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FuPhal
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Posted - 2004.08.12 15:36:00 -
[61]
Who wins out of a Moa vs Thorax fight is pretty much down to what range the fight starts at... if they both spot each other at 60km and they both have decent setups then the Thorax is gonna be in bad shape by the time it gets within range of blasters.
If the Moa lands 10 km from the Thorax then hes gonna have a tough time :/
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FuPhal
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Posted - 2004.08.12 15:36:00 -
[62]
Who wins out of a Moa vs Thorax fight is pretty much down to what range the fight starts at... if they both spot each other at 60km and they both have decent setups then the Thorax is gonna be in bad shape by the time it gets within range of blasters.
If the Moa lands 10 km from the Thorax then hes gonna have a tough time :/
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Usharin Silverberg
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Posted - 2004.08.12 15:59:00 -
[63]
I get sick and tired of these "Whaa, Whaa, Whaa my ship is not the best, must be something wrong, fix it" threads.
If I find something that I like in another ship, I learn too fly it - end of problem - no reason why you can't do the same.
Makes you a more versatile player and leads you into interesting new experiences.
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Usharin Silverberg
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Posted - 2004.08.12 15:59:00 -
[64]
I get sick and tired of these "Whaa, Whaa, Whaa my ship is not the best, must be something wrong, fix it" threads.
If I find something that I like in another ship, I learn too fly it - end of problem - no reason why you can't do the same.
Makes you a more versatile player and leads you into interesting new experiences.
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Selak Zorander
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Posted - 2004.08.12 16:25:00 -
[65]
Detaurus,
One other thing to note: As mentioned by Kieron, the changes you experienced on the live game server (if in fact you experienced them there) was only half of the change, and in no way reflects the actual dynamics of the changes to missiles which are not final yet. If you really want to experience the current form of those missile changes, log in to the test server and check them out there. If you dont like them, provide worthwhile feedback about them.
Worth-while feedback does not include "Missiles sux0r, thanks you stupid nob devs" or "OMG WTF I can't fight with XXX ship anymore because you NERFed it to being completely worthless."
Making snap judgements on proposed ideas that are not final or on data gather with only half the changes in place is a very stupid idea. Not only do you get flamed by nearly everyone, it makes your oppinion matter even less to people that have spent just a little more time reading DEV feedback in other posts or the threads they have started.
kthx, c-ya
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Selak Zorander
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Posted - 2004.08.12 16:25:00 -
[66]
Detaurus,
One other thing to note: As mentioned by Kieron, the changes you experienced on the live game server (if in fact you experienced them there) was only half of the change, and in no way reflects the actual dynamics of the changes to missiles which are not final yet. If you really want to experience the current form of those missile changes, log in to the test server and check them out there. If you dont like them, provide worthwhile feedback about them.
Worth-while feedback does not include "Missiles sux0r, thanks you stupid nob devs" or "OMG WTF I can't fight with XXX ship anymore because you NERFed it to being completely worthless."
Making snap judgements on proposed ideas that are not final or on data gather with only half the changes in place is a very stupid idea. Not only do you get flamed by nearly everyone, it makes your oppinion matter even less to people that have spent just a little more time reading DEV feedback in other posts or the threads they have started.
kthx, c-ya
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 17:02:00 -
[67]
They never said these changes were not intended, merely not intended for this current patch. It is being tested....
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 17:02:00 -
[68]
They never said these changes were not intended, merely not intended for this current patch. It is being tested....
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Shimatu
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Posted - 2004.08.12 18:02:00 -
[69]
 Originally by: Detaurus
They never said these changes were not intended, merely not intended for this current patch. It is being tested....
my god! theyre testing them!?! wtfomg?!
ever thought that the whole point of testing them is to find out what overall effects they have? and if more people logged onto chaos, tested the changes, and offered *constructive* criticism, maybe theyd get better faster...
quit whining about the effects one accidental patch.
3-I's T2 sales can be found HERE
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Shimatu
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Posted - 2004.08.12 18:02:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Detaurus
They never said these changes were not intended, merely not intended for this current patch. It is being tested....
my god! theyre testing them!?! wtfomg?!
ever thought that the whole point of testing them is to find out what overall effects they have? and if more people logged onto chaos, tested the changes, and offered *constructive* criticism, maybe theyd get better faster...
quit whining about the effects one accidental patch.
