Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Sethcrantwo
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 06:51:00 -
[1]
So, I've been scanning for a while now, and found something that seems quite valuable, a Guristas Provincial HQ. Wiki'd it and it says it's all rare and I definitely realize that I am having a hard time scanning it out. After taking almost an hour, I finally get it to 100% signal strength ( it's my first time scanning ), but when I right click on it, I do not get an option to warp to it like I have other scanning sites once I got to 100%.
In short, is it bugged? Do I need to be pixel perfect and the game is really just rounding up to 100% even when it isn't there yet? Or do I just need better skills at this point? ( I have astrometrics 2, and astroprecision 1, that's all ).
|
SentryRaven
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 06:54:00 -
[2]
A trick that helps:
Try to place 4 probes in a perfect tetrahedron with the signature in the center of said tetrahedron.
Works for me in 99% of all cases... --------
EBANK Forum Manager | KIA Recruiting Director |
Sethcrantwo
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 06:56:00 -
[3]
They pretty much are atm... In fact, they are pixels apart on my screen at max zoomed in, and it took me quite some time to get them that way ( had to get them ******edly close together to get 100% )
|
Farrellus Cameron
Sturmgrenadier Inc Skunk-Works
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 06:57:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Farrellus Cameron on 15/04/2009 06:57:58 You can get 100% without it being warpable if you are not hitting it with all four probes. You need both 100% AND four probes hitting it. You can actually get a 100% hit with a single probe if it is at 0.25 AU range and sitting on top of the signature, but it won't make it warpable.
Edit: Also, your probes need to be placed AROUND the target. If your probes are too close to each other on top of the signature then they will not triangulate the position and give you a warpable signature. ----------------------------------------------------
|
SentryRaven
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 06:59:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Sethcrantwo They pretty much are atm... In fact, they are pixels apart on my screen at max zoomed in, and it took me quite some time to get them that way ( had to get them ******edly close together to get 100% )
I have found that the closer I get, the worse the results are. You don't need to be close for the tetrahedron and be able to hit the signature with all 4 probes. --------
EBANK Forum Manager | KIA Recruiting Director |
Sethcrantwo
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 07:02:00 -
[6]
I am using 4 probes, and have 1 target, that isn't the issue :)
And the reason they are so close together, is because it had to be. I started with them quite far apart, and slowly moved them closer and closer. slowly I got 95%, 97%, 98%, 99%, 99.1%, 99.2%... etc until 100%. I don't think with my skills I am capable doing this any further than they are. I do notice that when they get too close, the signal strength drops off all of a sudden, but I've been working to get them pixel perfect with 100% strength.
|
SentryRaven
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 07:05:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Sethcrantwo I am using 4 probes, and have 1 target, that isn't the issue :)
I know what you are saying. This was my problem at first as well. Since someone told me about the tetrahedron arrangement, I have been able to hit signatures 100% and warp to them. --------
EBANK Forum Manager | KIA Recruiting Director |
Sethcrantwo
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 07:13:00 -
[8]
My probes were, and have been in a tetrahedron since I first started using them. I'm quite sure the shape of their arrangement isn't the issue :)
And it's not the first thing that I've scanned out, just the hardest thing so far. By far.
|
Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 07:27:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Sethcrantwo My probes were, and have been in a tetrahedron since I first started using them. I'm quite sure the shape of their arrangement isn't the issue :)
And it's not the first thing that I've scanned out, just the hardest thing so far. By far.
Hold shift and move the probes around on the horizontal plane ever so slightly. if this doesnt work keep trying in all possible directions, but only moving them ever so slighty. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
|
Wet Ferret
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 07:44:00 -
[10]
If your probes are too close together, it's possible some may be considered overlapped. Optimally, they should be spread out so the dot is between the probe itself and the edge of the sphere for each probe.
Other than that, not sure what could be wrong.
But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started. |
|
Kale Kold
Caldari Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 08:07:00 -
[11]
Probing is incredibly anal now and has been nerfed beyond use in PvP. Carebears get their way again.
|
Varrakk
Phantom Squad Atlas Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 08:26:00 -
[12]
Its because your 100% isnt 100%. Just rounded up from 99.something.
|
Tamahra
24th Imperial Crusade
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 08:37:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Tamahra on 15/04/2009 08:40:11 Edited by: Tamahra on 15/04/2009 08:39:28
Originally by: Sethcrantwo My probes were, and have been in a tetrahedron since I first started using them. I'm quite sure the shape of their arrangement isn't the issue :)
And it's not the first thing that I've scanned out, just the hardest thing so far. By far.
it always helps to being able to launch more than just 4 probes (skills can let you launch up to 8 simultaneously)
but since you can only launch 4 i assume, and have the signature already at 100%, your doing something wrong here.
You said your already placing them in a tetrahedron. but your probes are most likely (if not definately) to close to the signature now. try to increase the size of the tetrahedron a bit, so that you can put the probes as far from the signature icon as possible, but with each probe still overlapping with the 100% icon (100% means its definately there where it shows up, you just cant warp to it. but each probe will definately still overlap with it if you put them farther away, thus you cannot lose the signature again)
|
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 08:41:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Kale Kold Probing is incredibly anal now and has been nerfed beyond use in PvP. Carebears get their way again.
Onoz! I have to use player skill and can't buy it off the market! WAAAH! ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in =v=… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
Blue Harrier
Gallente IMPERIAL SENATE
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 10:11:00 -
[15]
Do you actually have a green dot that shows the position of the æhitÆ or most likely have a small red (very faint) ring hidden somewhere within the globes of your probes.
I always found if I had a 100% score but could not warp to it, it was because there was no æhitÆ marker just the red ring. By adjusting your probes to intersect with the edge of the ring the marker would appear and you could then warp to it.
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 10:35:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 15/04/2009 10:38:11
Originally by: Blue Harrier Do you actually have a green dot that shows the position of the æhitÆ or most likely have a small red (very faint) ring hidden somewhere within the globes of your probes.
This.
If you have a green dot you should be able to warp there.
If you have a yellow dot and a 100% scan strength that means it's 99.99% rounded up (never happened to me though, so it might be that when the 99.99% is rounded up it shows an unwarpable green dot. In this case I would definitely bug report it).
If you don't have either, it means you have only a very small ring, which in turn means your probes are too clustered. It's theoretically possible to obtain excellent scans by placing the probes in the right positions at few km from the signature, but wiht deviation and imperfect graphic display, the closer you go the more likely it is that you'll be placing them in the wrong positions, thus reducing the probes effectively employed for scan. All this and more can be found in the proper thread.
|
Kale Kold
Caldari Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 10:47:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Tippia Onoz! I have to use player skill and can't buy it off the market! WAAAH!
Player skill? That won't help scanning in PvP, what does matter is speed and stealth! i.e. getting the probed out quickly (getting 3-4 out is not quick), scan the target down so he's warpable to, then destroy probe! 'cos you can bet he is watching the scanner. I could do all the above with lvl5 in everything in about 22-23 seconds using the old system. Now i would like to see you get anywhere near that using 3/4 probes with the new system!!!
A: You aren't going to be quick enough. B: Your probes light up the scanner, i mean who doesn't notice 4 probes suddenly clustering around them? C: The interface is just not good enough. D: Did i mention it's not quick enough? Oh and now he's changed safe spot! Start again!
I notice by your corp your into exploration? Well i guess its okay for you to spend a few minutes tinkering with the scanner to find some carebear stuff but when lives and ships depend on it, the new scanner is too anal and too slow!
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 11:19:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kale Kold
Originally by: Tippia Onoz! I have to use player skill and can't buy it off the market! WAAAH!
Player skill? That won't help scanning in PvP, what does matter is speed and stealth!
I agree that there are some issues related to pvp scans, but some of your arguments are the worst I have ever seen.
Originally by: Kale Kold 'cos you can bet he is watching the scanner.
I thought the directional scanner had a maximum range? It's not like you are stuck with a 5AU range...
Originally by: Kale Kold Now i would like to see you get anywhere near that using 3/4 probes with the new system!!!
Maybe doing the most part of it outside the scanner range?
You are still applying the old categories to the new system. Instead try to put some effort to not let your probes be seen until the last moment. THAT takes player skill. Quite a lot, if you ask me.
|
Tippia
Raddick Explorations BlackWater.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 11:36:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Kale Kold Player skill? That won't help scanning in PvP, what does matter is speed and stealth!
…and player skills allows you to have both, for instance by getting your probes out and hidden before you begin the process, by using overlapping sets of probes (one set to scan, one set to hunt), and by taking advantage of the fact that you can still scan for ships from wa-a-ay outside their directional scanner range.
Yes, the process of launching and putting your probes in formation is a bit fiddly, but once you have them out there (and if you reuse your probes by moving them out of the way rather than destroying them), the scan process itself can be very very fast… ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in =v=… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
Sethcrantwo
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 15:09:00 -
[20]
Alrighty, ended up going to sleep because of not being able to figure it out.
I started with them on the edges. I had something like a 50% signal when they were within the edges of their .25 AU spheres, all overlapping them. I got a single hit at this point. I then moved them closer and closer together, slowly. All told, I spent 2 hours trying this thing. I definitely had 1 green unwarpable dot, and I definitely started with my probes in a tetrahedron very far apart. I continued moving them closer together until I got 100%, which took well over an hour itself, and by this time, they were pixels apart, almost on top of each other. Perhaps my skills just aren't good enough to do this at the distance it should be done?
|
|
Kale Kold
Caldari Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 15:14:00 -
[21]
Put your money where your mouth is!
Come to TXW-EI tonight and try and probe me down. I'll stay for 42 seconds in each safe spot to give you twice the time needed by the old probe system and see if you can find me. *yeah right* The reality is you wouldn't even find which quadrant i was in.
The new system is crapola and anyone who says differently hasn't used it in PvP!!!
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 15:56:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 15/04/2009 16:01:07
Originally by: Kale Kold The new system is crapola and anyone who says differently hasn't used it in PvP!!!
1) Your sentence implies that "scan in pvp" = "new system". If you had said something like "the new system is crapola for pvp" you might have been closer to some semblance of truth.
2) Alas, "closer" is not necessarily "close". It really depends on what type of "pvp" you are referring to. While the new system might make things more difficult in finding safespots, it makes things much easier in finding mission runners, with much less chances to be detected by directional scanner.
3) If you bothered to read, you might have read this:
Originally by: Space Wanderer I agree that there are some issues related to pvp scans,
The problem is not that there are no issues with pvp probing, it's just that you are saying it using arguments that hold no water, and that contradict each other. For instance your argument about the directional scanner was, shall we say, "not very well thought out"? If you think that it is enough to emorage to convince people of your point feel free to go ahead.
4) While it might be an issue for you, it is currently AS DESIGNED. It is devs intent, as greyscale stated multiple times, to make it that hard to find people continously flying between safespots.
|
Frobos
Weird Cat Research Zombie Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 16:03:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kale Kold ...The reality is you wouldn't even find which quadrant i was in...
I must agree with this comment to some degree. I have tried to use the new probes in lowsec combat and for a single ship it is nearly impossible to scan them down and get a warp-to signature...if they keep moving every 30-60 seconds.
Almost every time, it can take me at least 60 seconds, if not longer, to set range and position on all four probes. I've even dropped the max of eight probes, using a few at large ranges and others at low. Activating long rage group to get rough location and activating short range to narrow down. Didn't really help with speed much. Just more buttons to click.
However, the new probe system can still be effective I think. Especially when just trying to find the blob that is either forming up or regrouping as they tend to sit still long enough. Same thing with mission runners. But, basically, as mentioned, it is far easier for ppl to use directional scanner to see my probes before I find them using said probes.
Now, being devil's advocate, the 42 ISK question I have is.....was the old scanning method simply TOO EASY :-\
Oh yeah, so much for the OP's question about not able to warp to a 100% sig.
|
Marrrk
Vanquish Inc
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 16:08:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Kale Kold
The new system is crapola and anyone who says differently hasn't used it in PvP!!!
The old system was lame and far too easy, It turned scanning from an art form to a launch and click system that didnt need any player skill at all.
The new system has taken us someway back to the very old system - it at least needs some player skill i.e placing probes and triangulation etc.
|
Kale Kold
Caldari Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 17:25:00 -
[25]
Thank $Deity that someone else with PvP xp agrees!!! So your all not carebears around here! phew!
Originally by: Marrrk The new system has taken us someway back to the very old system - it at least needs some player skill i.e placing probes and triangulation etc.
Yes, and about as much fun as sticking a pencil in your eye repeatedly.
The old system was more FUN to use! and you had atleast a chance of probing a target down.
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 07:22:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Kale Kold Thank $Deity that someone else with my type of PvP xp agrees!!!
Fixed that. Every pirate hunting mission runners would disagree. Do you want to imply they don't pvp?
|
Research Shizzle
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 07:32:00 -
[27]
It sounds like you're close, have you tried upgrading the equipment you're using to Faction? Sisters Probes and Launchers both give a sig strength bonus. Upgrading to Faction kit might be enough to put you over the edge to being able to warp there....aside from training the scanning skills up another level or two. Also try using scan rigs if you don't have them already. Just my .02 ISK
|
Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr No Applicable Corporation
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 07:42:00 -
[28]
It always struck me, how it was easier in the old system to find a tiny ship in a massive system, than it was to find a large gas cloud or hacking location. Something about tracking down a small moving target ...
I like the new system. Well, I take that back. I liked the original system, and when they put in the crap that was the last system, I completely lost interest in probing. I could still find a safespot using the damn onboard scanner, if I had to. The last system was probably the stupidest thing CCP ever came up with. Never should exploration be so damned boring and repetitive that you are recommended to grab a book while your doing it.
The new system is heads over heels better in almost every category, and most complaints can be categorized into the "I don't like change" crowd (and very few of us do, I admit) or the "I don't like how more players are using probes now" crowd, who are more focused on their loss of popularity with the streamlining and logical reprocessing of a bugged and idiotic system.
The one category where I feel the new system is lacking, is in fact the scanning of a ship. That said, I'm not sure if I care. My only suggestion would be to 'group' signals due to relation in space.
The idea is that if two ships are within 10k of each other, they create enough density to make their 'signal' stronger. A fleet, in this conclusion, would have a massive signal and would be very easily found.
Finding a lone group, or a small gang, SHOULD be difficult. Finding a large body of ships, however, would be easy.
You could even escalate this concept, and allow players to 'mask' their signals with celestial bodies. Gas clouds, asteroids, moons, etc.
Originally by: 5pinDizzy Troll Score-o-Meter --------Failure----------|||-----------Succes------- 10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1--0--1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10
|
Miilla
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 09:19:00 -
[29]
It shouldnt report 100% if its not 100% warpable.
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |