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Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 00:41:00 -
[1]
In a pervious thread the reason for the confusion over the ninja salvaging 'issue' was discussed. However as this happened 3 or 4 pages and was very off the topic the op started I thought it prudent to move my suggestion to a seperate thread for discussion, point out to CCP and generally being poked at.
The TL;DR version is this: If the mechanic isn't broken, then the knowledge given to players during their rookie phase is. The New Player Experience (NPE) needs to be tweaked to accomodate this lack of knowledge.
Long Version.
The mechanics behind salvaging are, according to CCP working as intended. The demand of Risk Vs Reward is satisfied as rats change target (I feel this should be more frequent an occurance but that is a different subject). However threads keep opening, people keep complaining both here and in game about it. Whilst MMO's have been around for many years only a minority of video gamers play them, also those that have played other MMO's might not be familiar with the "public instancing" system EVE uses (I see you, you see me, hilarity ensues). They are very much used to being in their own private little world and being able to choose if they want to interact.
The NPE has been drastically overhauled but makes assumptions that the person is familiar with EVE to a degree, this is understandable, it was created and tested by people very familiar with the game. Thus a crucial chunk of knowledge needed by a new player is skipped: You are not alone and the world can come and say hello on IT's terms.
At some point in all of the various career paths you can choose an entity should warp in after the player and do "something". This entity should, as far as the overview is concerned, look like a player ship, perhaps Gallente/Caldari/Amarr/Minmatar Citizen9999999 or somesuch can be flying it. And following a scripted set of actions salvage a wreck, "kill steal" to trigger a respawn the player can't deal with or whatever else is appropriate for that mission.
As this is happening the tutorial window can be updating to point out that in EVE, nothing is 100% certain or private. Players can and will find you, they can and will disrupt your activities if they so wish and this is allowed, how you deal with this is to a degree up to you (use them, ignore them, fight them if possible). It should also point out "the same tools they have used, you have access to", leading to perhaps a civillian probe launcher & 4 probes, a scanning interface tutorial and another scripted encounter where the rookie "breaks in" to the same scripted entity's "mission".
Why? By going to these lengths a player unfamiliar with EVE's unique attributes can have a taste of gameplay they'd otherwise not see until much later in their stay, it also allows someone on a trial to decide that EVE isn't for them and leave without incurring a real world finiancial penalty; which leads to jaded people feeling the game/company ripped them off. It also means that every new player after this was introduced wouldn't be overly shocked when another player comes to pay them a surprise visit and ultimatley the complaints would, hopefully, begin to drop off after this point.
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Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 00:45:00 -
[2]
I think that does it. And I appologise for the wall of text, I'd nicely formatted it but the server kept throwing 500 errors.
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4THELULZ
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Posted - 2009.06.12 00:48:00 -
[3]
This actually isn't a bad idea. Letting new players know about things like canflipping mechanics and ninja salvage would be very useful and probably avert a fair few pointless deaths.
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Johli
Caldari
AWE Corporation
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2009.06.12 01:04:00 -
[4]
I remember when I first started playing, the silly tutorial said to target the station (but not fire). Of course a bunch of people fired and lolwrecks.
But I like the idea, I was hurr durr around EVE for like three months until I stumbled upon salvaging on my own. |
Santiago Fahahrri
Galactic Geographic
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Posted - 2009.06.12 01:04:00 -
[5]
*shrug* it seemed pretty obvious to me from day one that there were no "instances" in Eve. The no shards and no instances aspects were factors that attracted me to the game.
I suppose if it's really not that clear to new people it couldn't hurt to spell it out in big obvious letters. |
Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 01:10:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Vaneshi SnowCrash on 12/06/2009 01:13:09
 Originally by: Santiago Fahahrri
*shrug* it seemed pretty obvious to me from day one that there were no "instances" in Eve. The no shards and no instances aspects were factors that attracted me to the game.
I suppose if it's really not that clear to new people it couldn't hurt to spell it out in big obvious letters.
In some respects the old NPE did point it out much better than the new. Those acceleration gates in to deadspace training complexes and report gathering zones where you'd regularly see other people doing stuff in them. At least then you had the general idea of people can find you and stopped thinking about "my mission, my complex" and such. Well I did but hey. |
Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 01:30:00 -
[7]
As an additional thought based on my dealings with actual new players in FNA several tend to have the attitude "I'm a good person, I've done nothing wrong... why are you being horrible to me?" I'm in the "because I can" camp sometimes but hey.
Having them hmm... Making Mischeif (good as name as any) whilst still in their sandboxed playpen stops a lot of the issues, not just ninja's and can flippery, that come from social interaction. It also shows them less well... less nice and more selubrious ways of playing the game.
I mean if we could get the NPC's to reliably ransom them as well that'd be brilliant.
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Solostrom
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Posted - 2009.06.12 02:34:00 -
[8]
I am sorry you missed the last ten thousand threads regarding this subject. Which is brought up once a day.
Perhaps you were incapable of looking at the first or second pages worth of threads.
If you had you might have noticed that...
IT IS WORKING AS INTENDED! CCP KNOWS! CCP APPROVES! SALVAGE IS NOT YOURS!
Or perhaps you are learning or visually impaired. In the event you are just lazy, whelp... u suck... if you are just blind... I'm sorry. If you are learning impaired... aka can't check the other threads... would you please STFU! |
Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 02:50:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Vaneshi SnowCrash on 12/06/2009 02:51:54
Originally by: Solostrom
I am sorry you missed the last ten thousand threads regarding this subject. Which is brought up once a day.
Perhaps you were incapable of looking at the first or second pages worth of threads.
If you had you might have noticed that...
IT IS WORKING AS INTENDED! CCP KNOWS! CCP APPROVES! SALVAGE IS NOT YOURS!
Or perhaps you are learning or visually impaired. In the event you are just lazy, whelp... u suck... if you are just blind... I'm sorry. If you are learning impaired... aka can't check the other threads... would you please STFU!
Reported. Post is off topic. Subject matter is not Salvaging Mechanics. Subject is New Player Experience modifications to better prepare incomming subscriptions for the EVE universe with a focus on unregulated player interactions.
I have raised none of the points you seem critical of.
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SupaKudoRio
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Posted - 2009.06.12 04:07:00 -
[10]
You should change the title or you're going to get a lot more who just read the first word of the title and get no further. |
Lear Hepburn
Caldari
Ascendant Strategies Inc.
The Transcendent
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Posted - 2009.06.12 05:28:00 -
[11]
This is a decent enough idea. Eve needs a bit of guidance (but not too much!) for new players.
The first time someone dies is usually through ignorance of what other players can, and will, do to them in hisec, and this can be frustrating and cause people to leave. Inform them that these things can happen and less of them will leave.
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Vaneshi SnowCrash
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Posted - 2009.06.12 14:38:00 -
[12]
Originally by: SupaKudoRio
You should change the title or you're going to get a lot more who just read the first word of the title and get no further.
Or read the first word and produce a cut n' paste insultfest thinking it's yet another Ninja salvager whine.
Topic changed to "Making Mischeif" which seems kind of appropriate for the idea.
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Abrazzar
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Posted - 2009.06.12 14:59:00 -
[13]
They should send the newb into a "mission" area (including acc gate) to recover some stuff from a wreckage and have some white npc warp into the area, cleaning up wrecks that are floating there (just waypoints and despawning wrecks when the NPC reaches a waypoint). Then give a info window explaining to the newb what's going on.
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Ideas for: Mining
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