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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Malphilos
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:03:00 -
[31] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote: All games that come pre-nerfed to be carebear friendly always fail because there is simply no challenge,
Which clearly explains the utter failure of WoW.
I suggest your analysis may be incomplete.
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
513
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:12:00 -
[32] - Quote
Ask ccp greyscale about turning highsec into trammel with his new crimewatch system. |
clixor
Celluloid Gurus
13
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:15:00 -
[33] - Quote
As PVP in general is so freakking exciting. Gate camping for hours on end only to be blobbed to death. |
Twulf
The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact
49
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:20:00 -
[34] - Quote
Sri Nova wrote:Vaju Enki wrote:I sincerely hope not, but carebears are indeed the MMO cancer, they ruined UO (and every other good MMO in the market, see SWG). just curious how did care bears ruin swg ? i always thought sony is what killed swg .
Sony had nothing to do with it. The owner of Star Wars demanded that Sony change the game to be more like WOW because they wanted WOW like numbers instead of the numbers SWG had. It got blamed on Sony because gamers are stupid and never see the truth.
UO was a fun game but EQ was better, the PVP servers were amazing and fun and not safe even in cities. |
Twulf
The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact
49
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:24:00 -
[35] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:Vaju Enki wrote:I sincerely hope not, but carebears are indeed the MMO cancer, they ruined UO (and every other good MMO in the market, see SWG). This!!! If any game designer listens to carebears the mmo dies! UO: Carebears whined about getting killed in the unsafe areas so Trammel opened without pvp and everyone left Felluca. The game didn't then have any risk and so no challenge, subs dropped and it died. SWG: Carebears wanted to be a jedi and couldn't be bothered to grind, pvp or explore. Holocrons were issued as a 'gift', Now everybody wanted to be a jedi. Then you *had* to be a jedi to compete in PvP so the NGE was released. This removed most classes and skills, over simplifying the game and gave everyone the option to start as a jedi. The challenge was removed, subs dropped and the game died. DAoC Rogue characters could be invisible on the battlefields, but had to uncloak to attack. Carebears fed up of being killed, even though they new the frontiers were not safe started whining. So they nerfed stealth so you couldn't be invisible and over night masses of characters lost their role and reason for being there. Subs started declining because you couldn't now get any intel and the only option was to zerg, leading to massive stand offs for hours at a time. There was no fear or challenge to the frontiers only blobs. The game become boring and the whole reason of the game PvP (realm combat) was ruined. All games that come pre-nerfed to be carebear friendly always fail because there is simply no challenge, Dungeons and Dragons Warhammer Online Tabula Rasa Final Fantasy XIV Age of Conan Star Wars The Old Republic It just goes on and on. For any online game to succeed there has to be fear, challenge and loss and the satisfaction you get when you beat those and triumph!!!
Depends on what you call fail. WOW has no fear, no challenge and no loss and yet it makes way more money then EVE could ever hope to make and has more subs then CCP could ever dream up having. So to Blizzard and the other 11 million people WOW is anything but a failure but hey lets not let facts get in your way. Rant away with your nonsense and poor logic. |
Joe Skellington
13th Tribe of Kobol Expeditionary
58
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:30:00 -
[36] - Quote
Twulf wrote: Depends on what you call fail. WOW has no fear, no challenge and no loss and yet it makes way more money then EVE could ever hope to make and has more subs then CCP could ever dream up having. So to Blizzard and the other 11 million people WOW is anything but a failure but hey lets not let facts get in your way. Rant away with your nonsense and poor logic.
Oh god, wow started failing hard when Activision took the helm, you were right pre-Lichking. As it stands now, wow is losing subs left and right. Blizzard even made it free to play up to level 20 because it's getting so bad. Their online store is selling in-game pets like no tomorrow. -á-á |\__/|-á -á/ @ @ \ -á-á -á( > -¦ < )-á -á`-+-+x-½-½-¦ -á-á / O \ |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
415
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:33:00 -
[37] - Quote
Graic Gabtar wrote:Joran Dravius wrote:Graic Gabtar wrote:Can someone explain what the **** you are talking about so we can start trolling? Try being older than 12. Then you'll have heard of it. Give me a break, I mean what does it have to do with EVE. I was playing UO, when it was only U and on a C64.
Wormholes: The *NEW* end game of Eve - Online: No Local. No Lag. No Blues (No Intell Channesl). No Blobs.
NEW FEATURE: NO INCARNA! |
Dessau
40
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:34:00 -
[38] - Quote
This thread warmed my heart.
