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In the land of the insane, the sick are well. [CA Tax]

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Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:14:00 - [1] Edited by: Maasu on 23/08/2004 20:21:55 Firstly, i'm posting this with the nick that many CA are know me as. For those who don't know me under this nick, i'm Reverend Necrona. Why am i posting here? Well i feel that there is a need to address this very issue of what the CA is. The CA is a collection of players. Like the eve playerbase for example, we have all sorts great players, good players, bad players, idiots, clever people, stupid people (\o/), arrogant people and annoying people. Yes we even have zelota as well (yes i love him :/). Now despite this obvious distinction between the characters that fill up the CA,MOST, have one thing in common. That is an understanding. This understanding is that the CA is about playing eve together as a group, helping one another mostly in combat, sometimes in mining, npcing, commerce & trade etc. etc. We work together, we work as a team and we, in essence, are the Curse Alliance. HOWEVER As it is obvious to see as of a recent post, we are abused. For some reason, and i must iterate here that i am not making a pass at the leaders of the CA here as i have the utmost respect for all of you, the people that abuse our comradship and team work are allowed to do so. We keep them in our ranks, we allow them to wear our banners - most importantly we allow them to fill our politics with utter usless beuacracy and greed. If there was anything that i hated about being in the CA, the smack talkers, the forum spammers(heh), the alts etc. none of them would even come close to the fiends that represent those who are ATTACKING the crediblity of some fine players (of which i'm proud to play alongisde) just because of their greed and lack of consideration for those that waste a lot of time and resources protecting them. I'm sorry if this annoyed any of my proper CA comrades and leaders. It's never my intention to do so, but i want to state, publically my distaste for these leeches that we allow for whatever reason to feed off our efforts. The last thing we are is honourless bullies who want to steal money of our own members. We might be sick, but were not insane :/ ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:14:00 - [2] Edited by: Maasu on 23/08/2004 20:21:55 Firstly, i'm posting this with the nick that many CA are know me as. For those who don't know me under this nick, i'm Reverend Necrona. Why am i posting here? Well i feel that there is a need to address this very issue of what the CA is. The CA is a collection of players. Like the eve playerbase for example, we have all sorts great players, good players, bad players, idiots, clever people, stupid people (\o/), arrogant people and annoying people. Yes we even have zelota as well (yes i love him :/). Now despite this obvious distinction between the characters that fill up the CA,MOST, have one thing in common. That is an understanding. This understanding is that the CA is about playing eve together as a group, helping one another mostly in combat, sometimes in mining, npcing, commerce & trade etc. etc. We work together, we work as a team and we, in essence, are the Curse Alliance. HOWEVER As it is obvious to see as of a recent post, we are abused. For some reason, and i must iterate here that i am not making a pass at the leaders of the CA here as i have the utmost respect for all of you, the people that abuse our comradship and team work are allowed to do so. We keep them in our ranks, we allow them to wear our banners - most importantly we allow them to fill our politics with utter usless beuacracy and greed. If there was anything that i hated about being in the CA, the smack talkers, the forum spammers(heh), the alts etc. none of them would even come close to the fiends that represent those who are ATTACKING the crediblity of some fine players (of which i'm proud to play alongisde) just because of their greed and lack of consideration for those that waste a lot of time and resources protecting them. I'm sorry if this annoyed any of my proper CA comrades and leaders. It's never my intention to do so, but i want to state, publically my distaste for these leeches that we allow for whatever reason to feed off our efforts. The last thing we are is honourless bullies who want to steal money of our own members. We might be sick, but were not insane :/ ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:19:00 - [3] That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:19:00 - [4] That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:22:00 - [5] Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Untill you have the diginity somewhere to show your proper face, please go cancel your ISP subscription. ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:22:00 - [6] Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Untill you have the diginity somewhere to show your proper face, please go cancel your ISP subscription. ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:27:00 - [7] Care to try to force me oh bootlicker supreme? The only reason you stand up for this is because you stand to benefit greatly from it, don't try to lie and say otherwise, I doubt anybody is stupid enough to fall for it.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:27:00 - [8] Care to try to force me oh bootlicker supreme? The only reason you stand up for this is because you stand to benefit greatly from it, don't try to lie and say otherwise, I doubt anybody is stupid enough to fall for it.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:30:00 - [9] Originally by: Fergal Care to try to force me oh bootlicker supreme? The only reason you stand up for this is because you stand to benefit greatly from it, don't try to lie and say otherwise, I doubt anybody is stupid enough to fall for it. I doubt your even CA to be honest, given the comment you just made. :) ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:30:00 - [10] Originally by: Fergal Care to try to force me oh bootlicker supreme? The only reason you stand up for this is because you stand to benefit greatly from it, don't try to lie and say otherwise, I doubt anybody is stupid enough to fall for it. I doubt your even CA to be honest, given the comment you just made. :) ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:33:00 - [11] I guess we'll never know since, if I did say who my main was, myself and my corp would be summarily killed on sight, even though they never said a word, as was promised last night in CA chat.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:33:00 - [12] I guess we'll never know since, if I did say who my main was, myself and my corp would be summarily killed on sight, even though they never said a word, as was promised last night in CA chat.
Cruz	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:40:00 - [13] Originally by: Fergal I guess we'll never know since, if I did say who my main was, myself and my corp would be summarily killed on sight, even though they never said a word, as was promised last night in CA chat. And you blame them? .................
Cruz	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:40:00 - [14] Originally by: Fergal I guess we'll never know since, if I did say who my main was, myself and my corp would be summarily killed on sight, even though they never said a word, as was promised last night in CA chat. And you blame them? .................
crice	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:45:00 - [15] Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Your really are a coward aren't you. I can't believe your still posting with an alt bashing people. Too bad CCP can't let us know who you are, I am sure any alliance would be disgusted to have a worm like you in their ranks... Very sad.
crice	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:45:00 - [16] Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Your really are a coward aren't you. I can't believe your still posting with an alt bashing people. Too bad CCP can't let us know who you are, I am sure any alliance would be disgusted to have a worm like you in their ranks... Very sad.
Capt Ketamine	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:46:00 - [17] Ok enough can we drop it now. I dont give a st anymore tbh. Ive read enough tit for tat. Bottom line is.....leave Curse if you dont like the regime. Spit in the eye of your leaders and go join FA and boost their coffers. You obviously dont give a toss about your own alliance, what does it matter where u work eh? So please stfu! What is this? The 6th thread on it? This is not to say i could give a flying fk about the leaderships decisions either.....you do need miners at the end of the day. Seems a bit stoopid imo. To be quite honest, with all the pvp forces away im amazed Curse hasnt fallen to the enemy....as if there is anyone who had the might or the will to do it! View from an ignorant Carebear (but one who enjoys these forums, is tired of the same old crap and is entitled to express his view). Gnite losers "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made alot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move" Douglas Adams
Capt Ketamine	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:46:00 - [18] Ok enough can we drop it now. I dont give a st anymore tbh. Ive read enough tit for tat. Bottom line is.....leave Curse if you dont like the regime. Spit in the eye of your leaders and go join FA and boost their coffers. You obviously dont give a toss about your own alliance, what does it matter where u work eh? So please stfu! What is this? The 6th thread on it? This is not to say i could give a flying fk about the leaderships decisions either.....you do need miners at the end of the day. Seems a bit stoopid imo. To be quite honest, with all the pvp forces away im amazed Curse hasnt fallen to the enemy....as if there is anyone who had the might or the will to do it! View from an ignorant Carebear (but one who enjoys these forums, is tired of the same old crap and is entitled to express his view). Gnite losers "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made alot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move" Douglas Adams
Pa1nbringr	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:54:00 - [19] Originally by: Capt Ketamine Ok enough can we drop it now. I dont give a st anymore tbh. Ive read enough tit for tat. Bottom line is.....leave Curse if you dont like the regime. Spit in the eye of your leaders and go join FA and boost their coffers. You obviously dont give a toss about your own alliance, what does it matter where u work eh? So please stfu! What is this? The 6th thread on it? This is not to say i could give a flying fk about the leaderships decisions either.....you do need miners at the end of the day. Seems a bit stoopid imo. To be quite honest, with all the pvp forces away im amazed Curse hasnt fallen to the enemy....as if there is anyone who had the might or the will to do it! View from an ignorant Carebear (but one who enjoys these forums, is tired of the same old crap and is entitled to express his view). Gnite losers stop saying to be honest and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks ---------------------- Fedaykin Naib > eh this is boring, think im going to go choke one out Pa1nbringr > sick Fedaykin Naib > lol
Pa1nbringr	Posted - 2004.08.23 20:54:00 - [20] Originally by: Capt Ketamine Ok enough can we drop it now. I dont give a st anymore tbh. Ive read enough tit for tat. Bottom line is.....leave Curse if you dont like the regime. Spit in the eye of your leaders and go join FA and boost their coffers. You obviously dont give a toss about your own alliance, what does it matter where u work eh? So please stfu! What is this? The 6th thread on it? This is not to say i could give a flying fk about the leaderships decisions either.....you do need miners at the end of the day. Seems a bit stoopid imo. To be quite honest, with all the pvp forces away im amazed Curse hasnt fallen to the enemy....as if there is anyone who had the might or the will to do it! View from an ignorant Carebear (but one who enjoys these forums, is tired of the same old crap and is entitled to express his view). Gnite losers stop saying to be honest and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks ---------------------- Fedaykin Naib > eh this is boring, think im going to go choke one out Pa1nbringr > sick Fedaykin Naib > lol
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.08.23 21:01:00 - [21] Direct PvP isn't the only way of contributing to the alliance effort, as you well know, but I get the feeling a lot of CA members are feeling a distinct lack of ANY support be it by cheaper minerals, logistical support, named modules from NPC hunting on the cheap etcetc from their more passive members. The question you have to ask yourself is this; how are you going to enforce this tax and how do you ensure people are giving the correct amount? LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.08.23 21:01:00 - [22] Direct PvP isn't the only way of contributing to the alliance effort, as you well know, but I get the feeling a lot of CA members are feeling a distinct lack of ANY support be it by cheaper minerals, logistical support, named modules from NPC hunting on the cheap etcetc from their more passive members. The question you have to ask yourself is this; how are you going to enforce this tax and how do you ensure people are giving the correct amount? LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Cruz	Posted - 2004.08.23 21:02:00 - [23] Originally by: Pa1nbringr and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks yep .................
Cruz	Posted - 2004.08.23 21:02:00 - [24] Originally by: Pa1nbringr and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks yep .................
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:36:00 - [25] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:55:34 I knew Omega Corp would push for something like this. One of the major things Pooti, Red and myself were yelling at everyone in TS is that we thought Omega was really just out for themselves. When they described they spoke on the forums, it was never as an alliance member, but what their corp specifically had done I never saw them fly with other corps in their alliance, they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space (which to us in Curse, was ridiculous - I may have been a member of Red Corsairs first, which let me disregard whatever the Council tried to say and murder anyone outside the alliance we pleased, NAPs be damned, but we'd never open fire on someone like NGRU for taking a few pieces of crokite) When Duke first came to the CA asking for an alliance, it wasnt to join the CA and follow its rules, but have the entire CA and his one corp be considered equals in some alliance where he once again would be able to claim space for his corp, and one of the first things he made clear (within 10 minutes of coming on TS) was that any Curse pilot found trespassing in his space would be shot. Just seemed too arrogant and weird for me, and the current "** the miners they should be annihilated" just confirms what I thought at the time But our corps' voice was stifled, because tbh it was expected we'd vote for the " bringing in new members, we need people to shoot," and had voted no for every corp to be brought in for months. The only corp I think we voted on was ATUK, maybe not From an outside point of view now, I won't even say whether it's right or wrong to do this now(because I don't know, and tbh I wouldn't really give a ** if it weren't for having a handful of friends in the CA, you're all enemies now), but, say 9 months ago, would have angered me as a CA member, even if I'd most likely profit from an inflated tax and free kills on more nubs trapped in the home regions. Maybe just the libertarian in me Anyway, I know it's not just your corp that pushed for it, but my guess is that you've been speaking about it with everyone that's flown with you for months now. Guess I'll have to ask Burner
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:36:00 - [26] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:55:34 I knew Omega Corp would push for something like this. One of the major things Pooti, Red and myself were yelling at everyone in TS is that we thought Omega was really just out for themselves. When they described they spoke on the forums, it was never as an alliance member, but what their corp specifically had done I never saw them fly with other corps in their alliance, they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space (which to us in Curse, was ridiculous - I may have been a member of Red Corsairs first, which let me disregard whatever the Council tried to say and murder anyone outside the alliance we pleased, NAPs be damned, but we'd never open fire on someone like NGRU for taking a few pieces of crokite) When Duke first came to the CA asking for an alliance, it wasnt to join the CA and follow its rules, but have the entire CA and his one corp be considered equals in some alliance where he once again would be able to claim space for his corp, and one of the first things he made clear (within 10 minutes of coming on TS) was that any Curse pilot found trespassing in his space would be shot. Just seemed too arrogant and weird for me, and the current "** the miners they should be annihilated" just confirms what I thought at the time But our corps' voice was stifled, because tbh it was expected we'd vote for the " bringing in new members, we need people to shoot," and had voted no for every corp to be brought in for months. The only corp I think we voted on was ATUK, maybe not From an outside point of view now, I won't even say whether it's right or wrong to do this now(because I don't know, and tbh I wouldn't really give a ** if it weren't for having a handful of friends in the CA, you're all enemies now), but, say 9 months ago, would have angered me as a CA member, even if I'd most likely profit from an inflated tax and free kills on more nubs trapped in the home regions. Maybe just the libertarian in me Anyway, I know it's not just your corp that pushed for it, but my guess is that you've been speaking about it with everyone that's flown with you for months now. Guess I'll have to ask Burner
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:47:00 - [27] Could someone summarise the opening statement in this thread please? (I've read it twice now and I still don't understand exactly what Maasu is saying). Lots of love JF Public Forum
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:47:00 - [28] Could someone summarise the opening statement in this thread please? (I've read it twice now and I still don't understand exactly what Maasu is saying). Lots of love JF Public Forum
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:50:00 - [29] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:53:42 Sure thing. "CA is a team. And teams should do what the ** my whining ass wants them to. Anyone that operates differently is corrupting the team as a whole, and ** them all"
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:50:00 - [30] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:53:42 Sure thing. "CA is a team. And teams should do what the ** my whining ass wants them to. Anyone that operates differently is corrupting the team as a whole, and ** them all"
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:54:00 - [31] Originally by: BobGhengisKhan Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:53:42 Sure thing. "CA is a team. And teams should do what the ** my whining ass wants them to. Anyone that operates differently is corrupting the team as a whole, and ** them all" Much Obliged Sir, thats much clearer thank you. JF Public Forum
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:54:00 - [32] Originally by: BobGhengisKhan Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 22:53:42 Sure thing. "CA is a team. And teams should do what the ** my whining ass wants them to. Anyone that operates differently is corrupting the team as a whole, and ** them all" Much Obliged Sir, thats much clearer thank you. JF Public Forum
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:58:00 - [33] Edited by: Maasu on 23/08/2004 23:02:17 Bob - it wasn't just OC who pushed for this, it was the CA corps fighting day in / day out. You turned your back on the CA long ago anyways, to go on about OC abusing them is quite hypocritcal. OC has done nothing but good for the CA, ask any CA member if we are indeed using CA for our own means, we serve the CA. Yet radiate nothing but irrational ammmonosity towards OC anyways Bob, it's quite fine though your entitled to an opinion, however tunnled it is. Jade my opening line simply explained why i was using Maasu as opposed to Reverend Necrona to post. I fail to understand how it was that difficult to comprehend o.O . ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
Maasu	Posted - 2004.08.23 22:58:00 - [34] Edited by: Maasu on 23/08/2004 23:02:17 Bob - it wasn't just OC who pushed for this, it was the CA corps fighting day in / day out. You turned your back on the CA long ago anyways, to go on about OC abusing them is quite hypocritcal. OC has done nothing but good for the CA, ask any CA member if we are indeed using CA for our own means, we serve the CA. Yet radiate nothing but irrational ammmonosity towards OC anyways Bob, it's quite fine though your entitled to an opinion, however tunnled it is. Jade my opening line simply explained why i was using Maasu as opposed to Reverend Necrona to post. I fail to understand how it was that difficult to comprehend o.O . ATUK, The Forlorn Hope of Corps.
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:00:00 - [35] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 23:13:28 Well, for starters, you go on and on about being a proud member of a team and how everyone works together on what they enjoy (including the oh so fun mining), and how CA is a great alliance to be a part of. Then you say a couple of people are somehow "ATTACKING" you by mining or npcing or whatever, and throw all that work together and have fun **** right out the window And yes, I left the CA long ago, partly because I didn't like your corp, partly because of the council (well, Xirtam WAS the council) allowing in the same corps that you are now saying are ruining the alliance by carebearing and must be shot (if you mean Backwater and such, but tbh they were really no different than VOTF or Black Omega, I just didnt have good memories of them from "the old days"), but mostly because of how I saw my friends change in the time between the alliance starting and my departure (mostly Xirtam, although I flatout refused to admit it for months - the guy was my friend, as lame as it may sound) And yeah, I said I knew it wasnt just you guys, it was asked for by some like The Monk for months before you even left Stain, but I assume you had a big influence in finally getting it through. Basically, what I'm seeing is that Xirt and Droklar are the 2 people that get to choose who stays, and Xirt hasn't been aggressive in fighting since he got his battleship (used to be one hell of a BB pilot, I must say), and has been about the same as the Backwaters and NGRUs that I'm assuming youre pushing to kick, except he's loud and gets respect somehow, and Droklar's just about the weirdest bastard I've ever spoken to (dont think thats offensive, but man he's just odd)
BobGhengisKhan	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:00:00 - [36] Edited by: BobGhengisKhan on 23/08/2004 23:13:28 Well, for starters, you go on and on about being a proud member of a team and how everyone works together on what they enjoy (including the oh so fun mining), and how CA is a great alliance to be a part of. Then you say a couple of people are somehow "ATTACKING" you by mining or npcing or whatever, and throw all that work together and have fun **** right out the window And yes, I left the CA long ago, partly because I didn't like your corp, partly because of the council (well, Xirtam WAS the council) allowing in the same corps that you are now saying are ruining the alliance by carebearing and must be shot (if you mean Backwater and such, but tbh they were really no different than VOTF or Black Omega, I just didnt have good memories of them from "the old days"), but mostly because of how I saw my friends change in the time between the alliance starting and my departure (mostly Xirtam, although I flatout refused to admit it for months - the guy was my friend, as lame as it may sound) And yeah, I said I knew it wasnt just you guys, it was asked for by some like The Monk for months before you even left Stain, but I assume you had a big influence in finally getting it through. Basically, what I'm seeing is that Xirt and Droklar are the 2 people that get to choose who stays, and Xirt hasn't been aggressive in fighting since he got his battleship (used to be one hell of a BB pilot, I must say), and has been about the same as the Backwaters and NGRUs that I'm assuming youre pushing to kick, except he's loud and gets respect somehow, and Droklar's just about the weirdest bastard I've ever spoken to (dont think thats offensive, but man he's just odd)
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:04:00 - [37] By Statement I meant the entire opening post Maasu. It is quite confusing and contradicts itself a fair bit, I honestly couldn't get the sense of what you were trying to say. I understand you were lauding teamwork and then attacking some of your team-mates? Something like that? And then the line about "filling your politics with useless bureacracy" ... not sure what that means. And then you are saying you're "sick" but not greedy but you are for the tax I think? You lost me I'm afraid ;) JF Public Forum
Jade Constantine	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:04:00 - [38] By Statement I meant the entire opening post Maasu. It is quite confusing and contradicts itself a fair bit, I honestly couldn't get the sense of what you were trying to say. I understand you were lauding teamwork and then attacking some of your team-mates? Something like that? And then the line about "filling your politics with useless bureacracy" ... not sure what that means. And then you are saying you're "sick" but not greedy but you are for the tax I think? You lost me I'm afraid ;) JF Public Forum
Sabercat	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:14:00 - [39] Originally by: Pa1nbringr and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks Ain't that the truth
Sabercat	Posted - 2004.08.23 23:14:00 - [40] Originally by: Pa1nbringr and even if someone left CA, they wouldn't want to be under FA, FA just sucks Ain't that the truth
Nilit	Posted - 2004.08.24 00:52:00 - [41] The only message I got from original post is : "Greedy miners in my alliance suck" spread over 9 paragraphs. Have I missed something important ? Like a point of this thread is ... ? Arguing with EVE customer support is like chatting up stewardess on the plane - you know you're not gonna get any , but it's still hella fun trying
Nilit	Posted - 2004.08.24 00:52:00 - [42] The only message I got from original post is : "Greedy miners in my alliance suck" spread over 9 paragraphs. Have I missed something important ? Like a point of this thread is ... ? Arguing with EVE customer support is like chatting up stewardess on the plane - you know you're not gonna get any , but it's still hella fun trying
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 01:42:00 - [43] Edited by: Primer Xenius on 24/08/2004 01:44:52 The choice that must be made for the CA mining corps is if they are prepared to give these belligerent PVPers 20% of their mining so they can continue to make wars and have their fun in eve. Entirely my view here but I would have a little probem with this. Firstly, the belligerent leadership has CA at war with just about everyone. Secondly, while these PVPer expect you to mine in CA space to support them, they couldn't give a toss about actually defending you. They are out in FA space on raids or else where and have posted repeatedly that defending CA space is not fun and over rated. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 01:42:00 - [44] Edited by: Primer Xenius on 24/08/2004 01:44:52 The choice that must be made for the CA mining corps is if they are prepared to give these belligerent PVPers 20% of their mining so they can continue to make wars and have their fun in eve. Entirely my view here but I would have a little probem with this. Firstly, the belligerent leadership has CA at war with just about everyone. Secondly, while these PVPer expect you to mine in CA space to support them, they couldn't give a toss about actually defending you. They are out in FA space on raids or else where and have posted repeatedly that defending CA space is not fun and over rated. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
EternalDark	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:17:00 - [45] What is the #1 priority of any enemy? -To kill, maime, pillage, and plunder. -If this rout fails, as it has because eve does not allow alliances to be destroyed under duress. -Plan B. is to discredit, discourage, inflict losses in moral, divide and conquor. To the enemies of the CA, these forums, and your critical remarks on them are meaningless. We will continue to fight you all, on these forums and with our battle hardened men and women in game. Remember Jade and Bob, just because you know nothing about whats going on doesn't mean you have to speak on it.
EternalDark	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:17:00 - [46] What is the #1 priority of any enemy? -To kill, maime, pillage, and plunder. -If this rout fails, as it has because eve does not allow alliances to be destroyed under duress. -Plan B. is to discredit, discourage, inflict losses in moral, divide and conquor. To the enemies of the CA, these forums, and your critical remarks on them are meaningless. We will continue to fight you all, on these forums and with our battle hardened men and women in game. Remember Jade and Bob, just because you know nothing about whats going on doesn't mean you have to speak on it.
