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TraderAlt 4153172618
Jovian Labs Jovian Enterprises
12
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Posted - 2012.01.14 19:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm pretty much done with my missiles kills and almost done with my per/wis remap, I'm just wondering if the following skills are worth training, since I primarily pvp
Missile Bombardment V - 7 days Missile Projection V - 13 days Guided Missile Projection V - 17 days Target Navigation Projection V - 7 days
Non of them except maybe Target Navigation Projection seem to have enough of an effect to make them worth the time it takes to train.
Am I right? Am I wrong? Thoughts?
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
411
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Posted - 2012.01.14 19:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Do you have a burning desire to train something else?
Do you use missiles all the time?
Bombardment + Projection = range, which I really needed for Sleepers in C5/C6 as they can spawn very far away, and when using unguided missiles (rockets, torpedoes, heavy assault missiles, citadel torpedoes) which have a very short range.
Target Navigation Prediction = DPS (explosion velocity). Also affects unguided missiles which are not affected by rigs.
I have Guided Missile Precision 5 on my plan, and eventually Warhead Upgrades 5. I already have all the others to 5, as they don't take as long to train as those two. I also plan to train all the turret support skills to 5 (currently all at level 4, except Gunnery 5 which is rank 1). Currently turrets are a higher priority for me.
I also plan to train Heavy Missile Specialization 5... someday. I use a Tengu a lot. |
Mona X
Missions Mining and Mayhem Northern Coalition.
45
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Posted - 2012.01.14 20:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
That's less than .1s on Tengu. :) I need new signature. |
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
367
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Posted - 2012.01.14 21:55:00 -
[4] - Quote
Missile Control Elite on three chars signing in.
Every little helps. Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
414
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Posted - 2012.01.15 02:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mona X wrote:That's less than .1s on Tengu. :) If I've got nothing better to train, I'm gonna train it, because even 17 DPS is still useful to me.
But as I previously posted, I've still got other things to train. |
Squatdog
State Protectorate Caldari State
9
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Posted - 2012.01.15 05:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
TraderAlt 4153172618 wrote:I'm pretty much done with my missiles kills and almost done with my per/wis remap, I'm just wondering if the following skills are worth training, since I primarily pvp
Missile Bombardment V - 7 days Missile Projection V - 13 days Guided Missile Projection V - 17 days Target Navigation Projection V - 7 days
Non of them except maybe Target Navigation Projection seem to have enough of an effect to make them worth the time it takes to train.
Am I right? Am I wrong? Thoughts?
Missile Bombardment V - YES Missile Projection V - YES Guided Missile Precision V - Meh Target Navigation Projection V - YES
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Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
16
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Posted - 2012.01.17 01:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
I think I've got everything in the Missile category at 5 except Torpedo Specialization.
Well, OK, that's no true, I'm probably missing a couple of obscure skillz completely, and HAMs (which are not obscure but just don't appeal to me), but I'm pretty damn elite in Missiles.
The two rang skillz help immensely. At level 4 each, you get a 96% range bonus (1.4*1.4) relative to untrained, but if you train them to level 5 the range bonus is 125% (1.5*1.5). That's 30% more range. That's nifty if using larger guided missiles, and very important if using small guideds (Standard Missiles) or any unguided (Rockets, Hamsters, Torpedoes).
I can't speak for T2 ammo since I consider furries to be silly, but the 30% extra range may help there as well. Also note that one of the two skillz (I CBA to remember which one) makes your DPS arrive faster. That's always nice.
The only skillz in the Missiles category I've ever regretted training were Torpedoes (and Torpedo Specialization if I ever started on that). Everything else is sweet carebeary goodness, and it's not a question whether you should train them to 5, because of course you should. The only question is when.
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Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
299
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Posted - 2012.01.17 16:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
Squatdog wrote:Missile Bombardment V - YES Missile Projection V - YES Guided Missile Precision V - Meh Target Navigation Projection V - YES
That's pretty much my take too. TNP is top priority for all missiles. Projection is next because it increases both range and decreases the time it takes for missiles to get to targets closer than maximum range. Bombardment is most important for unguided missiles, as with Projection 5 guided missiles don't really need that much more range to start with. GMP is a bit niche, but it's still noticeable on, say, an otherwise maxed Tengu that needs to rely on heavies to kill frigates. |
Jack Miton
Lapse Of Sanity Narwhals Ate My Duck
94
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Posted - 2012.01.18 02:04:00 -
[9] - Quote
None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead. |
Hoskoal Ricks
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2012.01.18 02:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead.
QFT, unless you like bombers, missile skills are better spent elsewhere.