Vendor buy the bank some guards! CCP. Non-Russians deserve red jackets. As an alternative, I would also accept some form of USA-only content. |
Jon Taggart
State War Academy Caldari State
46
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Posted - 2012.05.07 14:42:00 -
[39] - Quote
Kehro Urgus wrote:*corp por*
*Kal Vas Flam*
Dessau wrote:This thread warmed my heart.
Vendor buy the bank some guards!
I always whispered "Guards!" at the Fel gates so nobody knew it was me! |
Nuela
Beacon Light Corporation Beacon Light Alliance
76
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:00:00 -
[40] - Quote
While I definitely agree with the OP, it isn't quite as easy as having a free for all.
If newbies join and are getting whacked constantly by experienced players as they are trying to learn the game, they will quit. So, some sort of newbie area but it can be very limited.
Having 'industrial' characters being preyed on by 'pirates' is great...but if there are too many pirates instead of industrials then that won't work. Therefore, going an 'industrial' route needs to pay substantially more than a 'pirate' route. There also can be no safe areas for experienced characters to pursue and industrial strategy to fund their pirate toon.
There needs to be regular turnover of the powers-that-be. Games can stagnate if one or a few power blocks control the resources. |
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highonpop
Void.Tech Fatal Ascension
51
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:04:00 -
[41] - Quote
Highsec is safer than ever?
I'm guessing someone was not online last weekend... My post was probably full of typos. I don;t care... |
Metal Icarus
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
133
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:15:00 -
[42] - Quote
So the only way to save EVE is to gank people in high sec?
Hmm.... |
Malen Nenokal
The Nightshift Shadow Cartel
5
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:34:00 -
[43] - Quote
Graic Gabtar wrote:Give me a break, I mean what does it have to do with EVE.
According to the devs, Eve's gameplay is inspired by a mix of Ultima Online, Elite, and Magic the Gathering. CCP would be wise to keep Eve's UOness in line with UO's golden years rather than it's autumn years. |
Aleksander Erkkinen
Southern Cross Empire Flying Dangerous
11
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:46:00 -
[44] - Quote
highonpop wrote:Highsec is safer than ever?
I'm guessing someone was not online last weekend... CONCORD has not always been around like it is now, was not always godlike, and sentry guns? Lol, lets just say gatecamps used to be so bad that CCP had to step in. With an unkillable fleet.
Yes, empire space and highsec have gotten a lot safer. Do your research (especially into m0o's antics and CCP's responses). |
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CCP Soundwave
C C P C C P Alliance
892
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:46:00 -
[45] - Quote
This might have been me, although I'm not sure.
The point I was trying to make is that we don't want the same levels of inflation. That's why we'll do a lot of adjustments that may sometimes feel like nerfs, because we've managed to keeps EVEs economy healthy for 9 years and that needs to continue.
Edit: On a sidenote, I <3 UO very much. |
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Gul'gotha Derv'ash
Occupational Hazzard Ushra'Khan
2
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:53:00 -
[46] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:This might have been me, although I'm not sure.
The point I was trying to make is that we don't want the same levels of inflation. That's why we'll do a lot of adjustments that may sometimes feel like nerfs, because we've managed to keeps EVEs economy healthy for 9 years and that needs to continue.
Edit: On a sidenote, I <3 UO very much.
Bring back the quarterly reports please. What you give us now (which I have seen little to nothing) is trash. |
John Schlong
Productive Prospects Inc.
0
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Posted - 2012.05.07 15:54:00 -
[47] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote: UO: Carebears whined about getting killed in the unsafe areas so Trammel opened without pvp and everyone left Felluca. The game didn't then have any risk and so no challenge, subs dropped and it died.
"whined about getting killed in the unsafe areas" The way things are in EVE right now, EVERY area an UNSAFE area
Kale Kold wrote: SWG: Carebears wanted to be a jedi and couldn't be bothered to grind, pvp or explore. Holocrons were issued as a 'gift', Now everybody wanted to be a jedi. Then you *had* to be a jedi to compete in PvP so the NGE was released. This removed most classes and skills, over simplifying the game and gave everyone the option to start as a jedi. The challenge was removed, subs dropped and the game died.
Hey, it's star wars, everyone wants to be a jedi. What does this have to do with PvP players killing non-PvP players
Kale Kold wrote: DAoC Rogue characters could be invisible on the battlefields, but had to uncloak to attack. Carebears fed up of being killed, even though they new the frontiers were not safe started whining. So they nerfed stealth so you couldn't be invisible and over night masses of characters lost their role and reason for being there. Subs started declining because you couldn't now get any intel and the only option was to zerg, leading to massive stand offs for hours at a time. There was no fear or challenge to the frontiers only blobs. The game become boring and the whole reason of the game PvP (realm combat) was ruined.
