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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
89
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 12:50:00 -
[1] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:Now you need even more subs/invention chars to achieve the same profit
Is there a problem? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
108
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 19:09:00 -
[2] - Quote
Chandra K'ailar wrote:why should CCP take T2 BPOs out of game? and also just fyi, t2 bpos owners cant compete in market against inventors, so shut up with this type of threads . . .
Yes they can. They can keep prices lower because they don't have to use time and money to invent T2 BPCs (do you really think it's free?). |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
108
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 19:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:of course they can, but as a economic thinking person they would never waste money and do that. everyone can manipulate the market, you dont have to be a manufcature at all, btw.
Of course they wouldn't waste money because they don't have to invent anything. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 22:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
Cap James Tkirk wrote:as an inventor they may not "waste money inventing" but they are limited to that one print and can only pump out so many items per day, look at t2 invuls if bpo owner could meet the demands the item would be a few 100k not 2ish m a pop
They can't copy those BPOs? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 00:00:00 -
[5] - Quote
Funny how you all defend these people.
Maybe you all own T2 BPOs. That makes sense. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 00:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Akita T wrote:You have all but conclusively proven you barely know how things work with regards to T2 invention/production, and you haven't shown a lot of signs of being capable of understanding the economic implications of the things you're trying to argue, whereas people with various degrees of proven track records argue the exact opposite thing of what you're trying to imply would be better.
Oh, "you don't have degree in economics" card. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 00:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:For instance, you seem to think that you must put BPOs in a POS to copy them at the POS. That is demonstrably false.
Do you even know how long it takes to get 10.0 standing with faction, 10.0 sec status and moon in hisec? Especially with pure industry trained character with very little combat skills. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 00:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:3. You can easily buy a corp with 5.0 Faction standing, because anchoring a POS only requires that your Corp have a certain standing.
Do you even know how that standing is calculated? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 01:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Yes, he/she does, but you apparently don't. Or you do, but can't make the mental leap required to understand how to EASILY "game" that system with the aid of another person (either as a favour or in exchange for cold, hard ISK). That, and you can't be bothered to use the search function to look for trades of corps with good standings and see it all explained in a "buying corps with standings for dummies" fashion.
Ok...
- I buy a corp with 5.0 faction standing - I get my research alt in (let's say this character has 2.0 standing with said faction) - Corp's standing with that faction will drop. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 01:17:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ore Bunny wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Ok...
- I buy a corp with 5.0 faction standing - I get my research alt in (let's say this character has 2.0 standing with said faction) - Corp's standing with that faction will drop.
maaate, I think your pedals are going to fast to see it, but it looks like they are going backwards
NPC factions/corps standings toward a player corporation are calculated in this way:
You take the standing (without skills included) of each corporation member (towards the NPC entity in question) on an active subscribing account, add them all up and then divide by the number of members that have the standing already in their character sheet. The ones who do not have a standing towards the entity are not taken into account. The standings will update to the avarage after every downtime.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Standings_mechanics#NPC_Faction_standings_towards_Player_corporations |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 17:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ok, let's use T2 invul BPO again because you people like it so much.
Only 100 runs per T2 BPC. What are chances that inventor even gets 100 run T2 BPC? Usually close to 10 runs per T2 BPC. Akita T owns T2 BPO and can do as many runs as she has materials for.
Invention takes time and money just to get that 10 run BPC. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 18:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:It takes 500 hours to make a 100 run BPC from a T2 Invuln BPO. It would have taken ~250-300 hours to build 100 T2 Invulns from that BPO.
It takes much less than 500 hours to invent and build 100 runs of T2 Invulns, especially since you can run more than one job at a time.
And you can't do that with T2 BPOs? There's like 5000 T2 invul BPOs in the game.
Pipa Porto wrote:Tell me again how BPOs have to be left in POSes to research and Anchoring POSes requires 10.0 Faction Standing and 10.0 Sec Status.
Guides. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 18:48:00 -
[13] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:You either found the world's most unreasonably terrible guides, or you're lying again. My bet is on the latter. Cite your sources.
I never said I have office in NYC.
Getting one would cost billions. Large POS already costs 1-2 billion a month to run. And that's labs offline. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 18:58:00 -
[14] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:that, plus 5000 T2 invul BPOs in the game ade my day, thank you
Any reason why I should use something else other than large deathstar/****star in hisec?
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:btw. is around 20 BPO's per item
Are you sure devs don't have more of them? I've heard they play this game too. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Your idiotic assessment of the cost isn't relative to the question. Tell me again how you have to put your BPOs in the POS and require 10.0 Faction standing and 10.0 Sec status to anchor.
