pvpers out there who have played longer then me have less to/equal to and at most only slightly better skills then me. at which point its not all about sp but about how you fit your ships (yes yes how big your wallet helps aswell) and tactics. now imo IF skill queueing came in then everyone will jsut skill as normal except you had a backup to trian incase of the unsupecting downtimes BUT i would be pretty sure taht people will ask for a 3rd skill to queue because i am sure that people out tehre will forget about how long their 2 skills last or if one of those "eve is offline for a day and then attempts to get back online but lags to hell for therest of the week" event where both their skills finished and they still couldnt get online and then jsut carry one whining and bashing at ccp to get a longer skill queue. at the end of the day imho i would jsut leave it as it is. everyone who has played eve is sure to have lsot some time to sp and its all just about thinking ahead to how long you can plan a skill. and tbh those sudden unexpected downtimes dont ahppen too often and when one does you kina will notice the performance on eve to drop for you to kinda think... hmmm eve may go down might cahgne a skill jsut incase dam im sorry if you had to read all that im in a forum whoring mood today Hypnotic Pelvic Thrusting Level 5
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 11:09:00 - [156] Ah, the old slippery slope fallacy. If we don't execute people for littering, they'll think we're soft on crime and start murdering little children and old ladies! Still, even if you're concerned about that, there's less of a logical progression from: "Allow a skill to keep training to the next level until it's finished level 5" to: "Allow me to import my 5 year Evemon plan" You must admit that those 6 hour skills are a pain in the behind. And you know what? I'd even settle for simply automatically continuing a skill only when the server was down. So if we're UNABLE to log in, skill training is continued. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Some Caldari Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2007.08.13 12:26:00 - [157] Edited by: Some Caldari on 13/08/2007 12:33:59 The farming argument is bull**** as it's macroed anyway and is it really that lazy if I want a que so I don't have to wake up at 4 in the morning so as not to loose training time, or leave work 2 hours early so I can get home to swap a skill? Must be according to you lot you know there are times when you can't use the computer for several hours due to sleep, work or someone else using the machine. 5 skill is too much admittedly but a auto complete or 2 skill ques isn't going to benefit the farmers much if at all but will benefit us immensely. Or am I just lazy for having obligations outside of EvE that take priority? Also with the "set a longer skill then" still leaves you with a ton of 4-6 hour skills to train afterwards and just makes the problem of not being on when the skill finishes largeer. Normal players will still play the game and enjoy it if you use the ques to not log in for 50 days well why are you still paying for it it's clear you arn't enjoying the game if you'd rather not log in for nearly two months. ------------ I'm a guy with a female character get over it, and for god's sake stop jerking off. It's creepy.
Poim Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:12:00 - [158] I don't think this is such a good idea. Kind of defeats the whole purpose of the skill system, really :\
Huggybear McCuddlekins	Posted - 2007.08.13 21:53:00 - [159] Here's my situation. I love Eve, but I am deployed very frequently to either Iraq or Afghanistan, where for obvious reasons I cannot play for months on end. A skill queue would be an absolute boon to folks in similar circumstances, who pay their fees monthly and yet cannot play as much as they might like to because of work or other commitments. I do realize that I'm in a minority of players in that specific regard, but there are a lot of people who do think queues are a good idea, and one that would enhance their experience with the game. Farming characters is, I suppose, an issue, but it isn't a large one. If you really look at it, CCP allows this to take place already, with sanctioned character sales/transfers. A queue would do nothing to speed up the process, since the training track is based on linear time and not grinding. It would take the queue the same five days to train X skill as it would for me to log in and do it manually. The only difference is that my toon gets to train consistently, instead of being active for a year and only having Frig V and Small Hybrid II for a skillset. CCP is not being cheated out of money, as the subscription fee still has to be paid, and it seems a no-brainer to me that a system of "No pay, no train" would be implemented. I've seen folks whinge about the social aspect of the game being lost if queues were implemented, and that has to be, sorry guys, the lamest, weeniest argument ever. You can't show me a loss in that regard, because in logging in, I am in no way obligated to do so much as say "Hi!" in Local. I don't have to fly a mission. I don't have to undock a boat. If all I do is log in, pick a new skill and click the train skill button and then log off, what has been lost? Not a single thing. Your experience remains completely unchanged. Perhaps there are compromises to be made, though. If, as a paying subscriber, it bothers someone to have a skill queue, then maybe the right thing to do is for the pro-queue crowd to accept a rate of time penalty in order to show respect for their fellows. That is to say, why not implement a queue system, but rig it so that any skill placed in queue trained at 75% speed? Or, perhaps nullify the effects of +X learning implants? There are probably thousands of players that such a system would benefit, from those who work long hours to those who are going on vacation with the family for a couple of weeks. There's no good reason not to implement a queue, IMO.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.13 22:51:00 - [160] Originally by: Poim I don't think this is such a good idea. Kind of defeats the whole purpose of the skill system, really :\ /disagree There is absolutley no point in having a skill-system as eve has if some players lose skill-time because they cant be ingame all the time to change short skills. FFS I really would like an official statement - even if it is bugger off there wont be a skill-queue - but then take the damn thing from the drawing board damnit... End of story is I (and many others) want an skill-queue ONE SKILL CAN BE QUEUEDI have given up about making a second account for a pure pvp-char as I just have neither the time nor the will to start a new char without a skill queue!

Katashi Ishizuka	Posted - 2007.08.14 09:54:00 - [161] So I'm training up an alt, and by god, the amount of 4-6 hour skills is driving me crazy. My alt is for occasional use, I don't want to have to log in on him for 10 minutes every 6 hours. ++ f'ing +.
Balese	Posted - 2007.08.15 04:19:00 - [162] Edited by: Balese on 15/08/2007 04:19:50 I played a trial account for this game 2 years ago. I enjoy the time I spent on it and really liked the idea of being able to skill up while offline. However, I didn't want to schedule my life around a game for skilling up. I figured a queue would be a no brainer for the enjoyment of the game for casual players (like myself) and in turn their subscribtion fees. This issue was big enough for me to decide not to extent my trial time into a pay account. That's 2 years of fees CCP lost out on. Last weekend I saw an ad for Eve and decided to convert that old trial account into an actual one, even if it was just for some entertainment value on a lazy weekend. I was surprised to find out that this simple feature still hasn't be added. My schedule is a little more flexible now than it was before, so this issue is less of an annoyance than it was several years ago, however I believe wholeheartedly that this feature should take relative priority. This thread has been going in circles for the the past two months and all of the relevant arguements have been heard. On August 31st I will vote in favor of a queue by cancelling my account for a week. I currently don't plan to leave the game because of this issue, but I do want to emphasis to CCP the importance of this issue to me (and I imagine several other players and potential players). I encourage anyone who would like see this feature implemented ASAP to do the same. A week off won't hurt you and you'll be voicing your vote in a very clear manner. Those of you happy with the status quo, don't have to do anything. Those of you who want the change but don't want to do anything about it, just don't want it badly enough (which is okay). I realize to many this seems like a silly thing to do, but equally silly is 6 pages of arguements going in circles with no definitive response from CCP about the priority of this issue in their further development of the game. In summary for those of you who skipped to point: - If you feel strongly enough about having this feature, cancel your subscription(s) for a week starting on August 31st. If you don't feel that way, carry on and enjoy the game.
Steelshine	Posted - 2007.08.15 07:40:00 - [163] I only read page 1 and 2 of this. Sorry. I'm a hardcore WoW player(let the hate begin). I did the EvE trial thing late in 06. I found the game to be really enjoyable, but at the time I just couldnt juggle two MMO's. Now, I have the time to play both, I think a one ability skill queue would not break the game. I'm a 1m SP character, I hate myself for not discovering this game earlier as I greatly enjoy it. I am not asking for an easy way to play catchup to all the veterans(though a linear increase in training up up to a certain #m skillpoint sure would make the game more accessable for new players). What I would like is that as I work towards the beginning ranks of all these low level skills, or if one is going to finish overnight, let me queue up just 1 to finish after that. However, making it so you can chain up 10 skills and just not do anything for 3 weeks is ******. I would : Add in a one-slot** queue. You can select only one skill to train after the current one, and it will start training after the current one is done. It would be nice not having to stress over what skill to leave on overnight, or if I want to get a partial, long term train started while at work that does not benefit me right away, or get a skill I can immediately use, but would waste 5 hours of train time since I cannot access my computer. I would not: Recomend anything past 1 slot queue's. This leaves too much room for abuse.
AeonOfTime Minmatar Syrkos Technologies	Posted - 2007.08.15 09:31:00 - [164] Originally by: Johraiken Fenris As there is no grind for XP/SP in Eve, and how the skill system is set up, your EUR/$ 15,- should give you 30*24hrs of skill training. I feel CCP should give you reasonable tools to fully utilise that time. That IS a good point. I also think that not being able to log in (even if you actually want to) is very commonplace and should definitely be taken into account. I am fine with the system as-is, but it would still be nice to even just put one skill in queue. -- Read the captain's log at eve.aeonoftime.com
Veryez	Posted - 2007.08.16 14:13:00 - [165] I am very much in favor of a 2 skill que. It has nothing to do with being lazy or wanting to farm characters. There is no doubt that eve has been a little unstable over the last few months. More than once I set my alarm to get up early to swap a skill, or waited until the last second to go to work to swap a skill, only to find the server was down. Even once I watched the server crash with 30 seconds left to train, and waited 2 hours or so to start my next skill. Simply put a 2 skill que will not drastically change farming in eve for better or worse, yet would be a welcome change for many players.
Ares Lightfeather Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.16 14:39:00 - [166] The only reason why I want a single skill queue is because I hate having to wait 1, 2 hours and staying awake while doing nothing significant just waiting for a skill to finish. Picture this, it must have happened already to most players out here : you start a skill, let's say 4 hours long. After 3 hours of playing, somehow all your gangmates went to bed / you finished whatever goal you wanted to do / whatever else. Now, you feel obligated to stay one more hour, because that particular 4 hour skill is lvl 1 now, and the 20 hours for the next level (making the level rise from 2 to 3) would be really useful tomorrow night, when you come back from work and finally can log in again. The solutions now are either staying one more hour in the game doing nothing significant, or switching the skill to another long skill, which sets your training for skill A one day later. It's not really that significant, but it's annoying. A one skill in queue system, would solve this. Well, it probably was said above , I just wanted to add my side of it . -- Siggie ! Come back here ! -- Originally by: Victor Valka Originally by: MotherMoon well a drone UI is a bit of an artist job Drone AI is obviously done by an artist too. One that is heavily into abstract
Propel	Posted - 2007.08.16 15:28:00 - [167] Originally by: Esu Nahalas Originally by: Elhina Novae the problem with a queue is character farming... that people set up a big queue and start farming characters for free for months. Yeah, instead of calling it a "skill training queue," you could call it "easy button for character-sellers on E-bay." Lol, whatever. If that's the case, then why is there so many accounts on ebay now? I agree with everyone else, that would make life a little bit easier on training. I would love to setup a few skills to train and just go on enjoying eve without worrying about did I train this or I forgot to do that. Some people just can't stand any kind of change what so ever.
Redflare Caldari SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.08.17 07:58:00 - [168] I want it. I don't play ALL THE TIME. I frequently take long breaks until whoever just crushed my alliance loses control of my home starbase and all hell breaks loose, allowing me to leave :). Usually 4-7 months of socializing and not playing eve :P. So, since skill ques STILL arne't available yet, I suggest everyone here train a Titan skill up to level 4 in regular time, and when its time for your break, set training to 5 and wala! The first time a skill takes longer than 7 months to finish... Hey, at least an alliance will want you now! AKITAS!!!11
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.08.17 14:45:00 - [169] I would say yes, just because of what happened today. I slept in, through my alarm, and now there's 2 hours of skill training time that could have been used towards other things. 2 hours by itself isn't a huge deal. But it's not going to happen just once, either.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.18 11:50:00 - [170] Originally by: Balese Edited by: Balese on 15/08/2007 04:19:50 I played a trial account for this game 2 years ago. I enjoy the time I spent on it and really liked the idea of being able to skill up while offline. However, I didn't want to schedule my life around a game for skilling up. I figured a queue would be a no brainer for the enjoyment of the game for casual players (like myself) and in turn their subscribtion fees. This issue was big enough for me to decide not to extent my trial time into a pay account. That's 2 years of fees CCP lost out on. Last weekend I saw an ad for Eve and decided to convert that old trial account into an actual one, even if it was just for some entertainment value on a lazy weekend. I was surprised to find out that this simple feature still hasn't be added. My schedule is a little more flexible now than it was before, so this issue is less of an annoyance than it was several years ago, however I believe wholeheartedly that this feature should take relative priority. This thread has been going in circles for the the past two months and all of the relevant arguements have been heard. On August 31st I will vote in favor of a queue by cancelling my account for a week. I currently don't plan to leave the game because of this issue, but I do want to emphasis to CCP the importance of this issue to me (and I imagine several other players and potential players). I encourage anyone who would like see this feature implemented ASAP to do the same. A week off won't hurt you and you'll be voicing your vote in a very clear manner. Those of you happy with the status quo, don't have to do anything. Those of you who want the change but don't want to do anything about it, just don't want it badly enough (which is okay). I realize to many this seems like a silly thing to do, but equally silly is 6 pages of arguements going in circles with no definitive response from CCP about the priority of this issue in their further development of the game. In summary for those of you who skipped to point: - If you feel strongly enough about having this feature, cancel your subscription(s) for a week starting on August 31st. If you don't feel that way, carry on and enjoy the game. /agree Yes and I am not making a second account until a queue is implemented. The lack of response from CCP is starting to really get on my nerves....

Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.18 12:27:00 - [171] Sure would be nice if I could right now change skills on the two of my accounts that have completed them... CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.18 12:48:00 - [172] Originally by: Malcanis Sure would be nice if I could right now change skills on the two of my accounts that have completed them... **** not even these bloody forum works now... Starting to really get sick of this.. 1-skill-queue so that we arent allyways dependant of these bloody downtimes grrrrrrr
Kucha Shangdi	Posted - 2007.08.18 14:08:00 - [173] No need for a que system, games are getting way to automated, soon we will just have to pay money and not bother playing ourselves, I think we are lucky enough to gain experince/learn a skill when we are offline as it is. It would be nice to beable to learn a skill on the other characters at the same time though, even though i guess thats kinda lazy too
Digitalfox Central Defiance	Posted - 2007.08.18 22:01:00 - [174] Ok I doubt my words will even be read since this is page 6 but here are my thoughts on the idea. 1. Yes I support this idea, a 1 to 2 skill trainning que would be very nice and very helpful 2. That this would creat Character farmers: This is about the biggest load of BS I have ever heard. It in no way encurages people to farm characters. The people who farm character are already doing just that. EVE skills are time based, allowing skill ques in no way enables faster skill learning all it does is alow someone more freedom. A person farming a character has already taken care of queing skills either via macro or by just being able to log on and change a skill when ever needed. 3. My reasones for backing this idea: I work an odd work schedual. I work 48 hours straight then have 48 hours off. Every other weekend I work 72 hours strait. I cannot log on to eve durring this time. So I am forced to lose skill time. Exsample, Caldari HACs finishes for me on thursday of this week, I work until friday morning, I am losing almost 12 hours of training becuase I cant que a skill. 4. There are no draw back to a 1 - 2 skill que, I'm sorry but all the excuses otherwise are weak and in my opinion hold no water, you wont create whats already there. Due to the uniqueness of eve's skill system this doesnt alow character farmers to make a character to sell any faster then they already do. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Central Defiance says "check out our movie" DEFY
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.19 11:30:00 - [175] Originally by: Kucha Shangdi No need for a que system, games are getting way to automated, soon we will just have to pay money and not bother playing ourselves, I think we are lucky enough to gain experince/learn a skill when we are offline as it is. It would be nice to beable to learn a skill on the other characters at the same time though, even though i guess thats kinda lazy too Why dont people understand this? The skill-system in eve (learning-offline) requires you to learn the WHOLE time WITHOUT NOT skilling a single minute !!!!!! Its built like that !!!! With a skill-system where you level you gain skills during gameplay - in eve its different(I like that system too)BUT YOU MUST ALLWAYS BE SKILLING SOMETHING IF YOU DONT WANT TO LOSE TIME !!! Whats so hard to understandf about that system - Works fine but it starts getting problematic if one loses time due to rl-issues and unscheduled downtimes. One has to earn isk to buy skills anyway BUT skilling must NEVER stop otherwise the whole system is obsolete. Thats why we need a skill-queue
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.19 20:59:00 - [176] Originally by: Kucha Shangdi No need for a que system, games are getting way to automated, soon we will just have to pay money and not bother playing ourselves, I think we are lucky enough to gain experince/learn a skill when we are offline as it is. It would be nice to beable to learn a skill on the other characters at the same time though, even though i guess thats kinda lazy too Yeah, and if we let children learn to type, then they'll all grow up into hackers and hack into NORAD and BLOW UP THE WORLD! Jeez, I want a skill queue because I LIKE playing EvE. Do you seriously think that character farmers, assuming such exist, don't macro the skill changes already? If a mining macro or a ratting macro can be written, and they certainly can, then it will be absolutely trivial to implement a skill macro. Hey, look, people still play EvE! A 1-skill queue, or letting a skill keep training until it hits level 5 (the option I favour) isn't going to destroy EvE. It isn't even going to make character farming significantly easier (a macro doesn't care if it only has to log in half as often). What it does do is help new players catch up a little quicker, and this in fact will HURT character farming. As for the "People should log in to change skills" argument... well Holmes, wouldn't it be nice if we COULD log in when skills need changing? Lately it seems like one of my accounts getting withing a few minutes of a skill change is what's causing TQ to fall over. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.19 21:01:00 - [177] Next skill is in 2D 0H 4Mins if anyone is worried when the next server failure is going to be btw. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Sazkyen	Posted - 2007.08.19 23:16:00 - [178] Guess a /SIGN can't do much hurt :D Implement it quickly pls.
Raiiden Gallente Pangalactic Aquisitions	Posted - 2007.08.20 05:04:00 - [179] haha everyone needs to stop crying. eve's skill system is almost comically easy to climb, the only "grinding" involved is the money required for books, but since its a "sandbox" environment there are any number of ways to get the loot ---------------------------------------- Trih`Xeem from TDZK
Aruv	Posted - 2007.08.20 08:59:00 - [180] well, for my part, I use my brain to decide how to train, without a skills queue system. If I know im going to be gone a long while, I switch skills to one that takes a long time and that I need to get up. If im in the game for a certain amount of time, any skills that have very little time left in the end by this method receive a skill up by the time Im done playing that session, at which point I switch back to another day+ skill. its not that hard to be intelligent about training, is it? Against any form of skill queuing.

Humwawa	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:03:00 - [181] Yes being intellegent helps if there are unscheduled downtimes or you have a full-time job and not so much time to be online.... We want a skill-queue! kthxbye
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:28:00 - [182] Fine add skill queue's but then inactive accounts should no longer be able to train at all. In saying this, there should also be a limit to a degree. I would love to set up a long queue of skills so all I do is make sure i have the skill books and account active and leave it alone for a few weeks/months. I think if one was prepared to wait they could have a semi decent alt who can do what they need at the end of the day. - :
Kryttos Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:29:00 - [183] I say, 1 skill Queue. /signed
Some Caldari Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:54:00 - [184] Yeah 1 skill que and inactivity limit if its for more then say 3 weeks? That should be long enough for holidays and such. ------------ I'm a guy with a female character get over it, and for god's sake stop jerking off. It's creepy.
Mona X Caldari C0VEN	Posted - 2007.08.20 12:31:00 - [185] Edited by: Mona X on 20/08/2007 12:31:51 Originally by: Aruv Edited by: Aruv on 20/08/2007 09:04:35 well, for my part, I use my brain to decide how to train, without a skills queue system. If I know im going to be gone a long while, I switch skills to one that takes a long time and that I need to get up. If im in the game for a certain amount of time, any skills that have very little time left in the end by this method receive a skill up by the time Im done playing that session, at which point I switch back to another day+ skill. its not that hard to be intelligent about training, is it? I think it shows that it truly does stem from laziness, since none of the skill queue bandwagon people have thought of doing it this way. its so simple to do and you waste no time. Against any form of skill queuing. Great idea mister brainiac. And how exactly you switch skills when serwers are down, because of crash or something?
Aruv	Posted - 2007.08.21 02:30:00 - [186] Originally by: Mona X Edited by: Mona X on 20/08/2007 12:31:51 Originally by: Aruv Edited by: Aruv on 20/08/2007 09:04:35 well, for my part, I use my brain to decide how to train, without a skills queue system. If I know im going to be gone a long while, I switch skills to one that takes a long time and that I need to get up. If im in the game for a certain amount of time, any skills that have very little time left in the end by this method receive a skill up by the time Im done playing that session, at which point I switch back to another day+ skill. its not that hard to be intelligent about training, is it? I think it shows that it truly does stem from laziness, since none of the skill queue bandwagon people have thought of doing it this way. its so simple to do and you waste no time. Against any form of skill queuing. Great idea mister brainiac. And how exactly you switch skills when serwers are down, because of crash or something? perhaps because I always choose one with at least one day or more left whenever I log off. I thought I made that clear, but guess you couldn't glean that little nugget from reading and logical thought process. abdication of thought on your part, or maybe you're just handicapped. this only reinforces my understanding that people want more and more things to be done for them, so they dont have to put any effort in. laziness. you're implying that skills are so important in your mind, yet you "forget" to check them on exiting? I know in this day and age its cool to be mindless, unobservant, and complain when things happen because you aren't paying attention to anything in life, but you could stand to become a little more self aware and solve this problem. Anyone consider that with even a single skill next queue, a person could still only log in once a week for one minute to queue up skills, and continue doing this until they are completely trained in all aspects, then play the game in easy mode thus removing most danger to themselves and adding danger to people that actually play and dont spend their account time mass training before ever stepping foot into the game? with ways of buying ISK and even a single skill queue, anyone who's rich enough to spend money( and believe me, if people pay 500 for a WoW account, they wont think twice about 200 for a fully trained Eve character) will do so just to avoid playing the game until they're "uber leet". Use your brains people.
Liu	Posted - 2007.08.21 05:10:00 - [187] Originally by: Aruv Edited by: Aruv on 20/08/2007 09:04:35 well, for my part, I use my brain to decide how to train, without a skills queue system. If I know im going to be gone a long while, I switch skills to one that takes a long time and that I need to get up. If im in the game for a certain amount of time, any skills that have very little time left in the end by this method receive a skill up by the time Im done playing that session, at which point I switch back to another day+ skill. its not that hard to be intelligent about training, is it? I think it shows that it truly does stem from laziness, since none of the skill queue bandwagon people have thought of doing it this way. its so simple to do and you waste no time. Against any form of skill queuing. oh look, a genius!!!! now, would you please tell us what your highness does when he has plenty of time to play, he decides to train a short skill, and the server goes puff?
dodgy242 Corpus PCG The State	Posted - 2007.08.21 09:09:00 - [188] Originally by: Liu oh look, a genius!!!! now, would you please tell us what your highness does when he has plenty of time to play, he decides to train a short skill, and the server goes puff? OMG OMG OMG!!! PANIC PANIC!!! You'd miss a hour/day of skilltraining!! The world will cease to exist, servers will crash and the sun will go down in a supernova!!!
Ares Lightfeather Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.21 15:12:00 - [189] Edited by: Ares Lightfeather on 21/08/2007 15:12:07 Originally by: dodgy242 Originally by: Liu oh look, a genius!!!! now, would you please tell us what your highness does when he has plenty of time to play, he decides to train a short skill, and the server goes puff? OMG OMG OMG!!! PANIC PANIC!!! You'd miss a hour/day of skilltraining!! The world will cease to exist, servers will crash and the sun will go down in a supernova!!! You fail this thread... People have been asking this for convenience's sake, for diverse reason, and all you find to answer that is a pathetic attempt at ridiculing the person you're speaking to. -- Siggie ! Come back here ! -- Originally by: Victor Valka Originally by: MotherMoon well a drone UI is a bit of an artist job Drone AI is obviously done by an artist too. One that is heavily into abstract
RaTTuS BIG	Posted - 2007.08.21 15:25:00 - [190] Umm, what I would like, similar to a skill queue, is that I can queue up a skill on an Alt, so - we have normal training and all it's problems, but we have the opportunity to have a backup skill going on an Alt Character -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve & RaTTuS Home

Ares Lightfeather Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.21 15:50:00 - [191] Originally by: RaTTuS Umm, what I would like, similar to a skill queue, is that I can queue up a skill on an Alt, so - we have normal training and all it's problems, but we have the opportunity to have a backup skill going on an Alt Character I believe the consensus on that one is a definite no. Because training 2 character at the same time in the same account => character selling in easy mode. Really easy mode. Too easy mode... -- Siggie ! Come back here ! -- Originally by: Victor Valka Originally by: MotherMoon well a drone UI is a bit of an artist job Drone AI is obviously done by an artist too. One that is heavily into abstract
RaTTuS BIG	Posted - 2007.08.21 15:54:00 - [192] Not at the same time, after one finishes, personally - a 1 skill queue would help in times of server illness, but I can live without it, though to have the ability to switch to training the next skill on the alt would be moderately useful [to me] -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve & RaTTuS Home
Caldain Vespers	Posted - 2007.08.21 16:14:00 - [193] Originally by: Aruv Anyone consider that with even a single skill next queue, a person could still only log in once a week for one minute to queue up skills, and continue doing this until they are completely trained in all aspects, then play the game in easy mode thus removing most danger to themselves and adding danger to people that actually play and dont spend their account time mass training before ever stepping foot into the game? with ways of buying ISK and even a single skill queue, anyone who's rich enough to spend money( and believe me, if people pay 500 for a WoW account, they wont think twice about 200 for a fully trained Eve character) will do so just to avoid playing the game until they're "uber leet". Use your brains people. Your responce does not make sense to me, I'm sure that people are doing this now. Anyone that has more that 1 account is guilty of doing this, and don't tell me that you can use 2 accounts at once. You can run 2 accounts at once but you can only use 1 account at a time. I am for a 1 skill queue, limit it so a skill can not be put into the queue until the timer runs under 24 hours that is fine. Or allow me to log into the Eve website and change skills. The skills in Eve train in real time, allow me the ability to direct my character development as my time allows.
Captian Internet	Posted - 2007.08.22 10:04:00 - [194] I support the skill queue because 4am skills suck
Digitalfox Central Defiance	Posted - 2007.08.23 00:25:00 - [195] Edited by: Digitalfox on 23/08/2007 00:26:47 Originally by: Aruv perhaps because I always choose one with at least one day or more left whenever I log off. I thought I made that clear, but guess you couldn't glean that little nugget from reading and logical thought process. abdication of thought on your part, or maybe you're just handicapped. this only reinforces my understanding that people want more and more things to be done for them, so they dont have to put any effort in. laziness. you're implying that skills are so important in your mind, yet you "forget" to check them on exiting? I know in this day and age its cool to be mindless, unobservant, and complain when things happen because you aren't paying attention to anything in life, but you could stand to become a little more self aware and solve this problem. Anyone consider that with even a single skill next queue, a person could still only log in once a week for one minute to queue up skills, and continue doing this until they are completely trained in all aspects, then play the game in easy mode thus removing most danger to themselves and adding danger to people that actually play and dont spend their account time mass training before ever stepping foot into the game? with ways of buying ISK and even a single skill queue, anyone who's rich enough to spend money( and believe me, if people pay 500 for a WoW account, they wont think twice about 200 for a fully trained Eve character) will do so just to avoid playing the game until they're "uber leet". Use your brains people. Ok, I'm sorry but this is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. They type of people WHO ALREADY farm acounts do this with or without a que. Eve skills are time baised. It does not matter if they que one, macro one or just log on once an hour to to change skills. Due to the fact that it is a time based system a que will not effect how quickly a character farmer can farm a character. Thats even beside the point of fact that they probably already have a macro set up to que it anyway. All this does is make life a little bit easier for the rest of us. Particulary those of us with jobs that run in 24, 48 or 72 hour shifts. And if a person who is paying for an account is already just loggin on to swich a skill and then logging off how does it matter if they have to do it once a day or once a week? All the same if you dont play your character, chances are good your gonna suck when you do start playing it, 50000sp or 50 million sp. Your right a skill que is born out of lazyness. I will freely admit that I dont feel like sitting down with a calander and a calculater and figuring our if my 35 day skill is gonna end on while I'm at work, asleep, at lunch or just playing eve. This simply alows me a little bit of freedom with my gameplay and real life job. I dont truely see how a 1 skill que would break the game or creat farmers that already exsist -------------------------------------------------------------------- Central Defiance says "check out our movie" DEFY
Deago Ridley	Posted - 2007.08.23 12:19:00 - [196] I dont know why everyone is making a big deal about character farming, no matter what, they're still gonna do it. Doesnt matter how hard or easy you make it for them. If I was a farmer and my job was just logging on to change skills, waking up at 3am isnt a big deal since thats paying the bills. Simply put, que or no que, they're basically queing it. I know some people are saying it should be in the responsibility of the player, but eveyones life is different and some ppl r still thinking "well I can do it, why can't they" For instance I'm in the Navy, I could recieve a phone call at any time cuz im needed... Trust me the last thing im thinking is "OH snap, better hop on and change that skill, no telling when im back..." After reading all the arguements, Id have to agree on just having the current skill just continuing to the next level. That way you can switch them at your convience with very little time lost. Only way someone could mess that up is forgetting when your lvl 5 ends to start another. Character farms will still be doing the same thing, they just might get an extra hour of sleep every night
Mona X Caldari C0VEN	Posted - 2007.08.23 13:48:00 - [197] Originally by: Aruv perhaps because I always choose one with at least one day or more left whenever I log off. I thought I made that clear, but guess you couldn't glean that little nugget from reading and logical thought process. abdication of thought on your part, or maybe you're just handicapped. this only reinforces my understanding that people want more and more things to be done for them, so they dont have to put any effort in. laziness. you're implying that skills are so important in your mind, yet you "forget" to check them on exiting? Are you ******? I'm asking how you change skills when serwers are down, not beacous it's daily downtime, or patch day, but when serwers are broken and "Known Issues & Workarounds" is flooded with "WTF?" or there was accident in ISP or great asteroid crushed in Iceland. How you deal with unexpected, huh? Originally by:** Aruv I know in this day and age its cool to be mindless, unobservant, 'From personal expexperience', you should add.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.08.27 17:09:00 - [198] What really sucks is if you are "micromanaging" your skills - eg having one run to lets say 10 min before you must leave your house and will not have computer access for 24h and discover JUST when you want to change to a long skill that the damn servers have crashed and you have NO TIME to wait for an hour that perhapsthe server will be online again... With a ONEskill-queue you could set a long one after the current short one and not have the hassle.... WTH would be sooo bad about that?
Malcanis High4Life	Posted - 2007.08.27 17:33:00 - [199] Originally by: Aruv Originally by: Mona X Edited by: Mona X on 20/08/2007 12:31:51 Originally by: Aruv Edited by: Aruv on 20/08/2007 09:04:35 well, for my part, I use my brain to decide how to train, without a skills queue system. If I know im going to be gone a long while, I switch skills to one that takes a long time and that I need to get up. If im in the game for a certain amount of time, any skills that have very little time left in the end by this method receive a skill up by the time Im done playing that session, at which point I switch back to another day+ skill. its not that hard to be intelligent about training, is it? I think it shows that it truly does stem from laziness, since none of the skill queue bandwagon people have thought of doing it this way. its so simple to do and you waste no time. Against any form of skill queuing. Great idea mister brainiac. And how exactly you switch skills when serwers are down, because of crash or something? perhaps because I always choose one with at least one day or more left whenever I log off. I thought I made that clear, but guess you couldn't glean that little nugget from reading and logical thought process. abdication of thought on your part, or maybe you're just handicapped. this only reinforces my understanding that people want more and more things to be done for them, so they dont have to put any effort in. laziness. you're implying that skills are so important in your mind, yet you "forget" to check them on exiting? I know in this day and age its cool to be mindless, unobservant, and complain when things happen because you aren't paying attention to anything in life, but you could stand to become a little more self aware and solve this problem. Anyone consider that with even a single skill next queue, a person could still only log in once a week for one minute to queue up skills, and continue doing this until they are completely trained in all aspects, then play the game in easy mode thus removing most danger to themselves and adding danger to people that actually play and dont spend their account time mass training before ever stepping foot into the game? with ways of buying ISK and even a single skill queue, anyone who's rich enough to spend money( and believe me, if people pay 500 for a WoW account, they wont think twice about 200 for a fully trained Eve character) will do so just to avoid playing the game until they're "uber leet". Use your brains people. For the love of God, not this stupid argument again. A ONE SKILL/SKILL-COMPLETION QUEUE WILL NOT HELP CHARACTER FARMERS I don't know how to make this any clearer. It might trivially reduce the time it takes to get a character to 20M SP (or whatever your definition of uberpwnl33tsk11lz0r is). Say 1 or 2%? People who play EvE as a job generally have all the log in time they want, and almost certainly more than one person will have access to a RMT-earning account in any case. But show me that evidence that character farming is a problem, or even that it occurs at all in any systematic way. As far as I can tell the economics of it are horrible, since characters sell for very little above the cost of creating the account and paying the subscription. Say that 20M SP character sells for the $200 you quote. 20M SP takes about 15 months. 15 x $15 = $225, that you don't see until 15 months after you've started the project. o0 Profit! Momma, we's gonna eat tonight! And don't forget you have to spend the ISK on implants and skillbooks too. It's a pretty poor way to turn $ in to ISK too. Leaving aside the option of just RMTing yourself some ISK, GTCs get a better return, instantly and with almost no effort. I sometimes wonder why ISK farmers don't sell their characters, but I guess who the hell wants a toon called asdfgh99 who's been in beatlrice for 18 months? Actually, they probably do sell them - just to each other rather than to the "real" player community. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Obeo	Posted - 2007.08.27 19:36:00 - [200] With the current system without a skill queue a properly written macro would allow 50 - 100 characters to be farmed on a single machine. Machines are cheap. A macroer that wanted to farm more characters would just add hardware. What limits character farming operations is not going to be the ease of skilling the characters but the up front investment $140 per character per year and the effort needed to sell the resulting characters. I dont see how adding a skill queue is going to change things much.

Humwawa	Posted - 2007.08.31 16:41:00 - [201] Originally by: Obeo With the current system without a skill queue a properly written macro would allow 50 - 100 characters to be farmed on a single machine. Machines are cheap. A macroer that wanted to farm more characters would just add hardware. What limits character farming operations is not going to be the ease of skilling the characters but the up front investment $140 per character per year and the effort needed to sell the resulting characters. I dont see how adding a skill queue is going to change things much. Yep thats exactly the point - Even without a skill-queue the char farmers will do it - With a skill-queue they will do it ASWELL. Adding a skillqueue will be a GREAT improvement for normal players. Not adding a skillqueue will not hurt the charfarmers but will be BAD for normal players.
Silvaticien Blue Sun Industries	Posted - 2007.09.01 11:53:00 - [202] I've been a long time supporter of a skill queue, I don't think any of the arguments against one hold up. Queuing for me would not be because I'm lazy or because I want to do nothing and have a saleable character after a few months. I (and many others I know) get sent away for 4-6 months at a time to places with no access to the game. I can (as now) access the website and I can tell you, there's little more annoying than reading the line 'Skill training complete' on the character information screen, knowing that I have 11 more weeks until I can set a new one. I am also still paying the subscription during this time too. For me a skill queue is not the only option, if I could change the skill via the website I would be just as happy. Or maybe an exception to the EULA rules to allow one nominated person to access my accounts to change skills for me - even if I have to have my characters flagged in some way to CCP or something to allow it? I know I am not the only Eve player in my line of work, there are a large number of us. Please CCP, do something with this!
Conniving Connivier Amarr Dirt Nap Squad FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.01 17:23:00 - [203] I think skill queue of ONE skill should be great. Basically you set skill in training, and skill that will take over once its done (usually some obsene lvl5). This way you cant character farm, but not gonna lose SP when you get held up for some time.
Soong Hay Caldari	Posted - 2007.09.07 21:21:00 - [204] Edited by: Soong Hay on 07/09/2007 21:21:28 I vote for a 1 skill queue too. Otherwise, I thought about a system (don't know if somebody has offered the idea already). It would be to double the speed of the skill learning for the amount of time of your inactivity. In other words, to try to make it clear (ESL spotted here :p): After the completion of my skill, I'm at work / on weekend / at an improvised diner at some friends house, whatever, make your choice. I can't switch to an other skill for 5 hours. Well next time I log on and launch a skill, during 5 hours the speed skill training would be doubled. Hope it's understandable :p You can limit this to 24hours if you are afraid of the character farmers, but it would be just like a buffer for all the impromptu things of an everyday life.
Falkus Windowmaker	Posted - 2007.09.08 03:25:00 - [205] Edited by: Falkus Windowmaker on 08/09/2007 03:28:03 Character farmers already have macro programs of their own design to help them out so adding a in game queue will do nothing to benefit them at all !!! Adding a skill queue system would only benefit people who don't cheat ( unlike farmers ) and don't have time to wake up early in the morning or stay up late at night because they have freaking jobs and lives to attend to when they are not playing. This is a no brainier folks !
Mirarj	Posted - 2007.09.08 07:32:00 - [206] Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:58 Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:29 .... ...... my god. i cant believe the number of spastic ******s that are on these forums. EVE skill training guide v1.0 1) look at eta of current skill. if eta < time til next logon, change to skill with eta > time til next logon. 2) THERE IS NO STEP 2!! is it that hard? i mean srsly. this is what makes eve eve. this is what makes it unique. casual players use eve as a casual game. meaning they arent going to notice extra 3% dmg bomus from medium projectile spec IV not finishing because instead they chose a skill to keep them going overnight. a hardcore player is willing to sacrifice 5 MINUTES MAXIMUM to log, change the skill, and quit again, in the middle of the night. if they even care. personally i think hardcore players will just be like 'meh' anyway and throw a few hours into a rankV overnight. if you can only log in for 2 hours every 50 days or wtf is going on, find a different game and stop trying to screw over mine. it shoudl become a habit of before going to bed, or leaving your pc, check evemon for the skill completion eta. its not hard. just move your mouse down to the bottom right corners, find the icon in the system tray, and leave it there for 2 seconds. YOU DONT EVEN HAVE TO CLICK!! ITS EASY AS THAT! and ffs if you dont have evemon yet, get it. http://evemon.battleclinic.com/
Soong Hay Caldari	Posted - 2007.09.08 17:57:00 - [207] Originally by: Mirarj Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:58 Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:29 it shoudl become a habit of before going to bed, or leaving your pc, check evemon for the skill completion eta. its not hard. just move your mouse down to the bottom right corners, find the icon in the system tray, and leave it there for 2 seconds. YOU DONT EVEN HAVE TO CLICK!! ITS EASY AS THAT! Well, it's just that some people love EvE, but have also other interest and hobbies in life...
V0idz Herrscher der Zeit	Posted - 2007.09.08 20:56:00 - [208] /not signed _____________________________________ EVE is like the "Fisherman's Friend" of MMOs. If it's too hard, you are too weak.
Great Artista Caldari Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.09.09 00:01:00 - [209] Totally wanted. _______ ◕◡◕ Space perverts and forum warriors united. [PERVS] My opinions rather rarely represent my corp, not to mention my alliance hihihi...
Pinkeh Girl	Posted - 2007.09.09 00:23:00 - [210] Originally by: Great Artista Totally wanted. agreed but isnt this like thread 15848525216556625551633222 about this issue/request ?

Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.09.11 09:14:00 - [211] No this is THE thread .)
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.09.11 09:15:00 - [212] Originally by: Soong Hay Originally by: Mirarj Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:58 Edited by: Mirarj on 08/09/2007 07:32:29 it shoudl become a habit of before going to bed, or leaving your pc, check evemon for the skill completion eta. its not hard. just move your mouse down to the bottom right corners, find the icon in the system tray, and leave it there for 2 seconds. YOU DONT EVEN HAVE TO CLICK!! ITS EASY AS THAT! Well, it's just that some people love EvE, but have also other interest and hobbies in life... Exactly - Not all Eve-Players are teenagers who can loggin all day...
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.09.11 22:18:00 - [213] This is REALLY great... Skills runs out in 35 min the ***** servers are down..again and i cant change skills again for about 24 hours - grrrrrrrrr Tell me how to micromanage that FFS With a 1+ skillqueue all this ** wouldnt matter damnit
Anton Bairloch Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.11 22:40:00 - [214] wow, why is this thread 8 pages long? hell, the devs said back in Beta that this would never, ever happen. they want people to play the game, not just set up a queue of skills. the very nature of the system means you could never have a queue, ever. it breaks everything. so let it go already. ___________________________________________ I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.
Vasponger Advanced Space Technologies Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.11 22:51:00 - [215] im sure they also thought the game would never continuously crash
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.09.11 22:52:00 - [216] WHY FFS is it on the ***** drawing board then AND NOT implementing the *** skill 1+ queue is *** stupid. My gtc runs out in a few months - if there isnt EITHER a skill-queue OR a possibility to change ***** skills over web-interface whatever I will not renew the gtc.Period
Ravenal The Fated Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.12 11:59:00 - [217] long thread, will support the following idea if its already posted. If it hasnt been posted its then an addition to the thread. Enable queuing skills up to 24 hours from current time. What this does is allow noobs to train those short skills over night and the next day till the time they can log back into eve (sleep + work = 16 hourish + 8 hours slack). so if you have a skill training that has 19hours to go you can add a skill to training that takes 5 hours. No way ever never should there be allowed to train x amount of skills after each other, like all racial battleship skills lvl5 or something. 24h limit from current time would be comfortable, I find that I often have several skills trained to 95 - 99% of skills trained because ill not be online to see it finish. thats just me. .
Veryez	Posted - 2007.09.12 13:23:00 - [218] Originally by: Ravenal Enable queuing skills up to 24 hours from current time. What this does is allow noobs to train those short skills over night and the next day till the time they can log back into eve (sleep + work = 16 hourish + 8 hours slack). Ah, if only that were true. However some of us work 12 hour shifts, so more accurately; (Sleep + work + Commuting time = 7 + 12 + 2 = 3 hours eve time). Which most of the time is fine. I just ensure that my skill won't end during the time I won't be able to log in. The problem occurs when the server is down (unplanned) during that time and I lose 14 hours or so of training time. That is why a 1 skill que would be a very welcome addition.
Daak Archidamos Caldari Galactic Defence Consortium	Posted - 2007.09.12 17:32:00 - [219] Edited by: Daak Archidamos on 12/09/2007 17:33:25 Originally by: Veryez Ah, if only that were true. However some of us work 12 hour shifts, so more accurately; (Sleep + work + Commuting time = 7 + 12 + 2 = 3 hours eve time). Which most of the time is fine. I just ensure that my skill won't end during the time I won't be able to log in. The problem occurs when the server is down (unplanned) during that time and I lose 14 hours or so of training time. That is why a 1 skill que would be a very welcome addition. Hear ye, Hear ye!!! - - - Why bother, you gonna die anyway
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.09.15 13:20:00 - [220] Great losing skilltime again due to servercrash.....

Angmar Da'Kirith	Posted - 2007.09.15 21:01:00 - [221] Originally by: Anton Bairloch wow, why is this thread 8 pages long? hell, the devs said back in Beta that this would never, ever happen. they want people to play the game, not just set up a queue of skills. the very nature of the system means you could never have a queue, ever. it breaks everything. so let it go already. Absolutly not, I really don't understand this CCP idea. If I have the time to play so I play, if I have the time just for change a skill training I log, change and log off so where is the point or "the magic" that makes me log for change skill and start playing EVE if I haven't time in that moment? I pay a monthly fee and if I want to just change skill and never play, never speak to anyone, never interact is my business, I don't think the skill queue will reduce the MMORPG-side of eve, instead it will reduce the pain due to server crash or RL unpredictable things
Korosoka	Posted - 2007.09.16 10:58:00 - [222] Most of us are not asking for something where you can program a skill tree for weeks. All I want is the ability to queue ONE (1) skill.
Atius Tirawa Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.17 06:20:00 - [223] EvE used to be harder, before all this EvE-Mon and **** people paid attention to their character skill training. Now I think EvE-Mon has helped the community in many ways, and for those of you who cannot remember your skill training times and such should get that - it will chime you when you need to change a skill, text your cell phone, and basically tell you when to log on. If that is not enough, I'd say you should stop playing. I mean seriously, skill training queues will change the skill training system in a fundamental way, and the last time EvE did that (introducing 'learning skills') they realized too late that they set newer players up for a horrendusly long pre-skill training period (2 months). So - I have always said no to skill queues because its simply for the lazy, the farmer or those who are not playing the game. . .all three are not good reasons.
Lilly Boyter Amarr Scorpio Whirlwind Cluster	Posted - 2007.09.17 08:11:00 - [224] Originally by: Atius Tirawa last time EvE did that (introducing 'learning skills') they realized too late that they set newer players up for a horrendusly long pre-skill training period (2 months). So - I have always said no to skill queues because its simply for the lazy, the farmer or those who are not playing the game. . .all three are not good reasons. I have to disagree with this, yes new players have a little more to train then again if people would not have those 5 extra attribute points training for a titan would be near imposible. CCP had to introduce the learning skills as not doing so would have made the older players stop. CCP keep telling us how hard it is to balance between old and new players without upsetting one of them. Newer players would love to see a training queue because they are training so many short skills, yet older players would be able not to log for months without loosing a second of training time which is exactly what CCP doesn't want. Giving new players only a skill queue to say 6M SP (learning skills done) would help them but it would also help our farmer friends. In the end I think it would be wise for CCP to leave things as is, introducing more learnig skills would make new players not even want to start anymore. Introducing a skill queue would make new players want to buy a character instead of waiting for a few months to be able to really join in (I know even without the learning skills trained one can join in but then again that is hard to explain to a level 70 War Elf (or what ever WoW characters are called) ) A dual training which even has been mentioned by CCP as a posible option might do the trick. Setting one long skill to train that will only train when your normal skill completes, this would mean you can set racial battleship level 5 as your long skill and electronics level 2 as your short skill and when you cannot login you will automaticaly train the BS skill after the electronics it done, posibly CCP could limit the short skill to only the first 2 or 3 levels so as to prevent people from training Capital ships and then Titan to level 5 in a row (well over 3 months for me ) Other then that I think CCP is doing a great job not letting us have a training queue.
Humwawa	Posted - 2007.09.17 09:32:00 - [225] Believe it or not there are people who havent allways got access to Eve. Either one should be able to change skill via webinterface OR a skillqueue ONE SKILL+ Thankyou
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.10.12 13:16:00 - [226] If atleast it were possible to change skills from your web-login sigh
RaTTuS BIG Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.10.12 13:33:00 - [227] If the db is down then changing via the web wont work - becase the Db is down .. -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve [Now Verified] & RaTTuS Home
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.10.12 13:40:00 - [228] Which takes us back to a ONEskill - queue....
Atius Tirawa Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.10.13 15:20:00 - [229] No skill queue. Its fundamental to the game that you learn to manage your skills, and losing a few hours here or there is a normal thing. Its not the end of the world. There are so many skill tools now that allow players to be text messaged, to be e-mailed, and to have their computers chimed when they are nearing a skill completion. It has gotten so basic, that I know people who just log in to change skills, and have been doing this for many months. There is not labor for skill economy in eve, the timer runs while you are offline - so - let us be glad that its not a timer that turn off when you log off.
Belmarduk	Posted - 2007.10.13 18:02:00 - [230] No The system works the way it is a must to skill ALL the time to stay competitve. What about people who cannot access eve for longer periods???? How the **** should they manage skills then? a skill-queue "ONE skill" is a feature that is missing. Period

royal killer Amarr The Funkalistic SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.13 23:53:00 - [231] This would be way too crasy for CCP to do, if it would be to at least be able to set 1 skill after the one ur currently training finishes, that would be awesome alrdy... --------------------
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2007.10.15 21:03:00 - [232] This thread is like a boomerang, everytime you think it is out of sight and you're done looking for it; it hits you on the back of your head. But I hope hell freezes over before this enters the game. ----------------------------------------------- Originally by: Paper Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.15 21:28:00 - [233] Originally by: Belmarduk What about people who cannot access eve for longer periods???? Then they set a skill that takes a long time to train if they know or think they will not be able to access Eve. I'm a relatively new player already, and I already have several skills that would take at least a couple weeks to train, probably even some that would take a month if I looked. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
Dubious Drewski	Posted - 2007.10.16 22:20:00 - [234] 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. Originally by: Slayton Ford a Drake is normally primaried last And that's why I love that homely boat!
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.17 13:31:00 - [235] Originally by: Dubious Drewski 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. If you're losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, you aren't scheduling them correctly. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
Marylin Monroe	Posted - 2007.10.17 16:31:00 - [236] Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Dubious Drewski 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. If you're losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, you aren't scheduling them correctly. get lost. accidental server downtimes are quite un-schedulable
Ann Caldera	Posted - 2007.10.17 16:35:00 - [237] Edited by: Ann Caldera on 17/10/2007 16:36:06 Originally by: Vicky Steel Edited by: Vicky Steel on 05/06/2007 03:36:42 Am I the only one tired of loging in just to discover i forgot to set a new skill for traing? I wich there was a queue system for skills to be trained, so u could set 5 skills and sleep good at night or if your computer brakes and are gone for a week u still know it,s ok since the last skills is a long one that you dont need right now. Or atlest that the skill u was training just contineu with the next level on the same skill would be a relife. /Vicky S Ah I c the problem, but if they set a queue of 2 and only 1 skill can be lev 5 that should limit farmers but yet give serius players what we want and maby rice the payment for 1 mounth so it would not be ekonomical to farmers, could this work? /Vicky S What a terrible idea. Forget about character farming, are you seriously telling us that it's too much trouble to log in every 7 or 8 days to queue up an additional skill? If you've gone that long without logging in then I've little sympathy for you, and if you do log in and still cannot anticipate a skill training finishing, (and queuing up something else to time the end of your skilltraining so that you're around for them,) then I have little sympathy for you. On the other hand, perhaps you're just aggravated at losing out on an hour or two of skills. Oops. I still have little sympathy for you. It was a measly 120 minutes! A skill queue would let people "play" the game without logging in for months on end. I don't care if they're paying or not, that's still a bad outcome. I mean, I've played a half dozen MMORPG's, and none of them require less from their players than EVE does: You can start a skill that takes 6 weeks to train, walk away for 41 of those 42 days, and the very next day you're all trained up. And that still doesn't satisfy?
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.17 17:39:00 - [238] Originally by: Marylin Monroe Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Dubious Drewski 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. If you're losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, you aren't scheduling them correctly. get lost. accidental server downtimes are quite un-schedulable The person I quoted said nothing about accidental server downtimes. (You his alt, maybe?) If that is the thing that causes you to lose skill training, and not your own inability to set skills of appropriate length, CCP needs not set a one skill queue, which would only be abused so that people switch skills half as often, but programmatically just continue training the next level of whatever skill you were working on. No lost Skill training time due to server crashes, no abuse of the system. Maybe it's not the skill you wanted to train at just this exact moment, but you can keep your precious skill points. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
Marylin Monroe	Posted - 2007.10.17 18:02:00 - [239] Edited by: Marylin Monroe on 17/10/2007 18:03:09 Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Marylin Monroe Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Dubious Drewski 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. If you're losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, you aren't scheduling them correctly. get lost. accidental server downtimes are quite un-schedulable The person I quoted said nothing about accidental server downtimes. (You his alt, maybe?) If that is the thing that causes you to lose skill training, and not your own inability to set skills of appropriate length, CCP needs not set a one skill queue, which would only be abused so that people switch skills half as often, but programmatically just continue training the next level of whatever skill you were working on. No lost Skill training time due to server crashes, no abuse of the system. Maybe it's not the skill you wanted to train at just this exact moment, but you can keep your precious skill points. no i am not his alt. but i am tired of people like you that do not bother to read the whole thread and just comes in and leaves a useless post that later has to be complemented when someone unfolds it as the real foolness it is. if you had bothered to read anything but the last page you would have seen that we have been talking about something that prevents us from loosing training time WHEN THINGS GO WRONG SERVER SIDE. we are all perfectly capable of scheduling and timing our skills so that we do not loose any time at all as long as the hamster do not decide to make a riot and stop working. also, if you had bothered to read the thread you would have seen how we really do not care if it is just that the skill keeps on training the next level or if we have a 1-skill-queue, as long as we can have inmunity to hamsters behaviour. but instead of reading you went for flaming. too bad.
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.17 19:06:00 - [240] Originally by: Marylin Monroe Edited by: Marylin Monroe on 17/10/2007 18:03:09 Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Marylin Monroe Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Dubious Drewski 1 queue system /totally signed Some people apparently don't mind losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, but I do. Just for peace of mind, it would be a welcome feature. If you're losing an "hour/day" of skill training time, you aren't scheduling them correctly. get lost. accidental server downtimes are quite un-schedulable The person I quoted said nothing about accidental server downtimes. (You his alt, maybe?) If that is the thing that causes you to lose skill training, and not your own inability to set skills of appropriate length, CCP needs not set a one skill queue, which would only be abused so that people switch skills half as often, but programmatically just continue training the next level of whatever skill you were working on. No lost Skill training time due to server crashes, no abuse of the system. Maybe it's not the skill you wanted to train at just this exact moment, but you can keep your precious skill points. no i am not his alt. but i am tired of people like you that do not bother to read the whole thread and just comes in and leaves a useless post that later has to be complemented when someone unfolds it as the real foolness it is. if you had bothered to read anything but the last page you would have seen that we have been talking about something that prevents us from loosing training time WHEN THINGS GO WRONG SERVER SIDE. we are all perfectly capable of scheduling and timing our skills so that we do not loose any time at all as long as the hamster do not decide to make a riot and stop working. also, if you had bothered to read the thread you would have seen how we really do not care if it is just that the skill keeps on training the next level or if we have a 1-skill-queue, as long as we can have inmunity to hamsters behaviour. but instead of reading you went for flaming. too bad. Well, excuse me. Apparently I put too much stock in the first two pages of the thread. Or comments like this or this or this. So excuse me if the post that came just after mine (which was a response to someone who wanted the skill queue to simplify his own life so he wouldn't have to think about when he would be able to log in to change skills) was about unexpected server crashes as opposed to the lazy loggers that was most recently being discussed. But instead of reading you went to flaming. Too bad. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108

Hashi Lebwohl Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.10.17 20:50:00 - [241] Originally by: Ravenal long thread, will support the following idea if its already posted. If it hasnt been posted its then an addition to the thread. Enable queuing skills up to 24 hours from current time. What this does is allow noobs to train those short skills over night and the next day till the time they can log back into eve (sleep + work = 16 hourish + 8 hours slack). so if you have a skill training that has 19hours to go you can add a skill to training that takes 5 hours. No way ever never should there be allowed to train x amount of skills after each other, like all racial battleship skills lvl5 or something. 24h limit from current time would be comfortable, I find that I often have several skills trained to 95 - 99% of skills trained because ill not be online to see it finish. thats just me. I like this idea but I would modify it slightly. I would have two queues. The first would be what we have now and would be the default. You would then be able to have a second queue with a 24hr timer. Into this queue you could stake skills to be trained (perhaps stealing the evemon interface). You would have to click a button to set the skills off and it would last 24 hrs at which time the queue would be cleared and the default skill commence training. The advantage of this is that you can stake all those 3-4 hour or less skills into the 24 hr timer and have a long skill in the default.
Reygrimm	Posted - 2007.10.20 04:50:00 - [242] Since in the General Discussion boards regarding the most recent unexpected downtime occurance people are bringing up wanting a skill queue, I figured I'd give this a nice ole "Bump" since we all know this is the real thread on the topic :) So here's my vote for a skill queue of "1" Reygrimm
Risokja	Posted - 2007.10.20 13:30:00 - [243] +1 for the 1 spot skill queue
Bohrier	Posted - 2007.10.20 13:31:00 - [244] I like the 1 spot queue. The 24h stack is nice too, but maybe abit too much. 1 skill in queue or continue the current skill (you choose when you queue) is thebest option for me.
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.20 13:39:00 - [245] Well, how about this, so it wouldn't get abused. (People would just skill change half as often and still complain when there's unexpected down time, because their second skill on the 1 skill queue was finishing up during the unexpected downtime.) There is a skill queue of one or two or hey, maybe 20 skills. However, you must log in as normal to change skills. This skill queue only gets initiated if the server is in down time when your current skill finishes. When the server is out of down time, normal skill changing would renew. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
Irebura Aliastra	Posted - 2007.10.22 06:50:00 - [246] Originally by: Dretzle Omega Well, how about this, so it wouldn't get abused. (People would just skill change half as often and still complain when there's unexpected down time, because their second skill on the 1 skill queue was finishing up during the unexpected downtime.) There is a skill queue of one or two or hey, maybe 20 skills. However, you must log in as normal to change skills. This skill queue only gets initiated if the server is in down time when your current skill finishes. When the server is out of down time, normal skill changing would renew. i think that is useless, cause what if you want to change the skill before going to sleep, but the server is offline? if you go to sleep and the server goes live before your current skill finishes, then the queue wouldnt start and you would loose training time. also, sometimes, even though the server is online, characters are stuck or desynch for a long time, and if you are in a hurry and need to go somewhere, you may not be able to change the skill and thus loose a lot of training time.
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:11:00 - [247] Originally by: Irebura Originally by: Dretzle Omega Well, how about this, so it wouldn't get abused. (People would just skill change half as often and still complain when there's unexpected down time, because their second skill on the 1 skill queue was finishing up during the unexpected downtime.) There is a skill queue of one or two or hey, maybe 20 skills. However, you must log in as normal to change skills. This skill queue only gets initiated if the server is in down time when your current skill finishes. When the server is out of down time, normal skill changing would renew. i think that is useless, cause what if you want to change the skill before going to sleep, but the server is offline? if you go to sleep and the server goes live before your current skill finishes, then the queue wouldnt start and you would loose training time. also, sometimes, even though the server is online, characters are stuck or desynch for a long time, and if you are in a hurry and need to go somewhere, you may not be able to change the skill and thus loose a lot of training time. Very easy to fix. Just make it so when there's unexpected down time the queue initiates for the following 24 hours, unless you log in to change skills after down time. People might still complain, "but it went into unexpected down time just as I was leaving for a two week trip". Well, it's better than nothing, and at least it wouldn't get abused. If you have a skill queue of 1 to handle unexpected down times, you can bet people will be abusing that, logging in to change skills half the time, then unexpected down time hits when the skill in their queue is about to finish. Now they complain again, because their losing SP training time. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108
RaTTuS BIG Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:19:00 - [248] make the leaning skill allow you to assign a Rank 1-5 Skill that will be trained as a default when the current one runs out. -- BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve [Now Verified] & RaTTuS Home
Irebura Aliastra	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:24:00 - [249] Originally by: Dretzle Omega Originally by: Irebura Originally by: Dretzle Omega Well, how about this, so it wouldn't get abused. (People would just skill change half as often and still complain when there's unexpected down time, because their second skill on the 1 skill queue was finishing up during the unexpected downtime.) There is a skill queue of one or two or hey, maybe 20 skills. However, you must log in as normal to change skills. This skill queue only gets initiated if the server is in down time when your current skill finishes. When the server is out of down time, normal skill changing would renew. i think that is useless, cause what if you want to change the skill before going to sleep, but the server is offline? if you go to sleep and the server goes live before your current skill finishes, then the queue wouldnt start and you would loose training time. also, sometimes, even though the server is online, characters are stuck or desynch for a long time, and if you are in a hurry and need to go somewhere, you may not be able to change the skill and thus loose a lot of training time. Very easy to fix. Just make it so when there's unexpected down time the queue initiates for the following 24 hours, unless you log in to change skills after down time. People might still complain, "but it went into unexpected down time just as I was leaving for a two week trip". Well, it's better than nothing, and at least it wouldn't get abused. If you have a skill queue of 1 to handle unexpected down times, you can bet people will be abusing that, logging in to change skills half the time, then unexpected down time hits when the skill in their queue is about to finish. Now they complain again, because their losing SP training time. no, they wont, becuase they will have lost their chance to use the queue to deal with the downtime. right now, unless you arent interested on finishing any skill and decide to change when there is more than 10 hours to finish, you are completely vulnerable to unexpected downtimes. with 1 queue skill, if anybody loses training time on any downtime shorter than 1 day, he is a complete idiot. also, what you propose is much more difficult to code and manage than a single queue. and what if people use it to log in half the time? how is that bad? the server already cant handle more afkers on jita, so it should only be a good thing. or do you mean that it is good to force people into logging? shouldnt the game be so awesome that everybody should want to be playing all day? changing skills shouldnt have become a real life constraint.
Dretzle Omega Caldari Psychedelic Party Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.22 15:29:00 - [250] Originally by: Irebura no, they wont, becuase they will have lost their chance to use the queue to deal with the downtime. People complain about anything, valid or not. I think they would, even if the complaint would be less valid than it is right now. Originally by: Irebura right now, unless you arent interested on finishing any skill and decide to change when there is more than 10 hours to finish, you are completely vulnerable to unexpected downtimes. with 1 queue skill, if anybody loses training time on any downtime shorter than 1 day, he is a complete idiot. True. Does not stop said complaining or people who would use it to log in half the time. Originally by: Irebura also, what you propose is much more difficult to code and manage than a single queue. and what if people use it to log in half the time? how is that bad? the server already cant handle more afkers on jita, so it should only be a good thing. or do you mean that it is good to force people into logging? shouldnt the game be so awesome that everybody should want to be playing all day? changing skills shouldnt have become a real life constraint. Personally, I would love to have a skill training queue that I could set out to several days. Would make the number of times I have to say to my wife "sorry, just got to go change skills" a lot less. However, I believe I've read that CCP wants people to have to log in to change skills. Don't ask me for the quote (maybe in this thread even?). I imagine it's because it keeps people coming back to Eve. They log in to change skills, end up chatting with corp mates for a little bit, okay, I'll come out for this short op... and what do you know, they're playing. <shrug> So it is in trying to keep with that goal that I've been making my statements. Because if we come up with an idea that still keeps with CCP's goal (if it really is to make people have to log in to switch skills) and yet helps allieviate our frustrations at unexpected down time, then the idea is more likely to be accepted and implemented by CCP. ------------------- 4 8 15 16 23 42 108

Irebura Aliastra	Posted - 2007.10.22 15:41:00 - [251] Originally by: Dretzle Omega Personally, I would love to have a skill training queue that I could set out to several days. Would make the number of times I have to say to my wife "sorry, just got to go change skills" a lot less. However, I believe I've read that CCP wants people to have to log in to change skills. Don't ask me for the quote (maybe in this thread even?). I imagine it's because it keeps people coming back to Eve. They log in to change skills, end up chatting with corp mates for a little bit, okay, I'll come out for this short op... and what do you know, they're playing. <shrug> So it is in trying to keep with that goal that I've been making my statements. Because if we come up with an idea that still keeps with CCP's goal (if it really is to make people have to log in to switch skills) and yet helps allieviate our frustrations at unexpected down time, then the idea is more likely to be accepted and implemented by CCP. i even have bookmarked quotes of devs saying there wont EVER EVER NEVER TIL THE END OF TIME a skill queue. but eventually they got down the horse and announced that there was a kind of skill queue on the drawing board. though, it could be just a way to cut down on the "skill queue" forum threads. anyway, i do not see any valid reason for not implementing a short 1-skill-only queue. forcing players to log in to change skills is not a valid reason IMHO.
Bohrier	Posted - 2007.10.26 12:19:00 - [252] I think a skill queue of 1 would do no harm to anyone, but would be a great help for those of us that cant login for 5min to change skills. Sometimes i need to train something thats 4h long, and I'm gone for the whole day. With the queue, I could go back to that 20d long skill after the 4h finishes.
DiveBlaster Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.09 19:55:00 - [253] /signed -----------------------------------------------
Elseer Radak Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation	Posted - 2007.11.09 20:07:00 - [254] I like the idea of a skill queue training system and would like the Devs to take it seriously. so /signed. Elseer Radak -- a Proud member of the Paxton Bowling league, frigate division.
Angel DeMorphis	Posted - 2007.11.09 20:36:00 - [255] Originally by: Bohrier I think a skill queue of 1 would do no harm to anyone, but would be a great help for those of us that cant login for 5min to change skills. Sometimes i need to train something thats 4h long, and I'm gone for the whole day. With the queue, I could go back to that 20d long skill after the 4h finishes. Only set skills that won't be finished before you can get back to Eve. Set the short skills to train while you are playing Eve. Deal with it, or GTFO.
Dimagus	Posted - 2007.11.09 20:51:00 - [256] Edited by: Dimagus on 09/11/2007 20:54:42 Throwing out a semi-novel idea here... They should actually implement "Skill Training", because what we have right now is more accurately described as "Rank Training". When training Drone Interfacing 4, it goes up to 226,275 / 1,280,000 SP and just stops. Why? We're learning the skill, not some arbitarily decided amount of points. Once the specified level is reached we should get the bonus of Rank IV but training shouldn't abruptly stop. Thus when Drone Interfacing 4 finishes, skillpoints should still continue to be acrued towards Drone Interfacing 5 until the skill finishes or we switch the training. This still mandates being online when a rank V finishes or to switch the skill in training, but would solve the biggest complaints for loss a points due to short time skills or unpredictable downtime/personal issues.
Vilth Wiben	Posted - 2007.11.16 03:31:00 - [257] So, who wants the ability to train one extra skill at $3 (or so) extra per month? CCP, please, PLEASE just do a survey and see the results... ...and yes, I have read a lot of the forums regarding this and I am aware of the pros and cons. Just do a survey...
Xynomorphine Gallente Xynomorph Industries	Posted - 2007.11.17 01:09:00 - [258] I like the idea of this quote is seems more plausable to achieve than the proper skill que system every one wants. Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 09/11/2007 21:00:29 Edited by: Dimagus on 09/11/2007 20:54:42 Throwing out a semi-novel idea here... They should actually implement "Skill Training", because what we have right now is more accurately described as "Rank Training". When training Drone Interfacing 4, it goes up to 226,275 / 1,280,000 SP and just stops. Why? We're learning the skill, not some arbitarily decided amount of points. Once the specified level is reached we should get the bonus of Rank IV but training shouldn't abruptly stop. Thus when Drone Interfacing 4 finishes, skillpoints should still continue to be acrued towards Drone Interfacing 5 but still mandates being online when the skill finishes or to switch the training. This would solve the biggest complaints for loss a points due to short time skills or unpredictable downtime/personal issues. If people prefer it can be a checkbox option in the settings Xynomorph Ind Believe in no one, trust in no one, the truth is really out there.
Commander Prishe Caldari The LoneStar Corp Edge Of Sanity	Posted - 2007.11.17 02:29:00 - [259] /signed Seems a lot of people want some sort of single skill queue added, and im astonished its still not been implemented yet. I mean it's bad enough the length of time it takes to train skills in this game without missing those valuable minutes/hours to start a new skill when you cant log in for whatever reason, or simply forget to, even losing 10 minutes of skill training ****es me off. It would be so nice to have a single emergancy skill selected that the game will automaticaly switch over to after current skill is finished so absolutley no training time is ever lost. Really would like ccp to make this happen in the upcoming expansion, would be a pleasent surprise.
Commander Prishe Caldari The LoneStar Corp Edge Of Sanity	Posted - 2007.11.17 02:52:00 - [260] Edited by: Commander Prishe on 17/11/2007 02:55:54 Another idea is add the skillbook: "Skill Level Queuing" in the learning skills section (allows you to queue the next level of the skill you are training) Everyone has level 1 trained as default when they start the game - This currently only trains any level of any rank of skill with no queue. Level 2 - If you was training a level 1 skill This would allow you to queue level 2 of that same skill. Level 3 - If you was training a level 2 skill This would allow you to queue level 3 of that same skill. Level 4 - If you was training a level 3 skill This would allow you to queue level 4 of that same skill. Level 5 - If you was training a level 4 skill This would allow you to queue level 5 of that same skill. So basicaly each level of "Skill Level Queuing" let you queue a single higher level of the same skill your training, you cant queue the entire 5 levels. edit thinking about it, it would take longer to train this skill than all the training time that may have been lost due to having no skill queue. hmmm

Scav Silver Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.17 06:42:00 - [261] Edited by: Scav Silver on 17/11/2007 06:45:14 Edited by: Scav Silver on 17/11/2007 06:41:51 It's been probably was said somehwere.. But anyway.. Skill que that makes sense.. 2 skills maxed qued (+1 in trainin'), or 7 days worth of skills.. Cancelation of account cancels skill que.. This way ya can either have 2 big skills qued and not wake up every 45 minutes to change small skills.. For example, I'm goin on vacation.. I que two big lvl 5 skills.. Oops, I forgot to change my paiment settin' to 3 months.. Qued Canceld.. Or, I que one 5 day skill and quite a few 25 min skills.. á ----------------------------------------------------------- "Scav est procul Porta!!" -=Pimary=- "Tonight you dine in....BKG?" -=Ashemi Darkhold=-
Ryuga VonRhaiden Caldari Insurgent New Eden Tribe Deus Ex.	Posted - 2007.11.17 19:48:00 - [262] the idea (coming from devs, as far as i can recall) of a double-skill training (one short and one long) is fairly ok. we might have a long (24h+) skill in the background and a short(24h and less to complete) sharing SPs until the short one is finished and the long one kicks in wholly. that way people will not be able to do offline training, and points won't be unexpectedly wasted (i.e. those nasty 6-7hour skills that you have to split in chunks or let 'em end 2-3 hours short of your wake up) Do not try and find the signature... that's impossible. Instead only try to realize the truth... There is no signature.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2007.11.19 20:29:00 - [263] Atleast be able to buffer skills for a few days - that would be good enough - Meaning when you have a short skill running that finishes during a servercrash another skill kicks in automaticly... CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Zhero Akior	Posted - 2007.11.20 00:03:00 - [264] Edited by: Zhero Akior on 20/11/2007 00:03:24 Originally by: Ryuga VonRhaiden the idea (coming from devs, as far as i can recall) of a double-skill training (one short and one long) is fairly ok. You saw it on the Drawing Board: http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/plannedfeat.asp
Faye Valentine	Posted - 2007.11.20 09:55:00 - [265] Against it.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2007.11.20 16:55:00 - [266] Originally by: Faye Valentine Against it. Against having a safe-net against unscheduled downtimes?? CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Carulis	Posted - 2007.11.28 11:15:00 - [267] AS most people have access to the Internet but not necessariy an EVE Client a browser based solution to managing training would be ideal. So CCP add another feature to the on-line account management system to manage training. Just my 2pence worth.
benm2012 Gallente Ion Corp. Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.29 01:03:00 - [268] Originally by: Carulis AS most people have access to the Internet but not necessariy an EVE Client a browser based solution to managing training would be ideal. So CCP add another feature to the on-line account management system to manage training. Just my 2pence worth. Definitely the best idea on here that I've seen to solve this "skill queue" problem.
Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.11.29 01:43:00 - [269] I've said it before and i'll say it again, over and over and over and over...NO TO SKILL QUEING! The proposed eve browser solution for managing skills is a good idea. It still means you have to manage the skills personally, however, you will be allowed to do it from any computer in the world. Be it at home or at work, USA or Iraq...
Saint Barnabas Amarr The Older Gamers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.11.29 11:13:00 - [270] Simple Just allow the queuing up of 1 skill only. Next issue! :) "We brake for nobody!"

Steyr Daghan	Posted - 2007.11.29 12:10:00 - [271] Edited by: Steyr Daghan on 29/11/2007 12:20:22 This is a completely useless thread. A skill queue system would create lots of problems and solve nothing. Eve is a game that's supposed to be and is played for months and years. In that timeframe what bloody difference does it make if you lose a couple of hours every now and then to an unscheduled downtime? How obsessed can you get? If you go on vacation set a long skill. If you can't be bothered to log in and change skills every week, then you're not really playing the game are you? If you "only like to play every now and then" fine but you won't progress as fast as those who play all the time. What's wrong with that? Name a MMO where you can advance as fast by not playing as you can by playing? Stupid idea, silly thread. Stop it.
Tyranis Bolke	Posted - 2007.11.29 12:51:00 - [272] I'm firmly in the no camp. It's easy enough to be online to train short skills and train long skills when your not. I often have short skills training when I'm playing and then switch to long skills for when I'm asleep/at work/away from the computer. Just deal with it guys. Skill queuing just encourages lazy players. And given that in less then a month of playing your at the stage of training 5/15/30 day skills, I don't see the need for queues. _______________________________________ Comfortably Numb
M'rvn Monki Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:38:00 - [273] yep, skill queue for me too thanks. +1 skill in a queue.
Leora Nomen	Posted - 2007.11.29 23:08:00 - [274] I would like to see some kind of a limited queue system that would hold one or two emergency use skills. It is easy to log on and change skills, however, every player sometimes has unforeseen circumstances coming up making him or her unable to log into the game. For example: 1. Computer malfunctioning. You have to take it for repair or get a new one - meanwhile you will lose days of skill training. 2. Unexpected downtimes and lag - people waiting for hours to log in and change their skills. Sometimes they lose a day because they can't log in, can't wait any longer because they have to go to school/work or get some sleep. 3. Change in travel and vacation plans - once again lose days of training. 4. Unexpected delays at work - be it traffic jam coming back home or having to work extra hours. 5. Simply forgetting. If you have a busy schedule, a family, if you don't sit at home every evening and game, remembering and thinking about EVE most likely does not take precedence for you. All in all, I calculated I lost several weeks over a year's time - not hours as some of you like to portray it. This is not to mention that before mac client was introduced, I had to restart my computer every single time to change a skill on any one account (some days over 3 times a day). I wasn't playing for this time, my character wasn't training anything - so why should I be paying anything for it? There was no way to for me to look into the future and plan around. I need to train short skills to get to long skills or to get some functionality for my character. And I can't be thinking about EVE all the time, worrying if I reset the skill training, setting up alarm clocks, etc. As it stands right now the training system rewards high levels of loyalty (addiction) and nerdishness - if you log on every day to play and if you think about EVE a lot, you're less likely to skip skill training and more likely to end up ahead. It basically turns into a competition of who is most addicted and whose schedule is most free to log on frequently, think about skills, set up the reminders, be at home to log on to your computer when skill training ends - and this is just silly. All those of you who are saying "no skills queue! queues are for lazy people" - i'm sorry but this is emotional reasoning, an argument based on how you feel, on your personal dislike of lazy people rather than some reasonable claim, something logically deduced and as such it is not an argument at all. Besides people skip training not because they are lazy - but because they are busy with other things in their real life, because sometimes unexpected things pop up, and because they are not computer game addicts and the game basically punishes them for it. guide to game time codes
Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.11.30 01:36:00 - [275] All you people who want a skill queing system should get your priorities straight. You either play the game or you dont! NO to skill queing.
Jespir Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2007.11.30 11:39:00 - [276] Skill queueing? Do you people want to actually play the game? Good grief. Its a favor enough to let us progress offline period, let alone queueing. Nope. "Silent is the air I breathe. Madness is my believer."
Pantheon Lea Farmer Boyz	Posted - 2007.11.30 12:10:00 - [277] Originally by: Connor Banks All you people who want a skill queing system should get your priorities straight. You either play the game or you dont! NO to skill queing. What the hell is wrong with not wanting to change skills in the middle of the night, i wan't a secondary skill to start training when the current one finishes. However integrating features like EVEMon into the client and making senior members able to give plans to new members would be nice, there is no need to make the stuff work automatic, but skill planning is quite a job without a tool for it. Pantheon Lea
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2007.11.30 12:55:00 - [278] Originally by: Connor Banks All you people who want a skill queing system should get your priorities straight. You either play the game or you dont! NO to skill queing. I would like a safenet for unscheduled downtimes ! - With the big patch coming up next week - Lets see how many people complain again because their likely will be problems for a few days afterwards.... Skillqueue +1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
b1zz	Posted - 2007.11.30 13:17:00 - [279] No
Biscuit0 GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.30 15:21:00 - [280] Edited by: Biscuit0 on 30/11/2007 15:21:47 Edited by: Biscuit0 on 30/11/2007 15:21:23 Character farmers are going to farm no matter what, that's their job. For those of us who have other jobs it's nice to have a fallback plan. Right now what I do is set a really long (week+) skill to train before I go to sleep then work the next day. Eventually as it whittles down and approaches a few hours I can't keep this skill training because it would cause lost time. So I pick another long skill. Half of my skills are within 4 hrs of completing and the rest weeks away. When I actually I play the 1-2 hr until completion skills get preference and as I log off I set the long ones to train. How about a compromise like a 24 to 48 hr skill queue where as long as the skills would fit in under 24hrs they will get added to a queue while anything longer isn't. That way I could knock out all those 1-4hr skills in a day. I'm a genius I know. (I didn't read this whole thread so if someone came up with it first send me ISK for being a time travelling thief) Life won't wait.

Angel DeMorphis Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.30 15:42:00 - [281] Originally by: Biscuit0 Right now what I do is set a really long (week+) skill to train before I go to sleep then work the next day. Eventually as it whittles down and approaches a few hours I can't keep this skill training because it would cause lost time. So I pick another long skill. Half of my skills are within 4 hrs of completing and the rest weeks away. When I actually I play the 1-2 hr until completion skills get preference and as I log off I set the long ones to train. Very good plan with the long skills. It's how it should be done. One question, though: Are you never home for more than 4 hours at a time? Or are you never home and you're not playing Eve? One possibility: When you get home, log in and set one of the short (4 hr) skills to train. Either just go afk, or completely log off and shut off the computer. 2 -3 hours later, when you go out for the night (or whatever) log back in quick and set a longer skill to train (whatever skill is slightly longer than the number of hours until you usually go to bed). Then when you get home, change it to the week+ skill again. This should help you take care of some of the shorter training times. You don't have to do this ever night, of course, but a couple nights a week like that will get some of those shorter skills that are so close to being finished out of the way. It's really not that hard, if you put some thought into it.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.30 17:21:00 - [282] Originally by: Connor Banks Edited by: Connor Banks on 29/11/2007 01:46:55 I've said it before and i'll say it again, over and over and over and over...NO TO SKILL QUEING! SKILL QUEING IS FOR LAZY PEOPLE! I DONT WANT EVE TO BECOME LAZY! dude, you shouldnt shout so much when you are wrong, more people might laugh at you.
Dimagus	Posted - 2007.11.30 20:01:00 - [283] ISK and character farming isn't even remotely connected to skill training. Those will happen regardless of the system, frankly it's a lame duck excuse. Another lame duck cop-out is the "expectation of playing the game". There's numerous people with either one or multiple accounts that only sign in to set skill training for weeks or months on end. There's also plenty of casual players that only have restrictive time windows to log on and play. These people pay their subscription the same as every other user. The issue is of necessity and convenience, not a single one of the people against a skill queue actually addresses why the system is or should remain a pain in the ass for everyone that isn't a hardcore elitist. Of all the ideas thrown around no one has suggested any increase in the amount of SP gained, they merely offer possible solutions to the fact that we are human and the server is not an infallible piece of hardware. Skill Queueing Continuous Skill Training Split Skill Training Web Browser Character Management At least one needs to be implemented to address the problems instead of ignoring it.
dav	Posted - 2007.12.01 02:30:00 - [284] /signed
Leora Nomen	Posted - 2007.12.01 02:40:00 - [285] Edited by: Leora Nomen on 01/12/2007 02:42:34 Originally by: Jespir Skill queueing? Do you people want to actually play the game? Good grief. Its a favor enough to let us progress offline period, let alone queueing. Nope. typing in your user name and password to log on != playing the game, mmmk? guide to game time codes
Misina Arlath	Posted - 2007.12.01 07:15:00 - [286] Originally by: Humwawa IF there is a skillsystem which learns while offline THEN there should be a QEUEING-SYSTEM.Period. I pay to play games such as World of Warcraft, Everquest 1, Everquest 2, Guild Wars, DDO, AO et.c. So when I am taking a PAID-break, should I demand that I get experience towards the next level? Or that I get compensation when I come back for the in-game currency I could have made while on my break? No, you don't. That the skill system continues to train while you are offline is a bonus that the game gives us. A bonus, that assumes we have the logic capacity to plan which skills to train according to how long we're planning to not be in the game. Which is extremely simple to do, given that you are told, on the minute, how long a skill will take to train. As with all online games, you pay for a service, and the service is to provide you with the server and the content of the game to play around in. If/when EVE servers are shut down, do you really think you can demand a huge amount of money to compensate for your characters worth? Only thing you'll get is a refund on the days you paid for that you didn't yet recieve. The skill system, as it is today, is just fine. If you are actively playing the game, there is no problems logging in to switch a skill. And yes, maybe you will lose a day or more of training sometimes. So what? It's a game. You take a 3 week bender while playing WoW, well sucks to be you, you lose your PvP ranking and don't get experience for the time gone. Neither should you in EVE, though, however, because of the long training times in EVE, it coincidentally allows you to train something over long periods of time where you can just ignore the game. Thats a bonus with the rather hardcore skill system, and not something you can demand from CCP. If they add a skill queue system, farmers can, and WILL, start queueing up skills for their alt/bots and get them "produced" much faster and much easier. Do you want more macro-missioners or macro-farmers in EVE? It would be handy, and easy, for us all to have an automatic skill-up system. But, I honestly belive that if you don't play the game actively, then you have no right to demand anything extra from the game. You want it, you put in the effort for it. And if you can't be arsed to log in and switch a skill, which takes less than 5 minutes on a PC that is newer than a 1987 model, then you fail at EVE, and don't deserve any skills at all. The only thing I could want, if there was to be a change in EVE skill system, was a "dual training". While training a skill that takes 3 weeks, you can set to train another skill which may only take 2 days. However, out of the total skillpoints you gain per hour, you set a slider to allocate how many of those points you want to be used for training the secondary skill. For instance, in increments of 10%. Lets say the secondary skill takes 50 hours to complete with 100% of the skillpoints going into it (as it does today). You set the slider to 50%, which means half the skillpoints go to the secondary skill, and the other 50% go to the 3 week skill. That will make the 50 hour skill take 100 hours instead of 50, and the 3 week skill will take 6 weeks instead of 3. What do you gain? You get a skill that takes shorter without losing skillpoints into training the 3 week skill. Once the faster skill finishes, the slider resets to 100% skillpoints into the 3 week skill. Also, it could let you finish two pre-requisite skills at once, such as AB IV and Nav IV which are both needed for Evasive Maneuvering. Instead of training one, then the other, you finish both at same time by allocating 50% skillpoints to each. This won't queue up anything, but it can slow down skills. So you if you are going on a two week vacation, you train two skills that take 1 week each, and set them to 50% each and thus you have both when you come home since they now take 2 weeks each. Thoughts? (I might have explained it poorly)
Todeskuh	Posted - 2007.12.01 13:45:00 - [287] /not signed
Ed Anger Weekly World News	Posted - 2007.12.02 04:43:00 - [288] Originally by: Steyr Daghan Edited by: Steyr Daghan on 29/11/2007 12:20:22 This is a completely useless thread. A skill queue system would create lots of problems and solve nothing. Eve is a game that's supposed to be and is played for months and years. In that timeframe what bloody difference does it make if you lose a couple of hours every now and then to an unscheduled downtime? How obsessed can you get? If you go on vacation set a long skill. If you can't be bothered to log in and change skills every week, then you're not really playing the game are you? If you "only like to play every now and then" fine but you won't progress as fast as those who play all the time. What's wrong with that? Name a MMO where you can advance as fast by not playing as you can by playing? Stupid idea, silly thread. Stop it. translation: u all suck! haha i am better player! too bad u have real life, i pwn u!
Cipher7 VersaTech Interstellar Ltd. SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.02 19:29:00 - [289] Personally I am ok either way. If we get a que I will enjoy the %100 efficiency. If we don't get a que I will continue not to worry about somtimes losing a few hours. I think most of the demands for a skillque are driven by Obsessive-Compulsive behavior.
Pitt Bull Caldari	Posted - 2007.12.02 21:23:00 - [290] Great idea, but looks better on paper. It would make raising your skills too easy.

Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.12.02 21:29:00 - [291] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Connor Banks Edited by: Connor Banks on 29/11/2007 01:46:55 I've said it before and i'll say it again, over and over and over and over...NO TO SKILL QUEING! SKILL QUEING IS FOR LAZY PEOPLE! I DONT WANT EVE TO BECOME LAZY! dude, you shouldnt shout so much when you are wrong, more people might laugh at you. Wrong? Me? If i'm wrong then how come EVE lacks a skill queing system? CCP simply wants players to be online as much as possible...nothing more to it. There will never ever be a queing system in EVE. So i guess it is me laughing at you dude... For you stupid ones who didn't understand me the first time: 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.03 12:17:00 - [292] Originally by: Connor Banks Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Connor Banks Edited by: Connor Banks on 29/11/2007 01:46:55 I've said it before and i'll say it again, over and over and over and over...NO TO SKILL QUEING! SKILL QUEING IS FOR LAZY PEOPLE! I DONT WANT EVE TO BECOME LAZY! dude, you shouldnt shout so much when you are wrong, more people might laugh at you. Wrong? Me? If i'm wrong then how come EVE lacks a skill queing system? CCP simply wants players to be online as much as possible...nothing more to it. There will never ever be a queing system in EVE. So i guess it is me laughing at you dude... For you stupid ones who didn't understand me the first time: 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE. i am bookmarking this post for the day when CCP releases the queue. also, you are dead wrong. skill queuing will not make people more lazy than auto-repeat on weapons, autopilot or a mobile phone with callendar. skill queue will make patch days and unscheduled server downtimes easier on CCP and all players. so, you make all your papers and presentions by hand cause computers are for lazy people? do you go everywhere riding your bike cause cars are too easy? you dont put allarms on your phone/watch cause that makes you a real man? grow up. skill training on EVE is given on a fixed rate. there is no grinding, no way to make up for the time you loose like there is on any other game. so loosing time on EVE is really a serious issue for those of us that love the game. specially when we can not blame ourselves, but the server, the ISP or whatever might come.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2007.12.03 20:11:00 - [293] skill queue will make patch days and unscheduled server downtimes easier on CCP and all players. skill training on EVE is given on a fixed rate. there is no grinding, no way to make up for the time you loose like there is on any other game. so loosing time on EVE is really a serious issue for those of us that love the game. specially when we can not blame ourselves, but the server, the ISP or whatever might come. That is exactly the issue - Thats why we need a skill-queue To the person who wrote this: For you stupid ones who didn't understand me the first time: 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE. You are either 14 years old or a very silly person. Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Crato North Star Networks Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.03 22:44:00 - [294] Originally by: Connor Banks All you people who want a skill queing system should get your priorities straight. You either play the game or you dont! NO to skill queing. signed
Solar Ra	Posted - 2007.12.04 01:11:00 - [295] I'd have to agree with Belmarduk. And nothing points towards that a backup skill will cause any change for the game as a whole, rather it will give a more level playing ground for those not spending 23 hours a day.
Leora Nomen	Posted - 2007.12.04 05:43:00 - [296] Originally by: Misina Arlath Originally by: Humwawa IF there is a skillsystem which learns while offline THEN there should be a QEUEING-SYSTEM.Period. I pay to play games such as World of Warcraft, Everquest 1, Everquest 2, Guild Wars, DDO, AO et.c. So when I am taking a PAID-break, should I demand that I get experience towards the next level? Or that I get compensation when I come back for the in-game currency I could have made while on my break? No, you don't. In those other games you mentioned and in EVE it is done for specific purpose to make you pay them more money - to make you pay even for the time you're not using the product. The company that provides you with the service figures that they can charge you for more cash this way. They can log how many hours your account is online and make you pay for only these hours. They can easily give you a system to queue skills. But they don't because it benefits them. If they charge you only for hours that your account was playing or gave you a skill queue system it would benefit you, you the paying customer, and make life simpler and cheaper for you. But for some reason you're basically saying that they are entitled to it instead of looking out for you own self-interest. Originally by: Misina Arlath That the skill system continues to train while you are offline is a bonus that the game gives us. A bonus, that assumes we have the logic capacity to plan which skills to train according to how long we're planning to not be in the game. Which is extremely simple to do, given that you are told, on the minute, how long a skill will take to train. The skill training system isn't some kind of privilege bestowed upon us by CCP. We pay for it, and the grind for skills CCP has simply replaced by grind for ISK which is just as long and tedious and requires that you have an active account (training of skills doesn't because it is not supposed to be part of the grind). Skill training was designed in such a way to make you play the game for several years. If you want to have a decent character, you have to play at least 1 year or pay CCP about $200-300 in game time codes to buy a trained character. If you want to fly capital ships, fly ships of multiple races, or have a indy+combat char you'll have to play EVE at least 2 years or pay CCP $400+ in GTCs to buy a char with such skills. Adding at least a limited skill queue that would hold just one 'emergency' skill and would become disabled if your account isn't active would allow people to save days/weeks of skill training each year that they would otherwise miss and would also reduce the hassle for every player in game - the hassle of having to remember, set reminders, think and remember about the game every single day. CCP already has all of us hooked for years as their skill training system is planned in such a way that you can't play 5-6 months and achieve much in game. A limited queue system would not make their profits plummet and would make a lot of their customers happy, and that's what most of us in favor of a queue are asking for here. And planing isn't always an option - i make plans but life is unpredictable, the server is unpredictable, and no matter how much you excel at making plans, you can be master plan-maker, but there will be times when you will miss skill training due to unforeseen circumstances propping up. Making plans is simple - making your life proceed according to those plans is not. guide to game time codes
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.12.04 14:26:00 - [297] Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 21/06/2007 09:13:33 I wouldn't mind a queue for the next skill only to automatically start training, just so we don't have to lose time or switch to another halfway because a skill will complete during downtime or when we're not home. We would still be required to log in for every skill to put next in the queue, but it'd be at a time that's convenient, and not whenever the timer happens to run out. Would be nice, i often end training skill i dont want or not training at all because of downtimes, extended downtimes or me going from or to work or waking up in half night just to train skills with short durations.
Jenina Arlath	Posted - 2007.12.04 17:54:00 - [298] No to skill queuing. Adding skill queues just means people will create an alt, queue up about 50 skills, then leave it running on the side without playing it. You change skills while in the game, playing the game. Thats the whole point. Why would you want to just progress skills without playing the game? Sounds to me like www.progressquest.com is more suited for people with that mentality. Turn it on, leave it running, and it plays itself. You can't plan the skills so they last past downtime? You can't plan the skills so they last through the night? Are you capable of a) reading, and b) planning when to go to the toilet? Yes, I know that sounds rude and childish, but I really start wondering when people need a queue system to be able to plan skills that take several hours at the least, days usually and forthnights at the worst. But you have to constantly change skills? Then you are still new to the game and learning basic skills. It won't take long until your skills, pretty much all of them, are on 8hr++ durations. Plan them to last past work, past the night or past downtime. It's really not hard. Oh noes, so you have to work 2 hours of overtime one day, and you lose 2 hours of skill training? Get over it already, it's a game. In other games you lose gasp 8 whole hours of "training", or exp'ing, while you are at work. At least in Eve you get the fullest out of those 8 hours as well, progresswise in the game. And still you whine and complain? If you can't be bothered to log into the game to switch skills as they finish, or you get upset over losing 30 minutes of training time in the game... well... I hate to be rude again... ... but you better take a look in the mirror and ask yourself if the lost training time is the real issue. The game has been going for many years, and like a miracle, people have actually been able to plan training, as well as actually be in the game and play it, all the way up to capitol ships and more. And the guy a few posts above me is right. People who can't log in to change a skill but needs a queue system are lazy, and nothing else. NO to Skill-queues in Eve !!
Nathaniel Blackthorne	Posted - 2007.12.04 18:30:00 - [299] Originally by: Connor Banks Wrong? Me? If i'm wrong then how come EVE lacks a skill queing system? CCP simply wants players to be online as much as possible...nothing more to it. There will never ever be a queing system in EVE. So i guess it is me laughing at you dude... FWIW, from the planned features page: Quote: Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again. Just an FYI
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.04 19:03:00 - [300] Originally by: Jenina Arlath No to skill queuing. Adding skill queues just means people will create an alt, queue up about 50 skills, then leave it running on the side without playing it. You change skills while in the game, playing the game. Thats the whole point. Why would you want to just progress skills without playing the game? Sounds to me like www.progressquest.com is more suited for people with that mentality. Turn it on, leave it running, and it plays itself. You can't plan the skills so they last past downtime? You can't plan the skills so they last through the night? Are you capable of a) reading, and b) planning when to go to the toilet? Yes, I know that sounds rude and childish, but I really start wondering when people need a queue system to be able to plan skills that take several hours at the least, days usually and forthnights at the worst. But you have to constantly change skills? Then you are still new to the game and learning basic skills. It won't take long until your skills, pretty much all of them, are on 8hr++ durations. Plan them to last past work, past the night or past downtime. It's really not hard. Oh noes, so you have to work 2 hours of overtime one day, and you lose 2 hours of skill training? Get over it already, it's a game. In other games you lose gasp 8 whole hours of "training", or exp'ing, while you are at work. At least in Eve you get the fullest out of those 8 hours as well, progresswise in the game. And still you whine and complain? If you can't be bothered to log into the game to switch skills as they finish, or you get upset over losing 30 minutes of training time in the game... well... I hate to be rude again... ... but you better take a look in the mirror and ask yourself if the lost training time is the real issue. The game has been going for many years, and like a miracle, people have actually been able to plan training, as well as actually be in the game and play it, all the way up to capitol ships and more. And the guy a few posts above me is right. People who can't log in to change a skill but needs a queue system are lazy, and nothing else. NO to Skill-queues in Eve !! 0 points for effort + 0 points for not reading the thread at all + 0 points for not understanding that you cant schedule unexpected server downtimes + 0 points for lack of touch + 0 points for over-exagerations (50 skills!!! wtf!!!!) + 0 points for not understanding how EVE training system is completely different to any other game's advance system = 0 you should remove your posting priviledges for at least 2 weeks to think about what you just posted.

Jenina Arlath	Posted - 2007.12.04 23:19:00 - [301] Are you trying to tell me people are going to settle with queuing up 1 skill after the one they are currently training? If you think that, then you are quite naive. 50 skills is an exaggeration? What then should the limit be? 1? 5? 10? 20? Anything beyond 1 is going to make it ideal for those who just leave a character rolling on training to use it for farming later, which, as too many experience in various channels and in their mailboxes, there are too many of in the game already, and I'll always oppose anything that makes it easier for them to infest the game with both spam and negative impact on the in-game markets. And if you settle on 1 skill in queue, honestly, what on earth do you gain by queuing up 1 skill compared to actually just logging in and switching the skill when it's done ? You gain +1 points for being lazy, and +1 points for avoiding a dreadful loss of, perhaps, a few hours of non-training due to an unforseen downtime, which in my experience happens very rarely. There is the 1 hour downtime everyday, which everyone knows about, and again, if you can't forsee that in your planning... well... figure that one out yourself. Again, as I said, if the game means so much to you that a few hours of training time lost is such a critical impact, then there are other more immediate things to look at than the games queue/skill system. As for your points for this and points for that, try to at least offer something constructive to the topic of the thread instead of attempting to just bash what others posted. Your post added no arguments pro or con to the queue system whatsoever. Please keep your 2 week off the forum coupon and use it yourself. Queue system only benefits those "farming" an alt character or a character for macro'ing. You have a real life and work? Great, so do I. I actually manage to take 1 minute to change a skill before I head off to work in the morning if I planned another skill to end then. It's not about planning your life around the game, it's about spending 1 minutes worth of time. Sometimes I skill will take an hour or two longer than it takes from when I go to bed until I go to work. Well, again, I spend a minute to log in, pause the skill, put on another 8hrs+ skill, then finish the overnight one after work, which, again, only takes 1 minute to do. You can actually do it while you're dinner is heating up after work. Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. Skill queuing con: Gives macro-miners/missioners more tools to help them farm in the game. I'd rather avoid the latter, instead of taking the selfish first option. I belive that overall, EVE benefits from giving as few tool as possible to macro'ers. Everytime, this boils down to the simple fact: People are too lazy to switch/plan their skills, or they are worried sick that they might lose a few hours of training in the game. If I'm wrong, please do inform me of other reasons why skill queuing is such a desperate thing to have implemented.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.04 23:33:00 - [302] Originally by: Jenina Arlath As for your points for this and points for that, try to at least offer something constructive to the topic of the thread instead of attempting to just bash what others posted. Your post added no arguments pro or con to the queue system whatsoever. Please keep your 2 week off the forum coupon and use it yourself. dude, you could have read the thread instead. you'll see i have already posted lots of constructive comments. but it is much more rewarding to just skip till the last page and insert clueless opinions. and yes, we are all asking for just 1, one, uno, skill queue. we do not want farmers to have an easier time. although they are dedicated, so they are the ones that have less problems. its like those copy protections companies like to put on original games. they only screw original owners, since those that have pirated copies use a no-cd ***** and laugh at starforce. but original owners, oh, poor them, they have to deal with broken dvd units and endless problems trying to play their game. well, this is the same. macroers do not need queues, they have all the time to change skills. its us, those that do not farm characters that have problems with those skills between 20 minutes and 2 hours. anyway, i advise you to just shut up and read the whole thread. you wont make yourself look more stupid.
Sazeh Dova	Posted - 2007.12.06 01:33:00 - [303] Originally by: Jenina Arlath Are you trying to tell me people are going to settle with queuing up 1 skill after the one they are currently training? If you read the posts carefully you will see that many of us would be satisfied with exactly that. And so far you haven't come up with a single good reason as to why this would be bad, except for accusing others of being "lazy". I can just as easily call you a "sad EVE addict" for always being near your computer and never missing any skill training (i assume you never missed a single hour because as you say it is so easy, right?). Originally by: Jenina Arlath Anything beyond 1 is going to make it ideal for those who just leave a character rolling on training to use it for farming later ISK farmers are not the ones missing skill training. Their accounts are being played 23 hours a day in shifts and there's always somebody there running EVE client to switch a skill when it is done. It is real players with busy rl, demanding jobs, and families who suffer most from lack of a skill queue. If you're worried that they will farm characters for sale, think about this: a character gains 1m sp/month. Characters sell for 200-300m ISK/1m sp. 1 month of EVE costs 150-200m ISK. By farming character for sale you're going to be making a whooping 100m ISK each month! ISK farmers obviously don't do this because they can make this amount in less than 1 day playing, and because they can buy already trained characters from other players. Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing con: Gives macro-miners/missioners more tools to help them farm in the game. ... yeah, not like already a macro account is online 23 hours a day being played by a shop worker who can easily switch skills so it doesn't miss any training at all Originally by: Jenina Arlath People are too lazy to switch/plan their skills, or they are worried sick that they might lose a few hours of training in the game. By calling people lazy for missing training, are you implying that they are too lazy to turn on the EVE client and log in? Where exactly are they being lazy? I personally haven't missed a SINGLE skill point because i was too lazy to start up the game. I was either unable to log on to EVE or I forgot because other things in real life were more important for me to think and remember about. Originally by: Jenina Arlath Again, as I said, if the game means so much to you that a few hours of training time lost is such a critical impact, then there are other more immediate things to look at than the games There are many things that in EVE aren't fair, but many of them cannot be resolved. This is one thing that is unfair and can be resolved, and so far I haven't read a single good reason for why it shouldn't be. Originally by: Jenina Arlath You have a real life and work? Great, so do I. I actually manage to take 1 minute to change a skill before I head off to work in the morning Yeah well next time your husband tells you to go pick up the kids from school because even though you agreed he is going to pick them up, he got held up at work, and so you have to drive to school, wait for them, take them to all of their after-school classes, while your cruiser IV skill is ending I hope you have that 1 minute to switch skills. Or when you're coming back from a trip and you get stuck in an airport due to bad weather for 1-2 days, I hope you have that you have that 1 minute to switch skills. Or when your computer breaks and you're unable to log onto EVE, I hope you have that 1 minute to change skills. You can't? Well that's too bad. Stop being lazy and go do it. See the absurdity of what you're saying?
Poime Gallente	Posted - 2007.12.06 06:08:00 - [304] sage
Tyranis Bolke Kingfisher Industries	Posted - 2007.12.06 11:48:00 - [305] Originally by: Sazeh Dova Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. At the end of the day, Eve is just a game. So what if you loose some skill points every day. Are you that much of a power player? _______________________________________ Comfortably Numb
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.12.06 15:25:00 - [306] Originally by: Tyranis Bolke Originally by: Sazeh Dova Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. At the end of the day, Eve is just a game. So what if you loose some skill points every day. Are you that much of a power player? Well i dont care much if i have 15 or 45 milion SP as long as i can do things is want, but there is small catch in that, being able to do anything in eve require SP and some things even LOT of them. (87 more days to be able fly new ships and gues what, 6 times skills end at downtime, 8 times during night and 7 times during my work time and thats 80% all skills i need end when i will not be able log in easily to change them)
Tyranis Bolke Kingfisher Industries	Posted - 2007.12.06 16:29:00 - [307] Originally by: Elain Reverse Originally by: Tyranis Bolke Originally by: Sazeh Dova Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. At the end of the day, Eve is just a game. So what if you loose some skill points every day. Are you that much of a power player? Well i dont care much if i have 15 or 45 milion SP as long as i can do things is want, but there is small catch in that, being able to do anything in eve require SP and some things even LOT of them. (87 more days to be able fly new ships and gues what, 6 times skills end at downtime, 8 times during night and 7 times during my work time and thats 80% all skills i need end when i will not be able log in easily to change them) Well, since you've got your skill plans all mapped out, then why not throw in a few long that your going to want at some point. That's what I do without any problems. Anyway, once you've got the plan sorted, then it isn't hard to shift things about when required. _______________________________________ Comfortably Numb
Elain Reverse Caldari Shokei	Posted - 2007.12.06 17:05:00 - [308] Originally by: Tyranis Bolke Originally by: Elain Reverse Originally by: Tyranis Bolke Originally by: Sazeh Dova Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. At the end of the day, Eve is just a game. So what if you loose some skill points every day. Are you that much of a power player? Well i dont care much if i have 15 or 45 milion SP as long as i can do things is want, but there is small catch in that, being able to do anything in eve require SP and some things even LOT of them. (87 more days to be able fly new ships and gues what, 6 times skills end at downtime, 8 times during night and 7 times during my work time and thats 80% all skills i need end when i will not be able log in easily to change them) Well, since you've got your skill plans all mapped out, then why not throw in a few long that your going to want at some point. That's what I do without any problems. Anyway, once you've got the plan sorted, then it isn't hard to shift things about when required. Its not so easy, i tryed but when you get few skill out of problematic timeframe another ones move in. And ofcourse it make your desired skill much further away due another skills put in. Sometimes i just switching skills in midle just to avoid this, but not everytime its possible and often geting even more problems to fit those partialy trained skills on end. Making skill queue just for 1 backup skill will make skill management much easier. In other MMOs you dont need queue as you train only when playng and i dont think its something isk selers will profit from, doing missions for them is much better income and they are online 23/7 anyway taking turns.
Vihris Gari	Posted - 2007.12.06 17:48:00 - [309] Just curious, did anyone from CCP ever respond in this thread? I scrolled through the first few pages and didn't see anything. It'd be nice to have an official statement to refer to.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2007.12.06 19:30:00 - [310] Originally by: Vihris Gari Just curious, did anyone from CCP ever respond in this thread? I scrolled through the first few pages and didn't see anything. It'd be nice to have an official statement to refer to. Nope afaik - It would be nice if a dev did... Either to tell us we should forget about it , it will NEVER happen or Yes we are considering about implementing it or we are totally unsure and therefore are blantatly ignoring all forum-threads about it.... Listens and waits for a dev-reply CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !

Liu	Posted - 2007.12.06 20:13:00 - [311] Originally by: Tyranis Bolke Originally by: Sazeh Dova Originally by: Jenina Arlath Skill queuing pro: Avoid a few hours of training due to rare, unforseen downtimes. I've calculated I lost several weeks from all of my accounts (millions of skill points) in all my time playing EVE. At the end of the day, Eve is just a game. So what if you loose some skill points every day. Are you that much of a power player? that reasoning is quite sad. it is not about power playing. its about being able to play as you wish. the way skills are set on eve, although there is not much to gain from level 4 to level 5, there are some skills that act as doorways to a whole new layer, like racial frig 5, racial cruiser 5, battlecruiser 5, weapon upgrades 5, projectiles/rails/lasers/missiles 5, etc. when those skills are near completion (3-10 hours), it is really a turnoff not being able to just set them to train, cause you cant be all the time on the computer, and sometimes this sets you back on your training schedule much longer than it should. for example, i have at least 12 skills at level 4 and 80-95% to level 5 that i am being unable to complete cause they are not as long as to train them overnight or during work hours. and i already have lots of skills i can train. for new players (like i was not so long ago), it is really a nightmare to fulfill a schedule (specially those pesky learning skills) a one, single, skill queue would solve all this problems without making life easier to farmers. like if they needed it, anyway Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.12.07 12:47:00 - [312] A very important feature of EVE is the skill training system. This very important feature requires little effort from a subscriber. The effort needed is to log in and start training a new level of a skill or a completely new skill. Sometimes you need to log in often and sometimes weeks can pass without needing to log in. For this, in my opinion, very small effort you get a huge reward which is that you donÆt need to actively train your skills! This brings me to the following. How can an adult person expect to get something in return without any effort? DonÆt YOU as an adult person know that anything in life worth getting costs something? All of you who want a skill queue system obviously think you should be equally rewarded as them players who actually take the time and effort to be online upon skill completion. Now, some of you will argue that you pay real life money to play this game and thus are entitled to a skill queue. This is, in my opinion, the same as arguing for a feature where I should be able to pre-set how my ship should behave in various situations. This also is a no go from my point of view! Of course I understand most of EVE players, me included, have a real life and everything that goes along with it, family, work, trips, etc. Since we live in the 21st century I strongly believe a skill manager via the browser will resolve most issues, if not all, regarding skill advancement without a skill queue. Skill completion during unexpected down time is a special case from which all players eventually suffer from. Actually, the only reason for a skill queue system is unexpected downtime because that is the one and only thing in EVE you cannot control and align with rest of your life. Some will argue that reason alone is enough for implementing a skill queue. I donÆt agree with that! Why? Unexpected downtime affects more than skill advancement. Unexpected downtime can occur on that very day which is the only day during that week you actually have time to spend a few hours and play the game. Would this be a reason to argue for an extrapolation system which calculates the amount of ISK you should have earned? Or the number of players you should have killed? To conclude: NO to a skill queue and YES to a skill manager via a browser!
Nathaniel Blackthorne	Posted - 2007.12.07 15:11:00 - [313] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Vihris Gari Just curious, did anyone from CCP ever respond in this thread? I scrolled through the first few pages and didn't see anything. It'd be nice to have an official statement to refer to. Nope afaik - It would be nice if a dev did... Either to tell us we should forget about it , it will NEVER happen or Yes we are considering about implementing it or we are totally unsure and therefore are blantatly ignoring all forum-threads about it.... Listens and waits for a dev-reply Well, since it's already stated on the drawing board page, maybe they don't find it necessary to reiterate what's already there?
Sazeh Dova	Posted - 2007.12.08 21:42:00 - [314] Originally by: Connor Banks ... this, in my opinion, very small effort you get a huge reward which is that you donÆt need to actively train your skills! This brings me to the following. How can an adult person expect to get something in return without any effort? DonÆt YOU as an adult person know that anything in life worth getting costs something? All of you who want a skill queue system obviously think you should be equally rewarded as them players who actually take the time and effort to be online upon skill completion. Now, some of you will argue that you pay real life money to play this game and thus are entitled to a skill queue. This is, in my opinion, the same as arguing for a feature where I should be able to pre-set how my ship should behave in various situations. This also is a no go from my point of view! Of course I understand most of EVE players, me included, have a real life and everything that goes along with it, family, work, trips, etc. Since we live in the 21st century I strongly believe a skill manager via the browser will resolve most issues, if not all, regarding skill advancement without a skill queue. Skill completion during unexpected down time is a special case from which all players eventually suffer from. Actually, the only reason for a skill queue system is unexpected downtime because that is the one and only thing in EVE you cannot control and align with rest of your life. Some will argue that reason alone is enough for implementing a skill queue. With skill training it is not like people don't want to put any effort. There are situations when they cannot. They would like to, but they are unable to log on to EVE. Isn't it a tad unfair that because of circumstances that are outside of your control the game punishes you? You want to put in effort but you can't and the game will set you back for it. A lot of people posting on this issue make it sounds like the problem lies with people being so lazy that they cannot start their EVE client and log in. That is simply not true, as anybody with a grain of reason understands. But whatever makes them feel superior and more self-righteous in their crusade against the so-called lazy people that they must imagine can't even make three clicks with their mouse to log in ... The problem lies in that whatever real life plans you make, real life comes and break them. It is impossible to live 100% by whatever plans you made. In the end, the game rewards those who sit at home hugging their computers most of the day because the are the ones who don't need to make plans and consequently real life doesn't come and break them. The downtime is an expected circumstance. And as you can see no one is complaining about it. Because it is expected. The whole reason behind having a 1-skill queue is that it will save you from losing points during unexpected events. For example, with the last patch many players had their boot.ini file deleted and were unable to log on to EVE and change skills. If they used outside support it probably took them days to get their computers working. The patch also messed up the Macintosh client pretty badly. One guy posted that he can no longer switch keyboard languages. Since he cannot type in his user name and password in Russian, he cannot log in and hence cannot change skills. He wrote a petition about it through the website probably, but guess how long it will take them to respond back to him among all the other petitions they are getting now? I can also site you a variety of real life circumstances that can break up whatever plans you made. The game will set you back for all of these things, whether they are your own issues or issues with the server and the game. Doesn't that seem just a tad unfair to you that the game will punish you for your inability to log in? It sure seems like that to me.
Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.12.09 00:06:00 - [315] I really don't care about any of your real life issues. Stop whining about your real life getting in your way of playing EVE effectively. That sort of complaining doesn't get you anywhere in real life and so it shouldn't do that here either. As I see it you should get your pirorities straight. You either play the game or you don't. It's simple as that. Personally, I favour those players who spend every wake moment in EVE. They should get a benefit of being online so often and for long periods of time. Don't get me wrong, I'm not of them addicted players. I have lost my share of skill training due to various reasons. And guess what, I still believe those players who make the effort being online upon skill completion should get something in return. The only thing one could complain about is the unexpected downtime(though i fail to see why since everyone suffers equally). If you so wholeheartedly want to be reimbursed for lost time why don't cry about lost ISK? ISK is as important as skills in EVE. A few hours of ratting can give several 100s of millions for experienced players. I have yet to see a thread about that! ...nevertheless, seems CCP has the skill queue issue on the drawing board...so I guess it will be implemented...just a matter of time. Personally, CCP, please don't do it! /Connor
Anita Blonde	Posted - 2007.12.09 00:18:00 - [316] +1 for skill training queue
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2007.12.09 03:36:00 - [317] Edited by: Tasko Pal on 09/12/2007 03:36:39 At a glance, I'd favor putting in a skill queue. I don't see saving more than a few hours here and there. But it does mean that i don't have to log in, oh precisely 34 minutes from now, to change a skill. The worst problem I had was when my computer's hard disk died and I ended up a couple of paid months absent from Eve. A queue would have meant that I'd recover some of that absent time. So from my point of view, it looks like a good deal. I'm somewhat bummed that I didn't get set up in time for inventing the EAS or heavy interdictor. Oh well. But I don't see a lot of benefit from a queue here unless it were particularly long (like 5 as some mentioned). As I see it, some sort of queue benefits those who can't be on the computer very much. I recognize it does harm a little those who can do the so called "time management" thing, that is, log in often enough at appropriate times of the day to near optimally train skills. OTOH, I don't see the world ending just because skill training remains as it is. The character farmers already have a huge advantage and a huge disadvantage with the way the game is set up. They don't have to play to "level" the characters, but they do have to pay. A skill queue would only make character farming a little cheaper in labor. It still doesn't cut the $11 to $15 per month that the farmer is paying to CCP.
AncientGuardian	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:14:00 - [318] Edited by: AncientGuardian on 10/12/2007 19:15:07 {QR} I only read the first page of +s and complaints... I like the idea of queue training. heres my .02 isk on the matter.. a Skill under the Learning set. It would require Learning to level 5 and possibly Research to level 3 (simply because of the Name of the skill goes along with it, just for unlocking purposes only) "Skill Queuing" would be the name of the skill. it would be a rank 5 skill. and would allow 1 skill queued per level. and for the ranters, "This skill cannot be trained on Trial accounts"
Esphere	Posted - 2007.12.11 16:51:00 - [319] Edited by: Esphere on 11/12/2007 16:52:12 Edited by: Esphere on 11/12/2007 16:51:20 +1 for the Queue. Decide what you want to reward. Reward not being lazy or reward good decisions. And with decisions i don't mean "I decide to wake up a 2 O clock in the night to log into eve". While WoW for example greatly favors those who play very much, often being pupils, unemployed (don't want to affront anybody) EVE Online offers the skill-Training system that trains while being offline giving me who has to work 10 Hours a day "basicaly" the same chances to advance in the game as somebody who spends the whole day playing. Of course, he who plays all day will soon have much more isk, better standing, better ingame contacts but the difference between a "casual" gamer (~2h a day) and those allways-on is not nearly as big as in WoW. Can you Imagine a WoW clan that consist of level 20 and level 60 chars that effectively play "together"? Impossible i think. I personally think the best games do not need effort as an end in itself. The perfect game is like life - if you are smart, you need less effort, if you have a lot of experience maybe too - but the way to experience for most needs a lot of effort. Got my thinking? CCP got the balls (mind me) to break with mainstream thinking small - i don't think it would hurt to go just a little step further.
Artazzo	Posted - 2007.12.13 23:57:00 - [320] Lots of posts :) anyway, i personally do want a queue, since i hate having my nights unused if a skill is done. however i do see the cons in this discussion as well. but why not combine the two so you can have a queue without the cons :) i would like to setup a queue for, let say 3days. however the constriction is you have to login in at least a couple of times during those days for a total time of 4 hours. if you don't reach the cap of logged in, you won't get the skill-time after all. or you have a queue of 24hours and you have to login the next day for 1 hour minimum. these are wild numbers ofcourse and i am sure there is a better balance for it, but you get the idea. i won't hold my sleep if it doesn't get there, but still.

Sazeh Dova	Posted - 2007.12.14 05:22:00 - [321] Edited by: Sazeh Dova on 14/12/2007 05:26:47 Originally by: Connor Banks I really don't care about any of your real life issues. I pay $15 to CCP and CCP cares to keep me as a customer happy so that I keep paying my monthly $15. I don't give much crap about you personally caring or not caring about other people's rl issue. This isn't what the discussion is about. All rl issues were given as examples to support my reasoning, but I guess you didn't understand that. Originally by: Connor Banks Stop whining about your real life getting in your way of playing EVE effectively. That sort of complaining doesn't get you anywhere in real life and so it shouldn't do that here either. Next time you play and get some kind of a bug or see something the game that you'd like to be changed, just be a tough guy and suck it up. Don't submit a bug report, don't whine to GMs about anything you'd like to get changed. After all, keeping quiet about what concerns you will really get you somewhere in real life and it should in EVE. Speaking out about your concerns, on the other hand, never gets you anywhere. Originally by: Connor Banks As I see it you should get your pirorities straight. You either play the game or you don't. It's simple as that. Typing in your user name and password, opening and closing character sheet, pressing escape button to quit the game does not equal to playing the game. People who are most likely to miss skill training are the ones who got their priority list straight - and EVE isn't at the top of that list. Originally by: Connor Banks Personally, I favour those players who spend every wake moment in EVE. They should get a benefit of being online so often and for long periods of time. And i personally favor players who win in EVE due to their own ingenuity and resourcefulness and wits, not by owning 3+ accounts and playing 30+ hours a week and being able to log in 2-3 time a day at any time. Originally by: Connor Banks The only thing one could complain about is the unexpected downtime(though i fail to see why since everyone suffers equally). Everyone does not suffer equally. Some people had a long skill in training, others were catching up on short skills. Because of this some people will miss skill training and others will not. And this is quite preventable if we have a 1-skill queue system in place. Originally by: Connor Banks If you so wholeheartedly want to be reimbursed for lost time why don't cry about lost ISK? ISK is as important as skills in EVE. A few hours of ratting can give several 100s of millions for experienced players. I have yet to see a thread about that! Ratting, trading, combat - these are all PVP (player vs player) activities that require people to actually play the game and compete with each other. If you take that away and make everyone equal in this respect, there is no competition and no sense of achievement. This will ruin the game and obviously is quite stupid to ask for. Changing skills on the other hand is not a player vs player activity and it is not playing the game. It is not an in-game competition of ingenuity, but a real life competition of whose schedule is most free, who can afford to spend more time at their computer running EVE client. Those of you who are saying people should be rewarded for changing their skills are basically saying we should compete in real life for who can log on more often and reward the ones who are most nerdy, most addicted, and don't have much of real life and real life plans, don't have a family or a job with unpredictable hours. You're saying that logging into EVE is an achievement of its own. Since these people can log in most often, the game should reward them because of that. To me this kind of reasoning sounds really twisted as I cannot understand why the game should reward players for simply logging in ... not playing, not completing with others in game, but simply logging in.
Misina Arlath Amarr	Posted - 2007.12.14 09:10:00 - [322] The furthest I'd go with skill queueing is being able to queue ONLY one skill, and in order to queue something after it, the first skill you are training, not the one you are queuing up, has to be on less than 3-6 hours before completed. It might have taken 14 days, but if there is more than 3-6 hours left before it finishes, you can't queue something after it. That should fix all those "wasting the hours at night" problems. I've had skills run 4-5 hours into the night after I go to bed and then have my character run 1-2 hours on empty until I got up... honestly, it doesn't bother me one bit to lose an hour or two of training, and if I was hardcore about the game I'd seriously consider quitting it altogether. However.. people are different and have different opinions, so meh.. I'm not going to be losing out on the lazymode-free-training, but I'm also not going to support long skill queues for people to lazy to actually log in and play the game. The only times I can see a problem where skill queues would be needed is for characters with less than 2 million skillpoints (newbies) who have to train numerous basic skills up to level III, all of which take anywhere from 15 mins (for level I) upwards to 5-18 hours (for level III). Once you are past that rookie stage in skill training, most of them take well over a day, and most take a week or more. If you still have problems "timing it right", that would only be bacuse it clashes with either work or sleep, and thus it falls inside the "less than 6 hours to complete" category and can be remedied by queuing up 1 skill after it. -------------------------------------------------- "Every complex problem has a solution which is easy, neat and wrong!"
Jettax	Posted - 2007.12.14 19:03:00 - [323] There should be a new learning skill called "skill queuing" +1 skill can be queued per level ...And a multi-tasking implant that let's you traing 2 skills at the same time! But I basically think the reason this hasn't been implemented is to encourage people to log in more often, then when they do, they might say quick hi to someone, catchup on their eve-mails etc... to encourage participation. The farming thing doens't wash at all, as the previous posters have pointed out very validly: Farmers stand to benefit little iskwise from charfarming, they can easily change skills anyway as it's what they do 24/7, and they use macros anyway which could easily be applied to skill queue management.
Honeyz Minmatar	Posted - 2007.12.15 01:30:00 - [324] Why do people keep asking for this, I think CCP know about it. I bet I could bump a hundread of this threads if I was inclined. Seeing this topic really is getting annoying, can't people use search ?
Quint Sight	Posted - 2007.12.15 07:57:00 - [325] somone may have made this suggestion but what if the trainng que was based on one day so you could que up skills as long as there combined times did not add up to more than a 24 hour period. I think thiss would be good for new players so that they would not have to log on every 2 hours or so to change skills, but at the same time it would discourage farming because all the worthwhile skills easily take more than a day. just a thought.
Connor Banks Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.12.15 18:04:00 - [326] Originally by: Connor Banks 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE.
Liu	Posted - 2007.12.15 22:28:00 - [327] Originally by: Connor Banks Originally by: Connor Banks 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE. why do you quote yourself on such wrong statements? that is not very intelligent. 1-skill-queue will make people log in on the game exactly as many times as they have to log in, minus one. so, if after 3 years, a player now logs in 1000 times, with a single skill queue they will log in 999 times. yeah, that is lazyness. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Nastasia	Posted - 2007.12.16 10:09:00 - [328] Originally by: Liu why do you quote yourself on such wrong statements? that is not very intelligent. 1-skill-queue will make people log in on the game exactly as many times as they have to log in, minus one. so, if after 3 years, a player now logs in 1000 times, with a single skill queue they will log in 999 times. yeah, that is lazyness. Exactly. Most of these arguments against any type of skill queue are made by players who are basically saying "if you don't log into to EVE any time it demands and plan your skill schedule around your real life, you're lazy". You might be a hard working individual in real life, an A+ student, but there people will say you're lazy because you forget to login to a computer game or can't log in sometimes. In fact a skill queue with one skill isn't about reducing the number of times you'll have to log in but simply giving players some more freedom with their training schedule.
Iluminat Minmatar WASTELAND MINERS Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.17 09:05:00 - [329] Skill q with a timer like 24 hours would be ok. it would help to pass some 7 or 8 hours skills.
Raukho Amarr Times of Ancar Pure.	Posted - 2007.12.17 15:10:00 - [330] yes to the possibillity to ad 1 skill in a que and a webbased browser Not all of us can troll EVE forums or similar at work. I think that the ingame variation would be more easily implemented then the webbased.

Victor Ivanov Minmatar The Fated Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.12.17 15:37:00 - [331] I too would like at least a 1 qeue capability. /signed ----------------------
Nevan Blade	Posted - 2007.12.17 17:22:00 - [332] Edited by: Nevan Blade on 17/12/2007 17:26:10 Cut the chatter ppl! The EVE skill training system is fine as it is, you just need to arrange your skills to the way it suits you best. If u know that u'r a day away from your pc and a certain skill is to finish that day... You switch it to a one day skill wich will be done right about the time when u get online again! There problem solved. LOL and now go and play eve
Liu	Posted - 2007.12.17 17:24:00 - [333] Originally by: Nevan Blade Cut the chatter ppl the EVE skill training system is fine as it is you just need to arrange your skills to the way it suits you best if u know that u'r a day away and a certain skill is to finish that day... you switch it to a one day skill that also needs to be completed there problem solved lol and now go and play eve people shouldnt be allowed to post before reading the whole thread. it would make the world so much better Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Nevan Blade	Posted - 2007.12.17 17:29:00 - [334] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Nevan Blade Cut the chatter ppl the EVE skill training system is fine as it is you just need to arrange your skills to the way it suits you best if u know that u'r a day away and a certain skill is to finish that day... you switch it to a one day skill that also needs to be completed there problem solved lol and now go and play eve people shouldnt be allowed to post before reading the whole thread. it would make the world so much better srry i dont get u but i read the thread i just think that the dev's have it hard enough without ppl complaining about this and we dont like sarcasm , No offence
Liu	Posted - 2007.12.17 17:50:00 - [335] Originally by: Nevan Blade Originally by: Liu Originally by: Nevan Blade Cut the chatter ppl the EVE skill training system is fine as it is you just need to arrange your skills to the way it suits you best if u know that u'r a day away and a certain skill is to finish that day... you switch it to a one day skill that also needs to be completed there problem solved lol and now go and play eve people shouldnt be allowed to post before reading the whole thread. it would make the world so much better srry i dont get u but i read the thread i just think that the dev's have it hard enough without ppl complaining about this and we dont like sarcasm , No offence well, if you had read the thread you would know that your advice is already known by everybody on the whole universe. yes, we know, set long skill at night and short skill when you are playing. we are not idiots. what we want is a safety net for times when you set a 15 minutes skill cause you are going to play for at least 2 hours, and suddenly the server goes down. now, tell me smartie, how do you set a long skill when there is no server? Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Slate Fistcrunch Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.12.17 18:04:00 - [336] The log in queue is starting to **** me off. Need to leave the house for hours to go out but can't change skill because I can't log in because there are 25 people ahead of me in the log in queue..... Seriously, make a web based way to change the skill. How much difference is there between opening client, enter user / pass, enter game, change skill to open broswer, enter user / pass, click change skill, change skill?
AncientGuardian	Posted - 2007.12.17 19:23:00 - [337] Again, i support Skill Queuing by any means. not because im lazy, but because i have a life. and id rather the game alow me to skip that one login for a damn skill so i can go out and have my life.
Zakgram Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.12.17 21:53:00 - [338] Why not just have an api so that evemon can change skills? Job done.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2007.12.31 17:40:00 - [339] shameless last bump of 2007 CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Gadawan	Posted - 2008.01.01 01:44:00 - [340] First bump of 2008 ;)

Aresgodofspace	Posted - 2008.01.02 09:33:00 - [341] It's a good idea period. As i see it the biggest arguement against having a queue system is character farming. Who cares about character farming really? As long as CCP is getting paid for the extra account who's getting hurt? No one, the guy with the devotion to take care of multiple accounts gets the isk from selling the farmed characters. The buyer gets what he or she is looking for in exchange for some isk and CCP is getting paid to do what the do, run the game. The only people who don't like the idea of a skill queue system are people that either don't understand the positive outcomes or they don't liek the idea of getting beat out buy a bought character. Secure character trading is legal friends, so is secure trading of GTC. Sure it would make farming a little easier for people but I'm sure farmers forget less then regular players after all that is their investment.
Sazeh Dova	Posted - 2008.01.02 11:04:00 - [342] Originally by: Aresgodofspace It's a good idea period. As i see it the biggest arguement against having a queue system is character farming. Who cares about character farming really? As long as CCP is getting paid for the extra account who's getting hurt? At the current character prices you'd be making about 50 million ISK profit from each character per month because game time codes do not cost much lower in comparison. Character farming is just simply not profitable for farmers with or without a skill queue. It is significantly more profitable for them to employ keyloggers to hack other people's accounts to steal their characters, which is indeed what the farmers currently do.
Nacho Daddy	Posted - 2008.01.02 15:35:00 - [343] The best way to do a skill queue (which I like BTW mainly for the 2,3,4, and 5 hour skills) is allow X amount of hours to be queued and make it relative to the rank of the skills. That way you could queue several level 1 or level 2 skills to train while you go to sleep or work, queue up a few level 3 skills, queue 2 level 4 skills and 1 level 5 skill. The thing is it sucks to lose time because a skill finishes training while you're asleep, at work, or doing something else. I hate having to switch to another skill before I go to work or sleep because the one I'm currently working on will complete while I'm AFK and I'll lose several hours of training that could be used to raise another skill to level 3. It also is a PITA because I'm using my play time to train the shorter skills where I have to manage it more, training that last 4 hours sucks because I'm not adding or gaining level in the lower level skills while I wait for it to complete.
Steyr Daghan thx for all the fish Minuit.	Posted - 2008.01.03 22:11:00 - [344] /thread This thread is an epic fail for reasons that have been mentioned already. CCP: Skill system is fine. Queue would do more harm than good. Don't listen to the whiners. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I was gonna make a cool sig-picture, it was gonna have hot babes, spaceships and stufff... ...but I spent my time playing EVE instead
Chemical Castration Chemical Castration Lotto	Posted - 2008.01.04 03:17:00 - [345] Edited by: Chemical Castration on 04/01/2008 03:16:57 They could easily make it less abusable by making the 'queued' skill only train at half or one third speed. That way if something happens where you CAN'T get to your computer for a day or two after training ends, your time isn't 100% wasted. Hell, even make it another skill. Make it require Level 5 Learning, and a high rank skill (with a Charisma primary, lol) and each level will make the training time increase by 10% (from zero) so it's 10% normal speed to 50% normal speed at level 5, which would be a large time investment to even get to 4. /shrug
Bellator Militaris	Posted - 2008.01.04 10:24:00 - [346] I'm just looking at all the cool sigs.
floater666	Posted - 2008.01.04 20:14:00 - [347] Edited by: floater666 on 04/01/2008 20:15:41 There are at least 3 kinds of people here: 1. Eat dog food because no job and family: Nay to queue, I have all the time to log in every minute when needed. i dont loose 1SP that way. I want to have my e-peen bigger with this advantage over other types of people, since my RL failed thats the only thing I have. 2. Lazy unreasonable people or farmers: I want infinite length queue. I dont care that the gameplay would be killed after that and I will have nothing fun to do. (There would be a huge gap in the game with the ships fliing: barely frigs or cruisers, The pumped up SP characters that come back after weeks of downtime will demand hi-tech equipement and ships even more, which would make CHINA to change name to EVEGOLD) 3. Reasonable people with balanced life. Good job that they like, and a loving family: Add the possibility to set a 1 length queue because I have other things to do somethimes but I dont want to loose SP for which I paid good money to CCP. (They realize that a 1 length queue wouldnt make any difference on the down side, but would bring a whole lot on the upside) Of course the first 2 characters are just hyperboles to shorten the story, but the 3rd character is a blood and meat real person with something between his ears. Really give us 1 length queue. Name it emergency plan, or backup skill or whatever that stipulates that there will be no more just this extra slot. JOB WELL DONE!
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.01.04 20:55:00 - [348] Yes thats exactly the issue here - One skill queue or dual skill training AS SAID ON THE DRAWINGBOARD FOR AGES...sorry caps Thats reasonable and a good emergency-backup for unscheduled downtimes plus is a LITTLE help for casual players. CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Gadawan	Posted - 2008.01.04 22:36:00 - [349] Originally by: Steyr Daghan /thread This thread is an epic fail for reasons that have been mentioned already. CCP: Skill system is fine. Queue would do more harm than good. Don't listen to the whiners. Please share one harmful thing caused by a queue to a regular player.
Zeknichov Life. Universe. Everything.	Posted - 2008.01.04 23:47:00 - [350] I probably already signed this but... /signed.

Polly Prissypantz	Posted - 2008.01.05 17:43:00 - [351] I've probably already signed this, but stuff it... /signed again. All we need is ONE SKILL QUEUED.
Pazzuzzu	Posted - 2008.01.08 14:53:00 - [352] /signed for a one skill training queue !
Katashi Ishizuka	Posted - 2008.01.09 13:38:00 - [353] Just canceled my account because I am getting tired of having to switch skills. I am a casual player, I don't log in more than once or twice a week when I have time. I really hate being chained to my computer at the strangest hours just so I can log-in to switch a virtual skill. EVE should be relaxation for me, not another job commitment I have to keep track of.
b1zz	Posted - 2008.01.09 13:42:00 - [354] Originally by: floater666 Edited by: floater666 on 04/01/2008 20:15:41 There are at least 3 kinds of people here: 3. Reasonable people with balanced life. Good job that they like, and a loving family: Add the possibility to set a 1 length queue because I have other things to do somethimes but I dont want to loose SP for which I paid good money to CCP. (They realize that a 1 length queue wouldnt make any difference on the down side, but would bring a whole lot on the upside) There's another type of person you missed: 4. Reasonable people with balanced life. Good job that they like, and a loving family, that don't care if they miss a few hours training because this is just a game. It doesn't sound like 1 skill queue is going to help you, you'd still be addicted. You need to let go. Originally by: Polly Prissypantz I've probably already signed this, but stuff it... All we need is ONE SKILL QUEUED. Will you be asking for a second skill queue once CCP have caved in on the first? The current skill training set-up is fine. Keep it simple stupid.
Andre Coeurl Gallente TOHA Heavy Industries Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.01.09 15:31:00 - [355] /signed, the 1 skill queue would be a much needed backup for emergencies. It could be even designed so that in case of server failure (meaning, impossibility to log and switch skills) the backup skill will go up normally, and in case a player can't/won't log-in in time, the backup skill will go at 50% speed for instance, so it won't be used as a "regular" feature. Originally by: b1zz There's another type of person you missed: 4. Reasonable people with balanced life. Good job that they like, and a loving family, that don't care if they miss a few hours training because this is just a game. It doesn't sound like 1 skill queue is going to help you, you'd still be addicted. You need to let go. Will you be asking for a second skill queue once CCP have caved in on the first? The current skill training set-up is fine. Keep it simple stupid. BTW, what's simple about EVE? So if you don't care to miss a skill training time, how a 1 skill queue would affect you? you shouldn't care as well right? Then why you (alt or newbie as you are) should call "stupid" all the ppl proposing a reasonable and long-awaited improvement to the game they like? Maybe it's you who need to take a pause from the game since you're taking this to personal levels without reason, well, that IS a bad sign of addiction, remind it's just a game! --- --- --- Trinity: best content release ever, totally obscured by the worst nerf ever
RoxorsEVE	Posted - 2008.01.10 00:13:00 - [356] Just because someone has life it doesn't mean that he won't feel cheated out of money and gaming-experience when his character is not trained if he misses a logon time. Its about values, like Bill Gates flies on economy class though he could buy the whole airline. Man without values is a dog, and eat dog food as I wrote above^^
b1zz	Posted - 2008.01.10 14:26:00 - [357] Edited by: b1zz on 10/01/2008 14:29:57 Originally by: Andre Coeurl /signed, the 1 skill queue would be a much needed backup for emergencies. It could be even designed so that in case of server failure (meaning, impossibility to log and switch skills) the backup skill will go up normally, and in case a player can't/won't log-in in time, the backup skill will go at 50% speed for instance, so it won't be used as a "regular" feature. If the server goes down everyone loses the same skill training time, so in comparative terms you will lose nothing. Originally by: Andre Coeurl So if you don't care to miss a skill training time, how a 1 skill queue would affect you? you shouldn't care as well right? Then why you (alt or newbie as you are) should call "stupid" all the ppl proposing a reasonable and long-awaited improvement to the game they like? Maybe it's you who need to take a pause from the game since you're taking this to personal levels without reason, well, that IS a bad sign of addiction, remind it's just a game! Keep it simple stupid (KISS) is an expression, it means don't over complicate it or you risk ruining it. I did not just insult everyone who wants skill queuing. My point is if you allow one skill queue, why not 2, or 3 or 4. Where does it end and where does it start? Why is one skill queue okay but not 2 skill queues? Who decides and how do they decide? If CCP give one, in a years time after the hub-hub has died down there will be calls for a second etc. If they introduced a skill queue I would use it. I'm a casual player. I get very little time during the week to play because of work. But, I don't think it's necessary. Even though I get very little time to play I manage my skills fine. If I miss a skill change over it's not the end of the world. The people who want this feature are those in a hurry to get their characters uber fast. Fair enough, but I offer one piece of advice for those people, patience and long term thinking in this game get rewarded. P.S This is my one and only character, and I've been playing for 2 months, if that's considered a newbie then so be it.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.01.10 15:25:00 - [358] Originally by: b1zz If the server goes down everyone loses the same skill training time, so in comparative terms you will lose nothing. oh, great! get rid of clone jumps, modules autorepeat, market search and autopilot. cause they may be a source of problems. since it affects everyone, you will loose nothing. great thinking einstein. Originally by: b1zz My point is if you allow one skill queue, why not 2, or 3 or 4. Where does it end and where does it start? Why is one skill queue okay but not 2 skill queues? no, you understood nothing at all. only 1 skill queue is needed. only one. enough to get by unexpected server downtimes. that is all. we wont ask for a second skill. we pay for training time. that is why we can not grind skill points. there is nothing we can do to accelerate training time actively. it is balanced because we train offline too. and we pay for it. thus, we are right on asking for a feature that saves us from loosing money when something goes wrong on the server. only 1 skill. more is not needed at all. and let the queue go inactive when the account is inactive too.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.01.11 10:35:00 - [359] Originally by: Sue Mee no, you understood nothing at all. only 1 skill queue is needed. only one. enough to get by unexpected server downtimes. that is all. we wont ask for a second skill. we pay for training time. that is why we can not grind skill points. there is nothing we can do to accelerate training time actively. it is balanced because we train offline too. and we pay for it. thus, we are right on asking for a feature that saves us from loosing money when something goes wrong on the server. only 1 skill. more is not needed at all. and let the queue go inactive when the account is inactive too. THIS is the quintessence of the whole issue !!!! EXACTLY this is the reason we need a 1 Skill-Queue Greetings Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Johnnie Procyon	Posted - 2008.01.11 10:51:00 - [360] Originally by: b1zz 4. Reasonable people with balanced life. Good job that they like, and a loving family, that don't care if they miss a few hours training because this is just a game. It doesn't sound like 1 skill queue is going to help you, you'd still be addicted. You need to let go. You're a rare type of player, b1zz. I daresay a very mature one. I have been playing for several months now (but under a year) and losing a bit of time to skill training has never been a crisis. In fact I have difficulty applying such a word to anything that happens inside a game. However I'd support a limited 'backup' skill activation, perhaps with a total running time of no more than a couple of hours. Just enough to bridge the inconvenient gaps that crop up fairly frequently. After the running time has run out, the character of course going back to 'No Skill in Training' status.

Lais Eron	Posted - 2008.01.11 12:03:00 - [361] I get slightly annoyed every time I miss skill training. Achievement is important to me as far as my enjoyment of games goes. I understand that not everyone cares to achieve, some people play to socialize or to role play, or do whatever else. I would not call either approach more mature than the other. It is just that people are different and have different goals in game and some are more focused on leveling up than others. With other games where skill training progresses according to what you do at least I did not feel forced to log on to level myself up. In EVE I have to log on at specific times throughout the day in order to level up according to game mechanics. This I do not like and thus I support a one skill queue because it would give me more freedom. I should be able to log in when I want - not when the game wants. CCP please give us a 1-skill queue!
b1zz	Posted - 2008.01.12 10:25:00 - [362] Originally by: Johnnie Procyon However I'd support a limited 'backup' skill activation, perhaps with a total running time of no more than a couple of hours. Just enough to bridge the inconvenient gaps that crop up fairly frequently. After the running time has run out, the character of course going back to 'No Skill in Training' status. Well, I can't say I've ever been affected by any unexpected downtimes in the time I've been playing. There was that one 4 hour extended downtime shortly after Trinity was released, but that did not affect me because I always set long training skills between playing sessions. Maybe that's why I'm not quick to encourage the addition of another addendum rule to a system that, for me anyway, works fine in its vanilla form. The only time I've lost training time is when I've been afk and just forgotten to get back to the keyboard by a certain time, and in these instances it's been my own fault and I would not expect any assistance from CCP. You guys are making it sound like these unexpected downtimes are happening every second day but that's not my experience. Have I just been lucky to start playing in a period when everything was running smoothly? If they do add a skill queue I hope it's an in-game skill of advanced level.
Epicurean Ian	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:53:00 - [363] Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 21/06/2007 09:13:33 I wouldn't mind a queue for the next skill only to automatically start training, just so we don't have to lose time or switch to another halfway because a skill will complete during downtime or when we're not home. We would still be required to log in for every skill to put next in the queue, but it'd be at a time that's convenient, and not whenever the timer happens to run out. Simply put, agreed.
Andre Coeurl Gallente TOHA Heavy Industries Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.01.14 18:49:00 - [364] Originally by: b1zz Originally by: Johnnie Procyon However I'd support a limited 'backup' skill activation, perhaps with a total running time of no more than a couple of hours. Just enough to bridge the inconvenient gaps that crop up fairly frequently. After the running time has run out, the character of course going back to 'No Skill in Training' status. Well, I can't say I've ever been affected by any unexpected downtimes in the time I've been playing. There was that one 4 hour extended downtime shortly after Trinity was released, but that did not affect me because I always set long training skills between playing sessions. Maybe that's why I'm not quick to encourage the addition of another addendum rule to a system that, for me anyway, works fine in its vanilla form. The only time I've lost training time is when I've been afk and just forgotten to get back to the keyboard by a certain time, and in these instances it's been my own fault and I would not expect any assistance from CCP. You guys are making it sound like these unexpected downtimes are happening every second day but that's not my experience. Have I just been lucky to start playing in a period when everything was running smoothly? If they do add a skill queue I hope it's an in-game skill of advanced level. b1zz I have indeed to say I'm sorry because I have gone a little too "far" in my reply to you, honestly it was a kind of reaction to the arguments you gave which seemed a bit "pretestuous" to me. Since you're fairly new to the game (in my POV at least, 2 months are a relatively short time in EVE, since I consider myself still a nOOb in most fields) you may have indeed "missed" some periods in which unexpected downtimes were a bit too frequent, and many ppl (me among them) lost more than a few hours training time because of that. Maybe the point you got wrong here is that the damage caused by an unexpected server crash is NOT the same for all players, since some will be hitten heavily, others less, others not at all. That's because when you log in to play, you may switch on to a short time skill to train in the meanwhile, and if the server unexpectedly and without previous warnings crashes then, your training stops. As well, that will damage all the players who need to log later to change a skill which have finished training in the meanwhile, they will be unable to launch a new skill. Players who have a long skill going on the other hand will get unaffected by this, so as you see the problem is not "democratic" at all, even if it's just chance-based. The other fact is, if you have the time to log on as soon as the server goes up again (sometimes it has been several hours later) you just miss that time, otherwise, if it's late night or if you have RL issues, you are going to log maybe one day later, maybe much more, so this can be quite an upsetting thing for a paying customer of course. I sincerely hope my explanation will be useful to show my POV on the issue, it's not like me and many others want a fancy new feature, we just want an emergency "parachute", meant for a limited purpose, no more and not to be expanded in the future at all, because that would make it a "feature", and we don't mean it that way! --- --- --- Trinity: best content release ever, totally obscured by the worst nerf ever
NyarghNia	Posted - 2008.01.14 23:48:00 - [365] I have to speak as a new player here. As someone who has spent a long time playing (and still does play) World of Warcraft, I have to admit that I REALLY REALLY LIKE the skill system here in EVE!! If you want mind-numbing booring, try levelling up fishing in WoW, standing there for hours and hours one end mashing two keys, or making 5000 pairs of pants to level up tailoring... yech. Seriously, nothing is worse than skill grinding. Toon farming would be rife if you could set long queues of skills, people would open up dozens of accounts, wait 6 months, then EBay em for a very nice profit! But, a skill queue would be VERY nice for those who are still participating, but will be AFK for some time (ie those in defence forces). How about a paid service? Ie, you pay a nominal fee depending on the length of the time you want queues skills to be used, also only allow training if account is paid up. Put an upper limit on it and maybe that would be a nice compromise?
Leora Nomen Amarr	Posted - 2008.01.15 01:16:00 - [366] Edited by: Leora Nomen on 15/01/2008 01:16:08 Originally by: NyarghNia Toon farming would be rife if you could set long queues of skills, people would open up dozens of accounts, wait 6 months, then EBay em for a very nice profit! read the rest of the thread - it has already been covered that it's not going to happen in short: it is not like farmers cannot farm characters already, but they don't do it because it is hardly as profitable for them to farm characters as compared to farming ISK - the profit per character that you would make per month is miserable compared to how much ISK they farm from game's resources, and demand is low guide to game time codes
Saarjuk Khan Caldari Incoherent Inc Otaku Invasion	Posted - 2008.01.16 15:51:00 - [367] Originally by: Steyr Daghan /thread This thread is an epic fail for reasons that have been mentioned already. CCP: Skill system is fine. Queue would do more harm than good. Don't listen to the whiners. This answer sounds like a frustrated long time player, that would hate to see the queue because he always wanted it when he had 1hour skills to train. but now is stuck at skills that take 30+days so he doesnt bother anymore =) hands Steyr a kleenex Anger is a Gift
Ines Sastre	Posted - 2008.01.17 18:08:00 - [368] just a few hours ago we suffered another unexpected and unscheduled problem, which is causing me more than 4 hours of training. and i am sure many more people are also affected. please, some of the intelligent players saying we dont need a queue tell me how to not loose training time when CCP fails at patching.
Lara Muklach	Posted - 2008.01.18 11:47:00 - [369] Ladies and Gents boys and Girls, I dont often reply to forum threads. I'm a fan of watching from the sidelines silently cheering, but not getting into the game of forum trolling. This topic however has peaked my intrest enough to put forward my 2c worth. There has been alot said on this topic from Char farmers, to people being too lazy to log in to change skills, to people being way too busy to log in to change a skill every few days. I dont really want to drag up all this stuff again, but as I said, I want to have my say on the topic. Having a skill cueing system removes the effort required to build a character from Noob ship to Shrike. To build a toon to a carrier/jump freighter/Rorqual level takes time, and the ability to plan your skill training. If you can cue skills, how easy does the skill training in this game become? It's easy enough as it is. If you work, have a family, have another hobby/wife/mistress that prevents you from changing a skill at the required time, good. It shows you have an interest outside a computer game and the time you invest in that will bring you more pleasure/payback and reward than playing this MMO ever will. You have also probably learned by now to plan your skill training so you always have long skills available for when you are away. I know I have. To everyone else, I like this game. Please dont try and push for a system that removes the only reason why char farmers aren't (more) rife. And more importantly, I enjoy the challange of planning my skills around when I can be online. If you don't or you can't, then maybe a game where you only advance when you are online is more suited to your lifestyle. Oh, and as for Technical issues, you win some and lose some. Take the times when the cluster is up 30 mins to half a day earler than scheduled as payback for the time you lose once in a blue moon (in my experience, latley) when we lose the server. I have a pretty thick skin to, so flame away. It's my opinion, what I think/feel on the subject. if you disagree, thats awesome. I love a good (rational) debate from time to time!!
Aphrodite Whiterose Amarr Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.01.18 12:07:00 - [370] I think having a queuing system would be good as long as you can only train for a paid account. As for farmers theres nothing really stopping them from just changing skills manually as it is atm anyway so i dont think thats too much of an issue. Alternatively being able to swtich skills from the EVE-Online.com webstite would be good as people can access a website from a lot more places than they can access the actual game and then manually switch it to a different skill via your account on the website. ----------------------------------------------- Amarr - Playing EVE in Hardcore Mode since 2007

Panch0Villa Caldari	Posted - 2008.01.18 18:11:00 - [371] Come on CCP! Plz w/ cherry on top! I need to set my skills to train that 2H 13M 10S skill and then move on to Cruiser V omw out the door. Surely if CCP didn't work @ Eve, they'd know this was inconvenient. I have school and work, 2 hr and .5 hr window during weekdays to change skills, 16 hours apart. I can only work these skills on weekends, but I pay to use Eve every single day Surely it's not too much to ask
Pearljammer 5657	Posted - 2008.01.19 12:04:00 - [372] Hi, everyone, im brand new to Eve, this is my first MMO. I love it and I love the skill system, eventually ill be training level 5 learning will take about 7 days where im at now, but still working on focus. Im training this skill gives me time off from this very addictive game, I used to play poker at the casinos all the time my last day at the casino was my first day on Eve. Skills that take days will get me away from my pc, hang out with the GF, see my friends. I feel all for who cant always login, because you need that certain level to use whatever!! Train the long skill, if youre away from PC you will have learning 5,etc eventually. I just wanted to put my 2 cents in, from a MMo rookie. Eve rocks.
Mr Azrael	Posted - 2008.01.20 09:44:00 - [373] All for it Should've been implemented long time ago Read all 13 pages of this thread and really haven't heard any good argument against it. Part from 'I play this game this way so everyone should play eve this way'. Sad But go CCP give me the queue thingy!
Aindrias Amarr Labteck Corporation LTD. Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2008.01.20 10:30:00 - [374] My thought on queues is this and I dunno if this has been suggested in the previous 13 pages, but here I go. You may set one skill in the queue. If you forget to queue a skill, it will go to the next level of the the skill you are currently training, if you just finished a lvl 5 skill, it will jump to the next skill in the list that isn't lvl 5 and begin training that. With this, you will be able to have some Queue Control (tm), let people be lazy and forget (but not necessarily train what YOU want next) but miss out on ANY training.
The Rain	Posted - 2008.01.20 16:25:00 - [375] And what do the people who can switch skills on time get? (Hint: it rhymes with "nothing"). Just like any other game, if you can't make time for it you don't receive the in-game rewards whether it's better items, more money, or higher skills. Also, in case the readers haven't noticed, this thread was started in June of '07 and is only one of the more recent ones on this topic. The people at CCP are well aware of the idea of a skill queuing system, have weighed its pros and cons, and decided long ago that it is not a desirable game mechanic. I'm not saying they always choose the right ways to go. What I am saying is that if skill queuing was going to be in the game, it already would be.
Sedontane	Posted - 2008.01.20 16:39:00 - [376] Edited by: Sedontane on 20/01/2008 16:39:13 EVEMon + Logitech G15 = Easy skill tracker w/o logins Problem sorted now you cant forget that that skill is on and will end in 25s . . . 23s . . . Ok I will login and change it cya o7 EDIT: spelling correction
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.01.20 18:50:00 - [377] Originally by: Sedontane Edited by: Sedontane on 20/01/2008 16:39:13 EVEMon + Logitech G15 = Easy skill tracker w/o logins Problem sorted now you cant forget that that skill is on and will end in 25s . . . 23s . . . Ok I will login and change it cya o7 EDIT: spelling correction So you have your G15 with you all the time (work and whereever? ) and you can loggin with only the G15 then? Oh wait CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.01.20 18:53:00 - [378] Originally by: The Rain And what do the people who can switch skills on time get? (Hint: it rhymes with "nothing"). Just like any other game, if you can't make time for it you don't receive the in-game rewards whether it's better items, more money, or higher skills. Wrong You ever compared mmo systems carefully? With this system its a MUST to skill ALL time... Also, in case the readers haven't noticed, this thread was started in June of '07 and is only one of the more recent ones on this topic. The people at CCP are well aware of the idea of a skill queuing system, have weighed its pros and cons, and decided long ago that it is not a desirable game mechanic. I'm not saying they always choose the right ways to go. What I am saying is that if skill queuing was going to be in the game, it already would be. The take it off the f.... drawing board for Christ Sakes ! CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
RIP Wash	Posted - 2008.01.20 19:14:00 - [379] X me up for this. I like this idea, If I'm paying the fee but cant log in for some reason let me keep training.
Xydros	Posted - 2008.01.20 20:09:00 - [380] I'm for the queuing 1 skill idea. Okay, I am a sub 2 million SP Pilot. I started playing Eve to hang out with some friends in a very, very small corp that is more concerned with the consumption of beer than doing any serious playing :) The skill system is an interesting concept, it kills the normal grind present in normal MMOs, but it instead has its own strengths (and weaknesses). The biggest one I see is the fact that I have to be online the minute a skill ends. Now I know some pilot when 5 million plus skill points is going to come out and call me a newb, but ultimately a company needs to balance pleasing the hardcore crowd with keeping their game accessible to noob pilots like me. I know this is a huge sin on these boards, but you know why WoW is the most popular MMO in the world? It's the most polished. It took everything every other MMO before it did well and improved on it and made it better. Now, Eve is a pretty decent game in some ways its the best MMO I've ever played (I've played every major MMO starting with UO) but in others its just bad. The game isn't well explained (the tutorial explains almost nothing and the newb help chat is a spam fest I never was able to get anything answered in there) and the interface isn't very polished. Most MMO players don't like having to log on at a certain time of day to do something, having to do that to continue leveling something you have to do is very, detrimental to Eve's growth. Allowing a single skill to queue would help to eliminate this and would fix the number one compliant about the game I've heard from most of the people Ive talked to (ignoring whining to nerf ship x or buff ship y of course :p). The OMG what about the account farmers argument is stupid. If you consider I can run 3 instances of the new engine with everything on high with a web browser and music player going, imagine what a 2-3 man isk farmer team (24 hours round the clock) could do considering how "macro" friendly mining is. They are probably already farming on the accounts they are planning to sell anyway. As they are online 24/7 anyway any kind of queuing system wouldn't benefit them.

