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Luna Nilaya Blood Works Inc. Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.03.11 11:21:00 - [31] Any idea which type of ECM should be used against sleepers or does it matter? - Installing premium content... Deleting file: \boot.ini
Brixer Dai Dai Hai	Posted - 2009.03.11 11:29:00 - [32] Originally by: Jommis I Got jumped by pirates in a wormhole. I was flying a raven. The pirates were using smaller ships. The Sleepers stopped shooting at me and targeted the pirates. Even if they did'nt shoot at the sleepers. They had to run and i finished the plex It looks like the sleepers target the smallest ship or drone. I had 2 T2 inv fields, 1 T2 therm hardener and a T2 dmg control. The towers do 2-500 dmg, the BS sleeper do also 2-500 dmg. But it also had a missile doing over 750 dmg. Took forever to kill, but it was fun There is some info on how Sleepers select targets.. I think it was in a dev blog somewhere. Very usefull info.
OneSock Crown Industries	Posted - 2009.03.11 12:23:00 - [33] Originally by: Weeka Just found a wm space that gimps your cap recharge .. enjoy Yeah I found one that gimps your lock range too. Not so nice.
Valaerian	Posted - 2009.03.11 12:47:00 - [34] Has anyone noticed wether the difficulty you run into is based on the number and size of the ships you bring (ex: Carrier)? It seems that from these few posts where Carriers were involved they ran into no less than 6 BS spawns. Yet some with fewer ships had a difficult time but managed to fare better. Anyone think it could be a mesured response by the AI?
Gefex Genco Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.11 13:31:00 - [35] Originally by: Korell Nova Entered a hole (hehe) in 0.0 gang was 2 pulse zealots covops and a nh. Warped the covops into a core garrison anom, 6 or 7 frigs, 5 cruisers and those bloody guns. We did this same plex last night with a heavily tanked Domi and a Nighthawk. It was VERY close at times, the shields on Domi went about 3 seconds after being locked. They must have popped about 10 drones in all, I ended up cycling sentry drones to kill the towers couldn't really do much else. We didn't stick around after the first wave when we saw the 3 battleships, is there only 2 waves in all? Dominix is probably best suited as a heavy logistic ship and salvager. Fill it with about 100 light T1 drones to use as fodder. :) I think the best team for these sites would be 2-3 Domi's spider tanking each other to keep agro on themselves, while pumping out light drones. 2-3 Nighthawks with precision missiles to kill smaller stuff and a couple of Abbaddons to kill the heavy ships. Target painters on the Domi's might be useful too.
Renox Gallente Celestial Apocalypse	Posted - 2009.03.11 14:32:00 - [36] Sleepers do go for drones, but only sometimes. I used an ishtar to do the first wave of a garrison (5 frigs, 5 cruiser, 3 sentries). I only lost 1 warrior despite sending them 40-50km away to kill frigs. So drones don't automatically get targeted. Also used sentries which were only shot at twice. Falcons also work ok, but you have to use range. At 200km I was able to permajam frigs and cruisers and they seldom went all the way out there to attack me. Bringing a capital into a sleeper spawn will spawn 3 additional sleeper BS I believe, so it might not be worth bringing them. "what are you gonna do with your pixels in your wallet when the server goes down is up to you." - Lilan
Luna Nilaya Blood Works Inc. Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.03.11 16:22:00 - [37] Originally by: Renox Falcons also work ok, but you have to use range. At 200km I was able to permajam frigs and cruisers and they seldom went all the way out there to attack me. Which type of ECM? - Installing premium content... Deleting file: \boot.ini
Ace Secunda Dragon's Rage Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.03.11 16:26:00 - [38] Edited by: Ace Secunda on 11/03/2009 16:26:25 Everyone keeps asking with no answers yet :D What are the sensors on a sleeper, Gravi, Magnet, Radar or Ladar or ALL/NONE of these? Which jammers work best? 'If I can't blow it up It don't exsist'
Kirikarasu Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.03.11 16:29:00 - [39] Edited by: Kirikarasu on 11/03/2009 16:34:19 Originally by: Hack Yeti Originally by: Baihuigau I found i could only solo down to wh found in 0.6 beyond that your going to need a buddy, and be carefull with the sleeper towers they hurt alot and have huge tanks. I found that ships with armor tanks do better against them, but you will still do crap dmg against them. So WH found in higher secs link to systems with easier spawns? So just like 0.8 belt rats are easier than 0.4 belt rats; then 0.8 WH lead to systems with easier spawns then 0.4 WH's? I was thinking it was all random. I assume all W-space is pvp ffa though? Originally by: Valaerian Has anyone noticed wether the difficulty you run into is based on the number and size of the ships you bring (ex: Carrier)? It seems that from these few posts where Carriers were involved they ran into no less than 6 BS spawns. Yet some with fewer ships had a difficult time but managed to fare better. Anyone think it could be a mesured response by the AI? The difficulty of the W-space is directly related the the amount of mass allowed through the WH and the system sec rating. I've seen a WH in 1.0 space that required 4 players to tackle on the test server. Couldn't be soloed. So watch the info when you look at the WH and then decided of you want to go in alone. -----------------------------------------------
Strupstad Quatidion Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.03.11 16:31:00 - [40] Edited by: Strupstad on 11/03/2009 16:32:15 Wormhole systems, info from patchday. [color=red]- Wormhole systems have multiple access points, we scanned 15. - resulting in that: multiple unknown players in the same system. - Zones are lawless (0.0 space) - players do NOT show up in local!! (unless they chat)[/color] NPC's: The aggro behavior is new. We managed to keep aggro concentrated on one Abbadon, which had a logistic ship on its back to tank. The aggro did switch instantly on a crow as it started scrambling. Also the logistic ship seemed to generate aggro by repping. [color=red]The damage kind dealt is none of the 4 known.[/color] [color=blue]Best damage to deal is EM[/color] Best bet is to get in it with a gank group+logistics, try to fit one ship with maximum HP. Do a 360 degree scan for possible gankers every few seconds. Avoid scrambling the NPC's. Adviseable to bring Webbers+painters, since all seem to have MWD. My own experiments told me: Damage on Crow (base resists) - Were 750ish a volley from the sentry turrets. - The battleships did of course miss me with those naughty Missiles. Next off, i went in there with a full tanked Raven, EM+ heat well over 80, rest 75ish. Absolutely same damage. Altho i think the missiles dealt by the NPC battleships might be kinetic, as i did not get hurt too much by them. The Abbadon tanking for us yesterday did report 1kish missile damage a pop and 750ish volley damage from the sentries too. This leaves only that conclusion. Thats all we could find out yesterday so far. We successfully cleared 4 places. Regards, QQQ - Strupstad
Gerald Osikawa	Posted - 2009.03.11 22:45:00 - [41] I'm not entirely sure about this, but as I was playing on SISI I scouted out a high sec Wormhole, once inside I engaged some sleepers with my buffer tanked Drake. As I was exchanging volleys I managed to select and show information on the missiles that I was being hit by. They all said explosive. Here is a copy-pasta from the info windows Heavy missile used by Sleeper cruisers. 0.03 m3 1000.0 kg 125 m 10.00 Sec. 3,750 m/sec 81 m/sec EXPLOSIVE 75 HP KINETIC 75 HP Base Shield Damage 75.0 Base armor damage 123.75 Once I discovered I could do this, I clicked on as many of the incomming missiles as I could. They were all the same. I don't know if anyone else has noticed this or not, but I figured I'd toss it up here. -Gerald
Xia Kairui	Posted - 2009.03.12 08:45:00 - [42] Originally by: Valaerian Has anyone noticed wether the difficulty you run into is based on the number and size of the ships you bring (ex: Carrier)? Yes. On SiSi I ran some tests in an "easy" WH system and was fighting in an anomaly for a while using battleships. The initial spawn was something like two frigs and two cruisers, and three frigs and three cruisers showed up after these were popped (not 100% sure). Normally the progression then calls two cruisers and a BS - this seems to be fixed with the anomaly type, we cleared an identical earlier. Since I had been sharing the entry WH bookmark liberally there were a lot of people in the system, including someone in a carrier. When his gang grew bored and left he joined us, but as soon as he warped into the complex six BS spawned. He confirmed that the same had happened in the other gang too. So, at least one line in the "AI" code seems to be: if (players bring capital ships) { spawn more BS; }
Renox Gallente Celestial Apocalypse	Posted - 2009.03.12 08:59:00 - [43] Originally by: Luna Nilaya Originally by: Renox Falcons also work ok, but you have to use range. At 200km I was able to permajam frigs and cruisers and they seldom went all the way out there to attack me. Which type of ECM? Any type, the stronger the better. So any racial > multispec "what are you gonna do with your pixels in your wallet when the server goes down is up to you." - Lilan
Shadowsword Epsilon Lyr Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2009.03.12 10:11:00 - [44] Edited by: Shadowsword on 12/03/2009 10:11:37 Originally by: Gerald Osikawa [ 2009.03.11 23:20:37 ] (combat)[color=0xff99bb00]Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Awakened Escort for 694 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:20:45 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Awakened Escort for 691 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:20:53 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Awakened Escort for 936 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:21:01 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Awakened Escort for 1723 damage The last two are against hull Frigates: [ 2009.03.11 23:15:22 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Emergent Patroller for 115 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:15:30 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Emergent Patroller for 115 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:15:54 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Emergent Patroller for 161 damage [ 2009.03.11 23:16:01 ] (combat) Group of Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile hit Emergent Patroller for 286 damage Again the last two were hull hits. Hope this helps everyone. -Gerald Thanks for those logs. Comparing hits on armor and on structure, I come up with a 60% EM armor resist for both the frigs and cruisers. CCP stated that sleepers omni-tanked, so the other resists should be similar. Someone please add some more logs ------------------------------------------
Ace Secunda Dragon's Rage Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.03.12 10:39:00 - [45] Jamming works great, we took a Raven, Dominix and Scorpion(me) up against 3 Sleeper BS, 5 Sleeper Cruisers and some frigates and we all survived. While the jams where not permanent I kept the battleships tied up long enough that shields/armor could be repped back up and I was using 7 x Multispecs and 3 x Distortion Amps. I expect if racials work then it will be even better when I refit to them. Im now going to try with a rook. 'If I can't blow it up It don't exsist'
Naomi Wynn Amarr Wynn Industries	Posted - 2009.03.12 10:59:00 - [46] In my dual LAR abby, I was successful in tanking 2x BSs and 2x Cruisers. The key was my AB. Their missiles appear to have poor enough explosion velocity to be affected by a 100mn AB, and perhaps even their tracking is crappy enough to be affected by this as well. Either way, I barely needed to dual rep when I was circling them at just the right angle.