No office in NYC = no corp hangar = BPO must be in POS. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:14:00 -
[16] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:And tell me again how you need a 10.0 Faction standing and 10.0 Sec Status to anchor it.
In 1.0 system you need those. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
114
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:22:00 -
[17] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Tell me again how the BPOs have to go into a POS and how Sec status is at all relevant?
If POS is in system without stations or CORP DOESN'T have OFFICE in that system, BPOs must be in POS. What part of that you don't understand? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 19:45:00 -
[18] - Quote
Lady Naween wrote:why on earth did you put a tower in a system with no station?
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1653133#post1653133
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:OMG have yo uever seen a POS in a 0.8 systems? Or did these guides tell you that?
I can see all nearby towers in d-scan. I've also seen few in 0.8 and 0.9 systems just by warping around. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 22:11:00 -
[19] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:If I owned a T2 BPO the first thing I'd do is sell it.
Why? You would get huge profit using it. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 23:17:00 -
[20] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:You could try reading the rest of my post.
I could make 2.5b building 30 Hulks a month with a BPO, or I could use the same capital and make 10-15b building a few hundred through invention. Or, I could use it for even more lucrative investments.
2.5% a month is pretty crappy profit for Eve.
That's same profit I get. Could be higher if I could get materials faster to build more.
You calculated it wrong. |
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 23:27:00 -
[21] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:Could be higher if I could get materials faster to build more. Here's a "novel" thought : how about your BUY THEM FROM THE MARKET ?
Even less profit at these prices. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 01:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
Akita T wrote:If a big portion of your profit actually comes from manufacturing components, why do you even bother with invention at all to begin with and not just scale up your component production capabilities instead ?
If I want to manufacture most of the components, why I'm not allowed to do that? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 09:41:00 -
[23] - Quote
Cheeba Don wrote:T2 bpos are perfect for eve as they stand now. A seductively expensive collectors item, some of which offer decent returns on investment.
So, T2 BPO owners can compete against inventors after all.
I said it a long time ago... |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 23:39:00 -
[24] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:the Bottlenecks in the moon goo, and they're pretty terrible investments.
Last time I checked Tech holders make profit from every Hulk destroyed even though they pay for it. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 00:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:This is a T2 BPO whine thread, not an OTEC whine thread. Keep your goalpost moving on topic.
The possibility that players might have a financial motive to put a bounty on a class of ship isn't relevant to the fact that T2 BPOs are horrible investments.
If you think they're too profitable, then there's an easy way to deal with it. Buy one and get rich.
Most important reason for Hulkageddon was to create those profits to Hulk BPO owners. It's very likely that Helicity and Goons owns most of the Hulk BPOs. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 00:45:00 -
[26] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:You tried this stupid argument before. A Hulk BPO is a terrible investment. It earns maybe 3b ISK a month on over 100b ISK of capital. Besides that, Hulk pricing is totally dominated by inventors, not BPO owners.
Not if you own like 10 of them. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 00:50:00 -
[27] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Can you make up your mind ? Was it Hulk BPOs or tech moons ? Because the INCOME from a single tech moon overshadows the PROFIT of a single Hulk BPO, badly. And there's hundreds of tech moons but only dozens of Hulk BPOs.
Clueless as always? Goonies own all Tech moons and most of the Hulk BPOs. 1 + 1 = 2? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 00:51:00 -
[28] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Ok, 30b ISK a month on 1 Trillion Isk of Capital still terrible.
They get trillion from their moons every month. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 00:55:00 -
[29] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Yes. And what in that Trillion Isk a month income would that make them take stupid pills and invest in Hulk BPOs instead of preparing for a future Tech nerf?
They're planning on taking all Cobalt moons. They already own some of them. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 01:05:00 -
[30] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:That's not an answer to my question. What in their Trillion Isk a month income would make them decide to invest in Hulk BPOs?
They've known about the nerf a month or two. You asked why they would buy T2 BPOs they already own instead of taking all Cobalt moons from other alliances.
First: they don't need to buy those BPOs because they already own them. Second: they are already taking all Cobalt moons from other alliances and have been doing quite some time.
But of course you should know about this or you're clueless about what your alliance is doing. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 01:27:00 -
[31] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:3. If you have any evidence to suggest that Devs have leaked information inappropriately to anyone, please send that information to CCP's IA department. Otherwise baseless accusations of misconduct are annoying.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1655270#post1655270
Lady Naween wrote:you are aware that helicity is in Shadow Cartel and we are NOT blue to goons.