The best fleet ships aside from the tengu (and if you have that kind of isk to burn, who cares what you train?) is a turret ship of one kind or another. The best gang ships, all turret ships (inc drake nerf btw). The best mission ships, Mach, Nightmare, Turrets. The best incursion ships? Mach, Nightmare, Vindi, turrets. The best wormhole ships? Oh my lord, missiles win one. Unfortunately for serious isk doing cap escalations you'll need a dread with, you guessed it: TURRETS.
As of the last patch, every turret weapon system (save for medium rails) looks either acceptable or outstanding. As of that same patch, every missile system aside from heavy missiles is either acceptable or **** poor. The latest word on balance and iteration? Improving turrets (don't get my wrong, hybrids needed love and I use them myself). The latest word on missiles or missile ships: nothing is wrong with the nighthawk (lol - wtb some grid, thnx).
Speaking as someone who's got more than one 4+ year old character with maxed out launcher support skills, do yourself a favor and forget these things exist. As mentioned in the first sentence, you either use them to fly a bomber/tengu or you use them to fly something inferior to the many alternatives. |
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Desert Ice78
Gryphon River Industries Bloodbound.
65
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Posted - 2012.01.18 03:43:00 -
[11] - Quote
Quite you heathens!!!!
Behold my mighty drake!!!!!
(All level V ftw) I am a pod pilot: http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/DesertIce/POD.jpg
CCP Zulu: Came expecting a discussion about computer monitors, left confused. |
Mona X
Missions Mining and Mayhem Northern Coalition.
45
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Posted - 2012.01.18 12:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
Hoskoal Ricks wrote:Jack Miton wrote:None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead. QFT, unless you like bombers, missile skills are better spent elsewhere.
Thundercats best cats. :P I need new signature. |
Hoskoal Ricks
Minmatar Republic
15
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Posted - 2012.01.18 19:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mona X wrote:Hoskoal Ricks wrote:Jack Miton wrote:None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead. QFT, unless you like bombers, missile skills are better spent elsewhere. Thundercats best cats. :P
Oh right, two ships merit the skills. MY B, DAWG. MY B. |
Kessiaan
Greater Order Of Destruction Happy Endings
38
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Posted - 2012.01.20 13:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
Hoskoal Ricks wrote:Jack Miton wrote:None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead. QFT, unless you like bombers, missile skills are better spent elsewhere. The best fleet ships aside from the tengu (and if you have that kind of isk to burn, who cares what you train?) is a turret ship of one kind or another. The best gang ships, all turret ships (inc drake nerf btw). The best mission ships, Mach, Nightmare, Turrets. The best incursion ships? Mach, Nightmare, Vindi, turrets. The best wormhole ships? Oh my lord, missiles win one. Unfortunately for serious isk doing cap escalations you'll need a dread with, you guessed it: TURRETS. As of the last patch, every turret weapon system (save for medium rails) looks either acceptable or outstanding. As of that same patch, every missile system aside from heavy missiles is either acceptable or **** poor. The latest word on balance and iteration? Improving turrets (don't get my wrong, hybrids needed love and I use them myself). The latest word on missiles or missile ships: nothing is wrong with the nighthawk (lol - wtb some grid, thnx). Speaking as someone who's got more than one 4+ year old character with maxed out launcher support skills, do yourself a favor and forget these things exist. As mentioned in the first sentence, you either use them to fly a bomber/tengu or you use them to fly something inferior to the many alternatives.
This man speaks the truth. I have 12M SP in gunnery but only 452K in missiles (over half of which is Rockets V from my FW days). Only thing I can't do that actually matters sometimes is fly a Drake, and even then I just fly something else (usually a Hurricane or a Lachesis, depending on fleet comp and doctrine).
I'll go out on a limb and say the Drake is the only missile ship that is commonly used in pvp. Sure, you'll see Caracals and Ravens once in a while but people don't build fleets out of them. The Crow is really good too but it's job is point, not DPS, and the Tengu costs too much for (most) people to just throw them at whatever looks interesting regardless of the outcome.
It doesn't help that there's absolutely zero synergy between gun and missile skills. Even as a secondary weapon system neuts are a solid alternative to missiles on most pvp fits. My killboard - http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Kessiaan |
Lunkwill Khashour
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
48
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Posted - 2012.01.20 15:30:00 -
[15] - Quote
Stealth bombers also see PvP activity. |
Boyd Achura
Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2012.01.20 21:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
Kessiaan wrote:Hoskoal Ricks wrote:Jack Miton wrote:None of them are useful, train the gunnery ones to 5 instead. QFT, unless you like bombers, missile skills are better spent elsewhere. The best fleet ships aside from the tengu (and if you have that kind of isk to burn, who cares what you train?) is a turret ship of one kind or another. The best gang ships, all turret ships (inc drake nerf btw). The best mission ships, Mach, Nightmare, Turrets. The best incursion ships? Mach, Nightmare, Vindi, turrets. The best wormhole ships? Oh my lord, missiles win one. Unfortunately for serious isk doing cap escalations you'll need a dread with, you guessed it: TURRETS. As of the last patch, every turret weapon system (save for medium rails) looks either acceptable or outstanding. As of that same patch, every missile system aside from heavy missiles is either acceptable or **** poor. The latest word on balance and iteration? Improving turrets (don't get my wrong, hybrids needed love and I use them myself). The latest word on missiles or missile ships: nothing is wrong with the nighthawk (lol - wtb some grid, thnx). Speaking as someone who's got more than one 4+ year old character with maxed out launcher support skills, do yourself a favor and forget these things exist. As mentioned in the first sentence, you either use them to fly a bomber/tengu or you use them to fly something inferior to the many alternatives. This man speaks the truth. I have 12M SP in gunnery but only 452K in missiles (over half of which is Rockets V from my FW days). Only thing I can't do that actually matters sometimes is fly a Drake, and even then I just fly something else (usually a Hurricane or a Lachesis, depending on fleet comp and doctrine). I'll go out on a limb and say the Drake is the only missile ship that is commonly used in pvp. Sure, you'll see Caracals and Ravens once in a while but people don't build fleets out of them. The Crow is really good too but it's job is point, not DPS, and the Tengu costs too much for (most) people to just throw them at whatever looks interesting regardless of the outcome. It doesn't help that there's absolutely zero synergy between gun and missile skills. Even as a secondary weapon system neuts are a solid alternative to missiles on most pvp fits.
Have to agree with both of you and I only fly caldari at this point. My hope is that the upcoming balance patch(es) will begin to address the issue. I am just thankful I got my gunnery skills early on. Being able to hop into the naga gave me a new lease on life with a character I was beginning to hate. If it were not for that and the joy of flying the basi, I probably would have cross trained by now.
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Nuela
Beacon Light Corporation Beacon Light Alliance
5
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Posted - 2012.02.09 20:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
TraderAlt 4153172618 wrote:I'm pretty much done with my missiles kills and almost done with my per/wis remap, I'm just wondering if the following skills are worth training, since I primarily pvp
Missile Bombardment V - 7 days Missile Projection V - 13 days Guided Missile Projection V - 17 days Target Navigation Projection V - 7 days
Non of them except maybe Target Navigation Projection seem to have enough of an effect to make them worth the time it takes to train.
Am I right? Am I wrong? Thoughts?
I recently came back from a long break. I bought myself 700,000 cruise missles. A week later my bay was empty and was like...WTH? Where's my missles?!
SO I did the math...and realized I can go through 700,000 missles in a week.
Short answer - Hell ya, they are worth it....for me anyway. |
OfBalance
Deep Core Mining Inc.
27
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Posted - 2012.02.09 21:59:00 -
[18] - Quote
Missile haters. |
Batelle
HOMELE55
14
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Posted - 2012.02.10 19:09:00 -
[19] - Quote
Salpad wrote:The two rang skillz help immensely. At level 4 each, you get a 96% range bonus (1.4*1.4) relative to untrained, but if you train them to level 5 the range bonus is 125% (1.5*1.5). That's 30% more range.
30% more of the base range.
training both to lvl 5 gives you a 15% bonus over having both at 4.
/masthsnob |
Czeris
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
37
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Posted - 2012.02.11 12:30:00 -
[20] - Quote
There are some very viable pvp missile fits.
Dual web HAM drake Fleet HML Drake Stealth Bombers Frig killing AML caracal is loltastic. Elite PvP fleet tengu etc..
All those skills are on my long term plan, after I do some of the gunnery stuff I've been neglecting.
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Fedimart
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
32
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Posted - 2012.02.12 04:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
If you plan on using missiles more than occasionally train all the support skills to 5. The same applies to guns. |
Viscount Hood
Gallivanting Travel Company Band of Wanderers
23
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Posted - 2012.02.14 13:00:00 -
[22] - Quote
train them all up to level 5 its worth it, accept FoF missiles and bombs.
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Mike Whiite
Progressive State
14
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Posted - 2012.02.14 14:21:00 -
[23] - Quote
FoF's are great, against Guritas and EMC in general
Bombs are a niche,
the only support skill that is rather useless when you're flying missiles ships is defender missiles, that one irs only usefull if you don't fly missiles ships with a lost missile hardpoint on it. |
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