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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
WhyTry1
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
0
   |
Posted - 2011.09.14 10:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
Why? When a time around trust, truth and honesty was needed, so go and change 'alot' the minutes? Why?
All you done is prove, you cannot be trusted, the CSM in CCPs eyes are pretty worthless, and you dont listen to anyone but yourselves. The game is severely going downhill and has done for some time. Your loss I guess..
Personally will never trust another thing CCP says or does..
Interesting thread..
http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/2011/09/minutes-of-scandal-of-minutes.html
http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/09/05/eve-online-stellar-council-head-hits-out-at-ccp/
http://www.next-gen.biz/news/ccp-accused-running-eve-online-ground
http://tentonhammer.com/eve/news/eve-online-csm-chairman-takes-aim-at-ccp
Trouble is your screwing your own players and game..real clever move...! |
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
209
|
Posted - 2011.09.14 12:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Quote:We need something new to do, not something new to wear.
We also need improvements to the things that we already do.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Conventia Underking
PIE Inc.
12
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Posted - 2011.09.14 16:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hmm... the minutes came out and both groups were satisfied with them. Just took a bit longer. Everyone tries to make themselves look better in public, can't really blame CCP for that.
For God, Empire and Empress! |
Varren Dar'khel
Starforged Ascendancy
1
|
Posted - 2011.09.14 19:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
Conventia Underking wrote:Hmm... the minutes came out and both groups were satisfied with them. Just took a bit longer. Everyone tries to make themselves look better in public, can't really blame CCP for that.
CSM was placated, not satisfied. A number of responses from various CSM members claimed a vast amount of editing was done to the Summit Minutes. This did not please CSM, and if you actually read the minutes it obvious why.
And yes I can blame people for trying to make themselves look better, especially at the cost of integrity and honesty.
If you truly believe that what CCP says to us is remotely what they actually mean or intend, you are hopelessly naive.
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
34
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
The CSM...
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1106/CCP_CSM_PR.jpg
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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
18
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:09:00 -
[6] - Quote
How many days till your subscription runs out Miilla?? You made a big deal about qutting, just wondering if you're sticking to that or if you changed your mind... |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
34
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:How many days till your subscription runs out Miilla?? You made a big deal about qutting, just wondering if you're sticking to that or if you changed your mind...
I already have cancelled my yearly subscription.
I now play out my isk for gametime, at my current wallet balance, I have enough for gametime up to 2016, and my isk is currently growing...
I have more isk for gametime than eve has lifetime.
No more money though, as I said, subscription cancelled, money now put to better use.
|
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
20
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
So the "I have ____many days till I'm done with EvE" countdown is officially over?? |
Sable Blitzmann
Massively Dynamic
Reverberation Project
12
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:38:00 -
[9] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:How many days till your subscription runs out Miilla?? You made a big deal about qutting, just wondering if you're sticking to that or if you changed your mind... I already have cancelled my yearly subscription. I now play out my isk for gametime, at my current wallet balance, I have enough for gametime up to 2016, and my isk is currently growing... I have more isk for gametime than eve has lifetime. No more money though, as I said, subscription cancelled, money now put to better use.
So all that hubbub about quiting was simply stopping your sub? You know that whether or not you sub or buy PLEX, CCP wins. Isn't that what you're against? Do this community a favor and leave already. ;) |
Nyio
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
Miilla wrote:I have enough for gametime up to 2016, and my isk is currently growing...
I accept donations. 
Features & Ideas Discussion: Agent Finder, Black Holes
Needs a banner here.. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
20
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Posted - 2011.09.14 20:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
So basically, Miilla's pomp and circumstance and countdown had nothing to do with them actually leaving the game. They simply now use other people's money to do the same thing - troll CCP, waste people's time in game, waste people's time on the forums, and provide nothing of any value in terms of criticism or discussion.
If only you had the integrity to follow through with what you said you were going to do Miillla - shame on you.
Miillla - whether you use PLEX or use your own cash, you are supporting the company. Do not pretend otherwise. You are a paying customer who is contributing to the ongoing financial health of the corporation you are tearing down.
If you want to make a statement to CCP, stop logging in. Be part of the number drop off that might actually motivate them to change their ways. You yourself encouraged others to stop logging in and playing. To keep playing with other people's cash via PLEX is utter hypocrisy.
You are, and have always been, part of the problem. Time to step up and be part of the solution. By leaving. |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness
The Midget Mafia
27
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Posted - 2011.09.14 21:01:00 -
[12] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:So basically, Miilla's pomp and circumstance and countdown had nothing to do with them actually leaving the game. They simply now use other people's money to do the same thing - troll CCP, waste people's time in game, waste people's time on the forums, and provide nothing of any value in terms of criticism or discussion.
If only you had the integrity to follow through with what you said you were going to do Miillla - shame on you.
Miillla - whether you use PLEX or use your own cash, you are supporting the company. Do not pretend otherwise. You are a paying customer who is contributing to the ongoing financial health of the corporation you are tearing down.
If you want to make a statement to CCP, stop logging in. Be part of the number drop off that might actually motivate them to change their ways. You yourself encouraged others to stop logging in and playing. To keep playing with other people's cash via PLEX is utter hypocrisy.
You are, and have always been, part of the problem. Time to step up and be part of the solution. By leaving.
youmad?
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Sable Blitzmann
Massively Dynamic
Reverberation Project
12
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Posted - 2011.09.14 21:09:00 -
[13] - Quote
Morganta wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:So basically, Miilla's pomp and circumstance and countdown had nothing to do with them actually leaving the game. They simply now use other people's money to do the same thing - troll CCP, waste people's time in game, waste people's time on the forums, and provide nothing of any value in terms of criticism or discussion.
If only you had the integrity to follow through with what you said you were going to do Miillla - shame on you.
Miillla - whether you use PLEX or use your own cash, you are supporting the company. Do not pretend otherwise. You are a paying customer who is contributing to the ongoing financial health of the corporation you are tearing down.
If you want to make a statement to CCP, stop logging in. Be part of the number drop off that might actually motivate them to change their ways. You yourself encouraged others to stop logging in and playing. To keep playing with other people's cash via PLEX is utter hypocrisy.
You are, and have always been, part of the problem. Time to step up and be part of the solution. By leaving. youmad?
A little, yeah. I had high hopes I would never see Milla again. =( |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
20
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Posted - 2011.09.14 21:53:00 -
[14] - Quote
Nope, not mad. Disappointed that Miilla somehow snuck past anti-troll security, but thats up to the moderators to decide.
I think its important to point out that if there are currently two effective ways to make a difference and improve Eve Online:
1) Stay, participate, offer constructive solutions, and be respectful to others in the community, as well as the developers who have worked hard to make Eve Online what it is. Frustration over the current state of affairs should be aimed at upper management, not developers. The developers are working hard, but are not being given enough resources to fix what players want them to fix. Miilla and other trolls simply roll it all into "CCP SUX" territory, which is pointless and disrespectful.
2) Leave the game. Not just cancelling your sub but logging in everyday for the next year, or switching to PLEX payment, but by actually not logging in. Jester's hard data is now in public view, CCP should be well aware that there is a direct correlation between player satisfaction and player participation. Players like Miillla who both play the game and simultaneously tear it down, obfuscate this correlation and prevent progress for the rest of us who enjoy EvE.
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Trolls Troll
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
14
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Posted - 2011.09.14 22:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Nope, not mad. Disappointed that Miilla somehow snuck past anti-troll security, but thats up to the moderators to decide. I think its important to point out that if there are currently two effective ways to make a difference and improve Eve Online: 1) Stay, participate, offer constructive solutions, and be respectful to others in the community, as well as the developers who have worked hard to make Eve Online what it is. Frustration over the current state of affairs should be aimed at upper management, not developers. The developers are working hard, but are not being given enough resources to fix what players want them to fix. Miilla and other trolls simply roll it all into "CCP SUX" territory, which is pointless and disrespectful. 2) Leave the game. Not just cancelling your sub but logging in everyday for the next year, or switching to PLEX payment, but by actually not logging in. Jester's hard data is now in public view, CCP should be well aware that there is a direct correlation between player satisfaction and player participation. Players like Miillla who both play the game and simultaneously tear it down, obfuscate this correlation and prevent progress for the rest of us who enjoy EvE.
Why do you care? |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
52
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Posted - 2011.09.14 23:20:00 -
[16] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:So the "I have ____many days till I'm done with EvE" countdown is officially over??
thats a huge surprise? how many ppl actually quit when they rage on the forums that theyre going to?
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:So basically, Miilla's pomp and circumstance and countdown had nothing to do with them actually leaving the game. They simply now use other people's money to do the same thing - troll CCP, waste people's time in game, waste people's time on the forums, and provide nothing of any value in terms of criticism or discussion.
well then do the right thing; report every post you see that qualifies as the above and Milla will eventually get banned.
Though if you wanna really get technical, youre doing what youre accusing him/her of doing "troll Milla, waste people's time on the forums, and provide nothing of any value in terms of criticism or discussion" and adding personal attack on top of it lol
They hired actual clothing designers for WiS clothes
"no wonder the monocle cost $80, they had to pay royalties"
Screw "FiS" its called EVE CCP |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
23
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Posted - 2011.09.15 00:09:00 -
[17] - Quote
Edit: forum ate my response. Apprently the new forums are buggy as hell with the in-game browser....but that's probably a topic for another thread. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
23
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Posted - 2011.09.15 00:27:00 -
[18] - Quote
Trolls Troll wrote:
Why do you care?