Helicity is friend of Goons = Shadow Cartel is friend of Goons. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
115
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 10:43:00 -
[32] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Or, in other words, you CAN'T remove them
The fact that you don't want them removed doesn't mean it can't be done.
Pipa Porto wrote:Happily, CCP just announced a buff to Invention compared to BPOs by introducing Tech alchemy.
No, that will be buff for T2 BPO owners. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
116
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 19:34:00 -
[33] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:BPO owners have an advantage on material costs. When material costs decrease, that advantage decreases. Cheap inputs reduce the advantage that waste conscious manufacturers (BPO owners) have over wasteful manufacturers (Inventors).
Reducing the price of inputs is a relative buff to inventors.
It will help T2 BPO owners more. CCP is going to remove only disadvantage from T2 BPO.
T2 BPO owners will get more profit because material costs will be reduced. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
116
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 21:03:00 -
[34] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:It reduces the value of their efficiency advantage, since the material cost will represent a smaller proportion of the invention dominated price (and prices will be lower).
Why only invention dominated prices? Why it doesn't affect material costs for T2 BPO owners? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
116
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 21:26:00 -
[35] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:It does, but since they use less, they get less benefit from material cost going down than inventors. Lower material prices reduce the difference in production costs between inventors and BPO owners. Since that difference is the entire economic value of a BPO, reducing the difference reduces the value of that BPO.
Why you keep mentioning the cost of BPO on every post? Like it's very difficult to get billions for nullbears. For example there was one big alliance that got 15 trillion (or something like that) removed from them not that long ago.
If BPO owners need less materials / module or ship they will get really big bonus to their profit. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
117
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 22:39:00 -
[36] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:In other words, the BPO owners cost to produce drops, but the price of the item drops by a larger amount (because the price is set by inventors), reducing the BPO's profits.
T2 invuls for 50k? Yeah, not going to happen. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
117
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 23:05:00 -
[37] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:What the hell are you talking about?
You mentioned that price of T2 modules/ships will drop a lot...
Pipa Porto wrote:If you think that Tech alchemy will help BPO owners more than inventors, show exactly how.
First of all, you don't have to invent anything. That's already huge advantage. Second, price of moon materials will drop noticeably. (Needed for T2 production). Third, T2 BPO owners need less materials to produce T2 module/ship. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
117
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 23:30:00 -
[38] - Quote
Akita T wrote:The current T2 BPO cost of one unit is 100 mil ISK (out of which 50 mil technetium), while the invented unit costs 160 mil ISK (out of which 70 mil technetium) and the market price is 170 mil ISK. T2 BPO profit is 7 bil ISK/month, inventor profit per line is 0.6 bil, but can be scaled up to 6.6 bil ISK/month via multiple lines (and a lot more effort). Now, technetium price gets slashed in half. T2 BPO production costs fall to 75 mil ISK (out of which 25 mil tech) while invented units cost 125 mil ISK (35 mil technetium). The market price will most likely settle at around 135 mil ISK, maybe a tad bit higher. T2 BPO profit is now 6 bil ISK/month (1 bil ISK less), while the inventor profit remains the same or even goes up a little bit.
I already know profit for T2 BPO owner is bigger than for inventor.
T2 BPO profit will go up after the buff. It can't drop if production costs drop and everything else stays the same. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
117
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 00:51:00 -
[39] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Well, see, that's where you're an idiot. You're forgetting that this is a competitive market, so the end product price will drop. It will drop by more than the amount that the BPO owner's cost to manufacture will drop, reducing the BPO owner's profits.
Akita just showed you exactly how it works.
Competitive market? Selling at a loss? What? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
118
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 21:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
Ore Bunny wrote:true, but on the other hand who honestly cares about your baby-like moaning?
Oh nice... More T2 BPO owners.
Hulk, Mackinaw and Skiff BPOs will be very good items to have. A lot of profit after Inferno 1.2 hits TQ.
CCP should give more free T2 BPOs. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
119
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 07:04:00 -
[41] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:T2 BPOs have never been free. Stop drinking Kuvakei's Kool-Aide.
Yes they were. Maybe some RP, but that has been easy, no effort income for years until CCP nerfed it recently. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
119
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 07:28:00 -
[42] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:1. Standings weren't as easy to grind then as they are now.
Yes, they were easy to get.
Pipa Porto wrote:2. Research Agents didn't work the way they do now.
