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Allan Robertson
Gallente Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:49:00 -
[1]
I work from the Placid region of EVE, I moved there about 2 1/2 years ago to escape the lag of Empire. This was in the days when 150 people was something to drop your jaw at and could easily lag a system.
The problem is many people complain that Empire is too crowded, Jita is the best known example, I've not been up there in over 2 years, last I heard it was nearing 300 people. But at least Empire is doing it's job it's a "mostly" safe place where industry and trade can grow. And 0.0 is also doing it's job as it wan intended, a sandbox region for large empires to grow, patrol and conquer.
But low security is kinda the odd one out and it's not filling it's job, and many systems are under populated with untapped resources, and people wonder why? For the most part creating a working virtual economy like in Empire and some alliance controlled areas is simply for the most part, impossible. Most piracy takes place around stargates, I've seen on more than one time upto 15 ships camping one system making flying though either for missions, industry, mining or anything else pointless. Most people in EVE either half of them stay in Empire and the other move to 0.0, I've done both and from this experience low security is not doing it's job.
With Empire becoming more crowded and some 0.0 flash points like FAT becoming, well FAT with people, how can people complain at these problems when the vast majority of low security remain under populated. I'm sorry this has been a bit long but I really feel that if things changed in low security and people where encouraged to move and live there, this could take the strain off some Empire systems, I'm not advocating making low security an "easy" place and I don't have the magic solution, I'm just asking if low security could do with a new job and direction, who is afraid of change?
--- Say YES! to Mining Cargo Holds on barges! |
Eval B'Stard
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Posted - 2007.10.04 23:45:00 -
[2]
If the rewards were to justify the risk then more people would move there, but at the moment it's insane risk for little reward so why bother. -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
When we gonna see the 40km and 80km tractor beams ? |
Allan Robertson
Gallente Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires
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Posted - 2007.10.05 00:00:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Eval B'Stard If the rewards were to justify the risk then more people would move there, but at the moment it's insane risk for little reward so why bother.
I agree, there is very little reward from low security, again I'm not saying that improving or adding more sentry guns would solve the problem I don't think that would, what might be needed is a whole new approach to low security, and giving people incentives to move out there.
--- Say YES! to Mining Cargo Holds on barges! |
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.05 01:00:00 -
[4]
300 people in jita? maybe DURING downtime, usually it is closer to 800
Originally by: Akita T No, it's a trap ! I can tell from some of the modules and from seeing quite a few traps in my time...
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Allan Robertson
Gallente Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires
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Posted - 2007.10.05 01:34:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme 300 people in jita? maybe DURING downtime, usually it is closer to 800
Thats why I stay away from there, but out here in low security Placid there is not much reward for the risk.
--- Say YES! to Mining Cargo Holds on barges! |
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.05 01:38:00 -
[6]
personally I find it isn't the rewards that need tweaking but the risk
what we need is concord, but not highsec concord, similar to faction spawns, that will show up if you attack someone who isnt a legit target, they could be killable and tankable
it would give the less pvp minded a little more security, while adding more fun for the pirates as well
Originally by: Akita T No, it's a trap ! I can tell from some of the modules and from seeing quite a few traps in my time...
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Nito Musashi
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Posted - 2007.10.05 01:56:00 -
[7]
concord in low sec? then what is the point of low sec at all.
needs to be more rewards for low sec, quality exploration sites, rebalancing of mineral worth, something to make it worth risking getting ganked gate camped and etc.
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Eval B'Stard
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Posted - 2007.10.05 02:19:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Nito Musashi concord in low sec? then what is the point of low sec at all.
needs to be more rewards for low sec, quality exploration sites, rebalancing of mineral worth, something to make it worth risking getting ganked gate camped and etc.
I agree Concord in low sec is a bad idea what it needs is pockets of mid to high end ores, not huge amounts but enough to justify the risk of entering low sec, better belt rats, again not huge amounts, rare exploration sites with high end goodies.