Kase Harkonnen	Posted - 2009.03.12 11:12:00 - [47] Originally by: Ruddger Unconfirmed yet, but it appears that sleepers may ignore cloaks. We had a covops cloaked that was still targeted and destroyed. I was hit, but I think it was a bug were when you start warp and then close the map, you resume the view of your covops uncloaked, (even tho I had left it on while scanning). I had to switch off the module and back on again (but couldn't as i was targeted) , and was reduced to 5% armor before escaping. Many of the sites have gas clouds to decloak you too.
Naomi Wynn Amarr Wynn Industries	Posted - 2009.03.12 11:14:00 - [48] I had my cov ops alt uncloak a lot because of the clouds. Almost got blow'd up twice, too (perhaps a cov ops salvage boat wasn't the best idea :P). Anyway, it's not a bug, it's a challenge :P.
Kaileen Starsong Amarr Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2009.03.12 11:18:00 - [49] Edited by: Kaileen Starsong on 12/03/2009 11:19:50 It looks there're 2 types of anomalies in each kind of WH. So far I've been to 3 levels of WH-systems. 1st level is what I'd call shallow. One of anomaly types is called "Perimer Camp". Only frig and cruiser spawns which leave basic wrecks, no EW from NPCs. Easily soloable, I'd say even T1 cruiser can do. 2nd level has "Perimeter Hangar" as one of anomaly types. Frigs, cruisers, singular BSes(as in I've only seen 1 BS in any spawn max). Basic wrecks, EW unknown. Looks like soloable in HAC. 3rd level is about "Frontier Outpost" or something along these lines. Up to 2 BSes per spawn, different NPCs web and nos; wrecks are of intermediate level. Also looks to be soloable in HAC, although might require warpout with plain T2 fit. I've heard people talking about "Core Fortress", looks like it's 4th or even 5th level of difficulty. Also, guess everyone noticed the pattern? Perimeter-Frontier-?-Core-?. Basically the closer to "central" kind of anomalies you get, the more dangerous they're. Also, loot and salvage differentiates with wreck levels. Basic BS wrecks yields only basic frig/cruiser drops, though in higher quantities. Intermediates are quite a bit better.
Naomi Wynn Amarr Wynn Industries	Posted - 2009.03.12 11:20:00 - [50] Edited by: Naomi Wynn on 12/03/2009 11:20:44 There's also a Perimeter Checkpoint which was in the same WS as Perimeter Hangars. I don't remember too well even tho it was two hours ago, but I think it had 4 or 5 ships of which at least one was a BS.
Kaileen Starsong Amarr Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2009.03.12 11:39:00 - [51] Yeah, that's correct. I didn't bother to remember both names of anomalies because they're always paired in the same system and can't be with anomaly of some other group. At least from my limited experience(around 15 WHs only so far)
ollobrains Caldari State Inc.	Posted - 2009.04.13 23:12:00 - [52] i would suggest grav ECM and Radar ECM against most of the sleepers multispecs they seem to break easily and more often ladar and mag seem ineffective
JunkYardJimmy	Posted - 2009.04.14 01:39:00 - [53] Originally by: Luna Nilaya Any idea which type of ECM should be used against sleepers or does it matter? Look at using Scorpians, in my experience these ships are very effective. 1 scorp can permajam 3 sleeper BS's, 4 80% of the time. With 2 scorps at 100k and a Plated RR BS gang you will easily clean up moderate to hard plex's. Warning DO NOT USE CAPS. Each CAP that warps in to a plex will spawn up to 6 sleeper BS's. We have tried, 2 carriers spawn 12 of the suckers.

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