Go to agent -> accept research project and log off. It has been like that from beginning.
Pipa Porto wrote:3. They weren't an income source during the Lottery, they were lottery tickets.
And more alts you got more likely you got T2 BPOs.
Pipa Porto wrote:4. You don't seem to have any idea how the Lottery worked.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
119
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 11:21:00 -
[43] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:If you want to buy them with RP, go ahead and get in your time machine and do so. You'll be sad to find that that's not how the lottery worked.
So, how it worked if RP wasn't any part of it? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
119
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 12:53:00 -
[44] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:1. Please, go to your Junior High English teacher and tell them that they badly failed you and that you would like remedial lessons in sentence parsing.
English isn't the only language in the world.
You do that just to move goalpost. We all know that you own T2 BPOs. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 06:08:00 -
[45] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Sentence parsing is a useful skill in any language.
Oh... we have expert here.
I'd be ready to bet that you can't complete one single sentence in Finnish or Swedish
Pipa Porto wrote:If I owned a T2 BPO, I'd have sold it already. Know why? Because they're terrible investments.
If T2 BPOs are terrible investments then why do they still exists in-game? Obviously there's something good in them.
- Profit - Owner dominates market. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 07:02:00 -
[46] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:-They provide a terrible income for their capital investment. -They do no such thing. A Hulk BPO produces 30 Hulks a month. Jita alone consumes 2000+. HAG killed 9,000 in like 3 months. There are maybe 5-10 Hulk BPOs. That's at most 300 Hulks from BPOs a month when at least 3,000 a month were needed just for replacement.
What is better investment? Invention is one of the worst ways to earn isk.
Why you link these terrible ones? There's better BPOs out there. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 07:16:00 -
[47] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:You clearly have no idea how to do invention. You can pretty easily break 2m ISK/hr/line doing invention.
I know how to do invention. Just not worth it. Nobody buys T2 BPCs. Or I would have to wait months to sell one. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 07:29:00 -
[48] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:That's because everyone does the smart thing with their invented BPCs so nobody bothers looking on contracts. You have to actually build the thing.
That's what I thought, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.
I would have to build few specific modules/ships to get decent profit. Otherwise I would get very small profit or actually lose money:
Akita T wrote:You ARE allowed to manufacture whatever the friggin' heck you want. You are NOT allowed to complain you're not making much profit if you build what you like not what gives you the best profit. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:02:00 -
[49] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:so?
Building only Basis, Scimis, T2 invuls, T2 LSEs and T2 HMLs starts to get boring at some point. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:09:00 -
[50] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Your claimed boredom is of absolutely no relevance to the issue at hand. Also, there's plenty more that make a decent profit other than just those. The only time you would be justified in complaining would be if you could not find any items whatsoever where you could make a decent profit.
You don't get it?
Only items I would get decent profit are Basis and Scimis. For example I would have to build 1M units of T2 HMLs to get decent profit. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:13:00 -
[51] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Then either you're screwing up calculations, or your skills are junk, or you're using the wrong decryptors.
50k isk profit / T2 HML
Most of build cost is in components. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:24:00 -
[52] - Quote
Akita T wrote:HULK, not HML, you spaz. As in, the damn friggin' exhumer. The ship. The one you fly in. To mine ore.
Not Hulk, the HML. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:33:00 -
[53] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Contradicting yourself much too ?
I thought you all think that invention is better than T2 BOP.
First you have to buy Covetor BPO for 20b and then research it (takes a year or two). Successfully inventing Hulk BPC is very rare. When you have that BPC you have to spend billions to get components. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:44:00 -
[54] - Quote
Akita T wrote:You don't need to research a Covetor BPO at all to invent from it.
I have to research it because I have to build Covetors. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 08:53:00 -
[55] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:I have to research it because I have to build Covetors. Wrong. How about you actually read the next couple of sentences after the one you just quoted.
But I need T1 version of Hulk, that's Covetor btw, to build one. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 12:57:00 -
[56] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:I sell you one for 15bn that I researched in 3 month, deal? not a troll!
Did you research it on NPC station?
No, you didn't. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 13:29:00 -
[57] - Quote
Not anymore since now everyone knows... |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
158
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 12:52:00 -
[58] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:I'm not sure what you're saying, but seeding new T2 BPOs will simply kill the market for invention
T2 BPO owners killed invention years ago. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
158
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 13:00:00 -
[59] - Quote
Zifrian wrote:Funny because I pay for 3 plex + profit doing invention. Too bad you can't figure it out. Maybe all the tears in your eyes are giving you problems seeing?
We aren't talking about T3s and wormholes here. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 15:24:00 -
[60] - Quote
Zifrian wrote:Man, those tears are really messing up your sight.
So, you own T2 BPOs. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
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Posted - 2012.09.03 15:54:00 -
[61] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Stop lying, Jorma. We've repeatedly explained to you exactly how Invention is quite profitable for the vast majority of T2 markets.
T2 BPO owners set the prices. For example Large Semiconductor Memory Cell II. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 16:13:00 -
[62] - Quote
Zifrian wrote:Might want to get your tear ducts checked out.
Because you keep mentioning tears, you seem to like those T2 BPOs. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 16:32:00 -
[63] - Quote
If there's no profit to be made from BPOs then there's no reason to keep them in game. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 16:42:00 -
[64] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:but they do make a little profit, wich means they belong in the game according to this rule
That's only the first month. After the first month you can make billions.
If it's only small profit then it's exactly like T1 BPOs. Why not give a option to get T2 BPOs from NPCs just like it is with T1 BPOs? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 17:00:00 -
[65] - Quote
Skeenal Raholan wrote:they have a limited number of runs they can make!
I've heard that copying T2 BPO is possible... |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 17:04:00 -
[66] - Quote
Zifrian wrote:Oh come on. We've been over this. Copies take longer to make than production.
Copying T2 BPO takes less time than inventing. And that's main point. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
161
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 17:37:00 -
[67] - Quote
Skeenal Raholan wrote:due to limited runs on the bpo
BPCs: limited runs BPOs: unlimited runs
Good game. You should try it. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
162
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 18:10:00 -
[68] - Quote
Skeenal Raholan wrote:Bpo = limited # of runs you can run per month, moron.
Try to copy it next time... |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
162
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 18:19:00 -
[69] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:And you end up manufacturing fewer items in that month. Good job.
That's why you have at least ten BPOs. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
162
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 18:25:00 -
[70] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:And now you're saying that it's worth tying say 5 Trillion ISK up in BPOs in order to make 40 billion ISK a month. (Scimitar BPOs)
There are any number of things you can do with 5 Trillion ISK that would earn far more than 40 billion ISK a month.
Those BPOs cost you exactly 0 isk. so 40 billion per month for 0 isk investment is quite good. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
162
|
Posted - 2012.09.03 18:38:00 -
[71] - Quote
Skeenal Raholan wrote:Isn't there a limited number of each type of t2bpo in game (thought I read 3 of each max). So yeah
For example there's 20-25 Scimi BPOs left in the game. There was around 200 but most of them burned in wrecks or something weird happened to them. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
163
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 08:48:00 -
[72] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:This has absolutely nothing to do with with beeing "gifted" and even you probably know that. Its not a donation if you hand something out that the oposite has paid for (in form of a lottery ticket for exmaple).
How much effort it required from you after you had that research job set up? None. It was, it is and always will be passive income. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
163
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 09:41:00 -
[73] - Quote
What does WWII tank has to do with EVE?
And no, lottery hasn't changed in last 5 years. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
163
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 10:19:00 -
[74] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Removing something isn't a change.
It's a change.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lottery |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
171
|
Posted - 2012.09.08 13:57:00 -
[75] - Quote
Was T20 a tank?
Or was it fictional character created by someone? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
172
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 12:55:00 -
[76] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Leaving T2 BPOs alone and instead buffing invention would lead to decreased T2 prices (arguably a good thing), lowered moongoo values (which is also arguably good), but still no extra profit per inventor (possibly, a lower profit per inventor, as invention entry barriers get lowered, more inventors pop up, and some will accept even lower profits, bringing down overall profitability).
So why it's so bad to buff T2 BPOs?
Something like you should be able to use all lines available in the system, but you only need that one BPO. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 14:41:00 -
[77] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:So why it's so bad to buff T2 BPOs? Something like you should be able to use all lines available in the system, but you only need that one BPO. It's basically the same as releasing 50-200 times more BPOs (so, 500k-2m extra T2 BPOs on top of the ~10k existing ones) and putting them ALL in the hands of the people that already have them. NOT EXACTLY the same, but as close as possible to that from most practical intents and purposes. This means you'd be drastically slashing T2 manufacture profits to around T1 manufacture levels, with T2 items at their lowest possible prices ever. Instead of having just a few low-usage items (which no serious inventor would really bother much with even if no T2 BPOs for it existed) where BPOs already fulfill the need, you'd have many more items where BPOs would be able to fulfill the entire need - almost all items, that is (if not all, period). You'd be basically restricting the market for invention services to a handful of items only, and even for those, at radically lower levels than before. For practical intents and purposes, invention would become
Forcing other players to stop T2 manufacturing would be good. T2 BPO owners should be allowed to control T2 market. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:57:00 -
[78] - Quote
CorInaXeraL wrote:You know what? Let's do it. CCP! We need another T2 lottery to push for this change. Let's hand out, oh...200 random T2 BPOs for high-end T2 items and make it happen.
While we're at it, how about one lucky person gets a Revenant BPO to beat back all those rare BPCs with a stick.
Who said anything about lottery? Just give those BPOs to current T2 BPO owners. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 06:03:00 -
[79] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Where has anyone, besides you and Brewlar, suggested that?
It's a bit weird that you don't see how good idea it is. Because you're better player you are allowed to control how other players play the game. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 06:58:00 -
[80] - Quote
Lara Dantreb wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:It's a bit weird that you don't see how good idea it is. Because you're better player you are allowed to control how other players play the game. Another false assumption in this thread : who is minding about someone's else business with this thread ? Those who claim to change arbitrary the rules, those who ask for the removal to control someone's else assets. No T2 bpo owner has ever whined about invention, because most of them are inventors also and know the ropes to make it a profitable business Want to mind about T2 bpo ? : start to buy a few ones and start producing/selling your goods. Then you may have some feedback to publicize.
I've heard that trying to do everything is bad for profit. Produce or sell, not both.
Point T2 BPO owners are making in this thread is that they want to get rid off inventors, because inventors lower their possible profit. |
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Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.14 17:08:00 -
[81] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Monopoly holders benefit from strengthened monopolies.
Exactly. Monopoly is always good for everyone. Even RL has proved that: nothing can compete against Microsoft. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 07:48:00 -
[82] - Quote
You used word "monopoly" without knowing what it means. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 08:21:00 -
[83] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:No, I didn't.
Then you should know that it's better for you as T2 BPO owner.
Have you actually read this thread? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 08:26:00 -
[84] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Ever going to post a quote and link to back up your bizzarre claims?
Have you actually read this thread? |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 08:52:00 -
[85] - Quote
Doktor Malinowka wrote:sorry son, but you`re the one who dont know what it means...
when every single player in the game can build what a T2 BPO owner can, you think thats Monopoly?
Read the thread...
Like I said before... Remove invention and this problem goes away. Only owners of T2 BPOs should be allowed to produce T2 ships/items. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 10:39:00 -
[86] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:true, but we dont live in a perfect world
Then:
- Remove invention - Give more T2 BPOs to current active T2 BPO owners - Allow them to "copy" job to other slots in same system (only one print per item is needed) - If there's not enough free slots for T2 BPO owner jobs with highest % completed will be canceled (only if T1 job) |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.15 14:22:00 -
[87] - Quote
Akita T wrote:And why exactly would CCP add back something they explicitly said they wanted to remove (the monopoly on T2 production) and did so equally explicitly by adding invention ?
Currently profit you as T2 BPO owner get from your investment is very small. That should be fixed. And because we are in cold and harsh universe cap between elite players and lesser players should be bigger. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 10:50:00 -
[88] - Quote
Akita T wrote:The gap between the "elite" and "n00b" players is already huge enough (not to be confused with the gap between "casual" and "active", which is a different issue altogether), and would remain similarly huge even if EITHER all T2 BPOs would be removed OR the invention process was removed. It's more than just raw ISK that makes the difference, it's expertise in finding ways to make ISK efficiently. An "elite" player will keep adapting to new ways of efficiently squeezing ISK out of almost any opportunity, while a "n00b" will keep on complaining that the one thing he learned how to do is not doing all that well (because there's too many other "n00bs" doing it lately).
You got that wrong.
Elite players: players who get info about upcoming changes 2-3 months before everyone else so they can adapt. Like for example this barge change. These players started crafting thousands of Retrievers and are now just waiting the moment they can start creating minerals from thin air by reprocessing those Retrievers.
Normal EVE players: players who need to adapt to changes after the changes have been publicly announced. Players without hacking/exploiting skills. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.16 11:06:00 -
[89] - Quote
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote: Elite players: players who get info about upcoming changes 2-3 months before everyone else so they can adapt.
you just had to read forums to know that...I know, its a bit more complicated than posting as there is no "read" button, but thats why we are elite player and you are just a newbie.
No info about barge changes in February/March on forums... |
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