I care because I enjoy this game. I've met a lot of great friends here, in and out of game. I want it to thrive. I want it to attract more players. I think community building is as important a part of that as begging CCP to invest more resources into fixing problems and deploying new content.
Part of that community building is healthy constructive dialogue on the forums. It's the reason there are posted rules. Some individuals try to push this - by either saying the bare minimum for a comment to not be considered a troll, or by outright button pushing, opening threads that they know full well will get locked. Tes Schwartz has been doing this a lot recently.
To answer Richard's question - the reason i spoke up about Miilla is that the entire community knows them to be altogether destructive and negative in their comments. Yes, we should all flag them. Same with Tes Schwartz.
I have no problem pointing the fingers when I dont think there's much to debate - its common knowledge Miilla gets their kicks by insulting CCP, insulting the CSM, and repeatedly and incessantly predicting Eve Online Doomsday scenarios, while continuing to support the company by remaining a paying customer. PLEX or cash is irrelevant.
Forum rules are there to keep things fun and positive, and I think its in the forum community's best interest to discourage this kind of childish behavior. By calling a spade a spade if necessary.
Anyone here is welcome to flag me, I'm confident the moderators will let me know if I've crossed the line. :)
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Fawcks
Avoid and Evade
Epsilon Shimmy Alliance
25
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Posted - 2011.09.15 00:57:00 -
[19] - Quote
WhyTry1 wrote:blah blah blah blah blah the CSM in CCPs eyes are pretty worthless blah blah
The CSM is worthless to everyone's eyes. :/ |
EVE Stig
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
4
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Posted - 2011.09.15 03:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
Fawcks wrote:WhyTry1 wrote:blah blah blah blah blah the CSM in CCPs eyes are pretty worthless blah blah The CSM is worthless to everyone's eyes. :/
except theirs
"Some say that he is actually dead, but the Grim Reaper is too afraid to tell him."
"Some say he is the 3rd member of Daft Punk and he did the vocals of "Technologic" song. All we know is,he's called EVE Stig"! |
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CCP Xhagen
C C P
21
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Posted - 2011.09.15 14:35:00 -
[21] - Quote
Why did we edit the minutes?
Many of you have some experience with writing up meeting minutes in the form we have been publishing CSM meeting minutes in the past. This conversational form, with a flow and grouping of subjects is a bit tricky to achieve.
Also, building a context for statements is also important so that neither questions nor answers are miscommunicated.
We've always edited the CSM meeting minutes. Both the CSM and CCP have had input into the editing process from the beginning. Usually those edits have been minor and done in perfect agreement between both parties.
Now, enter the special meeting minutes. This is the first where the CSM and CCP have had a conversation about the business strategies of CCP. Understandably we want the business stuff to sound right, after all CCP is a business entity.
When these two conditions meet, first time for business strategy with the CSM and CCP being a business, I'd say that difficulties arising in communication of those meetings are to be expected. And while I grossly underestimated the degree of difference of opinions between CCP and the CSM regarding the writeup of these minutes, we still managed to have both parties agree to a version.
In my opinion this is neither good nor bad - this type of discussion is a healthy one and while it takes time to resolve I still firmly maintain the rule that minutes shall not be released until both parties give their consent - but they will be released so a stalling tactic will not be made an acceptable method, by either party. My stance might be the result of my educational background (an MA in Philosophy from the University of Iceland), I however regard this as a good way to handle matters like these.
TL;DR - the CSM and CCP always edited the CSM meeting minutes after the initial writeup, the special circumstances of the special meeting required more work than with previous minutes.
CCP Xhagen | CSM Project Manager |
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Prince Kobol
40
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Posted - 2011.09.15 14:47:00 -
[22] - Quote
I refuse to blame CCP 100% for the delay like many other people are doing.
There are two sides to every story and since none of use where you have to chose yourself who you believe, either CCP or the CSM.
Personally I see both groups not wanting to look bad since both have a lot to lose.
CCP have already had lots of bad press and many people now have a very low opinion of them and on the other had you have the CSM who have also taken quite a bashing and again, are suffering from low opinions.
I imagine the CSM saw this as an opportunity to look like hero's at the expenses of CCP, knowning that at the time there was already considerable anger directed towards CCP and then you had CCP in all out damage control.
For me the end result was both sets looking poor and neither winning. |
Smoking Blunts
21
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Posted - 2011.09.15 15:11:00 -
[23] - Quote
i was under the impression that you stated your business plan 2 years or so ago. remember 18 months?
leave eve with only 2 people working on it while you moved everything to dust and wod. while using eve to test wod crap on. well we can see the results of that business plan everytime we look at the online figures.
rest of the minuets have nothing new and look like all the good bits have been condences into sound bite chunks which evenews24 highlighted so well.
CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Byshop Kayl
Club Bear
The Seventh Day
6
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Posted - 2011.09.15 16:46:00 -
[24] - Quote
I understand the amount of time and effort it took to edit the minutes for public consumption.
(I'm sure there were some heated words.)
It's been months. When will we see -any- results from this emergency meeting.
As a loyal fan, player, even consumer, for many years, I feel completely out of touch with CCP's direction.
We see a LOT of conversation apparently taking place without any idea of the content of those conversations.
(Hiding behind the shield of the NDA.)
But, more importantly, we have yet to see ANY actions.
A few of the low-hanging fruit and a couple of nice little patches between now and winter would have gone a long way to re-injecting some faith in CCP.
-á"Sanity is the playground of the unimaginitive."-á-- Anonymous
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over-áagain expecting different results."-á-- A. Einstein |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
K162
143
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Posted - 2011.09.15 16:53:00 -
[25] - Quote
We had to agree to the edits, or Xhagen would do this to us...  (kidding, we all love Petur!)
CSM 6 Alternate Delegate
@two_step_eve on Twitter
My Blog
What does CSM 6 do? |
Amar Azaph
Celestial Cartel
1
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Posted - 2011.09.15 17:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Byshop Kayl wrote:I understand the amount of time and effort it took to edit the minutes for public consumption.
(I'm sure there were some heated words.)
It's been months. When will we see -any- results from this emergency meeting.
As a loyal fan, player, even consumer, for many years, I feel completely out of touch with CCP's direction.
We see a LOT of conversation apparently taking place without any idea of the content of those conversations.
(Hiding behind the shield of the NDA.)
But, more importantly, we have yet to see ANY actions.
A few of the low-hanging fruit and a couple of nice little patches between now and winter would have gone a long way to re-injecting some faith in CCP.
An NDA is worthless, I am surprised that they even had to sign one. The CSM need business people on the chair, not avid gamers, or lawyers.
For my part I know nothing with any certainty, but the sight of the stars makes me dream. |
gargars
Cohesion Inc
Beyond-Repair
6
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Posted - 2011.09.15 17:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
I notice CCP Xhagen, all of a sudden you and other Devs have stopped calling the July CCP/CSM meeting in Iceland the 'emergency' meeting/summit, and now are all calling it only the 'special' meeting or summit.
A bit too obvious a manipulation, especially given this thread is about censoring and manipulation of facts lol.
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CCP Xhagen
C C P
21
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Posted - 2011.09.16 09:40:00 -
[28] - Quote
gargars wrote:I notice CCP Xhagen, all of a sudden you and other Devs have stopped calling the July CCP/CSM meeting in Iceland the 'emergency' meeting/summit, and now are all calling it only the 'special' meeting or summit.
A bit too obvious a manipulation, especially given this thread is about censoring and manipulation of facts lol.
I'm not trying to sound offensive or rude, but you just demonstrated what was going on with the minutes and the editing surrounding that.
Special, emergency, extraordinary, unscheduled... we had a meeting on a very short notice, what does it matter what it is called?
CCP Xhagen | CSM Project Manager |
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CCP Xhagen
C C P
21
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Posted - 2011.09.16 09:48:00 -
[29] - Quote
Byshop Kayl wrote:I understand the amount of time and effort it took to edit the minutes for public consumption.
(I'm sure there were some heated words.)
It's been months. When will we see -any- results from this emergency meeting.
As a loyal fan, player, even consumer, for many years, I feel completely out of touch with CCP's direction.
We see a LOT of conversation apparently taking place without any idea of the content of those conversations.
(Hiding behind the shield of the NDA.)
But, more importantly, we have yet to see ANY actions.
A few of the low-hanging fruit and a couple of nice little patches between now and winter would have gone a long way to re-injecting some faith in CCP.
You will absolutely see results from the meeting, actions and results. As per this thread :edit: and this post :edit: - CCP is just not ready to communicate about it publicly just yet. The CSM is however being kept in the loop as much as possible.
CCP Xhagen | CSM Project Manager |
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Alpheias
62
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Posted - 2011.09.16 09:51:00 -
[30] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:
Special, emergency, extraordinary, unscheduled... we had a meeting on a very short notice, what does it matter what it is called?
Because CCP, as their habit goes, makes blunders that can be likened to someone thinking that diarrhea and snow cannon is a cool idea.
GÖ½ When your ship gets blown to bits
GÖ½ And you lose your Faction fits
\Gÿ+/ Don't worry GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½
GÖ½ GÖ¬ GÖ½ GÖ¬ Be Happy \Gÿ+/ |
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