"even though they new the frontiers were not safe started whining." Again, this implies that areas OTHER than the frontiers were safe. NO place in EVE is safe right now.
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
612
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:17:00 -
[48] - Quote
Sp basically they need a place to be invulnerable and THEN we can start dying.
Gotcha. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd |
Bane Necran
468
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:19:00 -
[49] - Quote
Degren wrote:Ultima Online was the first sandbox.
I declare this to be the moment when that word became utterly meaningless.
"It's no use crying over spilt milk, because all the forces of the universe were bent on spilling it." ~William Maugham |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
6442
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:33:00 -
[50] - Quote
highonpop wrote:Highsec is safer than ever? I'm guessing someone was not online last weekend... Yes, and last weekend is a good illustration: it's now so safe that a concentrated alliance effort is required to produce a kind of carnage that was almost common-place before.
Gul'gotha Derv'ash wrote:I know it has been said before, but more people play/live in high sec than low/null. GǪand it is just as wrong now as it is before. Characters Gëá people. We have absolutely no information about where people live. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
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Thomas Kreshant
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
65
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:49:00 -
[51] - Quote
Tippia wrote:and it is just as wrong now as it is before. Characters Gëá people. We have absolutely no information about where people live.
I'd like to see a study of that done by CCP.
Just because people view themselves as highsec, lowsec or nullsec players it doesn't mean they are what they believe themselves to be.
The activities they truely spend their time on would reveal to CCP which areas of the game need focus and to be enhanced/developed and as a bonus it would help inform the never ending arguments about who/what/where |
Aleksander Erkkinen
Southern Cross Empire Flying Dangerous
11
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:49:00 -
[52] - Quote
@John Schlong: You seem to be under the impression that just because there are particularly unsafe areas that there must be safe areas. In actuality, while there are extremely unsafe areas (say, in the path of a currently erupting volcanoes = nullsec), there are only safer areas (say, bleeding in the ocean with nearby sharks = hisec). On the one hand, you're guaranteed some harm. On the other, there's always the chance the sharks aren't hungry. Nowhere is safe, but at least there's safer space. That is eve online. |
Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
131
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Posted - 2012.05.07 16:58:00 -
[53] - Quote
Tippia wrote:highonpop wrote:Highsec is safer than ever? I'm guessing someone was not online last weekend... Yes, and last weekend is a good illustration: it's now so safe that a concentrated alliance effort is required to produce a kind of carnage that was almost common-place before. Gul'gotha Derv'ash wrote:I know it has been said before, but more people play/live in high sec than low/null. GǪand it is just as wrong now as it is before. Characters Gëá people. We have absolutely no information about where people live.
You keep saying this on thread after thread, It's a pretty sure bet that if 70-85% of the pilots are in high sec, then the bulk of the player base is there.
I gave up living in null sec because it was simply too time consuming.
I do not think high sec is as safe now as it was when I started playing the game three years ago. Gankers and grievers have gotten better at what they do. I don't mind any of that as long as it is not always at the expense of new players, many of whom get their start by mining.
Blaming carebears and miners for all the problems in the game is utterly missing the point. Part of the reason PVP does not attract that many people is that most of the PVP kills go to pilots with 50 mill plus skill points. I'm not making that up. I read it in one of the last Quarterly Economic Newsletters. When a player achieves that level of skill points, he has PARITY with the players who live in null sec and low sec. That's two and a half years of work just to level the playing feel. If there's a problem with lack of enthusiasm for PVP, the issue starts with the learning curve.
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Ninevite
Shiva GIANTSBANE.
87
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:01:00 -
[54] - Quote
I used to sit in Britain and portal people into the middle of an orc encampment while spamming that it was an idoc |
Tazarak theDeceiver
Hooded Underworld Guys Northern Associates.
22
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:04:00 -
[55] - Quote
I still play UO. My first MMO. Can't bear to ever cancel. |
Twulf
The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact
50
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:07:00 -
[56] - Quote
Joe Skellington wrote:Twulf wrote: Depends on what you call fail. WOW has no fear, no challenge and no loss and yet it makes way more money then EVE could ever hope to make and has more subs then CCP could ever dream up having. So to Blizzard and the other 11 million people WOW is anything but a failure but hey lets not let facts get in your way. Rant away with your nonsense and poor logic.
Oh god, wow started failing hard when Activision took the helm, you were right pre-Lichking. As it stands now, wow is losing subs left and right. Blizzard even made it free to play up to level 20 because it's getting so bad. Their online store is selling in-game pets like no tomorrow.
How are you this stupid? Do you have to work at it or does it come natural?
If you think that CCP would not love to see the "failing hard" that Activision is currently going through you are out of your mind.
CCP would love to have the sub numbers that WOW has. Your crazy if you do not think so.
Also Sooner or later EVE is going to have to be more open to casual solo gamers that want to have "safe" area's this is called evolution, the game changes to match the needs of its player base. More players = good for EVE. EVE will never be 100% safe but it will change from what you Vets think it should be. CCP is the only one that has a say in it. If CCP sees more money and subs in making it more "Carebear" friendly, then they are going to make it more carebear friendly. Its called business. |
Degren
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
280
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:09:00 -
[57] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:Degren wrote:Ultima Online was the first sandbox. I declare this to be the moment when that word became utterly meaningless.
? Passive aggression, huh? -áNo, that's fine. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
6442
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:14:00 -
[58] - Quote
Ban Bindy wrote:You keep saying this on thread after thread, It's a pretty sure bet that if 70-85% of the pilots are in high sec, then the bulk of the player base is there. GǪexcept that it's not.
If 70% of the characters are in highsec, it means that 30% are not. Considering that every account has ~2-+ characters on it on average, and considering the widespread use of Gǣutility altsGǥ, and considering the convenience factor of having an alt in highsec for various purposes, we can quite easily imagine that for every non-highsec character, the same player has a highsec altGǪ
GǪand suddenly those 30% non-highsec characters translate into the game having 60% non-highsec players. The simple fact of the matter is that all we know is how a very na+»ve population statistic looks GÇö the percentage of character sitting in a specific sec level at the time of the data collection (where, btw, the highsec population has gone down over the last couple of years) GÇö but we know very little (in fact nothing) about how the players are distributed.
Quote:I do not think high sec is as safe now as it was when I started playing the game three years ago. Gankers and grievers have gotten better at what they do. Not really. The victims have just become more careless because the continuous increases in highsec safety lets them (and even entices them) to be more careless. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Bane Necran
468
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:18:00 -
[59] - Quote
Degren wrote:Bane Necran wrote:Degren wrote:Ultima Online was the first sandbox. I declare this to be the moment when that word became utterly meaningless. ?
Because it's used for every single online game now.
Online games aren't linear, have no ending, and players generate most of the content. If that's the only criteria for something to be a 'sandbox' then we're just talking about online games. The term has lost it's original meaning, and become nothing more than a buzzword. "It's no use crying over spilt milk, because all the forces of the universe were bent on spilling it." ~William Maugham |
Twulf
The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact
50
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Posted - 2012.05.07 17:18:00 -
[60] - Quote
Ban Bindy wrote:Tippia wrote:highonpop wrote:Highsec is safer than ever? I'm guessing someone was not online last weekend... Yes, and last weekend is a good illustration: it's now so safe that a concentrated alliance effort is required to produce a kind of carnage that was almost common-place before. Gul'gotha Derv'ash wrote:I know it has been said before, but more people play/live in high sec than low/null. GǪand it is just as wrong now as it is before. Characters Gëá people. We have absolutely no information about where people live. You keep saying this on thread after thread, It's a pretty sure bet that if 70-85% of the pilots are in high sec, then the bulk of the player base is there. I gave up living in null sec because it was simply too time consuming. I do not think high sec is as safe now as it was when I started playing the game three years ago. Gankers and grievers have gotten better at what they do. I don't mind any of that as long as it is not always at the expense of new players, many of whom get their start by mining. Blaming carebears and miners for all the problems in the game is utterly missing the point. Part of the reason PVP does not attract that many people is that most of the PVP kills go to pilots with 50 mill plus skill points. I'm not making that up. I read it in one of the last Quarterly Economic Newsletters. When a player achieves that level of skill points, he has PARITY with the players who live in null sec and low sec. That's two and a half years of work just to level the playing field. If there's a problem with lack of enthusiasm for PVP, the issue starts with the learning curve.
The main reason don't PVP is that PVP players are a minor when it comes to gamers in MMO's. Most gamers get there PVP in First person shooter games and play MMOs to "live" in a fantasy world. This is based on watching the released MMOs and how they do. The most successful MMO's on the market today are all PVE first games with PVP as a E-sport (Battlegrounds and the like). Hell GW2 is going to be one of the most popular MMORPG games when it is finally released and PVP will only allowed in some zones and area's.
Like it or not PVP is not popular no matter how you force it on people. EVE is NOT just about PVP, sure it is a huge part but EVE (If you are to believe the EVEVet's) is a Sandbox game and that means that PVP is optional if the player wants it to be.
Remember Sandbox means that each player gets to choose how they play the game. That is all it means. |
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