Ceseuron PRIMOS LOCOS The Red Skull	Posted - 2008.01.20 21:49:00 - [381] This morning I logged in at 5am PST-ish and noted over 30,000 players online. Assuming that the average monthly rate for all these players is about $13 a month, and assuming within a months time the average active user base with paying accounts in the game is 30,000 you wind up with about $400K in gross monthly income. The point? CCP isn't going to implement something that even remotely stands to interfere with the continued income from it's player base. If you log in and realize you forgot to set skill training, that time you lost translates into more time you have to stay subscribed to train that skill to completion. And that means more money you put into their coffers. Odds are good that CCP actually wants you to forget to cycle skill training from time to time. I'm sure CCP and a number of players want you to believe that the lack of common-sense implementations like the skill queue system, or even (mums the word) a respecialization system, is intended to prevent ISK farmers and character farmers from being able to peddle their ill-gotten gains for real-world money. The reality of the situation is that a skill queue system will never be implemented. Not because it's a bad idea, or because of any real concern over the ISK or charcater farmer. It's just not a good idea from an economical standpoint. Why do you think they stopped allowing skills to continue training on an account with an expired subscription?
Dimagus	Posted - 2008.01.20 23:32:00 - [382] ^^^ Your argument is that people will delay canceling subscription just to finish a skill because they had time wasted? Stop. Panic. Your common sense is failing. Players aren't going to pay for some extra months to get their characters to where they already should be, then mysteriously stop playing afterwards. The decision to quit will be made, and the payment will cease right then and there. The lack of accessibility and convenience in skill training is a factor that encourages players to quit sooner, and thus cost CCP money.
Ceseuron PRIMOS LOCOS The Red Skull	Posted - 2008.01.21 00:08:00 - [383] Originally by: Dimagus The lack of accessibility and convenience in skill training is a factor that encourages players to quit sooner, and thus cost CCP money. And yet, at the times I log in, there's not less than 20,000 people online. One or two or even a hundred people quitting the game over a lack of an out of game skill management feature isn't going to cause a notable impact on their income. And no, as much as the perceived veil of anonymity of the Internet compels you to cast lame insults at me, my common sense is just fine. Clearly you misunderstood my original post as I did state that I agree with the implementation of such a feature. It's just not going to happen. Allowing people to get closer to the top faster and more efficiently will also cost CCP money as people will simply cancel subscriptions out of boredom.
Dimagus	Posted - 2008.01.21 01:39:00 - [384] I see what you did there. Well played distractionary measure sir, most people will never notice.
Agif Templar Republic R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.01.23 00:13:00 - [385] as long as the skill didn't exceed 24hrs and was a backup skill encase your primary skill ended. Also in case the server go's down unexpectedly and doesn't come up before you have to bail out the door to work or whatever then the secondary skill would start. meh just a thought. /agif --------------- EvEmissions - Level 5 Missions - Updated 22/01/08
Kyra Felann Gallente Elite Storm Enterprises	Posted - 2008.01.23 17:16:00 - [386] Originally by: NyarghNia Toon farming would be rife if you could set long queues of skills, people would open up dozens of accounts, wait 6 months, then EBay em for a very nice profit! BTW, this game doesn't have "toons".
Turlin	Posted - 2008.01.24 10:41:00 - [387] A skill queue would be a boon to the new and intermediate player. However, it would need to be skillfully done so that it can not be used to go past the limits of what can be done currently without it. As it stands if you cancel your subscription the current skill will finish no matter what. Here is the best way I can of to implement the system so that it is used a gift to players with an active subscription or regular use of time cards. Eligibility for use: 1)Currently active subscription to the game. If you account is set to cancel then you will lose the use of the skill queue. People that use Game Time Cards will be put into pend cancel if their time is 5 days away from ending with no new additional time added. 2)Accounts must have at least 1 paid month on their account before the skill queue becomes available. Skill queue is not usable during the trial or first 30 days that come with the game. Here is how the skill queue will work. 1)The queue can queue up 24 hours worth of skills or a single multi-day skill. If you start a multi-day skill you will not be able to add additional skills until it is under 24 hours worth of time. Once under that 24 hours you can add additional skills so long as their combined total is not over 24 hours or a single multi-day skill to the queue. 2)Any skill rank or level can be added so long as all requirements for the skill to be trained are completed before the skill is to start training. 3)If at anytime you account enters pending cancel the queue will shutdown and the current skill will finish training with no other skills being started. 4)When an account enters active status again the queue will NOT automatically restart. The player will have to re-enter the game and setup the skills again. The way I have setup how the queue will work it will allow both veterans and new players alike to maximize it's usefulness. The point of the queue is not be able to train a lot of skills back to back without interacting in the game but rather to prevent loss of time due Real Life not allowing one to get into the game.
Pontet Canet Amarr en primeur	Posted - 2008.01.24 10:45:00 - [388] **** happens. I don't like the idea of a queue.
Liu	Posted - 2008.01.24 11:55:00 - [389] Originally by: Pontet Canet ** happens. I don't like the idea of a queue. what's wrong with a 1-skill queue that only works if the account is active? Originally by:** Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Ixiel	Posted - 2008.01.24 20:46:00 - [390] Heh, the real problem: Escalation. People have been whining about this for ages; if they grant it what'll folks whine about next that'll seem like a travesty they don't have it in a few years? The functional upshot is pretty minimal when you think about it unless you're looking to have a higher coolness score than the guy next to you. Even then, that's a fixed sum endeavor. You won't gain unless the rest of folks lose, and the guy than whom you want to be cooler will get a queuer too. If they put it in I'll use it, but losing an hour or so between skills isn't going to decide the battle. Oh and don't get me wrong: Nothing in this post should change what side someone's on. If the ancient skill queue war distracts the demos from interfering with stuff they can't understand but actually can change I say let the war continue. Ix

RedLion Caldari Polaris Project Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.01.27 11:26:00 - [391] I support this queueing system! The way it is now, without web support is ******ingly lame. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Andre Coeurl Gallente TOHA Heavy Industries Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.02.01 19:49:00 - [392] I have just realised that there's a big misunderstanding at the basis of all the discussion here. We should absolutely separate the concept of "emergency skill" from the "skill queue" one. What most of the experienced and sensible players would like is the first, an emergency skill to be set ONLY for the case in which a skill finishes its training while or short before the server goes down for any unscheduled reasons. That's all. One skill to be set as a "parachute" to avoid a failure on the game provider side to affect a paying customer right to train his skills. What someone is asking on the other side, the "skill queue" system, is completely different and it's not something me and I guess most of the abovementioned players would like. We don't want to change the skill mechanics, they're fine as they are. We just want a feature to cover up emergencies, simple as that, since no-one is perfect and servers aren't perfect too, but that doesn't mean we have to pay for failures if that could be avoided so easily! --- --- --- Trinity: best content release ever, totally obscured by the worst nerf ever
Dimagus	Posted - 2008.02.02 02:20:00 - [393] Such an "emergency skill" represents a position of self-guilt. The basis is that CCP would be absolved of all responsibility and reliability of the server and all blame is placed squarely on the players. Neither the player, CCP, nor your ISP is the guilty party. The skill interface is the problem, since it requires a) player availability at an exact time, b) server availability at that exact time, c) internet availability at that exact time, d) computer access with full EVE client install, e) no log-in queue or lag preventing in-game actions. The ideal system provides methods to supercede any potential problems. A Web-browser skill interface addresses most but not all of the issues, but a skill queue provides a backup for all.
Brother Welcome	Posted - 2008.02.04 17:45:00 - [394] Originally by: Bahk Naar The arguments of "character farming" are completely ridiculous. That would ONLY be true if the system were designed by a complete moron. Being able to queue up 1 SKILL would not create a mass influx of character farmers. Nor would it be the "easy button" for selling toons on ebay. The only thing this would do is GREATLY ENHANCE THE PLAYER EXPERIENCE FOR EVERYONE and it would do so at virtually no risk. It's honestly ridiculous that this hasn't been done. The only reasons I can see for this not being done are either: - Fussing over different options and not being able to actually decide what's "best" (in which case, pick something and test it) or - Devs are completely put off by what are completely erroneous risks Either way, I think this should be prioritized. In a persistent game world with a training system such as this, queuing up 1 skill seems like a beyond reasonable thing to implement.... even an expected thing to have. I love eve and am quite happy with the game, but I have yet to hear a convincing argument as to why this isn't done. The "character farming" argument is just silly. The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. As you say, it's obvious that it would be easy to implement a 'live account' test for training, so there really is no other reason. IMEO it is simply a bad design call for a metagame reason that isn't justified. Make game fun. Do not make players login for dumb reasons. TYVM
Brother Welcome	Posted - 2008.02.04 18:10:00 - [395] Originally by: Brother Welcome The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. As you say, it's obvious that it would be easy to implement a 'live account' test for training, so there really is no other reason. IMEO it is simply a bad design call for a metagame reason that isn't justified. Make game fun. Do not make players login for dumb reasons. Exploring this further, I see some people feel that you are 'lazy' if you don't like logging in. Sorry, is this a game or have I accidentally signed up for more work after my work? Anyway, I feel sure that isn't CCP's reason for not having a queue. Others suggest CCP want some amount of inefficiency in training. I feel that's specious. If they wanted you to train slower they'd just change the SP income rates. Still others talk about skills training on unpaid accounts. That again can't be CCP's reason. They aren't technically inadequate. Testing for live accounts is trivial. So that leaves a simple desire to make you login often. When you login, maybe sometimes you notice something else you want to do, or anyway you get to see how your character is doing, so you develop more attachment to Eve. From the point of view of other players it makes the world feel more alive to see it more populated. They might spot a friend and have a quick chat. Therefore I posit that the answer rests squarely on metagame reasoning. Personally, as intimated above, I feel that reasoning is a bit shoddy. However, I can't necessarily say that it is incorrect. It may very well be that it is best for the game to force frequent logins. If so, you might as well forget about getting a queue.
DitchDigger	Posted - 2008.02.05 00:21:00 - [396] Here's some thoughts on the matter: I like the strategy of the skill system - its interesting. It requires the player to make hard, irreversible decisions. It makes you balance specialization vs utility. Theres also a certain strategy in the timing. Yea, sometimes I'm not sure if I'll be playing in 6-8-15 hours from now, so I have to choose between that 8 hour skill that I really want and that 2 day skill that I'm not as interested in. That's part of the strategic options. I wouldn't want to take that away. Adding the ability to create an endless queue of skills would water down the skill system, thus catering the game to the lowest common denominator. I don't think anyone actually wants that. A good game will reward those players who are better at the game. I'd like to think that if I plan my skills intelligently that I can make a better character then a player who is not as smart about it. Sometimes, the best choice at 10:30 PM is to go with the 9 hour skill. This means that, if I want to make my character the best, I have to log in in the morning before I go to work. I've done this sometimes, but I didn't like it. It feels too much like I'm being rewarded for wrapping my life around the game instead of beeing rewarded for playing the game well. Also, sometimes there just aren't any good options. Sometimes the server goes down, or you just arent around to log in. There ought to be some kind of minimal 'safety net' that can be utilized for unforseen situations, or just situations where other priorities take precedence. Here's what I suggest. Each month, each account gets 24 hours of 'backup training time'. This means that when your character finishes a skill, it automatically goes into either 1: the next level up in that skill if another level is available, or 2: a preselected backup skill. Time spent training in this backup accrues against your 24 hours. If you don't manage your backup time well and run out before the month is up and then finish a skill, then your out of luck - should have planned better. This would take the edge off of having to log in at odd hours while still maintaining the strategic decision making process.
faxtarious Kai-Zen inc.	Posted - 2008.02.06 01:24:00 - [397] How casual must you be to need a skill que ??? I'm a casual player...and I log every now and then to fix my skills....It doesn't even bother anything...unless you are away from your PC for weeks.... Oh crap...look at all the pages...
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.06 04:26:00 - [398] I think that being able to queue up 24 hours or so of skills would be fine. It wouldn't let people set up a massive 6-month-long queue and not log in, but it would have the benefit of letting a player get some fairly short skills out of the way without having to babysit them. They'd still have to log in every day if they queue up skills, and if they are training long skills, it would work the same way it does now. I know that I often can't spend that long playing some days and some skills that take a few hours, but less than overnight don't get trained as soon as they otherwise would. For long skills, a queue isn't needed--it's for the short skills. If I could just set up a string of short skills to train overnight while I sleep I'd be fully happy.
Liu	Posted - 2008.02.06 07:50:00 - [399] Originally by: Brother Welcome Originally by: Brother Welcome The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. As you say, it's obvious that it would be easy to implement a 'live account' test for training, so there really is no other reason. IMEO it is simply a bad design call for a metagame reason that isn't justified. Make game fun. Do not make players login for dumb reasons. Exploring this further, I see some people feel that you are 'lazy' if you don't like logging in. Sorry, is this a game or have I accidentally signed up for more work after my work? Anyway, I feel sure that isn't CCP's reason for not having a queue. Others suggest CCP want some amount of inefficiency in training. I feel that's specious. If they wanted you to train slower they'd just change the SP income rates. Still others talk about skills training on unpaid accounts. That again can't be CCP's reason. They aren't technically inadequate. Testing for live accounts is trivial. So that leaves a simple desire to make you login often. When you login, maybe sometimes you notice something else you want to do, or anyway you get to see how your character is doing, so you develop more attachment to Eve. From the point of view of other players it makes the world feel more alive to see it more populated. They might spot a friend and have a quick chat. Therefore I posit that the answer rests squarely on metagame reasoning. Personally, as intimated above, I feel that reasoning is a bit shoddy. However, I can't necessarily say that it is incorrect. It may very well be that it is best for the game to force frequent logins. If so, you might as well forget about getting a queue. your reasoning is quite on spot, but it has one very big flaw. only one. and it is that with a 1-skill-queue players would log in exactly as many times as now. thus, the metagaming reasons would still be covered. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Brother Welcome	Posted - 2008.02.06 17:52:00 - [400] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Brother Welcome The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. your reasoning is quite on spot, but it has one very big flaw. only one. and it is that with a 1-skill-queue players would log in exactly as many times as now. thus, the metagaming reasons would still be covered. I like your argument, but I feel it needs to be taken even further. It seems to me that a 1-day queue is similar in certain instances to no queue at all. For example, you are training Navigation 5 taking 5 days. Isn't that the same as having one 2.5 day skill training and another on the queue? You still hit a training stop in 5 days time. A 1 day buffer is similar to the above, except it has the benefit of making the minimum time between logins >1 day, which may be a more comfortable match with the vagaries of reality. If you wanted to get super-sophisticated, it could be based on clone level. There is even a line of reasoning for having a finite lenght queue divorced from skill training times altogether, but I'm sure we don't want to go there...

Endless Wrath	Posted - 2008.02.06 19:58:00 - [401] I don't want a skill queue, I just want the ability to remotely log in and tell the system what skill to train next. It's not about being lazy, it's about having to spend an extra hour on EVEMon to make sure that each training period ends at a time that I am available to start the next skill training. Oh, that skill will finish at 4:30am, guess I better set me alarm, oh, another will finish at 2:30pm on a Monday, too bad for me, I'll be at work and will miss 4 solid hours that could have been spend training.
Buyerr	Posted - 2008.02.06 23:58:00 - [402] skill queue signet I declare war on stupidity
Buyerr	Posted - 2008.02.07 00:15:00 - [403] Originally by: Brother Welcome Originally by: Brother Welcome So that leaves a simple desire to make you login often. When you login, maybe sometimes you notice something else you want to do, or anyway you get to see how your character is doing, so you develop more attachment to Eve. From the point of view of other players it makes the world feel more alive to see it more populated. They might spot a friend and have a quick chat. Therefore I posit that the answer rests squarely on metagame reasoning. Personally, as intimated above, I feel that reasoning is a bit shoddy. However, I can't necessarily say that it is incorrect. It may very well be that it is best for the game to force frequent logins. If so, you might as well forget about getting a queue. yer or they do like me, i have 4 hours of my skill left i REALLY wanted this skill to be done (since it have been going for 10days +-) and now i have to change it to something else because i need to go to sleep which is VERY annoying since i wanted it done but don't want to lose training tike or **** up my sleep by waking in the middle of the night.. so this is what i do "i get very annoyed, log on, get more annoyed for having to do that now when i don't feel like getting into the game, gets even more annoyed thinking about how ridicules and pointless it is that there is no queue and that it can only be to annoy the users since that is what it does and every other issue is easy to fix" and this is just one time.. so after i have had to do this a ton of time and more when i forget to do it because of some rl impotent stuff that comes up, i get even MORE annoyed since i am coming home thinking that NOW i just have to enjoy myself, to find that yet another x-hour/days have been lost because of stupid design with no other purpose then to annoy the players that pays to have fun... seriously it is one of the most annoying factors in eve... (although lately it's not that bad since all skills now is a few days to finish soo quite relaxing " I declare war on stupidity
Kasalon	Posted - 2008.02.07 01:33:00 - [404] I am a hardcore gamer but I actually do have a life beyond the computer. I read over some of the previous posts and it seems to me that the voices people who are tired of wasting precious training time are drowned out by the voices of those who don't want to be able to skill up faster or just don't care for the benefit of the majority. It would benefit the players to create a short queue of say three to five skills but only characters with an active subscription would be able to train. This would encourage people like myself to pay for a subscription instead of creating a trial every few months. The up side is more players would pay to play, the down side, character farmers would have an easier time skilling. But perhaps this is a neccessary evil to encourage more ppl to subscribe. I think Eve has some real potential if the wrinkles can be ironed out in a reasonable fashion. I would still prefer WOW over Eve for ease of leveling and I would definatly subscribe to Eve if skilling was made easier one way or another. But I'm just one tiny voice. I mean, how many ppl will actually read this post? Probably not very many.
Liu	Posted - 2008.02.07 07:51:00 - [405] Originally by: Brother Welcome Originally by: Liu Originally by: Brother Welcome The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. your reasoning is quite on spot, but it has one very big flaw. only one. and it is that with a 1-skill-queue players would log in exactly as many times as now. thus, the metagaming reasons would still be covered. I like your argument, but I feel it needs to be taken even further. It seems to me that a 1-day queue is similar in certain instances to no queue at all. For example, you are training Navigation 5 taking 5 days. Isn't that the same as having one 2.5 day skill training and another on the queue? You still hit a training stop in 5 days time. i dont really understand your logic. lets say you are training Navigation 5, which takes 5 days and is ending on monday 03.27 AM. with no queue, you would have to either change to another skill before it is completed, loose 3-5 hours of training or wake up on the middle of the night to change the skill. with a 1-skill queue you could add Acceleration Control 3 to the queue, which takes 6 hours, so that when you wake up Monday morning you have trained Navigation 5 and 80% of Acceleration Control 3. then you log in and set another skill to the queue (Scout Drones 4) for when Acceleration Control 3 finish. Before Scout Drones 4 ends you log in again and set another skill on the queue, etc, etc, etc. conclusion: players log in exactly as many times as with no queue but the possibility of loosing training time for server dowtimes or real life strikes is severely minimized. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
ChudyPL Gallente MegaTech Enterprises Sempiternus	Posted - 2008.02.07 11:57:00 - [406] Edited by: ChudyPL on 07/02/2008 11:58:51 Edited by: ChudyPL on 07/02/2008 11:58:29 Originally by: Kasalon I am a hardcore gamer but I actually do have a life beyond the computer. I read over some of the previous posts and it seems to me that the voices people who are tired of wasting precious training time are drowned out by the voices of those who don't want to be able to skill up faster or just don't care for the benefit of the majority. It would benefit the players to create a short queue of say three to five skills but only characters with an active subscription would be able to train. This would encourage people like myself to pay for a subscription instead of creating a trial every few months. The up side is more players would pay to play, the down side, character farmers would have an easier time skilling. But perhaps this is a neccessary evil to encourage more ppl to subscribe. I think Eve has some real potential if the wrinkles can be ironed out in a reasonable fashion. I would still prefer WOW over Eve for ease of leveling and I would definatly subscribe to Eve if skilling was made easier one way or another. But I'm just one tiny voice. I mean, how many ppl will actually read this post? Probably not very many. My suggestion is: Queue for no more than 3 skills OR web access to Training Progam. Why? Every day I've work. My work is 24/7. At work I can't use EVE and some of my shifts are 12 hours. Actually I prefer web access than inside-game queue. ===================================================================================================================================== ================================================ Miner MegaTech Enterprises Corporation
Saerdna16ID Gallente 16th Interspacial Dynasty	Posted - 2008.02.07 12:06:00 - [407] Actually web access to the skills is fine.
Brother Welcome	Posted - 2008.02.07 13:26:00 - [408] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Brother Welcome Originally by: Liu Originally by: Brother Welcome The reason for no queue is to force logins so the world feels active. your reasoning is quite on spot, but it has one very big flaw. only one. and it is that with a 1-skill-queue players would log in exactly as many times as now. thus, the metagaming reasons would still be covered. I like your argument, but I feel it needs to be taken even further. It seems to me that a 1-day queue is similar in certain instances to no queue at all. For example, you are training Navigation 5 taking 5 days. Isn't that the same as having one 2.5 day skill training and another on the queue? You still hit a training stop in 5 days time. i dont really understand your logic. lets say you are training Navigation 5, which takes 5 days and is ending on monday 03.27 AM. with no queue, you would have to either change to another skill before it is completed, loose 3-5 hours of training or wake up on the middle of the night to change the skill. with a 1-skill queue you could add Acceleration Control 3 to the queue, which takes 6 hours, so that when you wake up Monday morning you have trained Navigation 5 and 80% of Acceleration Control 3. then you log in and set another skill to the queue (Scout Drones 4) for when Acceleration Control 3 finish. Before Scout Drones 4 ends you log in again and set another skill on the queue, etc, etc, etc. conclusion: players log in exactly as many times as with no queue but the possibility of loosing training time for server dowtimes or real life strikes is severely minimized. I explained badly. I meant that if the queue accepts any finite number of skills, then at the end of the last skill you have to log in. That means two short skills (N+N) has the same login demand as one long one (2N). In either case you can choose skills to ensure they end when it best suits you, unless you have zero multiple day skills to train. I don't think that happens even from start. So what is really needed is just a buffer to accomodate RL. To my mind that buffer is better expressed in amount of time than in number of skills. Is that clearer?
ChudyPL Gallente MegaTech Enterprises Sempiternus	Posted - 2008.02.07 13:27:00 - [409] Originally by: Saerdna16ID Actually web access to the skills is fine. I think about possibility to get access for training skills, not only to view them. ================================================ Vexilla Regis Prodeunt Inferni!!!
Max Essen Gallente Serenity Engineering and Transport Company deadspace society	Posted - 2008.02.07 22:00:00 - [410] I've been reading this thread for quite some time and I even posted in favor of a "Skill Que" back a while ago. I now completely retract that. My favor for a que system was mostly confined to a web version as I travel quite extensively for work and can't always get a decent hotel connection for playing. I made these statements while I was a new player to Eve. It is now obvious that this is not, and has not been a real factor in keeping my skill training moving forward without interruption as it has been quite easy to set one of those Level V skills to work that more than covers my travels. For those who contend that it is inconvienient to have a skill end at an inopportune time, well ... I will swap to a skill that ends (or doesn't) and finish up the one I want while I am arround. I guess it comes down to prioritizing your time and skill and as I have been playing for a while now, it has become much easier. Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth. Real Men Structure-Tank

Saerdna16ID Gallente 16th Interspacial Dynasty	Posted - 2008.02.08 11:12:00 - [411] Originally by: ChudyPL Originally by: Saerdna16ID Actually web access to the skills is fine. I think about possibility to get access for training skills, not only to view them. That what I ment.
FullMetal Basilisk Minmatar Scum Sucking Pigs	Posted - 2008.02.14 23:35:00 - [412] It would be nice to queue TWO skills. eg. One active, One in queue. would be rather useful for those of us whom cannot afford to or cannot get access to Eve client program.
Vested Interest	Posted - 2008.02.15 03:40:00 - [413] I don't know if this has been suggested yet. What if they set it so you could train points by attribute and then apply them to skills as they accumulate? You could set one primary and one secondary attribute to train constantly and then apply the points to your skill of choice once you have enough saved up. This would let you train continuously, as long as your account was paid. You'd simply have to take care to not stick, say, Charisma as your primary training attribute for 6 months and forget about it.
Drake Ryder	Posted - 2008.02.15 14:44:00 - [414] I'm all for either web access to switch skills. If not, I'd like at least one backup skill after your current skill trains. Case in point: I set a skill to finish last night while I was sleeping and planned on getting up this morning before work and setting an 8-hour skill that would be done when I got home. For some stupid reason though, I miscalculated daily downtime (I've been away from EVE for awhile and forgot what time it was Eastern time) and was unable to set the skill I was wanting to finish before leaving the house. So now Drake is sitting in a station training absolutely NOTHING for the next 10 hours while I kick myself repeatedly in the groin for making such a stupid mistake. Had I access from this website or something else I could change it up here at work, or I could've set a backup skill just in case something dumb like this happens. I can't put the EVE client on any of the PC's here so I'm SoL I guess.
Zarunil Vaheet	Posted - 2008.02.17 01:33:00 - [415] I'm all for this, we need to be able to queue skills. If you need to limit it, that's fine, but we need some kind of queuing system in place. I'm surprised this hasn't happened yet.
Astria Tiphareth Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.17 14:54:00 - [416] Originally by: Connor Banks For you stupid ones who didn't understand me the first time: 1. Skill queing is for lazy people. 2. Skill queing will make non lazy people lazy. 3. Skill queing will make EVE lazy. 4. I don't like lazy people. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE. I know, I shouldn't flame, I know, but it really is so easy when people set themselves up for such big long falls... A translation, with spelling correction thrown in for free, of the above for those with some grey matter between the ears - 1. Skill queuing is for lazy people. Translation: I don't know what I'm talking about but I'm going to insult a load of people because I have nothing better to do. 2. Skill queuing will make non lazy people lazy. Translation: I'm going to continue talking rubbish and making huge sweeping generalisations about something I clearly know nothing about. 3. Skill queuing will make EVE lazy. Translation: I'm going to take two concepts I managed somehow to link above and extend the generalisation even further! 4. I don't like lazy people. Translation: I'm then going to throw in some pointless personal gripe as though I'm the world's most dedicated worker and that in fact, EVE is my second or third job. 5. I don't want EVE to become lazy. Translation: The only sensible comment in the post - sadly, totally lacking in reference to the topic of the thread, that of skill queuing. 6. I don't want skill queing in EVE. Translation: At last we reach a conclusion with no basis provided, but at least we get an opinion, finally. Seriously, what is this obsession with lazy = skill queue? People who are lazy are... shock horror! lazy! Whether you give them a tool to queue skills is totally irrelevant. There is also an enormous difference between lazy and casual. Someone who cannot play more than, say, 8 hours a week is far from lazy, they just have more important things to do, like say, work. Separately, people who are desiring a laidback, lazy if you will, approach to the game who might well spend 40 hours a week in the game but do little useful in that time will take it regardless of what you do or do not have in the game. Indeed the irony of this laziness argument is that it is fundamentally flawed at the dictionary definition level. People asking for a skill queue of some form on the basis of not being able to change skills at key times are by definition the complete opposite of lazy. They want not a minute, not a second of precious training time wasted (ok, I exaggerate, but you get the idea) and that places them squarely in the dedicated player camp. They want to become effective and valuable contributors to the game as quickly as possible, and bravo to them! The metagame issue of logins is actually moot - CCP are unlikely to have an obsession with people logging into the game to change skills, what they want is active players and that's an entirely different issue. Logging in to change skills helps no statistics and doesn't actually increase the likelihood of that person sticking around and actually playing. They'll stick around and play when they want to, and nothing in the world is going to change that. I'm a casual player, and I can cope just fine with the skills system the way it is, but I support the idea of a limited queue, with any needed caveats to avoid exploits. I don't really believe that character farming or trading would be that heavily affected - those that engage in it are already able to employ lots of people/bots to farm money, skills, etc. so at worst a queue makes their bottom line a bit lower, and I suspect in practice would make not a jot of difference. If a person can write a macro to mine in EVE, they can write a macro to automate skill training. Yes to at least a next skill. ___ "If you can't debate using logic & fact, and at least recognise other people's point of view, don't waste time posting on forums. It only makes you look like a teenage idiot."
Raven Jan	Posted - 2008.02.17 23:02:00 - [417] I agree with above post and quote by, Astria Tiphareth. The idea sounds good and would be good for new players to eve and old players as well that are unable to play as much as they would like, but to help them achieve their goals in regards to skill training. If it's a 24 hrs timer no more, which works in with downtimes, it will be fine in my eyes, as it keeps it far for all concerned. Long training skills well most people are able to quickly work out a 5 - 25 day skill in there heads from the day of training it and know when itÆs going to finish training or use eve-mon to help them remember. So a 24 hr queue between down times I think is fine to help train little skills from 1-3 which is quite helpful. If player go away on work or holidays most train a long skill they have to cover time away. We must remember that it is still our own responsibility to make sure when skills are going to be completed, not eve's and if a sever crush well its still our responsibility if we choose to use the skill queue or not, skill training time losses will always happen from down times sever crushes and real life But I vote yes to a 24hr queue
Astria Tiphareth Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.18 09:22:00 - [418] Originally by: Raven Jan I agree with above post and quote by, Astria Tiphareth. ... So a 24 hr queue between down times I think is fine to help train little skills from 1-3 which is quite helpful. If player go away on work or holidays most train a long skill they have to cover time away. ... We must remember that it is still our own responsibility to make sure when skills are going to be completed, not eve's and if a sever crush well its still our responsibility if we choose to use the skill queue or not, skill training time losses will always happen from down times sever crushes and real life Thanks for the support & mention, and I agree that the onus is still on the player to ensure they get the basic planning done, the issue I think is avoiding that continuous 'I must log into EVE every hour to change a skill when I'm doing something else'. I wanted to mention another aspect that is perhaps less obvious for those of us already playing EVE and liking it. I was having a discussion with a female friend of mine (I mention the gender purely because they are statistically currently a low percentage of EVE players and therefore in business parlance, an untapped market) and she said she had tried EVE but got fed up with having to log in to change skills when she had other things to do. I quote, or at least paraphrase, 'EVE was great fun, but out of all the little things the one thing that really annoyed me was during a day when I had no plans to even think about EVE, I'd suddenly remember, oh darn I need to change a skill - it intruded on my day and meant I was annoyed with the game instead of enjoying it'. She went on to point out that a skill queue could mean that the days when she is busy and can't play EVE, she doesn't need to think about it, and then the days when she has time and wants to enjoy EVE, she can manage skills. Now, I know some naysayers just say 'manage your skills better' or 'stop whining and put the effort in' but frankly the current system sucks as the above example illustrates. I don't want EVE to be my second job, it's a game, I want to relax and enjoy it, not have EVEMon run my life. I have no doubt a skill queue of some form can be implemented that avoids exploits and satisfies the casual player at the same time. I'd also suggest that if posters really don't want a skill queue system, they provide a good and concrete reason backed up with arguments as to why it makes the game worse beyond 'I don't like it' because those aren't reasons. You personally don't have to use such a system if you don't want, but don't naysay just because you can. ___ "If you can't debate using logic & fact, and at least recognise other people's point of view, don't waste time posting on forums. It only makes you look like a teenage idiot."
IceDown	Posted - 2008.02.18 09:27:00 - [419] How about a learning skill, that allows you to place 1 skill in queue 2 hrs before the end of a skill per level. eg. with the queue skill at lvl 3, you can queue up a skill within 6 hrs of finishing the current skill and any change in the training skill resets the queue. Even make the requirements learning lvl 5 and make it a rank 8 skill. that way you have to work for it a little.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.02.18 23:20:00 - [420] CCP just either implement what you have had on the drawingboard for ages or take it off the drawing board !!! This is getting old... Its a shame that with a otherwise GREAT game with a good dev-team and management, this issue is just ignored even though many people are asking for it. shakes head Do it or dont do it but give us a possibility to change skills via webpage then and make it so that the server NEVER crash when one wants to change a skill.... I am not getting a palmheld or whatever just to change skills for christsake...... Greetings Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !

Kusha'an Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.19 18:12:00 - [421] Originally by: Vested Interest I don't know if this has been suggested yet. What if they set it so you could train points by attribute and then apply them to skills as they accumulate? You could set one primary and one secondary attribute to train constantly and then apply the points to your skill of choice once you have enough saved up. This would let you train continuously, as long as your account was paid. You'd simply have to take care to not stick, say, Charisma as your primary training attribute for 6 months and forget about it. I don't think this is the best idea, but it's not bad. It gave me this idea: Why not just have skillpoints constantly accumulating at a steady rate that is based on your current attribute level. The skill points do not stop accumulating because of downtime or whatever. At any time you may "purchase" any skill with those skillpoints, provided you have sufficient points accumulated and the skill is unlocked for you. This would eliminate the problem entirely and would STILL require logins to "purchase" skills. It would still require careful planning but would eliminate the sleep and work penalties. Example: Player A has xxx points accumulated and will have enough points to buy electronics 3 by 3:30 am, but is going to sleep. By the time he gets home from work the next day, he can log and immediately "buy" that skill and any other that he has accumulated enough points for. He has lost no playing time without that skill and he has lost no skill time. Everybody is on the same level playing field. This is the best way to solve the problem without fostering character farming.
ceyriot Minmatar Crimson Rebellion	Posted - 2008.02.20 01:34:00 - [422] i want this to happen as well, doubt it actually will though...IMO...you should only be able to stack 2 skills, and not lvl 5's....this way you stop extremely long trains, but sitll able to co-ordinate training times when offline. --- CEO - Crimson Rebellion
Kulgan Matak Minmatar White Wolf Enterprises Harmonious Ascent	Posted - 2008.02.21 10:35:00 - [423] Originally by: Kusha'an I don't think this is the best idea, but it's not bad. It gave me this idea: Why not just have skillpoints constantly accumulating at a steady rate that is based on your current attribute level. The skill points do not stop accumulating because of downtime or whatever. At any time you may "purchase" any skill with those skillpoints, provided you have sufficient points accumulated and the skill is unlocked for you. This would eliminate the problem entirely and would STILL require logins to "purchase" skills. It would still require careful planning but would eliminate the sleep and work penalties. Example: Player A has xxx points accumulated and will have enough points to buy electronics 3 by 3:30 am, but is going to sleep. By the time he gets home from work the next day, he can log and immediately "buy" that skill and any other that he has accumulated enough points for. He has lost no playing time without that skill and he has lost no skill time. Everybody is on the same level playing field. This is the best way to solve the problem without fostering character farming. This is, in effect, an unlimited skill-queue, unless there is some cap on how many points you can save up, before they have to be committet to a skill. Then it just becomes a limited queue. Without a cap, I could farm thus: 1. Buy 20 accounts 2. Apply skillpoints to learningskills for each of the 20 chars first. 3. After learning skills are up, sit back and wait untill you have enough SP. Say a year. Buy some more accounts while you wait. 4. Sell chars, either with skills applied, or better yet just with a pool for the customer to spend.
Squidgey	Posted - 2008.02.21 11:28:00 - [424] You could set it up so you can only queue two skills... but that stops working when you are at two skills that take 26 days each since you can just say "Im not paying for the game for two months, when I come back the skills are done". So that wont work. How about a 7 day queue? Or maybe less... Say, lets be able to queue for 24 hours or 4 skills, whichever comes first. You could queue up a few levels of one skill to be done training the next day in preparation for...Heavy Missiles, or something. Maybe 4 is too much? How about 24 hours max length or 2 skills, whichever comes first. Wouldnt be OP and would work out VERY nicely during DT instead of switching to another longer skill during DT. (Don't get me wrong, I have no issue planning my skills around my day, thats what Evemon is good at.) But sometimes Id like to be able to queue up a couple of 30 minute skills if I suddenly have personal affairs to attend to and I have to leave the house.
Squidgey	Posted - 2008.02.21 11:29:00 - [425] Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: Vested Interest I don't know if this has been suggested yet. What if they set it so you could train points by attribute and then apply them to skills as they accumulate? You could set one primary and one secondary attribute to train constantly and then apply the points to your skill of choice once you have enough saved up. This would let you train continuously, as long as your account was paid. You'd simply have to take care to not stick, say, Charisma as your primary training attribute for 6 months and forget about it. I don't think this is the best idea, but it's not bad. It gave me this idea: Why not just have skillpoints constantly accumulating at a steady rate that is based on your current attribute level. The skill points do not stop accumulating because of downtime or whatever. At any time you may "purchase" any skill with those skillpoints, provided you have sufficient points accumulated and the skill is unlocked for you. This would eliminate the problem entirely and would STILL require logins to "purchase" skills. It would still require careful planning but would eliminate the sleep and work penalties. Example: Player A has xxx points accumulated and will have enough points to buy electronics 3 by 3:30 am, but is going to sleep. By the time he gets home from work the next day, he can log and immediately "buy" that skill and any other that he has accumulated enough points for. He has lost no playing time without that skill and he has lost no skill time. Everybody is on the same level playing field. This is the best way to solve the problem without fostering character farming. This brings the issue of character farming, start a trial, pay for... one month, then let the character sit for 6 months and come back to millions of skillpoints which you could then sell the character and the buyer could build the character any way they want. This way would make it worse.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:04:00 - [426] Originally by: Squidgey This brings the issue of character farming, start a trial, pay for... one month, then let the character sit for 6 months and come back to millions of skillpoints which you could then sell the character and the buyer could build the character any way they want. This way would make it worse.[/quote For christ sake - they should just turn the possibility to train skills on a INactive account OFF !!!! Luckily there are never any unexpected downtimes...ah ooops there is just one NOW again... CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Vested Interest	Posted - 2008.02.22 04:52:00 - [427] Yeah sorry if I left the implication of these attribute streams training in perpetuity. Of course it would only be for as long as your account is active. I don't see "farming" being a big issue here. Heck I have a spare account just training an alt up in the basics as we speak. As it is now we essentially have this already only the skill points are applied directly to the skills as you train. Pooling them up for later application to a skill only seems like a next logical step to me. When you train a skill currently you are basically running a primary and 2ndary attribute stream, why not just let these accumulate. So if you were saving up for skills in the Trade tree, you'd set your primary training stream to be Memory or Charisma, with the 2ndary stream training Perception. The obvious and self-limiting downside is if you left Charisma training for 6 months you might not be able to spend the points. I appreciate the interest!
Alowishus mUfFiN fAcToRy Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.22 13:40:00 - [428] Edited by: Alowishus on 22/02/2008 13:40:25 People want everything handed to them these days. New Eve players are like a new generation of children, wishing things were easier and believing they're entitled to it. I demand that there never be a skill queue. The newer generation of Eve players should have to do what I have done for the last four years. Back in my day we didn't even have advanced learning skills and there were less carebears flooding the market with cheap implants. You all have it easy by comparison. Be thankful and STFU. /makes fart noise
Jade Rapture	Posted - 2008.02.22 20:04:00 - [429] Edited by: Jade Rapture on 22/02/2008 20:04:05 What he said. I'm new and I think this is some silver spoon caca. __________ Ask a Muslim, Jew, or Christian about their religion and they'll tell you. Ask a Scientologist and they'll tell you.. after the check clears.
Rhaegor Stormborn Volition Cult The Volition Cult	Posted - 2008.02.22 20:39:00 - [430] I guess I will add my two cents to an ever growing thread. I want a skill queue as well. Volition Cult Recruitment Post

1Commando1	Posted - 2008.02.23 11:57:00 - [431] Yes, I too want a skill queue of maximum 2 skills. 1 training and 1 sitting in the queue next to be trained. This would solve a lot of problems for people that do work full-time and spend the other time playing eve-online. Regards,
Squidgey	Posted - 2008.02.23 15:04:00 - [432] Originally by: 1Commando1 Yes, I too want a skill queue of maximum 2 skills. 1 training and 1 sitting in the queue next to be trained. This would solve a lot of problems for people that do work full-time and spend the other time playing eve-online. Regards, That causes a problem when you have two 26 day skills. You can just not pay for two months and away they go. Unless of course the account has to be active. But I like my idea better, 2 skills or 24 hours, whichever comes first. That way you cant train up two 26 day skills even if you wanted to and you still have to log in every day to check it. It just makes training the lowbie ass skills during DT a possibility.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.25 07:58:00 - [433] Originally by: Alowishus Edited by: Alowishus on 22/02/2008 13:40:25 People want everything handed to them these days. New Eve players are like a new generation of children, wishing things were easier and believing they're entitled to it. I demand that there never be a skill queue. The newer generation of Eve players should have to do what I have done for the last four years. Back in my day we didn't even have advanced learning skills and there were less carebears flooding the market with cheap implants. You all have it easy by comparison. Be thankful and STFU. you are a selfish childish poor person. so, we shouldnt have internet cause our parents had it the hard way? we shouldnt be able to travel by plane? we shouldnt have heart surgery? it is because people like you that both EVE and the real world are a nasty place. if you want to play eve the real way, like tought men do, turn off autorepeat from guns, delete your overview settings everytime you undock from a station and never switch skills when they are midway.
Morles	Posted - 2008.02.25 09:39:00 - [434] Originally by: 1Commando1 Yes, I too want a skill queue of maximum 2 skills. 1 training and 1 sitting in the queue next to be trained. This would solve a lot of problems for people that do work full-time and spend the other time playing eve-online. Regards, amen. it really could be set up to be for active accounts only couldnt be that hard. we need a bunch of ppl to protest it.. make them give us a skill queue! and while your at it.. let us log in to eve-online.com and set our skills for training there! we want quick and easy access (from work) for those who cant play all the time!
Pazzuzzu	Posted - 2008.02.26 00:46:00 - [435] I just dont understand why this is just being ignored by the devs? Maybe we should rally a ingame protest - Not sure if that is allowed though - If it were we could have hundreds of ships and cans called " Please give us a skill-queue " :) But as I said i dont know if its allowed so until that is clarified better no such actions. Greetings
Danorium	Posted - 2008.02.26 08:30:00 - [436] Edited by: Danorium on 26/02/2008 08:30:40 I'm very new too this game and i also had my though about the training system. i agree with a queue which would be nice but: if you can count and plan your life i don't see the problem whenever I play I am picking the short (30 min-8 hours) skills. whenever i go too bed i pick a 1-2-3(or more) days skill. i really don't see the problem and why people are whining so much. just think a bit before you go a few hours afk.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.02.26 12:12:00 - [437] Originally by: Danorium Edited by: Danorium on 26/02/2008 08:30:40 I'm very new too this game and i also had my though about the training system. i agree with a queue which would be nice but: if you can count and plan your life i don't see the problem whenever I play I am picking the short (30 min-8 hours) skills. whenever i go too bed i pick a 1-2-3(or more) days skill. i really don't see the problem and why people are whining so much. just think a bit before you go a few hours afk. If you like planing your life around a Computer game I expect you dont need a skill-queue.... And luckily there are NEVER unscheduled downtimes...ah wait.... CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Danorium	Posted - 2008.02.26 13:33:00 - [438] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Danorium Edited by: Danorium on 26/02/2008 08:30:40 I'm very new too this game and i also had my though about the training system. i agree with a queue which would be nice but: if you can count and plan your life i don't see the problem whenever I play I am picking the short (30 min-8 hours) skills. whenever i go too bed i pick a 1-2-3(or more) days skill. i really don't see the problem and why people are whining so much. just think a bit before you go a few hours afk. If you like planing your life around a Computer game I expect you dont need a skill-queue.... And luckily there are NEVER unscheduled downtimes...ah wait.... plan my life about this game? o.O if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game
Glacius Prime	Posted - 2008.02.26 13:59:00 - [439] I am confused I have a friend who started to play one mouth before me... It took me a little more then 2 mounts to beat his skill points! Yes, with one mouth advantage, now I have more skill points that he has ... <=== and that is by far the best thing I did in my n00b life in EvE. Now... I do work! and I do have a RL. Yes, I hate the idea of not being home in time to change/add a new skill... stil, I did it :P I guess after a while, when skills will take more then 2, 3 days it will not be such a problem... but it is hard now.
Danorium	Posted - 2008.02.27 08:13:00 - [440] Originally by: Glacius Prime I am confused I have a friend who started to play one mouth before me... It took me a little more then 2 mounts to beat his skill points! Yes, with one mouth advantage, now I have more skill points that he has ... <=== and that is by far the best thing I did in my n00b life in EvE. Now... I do work! and I do have a RL. Yes, I hate the idea of not being home in time to change/add a new skill... stil, I did it :P I guess after a while, when skills will take more then 2, 3 days it will not be such a problem... but it is hard now. i agree on you there. in the beginning it's hard to find some long run skills which are really needed. you want to focus on the ones you can use in the short run. still as you said it is not impossible or even hard.

Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.02.27 08:27:00 - [441] Originally by: Alowishus Edited by: Alowishus on 22/02/2008 13:40:25 People want everything handed to them these days. New Eve players are like a new generation of children, wishing things were easier and believing they're entitled to it. I demand that there never be a skill queue. The newer generation of Eve players should have to do what I have done for the last four years. Back in my day we didn't even have advanced learning skills and there were less carebears flooding the market with cheap implants. You all have it easy by comparison. Be thankful and STFU. get lost. if you are so tough, why dont you play EVE without the overview, relying on your l33t skills to target everybody, and calculate transversal speed on your own just by looking at the moving red crosses? stop already with your superiority. we dont want any easy mode button, we only ask for something to free us from unexpected server downtimes, which happen more often that you probably would like to admit.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.02.27 08:34:00 - [442] Originally by: Danorium whenever I play I am picking the short (30 min-8 hours) skills. and what do you do when the skill is about to finish and suddenly the server goes to take a nap? how does it feel those 6 hours of training time lost? what do you do if you are about to go to bed at that time? you wait? you go to bed knowing you'll loose 8 hours? we all know the trick, short skills when playing, long skills when loggin out. we are not that thick. problem is when the server goes on holiday without telling anybody. that is why a single skill queue would be perfect.
Belmarduk de Prieure Enuma Elish.	Posted - 2008.02.27 16:24:00 - [443] Originally by: Danorium if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game[/quote No offense mate but I think its priceless when a Newbie gives me tips about trying a different game because of the skill-system I have about 36 mio SP now after playing since beginning of 2006 and I have 10,15,20 ? skills that would take longer than a week - I even have a few skills which would take 30 days+ BUT I still want a skill-queue !!! Why? sigh I have mentioned it before in this thread at someplace ( PLEASE read through the WHOLE thread before giving answers like this..) 1.When you have many long skills and keep only learning those skills there will come a time when you will run out of long skills fast ! Especiouly when you are skilling towards a certain goal eg. Carrier 2. Logging on JUST to switch skills is a STUPID and UNNECCESSARY load on the servers which are often at there limit as it is !!!! 3. I am PAYING for playing and skilling so I would like to choose if and when I go online (DEACTIVATE SKILLTRAINING FROM INACTIVE ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!) sorry capkey got stuck 4.Eve¦s skillsystem in comparison to other games is built and designed that YOU MUST SKILL ALL THE TIME to NOT waste time. Its only gives you content not highendpower ! It takes you literally months/years to be able to be "highend" (Which I like about the skillsystem in EVE BUT as I said you are forced to be skilling at ALL TIMES ! In other games you can level up to highend in a few weeks (WoW - pukes) 5. There are often unforseen issues where you cant log in to change a skill (RL,unscheduled Downtimes,isp-issues etc etc) 6.A skillqueue has been on the drawing board for ages - What the hell is it with it? 7.I would safley say about 80% - 90% of the players activley WANT a skill-queue ! 8.I have myself heard from new players that quit after trial that they dont like the way they are forced to log in just for changing skills AND vets who quit partly because they played less and because they got ****ed off about changing skills all the time said "Ok I will quit completly - No point it keeping account alive if I only now and then start a skill to run out half the time" 9.I had more valid reasons but cant think of them now as I am at work (If ATLEAST one could change skills via webpage......) Greetings Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Zakurai	Posted - 2008.03.02 01:16:00 - [444] I for one am inclined to think a one-skill queue would be an excellent solution for many of the problems that occurred during downtime or personal problems in RL. I believe the best course of action is to have an eve-wide vote. Since the skill system effects all eve players new and old, everyone should have a say in the matter via voting thereby putting an end to several lengthy bouts of flame wars, and discussions alike (yay for democracy ) Please excuse me for being slightly off topic, but in a game with a futuristic sci-fi theme, i find it hard to believe that the computers which feed directly into a capsuler's head, are less efficient at queuing than windows media player (At least a pseudoscience explanation from the Dev team is necessary...)
Squidgey	Posted - 2008.03.02 16:49:00 - [445] Originally by: Zakurai Please excuse me for being slightly off topic, but in a game with a futuristic sci-fi theme, i find it hard to believe that the computers which feed directly into a capsuler's head, are less efficient at queuing than windows media player (At least a pseudoscience explanation from the Dev team is necessary...) QFW - Qouted for Win.
Dirty Snipe	Posted - 2008.03.03 16:01:00 - [446] I agree a one skill option would be good. And if you training a long skill and you havn't paid then the skills should stop training. Simple as, Stop messing around CCP and put up a vote and put an end to this flame wars thread!! [url=http://oss.evesource.com/kb/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=11604] [/url]
Cassanunda	Posted - 2008.03.03 20:56:00 - [447] I can understand how allowing a queue could be abused. How about this. Either in the Full Access API or the eve onlnine site, allow a "set skill in training". To stop bots, use the same anti bot system you have on your 14 day trial creation site. This would allow people to log in from anywhere with internet access and set the next skill and would require that person to be a "human" every time it is done. That way it is the "same" as logging in and setting your training skill then logging directly out, and it allows that functionality from any internet ready computer.
Matterick Boon Minmatar Rim Collection RC Zenith Affinity	Posted - 2008.03.04 00:46:00 - [448] that would help character farmers even more. they would just need one cheap computer that just needs to load a browsers. just give some kid a list of all skills and pay him 60 cents an hour to manager hundereds of characters via the website. genius idea cassanunda. if it's going to benefit you it's going to benefit farmers 100 times more. regardless of what "security" measures you take they will find ways around it. farming this game is their way of life. CCP or anyone else for that matter really don't care if you missed a few hours of training due to being at work or whatever. as many people on here suggested go play a game where you have to grind to skill up. you don't see people on those games begging for bots to play for them while they are at work do you? be grateful for what you already have or go somewhere else. o_O
Kusha'an Gallente	Posted - 2008.03.04 15:31:00 - [449] Originally by: Matterick Boon that would help character farmers even more. they would just need one cheap computer that just needs to load a browsers. just give some kid a list of all skills and pay him 60 cents an hour to manager hundereds of characters via the website. genius idea cassanunda. if it's going to benefit you it's going to benefit farmers 100 times more. regardless of what "security" measures you take they will find ways around it. farming this game is their way of life. CCP or anyone else for that matter really don't care if you missed a few hours of training due to being at work or whatever. as many people on here suggested go play a game where you have to grind to skill up. you don't see people on those games begging for bots to play for them while they are at work do you? be grateful for what you already have or go somewhere else. Follow your post to its logical conclusion. Punishing real game players for the sins of the farmers is not helpful. As you say, they're gonna benefit no matter what, and they're gonna cheat no matter what. So there's nothing that can be done about it anyway. So help out the real players who actually pay the bills.
Jake RIvers Caldari Vinyl Roid The Cool Kids Club	Posted - 2008.03.04 16:10:00 - [450] Edited by: Jake RIvers on 04/03/2008 16:16:37 I for one would like to see at least 1 queue for skills. It's annoying to keep jocking around the skills each day to just train a portion of a skill that is going to take 8 hours back to a skill that takes more than a day simply because I am not on for a 8 hour stretch. If its character farming that is the problem with putting in a queue just make it for paid up accounts. A skill queue would allow your character to progress more quickly on skills that take less time, giving your character more access to new items, making things more interesting to log in for each day. I play two accounts, so its twice as annoying to jockey around the skill training. I would also like to add, when I am playing and start training a short term skill, I almost always never notice when it has finished. Even thought the character portrait shows when your skill is done, I am usually concentrating on other things, like blowing up those nasty guristas on missions. When I am running missions, I don't like to have to concentrate on going over the skill tree every few hours. I would rather just go over my skill tree for a bit when I first log in, or while long distance travel, or when I am done for the night.

1Commando1	Posted - 2008.03.05 00:30:00 - [451] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Danorium if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game[/quote No offense mate but I think its priceless when a Newbie gives me tips about trying a different game because of the skill-system I have about 36 mio SP now after playing since beginning of 2006 and I have 10,15,20 ? skills that would take longer than a week - I even have a few skills which would take 30 days+ BUT I still want a skill-queue !!! Why? sigh I have mentioned it before in this thread at someplace ( PLEASE read through the WHOLE thread before giving answers like this..) 1.When you have many long skills and keep only learning those skills there will come a time when you will run out of long skills fast ! Especiouly when you are skilling towards a certain goal eg. Carrier 2. Logging on JUST to switch skills is a STUPID and UNNECCESSARY load on the servers which are often at there limit as it is !!!! 3. I am PAYING for playing and skilling so I would like to choose if and when I go online (DEACTIVATE SKILLTRAINING FROM INACTIVE ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!) sorry capkey got stuck 4.Eve¦s skillsystem in comparison to other games is built and designed that YOU MUST SKILL ALL THE TIME to NOT waste time. Its only gives you content not highendpower ! It takes you literally months/years to be able to be "highend" (Which I like about the skillsystem in EVE BUT as I said you are forced to be skilling at ALL TIMES ! In other games you can level up to highend in a few weeks (WoW - pukes) 5. There are often unforseen issues where you cant log in to change a skill (RL,unscheduled Downtimes,isp-issues etc etc) 6.A skillqueue has been on the drawing board for ages - What the hell is it with it? 7.I would safley say about 80% - 90% of the players activley WANT a skill-queue ! 8.I have myself heard from new players that quit after trial that they dont like the way they are forced to log in just for changing skills AND vets who quit partly because they played less and because they got ****ed off about changing skills all the time said "Ok I will quit completly - No point it keeping account alive if I only now and then start a skill to run out half the time" 9.I had more valid reasons but cant think of them now as I am at work (If ATLEAST one could change skills via webpage......) Greetings Belmarduk Well said mate, and spot on. DEV's Please take note of the above points in why we need a skill-queue.
1Commando1	Posted - 2008.03.05 00:50:00 - [452] Edited by: 1Commando1 on 05/03/2008 00:52:54 Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: Matterick Boon that would help character farmers even more. they would just need one cheap computer that just needs to load a browsers. just give some kid a list of all skills and pay him 60 cents an hour to manager hundereds of characters via the website. genius idea cassanunda. if it's going to benefit you it's going to benefit farmers 100 times more. regardless of what "security" measures you take they will find ways around it. farming this game is their way of life. CCP or anyone else for that matter really don't care if you missed a few hours of training due to being at work or whatever. as many people on here suggested go play a game where you have to grind to skill up. you don't see people on those games begging for bots to play for them while they are at work do you? be grateful for what you already have or go somewhere else. Follow your post to its logical conclusion. Punishing real game players for the sins of the farmers is not helpful. As you say, they're gonna benefit no matter what, and they're gonna cheat no matter what. So there's nothing that can be done about it anyway. So help out the real players who actually pay the bills. I think those 90-95% of players that actually play Eve don't really care about farmers or cheaters or e-bay buyers or whatever they do if they're not a genuine player. I myself am part of that 90-95% of the real players that enjoy playing Eve Online and are those that are requesting Eve to become better and improve for it's players that pay for the game. No one cares about those farmers, if they want to waste their life in what they're doing... so be it... why stop them? They are also "players" that don't play the game properly but that is their choice. Those 90-95% that do play and enjoy the game are the ones that are requesting these improvements so that it benefits players that play Eve. That is the bigger picture and not focusing about this farmers and/or bots/ebay buyers or whatever you call them... If you look at any game be it FPS or MMO or RPG you will always have cheats/macros/auto-bots. They are annoying no doubt but the real players them selves are the ones that are suffering, because they're not getting any improvements for a game that they are paying for per month to play in all it's glory! Dev Team please put a pool up for players to vote on if they do want a Skill queue to be able to queue up 1 training skill. Please take note of What Belmarduk posted here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=531551&page=16#452 It explains all the points required on why a skill queue is needed. Note: " To all those players that I've noticed are complaining about people queuing up 2 skills ie 1 training 16days, and another 16days queued up." The skill training will stop when the account is not paid for. So I don't see a problem. I do se a great solution to those players that have lives and also enjoy playing Eve Online at their leisure. Regards, Commando
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.05 03:26:00 - [453] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Danorium if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game[/quote No offense mate but I think its priceless when a Newbie gives me tips about trying a different game because of the skill-system I have about 36 mio SP now after playing since beginning of 2006 and I have 10,15,20 ? skills that would take longer than a week - I even have a few skills which would take 30 days+ BUT I still want a skill-queue !!! Why? sigh I have mentioned it before in this thread at someplace ( PLEASE read through the WHOLE thread before giving answers like this..) 2. Logging on JUST to switch skills is a STUPID and UNNECCESSARY load on the servers which are often at there limit as it is !!!! 3. I am PAYING for playing and skilling so I would like to choose if and when I go online (DEACTIVATE SKILLTRAINING FROM INACTIVE ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!) sorry capkey got stuck 4.Eve¦s skillsystem in comparison to other games is built and designed that YOU MUST SKILL ALL THE TIME to NOT waste time. Its only gives you content not highendpower ! It takes you literally months/years to be able to be "highend" (Which I like about the skillsystem in EVE BUT as I said you are forced to be skilling at ALL TIMES ! In other games you can level up to highend in a few weeks (WoW - pukes) the trade off for skilling up while offline is tha5t you must login for a new skill to be trained. this has been like this since year dot for eve. as for months or years to high end one self is utter bull****e! I am pure amarr specced. almost 31m sp and i aint even 2 years old chr wise. its not how the game mechanics benifit you, its how you benifit the game as a whole. while i am not able to play eve till late july at the worste I am still able to login and do skill changes at least. I am presently doing Commandships to lvl V, i know THIS skill finishes around 3 am for my TZ, so just before downtime I am going to swtich to Medium beam spec V. with luck this skill will finish in the evening.. if not i can then CHOOSE a lower rank skill i need doen that will bring it into my "normal" game time. then i will finish off these two skills that are nearly done. to be honest. I find it more of a pain to do short skill trains lol. I ACTUALLY look forward to long skill trains. infact. i might just as my last act before i rejion eve is learn Maruaders V as its not an overly long skill train for me,36 days'ish. so i now have 4-5 months of skill up my chr. i reckon around july 6 i will be somewhat 36m+ sp so my advice to you is... got to your Loyaty point store, cash in your LP's buy 14.7 trillion matches, 23.012 tonnes of glue, 4 hectres of land in the shape of a valley then... BUILD A BRIDGE AND GET OVER IT! - WTT - Machariel BPC, For a Paladin Contact me ingame.
Kusha'an Gallente	Posted - 2008.03.05 16:41:00 - [454] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad the trade off for skilling up while offline is tha5t you must login for a new skill to be trained. this has been like this since year dot for eve. as for months or years to high end one self is utter bull****e! I am pure amarr specced. almost 31m sp and i aint even 2 years old chr wise. its not how the game mechanics benifit you, its how you benifit the game as a whole. while i am not able to play eve till late july at the worste I am still able to login and do skill changes at least. I am presently doing Commandships to lvl V, i know THIS skill finishes around 3 am for my TZ, so just before downtime I am going to swtich to Medium beam spec V. with luck this skill will finish in the evening.. if not i can then CHOOSE a lower rank skill i need doen that will bring it into my "normal" game time. then i will finish off these two skills that are nearly done. to be honest. I find it more of a pain to do short skill trains lol. I ACTUALLY look forward to long skill trains. infact. i might just as my last act before i rejion eve is learn Maruaders V as its not an overly long skill train for me,36 days'ish. so i now have 4-5 months of skill up my chr. i reckon around july 6 i will be somewhat 36m+ sp so my advice to you is... got to your Loyaty point store, cash in your LP's buy 14.7 trillion matches, 23.012 tonnes of glue, 4 hectres of land in the shape of a valley then... BUILD A BRIDGE AND GET OVER IT! Self aggrandizing, unhelpful, gratuitous, redundant rant.
ICommandoI	Posted - 2008.03.05 19:42:00 - [455] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Danorium if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game[/quote No offense mate but I think its priceless when a Newbie gives me tips about trying a different game because of the skill-system I have about 36 mio SP now after playing since beginning of 2006 and I have 10,15,20 ? skills that would take longer than a week - I even have a few skills which would take 30 days+ BUT I still want a skill-queue !!! Why? sigh I have mentioned it before in this thread at someplace ( PLEASE read through the WHOLE thread before giving answers like this..) 2. Logging on JUST to switch skills is a STUPID and UNNECCESSARY load on the servers which are often at there limit as it is !!!! 3. I am PAYING for playing and skilling so I would like to choose if and when I go online (DEACTIVATE SKILLTRAINING FROM INACTIVE ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!) sorry capkey got stuck 4.Eve¦s skillsystem in comparison to other games is built and designed that YOU MUST SKILL ALL THE TIME to NOT waste time. Its only gives you content not highendpower ! It takes you literally months/years to be able to be "highend" (Which I like about the skillsystem in EVE BUT as I said you are forced to be skilling at ALL TIMES ! In other games you can level up to highend in a few weeks (WoW - pukes) the trade off for skilling up while offline is tha5t you must login for a new skill to be trained. this has been like this since year dot for eve. as for months or years to high end one self is utter bull****e! I am pure amarr specced. almost 31m sp and i aint even 2 years old chr wise. its not how the game mechanics benifit you, its how you benifit the game as a whole. while i am not able to play eve till late july at the worste I am still able to login and do skill changes at least. I am presently doing Commandships to lvl V, i know THIS skill finishes around 3 am for my TZ, so just before downtime I am going to swtich to Medium beam spec V. with luck this skill will finish in the evening.. if not i can then CHOOSE a lower rank skill i need doen that will bring it into my "normal" game time. then i will finish off these two skills that are nearly done. to be honest. I find it more of a pain to do short skill trains lol. I ACTUALLY look forward to long skill trains. infact. i might just as my last act before i rejion eve is learn Maruaders V as its not an overly long skill train for me,36 days'ish. so i now have 4-5 months of skill up my chr. i reckon around july 6 i will be somewhat 36m+ sp so my advice to you is... got to your Loyaty point store, cash in your LP's buy 14.7 trillion matches, 23.012 tonnes of glue, 4 hectres of land in the shape of a valley then... BUILD A BRIDGE AND GET OVER IT! Ogdru, I see what you're saying but it still doesn't help the fact that those people that are casual players would like other meants to either select a new skill via the eve-online website or be able to queue up a skill. Ie. a skill they need to train and a long skill so when the 1st skill finishes it continues to train the second. Then when you login you can change the skill you want. That way you don't loose any skill training time. Over the last week / 2 weeks I have lost atleast 6 - 10 hours per day by day basis. Ie. Intermitent server down time, can't change the next skill to train because of either ISP issues, or just unavailable because of RL, etc...etc... A sensible thing to do is to give those players like myself and there are many to be able to login to eve-online and change a skill train "if at work", and to be able to queue up a skill. If the Devs don't like queueing up skills then let the same skill continue to train after a level is complete. That way it will continue to train all the way to lvl 5.
1Commando1	Posted - 2008.03.05 19:43:00 - [456] Edited by: 1Commando1 on 05/03/2008 19:47:44 Edited by: 1Commando1 on 05/03/2008 19:45:14 And no, you wont be able to train those skills after your account subscription expires ie. It's disabled. So I don't see a problem with it and MORE of a benefit to those casual eve players that cannot plan a game around their life. I've actually stoped playing Eve for a year because I just couldn't cope with planing things with "things in life already happening". It's easy for those 10 - 18 yr olds that don't have jobs, that go to school, and that live with their momy and dady... :P It's different when you're out in life, working full time, and have a family of your own. etc...
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.06 02:55:00 - [457] Originally by: 1Commando1 Edited by: 1Commando1 on 05/03/2008 19:47:44 Edited by: 1Commando1 on 05/03/2008 19:45:14 And no, you wont be able to train those skills after your account subscription expires ie. It's disabled. So I don't see a problem with it and MORE of a benefit to those casual eve players that cannot plan a game around their life. I've actually stoped playing Eve for a year because I just couldn't cope with planing things with "things in life already happening". It's easy for those 10 - 18 yr olds that don't have jobs, that go to school, and that live with their momy and dady... :P It's different when you're out in life, working full time, and have a family of your own. etc... in that case why not have a skill queuing for as long as you ned while your account is active AND the skill in in ones head. so once you start a lvl 1 skill you can take it to lvl 5 without manually doing it. personally i dont like it lol. I see the advantages, but too easy. -
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.03.06 07:49:00 - [458] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad personally i dont like it lol. I see the advantages, but too easy. too easy? what? like auto repeat on weapons? like the starmap statistics? like having a graphic interface instead of a space based MUD? what you mean easy? we do not want free progression. we just want to be inmune to server diseases. and for that, 1 skill queue would be enough
Kusha'an Gallente	Posted - 2008.03.06 15:48:00 - [459] Edited by: Kusha''an on 06/03/2008 15:48:43 Originally by: Sue Mee Originally by: Ogdru Jahad personally i dont like it lol. I see the advantages, but too easy. too easy? what? like auto repeat on weapons? like the starmap statistics? like having a graphic interface instead of a space based MUD? what you mean easy? we do not want free progression. we just want to be inmune to server diseases. and for that, 1 skill queue would be enough Well of course he doesn't like it. He's already got 31 million SP. So poo on all the other players who aren't skilled up yet. Nobody else is permitted to have any improvements in the game that he didn't benefit from. See his logic? What's wrong with you?
ICommandoI	Posted - 2008.03.06 20:09:00 - [460] Personally if I had 100Mil SP Char I would still request and support the skill queue system. Why? Well think of all the new players and any friends that you may request to get into the game... For them it will be so much easier and so many players wouldn't leave because of that 1 big issue. I do hope that Eve Devs do realize the bigger picture.

Unprogrammable Grave Diggers Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.07 02:35:00 - [461] uhhh B - U - M - P / S - I - G - N He who gives up liberty for security deserves neither -Ben Franklin
Rudagar LEM0N	Posted - 2008.03.07 02:53:00 - [462] Signed. Im sure its been said already, but I cant be bothered to scroll through 16pages to check. A simple way of preventing character farming would be to only allow two skills to be que'd up. Lets you finish your small skill and then roll onto the next one which will last you until your next online to que up another. I hate not being able to let skills finish because they end when Im asleep, at work, whatever. Its such a pain.
Mooku	Posted - 2008.03.07 09:06:00 - [463] im on the road for 4-6 days a week..sometimes 7-8...i get to play for a couple days then im back on the road...my skill trees are a mess with lots of partially completed skills due to the time constraints i have in RL....if i could qeue just 1 skill....my 14 mil sp char(almost) would actually prolly be closer to 16mil by now..dont even ask about the other account...lol think 3-4mil sp less then where she should be.... /signed
Chiriel Amuri	Posted - 2008.03.07 10:29:00 - [464] I would as a new player support this. This is my second acount and again iam training my learning skills. and with my fastchanging shedule i miss a lot of time in training. and even if these farmers/goldseller (or whatever you call them) my have use for it the 95% who does play with honour will have more use for it.
Onno Quist	Posted - 2008.03.07 11:06:00 - [465] why is it so hard for a company to be a bit more playerfriendly?
Ogdru Jahad Amarr Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.08 15:52:00 - [466] Originally by: Onno Quist why is it so hard for a company to be a bit more playerfriendly? why are idiots making alts to make it look like more og joo's want a skill que? - If a pig loses his voice...is he disgruntled?
seliana tanis Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.08 17:27:00 - [467] Perhaps not 5 but certainly at least 1 skill that can be queued after another. /signed
GTFO Tinks	Posted - 2008.03.09 10:54:00 - [468] Being new to the game I agree that managing skills is a pain, but with the help of 3rd party monitors (evemon) and a bit of forethought I've not found it too much of an issue. If the devs are not willing to let you queue up even 1 skill, being able to manage the skill tree from the website would be great, not many people are able to have copies of the client at work for e.g. or like myself atm my son is bashing away at another game on the desktop pc, i'm stuck on a crappy old laptop that won't run the game. Ideally I would like to see the ability to queue 1 or 2 skills for PAID a/c's and be able to log into the character section of the website and manage things there too.
Barbelo Valentinian Gallente Liberty Corporation	Posted - 2008.03.10 01:01:00 - [469] The argument that people who want some kind of fallback or background skill or 1 skill queue or something like that are being lazy and should be grateful for having this kind of skill system at all is just silly. The game is set up in such a way that the skills would take far too long to learn from a rat-grinding in-game-only type of system - they're just far too complex. Plus, also, if you have a skill system like this, what's the point in stopping short of at least a minimal queue? Clearly, part of the idea is to keep the person connected to the game, so they can't just wait until their avatar is skilled up before they fly. They have to actually log in to the game. Fine. But even that wouldn't be affected by the QOL change of one fallback skill, or whatever. As for the arguments that farmers, etc., would take advantage of a minimal skill queue that's silly. If a full-on many-levelled skill queue was being proposed, that argument would definitely have merit. But a fallback, one level queue? Irrelevant to farmers, and a nice QOL boost for the average player. Bring it on please CCP - if you're going to have a system like this at all, there's no point in stopping with half-measures at a level that just irritates large numbers of casual players. Simplest is either train to next level, stop at 5, or set background skill (e.g. set a long-time training skill as background). The latter is probably more in the spirit of "you've got to keep your eye on the ball" because you will occasionally have to change the background skill. ***** "To wake up is to wake the world up" - D.E. Harding
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.03.10 07:43:00 - [470] Originally by: GTFO Tinks If the devs are not willing to let you queue up even 1 skill, being able to manage the skill tree from the website would be great, not many people are able to have copies of the client at work for e.g. or like myself atm my son is bashing away at another game on the desktop pc, i'm stuck on a crappy old laptop that won't run the game. while i understand what you are saying, being able to change skills trough the web wouldnt solve the biggest problem we have now: unexpected server downtimes. since the web is currently so tied up to the server, if the server goes down, so does the web, so we would be again stuck with a skill training for 20 minutes and then loose training time. that is why a 1 skill queue is a superior solution.

GTFO Tinks	Posted - 2008.03.10 11:49:00 - [471] Originally by: Sue Mee Originally by: GTFO Tinks If the devs are not willing to let you queue up even 1 skill, being able to manage the skill tree from the website would be great, not many people are able to have copies of the client at work for e.g. or like myself atm my son is bashing away at another game on the desktop pc, i'm stuck on a crappy old laptop that won't run the game. while i understand what you are saying, being able to change skills trough the web wouldnt solve the biggest problem we have now: unexpected server downtimes. since the web is currently so tied up to the server, if the server goes down, so does the web, so we would be again stuck with a skill training for 20 minutes and then loose training time. that is why a 1 skill queue is a superior solution. No dispute there, the main point of mentioning the web based skill management was only to give an alternative entry into your skill tree, without having to have the client loaded, imagine your on a weekend break, your remember on Sat morning 'Oh Lordy!, I just realised my skill runs out tonight and I won't be home 'till monday...oh noes......wait a minute...I can nip into this internet cafe and set something else up.' Obviously a skill queue, and btw devs, a default background skill is a very good idea, would be better, both a queue AND a web based system would be better still.
Ethan Joznin	Posted - 2008.03.11 10:18:00 - [472] I'm very opposed to a skill queue of any type. A skill queue is a reward for laziness and the current skill system rewards players who are able to invest a little time (and more importantly forethought) in the game. It sounds like a lot of people just want to set a queue, walk off for a few weeks, and come back flying HACs and marauders. Personally, I feel a much stronger sense of community knowing that everyone else out there has probably set a 3am alarm to finish up that last skill you need to fly a T2 ship. Also, a skill queue that lets you queue 1 skill simply opens the door for one that lets you queue 2, or 3, or 4 skills. The same problems people are complaining about now still exist with a queue for a single skill. Besides, if some of you are such casual players with such demanding real lives, then why are you worried about the skill progress of an imaginary character in an imaginary universe?
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.03.11 18:38:00 - [473] Originally by: Ethan Joznin I'm very opposed to a skill queue of any type. A skill queue is a reward for laziness and the current skill system rewards players who are able to invest a little time (and more importantly forethought) in the game. It sounds like a lot of people just want to set a queue, walk off for a few weeks, and come back flying HACs and marauders. Personally, I feel a much stronger sense of community knowing that everyone else out there has probably set a 3am alarm to finish up that last skill you need to fly a T2 ship. Also, a skill queue that lets you queue 1 skill simply opens the door for one that lets you queue 2, or 3, or 4 skills. The same problems people are complaining about now still exist with a queue for a single skill. Besides, if some of you are such casual players with such demanding real lives, then why are you worried about the skill progress of an imaginary character in an imaginary universe? I¦m sorry - You fail in your post - Please read the whole thread before posting BS. Thankyou Sir CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
ceyriot Crimson Rebellion Cold Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.11 18:42:00 - [474] Originally by: Ethan Joznin I'm very opposed to a skill queue of any type. A skill queue is a reward for laziness and the current skill system rewards players who are able to invest a little time (and more importantly forethought) in the game. It sounds like a lot of people just want to set a queue, walk off for a few weeks, and come back flying HACs and marauders. Personally, I feel a much stronger sense of community knowing that everyone else out there has probably set a 3am alarm to finish up that last skill you need to fly a T2 ship. Also, a skill queue that lets you queue 1 skill simply opens the door for one that lets you queue 2, or 3, or 4 skills. The same problems people are complaining about now still exist with a queue for a single skill. Besides, if some of you are such casual players with such demanding real lives, then why are you worried about the skill progress of an imaginary character in an imaginary universe? Please, PLEASE read the OP before commenting in the future.
Kusha'an	Posted - 2008.03.13 12:20:00 - [475] So I guess we got the middle finger from CCP since they didn't offer a skill queue in this latest patch? Or was it not intended to happen any time soon?
Grulltan	Posted - 2008.03.13 12:37:00 - [476] Level 5 gunnery or what ever doesn't change or get better the more SP you have. Its easy to catch up with a 70m player on a skill by skill bases. Learning skills make it easyer to get them skills up and should stay. I new player should not be rushing into learning till they have a basic ship setup and are running level 1&2 missions, mining or trading. Learning skills adds a bit of trade off, learn faster over a short term or faster over the long term. Make your choice....
Malena	Posted - 2008.03.13 12:46:00 - [477] Dear God, Please let this thread die. Please. Please. I've been decent to my fellows, and I don't ask for much. But please let this thread die and let the whiners find something else to go on about. On second thought, let the thread keep going but force all the whiners to go here instead of finding something else. At least then I can go back to ignoring this one thread instead of having to wonder if there is a legitimate logical suggestion somewhere in all of them. Thanks, Malena
Kusha'an	Posted - 2008.03.13 13:14:00 - [478] Originally by: Malena Dear God, Please let this thread die. Please. Please. I've been decent to my fellows, and I don't ask for much. But please let this thread die and let the whiners find something else to go on about. On second thought, let the thread keep going but force all the whiners to go here instead of finding something else. At least then I can go back to ignoring this one thread instead of having to wonder if there is a legitimate logical suggestion somewhere in all of them. Thanks, Malena Can't even decide what to ask God for? Then can't edit the post properly when you change your mind? This post is FAIL.
Elain Reverse	Posted - 2008.03.13 23:04:00 - [479] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Danorium if i select a 3 day skill it has nothing to do with planning but just with keep a skill going. or i guess you only log in once a week. well maybe try X3 reunion there is no skill training in that game[/quote No offense mate but I think its priceless when a Newbie gives me tips about trying a different game because of the skill-system I have about 36 mio SP now after playing since beginning of 2006 and I have 10,15,20 ? skills that would take longer than a week - I even have a few skills which would take 30 days+ BUT I still want a skill-queue !!! Why? sigh I have mentioned it before in this thread at someplace ( PLEASE read through the WHOLE thread before giving answers like this..) 2. Logging on JUST to switch skills is a STUPID and UNNECCESSARY load on the servers which are often at there limit as it is !!!! 3. I am PAYING for playing and skilling so I would like to choose if and when I go online (DEACTIVATE SKILLTRAINING FROM INACTIVE ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!) sorry capkey got stuck 4.Eve¦s skillsystem in comparison to other games is built and designed that YOU MUST SKILL ALL THE TIME to NOT waste time. Its only gives you content not highendpower ! It takes you literally months/years to be able to be "highend" (Which I like about the skillsystem in EVE BUT as I said you are forced to be skilling at ALL TIMES ! In other games you can level up to highend in a few weeks (WoW - pukes) the trade off for skilling up while offline is tha5t you must login for a new skill to be trained. this has been like this since year dot for eve. as for months or years to high end one self is utter bull****e! I am pure amarr specced. almost 31m sp and i aint even 2 years old chr wise. its not how the game mechanics benifit you, its how you benifit the game as a whole. while i am not able to play eve till late july at the worste I am still able to login and do skill changes at least. I am presently doing Commandships to lvl V, i know THIS skill finishes around 3 am for my TZ, so just before downtime I am going to swtich to Medium beam spec V. with luck this skill will finish in the evening.. if not i can then CHOOSE a lower rank skill i need doen that will bring it into my "normal" game time. then i will finish off these two skills that are nearly done. to be honest. I find it more of a pain to do short skill trains lol. I ACTUALLY look forward to long skill trains. infact. i might just as my last act before i rejion eve is learn Maruaders V as its not an overly long skill train for me,36 days'ish. so i now have 4-5 months of skill up my chr. i reckon around july 6 i will be somewhat 36m+ sp so my advice to you is... got to your Loyaty point store, cash in your LP's buy 14.7 trillion matches, 23.012 tonnes of glue, 4 hectres of land in the shape of a valley then... BUILD A BRIDGE AND GET OVER IT! Well i partialy aggre with you, but its not easy sometime manage skills. You donr have unlimited number of skills at lvl 4 whitch takes days or even weeks to train (and even those often tend to end at your wrong time), thing is most of the time you have to deal with skills taking just few min or hours and i dont know how you, but i am spending 9h+ each day at work and 6h+ in bed and that means 2/3 of day you cant log into game to change skills and even more if you have familly, child or girlfriend. I dont want to count how many times my skill ended just on downtime or how many times i had to ask my friends to change my skills (and they did to ask me). Just 1 Slot for skill queue would realy help with all of this.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.03.14 13:46:00 - [480] With these extended downtimes this shows..again..that a backup-skill is needed. For example I only by chance heard that today the downtime would be extended to 14 pm. I started work at 14 pm. If I hadnt luckily had a long skill running it would have been 10 hours lost...again. This ****es me off - It cant be so hard to have a BACKUP-SKILL implemented can it? CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !

Sasiah Rising Sun Mining Inc. Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.15 04:33:00 - [481] I am up for a skill queue, mainly because I work, a lot. My first week I work 5 days, the next I only work two... but on those days I work I get maybe 1 hour to come online and check skills. I have recently started hard core skill swapping to min / max my training simply because otherwise I lose sometimes up to 7 - 8 hours of training like last night, where I had a two hour skill I had planned to flip... but my ISP died on me. It's ignorant that we can't queue at least 1 skill to start over when the training finishs. On the days I work, I am working 12 hours straight and I don't get to come online except maybe 1 hour when I get off and 1 hour when I wake up to go back to work. I like the idea of this queue simply for this reason. 1 training skill queued, but you have to be within 24 hours of it being up. God this would help me so much, and I would actually have a chance of seeing HULK sometime before the middle of the year. sigh Yes, I support this 100%. And for those of you who say "If you want a skill queue, you're lazy." Try my story on for size, and I work for a sheriff's department. I just don't have the time I would like to be able to train. Jeez, I would even support if we could only queue a certain number of times a month. Like, have an allotment of queue's you can do to keep farmers off of the process.
Ethan Joznin Darkhold Enterprises Caeruleum Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.16 11:21:00 - [482] LOL! I'm still shocked at the enormous amount of "casual" players that stress out over an imaginary character's "skill" training in an imaginary world. You claim to be casual players who don't take games so seriously but you're all whining (yea, I use whining because its a stronger word than complaining.) about skill training and losing precious training time. If you were really casual players who didn't take games seriously then losing a few hours of training time wouldn't matter. I'm going on a job for the next three months with limited internet access and I DON'T want a skill queue. I'm foresighted enough to train up several skills to level 4 and start one training to level 5 before I leave. Now I just have to log on sometime three weeks later and change to the next skill. Repeat 5 times and I can stay gone for over three months and not lose any training time. So I'll get to have my cake, I'll just have to wait a week after I get back before I can eat it. I think it will taste wonderful. x for no skill queue!!!
X950 Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2008.03.16 12:16:00 - [483] BLESS!!!
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.03.16 12:40:00 - [484] Originally by: Ethan Joznin LOL! I'm still shocked at the enormous amount of "casual" players that stress out over an imaginary character's "skill" training in an imaginary world. You claim to be casual players who don't take games so seriously but you're all whining (yea, I use whining because its a stronger word than complaining.) about skill training and losing precious training time. If you were really casual players who didn't take games seriously then losing a few hours of training time wouldn't matter. I'm going on a job for the next three months with limited internet access and I DON'T want a skill queue. I'm foresighted enough to train up several skills to level 4 and start one training to level 5 before I leave. Now I just have to log on sometime three weeks later and change to the next skill. Repeat 5 times and I can stay gone for over three months and not lose any training time. So I'll get to have my cake, I'll just have to wait a week after I get back before I can eat it. I think it will taste wonderful. x for no skill queue!!! Youre a spiteful selfish little **** arent you? You are probly one of those people who like to take other peoples parking places away in front of there noses, and the kind of person I get hauled to court for,for breaking there noses... Thousands of people want a skill-queue - We are talking about a ONE Skillqueue - A BACKUP Skill You probly dont even know about that do you? You found this thread and without reading it and constructivley bringing arguments you just post your drivel to annoy people... Have a nice day and may your head NOT fall off at an akward moment.. CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Ogdru Jahad Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.03.16 14:35:00 - [485] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Ethan Joznin LOL! I'm still shocked at the enormous amount of "casual" players that stress out over an imaginary character's "skill" training in an imaginary world. You claim to be casual players who don't take games so seriously but you're all whining (yea, I use whining because its a stronger word than complaining.) about skill training and losing precious training time. If you were really casual players who didn't take games seriously then losing a few hours of training time wouldn't matter. I'm going on a job for the next three months with limited internet access and I DON'T want a skill queue. I'm foresighted enough to train up several skills to level 4 and start one training to level 5 before I leave. Now I just have to log on sometime three weeks later and change to the next skill. Repeat 5 times and I can stay gone for over three months and not lose any training time. So I'll get to have my cake, I'll just have to wait a week after I get back before I can eat it. I think it will taste wonderful. x for no skill queue!!! Youre a spiteful selfish little **** arent you? You are probly one of those people who like to take other peoples parking places away in front of there noses, and the kind of person I get hauled to court for,for breaking there noses... Thousands of people want a skill-queue - We are talking about a ONE Skillqueue - A BACKUP Skill You probly dont even know about that do you? You found this thread and without reading it and constructivley bringing arguments you just post your drivel to annoy people... Have a nice day and may your head NOT fall off at an akward moment.. how about ccp make is so you must be online only to train? how does that sounds? - If a pig loses his voice...is he disgruntled?
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.03.16 22:25:00 - [486] Edited by: Belmarduk on 16/03/2008 22:26:37 Originally by: Ogdru Jahad how about ccp make is so you must be online only to train? how does that sounds?[/quote Eve would be unplayable and everyone would still be flying T1 ships. People, you confuse content-opening with leveling. The system we have in Eve is good - but - it is built that you MUST skill from the first minute you play away otherwise you seriously fall back. Skilltime you lose here is LOST (and I¦m not talking about a few minutes but days,weeks - which can happen if you play for longer...) In other games you can level (Wow pukes)- If you fall back you can catch up again easily if you have a period of time where you can play more - NOT so in Eve. And if you work and have a RL it can happen FAST that you can lose 16 hours...Add that up and it gets BIG - the time you lost. It shouldnt be a hassle to skill ! Noone is talking about queuing up skills for weeks/months ! We ONLY want a backup-skill - ONE SKILL ! What also ****es me off is that this has been on the DRAWINGBOARD for MONTHS now.... Talk about dangling a carrot infront of ones nose and then a kick in the face... Greetings Belmarduk Edit: Typo CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Sue Mee Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.03.17 07:47:00 - [487] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad how about ccp make is so you must be online only to train? how does that sounds? great, as long as we get sp from missions and rats. uppps, welcome back to wow. eve sp system is balanced about the fact that we skill all the time. i would be stupid to be online 5 days (which can be as much as 3 months if you play 1 hour daily) to train navigation 5. you just dont think what you say, or are you that dumb?
Cfiloruz Xilocient Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.03.17 12:05:00 - [488] Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 21/06/2007 09:13:33 I wouldn't mind a queue for the next skill only to automatically start training, just so we don't have to lose time or switch to another halfway because a skill will complete during downtime or when we're not home. We would still be required to log in for every skill to put next in the queue, but it'd be at a time that's convenient, and not whenever the timer happens to run out. what he said. I totally agree. this would be helpful.
ICommandoI Astral Wolf Pack	Posted - 2008.03.19 02:33:00 - [489] Originally by: Ethan Joznin LOL! I'm still shocked at the enormous amount of "casual" players that stress out over an imaginary character's "skill" training in an imaginary world. You claim to be casual players who don't take games so seriously but you're all whining (yea, I use whining because its a stronger word than complaining.) about skill training and losing precious training time. If you were really casual players who didn't take games seriously then losing a few hours of training time wouldn't matter. I'm going on a job for the next three months with limited internet access and I DON'T want a skill queue. I'm foresighted enough to train up several skills to level 4 and start one training to level 5 before I leave. Now I just have to log on sometime three weeks later and change to the next skill. Repeat 5 times and I can stay gone for over three months and not lose any training time. So I'll get to have my cake, I'll just have to wait a week after I get back before I can eat it. I think it will taste wonderful. x for no skill queue!!! You pay for either a 30 Day Game Time Card, or 90 Day Game time Card, or pay per month via Credit Card. And in that time you expect those x days you've purchased to be used up appropriately and not get wasted because there is a lack of feature for players. If you paid 1 day by day basis then I don't think people would really care if they lost a few hours per day to on skill training. Which means the next day they will have to pay for again and continue the cycle. ie. they're getting close to 98% of their monies worth. If they're paying for 30 days / 90 days / per month via CC. Then they expect to receive what they are paying for. And those few hours per day stack up x 30 days = how many days lost on skill training? A lot. So it comes down to ie. you're paying for a service and you want 100% use of that service for the duration of the time you have purchased! BOTTOM OF THE LINE! THAT IS IT! Simple. Sorry for caps but it had to be noted and that is why the "casual" player wants skill queue, which all players would benefit from.
Cae'phon	Posted - 2008.03.21 04:29:00 - [490] I for one would love to see a Skill Training Que Skill, As far as training time, for those of us who have work, would be a very nice way of describing it, would have it skill based, where the time that the que would start would be doubled each time: Level 1: 30 Minutes Level 2: 1 Hour Level 3: 2 Hours Level 4: 4 Hours Level 5: 8 Hours The nice thing about this set-up, is that when first starting out, level 1 would be perfect for semi-noobs (Still can't be trained on Trial Accounts, and it's a Rank 10 Skill) Getting it to level 4 would be perfect for most with jobs and such, as you could train any skill less than 4 hours, and it could then switch to a longer skill, or even the next level of that skill. It isn't viable for Char-Farms as the que doesn't give them an option to just say hey I want Battleship 5 then Titan 5 to que up as BS is done. It's a viable Option to use, as most would just get it to level 4 for their work days. Does not breed laziness, just gives a litle shove in the right direction. And being a Rank 10 skill to boot means you have to work for that litle helper.

Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.03.21 09:26:00 - [491] Originally by: Cae'phon I for one would love to see a Skill Training Que Skill, As far as training time, for those of us who have work, would be a very nice way of describing it, would have it skill based, where the time that the que would start would be doubled each time: Level 1: 30 Minutes Level 2: 1 Hour Level 3: 2 Hours Level 4: 4 Hours Level 5: 8 Hours The nice thing about this set-up, is that when first starting out, level 1 would be perfect for semi-noobs (Still can't be trained on Trial Accounts, and it's a Rank 10 Skill) Getting it to level 4 would be perfect for most with jobs and such, as you could train any skill less than 4 hours, and it could then switch to a longer skill, or even the next level of that skill. It isn't viable for Char-Farms as the que doesn't give them an option to just say hey I want Battleship 5 then Titan 5 to que up as BS is done. It's a viable Option to use, as most would just get it to level 4 for their work days. Does not breed laziness, just gives a litle shove in the right direction. And being a Rank 10 skill to boot means you have to work for that litle helper. please, no more useless skills. just give us a backup skill CCP!!!!!
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.03.31 11:29:00 - [492] Originally by: Sue Mee please, no more useless skills. just give us a backup skill CCP!!!!! Yep - bumps CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Pegasus IX	Posted - 2008.03.31 13:22:00 - [493] I did not read this whole thread, but indeed I came to this forum to request this feature. Where I'm coming from: Give the noobies a break! C'mon! I have 23m SP and I don't really need this functionality, but the noobies do! Logic: Eve is HARD to get started in! Give the noobs a break by allowing them to queue 1 skill, or simply have the "Continue next level" feature. Lets face it, it is hard enough to get going in eve as it is, logging in every 2 hours to train a skill is an even bigger pain! And honestly, its only the noobies that are affected by this. Why the heck not? I would say certainly not to have an unlimited queue, but 1 or 2 skills in queue would be very helpful to new players. signed.
1Commando1 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.04.01 01:59:00 - [494] /signed for a skillque system
ceyriot Crimson Rebellion Cold Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:20:00 - [495] no wall'o'text, just /signed Faction Store
Jita Laggy	Posted - 2008.04.01 03:06:00 - [496] :) [img]<a href="http://www.smilenet3.net/" ><img src="http://off1.picsrc.net/images/sluv/animateme/animatedASCIIArtGirlDancinSexi.gif" border=0></a><br><a href="http://www.smilenet3.net/" >Sexy Comments
N'jai Hill	Posted - 2008.04.01 12:13:00 - [497] Its a game. Not the end of the world if u miss a few hours of training time. Already good enough we dont have to spend a bunch of time in game. First it will be one skill. Then more people will cry two. Then why cant we que up 4 and get speeded training time. Next you people will want auto pilot to jump like a player would. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
N'jai Hill Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.04.01 12:22:00 - [498] Originally by: ICommandoI Originally by: Ethan Joznin LOL! I'm still shocked at the enormous amount of "casual" players that stress out over an imaginary character's "skill" training in an imaginary world. You claim to be casual players who don't take games so seriously but you're all whining (yea, I use whining because its a stronger word than complaining.) about skill training and losing precious training time. If you were really casual players who didn't take games seriously then losing a few hours of training time wouldn't matter. I'm going on a job for the next three months with limited internet access and I DON'T want a skill queue. I'm foresighted enough to train up several skills to level 4 and start one training to level 5 before I leave. Now I just have to log on sometime three weeks later and change to the next skill. Repeat 5 times and I can stay gone for over three months and not lose any training time. So I'll get to have my cake, I'll just have to wait a week after I get back before I can eat it. I think it will taste wonderful. x for no skill queue!!! You pay for either a 30 Day Game Time Card, or 90 Day Game time Card, or pay per month via Credit Card. And in that time you expect those x days you've purchased to be used up appropriately and not get wasted because there is a lack of feature for players. If you paid 1 day by day basis then I don't think people would really care if they lost a few hours per day to on skill training. Which means the next day they will have to pay for again and continue the cycle. ie. they're getting close to 98% of their monies worth. If they're paying for 30 days / 90 days / per month via CC. Then they expect to receive what they are paying for. And those few hours per day stack up x 30 days = how many days lost on skill training? A lot. So it comes down to ie. you're paying for a service and you want 100% use of that service for the duration of the time you have purchased! BOTTOM OF THE LINE! THAT IS IT! Simple. Sorry for caps but it had to be noted and that is why the "casual" player wants skill queue, which all players would benefit from. Yes since theres plenty of MMOs that offer you ability to progress when not logged on. So you want reimbursement for not being entertained... Hmmmm I have to do real life stuff, EvE better automate my game play for me. What about FPS or RPGs... you payed the intial approx 60 dollars for them so they should give you 2 months of experience,skill, or knowledge in the game for any time that you arent playing, and are doing real life things. Big deal if you miss a training completion. All players wouldn't benefit. In the short run it seems like a benefit because even people like me who dont want it, or still reaping the benefits. But then farmers come in and see its easy to train up a saught after character. ISK sellers are already bad enough, we dont need more excuses for farmers to come. Seriously, missing a hour, hell even a day of training time is not the end of the world. No kittens will be killed.
align2me Fleeting Moments of Insanity	Posted - 2008.04.01 12:52:00 - [499] Just out of interest... has this post... in all its 17 pages of glory... ever had a single CCP reply? I for one agree this is required functionality for casual players with families etc... I am also going away on holiday for a few weeks on Saturday and its impossible for me to use the time constructively in Eve whilst I am gone... defeating the concept of training even when you can't be online... Would be nice for things like that... But should definitely STOP the second your subscription runs out. Join -FMI- Now!!!!
Bob Artis	Posted - 2008.04.01 18:13:00 - [500] Ok well I don't know if anyone has suggested this yet (And I am not spending 2 hours checking to see if someone has in these 17 pages) So heres how I think the skill auto-training should work. The queue for this system should be unlimited in how many skills you can put in the queue. What the limit should be is for how long the system will "auto switch" for you. For example if you put 100 skills in the queue, and the time limit is 24 hours then after 24 hours the queue will no longer switch to your next skill. After 24 hours are up you can log back in and reset the command. It will continue switching skills for you that you have in your queue for another 24 hours. Why would this system work? If it will only auto switch for 24 hours then farming will not be possible unless they plan on getting on that account every 24 hours, but it will still help you get all the small skills while your away. But Im going to be gone for 2 weeks, and I can't get back on every 24 hours! Set the queue so that the final skill in the queue is longer then your time away. If you have any questions I can answer them. It might just take me a while since I'm currently limited to computer access.

Falaricae University of Caille	Posted - 2008.04.02 06:29:00 - [501] Just implement a backup skill system already. Some will abuse it, so what? Don't **** over all the playerbase for the actions of the few. People who don't want to use it and play EVE the way it is now still can. Though I bet none will, since having a backup skill only makes sense.
Kusha'an Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.02 14:24:00 - [502] Originally by: Falaricae Just implement a backup skill system already. Some will abuse it, so what? Don't **** over all the playerbase for the actions of the few. People who don't want to use it and play EVE the way it is now still can. Though I bet none will, since having a backup skill only makes sense. THIS. I will bet that all the naysayers would take advantage of this system despite their "principles" just as they take advantage of the overview and all the boosts that their personal ships have received over the years.
Kyreax	Posted - 2008.04.02 22:29:00 - [503] What about if the skill training stops, then a RANDOM other skill starts training after ten minutes of no action? It could switch between skills every day until you log back on, giving you tons of skillpoints in useless stuff (but doesn't stop), encouraging you to log back on to stop the madness! --------------------------------------------------- It's a Templar, an Amarr Fighter used by Carriers.
ceyriot Crimson Rebellion Cold Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.05 00:39:00 - [504] Originally by: Kyreax What about if the skill training stops, then a RANDOM other skill starts training after ten minutes of no action? It could switch between skills every day until you log back on, giving you tons of skillpoints in useless stuff (but doesn't stop), encouraging you to log back on to stop the madness! This is good as well, cause you could end up training Presence V Faction Store
Damien Wind	Posted - 2008.04.05 19:43:00 - [505] The music and game industry is just starting to figure out that pirates aren't customers, never have been, and never will be: ergo, some developers are starting to drop copy protections that are so stringent it ends up irritating the actual customers. You can probably already see the parallel I'm going for here. The farmers, isk sellers, whatever, aren't really CCP's customers. Those of us with paid accounts who get into EVE, love it, and want 'in' for the long haul, are the customers. We decide, with our money, what CCP should and shouldn't do with the game. It's really not up to a small group of people exploiting the system, is it? So why spend all of your time, effort, money, and energy focused on what that minority is doing? Anyone with me, there? Can we have skill queuing now? The 9-to-5ers like me will <3 you for it, CCP! :D
Achran Dexx CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.05 20:57:00 - [506] Originally by: Damien Wind The music and game industry is just starting to figure out that pirates aren't customers, never have been, and never will be: ergo, some developers are starting to drop copy protections that are so stringent it ends up irritating the actual customers. You can probably already see the parallel I'm going for here. The farmers, isk sellers, whatever, aren't really CCP's customers. Those of us with paid accounts who get into EVE, love it, and want 'in' for the long haul, are the customers. We decide, with our money, what CCP should and shouldn't do with the game. It's really not up to a small group of people exploiting the system, is it? So why spend all of your time, effort, money, and energy focused on what that minority is doing? Anyone with me, there? Can we have skill queuing now? The 9-to-5ers like me will <3 you for it, CCP! :D Wrong. You decide to join their game, abide by their rules and play with the content that you are given, and promised every patch. I say no to this skill-queue, if you tell those that 'have nothing better to do than follow up every second of their skills' to essentially ** off then you are wrong, very very wrong. I've been playing for about a month now and I believe you guys are really, really **** up. When a skill ends, and I'm not there, I honestly couldn't care less. I play Eve to have fun, not to have the most skillpoints or to get closer to those five-year old veterans who have deserved their edge over the casual gamer. This is Eve. Nobody cares.
SheriffFruitfly FlyinPenguin Enterprises	Posted - 2008.04.05 21:47:00 - [507] Just a queue of 1 would be fine with me, and wouldn't help the farmers significantly.
HakanSherif	Posted - 2008.04.07 12:32:00 - [508] additional 1 skill at queue, training stops if the account is not paid. Loads of happy ppl. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Est Sularus oth Mithas
Lodia Jaegermeister Bedlam Consortium	Posted - 2008.04.07 13:00:00 - [509] Originally by: HakanSherif additional 1 skill at queue, training stops if the account is not paid. Loads of happy ppl. /signed
Kusha'an Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.07 13:15:00 - [510] Edited by: Kusha''an on 07/04/2008 13:16:49 Originally by: Achran Dexx I've been playing for about a month now and I believe you guys are really, really ** up. You really believe this, noob? That the thousands of people who work full time jobs and don't want to be punished for the actions of isk farmers are "really, really ***ed up?" I guess in your delusional, narcissistic world, anyone* who thinks anything that isn't perfectly aligned with your extreme views is "really, really **ed up." You, sir, sound like a wacko. Originally by:** welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.

Edgar Loke Knights with Honor Invictus Imperium	Posted - 2008.04.07 14:06:00 - [511] Perhaps allow the queue system for low characters, say their first 14 days or something like that. Allow one aditional item to be queued and beyond the 14 days (or X number of skill points) and then disable the system. That would make it easier for new folks to get in, and still provide what the game has for longer playing folks.
Kusha'an	Posted - 2008.04.07 14:48:00 - [512] I'll give an example of how inefficient the current system is. Let's say you want to upgrade your gunnery dps. So you buy all the requisite gun skills and train them to level 2. Now you have, say, 6 or 7 skills, each of which will take approx 7-8 hours to train to level 3. Say you get home from work at 5:30 and are in bed by 11 pm. That's 6.5 hours per skill. So you train sharpshooting for 6.5 hours and then go to bed, having set a long skill. The next day after work you finish sharpshooting and start with controlled bursts. You switch to a long skill again and go to bed. The next day (day 3) after work you finish controlled bursts and start on surgical strike. Again you go to bed after setting another long skill. You finish surgical strike the 4th day. 4 days, 3 skills, part of a long skill trained. Skill que: You set sharpshooting when you get home and then controlled bursts as queued skill. The next day both are finished. Then you set surgical strike and queue up trajectory analysis. The next day both skills are finished. 2 days, 4 short skills, no long skill trained. Result: Your goal is reached, gunnery dps increased in less time. This equals more fun, and faster. Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Achran Dexx CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.07 15:03:00 - [513] Edited by: Achran Dexx on 07/04/2008 15:02:51 Originally by: Kusha'an Edited by: Kusha''an on 07/04/2008 13:16:49 Originally by: Achran Dexx I've been playing for about a month now and I believe you guys are really, really ** up. You really believe this, noob? That the thousands of people who work full time jobs and don't want to be punished for the actions of isk farmers are "really, really ***ed up?" I guess in your delusional, narcissistic world, anyone* who thinks anything that isn't perfectly aligned with your extreme views is "really, really **ed up." You, sir, sound like a wacko. You make it sound like I don't have a job. But unless you whiners, I don't care if I lose some time. I don't care if I have to get another skill that doesn't make me benefit faster. EVE does not offer instant or fast gratification. EVE is a cold, harsh place, nobody cares. Oh yeah, compliments on using the word 'noob'. I believe the word you are looking for is 'newb' or 'newbie'. Originally by:** Kusha'an I'll give an example of how inefficient the current system is. Let's say you want to upgrade your gunnery dps. So you buy all the requisite gun skills and train them to level 2. Now you have, say, 6 or 7 skills, each of which will take approx 7-8 hours to train to level 3. Say you get home from work at 5:30 and are in bed by 11 pm. That's 6.5 hours per skill. So you train sharpshooting for 6.5 hours and then go to bed, having set a long skill. The next day after work you finish sharpshooting and start with controlled bursts. You switch to a long skill again and go to bed. The next day (day 3) after work you finish controlled bursts and start on surgical strike. Again you go to bed after setting another long skill. You finish surgical strike the 4th day. 4 days, 3 skills, part of a long skill trained. Skill que: You set sharpshooting when you get home and then controlled bursts as queued skill. The next day both are finished. Then you set surgical strike and queue up trajectory analysis. The next day both skills are finished. 2 days, 4 short skills, no long skill trained. Result: Your goal is reached, gunnery dps increased in less time. This equals more fun, and faster. Yet again, nobody cares. If you know you are going to lose time, you train a DIFFERENT SKILL. There, problem solved. You lose what? Seven, eight hours of your 'more fun and faster' gunnery DPS, but you don't lose skill time. There are literally TONS of people who play daily, who have jobs (amongst them, me) and manage to overcome that problem by simply training ANOTHER (useful) skill. But you don't see them complain, eh? I've said it before in a different thread: work with the tools that you are given.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.04.07 18:06:00 - [514] 1. Who the hell are you? 2. You are calling many people (also many vets) whiners ? 3. After one month you REALLY know the game eh? 4. Read the whole bloody thread before posting drizzle - There are many of the reasons for a single-skill skill-queue posted and EXPLAINED why it is needed ! 5. Good day Mr Newbie/Noob/Newb CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Apertotes	Posted - 2008.04.07 18:31:00 - [515] Originally by: Achran Dexx Yet again, nobody cares. wow, nobody wrote 18 pages already. must be quite a surprising nobody.
Achran Dexx	Posted - 2008.04.07 19:10:00 - [516] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Yet again, nobody cares. wow, nobody wrote 18 pages already. must be quite a surprising nobody. If even half a percent of the eve community would want a queue, this thread would be over a hundred pages. Originally by: Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue ! I'm a casual player, and I don't want a queue.
Apertotes	Posted - 2008.04.07 20:00:00 - [517] Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Yet again, nobody cares. wow, nobody wrote 18 pages already. must be quite a surprising nobody. If even half a percent of the eve community would want a queue, this thread would be over a hundred pages. wow, you are a genius at statistics
Kusha'an	Posted - 2008.04.07 20:09:00 - [518] Edited by: Kusha''an on 07/04/2008 20:09:22 Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Yet again, nobody cares. wow, nobody wrote 18 pages already. must be quite a surprising nobody. If even half a percent of the eve community would want a queue, this thread would be over a hundred pages. Wrong. You're assuming that all the people who care have the time to post on the forums. And you are a newb, a newbie, a noob, and an a-hole. And I never suggested that you don't have a job, that was your paranoid schizophrenia acting up again. Go take your meds and stop flaming like an idiot. Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Kusha'an	Posted - 2008.04.07 20:12:00 - [519] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Yet again, nobody cares. wow, nobody wrote 18 pages already. must be quite a surprising nobody. If even half a percent of the eve community would want a queue, this thread would be over a hundred pages. wow, you are a genius at statistics Yeah, he doesn't have a clue. Even assuming 40,000 players, half a percent would be 200 people. So his statement would only be true if each page held 2 posts. Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Ogdru Jahad Timetravel Enterprises Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.04.07 20:36:00 - [520] my final word on the matter is... SKILL QUE IS A WASTE OF GAME MECHANICS! itr will cause heaps of problems. ALWAYS traina long skill when you sleep or goto work/school. - Wanted To Sell - Guardian Angel Standing 2k isk per 1 LP

gr7hug	Posted - 2008.04.08 00:30:00 - [521] IMHO this feature should have been introduced 1 year after launch. gives non-vets a break. Lets face it, if you are above 20m skillpoints and you have need for a queue (aside from extenuating circumstances) you have just managed your training poorly. I think being able to set a backup skill would be REALLY nice.
Carmine Morgan	Posted - 2008.04.08 08:29:00 - [522] 1 skill queue would be a really good addition to skill training system. Chaotic Order Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Morrigu Storm	Posted - 2008.04.08 09:52:00 - [523] I want a queue system. Can't see why ppl raise so many objections about it tbfh!
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.08 15:38:00 - [524] Originally by: Ogdru Jahad my final word on the matter good. and please, all those know-it-all that say train a long skill when sleeping and short skill etc etc etc... shut up, we all know that. you are not smarter than the rest. but, unfortunately, there is this thing called UNEXPECTED and UNSCHEDULED server downtimes that may caught on you with a 10 minute skill training and make you loose lots of hours. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH A 1 SKILL QUEUE. ps: those that say it would benefit farmers... yes, just like mining lasers autorepeating. should we nerf them too?
ttkr	Posted - 2008.04.09 09:57:00 - [525] So... Any official reply from dev team on this topic?
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.09 14:33:00 - [526] Originally by: ttkr So... Any official reply from dev team on this topic? devs ignore this topic like the plague. you'll only find old quotes (+2 year old) saying that there would never ever be a skill queue. but some months later they added it to the designboard, and since then, not a single word on the issue. i think that CCP believes that the slower we train, the more money we expend on this game.
padraig animal Minmatar MisFunk Inc. Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2008.04.09 15:13:00 - [527] Edited by: padraig animal on 09/04/2008 15:13:54 Originally by: padraig animal http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/plannedfeat.asp Quote: Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again. It's still on the drawing board ,for me i don't need it but if they ever implant it i would use it why not [i]btw i guess 90% of who are posting haven't even searched for it ... anyway my first reply was 2007.07.25 ... ;)
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.09 21:33:00 - [528] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: ttkr So... Any official reply from dev team on this topic? devs ignore this topic like the plague. you'll only find old quotes (+2 year old) saying that there would never ever be a skill queue. but some months later they added it to the designboard, and since then, not a single word on the issue. i think that CCP believes that the slower we train, the more money we expend on this game. Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.09 22:15:00 - [529] Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: ttkr So... Any official reply from dev team on this topic? devs ignore this topic like the plague. you'll only find old quotes (+2 year old) saying that there would never ever be a skill queue. but some months later they added it to the designboard, and since then, not a single word on the issue. i think that CCP believes that the slower we train, the more money we expend on this game. Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription. thanks for the free bump. this topic is not exposed enough
Grarr Dexx Amarr laloutre Corp	Posted - 2008.04.10 12:35:00 - [530] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: ttkr So... Any official reply from dev team on this topic? devs ignore this topic like the plague. you'll only find old quotes (+2 year old) saying that there would never ever be a skill queue. but some months later they added it to the designboard, and since then, not a single word on the issue. i think that CCP believes that the slower we train, the more money we expend on this game. Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription. thanks for the free bump. this topic is not exposed enough Thanks for proving my point, idiot. You can't even come up with a valid response anymore, thread closed.

Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.10 13:14:00 - [531] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Thanks for proving my point, idiot. You can't even come up with a valid response anymore, thread closed. That's funny, I don't see "Moderator" under your name, poser. So if they decide to give us a skill queue, do we have YOUR word that you will never use it, Oh wise sage Eve superplayer? After all, supermagnificos like you don't need upgrades to the game to win EVE, do they? Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Gil sArne	Posted - 2008.04.11 10:41:00 - [532] Edited by: Gil sArne on 11/04/2008 10:44:48 Originally by: Mr Friendly Not again Eve is lucky enough to HAVE an offline training mode... however, we are supposed to log in every now and again... it encourages game immersion, forming bonds and CARING But if you forget or are unable to change your skill because of some reason or another it promotes detatchment and a feeling of "Oh Crap". My skill will finish in about 30 minutes and unfortunatly I'm at work and there is nothing I can do to change my skill queue. Originally by: Achran Dexx Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription. Good idea, thanks.
padraig animal Minmatar MisFunk Inc. Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2008.04.11 13:52:00 - [533] Originally by: Achran Dexx Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription. Good idea, thanks. You quit ? can i have your stuff ? Well about lucky the train when offline ,if not the whole training schedule would be different so imo not really something to compare .
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.11 14:13:00 - [534] Originally by: padraig animal Well about lucky the train when offline ,if not the whole training schedule would be different so imo not really something to compare . ??? Is English your third language? Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.12 15:59:00 - [535] Originally by: Gil sArne Edited by: Gil sArne on 11/04/2008 10:44:48 Originally by: Mr Friendly Not again Eve is lucky enough to HAVE an offline training mode... however, we are supposed to log in every now and again... it encourages game immersion, forming bonds and CARING But if you forget or are unable to change your skill because of some reason or another it promotes detatchment and a feeling of "Oh Crap". My skill will finish in about 30 minutes and unfortunatly I'm at work and there is nothing I can do to change my skill queue. Originally by: Achran Dexx Boo ******* hoo. The skill queue wasn't there when you subscribed for this game, and it still isn't. If you don't want to pay, cancel your subscription. Good idea, thanks. Oh man, you lose a few hours, oh no! Now you'll never be able to catch up to the 50 million SP characters who also never used a skill queue.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.12 21:33:00 - [536] Originally by: Achran Dexx Oh man, you lose a few hours, oh no! Now you'll never be able to catch up to the 50 million SP characters who also never used a skill queue. once again, thanks for the bump. you are doing a terrific job CCP, it would be nice to know whether you are serious about this feature or you just added it to the designboard hoping we would be quieter.
Hesod Adee Xen Of Onslaught	Posted - 2008.04.13 10:05:00 - [537] I support a skill queue since the current system is regularly making me chose between a long skill I don't really need (things like shield management 5 when I'm armor tanking), or skills I want sooner which require me to login for a quick skill change when I get up. And this is what happens during my normal schedule when I don't have any surprises. I've personally lost skill training time to both unexpected downtimes, my ISP having problems, and even having Eve somehow interpret a skill change command as the pause training command. There was no way for me to predict any of these, but with a training queue I wouldn't of lost anything. Since I don't have time to read the entire thread, I'll just ask what unresolved arguments are there against a skill training queue ? In case the argument about people making characters to sell isn't resolved, my position is that if an account is suspended because the owner isn't paying for it (with cash or GTCs) then they don't deserve to have any skill training happening. This includes the skill that is left running when the account gets closed.
Evita Achura Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.04.15 09:14:00 - [538] Edited by: Evita Achura on 15/04/2008 09:14:53 I know lets support skill training changes through the API! Then you don't need a Q or an argument about one. You can change them out of game! Wouldn't that be great! .... oh look flames comming ....
Dwissi Amarr Miners Delight Valainaloce	Posted - 2008.04.15 11:36:00 - [539] Edited by: Dwissi on 15/04/2008 11:36:53 Originally by: Evita Achura Edited by: Evita Achura on 15/04/2008 09:14:53 I know lets support skill training changes through the API! Then you don't need a Q or an argument about one. You can change them out of game! Wouldn't that be great! .... oh look flames comming .... lol - no flames yet - but that is a double or triple no anyways. API is and has to stay read only - so no fishy thingy there anyways :p Totally against any kind of queue - i am an old roleplayer and people think too much in grinding and CT terms. Eve is a fantasy world - hence a role playing tag MMORPG. In pen&paper times when you couldnt be with your mates and play - your char wouldnt advance. CCP makes us allready a gift by allowing to keep on skilling while offline - and i dont ever want it different. *Miners delight - your one stop source for dedicated services and equipment for the mining industry.* [url="http://desusig.crumpleco
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.15 13:52:00 - [540] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Oh man, you lose a few hours, oh no! Now you'll never be able to catch up to the 50 million SP characters who also never used a skill queue. once again, thanks for the bump. you are doing a terrific job CCP, it would be nice to know whether you are serious about this feature or you just added it to the designboard hoping we would be quieter. Not like this stupid thread isn't going to stay first-page anyways. If you've got nothing to retort with, please refrain from posting altogether! I know you guys are just doing it for laziness and personal gain, and easy gratification. No thanks.

Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.15 15:51:00 - [541] Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Oh man, you lose a few hours, oh no! Now you'll never be able to catch up to the 50 million SP characters who also never used a skill queue. once again, thanks for the bump. you are doing a terrific job CCP, it would be nice to know whether you are serious about this feature or you just added it to the designboard hoping we would be quieter. Not like this stupid thread isn't going to stay first-page anyways. If you've got nothing to retort with, please refrain from posting altogether! I know you guys are just doing it for laziness and personal gain, and easy gratification. No thanks. yay!!! third one!!! looks like you are the most interested on this queue thing. still, i am intrigued to know how do you do to completely not understand anything we are saying. i mean, either you are a troll, or you are not reading anything at all, but that would make you a troll, also, wouldnt it?
Grarr Dexx Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.04.16 12:30:00 - [542] Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Apertotes Originally by: Achran Dexx Oh man, you lose a few hours, oh no! Now you'll never be able to catch up to the 50 million SP characters who also never used a skill queue. once again, thanks for the bump. you are doing a terrific job CCP, it would be nice to know whether you are serious about this feature or you just added it to the designboard hoping we would be quieter. Not like this stupid thread isn't going to stay first-page anyways. If you've got nothing to retort with, please refrain from posting altogether! I know you guys are just doing it for laziness and personal gain, and easy gratification. No thanks. yay!!! third one!!! looks like you are the most interested on this queue thing. still, i am intrigued to know how do you do to completely not understand anything we are saying. i mean, either you are a troll, or you are not reading anything at all, but that would make you a troll, also, wouldnt it? What??? I countered ALL your points, provided insight, and you dare call me a troll? Why don't you just ADAPT to the game, instead of bending it your way. It's not cause you pay a measly 15-30-45 bucks per month that you should affect the lives of the 200.000+ characters who do not agree with you.
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.16 12:44:00 - [543] Edited by: Kusha''an on 16/04/2008 12:44:10 Originally by: Grarr Dexx I countered ALL your points, provided insight, and you dare call me a troll? Why don't you just ADAPT to the game, instead of bending it your way. It's not cause you pay a measly 15-30-45 bucks per month that you should affect the lives of the 200.000+ characters who do not agree with you. Hey troll... 1. You haven't countered jack shi-zzle from where I sit. 2. There aren't 200,000+ characters that do not agree with our position that we should have a skill queue. 3. CCP has considered doing this, so obviously the idea has merit. 4. Your life would not be affected by a skill queue in any negative way. 5. You are resorting to hyperbole so as not to let the facts get in the way of a trollish rant. Your post is FAIL. Originally by: welsh wizard stupid falcon pilots uncloak all the time coz they think they need to surface for air.
Belmarduk de Prieure	Posted - 2008.04.16 17:16:00 - [544] Edited by: Belmarduk on 16/04/2008 17:18:36 @ Mr Deex and also Mr alt Dexx I dont understand your problem - Why are you so against a skill-queue - You DONT understand much about the gamemechanics or do you claim to be an expert after hm 6 weeks now? I will refrain from listing reasons ...again... go and read through the whole thread first ----> Off to page 1 with you @ The peron who wrote this a few posts back: (edit: Dwissy) "Totally against any kind of queue - i am an old roleplayer and people think too much in grinding and CT terms. Eve is a fantasy world - hence a role playing tag MMORPG. In pen&paper times when you couldnt be with your mates and play - your char wouldnt advance. CCP makes us allready a gift by allowing to keep on skilling while offline - and i dont ever want it different." Now thats constructive feedback (ey Mr dexx? ) But I have in an earlier post explained WHY we learn offline and why we MUST allways train not to fall behind etc etc and that with this unique skillsystem a comparrison to levelgrinding etc is not correct Greetings Belmarduk
El Shaddai	Posted - 2008.04.17 13:55:00 - [545] Let me first start by saying that I am currently on my second attempt at EVE. I started playing EVE over two years ago and eventually had to stop playing because I could never spend enough time in the game. That meant my character never really got anywhere and I couldnÆt justify paying for something I wasnÆt getting a great deal out of. I am back in the game now as I have more time to make it the experience it should be. I have to agree that a 1 or 2 skill queue would be a good idea, for two reasons: 1)There are times when you simply canÆt get to the game no matter how hard you try. EVEÆs skill system is a breath of fresh air in the ægrind and growÆ world of on-line gaming, its complexity and potential for variance is unrivalled and should be applauded. That being said it has one enormous drawback: If you have time to sit at a PC all day you get the best char. If you donÆt, you donÆt. The issue with this is that someone who can spend all day ensuring that no time is lost on their skill building pays the same monthly fee as someone who canÆt, but gets far more benefit from it. Now this is all fair and ecumenical if the game is your basic æGAGÆ style. The more you are online, the better you should be. But thatÆs not what EVE should, over even pertains, to be. The more you are online, the more Gold and standing, and contact benefits you should get, but due to the nature of the system, it shouldnÆt mean you are better in every conceivable way. 2)Nobody is asking for a 20 or 30 skill mega list of queued skills. All that we are asking is that we can have a single (or at most 2) skills waiting to start, in the off-chance that our real lives stop us getting to a PC to log on for a few days. I completely understand that there are issues with this: Firstly, and most importantly, is the dreaded Char-Farmer, who would start heavy skills off and then not pay. Well donÆt let them. If you donÆt have a valid subscription, all skill training stops (at the moment the subscription runs out). Secondly, that these mega-chars could then be sold for vast amounts of cash. Again, donÆt allow it. It has to be asked why EVE allows characters to be sold for cash in the first place? People have argued that just because they no longer play a character, why shouldnÆt someone else? I love the altruism of that. If that be the case; give them away. Profiteering is profiteering. If you allow any form of it you open the system up for abuse. You canÆt want to be able to sell your old chars yourself, but then moan because someone finds a way of abusing it. If you stop the character sale and transfer system, you can then implement a limited skill queue without it affecting the game, because great characters canÆt be sold and so are worthless. Thirdly; the æAll Characters Would Be AwesomeÆ idea. That simply wouldnÆt be the case. You would still have to log on to ensure you had gained enough gold and standings to be able to be of any use in the game. Also, if you arenÆt on-line that often, who cares how good your character is? TheyÆll never do anything of note in three minutes every four weeks. In the long run, it comes down to game balance. If you enable this facility; one which would undoubtedly benefit all legitimate players. You also open the system up to certain levels of abuse from farmers, which you then have to deal with. Making the decision to stop the abuse of game systems (not moaning about possible enhancements) should be the only consideration.
Delphen Gruss Gallente Brethren Empire Hitchhiker's Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.18 21:24:00 - [546] I know this has been beaten to death, but here is my 2 cents (isk) A skill queue, would it be nice ... yes Is it nessesary ... no There are so many skill watch programsout there now that you don't even need to log in to know when your skill will finish. They even give you the exact date and time of when it will be done. If you have a problem logging in when a skill will finish, then maybe before you log off, swap to a skill that will finish at a time when you can get on, or just go for a few hours un-training. I mean, when you get up in levels, certain skills willt ake days to weeks anyways, a couple of hours here and there won't really make that much of a difference (imo).
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.18 23:17:00 - [547] Originally by: El Shaddai Edited by: El Shaddai on 17/04/2008 14:18:25 Let me first start by saying that I am currently on my second attempt at EVE. I started playing EVE over two years ago and eventually had to stop playing because I could never spend enough time in the game. That meant my character never really got anywhere and I couldnÆt justify paying for something I wasnÆt getting a great deal out of. I am back in the game now as I have more time to make it the experience it should be. I have to agree that a 1 or 2 skill queue would be a good idea, for two reasons: 1)There are times when you simply canÆt get to the game no matter how hard you try. EVEÆs skill system is a breath of fresh air in the ægrind and growÆ world of on-line gaming, its complexity and potential for variance is unrivalled and should be applauded. That being said it has one enormous drawback: If you have time to sit at a PC all day you get the best char. If you donÆt, you donÆt. The issue with this is that someone who can spend all day ensuring that no time is lost on their skill building pays the same monthly fee as someone who canÆt, but gets far more benefit from it. Now this is all fair and ecumenical if the game is your basic æGAGÆ style. The more you are online, the better you should be. But thatÆs not what EVE should, over even pertains, to be. The more you are online, the more ISK and standing, and contact benefits you should get, but due to the nature of the system, it shouldnÆt mean you are better in every conceivable way. 2)Nobody is asking for a 20 or 30 skill mega list of queued skills. All that we are asking is that we can have a single (or at most 2) skills waiting to start, in the off-chance that our real lives stop us getting to a PC to log on for a few days. I completely understand that there are issues with this: Firstly, and most importantly, is the dreaded Char-Farmer, who would start heavy skills off and then not pay. Well donÆt let them. If you donÆt have a valid subscription, all skill training stops (at the moment the subscription runs out). Secondly, that these mega-chars could then be sold for vast amounts of cash. Again, donÆt allow it. It has to be asked why EVE allows characters to be sold for cash in the first place? People have argued that just because they no longer play a character, why shouldnÆt someone else? I love the altruism of that. If that be the case; give them away. Profiteering is profiteering. If you allow any form of it you open the system up for abuse. You canÆt want to be able to sell your old chars yourself, but then moan because someone finds a way of abusing it. If you stop the character sale and transfer system, you can then implement a limited skill queue without it affecting the game, because great characters canÆt be sold and so are worthless. Thirdly; the æAll Characters Would Be AwesomeÆ idea. That simply wouldnÆt be the case. You would still have to log on to ensure you had gained enough ISK and standings to be able to be of any use in the game. Also, if you arenÆt on-line that often, who cares how good your character is? TheyÆll never do anything of note in three minutes every four weeks. In the long run, it comes down to game balance. If you enable this facility; one which would undoubtedly benefit all legitimate players. You also open the system up to certain levels of abuse from farmers, which you then have to deal with. Making the decision to stop the abuse of game systems (not moaning about possible enhancements) should be the only consideration. You talk about this issue as if it is a breeze, nothing but a minor issue.
Kilow2	Posted - 2008.04.19 01:35:00 - [548] Do it
Ariadiana	Posted - 2008.04.19 18:59:00 - [549] I'aint reading the previous 19 pages but please introduce it soon!
Nashtak Gallente Neoteric War Syndicate Notoriety Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.20 15:33:00 - [550] Originally by: Kusha'an Edited by: Kusha''an on 16/04/2008 12:44:10 Originally by: Grarr Dexx I countered ALL your points, provided insight, and you dare call me a troll? Why don't you just ADAPT to the game, instead of bending it your way. It's not cause you pay a measly 15-30-45 bucks per month that you should affect the lives of the 200.000+ characters who do not agree with you. Hey troll... 1. You haven't countered jack shi-zzle from where I sit. 2. There aren't 200,000+ characters that do not agree with our position that we should have a skill queue. 3. CCP has considered doing this, so obviously the idea has merit. 4. Your life would not be affected by a skill queue in any negative way. 5. You are resorting to hyperbole so as not to let the facts get in the way of a trollish rant. Your post is FAIL. Actually, i find he did. You on the other hand, say he hasn't without precising anything so this comment is fail. You're second one, well it's pretty pathetic. It sounds like my little sister. Beside, with all the players playing this game, finding 200 000 of them who dont agree with this idea is not even an issue. The 3rd one; the fact that CCP considered this idea and didnt follow it make this idea go from ''idea'' to ''bad idea''. 4; the only way this idea wouldnt affect me in any negative way is if it didnt affect me at all. But trust me it will. I think many posted the fact that this will make life a lot easier for those who dont follow the rules (ISK sellers). Anyway, i cant find any good reasons to implement skill queue and CCP neither since they rejected the idea obviously. This tread is not going anywhere. Learn to manage your skills. PS: If the community would agree with you that Grarr Dexx is a troll (like they say carebears stand for people who dont kill **** instead of the typical WoW player...) i'd never dare to come back on the forum ever again.

Pur3Bl00D Minmatar Volition Cult The Volition Cult	Posted - 2008.04.20 16:33:00 - [551] + 1 give us queues pls if u want to avoid character farming, or very long time of absence one thought i had was this: Rule of three : allow up to a 3 skills to be queued, which can be at most up to 3rd level and up to 3rd rank.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.20 16:39:00 - [552] Edited by: Apertotes on 20/04/2008 16:39:51 Edited by: Apertotes on 20/04/2008 16:39:24 Originally by: Nashtak I think many posted the fact that this will make life a lot easier for those who dont follow the rules (ISK sellers). you know nothing about isk sellers. no one is going to train a char for 2 years (Ç360) to sell it later for 5 billion isk, pay Ç20 for the transfer, and later sell all that isk for Ç250. isk farmers do other things, like mining for example. do you think that CCP should get rid of mining lases autorepeat to prevent isk selling? Originally by: Nashtak PS: If the community would agree with you that Grarr Dexx is a troll (like they say carebears stand for people who dont kill **** instead of the typical WoW player...) i'd never dare to come back on the forum ever again. that be twice as good
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.20 23:03:00 - [553] Originally by: Nashtak Originally by: Kusha'an Edited by: Kusha''an on 16/04/2008 12:44:10 Originally by: Grarr Dexx I countered ALL your points, provided insight, and you dare call me a troll? Why don't you just ADAPT to the game, instead of bending it your way. It's not cause you pay a measly 15-30-45 bucks per month that you should affect the lives of the 200.000+ characters who do not agree with you. Hey troll... 1. You haven't countered jack shi-zzle from where I sit. 2. There aren't 200,000+ characters that do not agree with our position that we should have a skill queue. 3. CCP has considered doing this, so obviously the idea has merit. 4. Your life would not be affected by a skill queue in any negative way. 5. You are resorting to hyperbole so as not to let the facts get in the way of a trollish rant. Your post is FAIL. Actually, i find he did. You on the other hand, say he hasn't without precising anything so this comment is fail. You're second one, well it's pretty pathetic. It sounds like my little sister. Beside, with all the players playing this game, finding 200 000 of them who dont agree with this idea is not even an issue. The 3rd one; the fact that CCP considered this idea and didnt follow it make this idea go from ''idea'' to ''bad idea''. 4; the only way this idea wouldnt affect me in any negative way is if it didnt affect me at all. But trust me it will. I think many posted the fact that this will make life a lot easier for those who dont follow the rules (ISK sellers). Anyway, i cant find any good reasons to implement skill queue and CCP neither since they rejected the idea obviously. This tread is not going anywhere. Learn to manage your skills. PS: If the community would agree with you that Grarr Dexx is a troll (like they say carebears stand for people who dont kill ** instead of the typical WoW player...) i'd never dare to come back on the forum ever again. Thank you very much. Originally by:** Pur3Bl00D + 1 give us queues pls if u want to avoid character farming, or very long time of absence one thought i had was this: Rule of three : allow up to a 3 skills to be queued, which can be at most up to 3rd level and up to 3rd rank. If you're so keen on giving any advice, please think about it for more than five minutes. I'm sure that type of idea has passed CCP's drawing board already, and as you see, it's still not implemented. Seriously, level 3 rank 3 skills take what, a day and a half? If you care so much about three or four lost days of skill training, maybe you need to get out more, you know, catch some sun rays.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.21 09:12:00 - [554] Originally by: Achran Dexx ...another bump... oh my god, you are tireless please CCP, do not let this dedicated man without reward, please implement a single skill queue as soon as possible.
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.04.24 15:53:00 - [555] Edited by: Belmarduk on 24/04/2008 15:54:47 555 Replies - 33000 views - Silence from the devs... Dear Devs please mark the following answer: a.: We will never implement a skill-queue and just havent got round to deleting that passage off the drawing board. b.: We are seriously considering it and plan to implement it (as stated on the drawing-board) as soon as more pressing matters have been taken care of. c.: We will not implement it but dont know how to tell the thousands of players who want one tactfully ;) d.: There are technical issues with it which must be handled before going live. e.: We honestly have no idea if we should implement one or not. hands the devs a pen and leans back again Greetings Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.24 17:28:00 - [556] /signed I'd say slow down the training speed when a queue is active. 75% of the original rate if you have another skill in your queue, regular speed if you don't. Or, tack on a 'dead time' at the end of a skill before moving on the the next in queue. For example, someone who's just finished a 10 day skill with more skills in queue would have to wait 2.5 days before being able to start a new skill.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.24 17:55:00 - [557] Originally by: MotoMissles I'd say slow down the training speed when a queue is active. 75% of the original rate if you have another skill in your queue, regular speed if you don't. why should i be punished if the server is unexpectedly unavailable?
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.24 18:18:00 - [558] Edited by: MotoMissles on 24/04/2008 18:23:22 Originally by: Apertotes why should i be punished if the server is unexpectedly unavailable? Aren't you anyway? You have a skill that ends when the server isn't available, you're losing precious moments of SP gain. Oh noes. Let's be honest. 6 hours without SP gain at 2000 SP/hour is all of 12k SP. 12k is a drop in the bucket when you're looking at a 20 million SP character. 75% of something > 100% of nothing. And those without an active queue would see 100% speed.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.24 18:30:00 - [559] Originally by: MotoMissles Edited by: MotoMissles on 24/04/2008 18:23:22 Originally by: Apertotes why should i be punished if the server is unexpectedly unavailable? Aren't you anyway? You have a skill that ends when the server isn't available, you're losing precious moments of SP gain. Oh noes. Let's be honest. 6 hours without SP gain at 2000 SP/hour is all of 12k SP. 12k is a drop in the bucket when you're looking at a 20 million SP character. 75% of something > 100% of nothing. And those without an active queue would see 100% speed. yes, 75%>0%. but what is the reason to slow down training a queued skill? if they ever get down the horse and decide to code a queue, why would they nerf it?
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.24 18:35:00 - [560] Originally by: Apertotes yes, 75%>0%. but what is the reason to slow down training a queued skill? if they ever get down the horse and decide to code a queue, why would they nerf it? If you're going on a 2 week vacation and have 3 5 day skills to train, you'll at least have made 75% progress while not being able to log into the servers. This way, people are motivated to not use the queue if they don't have to. Keeps them (farmers in particular) from getting lazy and queuing up 90 days of training and forgetting about the account until EveMon pops up in their system tray.

Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.24 18:56:00 - [561] Originally by: MotoMissles Originally by: Apertotes yes, 75%>0%. but what is the reason to slow down training a queued skill? if they ever get down the horse and decide to code a queue, why would they nerf it? If you're going on a 2 week vacation and have 3 5 day skills to train, you'll at least have made 75% progress while not being able to log into the servers. This way, people are motivated to not use the queue if they don't have to. Keeps them (farmers in particular) from getting lazy and queuing up 90 days of training and forgetting about the account until EveMon pops up in their system tray. nobody wants a 90 day queue. we just want a back up skill. that is all. about farmers, they already have all the time in the world to log in and change skills. they are dedicated, they would be the less benefited by a single skill queue. they do not play the game, so they do not care about the server going offline or not completing minmatar cruiser 5 and start training hacs. and even if they benefited a bit, why would the real players have to be f*ck up over that? CCP business is with us, the real players, those that are paying 200k accounts, and not with the few farmers that may be here. also, have you ever stopped and done the math about farming characters? its something completely stupid. it is ok on games where power playing can drive you to the top, but you cant hurry up training on eve. paying 14 euros every month to train hardly 2 million sp. for what? sell it 3 years (and 450 euros) later and even pay 20 euros for the transfer?
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.24 19:11:00 - [562] Edited by: MotoMissles on 24/04/2008 19:13:15 Originally by: Apertotes nobody wants a 90 day queue. we just want a back up skill. that is all. We want a back up skill, yes. We don't want a 90 day queue. Someone will want to exploit the system...Someone will want a 90 day queue. And about farmers, I would assume that they don't just train one character at a time. If I was to guess (and I'm purely guessing), each person that farms characters would handle 20-40 characters at a time...maybe more. Give them a 3 skill un-nerfed queue and the estimated number of characters one person can handle jumps to 60-120 characters. AND they'll be able to change the skills on their own schedule without ANY loss in SP per hour. Being able to change skills on your terms would make handling high numbers of characters even easier. Nerf the training queue, minimize that inflation of farming, provide the public with some form of queue, urge them to only use it when necessary.
acs Sacred Templars DeStInY.	Posted - 2008.04.24 21:37:00 - [563] What if there was a 3-skill queue, and it had a penalty in SP/time pr. skill it reached in the queue? So, if I have three skills in queue. Trained one by one manually, they would go, say, 2048 SP/hour. If I decided to queue them up instead, the SP/hour would be, respectively: 1st skill: 2048 SP/hour 2nd skill: 1730 SP/hour 3rd skill: 1100 SP/hour Perhaps the formula from in-game stacking penalties could be used? :-)
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.24 22:54:00 - [564] Originally by: MotoMissles Someone will want to exploit the system...Someone will want a 90 day queue. yes, and? should we nerf the game because someone will try to exploit it? Originally by: MotoMissles Give them a 3 skill un-nerfed queue 3 skills? why? we only want 1!!! Originally by: MotoMissles Being able to change skills on your terms would make handling high numbers of characters even easier. what are my terms? 1 skill-queue? Originally by: MotoMissles Farming may be completely stupid, but it is being done, and it can ruin the game experience for honest players. it doesnt for me or anybody i've met on 4 years. i repeat. farming characters for isk on eve is completely inneficient. and farmers care a lot about efficiency. Originally by: MotoMissles Nerf the training queue, but leave unqueued training (the system that has worked well for years) untouched. why? just because people may log in 2 times less every month? Originally by: MotoMissles The second idea that I posted originally about adding a 'dead' time after a skill before starting the next skill would give the same effect, but without actively slowing training. If you need to, you can start the next skill in your queue in that dead time, as a reward for logging in to change the skill. If you cannot log in, you still start the next skill after the dead period. again, i do not see the need for something like this. you are punishing real players for fear of farmers (which i havent seeen yet. i know there are isk farmers, but they mine or run missions, i havent seen any character farmer). that is a bad customer policy. i do not understand you fear of farmers. do you think that miner lasers shouldnt have autorepeat to make macro miner more difficult?
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.25 03:51:00 - [565] Edited by: MotoMissles on 25/04/2008 03:52:09 Edited by: MotoMissles on 25/04/2008 03:51:02 Originally by: Apertotes yes, and? should we nerf the game because someone will try to exploit it? How is adding new functionality nerfing the game? Originally by: Apertotes what are my terms? 1 skill-queue? You completely missed the point on this one. Changing skills 'on your terms' means when you want, not only after training is complete. Originally by: Apertotes again, i do not see the need for something like this. you are punishing real players for fear of farmers (which i havent seeen yet. i know there are isk farmers, but they mine or run missions, i havent seen any character farmer). that is a bad customer policy. how is adding new functionality a 'punishment' or 'bad customer policy'? Here's the bottom line the way I see it. There has to be some sort of give-and-take with this kind of thing for the devs to even consider it. A couple of examples: Scripts. Better optimal range, but worse tracking speed (Optimal Range Script). Spike Hybrid Ammo (T2). Better optimal range, but you can't move as fast. Cataclysm Fury Missile (T2). More damage, but reduced range. Any and all rigs. Offer a bonus at the cost of a drawback. A nerfed queue is much the same. You can queue your skills, but you won't train as fast as the person who plans their training carefully and can log in at the right times. EVERYTHING else in Eve costs something. Why would a queuing system be any different? The developers certainly aren't going to just come out and say "well, we've been doing it wrong all these years, here's a HUGE improvement to a system that's been in place since Eve began, and there are absolutely no drawbacks." If you ask me, a nerfed queue system is the only fair way of implementing a queue system.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.25 08:08:00 - [566] Originally by: MotoMissles How is adding new functionality nerfing the game? you are adding new nerfed functionality. how would you feel if skills trained faster when online and only at 75% when offline? you are proposing a similar feature Originally by: MotoMissles Originally by: Apertotes what are my terms? 1 skill-queue? You completely missed the point on this one. Changing skills 'on your terms' means when you want, not only after training is complete. so, changing skills when i want is something that needs to be nerfed? Originally by: MotoMissles Originally by: Apertotes again, i do not see the need for something like this. you are punishing real players for fear of farmers (which i havent seeen yet. i know there are isk farmers, but they mine or run missions, i havent seen any character farmer). that is a bad customer policy. how is adding new functionality a 'punishment' or 'bad customer policy'? it is bad policy cause you are adding a nerfed feature only for fear of farmers. and it makes me sad how you are ignoring all the reasonings about how stupid character farming is, and how about nerfing laser miners too so that farmers have a harder time. Originally by: MotoMissles There has to be some sort of give-and-take with this kind of thing for the devs to even consider it. why? are they loosing anything on exchange for featuring a skill queue? if something is needed, then there is no need for give-and-take. for example, if at some time they code a way to change ammo on all turrets at the same time, should it last 3 seconds more than changing ammo one turret at a time? Originally by: MotoMissles Scripts. Better optimal range, but worse tracking speed (Optimal Range Script). of course, casue they were nerfing tracking computers. that is the perfect example that you are trying to nerf a great addition. Originally by: MotoMissles Spike Hybrid Ammo (T2). Better optimal range, but you can't move as fast. t2 ammo is quite broken. guess why most people use faction instead... ok, i'll tell you, no drawbacks. now, tell me what is the drawback of vagabond over stabber, CNR vs raven, cerb vs caracal, sleipnir vs cyclone, ishtar vs vexor, etc... Originally by: MotoMissles A nerfed queue is much the same. You can queue your skills, but you won't train as fast as the person who plans their training carefully and can log in at the right times. EVERYTHING else in Eve costs something. Why would a queuing system be any different? cause training carefully would still need to be done, and, specially, cause no matter how careful you are, you cant plan unscheduled server downtimes. still, you havent given any single reason why training a queued skill should be slower, other than cause you think that is fair. Originally by: MotoMissles The developers certainly aren't going to just come out and say "well, we've been doing it wrong all these years, here's a HUGE improvement to a system that's been in place since Eve began, and there are absolutely no drawbacks." why not? they do that all the time. they have imporved many parts of the game. they do not have to say whether it was wrong or right before. they just change something and that is all. for example, when they fixed nosferatus after 2 years of protests, they didnt say, "hey, we were wrong for 4 years". they just tweaked the modules and gave the reasons. another example, after 5 years, many players (and potential players) were asking for a way to get out of the ship, and the asnwer was always the same. "EVE is a space game, WoW is the other way". and then, CCP decides that being actually a person would be good. so they anounce ambulation. but, did they apologize for being wrong all these years? of course not, it has nothing to do with being wrong or right. it is just that they feel that now it is time for something new
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.04.25 08:38:00 - [567] i see no need to nerf the queue training speed as long as it is limited to 1 skill. we are not penalized for training offline, so i see no reason for being penalized for having a backup skill. we do not wasn tsomething that allows us to stay 4 months without logging in. we like this game, we want to play. but since we can not actively accelerate the way we gain skills, we feel it is necesary to be training all the time. but server downtimes prevent us from doign so many times, and that is why a single skill queue would be great. players would have to log in as many times as now, but will be safe from accidents.
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.25 16:32:00 - [568] Originally by: Apertotes t2 ammo is quite broken. guess why most people use faction instead ... now, tell me what is the drawback of vagabond over stabber, CNR vs raven, cerb vs caracal, sleipnir vs cyclone, ishtar vs vexor, etc You're helping me prove my point. How much more does faction ammo cost? Is cost not a drawback? All the t2 ships require more training to use them...a month or more in many cases. You have to earn the ability to pilot them. Not to mention how much more they cost. Cost and Training Time = Drawbacks. Originally by: Apertotes still, you havent given any single reason why training a queued skill should be slower, other than cause you think that is fair. Please re-read my post. I gave a reason in the portion that you quoted above your response. Let me re-iterate. EVERYTHING else in Eve costs something. Why would a queuing system be any different? And regarding character farming, you'll notice I didn't mention it once in my previous post. I cede that point after looking on ebay and not finding a single character for sale. Ok, I see that a slowed training rate isn't feasible (75% speed while queued). Consider the idea dropped. I also see that nerfing a training queue to reduce character farming isn't an issue either. Consider that idea dropped. I still put forth the idea of a delay between queued skills (a 'dead' time after a skill is complete. This would delay the start of the next skill by 25% of the time it took the completed skill to train.) You could log in and start the skill before the delay ends, but if you are unable to log in, you'll still start your training after the delay. I'm simply trying to look at the queue requests from a developer's point of view, while you look at it from a player's point of view. Yes, a queue would be great, but it certainly isn't necessary. It hasn't been necessary for any of the characters with 50-75 million SP. Any other luxury in Eve has a cost...and a queue would be just that...a luxury.
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.04.25 18:29:00 - [569] Like auto-reload on weapons? Like the Autopilot? Like having a graphcial client instead of a text-client? (Anyone remember the text-rolegames in the eighties? :) ) Like being able to pull a stack of items from hangar to cargobay and not every single one? Backup-Skill-Queue ---- ONE skill-queue as stated on the drawingboard has NOTHING to do with luxury. Its a important safteynet against server-issues,RL-issues etc. Worst case scenariao - One starts a 50 day skill and queues another 50 day skill. Where is the difference to doing that manually ???? Ok I switch skill perhaps after day 48 leaving 2 days - but still dont have to loggin more than once in 100 days. There is absolutley NO reason to not implement a 1 skill-queue +
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.25 22:39:00 - [570] Originally by: Belmarduk Like auto-reload on weapons? Like the Autopilot? Like having a graphcial client instead of a text-client? (Anyone remember the text-rolegames in the eighties? :) ) Like being able to pull a stack of items from hangar to cargobay and not every single one? Backup-Skill-Queue ---- ONE skill-queue as stated on the drawingboard has NOTHING to do with luxury. Its a important safteynet against server-issues,RL-issues etc. Worst case scenariao - One starts a 50 day skill and queues another 50 day skill. Where is the difference to doing that manually ???? Ok I switch skill perhaps after day 48 leaving 2 days - but still dont have to loggin more than once in 100 days. There is absolutley NO reason to not implement a 1 skill-queue + What about actually PLAYING the goddamn game. I mean, it's a game right? Having fun is the point, no?

MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.04.25 22:40:00 - [571] Edited by: MotoMissles on 25/04/2008 22:43:29 Originally by: Belmarduk Like auto-reload on weapons? Like the Autopilot? Like having a graphcial client instead of a text-client? (Anyone remember the text-rolegames in the eighties? :) ) Like being able to pull a stack of items from hangar to cargobay and not every single one? Backup-Skill-Queue ---- ONE skill-queue as stated on the drawingboard has NOTHING to do with luxury. Its a important safteynet against server-issues,RL-issues etc. Worst case scenariao - One starts a 50 day skill and queues another 50 day skill. Where is the difference to doing that manually ???? Ok I switch skill perhaps after day 48 leaving 2 days - but still dont have to loggin more than once in 100 days. There is absolutley NO reason to not implement a 1 skill-queue + I would consider being able to pull a stack of 2000 cruise missiles at once instead of one at a time a necessity. Without it, you wouldn't be able to play the game. A graphical client is in the same vein. You wouldn't be able to play Eve as it exists today without a graphical client. In regards to autopilot, you'll notice that autopiloting is slower than actively piloting. It's a luxury that has a drawback. I agree with a 1+ skill queue. It has just become apparent that CCP doesn't, because if they did, it would be in place by now. So, I make my suggestion to CCP in an attempt to get some form of queue, instead of none. If a queue was a necessity then you wouldn't be able to play the game without it...and yet we all continue to play, and there are uncounted people with 50 million+ SP. A queue would be a luxury, and therefore, from a developer's point of view, should have a drawback.
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.04.26 18:17:00 - [572] Edited by: Belmarduk on 26/04/2008 18:17:11 Originally by: Achran Dexx Originally by: Belmarduk Like auto-reload on weapons? Like the Autopilot? Like having a graphcial client instead of a text-client? (Anyone remember the text-rolegames in the eighties? :) ) Like being able to pull a stack of items from hangar to cargobay and not every single one? Backup-Skill-Queue ---- ONE skill-queue as stated on the drawingboard has NOTHING to do with luxury. Its a important safteynet against server-issues,RL-issues etc. Worst case scenariao - One starts a 50 day skill and queues another 50 day skill. Where is the difference to doing that manually ???? Ok I switch skill perhaps after day 48 leaving 2 days - but still dont have to loggin more than once in 100 days. There is absolutley NO reason to not implement a 1 skill-queue + What about actually PLAYING the goddamn game. I mean, it's a game right? Having fun is the point, no? Whats the problem Mr Dexx? Read - Think - Write or go away CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Achran Dexx Caldari CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.04.26 19:40:00 - [573] Aren't you guys already happy enough you get skills that train offline?
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.04.27 04:16:00 - [574] Originally by: Achran Dexx Aren't you guys already happy enough you get skills that train offline? Obviously not, Mr. Condexxension. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Stazzmo Gallente The Grind	Posted - 2008.04.28 02:54:00 - [575] This will probably get lost among the flaming (and sorry if it has already been mentioned, this thread is a year old and i didn't feel like reading the whole thing) but i think its important to note something. I believe CCP views skill training as a commodity--something worth real life money. On any account you can have three characters, but you can only train skills on one of them at a time. To train on more than one character you have to buy more than one account. This says to me that to CCP, skilling = money. So then, from a certain point of view, a skill queue = giving money away. So it would be nice to see a queue, especially to a casual gamer like me who has real life responsibilities but i don't see it happening. I dream of electric sheep.
Liu	Posted - 2008.04.28 06:58:00 - [576] Originally by: Stazzmo This will probably get lost among the flaming (and sorry if it has already been mentioned, this thread is a year old and i didn't feel like reading the whole thing) but i think its important to note something. I believe CCP views skill training as a commodity--something worth real life money. On any account you can have three characters, but you can only train skills on one of them at a time. To train on more than one character you have to buy more than one account. This says to me that to CCP, skilling = money. So then, from a certain point of view, a skill queue = giving money away. So it would be nice to see a queue, especially to a casual gamer like me who has real life responsibilities but i don't see it happening. i agree. i think CCP believes that the slower we train, the longer we stay on the game, and thus the more money they get. a queue would mean we wouldnt loose training time ever, and thus CCP thinks it is bad for their pocket. CCP disguises this reasoning they want players to play the game, but maths do not lie, and a 1-skill-queue would make playes log in as many times as now, not half as many as people believe. not even discussing about whether logging in 30 seconds to change the damn skill is playing the game or not. about char farming, it has already been said how stupid it is on eve. there is no character for sale on ebay. even if somebody found it worth to farm characters, why would CCP give a worse gameplay experience to 200k legit player just because a few farmers would have it a little easier? Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
b1zz	Posted - 2008.04.28 11:05:00 - [577] Originally by: Stazzmo This will probably get lost among the flaming (and sorry if it has already been mentioned, this thread is a year old and i didn't feel like reading the whole thing) but i think its important to note something. I believe CCP views skill training as a commodity--something worth real life money. On any account you can have three characters, but you can only train skills on one of them at a time. To train on more than one character you have to buy more than one account. This says to me that to CCP, skilling = money. So then, from a certain point of view, a skill queue = giving money away. So it would be nice to see a queue, especially to a casual gamer like me who has real life responsibilities but i don't see it happening. A skill queue system would be helpful for multiple accounts, not a hindrance. It would make it easier to play multiple accounts, therefore more multi-account players, therefore more revenue for CCP. I say good on them for not helping players with multiple accounts because it's a tolerated exploit as far as I'm concerned. Originally by: Liu i agree. i think CCP believes that the slower we train, the longer we stay on the game, and thus the more money they get. a queue would mean we wouldnt loose training time ever, and thus CCP thinks it is bad for their pocket. CCP disguises this reasoning they want players to play the game, but maths do not lie, and a 1-skill-queue would make playes log in as many times as now, not half as many as people believe. not even discussing about whether logging in 30 seconds to change the damn skill is playing the game or not. Enough with the CCP conspiracy theories. I'm confident that if they thought it would make the game better they would implement it. This is not your usual multi-national entertainment company here, Eve is CCPs one and only game, they created it, they distribute it, and they're thinking long term, and even if you don't always agree with what they do you have to respect that the game is still growing after 5 years. How many other MMORPGs can say that. Originally by: Liu about char farming, it has already been said how stupid it is on eve. there is no character for sale on ebay. even if somebody found it worth to farm characters, why would CCP give a worse gameplay experience to 200k legit player just because a few farmers would have it a little easier? What do you mean worse game-play. If a bunch of people are squealing about not having a queue system I say that's good, I must be doing something right, because I never had a problem with it. I think I've lost about 10hrs in 5 months, and because of my own stupidity I might add. But I couldn't care less really, everyone's probably lost similar. It all evens out in the end. My advice to the queue advocates, cancel your multiple accounts, start putting some thought into your skill training schedule, and stay out of Jita
Liu	Posted - 2008.04.28 11:32:00 - [578] Originally by: b1zz Originally by: Liu i agree. i think CCP believes that the slower we train, the longer we stay on the game, and thus the more money they get. a queue would mean we wouldnt loose training time ever, and thus CCP thinks it is bad for their pocket. CCP disguises this reasoning they want players to play the game, but maths do not lie, and a 1-skill-queue would make playes log in as many times as now, not half as many as people believe. not even discussing about whether logging in 30 seconds to change the damn skill is playing the game or not. Enough with the CCP conspiracy theories. I'm confident that if they thought it would make the game better they would implement it. yes, but all trough those 5 years CCP has made many poor decisions that have been modified on succesive patches. why did they take 5 years to fix NOS and neuts? where they bad for the game only the last 3 months? why was the typhoon such a looser for more than 3 years? why were torps a long range weapon for 4 years? CCP doesnt always get it right the first time. i love this game, and how CCP handless it, but i am not blind to see how they not always pick the best option. Originally by: b1zz Originally by: Liu about char farming, it has already been said how stupid it is on eve. there is no character for sale on ebay. even if somebody found it worth to farm characters, why would CCP give a worse gameplay experience to 200k legit player just because a few farmers would have it a little easier? What do you mean worse game-play. If a bunch of people are squealing about not having a queue system I say that's good, I must be doing something right, because I never had a problem with it. I think I've lost about 10hrs in 5 months, and because of my own stupidity I might add. But I couldn't care less really, everyone's probably lost similar. It all evens out in the end. My advice to the queue advocates, cancel your multiple accounts, start putting some thought into your skill training schedule, and stay out of Jita by ignoring the request of many players you are not doing anything good. this feature has been requested by many players during all the years i have been playing. at the beggining, CCP always answered the same "there will never ever ever be a skill queue". later they added it to the designboard. whether they changed their mind or they gave us something to keep us quiet, i do not know. but if it was the second option, then they failed. there are many players that believe that loosing 18 hours of training cause the server went down unexpectedly is nothing good at all, and want a way to not be vulnerable to those accidents. we are not lazy players, or farmers, macroers or exploiters. we love the game as much as you, so much that we feel it is unacceptable to loose training time for something we can not control at all. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Shaemell Buttleson Darwin With Attitude oooh Shiny	Posted - 2008.04.28 12:12:00 - [579] I still want a queuing system can't see any reasons against it at all. I also want them to stop skills training when the sub runs out though!
Ortos Abyssus Incendia THORN Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.28 13:09:00 - [580] Beeing able to keep on training a skill uintill it hits level 5 would be good with me. No need for beeing able to queue diffrent skills.

b1zz	Posted - 2008.04.28 14:56:00 - [581] Originally by: Liu by ignoring the request of many players you are not doing anything good. this feature has been requested by many players during all the years i have been playing. Well, they're not ignoring my request to keep it as it is, and there's plenty who agree with me and have posted in this thread.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.04.28 16:34:00 - [582] Originally by: b1zz Originally by: Stazzmo This will probably get lost among the flaming (and sorry if it has already been mentioned, this thread is a year old and i didn't feel like reading the whole thing) but i think its important to note something. I believe CCP views skill training as a commodity--something worth real life money. On any account you can have three characters, but you can only train skills on one of them at a time. To train on more than one character you have to buy more than one account. This says to me that to CCP, skilling = money. So then, from a certain point of view, a skill queue = giving money away. So it would be nice to see a queue, especially to a casual gamer like me who has real life responsibilities but i don't see it happening. A skill queue system would be helpful for multiple accounts, not a hindrance. It would make it easier to play multiple accounts, therefore more multi-account players, therefore more revenue for CCP. I say good on them for not helping players with multiple accounts because it's a tolerated exploit as far as I'm concerned. Originally by: Liu i agree. i think CCP believes that the slower we train, the longer we stay on the game, and thus the more money they get. a queue would mean we wouldnt loose training time ever, and thus CCP thinks it is bad for their pocket. CCP disguises this reasoning they want players to play the game, but maths do not lie, and a 1-skill-queue would make playes log in as many times as now, not half as many as people believe. not even discussing about whether logging in 30 seconds to change the damn skill is playing the game or not. Enough with the CCP conspiracy theories. I'm confident that if they thought it would make the game better they would implement it. This is not your usual multi-national entertainment company here, Eve is CCPs one and only game, they created it, they distribute it, and they're thinking long term, and even if you don't always agree with what they do you have to respect that the game is still growing after 5 years. How many other MMORPGs can say that. Originally by: Liu about char farming, it has already been said how stupid it is on eve. there is no character for sale on ebay. even if somebody found it worth to farm characters, why would CCP give a worse gameplay experience to 200k legit player just because a few farmers would have it a little easier? What do you mean worse game-play. If a bunch of people are squealing about not having a queue system I say that's good, I must be doing something right, because I never had a problem with it. I think I've lost about 10hrs in 5 months, and because of my own stupidity I might add. But I couldn't care less really, everyone's probably lost similar. It all evens out in the end. My advice to the queue advocates, cancel your multiple accounts, start putting some thought into your skill training schedule, and stay out of Jita If they do it just for the money, I would quit. Originally by: Shaemell Buttleson I still want a queuing system can't see any reasons against it at all. I also want them to stop skills training when the sub runs out though! Open your eyes, etc, Guano Apes song I believe.
Liu	Posted - 2008.04.28 17:18:00 - [583] Originally by: b1zz Well, they're not who agree with me and have posted in this thread. hey, your trolling skills have gone up 0.2 points!!!! ps: btw, i've copied your tactics Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
RedLion Caldari Polaris Project Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.29 01:04:00 - [584] Can we plaese have faster training too? ^^ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Liu	Posted - 2008.04.29 16:36:00 - [585] Originally by: RedLion Can we plaese have faster training too? ^^ i disagree on that, although i would like to see learning skills gone and the atributes added to all characters. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Veryez	Posted - 2008.04.29 22:12:00 - [586] Twenty pages, almost a year old, and still no response from CCP other than their vague statement on the drawingboard. A textbook example of how customer service isn't suppose to work. Well done guys.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.04.30 00:24:00 - [587] Boohoo go cancel your subscription.
Liu	Posted - 2008.04.30 06:34:00 - [588] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Boohoo go cancel your subscription. that is the looser's argument. just because we do not get what we want, we are not gonna leave the game, or even threat CCP about it. just because we want a backup skill doest mean that we are cheaters/exploiters/weak players waiting for a decission we dont like to cancel the game. now, if you are so insulted by this request, just do not read it. but by coming here every single day to insult many legit players you are giving us even more strentgh. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.04.30 09:28:00 - [589] I think Mr Dexx the 7 week-newb/noob/newbie is a classic example of a thread-troll/hijacker Mr Dexx didnt you earlier on state that this was your last statement in this thread - hmm ? Bye waves CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.04.30 18:22:00 - [590] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Grarr Dexx Boohoo go cancel your subscription. that is the looser's argument. just because we do not get what we want, we are not gonna leave the game, or even threat CCP about it. just because we want a backup skill doest mean that we are cheaters/exploiters/weak players waiting for a decission we dont like to cancel the game. now, if you are so insulted by this request, just do not read it. but by coming here every single day to insult many legit players you are giving us even more strentgh. By continuing your hilarious responses you are giving me 'strentgh' too. Go back a few pages and read my arguments, see if you can pose a response to them.

SketS Minmatar Precision Engineering Insurgency	Posted - 2008.04.30 19:51:00 - [591] /flame protect the skills, waiting lines suck. they wait for days in a row have to bring theyre own food and drinks and get nothing good in return accept a lvl up wich really gives them hardly any benefits and only provides theyre masters with more isk... i say NO LINES! and free the skills!!! no more slaveskillery! Only an idiot quotes himself -SketS
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.01 01:47:00 - [592] Edited by: Liu on 01/05/2008 01:47:34 Originally by: Grarr Dexx By continuing your hilarious responses you are giving me 'strentgh' too. Go back a few pages and read my arguments, see if you can pose a response to them. sad as it sounds, you have given nothing but gibblerings. we have already demostrated how char farming doesnt exists on eve. and maths strike the "lazyness" argument for wreking damage. players would need to log in as many times as now. so, its back to the design table for you. try to come back with something useful, or even better, try to not come back (and please, keep your alts with you) Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Draighen	Posted - 2008.05.01 08:02:00 - [593] What I would like to see is if you stop training before a skill you are training is finished to start training another skill you loose some percentage of the training of the skill you are stopping when you move to another skill. The higher the skill the more you would loose. I always think it would be nice to have a queue system, but am happy with the way it is. I curse when I miss my iPhone timer alarm. It makes the game that much more exciting. Now I gotta stop scheduling my RL around skill training
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.01 12:59:00 - [594] Edited by: Veryez on 01/05/2008 13:00:01 Originally by: Grarr Dexx By continuing your hilarious responses you are giving me 'strentgh' too. Go back a few pages and read my arguments, see if you can pose a response to them. I suppose these are the eloquent arguements to which you refer? Originally by: Achran Dexx Wrong. You decide to join their game, abide by their rules and play with the content that you are given, and promised every patch. I say no to this skill-queue, if you tell those that 'have nothing better to do than follow up every second of their skills' to essentially ** off then you are wrong, very very wrong. I've been playing for about a month now and I believe you guys are really, really ** up. When a skill ends, and I'm not there, I honestly couldn't care less. I play Eve to have fun, not to have the most skillpoints or to get closer to those five-year old veterans who have deserved their edge over the casual gamer. Fine, You are correct in that when you join you agree to play the game by the rules CCP has setup and to abide by them. That does not mean the game is perfect and that it's customers can't make suggestions for improving it. That's what this is, a way to make a great game even better. Additionally, your 2 months or so playing time, means that EvE is still very new and fresh for you. Good, enjoy your time, but perhaps you should listen to players who have had characters here more than 10 times longer than you. One of the things that keeps interest in this game is having goals, personal, corporate or even alliance goals. Skills are one way to achieve those goals (with iskies the other). Making a suggestion to improve the game where your skill training would be more efficient is not whining or crying. I doubt anyone thinks you can make up for the difference that players have in years, but a way to more efficiently reach your goals is not bad for the majority of players. Originally by:** Achran Dexx This is Eve. Nobody cares. Sorry you feel that way already, another reason I play EvE is the friends I've made from all over the world. Since you have no friends and no goals, when your bored with EvE after six months or so and quit, remember I asked first - Can I have your stuff?
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.01 13:21:00 - [595] Nah. I joined Eve for it's harsh and unforgiving world. You lost your ship? Too bad. You forgot to set a longer skill? Too bad. You were kicked out of your corporation, lost all your assets and have to start anew in empire? TOO BAD. I have always had to resort to 'free' MMORPG's where losing something meant nothing at all. And I can tell you, it was disgusting. And oh yeah, nice skimming over my arguments.
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.01 13:52:00 - [596] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Nah. I joined Eve for it's harsh and unforgiving world. You lost your ship? Too bad. You forgot to set a longer skill? Too bad. You were kicked out of your corporation, lost all your assets and have to start anew in empire? TOO BAD. I have always had to resort to 'free' MMORPG's where losing something meant nothing at all. And I can tell you, it was disgusting. And oh yeah, nice skimming over my arguments. But I didn't need to skim your arguments, your arguements were based on the premise that a skill que was something to help you get closer to higher skill players, which was wrong. I agree with you that EvE is a harsh unforgiving world - and I wouldn't have it any other way. I believe you're mixing up skills with ingame items. I can kill you, pod you, wardeck you, have alts infiltrate your corp and steal everything or even have you booted. All in game, all legal. Can I stop you from training a skill? Can I take skill points from you? Can I force you to train something that you don't want? No. Skills while part of the game are different in that it is between you and CCP only. In the long run, skills are what you are paying for, and are really the only thing of value in this game - otherwise as was pointed out you could have all 3 characters on one account training at once. You can probably count the number of skills that have finished while I wasn't online (and was able to get online) on 3 characters over the last 2.5 years on 1 hand. I take skill training very seriously, and manage my skills very carefully, because as I said they are the only things of value in EvE. However you will run out of fingers rather quickly if you try to count the number of times I had a skill finish while EvE was crashed. Even a 24 hour limit for a skill que would be an improvement, since you'll still have to log in everyday. Not abusive, not game breaking. You don't want a que - fine, others do.
Maxwell Murders	Posted - 2008.05.01 13:56:00 - [597] Ethan Joznin nice of you to think of your self and only of your situation . i don't need it so i vote no. i just started and cant use anything because i don't have the skills so i want to minimize the time im paying for and waisting that i cannot enjoy. as im flying a bantam woohoo how much fun. with a skill que i would be able to enjoy my in game time a lot sooner. ATM not thinking of buying more time as a result of the dead time and the way that with every lvl you go up the stuff your looking froward to is just as tedious to obtain with the constant repetition. skill que would just make the game more fun sooner i see the potential but is 6 month of skilling worth it ?when if no dead time was there you could do it in 3 to 4 ? i just want to have FUN. atm it feels like i have 2 jobs.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.01 15:57:00 - [598] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: Grarr Dexx Nah. I joined Eve for it's harsh and unforgiving world. You lost your ship? Too bad. You forgot to set a longer skill? Too bad. You were kicked out of your corporation, lost all your assets and have to start anew in empire? TOO BAD. I have always had to resort to 'free' MMORPG's where losing something meant nothing at all. And I can tell you, it was disgusting. And oh yeah, nice skimming over my arguments. But I didn't need to skim your arguments, your arguements were based on the premise that a skill que was something to help you get closer to higher skill players, which was wrong. I agree with you that EvE is a harsh unforgiving world - and I wouldn't have it any other way. I believe you're mixing up skills with ingame items. I can kill you, pod you, wardeck you, have alts infiltrate your corp and steal everything or even have you booted. All in game, all legal. Can I stop you from training a skill? Can I take skill points from you? Can I force you to train something that you don't want? No. Skills while part of the game are different in that it is between you and CCP only. In the long run, skills are what you are paying for, and are really the only thing of value in this game - otherwise as was pointed out you could have all 3 characters on one account training at once. You can probably count the number of skills that have finished while I wasn't online (and was able to get online) on 3 characters over the last 2.5 years on 1 hand. I take skill training very seriously, and manage my skills very carefully, because as I said they are the only things of value in EvE. However you will run out of fingers rather quickly if you try to count the number of times I had a skill finish while EvE was crashed. Even a 24 hour limit for a skill que would be an improvement, since you'll still have to log in everyday. Not abusive, not game breaking. You don't want a que - fine, others do. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. I pay to have fun and play with friends. Nice one, though.
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.01 20:12:00 - [599] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. I pay to have fun and play with friends. Nice one, though. Mr Dexx how old are you? I would estimate about not more than half my age. CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.01 21:20:00 - [600] Oh yes, age, awesome. Please keep this thread on topic.

Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.02 01:44:00 - [601] Originally by: Grarr Dexx I pay to have fun and play with friends. Figures. Pretty sad that the only way you have friends is to pay for them to play with you.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.02 02:46:00 - [602] Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: Grarr Dexx I pay to have fun and play with friends. Figures. Pretty sad that the only way you have friends is to pay for them to play with you. Yeah, even worse argument. Back to bed, troll.
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.02 12:39:00 - [603] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. I pay to have fun and play with friends. Nice one, though. Your attempt at humor failed, by value I mean monetary value, I don't place monetary value on friends. And you are the one derailing this topic. You expressed your opinion and I have refuted it. That you chose not to listen to counter arguements is your problem. Since you've added nothing in the last 3 pages, I suggest you move along.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.02 13:10:00 - [604] I can play free mmo's with my friends too, or RTS's that I pirated. I'm not saying that I need to PAY TO PLAY WITH FRIENDS, just pay to play THIS VERY GAME with friends. I don't pay because of some silly online skill points, spaceshipz are not srz bznss to me.
Maxwell Murders	Posted - 2008.05.04 11:16:00 - [605] lol because i work 10hrs per day... iv been play for not even 30 days. And lost i would say... going close to 30 to 40 hrs the system sucks. The longer it takes to train skills the more real money they earn i guess . i have limited time to play games i am flat out most of the time i see the game as a time expensive some thing i am not rich with is time.i feel with low poor skills i can not have fun i use the game to destress. i do not want to have any down time getting the skills to enjoy it. PLS SKILL QUE
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.04 11:39:00 - [606] Train OTHER skills so you don't lose skill time, jesus christ.
Elrich Zann Minmatar Hidden Agenda	Posted - 2008.05.04 12:53:00 - [607] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Train OTHER skills so you don't lose skill time, jesus christ. Ah thank you for your brilliant observations. Obviously none of us could have figured this out without your erudite help. Truthfully, I donÆt lose sleep over losing a few hours of training here or there. I try not to, but stuff happens. However I empathize with players who have to train the 6 to 12 hour skills, that arenÆt too common for me anymore. I suggest the following û a 12 hour skill queue. How this would work, if you are within 12 hours of finishing a skill, you may queue up a second skill (but only a second skill, no more). Period, done. YouÆll still have to log in just as often, but this means you donÆt have to be online at exactly the time a skill finishes. LetÆs face it, we all log into eve and play when it is convenient to us, not when a skill is set to finish. IÆve been playing quite a while, and everyday, at all hours of the day, I see people log in and log out after a few minutes/seconds, with the comment æskill changeÆ. This is not enjoyable, nor is it interacting/playing with other players, or even playing the game for that matter. ItÆs a stupid, menial chore we all endure, not because we like it, but because we like the other parts of this game so much. This task (changing skills) does nothing to enhance the game for its players, and is especially hard on newer players who have many short skills to train. Since it would benefit newer players (enhance the new player experience in the words of CCP), I am in favor of a limited 12 hour skill queue.
Exie	Posted - 2008.05.04 15:41:00 - [608] A short queue is a great idea... we just need to also llok at things from CCP's point of view... there is no gain for the game to create a way to easily "farm" toons to sell for billions of ISK. I for one though would love to have a 12 hour queue that I could fill up, make training all these lvl1 and lvl2 skills a lot easier...
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.04 16:15:00 - [609] Eve's not supposed to be easy, now is it?
Elrich Zann Minmatar Hidden Agenda	Posted - 2008.05.04 17:20:00 - [610] Originally by: Exie A short queue is a great idea... we just need to also llok at things from CCP's point of view... there is no gain for the game to create a way to easily "farm" toons to sell for billions of ISK. I for one though would love to have a 12 hour queue that I could fill up, make training all these lvl1 and lvl2 skills a lot easier... Fill up???? Originally by: Elrich Zann if you are within 12 hours of finishing a skill, you may queue up a second skill (but only a second skill, no more) No, I am not in favor of a 12 hour queue you could fill up, in fact I think that would be a bad idea.

Liu	Posted - 2008.05.05 06:50:00 - [611] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Eve's not supposed to be easy, now is it? yeah, CCP should get rid of: 1. insurance 2. map 3. modules autorepeat 4. overview 5. keyboard shortcuts 6. autopilot 7. high security 8. right click navigation then EVE would be really challenging. these devs are too carebears Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.05 14:19:00 - [612] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Eve's not supposed to be easy, now is it? Either offer a solution to this obvious problem or shut up. You've already made your point - i.e. "U alz suxor Eve duznt needz skill q lolz buncha f-in nubz roflmao I iz ubermmorpg plyrz" - so anything you say now is nothing but trolling. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.05 14:41:00 - [613] Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: Grarr Dexx Eve's not supposed to be easy, now is it? Either offer a solution to this obvious problem or shut up. You've already made your point - i.e. "U alz suxor Eve duznt needz skill q lolz buncha f-in nubz roflmao I iz ubermmorpg plyrz" - so anything you say now is nothing but trolling. i think we should make it retroactive. he's been trolling for some weeks already. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.05 18:16:00 - [614] Here's your solution... It's been used since eve started... SET A LONGER SKILL IF YOU'RE NOT SURE YOU'RE GONNA MAKE IT BEFORE THE SKILL YOU SET ENDS. Thank you.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.05.05 18:49:00 - [615] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Here's your solution... It's been used since eve started... SET A LONGER SKILL IF YOU'RE NOT SURE YOU'RE GONNA MAKE IT BEFORE THE SKILL YOU SET ENDS. Thank you. oh my god. how can you be so thick. i cant believe it. is it a pose? or are you really that dumb? please, answer me, whether in caps or not, however you like, how do you set a long skill when the server is down and it shouldnt. please, come up with a valid answer, and we'll cease all this queue thing.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.05 20:06:00 - [616] You set it before the server goes down, jeez even the latest news item tells you to do that, just in CASE, jesus ******* christ.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.05.05 20:31:00 - [617] Originally by: Grarr Dexx You set it before the server goes down, jeez even the latest news item tells you to do that, just in CASE, jesus ******* christ. yep, certainly, you are dumb. i have never seen an unexpected server downtime being broadcasted on the news item. you are setting new trolling standards.
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.05 21:34:00 - [618] Edited by: Kusha''an on 05/05/2008 21:35:00 Originally by: Grarr Dexx You set it before the server goes down, jeez even the latest news item tells you to do that, just in CASE, jesus ***** christ. Hey troll, I want you to respond to this post BEFORE I actually post it. Come on, you can do it. Troll is dumber than a bag of hammers. Go away, troll. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?**
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.05 21:38:00 - [619] Raage. When the server goes down, EVERYONE is affected. You are not the only one losing a skill change, other people are affected by this too! Even the five-year old player, who had his Cloaking III finish during an unexpected downtime! Poor him, right? No.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.05.05 21:50:00 - [620] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Raage. When the server goes down, EVERYONE is affected. You are not the only one losing a skill change, other people are affected by this too! Even the five-year old player, who had his Cloaking III finish during an unexpected downtime! Poor him, right? No. wow, so we come down to this, right? you aint got no reason or argument. only "since we all suffer, it is ok" i hope you never get any important job, or any place where your decissions matter the littlest bit. well, i rather prefer nobody had to suffer than everybody, but maybe its just that i am too generous.

Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.05 23:52:00 - [621] Isn't that what you wanted? Keep up or catch up with the veterans of this game? Or should you suddenly get an advantage over them?
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.06 02:53:00 - [622] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Isn't that what you wanted? Keep up or catch up with the veterans of this game? Or should you suddenly get an advantage over them? What's it to you, noobtroll? ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
RisingStar1971	Posted - 2008.05.06 11:47:00 - [623] I admit, a queue system would be nice, AND I admit the arguments against it are sound. Since there is no cue system, this is what I do. (Feel free to use this system, I wont sue you or anything :)) 1. I decide on what skill I would like to train. (based on desire for a piece of equipment or whatever.) 2. I think about what day it is. (Ok am I working today, if so, what time am I supposed to be there) 3. I turn my head 90 degrees and look at the clock (you may have to turn your head farther to see your clock) 4. I compare the training time vs work time.(Lets say I have a skill training that takes 7 days. I need that missle launcher skill by the time I get home, says 3 hours. OK I have to be to work in 4. I will stop the 7 day training, start the missle launcher training, then switch back to the 7 day training 1 hour before work. Long skills like this get trained while Im at work or sleeping, short skills get trained while Im awake and home.) The point is to use your time as efficently as possible. And yes, sometimes you may waste 4 hours or even more not being able to get back to your machine to get that next skill training. This brings me to point 5 5. GET OVER IT!!!! This concludes my training guide.....I played 4 years ago and am now comming back into Eve. The training part seems pretty much the same, and this worked for me back then. Feel free to use this method IT COULD CHANGE YOUR LIFE, BUT IT WONT MAKE YOU RICH, MAKE YOU A BETTER LOVER, CURE DISESES, OR STOP YOUR WIFE FROM DIVORCING YOU. Some things you STILL have to actually DO. Star
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.06 14:47:00 - [624] Originally by: RisingStar1971 I admit, a queue system would be nice, AND I admit the arguments against it are sound. Since there is no cue system, this is what I do. (Feel free to use this system, I wont sue you or anything :)) 1. I decide on what skill I would like to train. (based on desire for a piece of equipment or whatever.) 2. I think about what day it is. (Ok am I working today, if so, what time am I supposed to be there) 3. I turn my head 90 degrees and look at the clock (you may have to turn your head farther to see your clock) 4. I compare the training time vs work time.(Lets say I have a skill training that takes 7 days. I need that missle launcher skill by the time I get home, says 3 hours. OK I have to be to work in 4. I will stop the 7 day training, start the missle launcher training, then switch back to the 7 day training 1 hour before work. Long skills like this get trained while Im at work or sleeping, short skills get trained while Im awake and home.) The point is to use your time as efficently as possible. And yes, sometimes you may waste 4 hours or even more not being able to get back to your machine to get that next skill training. This brings me to point 5 5. GET OVER IT!!!! This concludes my training guide.....I played 4 years ago and am now comming back into Eve. The training part seems pretty much the same, and this worked for me back then. Feel free to use this method IT COULD CHANGE YOUR LIFE, BUT IT WONT MAKE YOU RICH, MAKE YOU A BETTER LOVER, CURE DISESES, OR STOP YOUR WIFE FROM DIVORCING YOU. Some things you STILL have to actually DO. Star You obviously haven't read the entire thread before posting. Any 10-day old noob knows this. Count the pages in this thread. Do you REALLY think this hasn't been mentioned already? Thank you for your sarcastic and worthless noncontribution. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.06 18:35:00 - [625] Originally by: RisingStar1971 4. I compare the training time vs work time.(Lets say I have a skill training that takes 7 days. I need that missle launcher skill by the time I get home, says 3 hours. OK I have to be to work in 4. I will stop the 7 day training, start the missle launcher training, then switch back to the 7 day training 1 hour before work. Long skills like this get trained while Im at work or sleeping, short skills get trained while Im awake and home.) The point is to use your time as efficently as possible. And yes, sometimes you may waste 4 hours or even more not being able to get back to your machine to get that next skill training. This brings me to point 5 Isn't that quaint, someone who works a 8 hour day. Thought those went the way of the dinosaur. Well, lets say you work a 13 hour day, add a 1 hour commute which accounts for 15 hours of your time, add in that dreaded sleep stuff and eating and you quickly come to 2 to 3 hours of eve time on workdays. Normally not an issue, since I just train longer stuff when at work and shorter stuff when online. So please enlighten me, how do you manage to swap skills when Eve crashes? Especially when it happens in that all too brief 2 to 3 hour window. And since you've haven't been here for some time - it's not that infrequent.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.06 19:38:00 - [626] Originally by: RisingStar1971 The point is to use your time as efficently as possible. And yes, sometimes you may waste 4 hours or even more not being able to get back to your machine to get that next skill training. This brings me to point 5 5. GET OVER IT!!!! This concludes my training guide.....I played 4 years ago and am now comming back into Eve. The training part seems pretty much the same, and this worked for me back then. Feel free to use this method IT COULD CHANGE YOUR LIFE, BUT IT WONT MAKE YOU RICH, MAKE YOU A BETTER LOVER, CURE DISESES, OR STOP YOUR WIFE FROM DIVORCING YOU. There you go.
Sharp Feather Gallente Ministry of Natural Resources OPUS Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.06 20:39:00 - [627] I look at your avatar, and you dont even need to say a word before I know you are an ''eloh ssa''... You must be really lonely to keep posting every 2sec in this thread... poor little weak thing.
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.05.07 06:43:00 - [628] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Isn't that what you wanted? Keep up or catch up with the veterans of this game? Or should you suddenly get an advantage over them? what? you are completely wrong. nobody is talking about catching everybody. that is why your "we are all doomed as well" theory falls. we know we are not going to catch up veterans, and there is no need for it. we are glad with how the game rewards those that havee been training longer. but that has nothing to do with loosing training time when we have done all we could and it is not our fault. btw, you keep saying "its just a game", yet you post 3-5 times a day on this same thread. it looks as though this game is more important than your average one. you know, go out, get a girlfriend, watch a movie, play some football, read a book... eve is not the only thing to do on life.
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.08 13:33:00 - [629] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Isn't that what you wanted? Keep up or catch up with the veterans of this game? Or should you suddenly get an advantage over them? This is a really stupid argument. Obviously the veterans of the game would have the same skill queue, so there would be no advantage. And yes, it would be nice to keep up, that's only fair. Next trollish argument, please. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Pomdapi Gallente B4RB3CR3W	Posted - 2008.05.08 14:02:00 - [630] I think that a "one skill in queue" would be fine. So you can put a "short time" skill when you go offline and a "long time" skill in case you're not online when the "short time" skill as ended. Les pieds sur terre, Le coeur avec les hommes, La tOte dans les Ttoiles ! Mass Hysteria

Drazok	Posted - 2008.05.08 15:37:00 - [631] A +1 oe 2 que system would be very very nice for people who can;t camp there computer, and for newbies who train 10 skills a day. As for bot fear its been stated all ready that macroing your own skill que bot would not be that difficult, also i thin it would be cool if we could change skill training over the web site, i;ve had that problem where i have net acces but the comp does not have eve on it. This post has not been checked ofr spelling, gramtical correctness , or polical correctness
Jihn Anolar	Posted - 2008.05.09 07:34:00 - [632] I would love a skill queue system, and so would anyone who has ever had thier computer access taken away for more than a couple of days.I'm not going to be able to train a single SP until this time next week, and it's already been 1 week. ):
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.09 19:09:00 - [633] That's called punishment, fool. Live with it.
Sariyah HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded	Posted - 2008.05.09 22:47:00 - [634] It is fine as it is. Play the game. Or don't, it's your time management.
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.10 22:05:00 - [635] Edited by: Liu on 10/05/2008 22:05:21 Originally by: Sariyah It is fine as it is. Play the game. Or don't, it's your time management. no its not. its unscheduled server downtimes. and those are non-manageable Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.11 00:17:00 - [636] And they affect everyone. Not just you.
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.11 01:32:00 - [637] Edited by: Liu on 11/05/2008 01:34:37 Originally by: Grarr Dexx And they affect everyone. Not just you. so? how is that acceptable? edit: i think i got it!!! you are so confused!!! you think all this is because we believe skills are a race and veterans are ahead and we want to catch them. OMG!!! you are so lost!! this has nothing to do with catching up. although you probably wont understand it anyway. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.11 01:55:00 - [638] Why do you want the queue then, if it's not about keeping up with other players?
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.11 03:17:00 - [639] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Why do you want the queue then, if it's not about keeping up with other players? dude, it is written all over the thread. i am not gonna waste a single minute giving you a special explanation. instead of trolling you could try reading sometimes. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.11 03:35:00 - [640] Originally by: KidBrat This is a funny thread... #1 Eve = Eaiset game for traing, ever #2 Lazy people get lazier #3 Char farming is terriable for EVE game play #4 Gold/char farrmers will simply by 90 day GTC #1 Eve is easy for skills Eve is FAAR, most and i stress it... THE EASIET GAME ONLINE TO to deal with training skills. THERE IS NO GRINDING SKILLS INVOLED. Just need to log in every so offten, click a button and look at where your skill are at... #2 Lazy people... Only people that are complaing there is no Skills Que, or somthing like it. Are the most disqusting people in game. OMG, just move the mouse over your char info sheet and check... Ok once a day is fine to checek on most skills... Once you get pass lvl 2 or 3 on most skills, (depends on implants and learning curve), most skills starts turning into days to train... I will be 4 days away from able to use a hulk, but, took me 7 weeks to get it... #3 Gold farms are a problem already Look gold farming is already a problem. Does everyone want Char farming a problem to. I left a game once b/c bots ruined a great game, char and gold farming bots just brings down the ecomeny, game play and most imporantly, human interaction. I would hate to see a year from now, every tom ** haryy, jane doe having titans, star bases and all other high lvl stuff, b/c they just bought it from joe blow that farm the heck out of one char then sold it. #4 Game time cards, (GTC), and gold farmers Well hell, some of you complain about skills que should be in lay, (you lazy S.O.Bs), Another person suggest to simply turn off the skill when the account is not paid for, Brovo... great idea, fantasitc... but you forget one thing... A person that has billions of isk can just turn and simply by enough GTC for a year with isk... Who has billions and billions of isk to do this? Gold Farmers... Look as far as skills goes, EVE has the most simple system ever, i think its brilght that eve make the palyer responable to keep an eye on their own skills. It takes no time at all to log in, check your skills once a day. for those short skills, the one only takes a few hours, o darn, your playing already, (RIGHT )**, so its easy to keep an eye on those skills that only take a few hours. In most MMORPGs you need to grind the hell out of skills to get the lvl of it... Here you just sit and wait. I use to play a game called SilkRoad Online, a great game, smooth graphics. Then the Bot invasion came. Char and gold Farmers came and everyone had 100 million, everyone had a lvl 60+ char... all b/c of bots... not b/c of players actully grinding... Many many many players left this game, now its bot infested, game play sucks, ecomeny sucks and cant find a real player to save my life. So in light of that, do you want everyone running around with hulks, titans, freights and having billions and billions of isk, when you are the only player still trying to learn lvl 5 indy? Brat So have the counters, gtfo.

Liu	Posted - 2008.05.11 04:41:00 - [641] Originally by: KidBrat This is a funny thread... #1 Eve is easy for skills Eve is FAAR, most and i stress it... THE EASIET GAME ONLINE TO to deal with training skills. THERE IS NO GRINDING SKILLS INVOLED. Just need to log in every so offten, click a button and look at where your skill are at... yes, and that means also that you can not speed up the process. the game is built in so that chars have to be training 24 hours/day. even so, there are 25 years of skill training. there isnt a single game with a longer training than EVE. so, yes, training is easier, but long. and we want to train 24 hours/day Originally by: KidBrat #2 Lazy people... Only people that are complaing there is no Skills Que, or somthing like it. Are the most disqusting people in game. OMG, just move the mouse over your char info sheet and check... Ok once a day is fine to checek on most skills... Once you get pass lvl 2 or 3 on most skills, (depends on implants and learning curve), most skills starts turning into days to train... I will be 4 days away from able to use a hulk, but, took me 7 weeks to get it... wow, so just move your mouse... where do you move your mouse when the server is down unexpectedly Originally by: KidBrat #3 Gold farms are a problem already Look gold farming is already a problem. Does everyone want Char farming a problem to. I left a game once b/c bots ruined a great game, char and gold farming bots just brings down the ecomeny, game play and most imporantly, human interaction. I would hate to see a year from now, every tom ** haryy, jane doe having titans, star bases and all other high lvl stuff, b/c they just bought it from joe blow that farm the heck out of one char then sold it. it has been said many times. char farming has nothing to do with gold farming. Gold farming is a problem. yes. should we turn down autorepeat on guns and mining lasers to make it more difficult? char farming will never be an issue cause it is not worth it. nobody is gonna expend 500$ to train a char for 3 years, and then sell it for 4000 million isk, and then sell that isk for 280$, and even pay 20$ for the transfer in the process. well maybe Mr Dexx would do it. but nobody else. Originally by:** KidBrat #4 Game time cards, (GTC), and gold farmers Well hell, some of you complain about skills que should be in lay, (you lazy S.O.Bs), Another person suggest to simply turn off the skill when the account is not paid for, Brovo... great idea, fantasitc... but you forget one thing... A person that has billions of isk can just turn and simply by enough GTC for a year with isk... Who has billions and billions of isk to do this? Gold Farmers... so? all we want is a single skill queue. who cares about 90 day cards? Mr Dexx, you can paste those stupid arguments all the times you want. it only gives us the chance to throw them on the floor again. you have no credibility left. but i am glad you keep bumping this thread so often. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.11 12:53:00 - [642] Yes, Mr Dexx you are starting to get only annoying now... We are only talking about a backupskill not queueing indefinatley for christ sakes... Come forth with a valid argument or shut up ! Period. CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.11 13:05:00 - [643] You guys are funny. Enjoy not having a skillqueue
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.11 15:17:00 - [644] Originally by: Grarr Dexx You guys are funny. yes we are. on the other hand, you are not. you lost your credibility, and lack any sensible argument on the topic. but at least you are great at bumping. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
vrutex	Posted - 2008.05.12 13:34:00 - [645] ccp wont allow it, they want to show us how many player online, without que system there would be many new character waiting for finished training. but i suggest, let the player that already play long time say how many month to get que training system. then it would not be character farming.
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.12 16:34:00 - [646] Originally by: Grarr Dexx You guys are funny. And you're a boring troll. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.12 22:01:00 - [647] Originally by: vrutex ccp wont allow it, they want to show us how many player online, without que system there would be many new character waiting for finished training. but i suggest, let the player that already play long time say how many month to get que training system. then it would not be character farming. We are talking about a BACKUPSKILL - 1 - Skill can be queued as said on the DRAWINGBOARD Please dont assume we are asking for indefinate skill-queueing. Thankyou Greetings Belmarduk CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.12 22:03:00 - [648] sigh For the 10th (?) time - THIS: Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again. Not talking about ANYTHING else CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2008.05.12 23:09:00 - [649] Edited by: Atsuko Ratu on 12/05/2008 23:10:01 Originally by: Liu Edited by: Liu on 10/05/2008 22:05:21 Originally by: Sariyah It is fine as it is. Play the game. Or don't, it's your time management. no its not. its unscheduled server downtimes. and those are non-manageable all 0.25 a month 95% of "unscheduled server downtimes" are actually announced days in advance, if you read the news. Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: vrutex ccp wont allow it, they want to show us how many player online, without que system there would be many new character waiting for finished training. but i suggest, let the player that already play long time say how many month to get que training system. then it would not be character farming. We are talking about a BACKUPSKILL - 1 - Skill can be queued as said on the DRAWINGBOARD Please dont assume we are asking for indefinate skill-queueing. Thankyou Greetings Belmarduk So I can train for 3~ months without paying? Saweet.
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.13 00:10:00 - [650] Originally by: Atsuko Ratu Originally by: Liu Originally by: Sariyah It is fine as it is. Play the game. Or don't, it's your time management. no its not. its unscheduled server downtimes. and those are non-manageable all 0.25 a month 95% of "unscheduled server downtimes" are actually announced days in advance, if you read the news. what part of "unscheduled" do you not understand? Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf

Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.13 00:42:00 - [651] What part of 95% do you not understand?
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.13 03:22:00 - [652] Originally by: Grarr Dexx What part of 95% do you not understand? What part of "go away troll" do you not understand? ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.13 05:41:00 - [653] "go away troll"
Hannibal AntePorta Minmatar Finis Lumen Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.14 05:42:00 - [654] Dunno bout anyone else, but I'm at a point where I don't have the time to log into eve to change a 3 hour training time skill. I don't much care about queuing 10 day skills, just the ones that I have to change 3 times a day when I'm starting on a new thing. I don't have the time available to run home and do this so I waste a lot of training time. k
Sue Mee	Posted - 2008.05.14 06:36:00 - [655] Originally by: Hannibal AntePorta Dunno bout anyone else, but I'm at a point where I don't have the time to log into eve to change a 3 hour training time skill. I don't much care about queuing 10 day skills, just the ones that I have to change 3 times a day when I'm starting on a new thing. I don't have the time available to run home and do this so I waste a lot of training time. then a single skill queue would be great for you. it will help you finish all those annoying 2-10 hour skills. although i have to say that i disagree with your reasons for a queue.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.14 06:58:00 - [656] Originally by: Hannibal AntePorta Dunno bout anyone else, but I'm at a point where I don't have the time to log into eve to change a 3 hour training time skill. I don't much care about queuing 10 day skills, just the ones that I have to change 3 times a day when I'm starting on a new thing. I don't have the time available to run home and do this so I waste a lot of training time. Big difference between "don't have the time" and "can't be arsed to do it".
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.14 11:48:00 - [657] Edited by: Belmarduk on 14/05/2008 11:48:24 Originally by: Grarr Dexx Big difference between "don't have the time" and "can't be arsed to do it". Yeah and some people have a job and work and family and are not teenage trolls with no life and spend the whole day trolling in forums CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.14 12:05:00 - [658] Originally by: Belmarduk Edited by: Belmarduk on 14/05/2008 11:48:24 Originally by: Grarr Dexx Big difference between "don't have the time" and "can't be arsed to do it". Yeah and some people have a job and work and family and are not teenage trolls with no life and spend the whole day trolling in forums Hate to bring it up to you, but yeah, guess I should quit my job and go back to being a teenager as to not nullify your 'argument'.
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.14 13:01:00 - [659] Originally by: Grarr Dexx "go away troll" Grarr I suggest you take some time and read this: http://www.eve-online.com/pnp/forumrules.asp Especially number 7, it might help you and prevent a forum ban. What meaningful ideas have you added in the last 4 pages?
Kusha'an Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.	Posted - 2008.05.14 13:20:00 - [660] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: Grarr Dexx "go away troll" Grarr I suggest you take some time and read this: http://www.eve-online.com/pnp/forumrules.asp Especially number 7, it might help you and prevent a forum ban. What meaningful ideas have you added in the last 4 pages? I think he needs this thread more than it needs him. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?

Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.14 14:22:00 - [661] Go ahead, report me. See how much result it yields. But hereby I stand, and I will stand my ground. My points stand valid, and you have done nothing to argue them, other than calling me a troll. Maybe it should be you who is up for a forum ban?
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.14 16:30:00 - [662] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Go ahead, report me. See how much result it yields. But hereby I stand, and I will stand my ground. My points stand valid, and you have done nothing to argue them, other than calling me a troll. Maybe it should be you who is up for a forum ban? Point? You've spent almost 4 pages of replies with no point at all. And actually if you go back to page 20 I refuted your points from the beginning. Lets see - a one skill que is wanted to allow newer players to 'catch up' with veterans. Wrong, these same veterans will have access to the same one skill que - so there is no advantage. Training doesn't speed up, all players have access to the same tool - no advantage. and your other point - EvE is harsh. Yeah so what, a 24 hour skill que isn't going to make playing EvE any easier. You see that's the vital point you refuse to grasp. Training skills is not playing EvE, I think it safe to say every player spends FAR more time training skills then logged in and playing EvE. I'm sure everyone logs in from time to time for no other reason than to swap skills, because we've all got real lives in the way. Besides if EvE was really harsh, you would only be able to train skills while online (and not while sitting in station) - and the number of subscription cancellations would be huge.
Klistell	Posted - 2008.05.16 05:21:00 - [663] AMAZING!!!!!! 23 "pages" of people basically complaining about this system and not ONE dev comes on and addresses the issue. Hello guys! ARe you really reading this? Dont you get it? PEOPLE WANT A CHANGE HERE! im no programmer, but i cant see how hard it would be to do something to adjust the system so that people can have what they want a way to be able to not haveto log in every day and still be able to (you know, so that people can still get the benefits of paying for this game without having to livenext to their computers. i.e: people can do truly trivial things like....um.. work and have a social life) AND a way to be able to regulate it easily to make sure that non-paying people arent benefitting from the system. Are you devs really listening to this? Id really like to hear from one of you guys about what you plan on doing about this issue and what you stand is on it. surely there is a way to reconcile the desires of your clients (you know, the people who are paying for this game) and the need to keep fairness in respect to character farming.
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.16 07:10:00 - [664] Originally by: Klistell In my opinion, if farming is the issue,then it will continue no matter how hard CCP tries to control it. Heck, even paying customers could do that on the current system if they really wanted to (wouldnt make much sense, though). it has been discussed already. char farming is not a problem on EVE. it is not worth the money and efforts. but i think that CCP believes that the slower we train, the longer we'll pay for the game. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Leigonair	Posted - 2008.05.16 11:27:00 - [665] I Totaly agree it would b good for SOOOOOOO many resons thow lol laser people would get laser lol funny. They could make it like 10 skill's ;ong or a seten time it could add up to yer the time would b better that way you could put 100 days time in training thing i dono any way it would be good.
MotoMissles	Posted - 2008.05.18 00:29:00 - [666] Originally by: Klistell Ive heard that this has been an issue for the last 4 years. It is amazing to me that so many customers feel so strongly about an issue and the company doesnt provide and solution. But, the current training system isn't broken. Any sort of queue would be a luxury, a perk, a bonus. Just because people complain does not mean that change is needed. While I agree that even a 1 skill queue would be nice, I don't see it as something necessary to the development of EVE. I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP?
Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.18 13:08:00 - [667] Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations....
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.18 15:39:00 - [668] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations.... yes, or the rorqual, or useless l5 missions, or a paper book... but that is how it goes. it seems CCP do not want us to train 24 hours a day. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.18 20:00:00 - [669] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations.... If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team
Liu	Posted - 2008.05.18 23:32:00 - [670] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Originally by: Veryez Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations.... If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team a separate team which is paid by the same subscriptions that pay the other teams. since money is a limited resource, its CCP's responsability to manage it however they see best. and somehow they decided that ambulation was more important. if they had decided otherwise, the ambulation team would be working on some other thing, or they wouldnt have been employed on the first time, and another team with another talents would have been hired instead. so your argument is really lacking any meaningful content. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf

Kusha'an Gallente RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.05.19 12:33:00 - [671] Originally by: Liu so your argument is really lacking any meaningful content. QFT. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.19 14:59:00 - [672] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Grarr Dexx Originally by: Veryez Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations.... If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team a separate team which is paid by the same subscriptions that pay the other teams. since money is a limited resource, its CCP's responsability to manage it however they see best. and somehow they decided that ambulation was more important. if they had decided otherwise, the ambulation team would be working on some other thing, or they wouldnt have been employed on the first time, and another team with another talents would have been hired instead. so your argument is really lacking any meaningful content. ar+gu+ment Audio Help /ˈɑrgyəmənt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ahr-gyuh-muhnt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation ûnoun 1.an oral disagreement; verbal opposition; contention; altercation: a violent argument. 2.a discussion involving differing points of view; debate: They were deeply involved in an argument about inflation. 3.a process of reasoning; series of reasons: I couldn't follow his argument. 4.a statement, reason, or fact for or against a point: This is a strong argument in favor of her theory. 5.an address or composition intended to convince or persuade; persuasive discourse. 6.subject matter; theme: The central argument of his paper was presented clearly. 7.an abstract or summary of the major points in a work of prose or poetry, or of sections of such a work. 8.Mathematics. a.an independent variable of a function. b.Also called amplitude. the angle made by a given vector with the reference axis. c.the angle corresponding to a point representing a given complex number in polar coordinates. Compare principal argument. 9.Computers. a variable in a program, to which a value will be assigned when the program is run: often given in parentheses following a function name and used to calculate the function. 10.Obsolete. a.evidence or proof. b.a matter of contention. vs. Verb1.point out - make or write a comment on; "he commented the paper of his colleague" comment, remark, notice criticise, criticize, pick apart, knock - find fault with; express criticism of; point out real or perceived flaws; "The paper criticized the new movie"; "Don't knock the food--it's free" note, remark, mention, observe - make mention of; "She observed that his presentation took up too much time"; "They noted that it was a fine day to go sailing" wise***** - make a comment, usually ironic kibbitz, kibitz - make unwanted and intrusive comments
Grarr Dexx Amarr Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.20 08:19:00 - [673] Not an argument by the way, I just pointed out the error in his post.
Zaerlorth Maelkor The Maverick Navy Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.05.20 08:58:00 - [674] Originally by: Liu Originally by: Grarr Dexx Originally by: Veryez Originally by: MotoMissles I don't buy the 'o noes! my skill ended during unexpected down time!' line. There have been unexpected downtimes for 5 years...and the worst that's happened? You got set back by 6000SP? Actually a little over 38000, since I work 15 hour days (when you include commuting time) - and yes it has happened. You're right it's not broken, but it could be made better. And it is certainly more valuable to me than walking around in stations.... If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team a separate team which is paid by the same subscriptions that pay the other teams. since money is a limited resource, its CCP's responsability to manage it however they see best. and somehow they decided that ambulation was more important. if they had decided otherwise, the ambulation team would be working on some other thing, or they wouldnt have been employed on the first time, and another team with another talents would have been hired instead. so your argument is really lacking any meaningful content. You are wrong! Ambulation is a business decision. CCP wants to expand their business with the vampire/werewolf MMO. Ambulation is using the exact same code. So it does not detract from EVE in any way. ================================================== I should really get a sig.
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.05.20 17:53:00 - [675] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Not an argument by the way, I just pointed out the error in his post. I don't see the error, he never said any 'company' was working on ambulation. He simply stated that ambulation as an idea wasn't as valuable. BTW the purpose/usefulness of that post is about as meaningless as this one. With that I'll stay on topic and mention that a queue would be convenient. It's more of a luxury than a feature however. Still it would make the more casual gamers not have to login as much just to change a skill. Even if it's just one it still helps. It also comes down to how much effort would be needed to make it happen. Apparently CCP doesn't see the effort worth while or are just ignoring it.
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.05.20 19:30:00 - [676] Originally by: Highwind Cid Apparently CCP doesn't see the effort worth while or are just ignoring it. I tend to believe the latter - The reason baffles me though CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Ninja Kusoda	Posted - 2008.05.21 06:39:00 - [677] How about enable user to queue up to 24 hours worth of skill points? so busy player just need to login once a day to set up his next training queue.
Aniel Zaar	Posted - 2008.05.21 10:50:00 - [678] Honestly, I don't see a problem with the way the system is now. I simply train the short skills when I am online, then, when I have to log off, I put some long skill that will absolutely ensure I will be back online before it finishes (4 days +). When I'm back, I simply start training another short skill. (anything under a day or two is short)
Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.05.21 13:40:00 - [679] Originally by: Aniel Zaar Honestly, I don't see a problem with the way the system is now. I simply train the short skills when I am online, then, when I have to log off, I put some long skill that will absolutely ensure I will be back online before it finishes (4 days +). When I'm back, I simply start training another short skill. (anything under a day or two is short) Yeah, this strategy has already been covered ad nauseum. Here's the problem: Doing it your way forces a player to be nonlinear in his/her training. That's all well and good if your goal is just to keep the meter running. But in most cases where a player is training up for a specific goal, such as a new Tech 2 ship, the training needs to be linear. This makes logging on to set and/or change skills a real hassle, which is compounded for players who work a lot. A skill queue makes that goal attainable more quickly as nonlinear skills can be set aside for the most part during this period. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Ninja Kusoda	Posted - 2008.05.21 19:07:00 - [680] it could be the that CCP want to have more player in server, good figure to report. So they won't bother implementing this feature.

Veryez	Posted - 2008.05.21 20:38:00 - [681] Originally by: Grarr Dexx If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team And when you learn how business works you'll understand my comment better. But allow me to explain: Your clever answer would be correct if a company had infinite resources (and time) such that all it really had to do is decide when to solve each problem. But alas in the real world no company can do that, so every decision made to commit resources in fact subtracts resources from other ideas. The business decision to introduce ambulation inevitably takes resources away from making other improvements (in this case implementing a skill que). The example of "walking around in stations" was simply a metaphor. In reality the people who would code in a skill que are doing other tasks, and simply haven't been directed to do this. It can safely be assumed they aren't sitting around waiting to work. So if CCP decides to implement a skill que, these people must be pulled from what they are doing (or working on) and redirected to this. Once again stealing resources (people) from other projects. So while I might not have the skill Reading I trained, I'm pretty sure I finished Business V.
Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.05.22 13:09:00 - [682] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: Grarr Dexx If you had learned Reading I you could have learned that Ambulation was being worked on by a separate team And when you learn how business works you'll understand my comment better. But allow me to explain: Your clever answer would be correct if a company had infinite resources (and time) such that all it really had to do is decide when to solve each problem. But alas in the real world no company can do that, so every decision made to commit resources in fact subtracts resources from other ideas. The business decision to introduce ambulation inevitably takes resources away from making other improvements (in this case implementing a skill que). The example of "walking around in stations" was simply a metaphor. In reality the people who would code in a skill que are doing other tasks, and simply haven't been directed to do this. It can safely be assumed they aren't sitting around waiting to work. So if CCP decides to implement a skill que, these people must be pulled from what they are doing (or working on) and redirected to this. Once again stealing resources (people) from other projects. So while I might not have the skill Reading I trained, I'm pretty sure I finished Business V. I endorse this post. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Highwind Cid	Posted - 2008.05.22 16:55:00 - [683] Originally by: Aniel Zaar Honestly, I don't see a problem with the way the system is now. I simply train the short skills when I am online, then, when I have to log off, I put some long skill that will absolutely ensure I will be back online before it finishes (4 days +). When I'm back, I simply start training another short skill. (anything under a day or two is short) Yes you are right, there really is nothing wrong with the way it is now. But this 'feature' would make everyones lives a little bit easier. If CCP were to integrate something like this tiny luxury it would make a big impact on players feelings towards them, in a good way.(I'm assuming this, there isn't anyone who would go against this correct?) Little, change, big, (good) impact. The only thing that I'm not including in this formula is what I mentioned above. Either CCP doesn't see the time worth the outcome or they are just ignoring it.
Pur3Bl00D Volition Cult The Volition Cult	Posted - 2008.05.22 17:55:00 - [684] + 1 + 1 + 1 i've said it again sometime ago i thing. set a limit like that one of the following limits and let us use skill queing: - only low lvl / rank skills can be put in a queue e.x. up to rank 3 or lvl 3 oh and +1
Jake RIvers Vinyl Roid The Cool Kids Club	Posted - 2008.05.27 14:57:00 - [685] I sure hope the new expansion brings in a skill training queue.
ceyriot Induseng Enterprises R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.05.28 01:01:00 - [686] I support this Idea and/or service. Faction Store - Killboard
Guttripper State War Academy	Posted - 2008.05.28 07:45:00 - [687] I doubt CCP would ever implement a skill queue system because the players would never be satisfied with it. If CCP created a system to allow a player to queue one skill from level 1 to level 2, then there will be complaints about desiring to queue into level 3, into level 4, and into level 5. There will be complaints that the system allows only one skill and thus one queue, and not numerous skills with numerous queues. There will be complaints that players can not switch skills in the queue order; that is, once a skill completes to begin a whole new skill. Thus to satisfy all these potential complaints, a system would have to be implemented that would then allow character farming to become a potential ~feature~. Thus for CCP to fend off farming and whatnot, they will leave this Pandora box closed while these threads rage onward and onward and onward...
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.28 08:34:00 - [688] Originally by: Guttripper I doubt CCP would ever implement a skill queue system because the players would never be satisfied with it. If CCP created a system to allow a player to queue one skill from level 1 to level 2, then there will be complaints about desiring to queue into level 3, into level 4, and into level 5. There will be complaints that the system allows only one skill and thus one queue, and not numerous skills with numerous queues. There will be complaints that players can not switch skills in the queue order; that is, once a skill completes to begin a whole new skill. Thus to satisfy all these potential complaints, a system would have to be implemented that would then allow character farming to become a potential ~feature~. Thus for CCP to fend off farming and whatnot, they will leave this Pandora box closed while these threads rage onward and onward and onward... dude. read the thread before. all we want is a single skill queue. that is all that's needed. not 2, 3, 5 or 42. no need to alter the order. only a backup up skill. and please, leave the farming argument rest already. due to the way training works on EVE, char farming for money is completely stupid.
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.28 09:14:00 - [689] I thought I taw a puddy-tat.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.28 09:52:00 - [690] Originally by: Grarr Dexx I thought I taw a puddy-tat. wow. you are such a bad troll... we all know how until late 2006 everything CCP said about a skill queue was "NEVER, EVER, EVER". you havent brought up anything that is not common knowledge. but then, suddenly they changed their mind (who knows why, probably too much beer, or beer shortage, anything could be) and introduced a "system queue or dual training" on their designboard if quoting a 3 year old post is the best you can do...

Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.28 10:06:00 - [691] if someone needs a better proof about how stupid it is the "OMG, a queue is chars farmers weat dream" searching "eve online" on ebay gives 31 results. 1 of them is a 28 million sp gallente char, being sold for $300. 19 of them are "mining macros" or "mining utilities" so, macro mining is a problem 20x bigger than char farming, yet we have autorepeat on mining lasers. why do not get rid of that "macro miners most powerful tool" and instead implement a single skill queue that would benefitiate many more players withouth hurting so much the game?
Guttripper State War Academy	Posted - 2008.05.28 15:15:00 - [692] Originally by: Apertotes dude. read the thread before. all we want is a single skill queue. I have read this thread and similar threads and nothing has ever come from it. As I mentioned previously, what if CCP implemented the skill queue to allow one skill to go from level 1 to level 2 and nothing further? Would people accept this response or desire (demand) that they, "the paying customer" (blah blah blah) be allowed to single queue any combination of skills and levels? The prime example has always been <race> Battleship level 4 to level 5 while canceling the account for a month. The counterargument was if the account was canceled or suspended, then the skill stops. Would this be further work for CCP, to have the skill server constantly pinging the accounts for status? Or have the account server constantly feeding information to the skill server, telling it which accounts are active to non-active? --- Long ago, I did not care either way if there was a skill queue system or not. Hell, I suggested that those with extended military leave or certain jobs that are away from society as a whole for great lengths of time should be allowed to have an extended queue service offered. And what were some of the replies that rubbed me the wrong way? "That is their choice - why should they get special privileges?" So you have a family? That is your choice. So you work twenty hours a day? That is your choice. Server bellied-up right when you were about to change a skill? Sucks to be you I guess. Too many people wanting things just a bit easier in the game... I am the opposite - like the whole setting of being cold and harsh, you want to succeed in Eve, then work for it. Oh, did I mention I also proposed doubling the skill point requirements for skills in general?
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Carpe Universitas	Posted - 2008.05.28 17:34:00 - [693] Aside from the whole skillpoint doubling thing (), I like you already!
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.28 22:38:00 - [694] Originally by: Guttripper Too many people wanting things just a bit easier in the game... I am the opposite - like the whole setting of being cold and harsh, you want to succeed in Eve, then work for it. the queue has nothing to do with game dificulty. this game is hars, but not because there is no queue. it is harsh cause scamming is accepted and encouraged, cause pirating is advertised as a game feature, it is harsh because when you die, you loose a lot, it is hard cause its all based on competition with other players, and players are much more smart than npcs. having or not having a queue doesnt make the game harsher or colder. but if you want a cold experience, try playing EVE without map, without local, without insurance, without automatic orbits, without weapons and modules autorepeat, without npc agents, without clone jumps, and without overview. then the game would be harsh, and colder. those are the things that make a game harsher or not, and not a simple 1 skill queue. also, the fact you keep arguing about us wanting a longer queue later, means you really didnt understand nothing about it
Guttripper State War Academy	Posted - 2008.05.29 07:30:00 - [695] Originally by: Apertotes having or not having a queue doesnt make the game harsher or colder. An example off the top of my head - having a queue would remove the choice between logging in a moment to change a skill to spending some quality time with the family. Without the queue, a pretty harsh decision if you're a hardcore gamer to being a quality family member. Those players without a family need not concern with such matters and will gain a slight benefit by being able to change skills to those that decide family comes first over an online game and let the skill lapse. Originally by: Apertotes but if you want a cold experience, try playing EVE without map, without local, without insurance, without automatic orbits, without weapons and modules autorepeat, without npc agents, without clone jumps, and without overview. then the game would be harsh, and colder. those are the things that make a game harsher or not, and not a simple 1 skill queue. All the examples you mentioned above are within the confines of the game. A skill queue would be an out of game benefit. Once I logoff, my avatar is not being affected or influenced by agents, jump clones, maps, etc., yet a skill queue would alter my character. Yes, offline training does affect my avatar, but it is a single incident that without my real life influence, will eventually end. Fortunately CCP allows such tools like EveMon to monitor the training but will not allow such tools to change skills. It does seem CCP wants that human interaction to "grow" the avatar by careful nurturing and not by allowing a computer to "raise" the avatar for you via a queue. If CCP did not care either way, then don't you think some outside program would already be doing such tasks and these threads would be for naught? Originally by: Apertotes also, the fact you keep arguing about us wanting a longer queue later, means you really didnt understand nothing about it Human nature will always want more than what it has currently. People want a single skill queue; and if that was granted, people will then want multiple skill queues. Give an inch, want a foot; give a foot, want a mile. I offered the example of changing one skill from level 1 to level 2 - would this be enough? Would players then quit asking CCP for a skill queue or would players want to be allowed to change any skill for any level afterwards? I doubt anyone would be content with just a simple level 1 to level 2 queue. And what's wrong with double the skill points?
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.29 08:44:00 - [696] Edited by: Apertotes on 29/05/2008 08:44:59 Originally by: Guttripper Originally by: Apertotes having or not having a queue doesnt make the game harsher or colder. An example off the top of my head - having a queue would remove the choice between logging in a moment to change a skill to spending some quality time with the family. Without the queue, a pretty harsh decision if you're a hardcore gamer to being a quality family member. Those players without a family need not concern with such matters and will gain a slight benefit by being able to change skills to those that decide family comes first over an online game and let the skill lapse. so, spending time with the family without loosing EVE training time is something bad? anyway, a single skill queue would make players log in as many times as now (and not half, like many people believe), so i do not see the problem. Originally by: Guttripper Originally by: Apertotes but if you want a cold experience, try playing EVE without map, without local, without insurance, without automatic orbits, without weapons and modules autorepeat, without npc agents, without clone jumps, and without overview. then the game would be harsh, and colder. those are the things that make a game harsher or not, and not a simple 1 skill queue. All the examples you mentioned above are within the confines of the game. A skill queue would be an out of game benefit. Once I logoff, my avatar is not being affected or influenced by agents, jump clones, maps, etc., yet a skill queue would alter my character. Yes, offline training does affect my avatar, but it is a single incident that without my real life influence, will eventually end. Fortunately CCP allows such tools like EveMon to monitor the training but will not allow such tools to change skills. It does seem CCP wants that human interaction to "grow" the avatar by careful nurturing and not by allowing a computer to "raise" the avatar for you via a queue. If CCP did not care either way, then don't you think some outside program would already be doing such tasks and these threads would be for naught? well, EVE is a perssistent world. the character already advances without your interaction. we have offline training. yes, offline. the only interaction you need is log in, set a skill. that is not interaction at all. but that is not the only thing. many features of the game work offline, like market orders, or POSes, contracts, etc. if market orders remain while you are offline, and they can be filled, i do not see the reason why training can not have a single skill queue Originally by: Guttripper Originally by: Apertotes also, the fact you keep arguing about us wanting a longer queue later, means you really didnt understand nothing about it Human nature will always want more than what it has currently. People want a single skill queue; and if that was granted, people will then want multiple skill queues. Give an inch, want a foot; give a foot, want a mile. I offered the example of changing one skill from level 1 to level 2 - would this be enough? Would players then quit asking CCP for a skill queue or would players want to be allowed to change any skill for any level afterwards? I doubt anyone would be content with just a simple level 1 to level 2 queue. you still do not understand it. we do not want a queue cause we do not like to play the game and just want to train. we do not want a queue cause we are lazy. we do not want a queue to farm characters. we do not want a queue to set 6 months of skills and forget about it. we want something that help us not loose training time when, even through careful and smart planning, something prevents us from training. this happens mostly when there are unexpected server downtimes. to get that immunity, only 1 skill in the queue is needed, and thus we will not ask for more. cause, i repeat, we are not lazy. we just want to train 24 hours everyday, without being penalized for something that is out of our scope.
Shaemell Buttleson Darwin With Attitude oooh Shiny	Posted - 2008.05.30 11:19:00 - [697] Come on give us a queue FFS!
Zakurai	Posted - 2008.06.02 19:17:00 - [698] Is there any way we can petition to have a Dev read and respond to this thread?
Epidemis	Posted - 2008.06.02 21:28:00 - [699] The skill system in place is currently very annoying if you have any obligation at all. IT's frustrating you have to be online at a specific time all the time.
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.06.03 07:43:00 - [700] No, you don't. You just set a new skill if the skill you're training finishes at an inconvenient time.

Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.06.03 11:28:00 - [701] Originally by: Grarr Dexx No, you don't. You just set a new skill if the skill you're training finishes at an inconvenient time. still here? arent you tired of being proved wrong time and time again? you are convincing no one, cause you lack arguments. you just troll, and that has already thrown your credibility to the ground. well, at least you are doing a terrific job at mantaining this topic on the front page.
Resamo	Posted - 2008.06.03 17:48:00 - [702] Originally by: Grarr Dexx No, you don't. You just set a new skill if the skill you're training finishes at an inconvenient time. Ok... so i know i will be home at 6:00pm and my skill finishes at 6:30pm cool i am set. But my kid got hurt at and i have to take him to the hospital and dont get home until 9:00 or 10:00 and maybe at that point i am a little to concerned with my family to log onto eve to change my skill. should i be penalized for this? Your argument is set a skill that finishes at a convinent time... well sometimes you dont know when the time is when you set the skill. EVE is great because it allows people with real lives to advance just like people with no lives (like you) a skill queen just adds to that makeing people with lives much happier and keeps them in the game and attracts more to the game. EVE has a mature player base (well that might be a stretch) for the most part due to the fact that you can still be competitive even with a busy life why not add to this?
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.06.03 18:08:00 - [703] Originally by: Resamo Ok... so i know i will be home at 6:00pm and my skill finishes at 6:30pm cool i am set. But my kid got hurt at and i have to take him to the hospital and dont get home until 9:00 or 10:00 and maybe at that point i am a little to concerned with my family to log onto eve to change my skill. should i be penalized for this? oh no, now mr. dexx is gonna call you a looser and a no-life cause you get concerned for loosing 4 hours of training. yeah, that is the way he reasons. he just makes noise, and says how easy it is to plan your skills so that they end at a convenient time (which we all know), and then when confronted with how unstable the server and real life are, he just says that loosing hours of training is no big deal. and then its circle logic all over again. yes, he is annoying, but he keeps the thread updated and on the front page, that is why we feed him sometimes.
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.06.03 21:57:00 - [704] Originally by: Resamo Originally by: Grarr Dexx No, you don't. You just set a new skill if the skill you're training finishes at an inconvenient time. Ok... so i know i will be home at 6:00pm and my skill finishes at 6:30pm cool i am set. But my kid got hurt at and i have to take him to the hospital and dont get home until 9:00 or 10:00 and maybe at that point i am a little to concerned with my family to log onto eve to change my skill. should i be penalized for this? Your argument is set a skill that finishes at a convinent time... well sometimes you dont know when the time is when you set the skill. EVE is great because it allows people with real lives to advance just like people with no lives (like you) a skill queen just adds to that makeing people with lives much happier and keeps them in the game and attracts more to the game. EVE has a mature player base (well that might be a stretch) for the most part due to the fact that you can still be competitive even with a busy life why not add to this? Your kid gets hurt and all you care about is 90 minutes (OH JESUS!) of skilltime lost?
Guyy Fawkes	Posted - 2008.06.04 11:42:00 - [705] Hey guys, Theres this macro program called Apis Ceratina. It records mouse clicks and movements. IM NOT SAYING I HAVE EVER USED THIS. In the program, there is a scheduler. It is possible to schedule the program to train your skills for you THROUGHOUT THE DAY.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.06.04 11:53:00 - [706] Originally by: Guyy Fawkes Hey guys, Theres this macro program called Apis Ceratina. It records mouse clicks and movements. IM NOT SAYING I HAVE EVER USED THIS. In the program, there is a scheduler. It is possible to schedule the program to train your skills for you THROUGHOUT THE DAY. edit this message inmediatly. we do not want or like macros, and CCP does neither.
Guyy Fawkes	Posted - 2008.06.04 11:57:00 - [707] Well, as soon as someone lets me know talking about a program people use to do this sort of stuff is illegal, ill keep it up. If a Mod or dev should contact me about it, I will take it down. Ive never used it, however, alot of people I know have.
Guyy Fawkes	Posted - 2008.06.04 11:57:00 - [708] Well, as soon as someone lets me know talking about a program people use to do this sort of stuff is illegal, ill keep it up. If a Mod or dev should contact me about it, I will take it down. Ive never used it, however, alot of people I know have.
Achran Dexx CompleXion Industries	Posted - 2008.06.04 12:03:00 - [709] I s'pose you just scrolled by the EULA, eh?
Resamo	Posted - 2008.06.04 15:28:00 - [710] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Originally by: Resamo Originally by: Grarr Dexx No, you don't. You just set a new skill if the skill you're training finishes at an inconvenient time. Ok... so i know i will be home at 6:00pm and my skill finishes at 6:30pm cool i am set. But my kid got hurt at and i have to take him to the hospital and dont get home until 9:00 or 10:00 and maybe at that point i am a little to concerned with my family to log onto eve to change my skill. should i be penalized for this? Your argument is set a skill that finishes at a convinent time... well sometimes you dont know when the time is when you set the skill. EVE is great because it allows people with real lives to advance just like people with no lives (like you) a skill queen just adds to that makeing people with lives much happier and keeps them in the game and attracts more to the game. EVE has a mature player base (well that might be a stretch) for the most part due to the fact that you can still be competitive even with a busy life why not add to this? Your kid gets hurt and all you care about is 90 minutes (OH JESUS!) of skilltime lost? Thats right i dont care about hte 90 minutes or 5h or 2days or what ever since i have more important things to worry about. Why should i be penalized? (I asked you a real question and put some real points to you but your response was a waste of my time... do you really think you are effectivly debating this. I guess you are just trolling this, thats unfortunate as it destroys any positive comments you have made for your side.)

Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.06.04 17:08:00 - [711] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Quote: Ok... so i know i will be home at 6:00pm and my skill finishes at 6:30pm cool i am set. But my kid got hurt at and i have to take him to the hospital and dont get home until 9:00 or 10:00 and maybe at that point i am a little to concerned with my family to log onto eve to change my skill. should i be penalized for this? Your kid gets hurt and all you care about is 90 minutes (OH JESUS!) of skilltime lost? Er...not only are you a troll, but you're not even a good one. 9pm minus 6:30pm doesn't equal 90 minutes. Sheesh. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
SellYourPoppa	Posted - 2008.06.05 11:13:00 - [712] A skill queue will help break the addiction. We wouldn't wanna do that :).
Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.06.05 14:09:00 - [713] Originally by: SellYourPoppa A skill queue will help break the addiction. We wouldn't wanna do that :). No, it won't. What it will do is allow people to avoid unplanned downtime losses. People who would normally be getting up for work and need to change a skill aren't suddenly drawn to play the game in the morning. They just log in, change the skill, and log out. With the skill queue, they wouldn't have to do that. Or if there's downtime, they won't be punished. No actual decrease in play time would be realized; in fact, it probably would increase since people would be training more short skills and would be more eager to play since their short term goals would be accomplished more often. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.06.05 14:59:00 - [714] Edited by: Belmarduk on 05/06/2008 14:59:22 Yep exactly - and again a few good reasons for a 1+ skill-queue....again Why arent the devs answering? The post is moderated by Mr.Navigator - Please Mr Navigator tell a dev to answer - Thankyou And before anyone...again... necros that old answer from hm 2004 (?) up...again...Please dont forget that the skill-queue or dualtraining system was put onto the drawingboards AFTERWARDS Thankyou for your attention...again CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
b1zz	Posted - 2008.06.05 17:02:00 - [715] Originally by: Belmarduk Edited by: Belmarduk on 05/06/2008 14:59:22 Why arent the devs answering? Because I asked them not to. Please devs, just get on with other more pressing issues thanks. These aren't the drones you're looking for. Move along, move along. Originally by: Resamo (I asked you a real question and put some real points to you but your response was a waste of my time... do you really think you are effectivly debating this. I guess you are just trolling this, thats unfortunate as it destroys any positive comments you have made for your side.) Every argument for and against has been posted in this thread more than once so admonishing people for not replying to your points simply indicates to me that you're not interested in finding out about them and would not be persuaded by them even if they were. This thread has to take the record as the most bumped, and also the most alt bumped .
Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.06.05 17:11:00 - [716] Originally by: b1zz This thread has to take the record as the most bumped, and also the most alt bumped . And yet here you are bumping it again. Thanks for that, by the way. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
b1zz	Posted - 2008.06.05 17:47:00 - [717] Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: b1zz This thread has to take the record as the most bumped, and also the most alt bumped . And yet here you are bumping it again. Thanks for that, by the way. You can't bump a thread that is already at the top you moron.
Kusha'an RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.06.05 19:45:00 - [718] Originally by: b1zz Edited by: b1zz on 05/06/2008 17:56:43 Originally by: Kusha'an Originally by: b1zz This thread has to take the record as the most bumped, and also the most alt bumped . And yet here you are bumping it again. Thanks for that, by the way. And I would accept that thanks if I had bumped anything. The thread was already at the top when I posted so direct your sarcasm elsewhere numbnuts Thanks for your noncontribution. I will take it under advisement. By the way, your mom can explain why my nuts are numb. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand?
Jacqueri Calroszian Lords Of Kaos	Posted - 2008.06.06 05:56:00 - [719] I frankly think a queue would be incredibly convenient, but am not all for it. For all of us who *can't* login because they: Have a high-latency connection (satellite) and constantly get dropped Have a slow computer Are not able to install Eve on the computer they are forced to use for a period of time Do not have the convenience of logging in (work/job - those ones where you can't get away with carrying a laptop around with Eve installed) Have a family that they need to attend to almost 24/7 - without having to spend 10 minutes just to click 4 buttons to train a new skill and log off Any other reason you can think of - I can think of a lot more ... Why not just make a damn link on the website itself? Log in here, click the character you want to train, click the skill you want to train all from the EVE Online site, etc. A queue could really give this game over to character farmers, but a far more lightweight ability to control what your character does while you're offline shouldn't be such a problem should it? Of course, I've been having massive problems logging on over the last few days because of my HughesNet satellite connection. I'm really fuming currently because I've lost 7 days worth of training time due to the fact I'm not at my house with cable internet and am not able to log in at all. I just think it's ridiculous that I have to log in with the client just to start training something like "Jump Drive Operation 4" when I could have finished training it by now. I would even pay something like 5 dollars static fee just to have a service like this enabled - because thus far I have lost about 2-3 dollars of my subscription not being able to play. Overall, am I for a queue system? No. Am I for a lightweight HTML implementation that lets you do the same thing approximately 5 times faster and without worry of the client vomiting you off of the server? Yes. Also, maybe put something in like one of those random picture-number-letter generators and have the user input what the picture shows to avoid training bots...
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.06.06 07:32:00 - [720] Your 'lightweight' html application would require a direct connection with the database, needlessly overloading it. The code-input would not scare off any decent script, and if those scripts do get through everyone and their mother will have one, and character-farming will be oh-so rampant. CCP has said it time and time again. NO skill queue, and definitely NO web-based application to manage your skills. If you are having trouble with your internet connection, take it out on your ISP and stop degrading this game.

Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.06.06 11:21:00 - [721] Originally by: Jacqueri Calroszian I frankly think a queue would be incredibly convenient, but am not all for it. For all of us who *can't* login because they: Have a high-latency connection (satellite) and constantly get dropped Have a slow computer Are not able to install Eve on the computer they are forced to use for a period of time Do not have the convenience of logging in (work/job - those ones where you can't get away with carrying a laptop around with Eve installed) Have a family that they need to attend to almost 24/7 - without having to spend 10 minutes just to click 4 buttons to train a new skill and log off Any other reason you can think of - I can think of a lot more ... Why not just make a damn link on the website itself? Log in here, click the character you want to train, click the skill you want to train all from the EVE Online site, etc. A queue could really give this game over to character farmers, but a far more lightweight ability to control what your character does while you're offline shouldn't be such a problem should it? Of course, I've been having massive problems logging on over the last few days because of my HughesNet satellite connection. I'm really fuming currently because I've lost 7 days worth of training time due to the fact I'm not at my house with cable internet and am not able to log in at all. I just think it's ridiculous that I have to log in with the client just to start training something like "Jump Drive Operation 4" when I could have finished training it by now. I would even pay something like 5 dollars static fee just to have a service like this enabled - because thus far I have lost about 2-3 dollars of my subscription not being able to play. Overall, am I for a queue system? No. Am I for a lightweight HTML implementation that lets you do the same thing approximately 5 times faster and without worry of the client vomiting you off of the server? Yes. Also, maybe put something in like one of those random picture-number-letter generators and have the user input what the picture shows to avoid training bots... well, i am sorry. i am all for a limted 1-skill queue. but i believe that none of the reasons you gave are valid to have it. in my opinion, none of those are CCP responsability, so they have no obligation to provide any way to get through them. the way i see it, the most valid reason they have to give us a queue is because there are unexpected server downtimes and many people loose training time directly through CCP's responsability, no matter how hard they planned they skills. again, i challenge you to probe how char farming is an issue on a game like EVE. think about it. it is completely stupid. and finally, a web browser interface to change skills would be better than nothing, but i do not like it cause it would make it possible to advance the character without really playing the game at all, not even to log in. i really believe that a limited 1 skill queue is the perfect answer. it wipes away any possibility of loosing training time with careful planning, and at the same time it does nothing worth of resemblance for char farmers (if ever there was any)
Tyrenical Vae Victus.	Posted - 2008.06.06 11:21:00 - [722] Lazy cat is lazy
Guttripper State War Academy	Posted - 2008.06.06 13:30:00 - [723] There are two compromises I feel could be an alternative to having a full-blown skill queue. First would be to have the queued skill limited to twelve (12) hours maximum in length, or the skill completes another level - which ever happens first. This would encompass those server issues and anything outside the normal routine of life without allowing the player to be casual about their training. Second would be an unlimited timed skill or skills queue, but the skill in training costs, oh one million times the skill rank per hour, paid upon the first of ever hour. Thus if you have unlimited funds and decide that you can afford to not login to alter a skill and just let the current one continue until it completes level five, then more power to you. This would take out much of the excessive credits in the game while allowing the player to "farm" their avatar if they desired. As for a web based alteration or queue, while not a computer programmer, I would think the one reason CCP would not allow this route would be the potential of hacking a character directly to alter the skills. Or corrupt the skill training database and reduce all pilots to no skill points or maximum skill points or... Do you think CCP could put a good public relation spin with the news that every character reduced to zero?
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.06.06 13:48:00 - [724] Edited by: Belmarduk on 06/06/2008 13:48:35 Originally by: Grarr Dexx CCP has said it time and time again. NO skill queue, Wrong Why is it on the drawingboard then? CCP if you DONT want a skill-queue TAKE IT OFF THE DRAWINGBOARD FFS Thankyou Yours sincerly CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Jacqueri Calroszian Lords Of Kaos	Posted - 2008.06.07 00:06:00 - [725] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Your 'lightweight' html application would require a direct connection with the database, needlessly overloading it. The code-input would not scare off any decent script, and if those scripts do get through everyone and their mother will have one, and character-farming will be oh-so rampant. True, I can see how an HTML-based skill-training application could be easily manipulated and exploited - even with the necessary precautions it could evolve into a serious problem, so you have a good point. I suppose it's not as practical as it seems. Originally by: Grarr Dexx CCP has said it time and time again. NO skill queue, and definitely NO web-based application to manage your skills. If you are having trouble with your internet connection, take it out on your ISP and stop degrading this game. In all honesty I have taken this issue up with my ISP - several times. I just think it's strange how this is the only program that does not work whatsoever when using this connection, so it looks like another CCP problem and the way that they monitor or control their server(s), rather than only an ISP issue. On one last note, if attempting to find a compromise or a solution to a particular problem is your definition of "degrading this game," then I won't bother arguing. Also, why would I dirty this games reputation with little things like connection issues when there are so many countless other things that I could name off that should be (and often aren't) fixed and that are far more serious issues? I'm sure we can all come up with a few ourselves. There doesn't seem to be any practical and simple solution to lost skill training time - even with a limited queue, there are still going to be complaints, and putting a price on the number of skills you queue is also unfair in terms of the fact that it helps only the older players, not the newer ones. The senior players of this game have enough perks as it is.
Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.06.07 01:19:00 - [726] Finally, a sane post. I'm getting tired of all the troll-calling here. I believe you're mostly right there, although I do have to point out that these 'perks' only go so far. Level V is as far as skills can go and there is not one ship capable of using 100% of the skillpoints you have. I too would dig a skill queue, but I just don't find it viable in any way or shape in this game. Eve Online has gone by without a skill queue for five years, and that's one of the things I like about this game: it's unforgiving for everyone, not just newbies. But you know, when my kid gets hurt and has to stay in the hospital for a few days, I don't care that I miss out on skillpoints. I wouldn't even petition it, because I know it's part of the game. Eve's harsh for everybody, and if this skill queue is a help to everybody it's also a bother to everybody. If you miss out on skillpoints, too bad, someone else will also have been affected by that. You just need to know how to plan your skills a little more precariously, which I know isn't easy, or there aren't always skills relevant to what you want to train, but that's Eve. Really, this skill queue would add zero gameplay value, and the web-based interface would do nothing more than bog down the database / encourage character farming through easy scripts.
Black Leather	Posted - 2008.06.07 17:21:00 - [727] If I'm 4 hours from a skill I really want to have when I get home from work and my shift is 8 hours, I train it anyway. What's the big deal about 4 hours. Then again, I'm not one of those anal 'I live for EVE', OCD type players that need to account for every split second of training time. Sheesh, guys. Get some fresh air. It's summertime. That said, I wouldn't turn down a one skill queue
Zakurai	Posted - 2008.06.09 19:33:00 - [728] My last post seemed to have been ignored. I will ask again; is there any way to petition to get a Dev to review this thread. We could start a non-eve petition and get signitures to get them to READ this forum. Whether their for or against its at their discretion, but at least it would give some sence of accomplishment, not just bickering one way or the other.
Admiral Madbull	Posted - 2008.06.09 20:22:00 - [729] Originally by: Zakurai My last post seemed to have been ignored. I will ask again; is there any way to petition to get a Dev to review this thread. We could start a non-eve petition and get signitures to get them to READ this forum. Whether their for or against its at their discretion, but at least it would give some sence of accomplishment, not just bickering one way or the other. A 25 pages long thread, you can bet that they have read this thread. But dont hold your breath on any response in it, couse if they start then players will want an answer and im sure they wont have one. As most have said before, this question has been up for more then 4 years, and nothing has happend to date, so dont hold your breath on this. Myself i would like the idea of having a que system, but for obvius reason i can see also why CCP havent implemented this into eve. Eve has the best skill system of all MMO i have played so far, and having a skill que or not should not be such a big issue in a game like this. sure i want it, but if they dont implement it i can live with that also. If i have 4 hours until the skill is done and i know i will be away for 8 hours or just dont know how long i rather just set a long skill, like 2 days or so. And when i put 2 days and i cant log in for 4 days, and i miss 2 days, well thats just life, deal with it. .
Drakazi	Posted - 2008.06.10 23:54:00 - [730] Edited by: Drakazi on 11/06/2008 00:00:43 Originally by: Jacqueri Calroszian Originally by: Grarr Dexx Your 'lightweight' html application would require a direct connection with the database, needlessly overloading it. The code-input would not scare off any decent script, and if those scripts do get through everyone and their mother will have one, and character-farming will be oh-so rampant. True, I can see how an HTML-based skill-training application could be easily manipulated and exploited - even with the necessary precautions it could evolve into a serious problem, so you have a good point. I suppose it's not as practical as it seems. Originally by: Grarr Dexx CCP has said it time and time again. NO skill queue, and definitely NO web-based application to manage your skills. If you are having trouble with your internet connection, take it out on your ISP and stop degrading this game. Following is a quote from the drawingboard section of 'patch notes' Skill Training - Queue or Dual training This could enable players to either queue skills so that when one level finishes the next level in that skill starts training automatically, or another preset skill starts training automatically. Dual training would enable you to have a primary long-term skill in training with a secondary short-term skill sharing the training time. After a level in the secondary skill has trained, the primary skill trains at full speed again. As far as an html application taxing the database... what do you think the in-game character sheet uses? And as far as scripting goes, mouse clicks are not hard to script either. Heres my real reason for wanting a skill que: When I buy the next level of implant for learning skills I get +1 to an attribute. That may take 4 hours or 4 minutes off of my training time. If I forget to log in, or I am paged to go to work, or my computer dies, or power goes out, it may be 4 hours or 4 days before I can log in again. The money I used to buy the implant was effectively wasted. If I can buy an implant to increase my training rate, I should be able to get the most out of it. As to the argument that I dont have to grind, (stop whining): Thats true. That is part of why I like this game. But why tie me to a specific minute and second and penalize me for being afk at that minute and second? I can live with the current system, but I see not one reason that dual training or a short skill queue should not be implemented.

Grarr Dexx Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.06.12 12:30:00 - [731] You see, your logic is flawed there. The ISK for the implants is not for the lower training times, they are for the +1 attribute.
sm1thy	Posted - 2008.06.13 15:09:00 - [732] this is the third time i see a thread like this and i want to say : + 1, please give us queues. Put some type of time-limits maybe, but pls just bring them on. Having to log-in just to switch a 5hrs skill to another 10 hrs skill is plain stupid, and definately not in the spirit of the Skill system this game should use at all.
Liu	Posted - 2008.06.17 10:05:00 - [733] well, given that Mr. Dexx has failed to update the thread (what do we want him for now?), i will once again remember the importance of a single skill queue. we all have present the problems many players had with friday's un-announced extended downtime. with a simple one-skill-queue CCP would have prevented any mourning. Originally by: Apertotes tbh, boot.ini was overpowered and needed a nerf
Belmarduk de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.06.20 19:05:00 - [734] Dev statement about skill-queue incoming :)))) Soon (TM) CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.06.20 19:47:00 - [735] Originally by: Grarr Dexx Finally, a sane post. I'm getting tired of all the troll-calling here. I believe you're mostly right there, although I do have to point out that these 'perks' only go so far. Level V is as far as skills can go and there is not one ship capable of using 100% of the skillpoints you have. I too would dig a skill queue, but I just don't find it viable in any way or shape in this game. Eve Online has gone by without a skill queue for five years, and that's one of the things I like about this game: it's unforgiving for everyone, not just newbies. But you know, when my kid gets hurt and has to stay in the hospital for a few days, I don't care that I miss out on skillpoints. I wouldn't even petition it, because I know it's part of the game. Eve's harsh for everybody, and if this skill queue is a help to everybody it's also a bother to everybody. If you miss out on skillpoints, too bad, someone else will also have been affected by that. You just need to know how to plan your skills a little more precariously, which I know isn't easy, or there aren't always skills relevant to what you want to train, but that's Eve. Really, this skill queue would add zero gameplay value, and the web-based interface would do nothing more than bog down the database / encourage character farming through easy scripts. What makes you think character farmers aren't using macros already? Where's the proof or even the evidence that a skill queue will cause character farming? Seriously, opposing a skill queue because you're worried about character farming is barely more credible than saying it's letting the terrorists win. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Dmian Gallente Starline Engineering Corporation	Posted - 2008.07.01 09:13:00 - [736] I've put a Skill Queue idea on the F&ID forum. I hope you like it. ---- Eve Alpha - The font of Eve - Get it here
Reygrimm	Posted - 2008.07.03 14:29:00 - [737] +1 to a skill queue of one (1) Reygrimm
Doc Extropy Gallente Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.07.03 15:25:00 - [738] Repost of myself: We should make a signature for a skill queue, so the developers see the massive public need for this feature. Also everybody supporting this idea may have a look at my bio ingame. Please, everybody, support the ongoing discussion in the assembly hall! --- Skill queue now! Nerf skillpoint loss and half done skills! WE ARE PAYING CUSTOMERS AND DESERVE MAXIMUM COMFORT!
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.07.04 13:35:00 - [739] Originally by: Doc Extropy Repost of myself: We should make a signature for a skill queue, so the developers see the massive public need for this feature. Also everybody supporting this idea may have a look at my bio ingame. Please, everybody, support the ongoing discussion in the assembly hall! I have but for some strange reason it keeps getting deactivated ? Any ideas why this could be? btw signatures seem to not work proply anymore since about a year now. Thx CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Doc Extropy Gallente Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.07.05 10:09:00 - [740] Edited by: Doc Extropy on 05/07/2008 10:10:06 Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Doc Extropy Repost of myself: We should make a signature for a skill queue, so the developers see the massive public need for this feature. Also everybody supporting this idea may have a look at my bio ingame. Please, everybody, support the ongoing discussion in the assembly hall! I have but for some strange reason it keeps getting deactivated ? Any ideas why this could be? btw signatures seem to not work proply anymore since about a year now. Thx You need to activate it in forum settings. I CAN see your pro - skillqueue sig and I like it. @CCP Any news when the skill queue will be implemented? August 2008? --- Skill queue now! Nerf skillpoint loss and half done skills! WE ARE PAYING CUSTOMERS AND DESERVE MAXIMUM COMFORT!

ceyriot Entropians on Vacation	Posted - 2008.07.07 12:17:00 - [741] /me wants one already Faction Store - Killboard
Pavlinka Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.07 17:08:00 - [742] We all know, CCP is worried about adding skill queue, cos of char farmers. But what about enabling to add skill to queue only if current queue/skill will be learnt in 8/4/12/24/2 hours? Pavlinka & Pavlinecka
Pheonix Gallen	Posted - 2008.07.07 17:30:00 - [743] Okay I don't know if this has been mentioned but I'm asking anyway. Could we please have the facility to change a skill when we log into the official 'EVE Online' web site for example, by logging onto 'My Character' Whilst at work, the company computer network is protected by a firewall and adminstator privleges, this prevents me loading EVE and hence playing online. I can however access 'EVE Online' during work time and would be able to change skills without the complications that arise with skill queueing. I really think this is one recomendation CCP should take notice of, What do you think ? Pheonix Gallen
Kusha'an Gallente RuffRyders Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.07.08 13:40:00 - [744] Originally by: Doc Extropy Repost of myself: We should make a signature for a skill queue, so the developers see the massive public need for this feature. Also everybody supporting this idea may have a look at my bio ingame. Please, everybody, support the ongoing discussion in the assembly hall! Done. Good idea. ---- CCP, please implement a skill queue!
AGreenLing	Posted - 2008.07.08 21:26:00 - [745] If you want to be lazy just set a 4D skill, if you want to train lvl 1`s you have to do some work. You say 1 skill would be ok, not really. You are giving all farming a huge advantage because they can manage twice as many characters,(this is just an example dont flame because its not correct) if the farmer has 30 characters and the skill takes 30 mins he can only have that many characters will skills, with the queue he can have 60 characters. Yes, its a crude example but it gets you the idea. Anyway, it takes you between 1-2 mins to change a skill. So its not hurting you that much.
Apertotes Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.07.09 06:35:00 - [746] Originally by: AGreenLing If you want to be lazy just set a 4D skill, if you want to train lvl 1`s you have to do some work. You say 1 skill would be ok, not really. You are giving all farming a huge advantage because they can manage twice as many characters,(this is just an example dont flame because its not correct) if the farmer has 30 characters and the skill takes 30 mins he can only have that many characters will skills, with the queue he can have 60 characters. Yes, its a crude example but it gets you the idea. Anyway, it takes you between 1-2 mins to change a skill. So its not hurting you that much. come back when you read the thread
Veryez	Posted - 2008.07.10 19:59:00 - [747] A response - FINALLY \o/ 0001 Skill Queue Functionality Noah (CCP) indicated CCPÆs awareness of the player frustrations with the ~6 hour duration skill trainings. However, CCP strongly believes that switching skill training is an activity that encourages players to log into the game and play. A skill queue would be a possible solution, if there would be limitations, such as a limited amount of skills being trained, or that only skills of a total up to a certain duration can be stacked into the queue. Alex (CSM Bane Glorious) noted that players have also suggested a dual training mechanic, where players can pick a primary and secondary skill, which both train at half speed. As soon as the skill with the shortest duration is finished, the other skill will train at full speed. It was concluded that CCP will look into a solution for this issue. Thank you CSM's Original post: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=819225
Lion El'Jhonson	Posted - 2008.07.10 21:02:00 - [748] I say yes to skill queue, this was one of the things i first thought as an imporvement to the game when i ran the trial, now that i have some more time in the game this has to be a must, some of us do have a life.
Moritsu Takana	Posted - 2008.07.10 21:13:00 - [749] Skill queue = not needed imo. The system works fine as it is, I hope CCP doesn't cave to all the whiny crybabies who can't bear the thought of their character missing a few hours of training, or who are too lazy to log in and actually play the game. In other MMO's, you have to be online, playing the game, to gain XP which translates to higher levels and greater skills. In this game, you can continue to skill up while offline. Why can't you appreciate this instead of crying for more? Babies.
Veryez	Posted - 2008.07.10 22:31:00 - [750] Originally by: Moritsu Takana Skill queue = not needed imo. The system works fine as it is, I hope CCP doesn't cave to all the whiny crybabies who can't bear the thought of their character missing a few hours of training, or who are too lazy to log in and actually play the game. In other MMO's, you have to be online, playing the game, to gain XP which translates to higher levels and greater skills. In this game, you can continue to skill up while offline. Why can't you appreciate this instead of crying for more? Babies. Sadly proving that hydrogen and stupidity are still the most abundant items in the universe... Nobody can honestly argue that logging on to swap a skill, and then logging off is really "playing the game" - I see it everyday, and do it myself. However that is not the important reason. A skill queue is needed when Tranquility is down (unscheduled) and we're unable to log in to play. Normally this isn't a great problem, but when tranquility goes down before work, I don't lose 1 to 2 hours of training - I lose 18, because I can't log in from work. Notice, I did nothing wrong, I balanced my skills so that 1 would end while I was getting ready for work, giving me time to log in and talk to friends. I don't want a skill queue because I'm too lazy to set a long skill when I can't play - I want one when Tranquility crashes unexpectedly! The other games you refer to aren't an issue since when your server goes down - nobody gets to log in and play - i.e it's inherently balanced. Even a 12 hour, 1 skill que is an immense improvement - since now I will have a window of time when I can log in and set the next skill up (like before I go to sleep). Notice I'm still logging in and playing the game, both sides get what they want. It's called a compromise, something adults do. Besides CCP appears to understand our side of the arguement now.

Darkeen Gallente	Posted - 2008.07.11 01:32:00 - [751] I've seen this topic many times and thought I'd put my voice in, especially if CCP look at this thread and se eonly complaints. I agree with Moritsu. The system is not broken. I set up 15-19 hour skills when I log off for the night and then when I return home from work the next day the skill is trained. I can then train a few hourly skills (2-4 hours) to cover over D/T and then start a long term training again. When skills only have 7-9 hours to train I log in again before I leave for work the next day and start a long term skill again. Better to start training a 5 day skill over the time I'm not here, than to not train a skill at all. I think the system works wonderfully. - It makes you think about your character and how to best use the time you have. - It prevents characters farmers - which would increase the number of players exponential and cause huge lag issues from those farming chars. - CCP would have to devote more time to preventing ther ISk farmers from selling (ebay, etc) and not be able to fix issues ingame (or adding features, etc). Sure, its a bit of a pain, especially if you have to be elsewhere and you REALLY want to train that 2 hour skill - but your going out for the day. But thats life. You cant always get want you want. Keep up the Good work CCP. Your system is beautiful! Regards, Jason Brisbane
Moritsu Takana	Posted - 2008.07.11 01:49:00 - [752] Originally by: Veryez A skill queue is needed when Tranquility is down (unscheduled) and we're unable to log in to play. Normally this isn't a great problem, but when tranquility goes down before work, I don't lose 1 to 2 hours of training - I lose 18, because I can't log in from work. Ah, I see. Well, in that case... a couple of questions come to mind. First, precisely how often has this exact scenario happened to you in, say, the last month? Second, what do you do for a living that you work 18 hours a day? And most importantly: what happens if your character goes 18 hours without training? Does God kill a kitten or something? Originally by: Veryez The other games you refer to aren't an issue since when your server goes down - nobody gets to log in and play - i.e it's inherently balanced. Ah, I see. Other MMO's are inherently balanced. Thanks for that handy tip, I'll keep that in mind. Originally by: Veryez It's called a compromise, something adults do. Besides CCP appears to understand our side of the arguement now. Wow, cool! Is that what adults do? I've heard so many things about what adults do. I can hardly wait till I grow up so I can be smart like you. Looks like CCP is finally getting smart too. After 4 years of whining, they've finally seen the light, is that what you're saying? A great veil of misunderstanding has been lifted from their eyes. Or perhaps they're just caving in to pressure from all the crybabies? Perhaps you, being so adult and all, can sort that one out. I still say it's all one big waaaaaah. I personally don't think they should change it. And if they do, hopefully whatever new system they implement will reduce "skill queue" whine posts enough to offset the new "char farmer" whine posts. But I wouldn't bet on it.
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.07.11 05:58:00 - [753] How about stfu ? Read the damn thread before posting your drivel ! You have now ONLY given the same lame arguments that have been counterdiscoused to death on this thread. Bring a constructive counterargument or go away. If I read another bullshit about char-farming I will scream.... CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Kyra Felann Gallente Noctis Fleet Technologies	Posted - 2008.07.11 14:38:00 - [754] A support a 24-hour max queue. I see no way to abuse it. If you used it, you'd still have to log in once a day. Long skills would still work normally, but a 24-hour queue would let you get some of the shortish skills out of the way instead of having to switch to them for an hour, then switch back to another skill several times to get them finished. Some of us don't play 5-6 hours a day and getting those skills that are longer than a few hours, but shorter than overnight are a pain. Long skills are not a problem.
BBQigniter	Posted - 2008.07.13 20:35:00 - [755] A queue for ONE skill, that should be trained next, would be really great. It even wouldn't bother me if there would be a pause (e.g. for 2-8 hours (perhaps reduced by a new skill called "Multi Tasking")) to the next skill - as if the character would be sleeping ;). I also have a normal life, friends I have to meet and a job where I can't login and change the skills everytime.
Slapnuts MkGee Caldari Scoopex Zenith Affinity	Posted - 2008.07.14 11:44:00 - [756] Edited by: Slapnuts MkGee on 14/07/2008 11:45:00 Originally by: Kyra Felann A support a 24-hour max queue. I see no way to abuse it. If you used it, you'd still have to log in once a day. Long skills would still work normally, but a 24-hour queue would let you get some of the shortish skills out of the way instead of having to switch to them for an hour, then switch back to another skill several times to get them finished. Some of us don't play 5-6 hours a day and getting those skills that are longer than a few hours, but shorter than overnight are a pain. Long skills are not a problem. I like this idea a lot. I hate having to log-in throughout the workday just to start a new 30-minute to three-hour skill. Slapnuts MkGee That guy with the silly name.
Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.07.31 15:30:00 - [757] heaves thread back to top again CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Setarcos Nous	Posted - 2008.07.31 23:49:00 - [758] You know, I would be happy with a 1 skill queue or a fallback/backup skill for when one finishes. Is it "necessary"? No. But as others have mentioned, neither is autopilot etc. Would it be convenient and make the game more enjoyable? Definitely. I've been trying to train Refining 5 this week, but when I started it a few days ago, I figured out that it would finish at 2am tonight; which is pretty useless to me as I would have plenty of wasted training time after, and wouldn't be able to use it until I have free time available about 17 hours later. So while playing this week, about 2 hours every night I might add, I have been training shorter skills to shift the finish time to right after I get off work. Unfortunately, a lot of those skills are completely useless to me in the extended-short term. I am waiting on Refining 5 and filling time with irrelevant stuff like Small Energy Turret 2. What would have been nice is if I could have set a few 6 hour skills ahead of it (or after) to automatically shift it. That way, instead of spending precious game time every night figuring out which would be the least useless in that will fit in the play time I have available, I could have just been playing. The more I think about it, and after having read this thread (ALL of this thread), I think there are no drawbacks to a queue of possibly extreme length...at least a queue that has is length measured by skill points and is exactly equal to the points required to train Titan from 4 to 5. Either that, or make it shorter, forcing players training such skills from 4 to 5 to actually log in once in a while. As long as any player can train that many skill points without logging in, all players should be able to. equips Heat Dissipation Field II
Khaladan Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.08.01 20:14:00 - [759] Edited by: Khaladan on 01/08/2008 20:14:12 Originally by: Dimagus Edited by: Dimagus on 21/06/2007 09:13:33 I wouldn't mind a queue for the next skill only to automatically start training, just so we don't have to lose time or switch to another halfway because a skill will complete during downtime or when we're not home. We would still be required to log in for every skill to put next in the queue, but it'd be at a time that's convenient, and not whenever the timer happens to run out. ^^ Just let us set the next skill. People still have to log in, but this way you do not have to deal with the hassle of skills ending in the middle of the night, or when you're at work, etc...
Darkerz	Posted - 2008.08.03 17:16:00 - [760] If a skill ends at night/work/DT etc etc... just when u go to work/night/dt just put on another skill i do this skill ends at 3:00 pm i go to sleep around 12:00 am i dont want to go to sleep that late so i just put up another 8-10 h skill when i wake up i train the 3hrs left problem solved

Belmarduk Amarr de Prieure Four Elements	Posted - 2008.08.05 11:47:00 - [761] Originally by: Darkerz If a skill ends at night/work/DT etc etc... just when u go to work/night/dt just put on another skill i do this skill ends at 3:00 pm i go to sleep around 12:00 am i dont want to go to sleep that late so i just put up another 8-10 h skill when i wake up i train the 3hrs left problem solved GOSH - People I think we have the solution !!!! Why did we never think of so much ingenuity ??? CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
Setarcos Nous	Posted - 2008.08.05 17:46:00 - [762] Originally by: Belmarduk Originally by: Darkerz If a skill ends at night/work/DT etc etc... just when u go to work/night/dt just put on another skill i do this skill ends at 3:00 pm i go to sleep around 12:00 am i dont want to go to sleep that late so i just put up another 8-10 h skill when i wake up i train the 3hrs left problem solved GOSH - People I think we have the solution !!!! Why did we never think of so much ingenuity ??? It must be because we are all so stupid and lazy.
Cyb3r Thr3at Mnemonic Enterprises New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.09.10 18:24:00 - [763] Great idea! i support this 100% c'mon CCP.. skill queue plz!
Reygrimm	Posted - 2008.09.15 17:28:00 - [764] Count me for a vote of skill queue of 1. The reality is that life takes over many times and leaves people unable to change skill training. Look at all the crazy weather that has rolled thru the US the past few days leaving many without electric or internet access. While life and people's safety comes first and EvE is probably the last thing on their minds, it's 1 bonus for a game that they can enjoy once things are back in order for their personal lives, knowing that their character didn't lose any training time. Reygrimm
Wikis	Posted - 2008.09.17 15:59:00 - [765] Totally damn agree, give a skill q I think best solution is just allow to queu up skill no longer then 24 hours, so for example you have the following queu - X hours skill -> another skill, where X is less than 24 hours, thats it. So much more easier life and no farmers problem ! COOOOOMMMMMMMOOOOOONNNNN CCCCCCPPPPPPPP stop being so unresponsive to comunity needs ! Im maintaing 3 freaking accounts, have full time job (luckily no wife and kids), but I still have friends and girls to have fun with, and I'm having really hard time maintaining those 3 accounts in constant training !!! SO LISTEN TO PPL AND DO IT FINALLY !!!!
Ben Walker	Posted - 2008.10.22 13:35:00 - [766] I completely support this. A small skill training queue for eve would make managing training plans so much easier for players, and there appears to be no good reason to not have a small skill queue. Come on CCP - Listen to the Players - Give us a skill Training Queue Plz
Belmarduk Amarr M.A.R.S. Enterprises Majesta Empire	Posted - 2008.10.22 19:17:00 - [767] Come and support this bloody overdue thing in this post in the assembly hall please Linky for skill-queue support Greetings Belmarduk Mainchar:
Joshua Calvert Caldari Safespot Industries	Posted - 2008.10.22 19:44:00 - [768] It would be a nice feature - it's so frustrating when you're training a skill and it ends at 4am. The only way to avoid this was to set a LVL5 skill on to training so you at least make use of those sleeping hours... Peace and love, Josh
Shoopinou Gallente Garoun Investment Bank	Posted - 2008.10.22 21:11:00 - [769] Now that ghost training is gone, it sounds fair to be able to queue at least one skill
Neyro7830 Gallente Stormfront A.W. Stormfront J.U.N.T.A.	Posted - 2008.10.23 03:42:00 - [770] Originally by: Shoopinou Now that ghost training is gone, it sounds fair to be able to queue at least one skill I like the way you think ------------------------------------------------ I am not responsible for the above post, because apparently, my cat has learned how to type. :3

Hannibal Ord Minmatar Cr4ck Whores	Posted - 2008.10.23 12:28:00 - [771] Okay. Look, I understand exactly why we have the training system as it is. Lets face it, it is a good system as it stands. Better than any MMO in my opinion. Many of us are attracted to eve because of this feature alone, meaning we can train whilst we aren't playing. A skill queue, DOES NOT allow players to catch up with others. Everyone would have the same option. It will not allow players to catch up with vets. The problem I believe with the skill system is the whole process, whilst simple, is also quiet dark age in its implementation. Many people, including myself, log in and change skills and log out. That's sad, because you are scheduling your RL around a game. Many people cannot do this. Losing skill time. Now, since you can't power level, and nobody will ever been a fully maxed out character because it takes 25 years or something to train everything and since Ghost training has been removed which means you have to pay to train. Skill queuing makes sense. Three options I think are good: 1. A set skill keeps repeating training until it gets to lvl 5 and then stops. 2. A single backup skill can be set, which eve switches too when the main skill is finished. Once this finishes, the training stops. Maybe have this train at reduced rate. 3. The skill systems simply selects ANY RANDOM skill that isn't trained and trains that. Then selects another random skill and trains that and so on, once the main skill is finished. I honestly believe that any of these options would work. People will log in and play the game still. People will obviously still have to pay the game to train. Those who say that it will make character farming easier with alts. Well, anyone who has alts has to log in anyway and train their characters. This will never change. Alts are prolific as it is, it won't make any difference. And because of the way the skill system is and the fact you can't power level, means the return for character farming is null because you have to pay for subscription to train them, especially now Ghost training is gone. It won't dumb down eve. It isn't giving in to care bears or any such crap. It simply is modernizing a process that whilst is very good, could be much better. Vets have no fear. If anything it will encourage more players into eve online, more money for CCP, more competition for everyone else in eve. And it will mean the game skill system doesn't OWN you. It doesn't control parts of your life and it shouldn't. This is a game. A game we really all love and adore so much. It won't break it, trust me.
Haiial Amarr Brothers In Scarlet	Posted - 2008.10.23 13:35:00 - [772] Hi all. My suggestion for the skill queue system would be: A) New skillbook titled 'Multiply Study' with level to enable the couple skill training by how many skill can be trained at same time. B) Skills that is already known and still training, would have this 'Multiply Study' applied with dividing up your attention of time to each of skills. (If have it trained and can train by studying couple skills at same time) C) Skills must be same rank number in order for 'Multiply Study' skill to work. D) Skills levels don't matter, if complete the single skill, still will be equally study all skills being training as long have the trained 'Multiply Study' according to number of skills able to train at same time. (Reduced burden of study so many) E) 'Multiply Study' Skillbook will need memory and willpower to reduce how much training time is being spent. What does everyone think of this idea? Seem very simple reasonable suggestion. "Shadow Wolf" Exist still? Anyone?
HARYBARY Bulgarian Mafia Squad Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2008.10.23 14:26:00 - [773] Isn't it strange? 26 pages with players ideas and suggestions and there in no single response from DEVS. Guys do you think that any of them cares what we want??? In last few years was written many posts about Skill Queue and there is no response from CCP. Don't blame yourself - they will never implement Skill Queue. THAT"S ALL.
Elder Langley	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:50:00 - [774] Originally by: Haiial Hi all. My suggestion for the skill queue system would be: A) New skillbook titled 'Multiply Study' with level to enable the couple skill training by how many skill can be trained at same time. I like that part, but rather then the rest you have there why not make it simple and say "Allows one skill to be added to the skill que per level"
Haiial Amarr Brothers In Scarlet	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:42:00 - [775] Originally by: Elder Langley Originally by: Haiial Hi all. My suggestion for the skill queue system would be: A) New skillbook titled 'Multiply Study' with level to enable the couple skill training by how many skill can be trained at same time. If alot like this suggestion. Just quote it. Heh I like that part, but rather then the rest you have there why not make it simple and say "Allows one skill to be added to the skill que per level"
GenXS	Posted - 2008.11.18 13:52:00 - [776] Hows this.. allow 1 to queue BUT have a confirmation message pop up ;) I'll be happy to 'remember' the next skill to train without pulling up my notepad. Confirming such a message would only improve my skill planning. AND of course.. no confirmation then the skill wont train. Avoid macro'ing and position the 'Accept training' randon left or right in the box ;)
Erastus II	Posted - 2008.11.18 23:12:00 - [777] I would be happy with a browser based way to change skills online at eve-online.com, or a mobile phone application that would allow you to log in, review skills and make changes...If the goal here is to ensure people are immersed in the game, why not give them the ability to engage in it while away form the game client? (Skills, limited Market, Contracts etc...via Browser or Phone...) Of course great care needs to be taken to prevent farming and ISK sellers abuse...but one of the things that originally attracted me to this game was the time based skill system and that I could be at work and still "playing"...Many people (myself included) get taken away from their gaming computers for extended periods of time for millitary deployments or business travel...why not encourage them to keep their subscription and stay engaged by opening some of the non pilot mechanics of the game to a phone application or browser interface? And dont say it wont ever happen, or its game breaking, CCP has proven to be quite innovative, and I have no doubt that their developers and this community could come up with something workable... Erastus MkII
El Shaddai	Posted - 2008.12.08 12:46:00 - [778] There are three viable suggestions on this entire thread for this: 1) Don't bother - The game works fine as it is. Eve is unique because of it's training system. So why change it. 2) You don't train a skill level, you train a skill. Training 'Drone Interfacing', starts putting skill points into 'Drone Interfacing', the training stops when you tell it to, no matter what level the skill has reached. 3) A single backup skill sat in a Q. This allows you to cover your back with a long skill always ready to start training if you can't make it to a PC for a few days. For me, option 2 is the winner by a mile, as it wouldn't take much time to implement and would still require intervention in order to build usable characters.
Bellatrix Black	Posted - 2008.12.08 18:51:00 - [779] Being that we have this new dandy certificate system. Why not allow queuing of the certificate skills? Would make them more functional and less just eyecandy notes. Just an idea.
brinelan Caldari Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.12.08 19:07:00 - [780] I have a skill que, its called evemon. I do short skills when I am playing and long skills when I am not. I do month long skills near patch times. It has worked for over 2.5 years, so whats the issue? -------------------------- Some days you're the bug, some days you're the windshield

Dr Karsun Gallente Integrity.	Posted - 2008.12.08 20:57:00 - [781] Wow, reading all this made my eyes go out... I see the problem, I can feel it. Mostly because I got a lot of small skills to train and turning eve on every few hours to train multiple small skills I want to finish early is a pain... For now I've seen a few nice ideas, mostly: I. 1 skill sq - a nice addition. Would solve 99% of the problems. Would also allow many, many players to log in once a day and ENJOY not losing training time. II. 24 hour skill plan. This one I really liked. Mentioned a few times too. Withing 24 hours you can fit as many skills as you want to the plan, the last one would be a long skill that would take a few days. That's the very best idea I've seen so far. III. Compiled ideas I. and II. - the best. You can either chose to take the 24 hour plan, or if you'r off for a long trip, just switch one few-day skill on and another few-day skill on next. The best idea I've come up with so far, that would also allow people not to char-farm. So... What's the problem here... Since I've seen EVE working (not such a long time) I've noticed that a lot of people complain about it. The mods don't react, they don't care... BECAUSE THEY CAN'T DO IT. Lets face it. They are just poor geeks, they don't want to mess it all up (omg, that would be a terrible flame for them if the system collapsed totally) and they don't want to bother. Changing this wouldn't attract far more players (compared to the new ship, stargates, etc stuff)... If they will want to do us a favour, they will and they will try to design the system. For now they just haven't got the balls to admit that they can't do it... ------------------------ My Deviantart profile
tekpede	Posted - 2008.12.10 02:01:00 - [782] I think have a 1 skill queue would be great.
Nikolai Razkolnikov	Posted - 2009.01.23 16:37:00 - [783] One skill to train next, please. Big improvement!
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Minmatar The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2009.01.23 17:10:00 - [784] Originally by: brinelan I have a skill que, its called evemon. I do short skills when I am playing and long skills when I am not. I do month long skills near patch times. It has worked for over 2.5 years, so whats the issue? This. And for all the people whining in this thread... can it.
ZephyrLexx Caldari The Graduates Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.01.23 20:06:00 - [785] Originally by: Elseer Radak I like the idea of a skill queue training system and would like the Devs to take it seriously. so /signed. Elseer Radak
Dani SP Rupture Farms Mining	Posted - 2009.01.24 17:00:00 - [786] this would be a great help for: - macrominers and other farmers - people who doesnt really play the game, or just connect 1 time per week - trialers, they set a huge 3-month queue and then activate the game once its done Yeah I would love myself to do the latest, but c'mon its unfair and you all know it. Train a longer skill when you are out from computer, and that's all. The only time you will have "problems" is at very-newbie stage when ALL the skills are so short, and its not possible to set a 8+ hours skill. But it only happens the first or second day :)
BrundleMeth Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.24 19:51:00 - [787] Edited by: BrundleMeth on 24/01/2009 19:51:37 Edited by: BrundleMeth on 24/01/2009 19:51:13 I just started playing a short time ago annd I love this game. Someone early in this thread said "most people have a job" and "it's impossible to log on at work to train". Not for me. I simply take in my personal laptop and i have one of those new portable internet devices that can connect anywhere. Just to show you how crazy I am, I just bought one of those new $500.00 "Netbook" computers with an 8.9 inch screen and it weighs 2.3 pounds. www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop-inspiron-9?cs=19&s=dhs&ref=homepg I keep it strapped to my waist in a carrying pouch and can whip it out, log onto the net, and start a new session in 5 minutes or less... Woot !!!
Hardened Heart	Posted - 2009.01.25 01:33:00 - [788] They won't ever do it. Why? Because having to change skills gets you to log in. And logging in mean you might talk to you corp mates 'just to say hello.' And.. ...your war targets might be 1 jump away. ...or your space might have a hostile fleet/CTA is called. ...or your buy orders got under cut and need to be re-made. ...or your scam contracts just sold so you can buy that new toy. And you get sucked into playing... CCP will lose suscriber base 3 months after they make a skill queue from people saying 'holy crap, I haven't logged into this game in 2 months, why am I paying for it?' Sad, but true. Quit whining, it won't happen.
Ronha Ottrit Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.25 02:55:00 - [789] Originally by: Hardened Heart They won't ever do it. Why? Because having to change skills gets you to log in. And logging in mean you might talk to you corp mates 'just to say hello.' And.. ...your war targets might be 1 jump away. ...or your space might have a hostile fleet/CTA is called. ...or your buy orders got under cut and need to be re-made. ...or your scam contracts just sold so you can buy that new toy. And you get sucked into playing... CCP will lose suscriber base 3 months after they make a skill queue from people saying 'holy crap, I haven't logged into this game in 2 months, why am I paying for it?' Sad, but true. Quit whining, it won't happen. I'd say 90% of the people your describing would not stay online.
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Minmatar The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2009.01.25 12:40:00 - [790] Originally by: Dani SP - trialers, they set a huge 3-month queue and then activate the game once its done Yeah I would love myself to do the latest, but c'mon its unfair and you all know it. Train a longer skill when you are out from computer, and that's all. You are aware ghost-training was disabled in oktober, right... the best you can get are 3 days of free training. And a trial takes 14 days at most, during which time you can learn what does what... and where you want to go. ----------------------------------------------- Originally by: Paper Rock's fine, nerf Scissors

BrundleMeth Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.25 18:38:00 - [791] I haven't read this whole thread so this may have been touched on already. I think queue traing is bad for many of the reasons I see here. What I would really like to see it that skills take less time to train. And I am talking about Level 5 only. A 21 day traing time seem excessive to me. But what the heck I suppose it could be worse...
Hairy Blutac Amarr A Quest Millitia	Posted - 2009.01.27 13:41:00 - [792] Edited by: Hairy Blutac on 27/01/2009 13:42:51 The skill system is OK as it is, but in the light of the fact CCP have nerfed "ghost" training I see no reason why you should not be able to have 1 skill queued after the current one ends, helpful to players but not much help to toon farmers. I know this has been asked for almost since Eve was launched, (me = reactivated toon), so I guess it will never happen, but hey, no harm in asking, (again), right? PS never Ghost trained btw, left and came back due to all the inncessant emails and promo from CCP ;) -= If it ain't broke... Don't fix it! =-
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Minmatar The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2009.02.04 16:44:00 - [793] Dev blog No idea on an ETA, but it's coming.... a 24-hour queue. ----------------------------------------------- Originally by: Paper Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
Ki Tarra Caldari Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2009.02.04 18:46:00 - [794] Originally by: Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Dev blog No idea on an ETA, but it's coming.... a 24-hour queue. ETA is March 10.
Pedro Montana	Posted - 2009.02.04 20:02:00 - [795] no more putting skills on hold before going to sleep because it finishes in 5 hours and having to wait later to do em. This solves on of my gripes about when skills finish. more would be better. 48 or 96 hours etc but I can queue up some little skills to run while im at work...or if i know one of my 8 day skills finishes at 3am..i can just pop the next one I want into the queue before going to bed and sleep happily.
Intergalactic Quant Darkmatter Research and Industries	Posted - 2009.02.12 14:14:00 - [796] Originally by: Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Dev blog No idea on an ETA, but it's coming.... a 24-hour queue. I just was reading through this and was just thinking I'd like a que to add up my short skills. I'm in favor of a 24 hour que. Most people should be able to log in at least once a day to set a skill (or the que) While I'm at work I don't have to sneak on to set skills, and it still requires me to plan my training daily. If I'm already skilling a 3-30 day skill, the que doesnt' matter and it won't (or shouldn't) accept a new skill in the que.
Mrs Brokker	Posted - 2009.02.12 17:47:00 - [797] Originally by: Pedro Montana no more putting skills on hold before going to sleep because it finishes in 5 hours and having to wait later to do em. This solves on of my gripes about when skills finish. more would be better. 48 or 96 hours etc but I can queue up some little skills to run while im at work...or if i know one of my 8 day skills finishes at 3am..i can just pop the next one I want into the queue before going to bed and sleep happily. 24hrs is more than enough. I mean how many people actually can't get onto a computer for more than a period of 24 hours. If you can't, just finish with a long skill and you got nothing to worry about...
Kusum Fawn	Posted - 2009.02.15 10:22:00 - [798] Originally by: Dani SP this would be a great help for: - macrominers and other farmers - people who doesnt really play the game, or just connect 1 time per week - trialers, they set a huge 3-month queue and then activate the game once its done Yeah I would love myself to do the latest, but c'mon its unfair and you all know it. Train a longer skill when you are out from computer, and that's all. The only time you will have "problems" is at very-newbie stage when ALL the skills are so short, and its not possible to set a 8+ hours skill. But it only happens the first or second day :) 1) macroers dont have a skill change macro and/or they have more time to set up their skills to not end at bad times, since they are macros its not as imoprtant to get that last second, 2) what about the people who like to sleep ad/or get all the stupid 7 hour skills out of the way while at work and not have to have 3-8 different skills at varying levels of completion to have a few choices when changing skills for work or sleep or god forbid vacation times, id like to be able to que as many things as i can, if im paying for the account then i dont see a good reason why not, maybe have it only for subscription accounts? 3)no. first or second day? you must not remember, how many skills are 8 hour skills, and how many a active player might have at that level, hell, i have 173 skills and a good 60 of them are at lev 2, a skill train would make learning lasers a lot faster, cause i dont want to have to wait the 4 hours to change when arti2 finishes, id rather get that out of the way while im away
Gothiele	Posted - 2009.02.15 11:53:00 - [799] Glad to hear this is going to happen. Honest, I would've settled for just having one additional skill waiting for the current to finish. 24 hours will be very nice, so I don't have to keep fiddling with all the small-time skills. More than one day would definitely be too powerful, though.


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