3-I's T2 sales can be found HERE
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Roderic Excelion
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Posted - 2004.08.12 18:24:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Ghosthunter
so, just cuz you fly Moa it should be best cruiser of all of them??
ok, what about scorp jamming mega then??? same thing...some ships are better then other...
Hows about thinking of the race's other specialty rather than shields: Electronic Warfare. 2 Magnometric ECMs has just made the Balserax a nice drine launching platform and your 4 turrets can kill it while your 2 light missile launchers pulverize the drones, while your 2 remaining mid slots keep your shields up due to its improved boosting ability. This took me 3 seconds to think up, and Oh, Ive 4 low slots still unused. Just cos It's not designed to, doesn't mean I cant armour tank.
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Roderic Excelion
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Posted - 2004.08.12 18:24:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Ghosthunter
so, just cuz you fly Moa it should be best cruiser of all of them??
ok, what about scorp jamming mega then??? same thing...some ships are better then other...
Hows about thinking of the race's other specialty rather than shields: Electronic Warfare. 2 Magnometric ECMs has just made the Balserax a nice drine launching platform and your 4 turrets can kill it while your 2 light missile launchers pulverize the drones, while your 2 remaining mid slots keep your shields up due to its improved boosting ability. This took me 3 seconds to think up, and Oh, Ive 4 low slots still unused. Just cos It's not designed to, doesn't mean I cant armour tank.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 19:12:00 -
[73]
I am quite sure an expert player may defeat almost any other cruiser including the thorax, in almost any cruiser against an average player. The point is that the starting ground for The Thorax and other cruisers is disparate. In the hands of expert players, The Thorax will be the victor.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 19:12:00 -
[74]
I am quite sure an expert player may defeat almost any other cruiser including the thorax, in almost any cruiser against an average player. The point is that the starting ground for The Thorax and other cruisers is disparate. In the hands of expert players, The Thorax will be the victor.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:06:00 -
[75]
Shall I get started on Battleship Disparity then? in any case The Thorax is overpowered, the devs have admitted it. I am not arguing solely concerning firepower, or even versatility, but in fact the REDUCTION of firepower on cruisers required to counteract Frigates and drones, wheras other Cruisers with larger drone bays need sacrifice nothing. 8 Drones = SEVERAL turrets in DPS.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:06:00 -
[76]
Shall I get started on Battleship Disparity then? in any case The Thorax is overpowered, the devs have admitted it. I am not arguing solely concerning firepower, or even versatility, but in fact the REDUCTION of firepower on cruisers required to counteract Frigates and drones, wheras other Cruisers with larger drone bays need sacrifice nothing. 8 Drones = SEVERAL turrets in DPS.
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Iron Jackal
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:37:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Detaurus
Shall I get started on Battleship Disparity then? in any case The Thorax is overpowered, the devs have admitted it. I am not arguing solely concerning firepower, or even versatility, but in fact the REDUCTION of firepower on cruisers required to counteract Frigates and drones, wheras other Cruisers with larger drone bays need sacrifice nothing. 8 Drones = SEVERAL turrets in DPS.
Yes, they did say that is was the best cruiser in the game, Much the same way that the Iowa Class Battleship was far supperior to the Soviet Kirov Class Battleship.
Learn to live with it. The Soviets did [for a time]
I like to say that 8 Ogres is like 8 Frig's myself. Now that the changes on drones have gone though, they die like frigate too when the right pilot take me on.
trolling removed - Sherkaner
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Iron Jackal
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:37:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Detaurus
Shall I get started on Battleship Disparity then? in any case The Thorax is overpowered, the devs have admitted it. I am not arguing solely concerning firepower, or even versatility, but in fact the REDUCTION of firepower on cruisers required to counteract Frigates and drones, wheras other Cruisers with larger drone bays need sacrifice nothing. 8 Drones = SEVERAL turrets in DPS.
Yes, they did say that is was the best cruiser in the game, Much the same way that the Iowa Class Battleship was far supperior to the Soviet Kirov Class Battleship.
Learn to live with it. The Soviets did [for a time]
I like to say that 8 Ogres is like 8 Frig's myself. Now that the changes on drones have gone though, they die like frigate too when the right pilot take me on.
trolling removed - Sherkaner
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:47:00 -
[79]
Missile balance comes later, it has been stated several times.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.12 20:47:00 -
[80]
Missile balance comes later, it has been stated several times.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.08.13 01:47:00 -
[81]
The thread starter said the thorax would have 0 cap taken from it using a mwd at level 5, this is not true. I believed this as well but was proven wrong.
At level 5 it will still have 7% cap taken away. at level 4, 10%.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.08.13 01:47:00 -
[82]
The thread starter said the thorax would have 0 cap taken from it using a mwd at level 5, this is not true. I believed this as well but was proven wrong.
At level 5 it will still have 7% cap taken away. at level 4, 10%.
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Saint Jack
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Posted - 2004.08.13 01:53:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Selim
The thread starter said the thorax would have 0 cap taken from it using a mwd at level 5, this is not true. I believed this as well but was proven wrong.
At level 5 it will still have 7% cap taken away. at level 4, 10%.
The originator of this thread is not well versed in the facts. Please do not continue to confuse him further.
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Saint Jack
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Posted - 2004.08.13 01:53:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Selim
The thread starter said the thorax would have 0 cap taken from it using a mwd at level 5, this is not true. I believed this as well but was proven wrong.
At level 5 it will still have 7% cap taken away. at level 4, 10%.
The originator of this thread is not well versed in the facts. Please do not continue to confuse him further.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.13 04:15:00 -
[85]
Oh I am quite aware of the 'facts', no missile changes have occured.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.13 04:15:00 -
[86]
Oh I am quite aware of the 'facts', no missile changes have occured.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.13 04:20:00 -
[87]
Oh an btw, torpedoes/cruise have troubles against some frigates because they are mwding away, particularly higher end pirate spawns, and this has always been an evasion tactic. When a 6,000 isk piece of ammo does 32 damage to a 10k Frigate(As was described in the sticky thread), you will indeed know that Missile nerfing is on its way.
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Detaurus
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Posted - 2004.08.13 04:20:00 -
[88]
Oh an btw, torpedoes/cruise have troubles against some frigates because they are mwding away, particularly higher end pirate spawns, and this has always been an evasion tactic. When a 6,000 isk piece of ammo does 32 damage to a 10k Frigate(As was described in the sticky thread), you will indeed know that Missile nerfing is on its way.
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PASTOR TROY
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Posted - 2004.08.13 07:11:00 -
[89]
Counters to your mentioned thorax encouters.
1)use smartbombs
2)use ew
3)use its really crappy tracking against it..
4)target heavies with main guns because they die really quick and have huge sig bonus now..also heavies actually miss targets now.
comparing 1 ship against anothers and just using its weakness against the other ships strengths is not valid. Eve is full of such instances.. If a close range setup gets in close well.. maybe you should run. If your being attacked by a long range setup and your short range. Maybe you should run. If your fighting NPC's and you can destroy frigs in your setup, maybe your setup isn't the best? Maybe missiles shouldn't be your weapon of choice if it isn't doing the damage you want. This game is full of advantage/disadvantages. Thats what makes this game so great. If your ship doesn't fit your style of play or if its just not the "flavor of the month", maybe you should change ships. Trust me ..I understand.. I used to fly a megathron.. the tracking got hosed.. I switched to a raven... now missiles will be hosed eventually. Training for Apoc as we speak. I hate saying this to people because it really bugged me when it was said to me.. my advice to you is to adapt. If you dont want to and would rather complain to devs to make your ship better.. I understand... however complaining will make your transition worse....
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PASTOR TROY
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Posted - 2004.08.13 07:11:00 -
[90]
Counters to your mentioned thorax encouters.
1)use smartbombs
2)use ew
3)use its really crappy tracking against it..
4)target heavies with main guns because they die really quick and have huge sig bonus now..also heavies actually miss targets now.
comparing 1 ship against anothers and just using its weakness against the other ships strengths is not valid. Eve is full of such instances.. If a close range setup gets in close well.. maybe you should run. If your being attacked by a long range setup and your short range. Maybe you should run. If your fighting NPC's and you can destroy frigs in your setup, maybe your setup isn't the best? Maybe missiles shouldn't be your weapon of choice if it isn't doing the damage you want. This game is full of advantage/disadvantages. Thats what makes this game so great. If your ship doesn't fit your style of play or if its just not the "flavor of the month", maybe you should change ships. Trust me ..I understand.. I used to fly a megathron.. the tracking got hosed.. I switched to a raven... now missiles will be hosed eventually. Training for Apoc as we speak. I hate saying this to people because it really bugged me when it was said to me.. my advice to you is to adapt. If you dont want to and would rather complain to devs to make your ship better.. I understand... however complaining will make your transition worse....
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