| Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Wu Jiaqiu
Minmatar
Tian-di Regime
   |
Posted - 2009.02.23 00:46:00 -
[1]
I'm trying to settle a debate over which is better. A little insight on this would be nice. =]
In solo PvP:
In group PvP:
Against each other:
Pros and cons:
|
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 02:27:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 23/02/2009 02:26:45
 Originally by: Wu Jiaqiu
In solo PvP:
Vagabond.
Quote:
In group PvP:
Vagabond.
Quote:
Against each other:
Vagabond
Quote:
Pros and cons:
Vagabond:
+ Fastest cruiser hull, faster than even some frigates.
+ Excellent slot layout.
+ Decent tank.
+ 25m3 drones + neut for frigate removal.
+ Decent dps with excellent tracking.
- Must close in to web range to do full dps.
- Demands significant player skill and a lag-free environment to avoid dying.
Deimos:
+ Not a Muninn.
- Poor tank.
- Pathetic range.
- Must give up all speed advantage over a Brutix to deal non-zero dps.
- Only three mids on a ship that needs at least four.
- Fails to out-perform a Brutix, for over 3x the cost.
-----------
|
Jaina Proudmoar
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 03:12:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 23/02/2009 02:26:45
Originally by: Wu Jiaqiu
In solo PvP:
Vagabond.
Quote:
In group PvP:
Vagabond.
Quote:
Against each other:
Vagabond
Quote:
Pros and cons:
Vagabond:
+ Fastest cruiser hull, faster than even some frigates.
+ Excellent slot layout.
+ Decent tank.
+ 25m3 drones + neut for frigate removal.
+ Decent dps with excellent tracking.
- Must close in to web range to do full dps.
- Demands significant player skill and a lag-free environment to avoid dying.
Deimos:
+ Not a Muninn.
- Poor tank.
- Pathetic range.
- Must give up all speed advantage over a Brutix to deal non-zero dps.
- Only three mids on a ship that needs at least four.
- Fails to out-perform a Brutix, for over 3x the cost.
This tbh.
|
Dyaven
The Tuskers
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 03:20:00 -
[4]
Oh gawd, I can't believe I'm about to say this:
Merin is right.
|
Chssmius
Capital Support
House of Mercury
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 05:35:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Dyaven
Oh gawd, I can't believe I'm about to say this:
Merin is right.
I know, wait..:looks out window:. Yup still there, guess the sky isn't falling.
Take The EvE Personality Test today! |
Oli Robbo
Gallente
Galactic Defence Syndicate
Eradication Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 14:03:00 -
[6]
No! not my pretty deimos :(
tbh, the guy is right..
but.
I sure do want to make a deimos pvp vid now to prove him wrong ha.
/me starts digging into the ISK reserves.. its gonna cost a lot. 
|
Trebor Notlimah
Lone Star EVE Group
Veni Vidi Vici
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 15:37:00 -
[7]
Deimos is a GREAT ratter for rats with kin/therm weakness -- but even the Ishtar is a better choice for that -- it doesn't require much ammo & two free slots for salvagers.
While it isn't a cripple for other roles, there are several other ships which can do the roles better/cheaper.
|
Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
DEATH'S LEGION
Red Box.
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 18:58:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 23/02/2009 19:05:22
Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 23/02/2009 19:00:17
Solo:
vagabond is superior here, mainly because solo means you got to be able to leave asap if needed.
deimos has its ultimate weak point in solo, and that is it has to fight in web range, meaning it cant escape once engaged.
Group:
both work equally well, deimos sports more dps but vagabond can apply its dps earlier.
at least on our killboard, deimos seems to be more popular than the vagabond in this regard.
against each other:
largely depending on pilot skill. if deimos manages to get the vaga within scrambler range by overheat+approach at the right time it tears it apart, if it doesnt the vaga will slowly grind it down. if deimos fits 5x ec-600 that sucks for the vaga.
Pros:
vaga: fast, can engage at different ranges, can run away unless scrambled/webbed
deimos: high dps (BC-grade dps in a cruiser package), nice dronebay (ec-600=win)
Cons:
vaga: vulnerable to (assault) frigates / scramblers, low dps
deimos: fights in webrange (no disengaging most of the time, -> 'diemost')
Deimos excels as damage dealer in cruiser-size gangs if used right, vaga excels as a solo ship and frigate hunter if used right. Both ships need to be flown very careful, or you are dead quick.
Edit: not many people fit it yet I think, but deimos needs a warp scrambler, not disruptor. Yes it cant tackle properly that way, but it isnt a tackler anyway and you need the scrambler to be superior in webrange.
|
Cupdeez
Out of Order
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 19:02:00 -
[9]
The Vaga is probably better 90% of the time but if the vaga screws up and gets webbed by a Demios it's dead.
Demios does about 550+ DPS
Vaga does about 300+ DPS
Demios is slow (ok tank but nothing more)
Vega is fast (Speed tank or it's dead)
|
Raimo
Gallente
Wrath of Fenris
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 19:56:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Raimo on 23/02/2009 20:00:44
Originally by: Lilith Velkor
Deimos excels as damage dealer in cruiser-size gangs if used right, vaga excels as a solo ship and frigate hunter if used right. Both ships need to be flown very careful, or you are dead quick.
Edit: not many people fit it yet I think, but deimos needs a warp scrambler, not disruptor. Yes it cant tackle properly that way, but it isnt a tackler anyway and you need the scrambler to be superior in webrange.
Edit2: dont believe people saying deimos tank is crap, its a lie. With 2x eanm II + dc2 you get almost the same EHP buffer as the vaga gets with dual LSEs.
(*) Also range isnt as crappy as people say it is, with Null you get 17+ km before rigs (while vastly outdamaging the vaga which gets 20km with barrage before rigs). So you can technically fly it like the vaga, while exploiting the better cap for mwd to negate lower base speed disadvantage.
This really, especially the 1st part. Deimos is actually pretty good if used right in its proper role. (It seems that this is my "defend Deimos" day :P )
You can actually approach 1k overheated DPS in a Deimos with only mild pimping though then your tank will be very small... (25k ish EHP)
A more conservatively fitted Deimos will still do double the damage of a Vaga, and it still is one of the fastest HACs and cruiser hulls in general(though considerably slower than the Vaga) which IMO makes it vastly superior to a Brutix as opposed to the popular meme. But indeed you have to get well in to web/scram range to apply most of your DPS so if things do go pear shaped you will be one of the 1st to fall.
TBH the Deimos could *really* benefit from a 4th mid but I really like it even in its current form, in a gang setting flying with competent pilots that is... (Wouldn't solo in it post-QR)
---
|
|
|
Take Enemy
BAD WOLF INC.
No Apology
|
Posted - 2009.02.24 04:54:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Take Enemy on 24/02/2009 04:58:58
Zealot, tbh. Pulse/scorch and range beam setups are own.
(edit)
Ok, I will add that I do love the Deimos for ratting. Just mows through rats. I would NOT solo pvp in it. It can however be an effective group DPS platform for a cruiser gang.
Just that the Zealot is almost as good a ratter and as cabable at solo and a FAR better group platform - beam setup (over 100k optimal) and pulse out to 36+KM is just own.
(disclaimer)
Never flew the vagaond (and I really dislike Matari ships)...
|
foobarx
|
Posted - 2009.03.03 02:17:00 -
[12]
The Deimos has a fragile tank and you need to be right on top of your target to do max damage. A good Vaga pilot will easily smoke a Deimos in 1v1 combat - he just needs to stay out of point-blank range.
Why they gave a knife fighter such a weak tank is beyond me.
|
Sobic
Republic Military School
|
Posted - 2009.03.03 02:32:00 -
[13]
When I FC I call targets in this order, and I imagine most FC do as well.
ECM (Falcons) So we can actually target them.
NEUTS (Curses) So we can actually tank them.
DPS (DEIMOS) So we can actually out DPS them.
Vagas not so much, because they tend to be a waste of primary as they just run.
But the deimos will die in a gang battle pretty damn quick if the enemy FC knows whats putting out the most hurt.
This is all assuming the average cruiser and below gang battle.
Vagas make for awesome tacklers and anti support in big battles. You just have to be more careful these days. Missiles can actually be a big problem with the changes.
|
Tai Paktu
Beyond Divinity Inc
|
Posted - 2009.03.03 04:47:00 -
[14]
But...but.. the Diemost has green engine trails! GREEN!
|
Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
DEATH'S LEGION
Red Box.
|
Posted - 2009.03.03 05:49:00 -
[15]
Originally by: foobarx
The Deimos has a fragile tank and you need to be right on top of your target to do max damage. A good Vaga pilot will easily smoke a Deimos in 1v1 combat - he just needs to stay out of point-blank range.
Why they gave a knife fighter such a weak tank is beyond me.
Well, the Deimos with 2x eanm + DC has almost the same buffer as the Vaga (funny like people say the Vaga has a decent buffer and the Deimos a poor one...), and with Null you get a very decent area where you outdamage the Vaga.
The only problem in actually killing the Vaga with the Deimos is keeping it from running away.
|
|
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |