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Corp thieving getting out of hand

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Psycho Doughboy	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:00:00 - [1] It seems that more and more corps recently have had ceo's or directors run off with the corp holdings. The entire corp holdings. With Shiva this will become impossible and it seems many bit thieves, knowing that their pinching will be found out, are now robbing corps of their entire assets. Yes I know this is part of the 'game mechanics' supposedly. But corps of 100 members have been cleaned out like this. Result 50-60 people leave the game! Surely CCP must classify this sort of looting as an exploit now given the changes they are making to stop it from happening.
Psycho Doughboy	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:00:00 - [2] It seems that more and more corps recently have had ceo's or directors run off with the corp holdings. The entire corp holdings. With Shiva this will become impossible and it seems many bit thieves, knowing that their pinching will be found out, are now robbing corps of their entire assets. Yes I know this is part of the 'game mechanics' supposedly. But corps of 100 members have been cleaned out like this. Result 50-60 people leave the game! Surely CCP must classify this sort of looting as an exploit now given the changes they are making to stop it from happening.
slothe	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:07:00 - [3] corp theft can be truly devastating to a corp i know. Its not just part of the "game mechanics" im afraid its part of the game. The best wayof avoiding it is to hold your own assetts whenever possibly. I do accept that this can become difficult with joint corp assetts like blueprints. However in that situation you just have to be able to trust your corp. Ive been in 3 main corps so far, and never experienced major corp theft, id like to think because i have joined good corps with trustworthy members. I think the average age of my corp helps as most people are mid-late 20's so are much less likely to steal items, which can be a childish trait. Say hello on our forum @www.aserea.com or join our public channel ingame "MLM Public" http://www.khainestar.com/eve
slothe	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:07:00 - [4] corp theft can be truly devastating to a corp i know. Its not just part of the "game mechanics" im afraid its part of the game. The best wayof avoiding it is to hold your own assetts whenever possibly. I do accept that this can become difficult with joint corp assetts like blueprints. However in that situation you just have to be able to trust your corp. Ive been in 3 main corps so far, and never experienced major corp theft, id like to think because i have joined good corps with trustworthy members. I think the average age of my corp helps as most people are mid-late 20's so are much less likely to steal items, which can be a childish trait. Say hello on our forum @www.aserea.com or join our public channel ingame "MLM Public" http://www.khainestar.com/eve
TAKI OKAWA	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:16:00 - [5] Originally by: slothe corp theft can be truly devastating to a corp i know. Its not just part of the "game mechanics" im afraid its part of the game. The best wayof avoiding it is to hold your own assetts whenever possibly. I do accept that this can become difficult with joint corp assetts like blueprints. However in that situation you just have to be able to trust your corp. Ive been in 3 main corps so far, and never experienced major corp theft, id like to think because i have joined good corps with trustworthy members. I think the average age of my corp helps as most people are mid-late 20's so are much less likely to steal items, which can be a childish trait. You think stealing from corp is only confined to those who are below 20's? ================================================== Its not the size of dog in the fight but the size of fight in the dog which matters ==================================================
TAKI OKAWA	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:16:00 - [6] Originally by: slothe corp theft can be truly devastating to a corp i know. Its not just part of the "game mechanics" im afraid its part of the game. The best wayof avoiding it is to hold your own assetts whenever possibly. I do accept that this can become difficult with joint corp assetts like blueprints. However in that situation you just have to be able to trust your corp. Ive been in 3 main corps so far, and never experienced major corp theft, id like to think because i have joined good corps with trustworthy members. I think the average age of my corp helps as most people are mid-late 20's so are much less likely to steal items, which can be a childish trait. You think stealing from corp is only confined to those who are below 20's? ================================================== Its not the size of dog in the fight but the size of fight in the dog which matters ==================================================
slothe	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:19:00 - [7] Edited by: slothe on 29/08/2004 11:21:47 Originally by: slothe which can be a childish trait. i didnt say that only younger members steal. i would, however, generally trust younger members less as a rule. Say hello on our forum @www.aserea.com or join our public channel ingame "MLM Public" http://www.khainestar.com/eve
slothe	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:19:00 - [8] Edited by: slothe on 29/08/2004 11:21:47 Originally by: slothe which can be a childish trait. i didnt say that only younger members steal. i would, however, generally trust younger members less as a rule. Say hello on our forum @www.aserea.com or join our public channel ingame "MLM Public" http://www.khainestar.com/eve
Mario Rebelknight	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:21:00 - [9] well dude, when people vote with their feet and quit the game it hurts CCP. In this game it takes ****loads of time to come back from a heavy loss. One thief can destroy 100 peoples enjoyment of the game. If 50-60 of them leave every corp this happens to CCP starts to feel it. BAD. Lets face it a battleship bpo can be a huge investment. If someone walks with it, then its a huge blow to a corp. Look it should be able to happen, but the problem is, pre Shiva its really easy to do it. And even with Shiva, if a CEO does it no one can stop them. CCP need to resolve this issue. Otherwise peeps are going to keep on walking away.
Mario Rebelknight	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:21:00 - [10] well dude, when people vote with their feet and quit the game it hurts CCP. In this game it takes ****loads of time to come back from a heavy loss. One thief can destroy 100 peoples enjoyment of the game. If 50-60 of them leave every corp this happens to CCP starts to feel it. BAD. Lets face it a battleship bpo can be a huge investment. If someone walks with it, then its a huge blow to a corp. Look it should be able to happen, but the problem is, pre Shiva its really easy to do it. And even with Shiva, if a CEO does it no one can stop them. CCP need to resolve this issue. Otherwise peeps are going to keep on walking away.

The Mariachi	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:21:00 - [11] Originally by: slothe Edited by: slothe on 29/08/2004 11:21:47 Originally by: slothe which can be a childish trait. i didnt say that only younger members steal. i would, however, generally trust younger members less as a rule. Best thing to do is to hang onto BPOs of important items yourself. Place BPCs in the corporate BP hangar if you don't particularly trust the manufacturing players. Sure, takes more time and is a bit more inconvenient, but at least it offers peace of mind. Mariachi A person's signature often reveals one's character, and sometimes one's name
The Mariachi	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:21:00 - [12] Originally by: slothe Edited by: slothe on 29/08/2004 11:21:47 Originally by: slothe which can be a childish trait. i didnt say that only younger members steal. i would, however, generally trust younger members less as a rule. Best thing to do is to hang onto BPOs of important items yourself. Place BPCs in the corporate BP hangar if you don't particularly trust the manufacturing players. Sure, takes more time and is a bit more inconvenient, but at least it offers peace of mind. Mariachi A person's signature often reveals one's character, and sometimes one's name
Psycho Doughboy	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:28:00 - [13] Ok lets say you got the one goon who has been robbing you from the start. You trust this guy. Over the past 6 months you have built a great corp and you have 100 members. loads of bpo's and battleships in the burner. maybe you even make this guy CEO. Then he sees that Shiva will show up all his pilfering. You know the blackbird here, taking the 10% cut of mega there, that sort of thing. So he decides. Screw this. I'm running off with the lot. He takes all the shares. Fires everyone in the corp and empties the hangers. What do you do then? CCP need to classify this as exploiting because it is happening to too many corps in the recent past pre Shiva and people are quitting en masse because of it. So CCP has to choose. Is it game mechanics? Or is it an exploit that will ruin the game for everyone.
Psycho Doughboy	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:28:00 - [14] Ok lets say you got the one goon who has been robbing you from the start. You trust this guy. Over the past 6 months you have built a great corp and you have 100 members. loads of bpo's and battleships in the burner. maybe you even make this guy CEO. Then he sees that Shiva will show up all his pilfering. You know the blackbird here, taking the 10% cut of mega there, that sort of thing. So he decides. Screw this. I'm running off with the lot. He takes all the shares. Fires everyone in the corp and empties the hangers. What do you do then? CCP need to classify this as exploiting because it is happening to too many corps in the recent past pre Shiva and people are quitting en masse because of it. So CCP has to choose. Is it game mechanics? Or is it an exploit that will ruin the game for everyone.
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:35:00 - [15] The safest thing to do is actually to start a corp with real life friends. You can trust them and you know where they live... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.08.29 11:35:00 - [16] The safest thing to do is actually to start a corp with real life friends. You can trust them and you know where they live... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Tech2 Shoppe	Posted - 2004.08.29 12:07:00 - [17] Originally by: The Mariachi Best thing to do is to hang onto BPOs of important items yourself. Place BPCs in the corporate BP hangar if you don't particularly trust the manufacturing players. Sure, takes more time and is a bit more inconvenient, but at least it offers peace of mind. Maria Problem is, if he himself then rns off with the stuff, all the others are screwed.
Tech2 Shoppe	Posted - 2004.08.29 12:07:00 - [18] Originally by: The Mariachi Best thing to do is to hang onto BPOs of important items yourself. Place BPCs in the corporate BP hangar if you don't particularly trust the manufacturing players. Sure, takes more time and is a bit more inconvenient, but at least it offers peace of mind. Maria Problem is, if he himself then rns off with the stuff, all the others are screwed.
Nafri	Posted - 2004.08.29 12:11:00 - [19] it should be possible to "mark" modules/BP marked modules/BP can only be used by members of the corp which marked the module/BP. If someone leaves the corp and takes the BP/module thy are useless for him because he cant use them at all or even sell them. this allows you to give your fleet guys expansive items without the danger of getting ripped of as a whole and it still allows you to damage corps with alts, since you can take the BP away, but you dont profit from it well, nafri's thoughts Wanna fly with me?
Nafri	Posted - 2004.08.29 12:11:00 - [20] it should be possible to "mark" modules/BP marked modules/BP can only be used by members of the corp which marked the module/BP. If someone leaves the corp and takes the BP/module thy are useless for him because he cant use them at all or even sell them. this allows you to give your fleet guys expansive items without the danger of getting ripped of as a whole and it still allows you to damage corps with alts, since you can take the BP away, but you dont profit from it well, nafri's thoughts Wanna fly with me?

Omega Man	Posted - 2004.08.29 15:12:00 - [21] the corp should not own joint assets. consider any jointly owned assets in the corp hangar as basically likely to be stolen at any moment. the assets of the corp should be the combined assets of the corp members, who retain control of those assets within their own personal hangers. I know many corps strive to get that first BPO with a group effort. That is fine, but it should be something you are willing to have stolen (ie dont buy an APOC BPO first off, if you are a little corp). This group effort should not be, lets go mine, stuff all the minerals in the hangar, sell 'em and buy the BPO for the corp. It should be, this BPO will cost 1million isk. The first 10 people that put up 100k will "own" the BPO. Those then get a tenth of the BPC that are made from this BPO every week. Then those 10 people start buying each other out. The person that has bought all ten shares of the BPO gets the BPO and puts it in their hangar. Yes, it is cumbersome, so avoid the whole thing about corp shared property and just wait till individuals are rich enough to own the stuff, if you cannot be bothered. Either way, think about how to remove the problem of "corp owned property" there is no such thing, it is just stuff waiting to be nicked and cause a lot of grief.
Omega Man	Posted - 2004.08.29 15:12:00 - [22] the corp should not own joint assets. consider any jointly owned assets in the corp hangar as basically likely to be stolen at any moment. the assets of the corp should be the combined assets of the corp members, who retain control of those assets within their own personal hangers. I know many corps strive to get that first BPO with a group effort. That is fine, but it should be something you are willing to have stolen (ie dont buy an APOC BPO first off, if you are a little corp). This group effort should not be, lets go mine, stuff all the minerals in the hangar, sell 'em and buy the BPO for the corp. It should be, this BPO will cost 1million isk. The first 10 people that put up 100k will "own" the BPO. Those then get a tenth of the BPC that are made from this BPO every week. Then those 10 people start buying each other out. The person that has bought all ten shares of the BPO gets the BPO and puts it in their hangar. Yes, it is cumbersome, so avoid the whole thing about corp shared property and just wait till individuals are rich enough to own the stuff, if you cannot be bothered. Either way, think about how to remove the problem of "corp owned property" there is no such thing, it is just stuff waiting to be nicked and cause a lot of grief.
Dao 2	Posted - 2004.08.29 15:44:00 - [23] how about u can have certain items in the hanger that cant be taken out by a member? only installed in factories or lab. this status of course can be removed by the ceo, someone mentioned this i think, not sure who sorry >< also maybe u can also have 'flag' items so they can be removable by certain ppl in the corp
Dao 2	Posted - 2004.08.29 15:44:00 - [24] how about u can have certain items in the hanger that cant be taken out by a member? only installed in factories or lab. this status of course can be removed by the ceo, someone mentioned this i think, not sure who sorry >< also maybe u can also have 'flag' items so they can be removable by certain ppl in the corp
Omega Man	Posted - 2004.08.29 16:03:00 - [25] it does not solve the problem of the CEO clearing out the corp hangars.
Omega Man	Posted - 2004.08.29 16:03:00 - [26] it does not solve the problem of the CEO clearing out the corp hangars.
Syphin	Posted - 2004.08.29 16:24:00 - [27] Shiva-ness As far as i know these rules apply to CEO as well. But still all the precautions are put upon the player. If you do not trust your CEO or directors then just leave the corporation. There will always be things in eve out of your control so best thing to do is play with the best group of people you can find and have fun. If s$!% hits the fan you just have to roll with it. - - - - - - - Disclaimer I take no responsibility for the spelling or grammar usage in the above statement Nor do i agree with its ideas and or claims Or even acknowledge its existance.
Syphin	Posted - 2004.08.29 16:24:00 - [28] Shiva-ness As far as i know these rules apply to CEO as well. But still all the precautions are put upon the player. If you do not trust your CEO or directors then just leave the corporation. There will always be things in eve out of your control so best thing to do is play with the best group of people you can find and have fun. If s$!% hits the fan you just have to roll with it. - - - - - - - Disclaimer I take no responsibility for the spelling or grammar usage in the above statement Nor do i agree with its ideas and or claims Or even acknowledge its existance.
MaiLina KaTar	Posted - 2004.08.29 17:08:00 - [29] I actually showed this game to more than 20 of my RL friends by now. Quite a few of them were interested in the game but hearing some stories about people robbing others, destroying months and in some cases more than a year of solid "gaming-work" was (amongst a few others) a reason for them to not start playing Eve (believe it or not). People I live with prefer to play games where the players can't grief each other as heavily and as personally as you can in EvE... hence I'm still playing this game with lots of people but none of them are "RL-friends" which I find pretty sad. In my opinion corp theft should've been classified as cheating right from the start and everyone doing it should've been banned without hesitation. How am I as a CEO supposed to prove that I trust my members and am willing to share authority with them when I have no tools whatsoever to prevent corp theft from happening? Personally I am happy because I have people in my corp that have proven to be trustworthy many times by now but other CEOs might not have these members and I feel really really sorry for them as they have to deal with all this bull** when really they should be enjoying the game. To some of y'all corp theft might sound cool and mysterious and you might see it as part of the game or whatever but I think that only lasts until you've experienced it yourself. Just ask yourself how you'd feel when everything you've played for during the last 11 months is gone and you find out that it has been stolen by someone you saw as a trusted friend. No matter how naive one might be. Stuff like this should never happen in a game** that's supposed to be fun and IMHO the devs must do everything they can to prevent stuff like this from happening which means that if they can't provide the tools to prevent corp theft they must ban corpthieves and mark corptheft as a clear exploit. Mai's Idealog
MaiLina KaTar	Posted - 2004.08.29 17:08:00 - [30] I actually showed this game to more than 20 of my RL friends by now. Quite a few of them were interested in the game but hearing some stories about people robbing others, destroying months and in some cases more than a year of solid "gaming-work" was (amongst a few others) a reason for them to not start playing Eve (believe it or not). People I live with prefer to play games where the players can't grief each other as heavily and as personally as you can in EvE... hence I'm still playing this game with lots of people but none of them are "RL-friends" which I find pretty sad. In my opinion corp theft should've been classified as cheating right from the start and everyone doing it should've been banned without hesitation. How am I as a CEO supposed to prove that I trust my members and am willing to share authority with them when I have no tools whatsoever to prevent corp theft from happening? Personally I am happy because I have people in my corp that have proven to be trustworthy many times by now but other CEOs might not have these members and I feel really really sorry for them as they have to deal with all this bull** when really they should be enjoying the game. To some of y'all corp theft might sound cool and mysterious and you might see it as part of the game or whatever but I think that only lasts until you've experienced it yourself. Just ask yourself how you'd feel when everything you've played for during the last 11 months is gone and you find out that it has been stolen by someone you saw as a trusted friend. No matter how naive one might be. Stuff like this should never happen in a game** that's supposed to be fun and IMHO the devs must do everything they can to prevent stuff like this from happening which means that if they can't provide the tools to prevent corp theft they must ban corpthieves and mark corptheft as a clear exploit. Mai's Idealog



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