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:38:00 - [47] which would be a damn sight more than they currently do for the CA, which is a grand total of 2 things - mine all the rares, and die to prop up hopeless pvp'ers kill counts (eg, FA) ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:38:00 - [48] which would be a damn sight more than they currently do for the CA, which is a grand total of 2 things - mine all the rares, and die to prop up hopeless pvp'ers kill counts (eg, FA) ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
Walking Contradiction	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:40:00 - [49] Remember who's creating all these enemies for you....the PVP corps.
Walking Contradiction	Posted - 2004.08.24 02:40:00 - [50] Remember who's creating all these enemies for you....the PVP corps.
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 03:05:00 - [51] Edited by: Primer Xenius on 24/08/2004 03:07:39 Quote: which would be a damn sight more than they currently do for the CA, which is a grand total of 2 things - mine all the rares, and die to prop up hopeless pvp'ers kill counts (eg, FA) Got to love the complete and utter lack of respect for the miners within CA You better listen to the man, you CA miners are scum and give us a bad kill ratio in the war but we will forget this as long as you pay us badass PVPer ISK so we can keep having fun. Oh..and we are not going to defend you. Defending CA is boring. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 03:05:00 - [52] Edited by: Primer Xenius on 24/08/2004 03:07:39 Quote: which would be a damn sight more than they currently do for the CA, which is a grand total of 2 things - mine all the rares, and die to prop up hopeless pvp'ers kill counts (eg, FA) Got to love the complete and utter lack of respect for the miners within CA You better listen to the man, you CA miners are scum and give us a bad kill ratio in the war but we will forget this as long as you pay us badass PVPer ISK so we can keep having fun. Oh..and we are not going to defend you. Defending CA is boring. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Darodem	Posted - 2004.08.24 03:14:00 - [53] It is a very difficult thing to unite the routine miner types and the Mob. The one thing that both share is some connection with the alliance territory. If the Mob is outside the territory and disconnected from the true motivations of the alliance then the Mob asks for tribute without providing real security... well just stew in your own juices, you only have yourself to blame.. it seems there is no end to the pilots who will pay for safety and no end to those who don't have it.
Darodem	Posted - 2004.08.24 03:14:00 - [54] It is a very difficult thing to unite the routine miner types and the Mob. The one thing that both share is some connection with the alliance territory. If the Mob is outside the territory and disconnected from the true motivations of the alliance then the Mob asks for tribute without providing real security... well just stew in your own juices, you only have yourself to blame.. it seems there is no end to the pilots who will pay for safety and no end to those who don't have it.
st0ned	Posted - 2004.08.24 05:15:00 - [55] rather silly question for a n00b like me , but what exactly stops the CA corps from refining in the Non conquerable npc stations in curse ?
st0ned	Posted - 2004.08.24 05:15:00 - [56] rather silly question for a n00b like me , but what exactly stops the CA corps from refining in the Non conquerable npc stations in curse ?
Amthor	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:25:00 - [57] Edited by: Amthor on 24/08/2004 06:59:28 Do any of you tards have a timeline of when these events took place and a clue as to why? (other than we are ebil pirates.) No, I don't think you do. Edit: My personal views and not of my corp Gunship, you're absolutly right.. For a wounded man shall say to his assailant "If I live, I will kill you, if I die, you are forgiven." Such is the rule of honor.
Amthor	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:25:00 - [58] Edited by: Amthor on 24/08/2004 06:59:28 Do any of you tards have a timeline of when these events took place and a clue as to why? (other than we are ebil pirates.) No, I don't think you do. Edit: My personal views and not of my corp Gunship, you're absolutly right.. For a wounded man shall say to his assailant "If I live, I will kill you, if I die, you are forgiven." Such is the rule of honor.
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:25:00 - [59] Edited by: JaiMaster on 24/08/2004 06:26:50 Id have said "eg, XETIC" but I dont think even hardcore miners can die to players who still havnt figured out that you cant kill anything except roids with mining lasers... and you wonder why XETIC get no respect at all... trying to talk the talk, when the closest youve come to walking the walk was being pushed around like a rag doll ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:25:00 - [60] Edited by: JaiMaster on 24/08/2004 06:26:50 Id have said "eg, XETIC" but I dont think even hardcore miners can die to players who still havnt figured out that you cant kill anything except roids with mining lasers... and you wonder why XETIC get no respect at all... trying to talk the talk, when the closest youve come to walking the walk was being pushed around like a rag doll ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
Gunship	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:51:00 - [61] Maasui, there is a CA forum where you can discuss this, so why post here I don't see your point nor do I understand your post any better than Jade... Anyway I would perfer a PM on the CA forum, this is really no bussiness of anyone else than the CA CCP Petition!
Gunship	Posted - 2004.08.24 06:51:00 - [62] Maasui, there is a CA forum where you can discuss this, so why post here I don't see your point nor do I understand your post any better than Jade... Anyway I would perfer a PM on the CA forum, this is really no bussiness of anyone else than the CA CCP Petition!
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:09:00 - [63] BobGhengisKhan, do you know anything of which you speak? Quote: I never saw them fly with other corps in their alliance Referring to our days in the SA we were the most active PvP corp. With as many times as you ran from us I would think you would remember. We fought in every major engagement of the SA and in the CA offensive. Quote: they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space And what do you know from the outside looking in? SA was territorial from its foundation which we were part of the original four founding corps. After months of strip mining their territories the other corps had run out while we had prudently reserved ours. Once theirs was depleted by their strip mining greed they decided it was time to "redistrict" all of stain. Even one of your "caliber" can see the treachery in this action. Removed flaming - Orestes Quote: Droklar's just about the weirdest bastard I've ever spoken to (dont think thats offensive, but man he's just odd) From someone of your "limitations" I'll gladly wear that mantle. Most people are followers unwilling or unable to do what must be done to lead. The vast majority do not have the motivation, self confidence in their ideas and decisions or shy away from confrontation with those they believe to be wrong. So anyone that rises above that "norm" would statistically be "odd" to someone like you. Some will scream "omg he's so arrogant" or "what an arse to say something like that". However some will realize the truth in what I said. They are probably leader personalities. Some facts: Not all but many mining corps have not contributed jack to the CA. They do not respond to call to arms or provide discounted minerals or products. So what exactly do they do to contribute to the alliance? Could this possibly be a reason as to why the CA fighters do not give a crap about defending them? Hmmm... The proposed refining tax would be paid by ALL corps including PvP corps and the benefits from those taxes would be used to benefit the entire alliance. Since any Council member can submit a proposal as to how the funds should be used and the Council would then vote approval or denial on these proposals I personally cant see how this can be viewed as "unfair". The governments are able to do large scale projects because of revenue systems such as this and that is the goal.
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:09:00 - [64] BobGhengisKhan, do you know anything of which you speak? Quote: I never saw them fly with other corps in their alliance Referring to our days in the SA we were the most active PvP corp. With as many times as you ran from us I would think you would remember. We fought in every major engagement of the SA and in the CA offensive. Quote: they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space And what do you know from the outside looking in? SA was territorial from its foundation which we were part of the original four founding corps. After months of strip mining their territories the other corps had run out while we had prudently reserved ours. Once theirs was depleted by their strip mining greed they decided it was time to "redistrict" all of stain. Even one of your "caliber" can see the treachery in this action. Removed flaming - Orestes Quote: Droklar's just about the weirdest bastard I've ever spoken to (dont think thats offensive, but man he's just odd) From someone of your "limitations" I'll gladly wear that mantle. Most people are followers unwilling or unable to do what must be done to lead. The vast majority do not have the motivation, self confidence in their ideas and decisions or shy away from confrontation with those they believe to be wrong. So anyone that rises above that "norm" would statistically be "odd" to someone like you. Some will scream "omg he's so arrogant" or "what an arse to say something like that". However some will realize the truth in what I said. They are probably leader personalities. Some facts: Not all but many mining corps have not contributed jack to the CA. They do not respond to call to arms or provide discounted minerals or products. So what exactly do they do to contribute to the alliance? Could this possibly be a reason as to why the CA fighters do not give a crap about defending them? Hmmm... The proposed refining tax would be paid by ALL corps including PvP corps and the benefits from those taxes would be used to benefit the entire alliance. Since any Council member can submit a proposal as to how the funds should be used and the Council would then vote approval or denial on these proposals I personally cant see how this can be viewed as "unfair". The governments are able to do large scale projects because of revenue systems such as this and that is the goal.
Lord Draco	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:33:00 - [65] Allow me to translate that for Bob: Please go find the nearest cow and tip it over.
Lord Draco	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:33:00 - [66] Allow me to translate that for Bob: Please go find the nearest cow and tip it over.
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:34:00 - [67] Bob, you naughty boy, you interrupted Dukes agent running in north Lonetrek and made him come to the forums. He'll now use real-life comparisons in a really cool way to proof that he can never ever be wrong and anyone disagreeing with him must obviously be a miner of the highest order. Then he'll try to tax you. OC have always been arrogant and annoying and I think CA are finding out exactly what made the rest of Stain want rid of them. LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:34:00 - [68] Bob, you naughty boy, you interrupted Dukes agent running in north Lonetrek and made him come to the forums. He'll now use real-life comparisons in a really cool way to proof that he can never ever be wrong and anyone disagreeing with him must obviously be a miner of the highest order. Then he'll try to tax you. OC have always been arrogant and annoying and I think CA are finding out exactly what made the rest of Stain want rid of them. LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:47:00 - [69] Edited by: Duke Droklar on 24/08/2004 07:54:37 Yes Josh I do run about 5 hours of research agents per week... your point? Few people in eve have lead as many combat ops as myself. You should try PvP sometime, you might like it. Bob: I see, now its the voice? Well you keep thinking of things about "what you REALLY meant to say" and get back to me on that. DnD, wtf are you rambling about? Oh wait, you don't really know either do you?
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:47:00 - [70] Edited by: Duke Droklar on 24/08/2004 07:54:37 Yes Josh I do run about 5 hours of research agents per week... your point? Few people in eve have lead as many combat ops as myself. You should try PvP sometime, you might like it. Bob: I see, now its the voice? Well you keep thinking of things about "what you REALLY meant to say" and get back to me on that. DnD, wtf are you rambling about? Oh wait, you don't really know either do you?
Colonel Mustard	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:57:00 - [71] First lets get some obvious flamebait diepensed with : Yes, im posting with an alt, and I am not a CA, FA, SA , XETIC, PA or any other alliance member, never have been. Its very interesting from an outsiders point of view to see which corps that are the most abusive and vocal in this discussion and others considering mining. VOTF and Omega corp post a lot on all the threads about the new tax and seem very upset that anyone is having an opinion about CA policies. As I understand it VOTF and Omega are also two of the larger and most active PvP corps in CA. It is clear that they both will be beneficiaries of the new policy. So why is it neccessary to flame everyone with a different opinion ? The contempt and sometimes hatred for miners that is expressed amazes me. What exactly is it that miners do that rouses those feelings ? There is a lot of talk about the "greedy miners" from pvp people. And in the next breath they say that they too mine. It seems like quite a double standard to me to in one sentence brand all miners as greedy good-only-for-taxation leeches, and in the next sentence talk about how you also have to pay the tax when you mine. Does this mean that some CA miners are more equal than others ?
Colonel Mustard	Posted - 2004.08.24 07:57:00 - [72] First lets get some obvious flamebait diepensed with : Yes, im posting with an alt, and I am not a CA, FA, SA , XETIC, PA or any other alliance member, never have been. Its very interesting from an outsiders point of view to see which corps that are the most abusive and vocal in this discussion and others considering mining. VOTF and Omega corp post a lot on all the threads about the new tax and seem very upset that anyone is having an opinion about CA policies. As I understand it VOTF and Omega are also two of the larger and most active PvP corps in CA. It is clear that they both will be beneficiaries of the new policy. So why is it neccessary to flame everyone with a different opinion ? The contempt and sometimes hatred for miners that is expressed amazes me. What exactly is it that miners do that rouses those feelings ? There is a lot of talk about the "greedy miners" from pvp people. And in the next breath they say that they too mine. It seems like quite a double standard to me to in one sentence brand all miners as greedy good-only-for-taxation leeches, and in the next sentence talk about how you also have to pay the tax when you mine. Does this mean that some CA miners are more equal than others ?
Lord Draco	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:12:00 - [73] Originally by: Colonel Mustard As I understand it VOTF and Omega are also two of the larger and most active PvP corps in CA. It is clear that they both will be beneficiaries of the new policy. So why is it neccessary to flame everyone with a different opinion ? First off, everyone will benefit. I am for it 100%. Infact, I had the idea months ago. Second, nobody likes to hear opinions based off fction do they? Third, if you arent any of the related corps, why post with an alt?
Lord Draco	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:12:00 - [74] Originally by: Colonel Mustard As I understand it VOTF and Omega are also two of the larger and most active PvP corps in CA. It is clear that they both will be beneficiaries of the new policy. So why is it neccessary to flame everyone with a different opinion ? First off, everyone will benefit. I am for it 100%. Infact, I had the idea months ago. Second, nobody likes to hear opinions based off fction do they? Third, if you arent any of the related corps, why post with an alt?
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:14:00 - [75] Colonel Mustard, I will address your question/statement without flames. Everyone in the game must aquire their ships through mining, production, piracy or some other means of income... thats a given. The difference is when it comes to defense or offense needs of the alliance. The PvP corps drop what they're doing and respond to the calls to arms while far too many mining corps simply log off or just continue about their little mining ops. Now answer this: if a mining corp doesnt field combat pilots and ships to help defend the alliance, it doesnt provide discounted minerals or products to alliance members and all it does is mine to line its corp wallet, then what exactly do they contribute to an alliance? Now I expect some to say well try this or try that to get them to contribute in some way but understand that the CA has tried many different things and nothing has changed. Beyond all the PvP vs Miner issues, this would be instituted if CA was ONLY PvP corps. The reason is simple, this will build a large CA fund that will benefit the alliance and the PvP corps aren't in this for getting rich but to be a part of something larger. We all know that certain things coming in shiva are going to require great wealth to take advantage of and that is only one facet of what this will make possible. So take the miner corps out of the equation and the PvP corps would still do the same thing, after all, we will paying that same 20% tax whether there are any miners or not.
Duke Droklar	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:14:00 - [76] Colonel Mustard, I will address your question/statement without flames. Everyone in the game must aquire their ships through mining, production, piracy or some other means of income... thats a given. The difference is when it comes to defense or offense needs of the alliance. The PvP corps drop what they're doing and respond to the calls to arms while far too many mining corps simply log off or just continue about their little mining ops. Now answer this: if a mining corp doesnt field combat pilots and ships to help defend the alliance, it doesnt provide discounted minerals or products to alliance members and all it does is mine to line its corp wallet, then what exactly do they contribute to an alliance? Now I expect some to say well try this or try that to get them to contribute in some way but understand that the CA has tried many different things and nothing has changed. Beyond all the PvP vs Miner issues, this would be instituted if CA was ONLY PvP corps. The reason is simple, this will build a large CA fund that will benefit the alliance and the PvP corps aren't in this for getting rich but to be a part of something larger. We all know that certain things coming in shiva are going to require great wealth to take advantage of and that is only one facet of what this will make possible. So take the miner corps out of the equation and the PvP corps would still do the same thing, after all, we will paying that same 20% tax whether there are any miners or not.
dalman	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:40:00 - [77] Originally by: Duke Droklar Quote: they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space And what do you know from the outside looking in? SA was territorial from its foundation which we were part of the original four founding corps. After months of strip mining their territories the other corps had run out while we had prudently reserved ours. Once theirs was depleted by their strip mining greed they decided it was time to "redistrict" all of stain. Even one of your "caliber" can see the treachery in this action. Yes, OC contributed alot to SA PvP, at least at the time just before you left. And I was sad to see you leave, only having good relations to OC members. But this about strip mining I can not take. You in OC alone had much more bistot fields in your territory than the total amount in the area MASS and SGE shared. And you know we made lots of experiments to determine how the roids would regrow as fast as possible. At one time, we stripped an entire system to 0 to see how it would regrow. And with that I don't just talk about bistot. I'm talking about all roids, Veldspar and scor etc. And including spending time to find all 'hidden roids' outside of the grids. And in general, only 1 person in MASS was allowed to mine bistot in our area. That was our mining director with his 2 accounts. And he kept a list of every single bistot roid in the area, EACH day scanning them all and writing down how big they were. If the corp was to do a mining op we went down to the regions below stain, 40+ jumps from our HQ and ~15 jumps from closest station. Yes, your area was far from empire. I don't know if you liked that or hated it, since it's bad to have to travel that long to empire, but good since enemies very rarely came to see you (and back then pre-castor you didn't really have to go to empire for anything but buying skills). And you can say you had worked hard for your area and that you think you deserved to have it. But don't give me some bull**** about how the other corps strip mined while you alone were clever (when I bet you really only mean EV). M.I.A. since 2004-07-30
dalman	Posted - 2004.08.24 08:40:00 - [78] Originally by: Duke Droklar Quote: they left over a disagreement of sharing Alliance space And what do you know from the outside looking in? SA was territorial from its foundation which we were part of the original four founding corps. After months of strip mining their territories the other corps had run out while we had prudently reserved ours. Once theirs was depleted by their strip mining greed they decided it was time to "redistrict" all of stain. Even one of your "caliber" can see the treachery in this action. Yes, OC contributed alot to SA PvP, at least at the time just before you left. And I was sad to see you leave, only having good relations to OC members. But this about strip mining I can not take. You in OC alone had much more bistot fields in your territory than the total amount in the area MASS and SGE shared. And you know we made lots of experiments to determine how the roids would regrow as fast as possible. At one time, we stripped an entire system to 0 to see how it would regrow. And with that I don't just talk about bistot. I'm talking about all roids, Veldspar and scor etc. And including spending time to find all 'hidden roids' outside of the grids. And in general, only 1 person in MASS was allowed to mine bistot in our area. That was our mining director with his 2 accounts. And he kept a list of every single bistot roid in the area, EACH day scanning them all and writing down how big they were. If the corp was to do a mining op we went down to the regions below stain, 40+ jumps from our HQ and ~15 jumps from closest station. Yes, your area was far from empire. I don't know if you liked that or hated it, since it's bad to have to travel that long to empire, but good since enemies very rarely came to see you (and back then pre-castor you didn't really have to go to empire for anything but buying skills). And you can say you had worked hard for your area and that you think you deserved to have it. But don't give me some bull**** about how the other corps strip mined while you alone were clever (when I bet you really only mean EV). M.I.A. since 2004-07-30
Colonel Mustard	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:05:00 - [79] Edited by: Colonel Mustard on 24/08/2004 09:15:04 Thank you Duke Droklar for the informative, flame free and to the point answer. Your post is probably the most informative one so far in this thread As for mining corps participation in alliance activities I see your point, of course they should contribute somehow. On the other hand if CA is a pvp-based alliance, why even allow pure mining corps in it ? Maybe you are better off by ejecting them and keeping the roids for yourselves ? And the reason Im using an alt is of course the non-nice attitude some CA members display on the forums. Ive spoken with enough CA people that I know that you arent all evil and vindictive. Sadly many of the forum posters often display a certain tendency to flame and threaten anyone who comments on anything CA-related. Admirable loyalty of course, but sometimes quite misguided. And I am not looking for more enemies to come looking for me just because Im curious.
Colonel Mustard	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:05:00 - [80] Edited by: Colonel Mustard on 24/08/2004 09:15:04 Thank you Duke Droklar for the informative, flame free and to the point answer. Your post is probably the most informative one so far in this thread As for mining corps participation in alliance activities I see your point, of course they should contribute somehow. On the other hand if CA is a pvp-based alliance, why even allow pure mining corps in it ? Maybe you are better off by ejecting them and keeping the roids for yourselves ? And the reason Im using an alt is of course the non-nice attitude some CA members display on the forums. Ive spoken with enough CA people that I know that you arent all evil and vindictive. Sadly many of the forum posters often display a certain tendency to flame and threaten anyone who comments on anything CA-related. Admirable loyalty of course, but sometimes quite misguided. And I am not looking for more enemies to come looking for me just because Im curious.
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:22:00 - [81] Quote: Id have said "eg, XETIC" but I dont think even hardcore miners can die to players who still havnt figured out that you cant kill anything except roids with mining lasers... and you wonder why XETIC get no respect at all... trying to talk the talk, when the closest youve come to walking the walk was being pushed around like a rag doll I'm guessing by that forum warrior glow that your a CA PVPer. As such, I doubt you would know much about what goes on in CA space because your never there. I don't mind your lack of respect. I mean, if anyone should get respect here its CA. I mean you * started a war with those miners in XIF by breaking the NAP. * you failed in all three of publicly posted war objectings. Quote: 1.) XETIC formally and completely surrenders to CA, after Terms of Surrender are written up and agreed upon. 2.) XETIC disbands itself and no longer attacks CA or any of its affiliates. 3.) The CA leaders and CA itself, declare the war as over, and declare victory, at suchtime, if XETIC still lives, A new NAP will be proposed and Peace talks can commense. * CA space is largely empty of CA forces. Our mining teams are complaining that they are not getting podded enough there these days. * CA is a mess with all the internal classes and divisions (20% tax on your 'useless' miners..leave if you don't like it is a fine example). Whats there not to be proud off. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:22:00 - [82] Quote: Id have said "eg, XETIC" but I dont think even hardcore miners can die to players who still havnt figured out that you cant kill anything except roids with mining lasers... and you wonder why XETIC get no respect at all... trying to talk the talk, when the closest youve come to walking the walk was being pushed around like a rag doll I'm guessing by that forum warrior glow that your a CA PVPer. As such, I doubt you would know much about what goes on in CA space because your never there. I don't mind your lack of respect. I mean, if anyone should get respect here its CA. I mean you * started a war with those miners in XIF by breaking the NAP. * you failed in all three of publicly posted war objectings. Quote: 1.) XETIC formally and completely surrenders to CA, after Terms of Surrender are written up and agreed upon. 2.) XETIC disbands itself and no longer attacks CA or any of its affiliates. 3.) The CA leaders and CA itself, declare the war as over, and declare victory, at suchtime, if XETIC still lives, A new NAP will be proposed and Peace talks can commense. * CA space is largely empty of CA forces. Our mining teams are complaining that they are not getting podded enough there these days. * CA is a mess with all the internal classes and divisions (20% tax on your 'useless' miners..leave if you don't like it is a fine example). Whats there not to be proud off. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Reverend Necrona	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:28:00 - [83] Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Reverend Necrona
Reverend Necrona	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:28:00 - [84] Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Reverend Necrona
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:54:00 - [85] Quote: Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 09:54:00 - [86] Quote: Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1" - Lallante
Dolemite2K	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:03:00 - [87] Originally by: Primer Xenius Quote: Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut dude your xetic. i can count on 1 hand how many people acually cares what you have to say ----------------------------------------------- Life is like a long poo that you have to take a bite of every day
Dolemite2K	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:03:00 - [88] Originally by: Primer Xenius Quote: Get off high horse PX, Xetic standing on the shoulders of Stain. Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut dude your xetic. i can count on 1 hand how many people acually cares what you have to say ----------------------------------------------- Life is like a long poo that you have to take a bite of every day
Svarun	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:12:00 - [89] Originally by: Primer Xenius Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut Your "facts" are based on outdated secondhand information. Thats what ****es people off. Your ramblings are really not much better than those of BobGhengis - ie its all biased, even fictional crap.
Svarun	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:12:00 - [90] Originally by: Primer Xenius Funny how I took the care not to lay claim to anything in my post. Just pointed out facts to illustrate how little anyone cares about whether or not we have the respect of your typically delusional CA forum numbnut Your "facts" are based on outdated secondhand information. Thats what ****es people off. Your ramblings are really not much better than those of BobGhengis - ie its all biased, even fictional crap.
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:15:00 - [91] Quote: Your "facts" are based on outdated secondhand information. Thats what ***es people off. Your ramblings are really not much better than those of BobGhengis - ie its all biased, even fictional crap. Your welcome to correct me. Thats what the forums are for. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1"* - Lallante
Primer Xenius	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:15:00 - [92] Quote: Your "facts" are based on outdated secondhand information. Thats what ***es people off. Your ramblings are really not much better than those of BobGhengis - ie its all biased, even fictional crap. Your welcome to correct me. Thats what the forums are for. "we all know CA planned to attack Xetic "when the time was right" from day1"* - Lallante
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:15:00 - [93] The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! Shiva is coming and i for one can¦t wait, it¦s going to be so much fun and so costly if you fail to see this, plz get a crystalball! "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:15:00 - [94] The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! Shiva is coming and i for one can¦t wait, it¦s going to be so much fun and so costly if you fail to see this, plz get a crystalball! "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:19:00 - [95] Well, since the moderators are on a rampage I'll repost here for posterity... After sifting through all the replies throughout the various threads herein, those of us who are concerned about this have decided action must be taken, but not in haste. Within the coming week, possibly more, as we are still in negotiations and discussion, we will announce the departure of a minimum of 3, and as many as 7+ corporations from the Curse Alliance. These people include not only the best miners the Alliance had to offer but many of it's best PVP'ers, who will bring their military expertise with them. As I said, talks are still ongoing but the amount of support received IN game for this is vastly different than the vocal few of curse here on the boards. Those corps that do not leave outright, will find many sympathetic members leaving with us and bolstering our numbers. I'd like to thank all of you who have messaged me in support of my statements here, when I logged on this character today I was shocked by the number of "how can I help" type messages received from fellow alliance members. Perhaps there is hope for us yet, it seems the "military" isn't quite as strong as it likes to believe it is in light of it's outlandish greed. The silent majority have finally spoken. This has been a long time coming, I'm glad this issue has finally brought it to light. That said, we have not decided if we will claim Curse as our home (probably not), or find refuge in one of it's more northern territories where ore is better, but watch the game and boards for our time comes soon. I would urge the greedy loyalists of this soon to be divided empire to think about the ramifications of what is to come and though we hope we can plan for peace, know that we plan for war. Thank you all for you tremendous support, I didn't know what I was getting into when I first posted here, but I'm glad I did.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:19:00 - [96] Well, since the moderators are on a rampage I'll repost here for posterity... After sifting through all the replies throughout the various threads herein, those of us who are concerned about this have decided action must be taken, but not in haste. Within the coming week, possibly more, as we are still in negotiations and discussion, we will announce the departure of a minimum of 3, and as many as 7+ corporations from the Curse Alliance. These people include not only the best miners the Alliance had to offer but many of it's best PVP'ers, who will bring their military expertise with them. As I said, talks are still ongoing but the amount of support received IN game for this is vastly different than the vocal few of curse here on the boards. Those corps that do not leave outright, will find many sympathetic members leaving with us and bolstering our numbers. I'd like to thank all of you who have messaged me in support of my statements here, when I logged on this character today I was shocked by the number of "how can I help" type messages received from fellow alliance members. Perhaps there is hope for us yet, it seems the "military" isn't quite as strong as it likes to believe it is in light of it's outlandish greed. The silent majority have finally spoken. This has been a long time coming, I'm glad this issue has finally brought it to light. That said, we have not decided if we will claim Curse as our home (probably not), or find refuge in one of it's more northern territories where ore is better, but watch the game and boards for our time comes soon. I would urge the greedy loyalists of this soon to be divided empire to think about the ramifications of what is to come and though we hope we can plan for peace, know that we plan for war. Thank you all for you tremendous support, I didn't know what I was getting into when I first posted here, but I'm glad I did.
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:20:00 - [97] Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:20:00 - [98] Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Orestes	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:20:00 - [99] Keep this thread clean or don't keep it at all Join the IC!
Orestes	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:20:00 - [100] Keep this thread clean or don't keep it at all Join the IC!
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:24:00 - [101] Originally by: Kulach Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it /sighs I post the same so it doesn't get lost, I want CA to see that though a vocal few speak of how much everybody agrees, it is very much not the case, and that change is coming. No flames and bad language please, I'd prefer a civilized debate on the issue of seperation, maybe it can be something other than yet another war nobody wants.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:24:00 - [102] Originally by: Kulach Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it /sighs I post the same so it doesn't get lost, I want CA to see that though a vocal few speak of how much everybody agrees, it is very much not the case, and that change is coming. No flames and bad language please, I'd prefer a civilized debate on the issue of seperation, maybe it can be something other than yet another war nobody wants.
Svarun	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:25:00 - [103] Edited by: Svarun on 24/08/2004 10:27:31 Originally by: Primer Xenius Your welcome to correct me. Thats what the forums are for. Fair enough, here is the correction - CA space is far from empty, as a matter of fact, last week has seen a return of Curse PVPers to our homegrounds. Majority is already there, more are arriwing every hour. There, I hope you will now stop with "empty curse space", "poor miners having to defend themselves", "curse pvpers never being home" (the last one is funny - we spent last 4-6 months defending curse space from moo, evol, sa, atuk, xetic then we go on one major campaign in enemy space and you start yelling the "CA pvpers are never in curse!!!111one") and other similar nonsense.
Svarun	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:25:00 - [104] Edited by: Svarun on 24/08/2004 10:27:31 Originally by: Primer Xenius Your welcome to correct me. Thats what the forums are for. Fair enough, here is the correction - CA space is far from empty, as a matter of fact, last week has seen a return of Curse PVPers to our homegrounds. Majority is already there, more are arriwing every hour. There, I hope you will now stop with "empty curse space", "poor miners having to defend themselves", "curse pvpers never being home" (the last one is funny - we spent last 4-6 months defending curse space from moo, evol, sa, atuk, xetic then we go on one major campaign in enemy space and you start yelling the "CA pvpers are never in curse!!!111one") and other similar nonsense.
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:30:00 - [105] Originally by: Fergal Originally by: Kulach Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it /sighs I post the same so it doesn't get lost, I want CA to see that though a vocal few speak of how much everybody agrees, it is very much not the case, and that change is coming. No flames and bad language please, I'd prefer a civilized debate on the issue of seperation, maybe it can be something other than yet another war nobody wants. Maybe you should have acted smarter and put up your reply on the private CA forums instead of posting with an alt on the public boards then. After all this was taken up in several meetings and discussed (in the longest bloody meeting I ever seen by the way). After all the alliance voted on this and it got through. If you got a problem with that just leave, there is no need to have a tantrum on these boards about it. Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:30:00 - [106] Originally by: Fergal Originally by: Kulach Edited by: Kulach on 24/08/2004 10:23:11 Well as you post the same as you did in the last post this one is probably be locked too No go and cry somewhere else alt boy... EDIT Orestes beat me to it /sighs I post the same so it doesn't get lost, I want CA to see that though a vocal few speak of how much everybody agrees, it is very much not the case, and that change is coming. No flames and bad language please, I'd prefer a civilized debate on the issue of seperation, maybe it can be something other than yet another war nobody wants. Maybe you should have acted smarter and put up your reply on the private CA forums instead of posting with an alt on the public boards then. After all this was taken up in several meetings and discussed (in the longest bloody meeting I ever seen by the way). After all the alliance voted on this and it got through. If you got a problem with that just leave, there is no need to have a tantrum on these boards about it. Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:33:00 - [107] It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board.
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:33:00 - [108] It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board.
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:36:00 - [109] Originally by: Fergal It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board. Well perhaps CA was not the alliance you should have been in then in the first place. It's very simple really. The whole this was taken up in meetings, then discussed and a decision was taken. If you do not agree with a decision taken in a council meeting then perhaps no alliance at all is suitable for you. Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:36:00 - [110] Originally by: Fergal It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board. Well perhaps CA was not the alliance you should have been in then in the first place. It's very simple really. The whole this was taken up in meetings, then discussed and a decision was taken. If you do not agree with a decision taken in a council meeting then perhaps no alliance at all is suitable for you. Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:41:00 - [111] Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 10:41:00 - [112] Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:00:00 - [113] Originally by: Werlii Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? I am at work and bored Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:00:00 - [114] Originally by: Werlii Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? I am at work and bored Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
DREAMWORKS	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:10:00 - [115] Originally by: Kulach Originally by: Werlii Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? I am at work and bored moan working.. moan __________________________ http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html
DREAMWORKS	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:10:00 - [116] Originally by: Kulach Originally by: Werlii Kulach! Why even bother arguing with altie, you at work or just bored? I am at work and bored moan working.. moan __________________________ http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html
Sardau Kar	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:18:00 - [117] Quote: The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! There is no present,every moment is the past,and the future is to come. Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system.
Sardau Kar	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:18:00 - [118] Quote: The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! There is no present,every moment is the past,and the future is to come. Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system.
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:25:00 - [119] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! There is no present,every moment is the past,and the future is to come. Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system. bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. Come up with something different will ya as this one is getting boring? Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Kulach	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:25:00 - [120] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: The past is of no importance, The present is just a way to get to the FUTURE! There is no present,every moment is the past,and the future is to come. Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system. bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. Come up with something different will ya as this one is getting boring? Just because something is fixed doesn't mean you can't break it
Skogul	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:29:00 - [121] Originally by: crice Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Your really are a coward aren't you. I can't believe your still posting with an alt bashing people. Too bad CCP can't let us know who you are, I am sure any alliance would be disgusted to have a worm like you in their ranks... Very sad. I have to agree with Crice here - if you're going to point out what's wrong, it's the honorable thing to do to be public and open about it. In other words, if you can't say it with your main character, don't say it at all. Have some guts - there IS life after CA, I promise you. Anyway, Crice is right, you're being rather weaselly.
Skogul	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:29:00 - [122] Originally by: crice Originally by: Fergal That's pretty much all your are as of yesterday. Get used to wearing your new colors. Your really are a coward aren't you. I can't believe your still posting with an alt bashing people. Too bad CCP can't let us know who you are, I am sure any alliance would be disgusted to have a worm like you in their ranks... Very sad. I have to agree with Crice here - if you're going to point out what's wrong, it's the honorable thing to do to be public and open about it. In other words, if you can't say it with your main character, don't say it at all. Have some guts - there IS life after CA, I promise you. Anyway, Crice is right, you're being rather weaselly.
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:30:00 - [123] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system. Ohh so you need a fleet to protect you when mining! "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Werlii	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:30:00 - [124] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: Oh and,I havent seen a single CA mining op with protection.All I got in local was threats to log off and go play with alts untill we left the system. Ohh so you need a fleet to protect you when mining! "No One Can Hear You Scream In Space"
Sardau Kar	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:35:00 - [125] Quote: bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. A bunch of miners fleeing from a gank-squad is not to be blamed.But why keep denying the truth?
Sardau Kar	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:35:00 - [126] Quote: bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. A bunch of miners fleeing from a gank-squad is not to be blamed.But why keep denying the truth?
Skogul	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:42:00 - [127] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. A bunch of miners fleeing from a gank-squad is not to be blamed.But why keep denying the truth? It's called "doublespeak" ... (I think I'm messing up my Orwell here, please forgive me). FREEDOM = SLAVERY WAR = PEACE COORS LIGHT = BEER and other assorted nonsense.
Skogul	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:42:00 - [128] Originally by: Sardau Kar Quote: bla bla bla bla CA have no protection bla bla bla bla as usual. A bunch of miners fleeing from a gank-squad is not to be blamed.But why keep denying the truth? It's called "doublespeak" ... (I think I'm messing up my Orwell here, please forgive me). FREEDOM = SLAVERY WAR = PEACE COORS LIGHT = BEER and other assorted nonsense.
The Ratfink	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:43:00 - [129] top pvp'ers in the alliance? rotflmao if your not in the top 10 of the kill lists you can suck my left nut saq also being the top miners in the alliance too? as far as im aware we don't have a "miner" support system for the pvp players the ones that defend curse have to do both mine for their own losses and defend curse sooner you get your ass out of the alliance that is if your even an alt of any real CA corp then the better or if your some sort of alt nub for some other alliance you can go back to suckin my left nut saq
The Ratfink	Posted - 2004.08.24 11:43:00 - [130] top pvp'ers in the alliance? rotflmao if your not in the top 10 of the kill lists you can suck my left nut saq also being the top miners in the alliance too? as far as im aware we don't have a "miner" support system for the pvp players the ones that defend curse have to do both mine for their own losses and defend curse sooner you get your ass out of the alliance that is if your even an alt of any real CA corp then the better or if your some sort of alt nub for some other alliance you can go back to suckin my left nut saq
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 19:38:00 - [131] Bitterness will get you nowhere, in fact, from your tone I daresay you're worried. In related news, another corp has decided to follow our banner, an official post will be made soon :)
Fergal	Posted - 2004.08.24 19:38:00 - [132] Bitterness will get you nowhere, in fact, from your tone I daresay you're worried. In related news, another corp has decided to follow our banner, an official post will be made soon :)
Reverend Necrona	Posted - 2004.08.25 16:40:00 - [133] Originally by: Fergal It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board. EH? Like anti ca need _MORE_ public support? OH WAIT YOUR NOT EVEN CA. Reverend Necrona
Reverend Necrona	Posted - 2004.08.25 16:40:00 - [134] Originally by: Fergal It's difficult to drum up public support for an action like the one we intend to undertake on a private board. EH? Like anti ca need _MORE_ public support? OH WAIT YOUR NOT EVEN CA. Reverend Necrona
Tristan	Posted - 2004.08.25 17:35:00 - [135] Edited by: Tristan on 25/08/2004 17:38:06 The only thing of interest in this whole thread is that ratfink has a "left nut saq" which also suggests he has a "right nut saq" and i would suggest Ratfink you see a doctor immediately matey. As for the Flame posts in this thread... yeah whatever. yawn.
Tristan	Posted - 2004.08.25 17:35:00 - [136] Edited by: Tristan on 25/08/2004 17:38:06 The only thing of interest in this whole thread is that ratfink has a "left nut saq" which also suggests he has a "right nut saq" and i would suggest Ratfink you see a doctor immediately matey. As for the Flame posts in this thread... yeah whatever. yawn.

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