I can (and do) get all these things from 0.0 without any of the risk associated with low sec, as things stand low sec is pointless.
I don't want to see things made harder for pirates in low sec I just want to see the rewards increased in line with the risks involved. -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
When we gonna see the 40km and 80km tractor beams ? |
Rooker
Lysian Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.10.05 02:22:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Rooker on 05/10/2007 02:22:16 They're not exactly Concord, but gate guns, gate rats and belt rats are bad enough if you're not paying attention to them. I can point to a couple of people who've gotten popped right after a fight because they forgot about the rats. I've even heard of Guristas coming to the resuce by jamming belt pirates :P
But seriously, lowsec is part of the PvP zone. Having police rats show up kind of defeats the purpose. If people are going to live there, there needs to be something worth having and defending. Little 100K rats won't do it.
-- This Space For Rent |
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.05 03:00:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Nito Musashi concord in low sec? then what is the point of low sec at all.
needs to be more rewards for low sec, quality exploration sites, rebalancing of mineral worth, something to make it worth risking getting ganked gate camped and etc.
the point wouldn't change one bit, it isn't 0.0 so "no police" makes about as much sense as "killable police"
pirates could still have their cake and eat it too, and maybe even get some nice concord drops
Originally by: Akita T No, it's a trap ! I can tell from some of the modules and from seeing quite a few traps in my time...
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hellsknights
Hells Angels Inc.
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Posted - 2007.10.05 03:08:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme personally I find it isn't the rewards that need tweaking but the risk
what we need is concord, but not highsec concord, similar to faction spawns, that will show up if you attack someone who isnt a legit target, they could be killable and tankable
it would give the less pvp minded a little more security, while adding more fun for the pirates as well
Have you ever gatecamped? If so, if you add some sort of protection "faction police" as soon as they all cycle to you your gonna be toast.
I don't like this option I think low sec needs more rewards and not added security, it's low sec godamnit.
recruitment thread Join channel Hells Angels Inc
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Celeritas 5k
Caldari Initrode The Core Collective
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Posted - 2007.10.05 03:44:00 -
[12]
Move all l4 agents to low sec. Hey, this game is about risk vs. reward right?? Does anyone else see it as broken that one of the most profitable professions in the game can be done without ever leaving high sec space?
That, or give us better roids. that would be nice too... ----------
"Always be Happy, Never be satisfied." |
Haerana
The Republican Guard The Sundering
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Posted - 2007.10.05 03:45:00 -
[13]
give lots and lots more level 5 agents spread out around the eve universe in low sec! still never run a lvl 5
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Grapez
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Posted - 2007.10.05 04:38:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Grapez on 05/10/2007 04:46:24 Somone once suggested that there should be roaming faction police gangs through low-sec. I thought that was a great idea. Kind of like the gate/belt rats, except killing them lowers faction standing and they don't target you unless you have a global criminal flag.
I see 0.1-0.4 as an 0.0 buffer zone; a gang that is engaged in 0.0 (usually) cannot, with one jump, land in high-sec space and be completely safe. Usually, they would have to jump into a low-sec system, which is 'safer,' but not by much.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that the low-sec buffer zone around most 0.0 works the other way too. It keeps most nubs out of null sec. This saves them lots of grief == prevents a lot of whiney forum threads. @º¬íí-T«+ºH for all your political humor needs |
Marangela
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Posted - 2007.10.05 05:56:00 -
[15]
I'd like to see four sentry guns at gates in 0.4 systems. Three in 0.3. etc. Or something like that. I mean, what's the difference between 0.1 and 0.4 now?
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Eval B'Stard
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.10.05 06:17:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Grapez I see 0.1-0.4 as an 0.0 buffer zone; a gang that is engaged in 0.0 (usually) cannot, with one jump, land in high-sec space and be completely safe. Usually, they would have to jump into a low-sec system, which is 'safer,' but not by much.[/quote
Low-sec is less safe than 0.0 not 'safer'
I'd rather go 30 jumps in 0.0 than 5 in low-sec, then again that should never change, but living in low-sec should be made more rewarding for the risks involved. -------------------------------------------
When we gonna see the 40km and 80km tractor beams ?
Welcome to EvE, where the School of Hard Knocks comes for (it's) Education. |
Allan Robertson
Gallente Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:00:00 -
[17]
intresting posts, I agree with some but I kinda like the idea of a hunter prey style as most of the combat takes place around stargates EVE now has better system for scanning would it not be more involved if pirates needed to hunt prey and explorers and miners to prospect for ore.
--- Say YES! to Mining Cargo Holds on barges! |
Christari Zuborov
Amarr Ore Mongers R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:18:00 -
[18]
Create a new ore that's rarer than others, move the data encryptors / skill book / data core hack sites, and anything else that's very valuable to lowsec, 2nd rarest ores stay in 0.0, most common stay in hisec.
Let dog scraps begin, sit back and enjoy.
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Paulo Damarr
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:22:00 -
[19]
High sec is getting close to bursting there are that many people and just about every lvl 3 or lvl 4 agent has a stream of Ravens and Drakes undocking. I spend some time in low sec and outside the camping areas once you are deep in low sec you rarely see anyone.
But it frankly sucks there is no market you have to travel far to buy/sell anything the ore is not worth it and you can get the same rats in higher level missions. There is no balance of risk vs reward as its pure risk because it can be difficult to get a resource gathering ship out there (miner/ratter) when you need to cross the camped bottlenecks and then once there you have difficulty operating due to bad markets and shipping loot and salvage or minerals out.
Even the pirates have to use alts to transfer goods they use or sell to high sec space, So how low sec is now its difficult to justify expensive losses when faced with the reality of how low sec works.
If you dont mind operating at a loss and have alternate means of money raising low sec isn't as boring as high sec though.
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Christari Zuborov
Amarr Ore Mongers R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:30:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Paulo Damarr High sec is getting close to bursting there are that many people and just about every lvl 3 or lvl 4 agent has a stream of Ravens and Drakes undocking. I spend some time in low sec and outside the camping areas once you are deep in low sec you rarely see anyone.
But it frankly sucks there is no market you have to travel far to buy/sell anything the ore is not worth it and you can get the same rats in higher level missions. There is no balance of risk vs reward as its pure risk because it can be difficult to get a resource gathering ship out there (miner/ratter) when you need to cross the camped bottlenecks and then once there you have difficulty operating due to bad markets and shipping loot and salvage or minerals out.
Even the pirates have to use alts to transfer goods they use or sell to high sec space, So how low sec is now its difficult to justify expensive losses when faced with the reality of how low sec works.
If you dont mind operating at a loss and have alternate means of money raising low sec isn't as boring as high sec though.
For solo work, yes, it's way dangerous - As a corp however, you'd be surprised just how carefree you can be when you have your -10 corp mates with you in the belt you're mining...
Just one or two of them ratting while you mine pretty much keeps EVERYONE out of there.
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Baaldor
Caldari Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:44:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme personally I find it isn't the rewards that need tweaking but the risk
what we need is concord, but not highsec concord, similar to faction spawns, that will show up if you attack someone who isnt a legit target, they could be killable and tankable
it would give the less pvp minded a little more security, while adding more fun for the pirates as well
Can you please clarify what "isn't" a "legit " target is? I would be very interested what that would be....
THE PREVIOUS VIEWS AND STATEMENTS DO NOT REPRESENT AND OR SUPPORTED BY THE MANY VOICES IN MY HEAD. |
Lord Dynastron
Mystical Knights Legionnaire Services Ltd.
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Posted - 2007.10.05 19:48:00 -
[22]
I hear ya, and agree for the most part. However, I will contend that you can secure one low sec system if you are bound and determined to do so. We have secured just such a system and it has been MONTHS since I have been fired on by a gate pirate. Hehe, but do not confuse that with US firing on a gate pirate.
Hint: get with all the locals (people owning POS's) and arrange for an old-school alliance.
Belts tho,, those are another story. We are still having a little trouble with those.
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Reem Fairchild
Minmatar Republic University
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Posted - 2007.10.05 20:08:00 -
[23]
You add more rewards to low-sec and all that would happen is that the people who don't have any difficulty existing in low-sec (and are already there or in 0.0 as it is) will just farm them while the risk averse players stay in high-sec like they do now.
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Sicil Fioet
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.10.05 20:12:00 -
[24]
Low sec right now is like NPC controlled 0.0 only without the money. Anyone can dock at stations and base in any system but there are no battleship rats, no 0.0 ores and moons, no exploration complexes that would be same as in 0.0, no agents that would pay as much as 0.0 agents do. Plus for shooting anyone you get punished with your sec status. No wonder it is underpopulated - who'd want to live in such a place?
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Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.05 20:15:00 -
[25]
To be honest, it isn't only about risk vs rewards. There is nobody to socialize or socialize nicely in low-secs.
Low secs are ghost towns. Null-secs are wastelands unless you fly the same flag. For the rest of us, we live in high-secs. --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria!
Kali is for KArebearLIng. I 100% agree with Avon.
Female EVE gamers? Mail Zajo or visit WGOE.Public in-game. |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar Republic University
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Posted - 2007.10.05 20:15:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Sicil Fioet Low sec right now is like NPC controlled 0.0 only without the money. Anyone can dock at stations and base in any system but there are no battleship rats, no 0.0 ores and moons, no exploration complexes that would be same as in 0.0, no agents that would pay as much as 0.0 agents do. Plus for shooting anyone you get punished with your sec status. No wonder it is underpopulated - who'd want to live in such a place?
On the other hand, it has sentry guns and no bubbles.
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VicturusTeSaluto
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Posted - 2007.10.05 20:20:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Eval B'Stard If the rewards were to justify the risk then more people would move there, but at the moment it's insane risk for little reward so why bother.
That's not at all true. Low sec has recently been buffed in a very major way(perhaps even by accident?), but I'll just leave t he carebears to figure it out on their own.
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Sicil Fioet
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.10.05 22:50:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild On the other hand, it has sentry guns and no bubbles.
So it is safer if you fly around in a destroyer-sized ship or something smaller. Getting podded is also more difficult. But it makes no difference for cruisers and up as you can still get wtfpwned by stations and gates with sentries and without use of bubbles.
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Reem Fairchild
Minmatar Republic University
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Posted - 2007.10.05 23:04:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Reem Fairchild on 05/10/2007 23:05:00
Originally by: Sicil Fioet
Originally by: Reem Fairchild On the other hand, it has sentry guns and no bubbles.
So it is safer if you fly around in a destroyer-sized ship or something smaller. Getting podded is also more difficult. But it makes no difference for cruisers and up as you can still get wtfpwned by stations and gates with sentries and without use of bubbles.
Not if you're fitted for travel. Even an Iteron is very difficult to catch in low-sec unless you are sitting there with a smartbombing NYX. I've never lost one, and that's including with me, this spring, setting up, refueling for more than a month, and then taking down a small pos in an 0.1 system, all by myself, in an Iteron 3.
And in either case, low-sec gate camps are few and far inbetween except for in a tiny few systems (like say Rancer). 0.0 gate camps on entry points are a nearly a 23/7 thing, and the chances of running into roaming gangs or gate camps once inside are not too low either.
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Doven
Caldari Doven Independent
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Posted - 2007.10.05 23:19:00 -
[30]
heyo..
may not fix or better for many players.. but here are a couple ideas.
low sec:
1. lower cost station services, including insurance.
2. Possible FREE repair services based on faction/corp standing
3. higher yields for reprocess/refine
4. pod destruction limited only to 0.0. you can take my ship and loadout.. just for god sakes.. let me KEEP my implants.. lol. :)
few more ideas.. but this good enough for now.
done d
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