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Rudolf Miller
Dawn of a new Empire
The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.06.22 22:50:00 -
[1]
/me puts on flame shield, as I have read threads like this before
I am aware this has been suggested before, but not in the way I am presenting it and I believe it is a modest concession between the current training system and rewarding players who use weapons/skills often
 So what exactly are you recommending?
I am proposing a "Level 6" of sorts. This "level 6" skill can only be achieved once a skill has been trained by the normal means to Level 5. So for example you must train Afterburner 5 to begin earning skill points towards a level 6 bonus.
Still sounds like Wow, how is this different?
Because any given skill will need to be trained using the currently established skill system, it will not upset the balance of long time eve players and new beginners. Everyone will start on the same level. To this point, anyone who invests the time into training a skill to level 5 can get rewarded through a usage based system.
To explain exactly how it will work, consider the combination of gaining Concord standings through ratting with gaining LP through missions. The two skills required to begin earning a L6 bonus will affect both of these systems to get skill points awarded towards the next level. So training "base experience learning" will shorten the window in which skill points can be accumulated before skill points are awarded. This will allow a player to fit more windows into the 23 hour game time to earn more SP. "Advanced experience learning" (based experience learning 4 or 5 as a prereq.) will increase the amount of SP earned per time period based on usage.
Define the "L6" bonus.
It's like you trained one more skill level above the current system. For example, Large Energy Turret grants a 5% damage bonus. Well that what you will get at L6
 Checks, Balances, and exemptions
First off, learning skills should not be available to attain a "level 6 bonus" This can lead to an abuse of neural remaps and gaining too many points in Perception/Charisma etc.
Second, the ability to get a L6 bonus will require strong prerequisites in the Learning Field. For example, Pre-Reqs can include Learning 5, and 2 new skills in the Learning skill subset that will be a high tier skill (example a tier 5 skill)
Third, the difference in earning L6 skill points will be based on what skill is used on the item in question. For example, if you wanted to earn an L6 bonus on Large Energy Turret, then you will need to use a meta 1-4/faction/officer energy turret to start earning points. Since a T2 Large Energy Turret requires Beam/Pulse Spec, you will need to have those skills at Level 5 to earn the experience bonus and as a result will NOT earn any points towards Large Energy Turret base skill.
This sounds like it can still be abused by Macro'ers
With proper balancing, it can be implemented such that at maximum learning skills, it would still take 100 in game hours of using the experience system in order to attain the L6 bonus.
 Alternative possibility to this system can be a "restart" in the skill training after you reach level 5. So if you wanted to get an Level 6 through Level 10 bonus, you have to earn the points all through experience. This one I think would be less preferable to the established player base.
Thoughts? Improvement? Flames? I'm open to constructive criticism
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Rudolf Miller
Dawn of a new Empire
The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.06.22 22:51:00 -
[2]
Reserved for further explanation/clarification. |
Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.06.22 22:56:00 -
[3]
No. Usage-based skills will NEVER happen. |
Krando Tellesse
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Posted - 2009.06.22 23:00:00 -
[4]
Not a good idea one of the biggest draws for people myself included is that we can play the game casualy without falling to far behind our corpmates / friends. As it is now to be good at the biggest draw to eve (PVP) you have to put in the hours already just having the skills to fly ship and shoot the guns will not make you win.
The rewards for ratting and mission running i.e. lp stor purchases, security status can be lost.. the system doesn't have a way to lose that extra edge.
You also need to realize that the bonuses for each skill lvl increase logrithmacly that is. the bones to a skill at lvl 5 is (base*1.05)*1.05)*1.05)*1.05)*1.05) which is why it takes 5 days to learn a 4 in a skill and 25 to learn lvl 5. The difference between the lvls is greater the higher the lvl.
Secondly EVE is great about not giving somone and "edge". Everything in the game has a counter and if you don't think the counter is good enough there is nothing preventing you from fitting and flying exactly what the opposition is which again levels the playing field.
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1072
Fliegerkorps
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Posted - 2009.06.22 23:02:00 -
[5]
I have never played any MMO cause I dont have time to grind.
I play EVE only because of auto-training which helps me keep up with other players. There are times where I cant log for a week or 2 due work or RL and I tend to believe there are lots o guys like me in new eden.
Eve is about macro planning and micro fighting. So you need brain & skills to be successful. I have no problems with both of them, will be happy to get blown up by anyone who out-levels me in those.
BUT
I dont wanna get popped by a 14 years old who lvl6ed all his BS skills doing missions in empire 10 hours per day.
The day any kind of grinding mechanics implemented on eve, I will insta-leave.
-boombastica !- |
Nub Sauce
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Posted - 2009.06.22 23:07:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: 1072
I have never played any MMO cause I dont have time to grind.
I play EVE only because of auto-training which helps me keep up with other players. There are times where I cant log for a week or 2 due work or RL and I tend to believe there are lots o guys like me in new eden.
Eve is about macro planning and micro fighting. So you need brain & skills to be successful. I have no problems with both of them, will be happy to get blown up by anyone who out-levels me in those.
BUT
I dont wanna get popped by a 14 years old who lvl6ed all his BS skills doing missions in empire 10 hours per day.
The day any kind of grinding mechanics implemented on eve, I will insta-leave.
Very well said. If you want a bonus, get some drugs.
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Santiago Fahahrri
Galactic Geographic
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Posted - 2009.06.23 00:01:00 -
[7]
Put my vote in the No Skill Increase Through Grinding count.
~ Santiago Fahahrri
Galactic Geographic |
Rudolf Miller
Dawn of a new Empire
The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.06.23 00:06:00 -
[8]
I would just like to point out in 14 years of skilling from 0, a player will have Level 5'd 60% of the entirety of all current Eve Skills.
At this point I already see that it is not worth trying to defend my point, but there will come a time (roughly 22 years from the characters birth) when the player will run out of skills to train. So CCP will need to stay ahead of that wall somehow.
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente
The NightClub
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Posted - 2009.06.23 01:26:00 -
[9]
1) If you have to explicitly state "This is not like WoW"... it probably means it is. Just like starting a sentence with "don't be offended, but..." usually means you're about to say something offensive.
2) If you could gain any sort of skill from repetition rather than timed training, then people will just find a way to "macro" their way to greatness. Navigation skills could be as simple as setting orbit and letting it run all day. Or flying straight off into the darkness and don't look back. Gun skills would be as easy as pointing a laser at an asteroid, so you don't waste ammo while you "skill up".
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Players aren't interested in Variety, they only want THE BEST |
Drakarin
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.23 01:43:00 -
[10]
A decent proposal but with a lot of potential for imbalance. Not every skill should have a sixth level or it would become somewhat overpowered.
Besides this, while I agree with your idea I don't think it will ever be implemented. Simply put, this game has a main player base of adults who often feel they have too little time to devote to the game.
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Photus
Caldari
Roll For Initiative
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Posted - 2009.06.23 04:56:00 -
[11]
It's a novel idea, but one that won't really work. The whole idea of skill grinding was put to rest when someone pointed out that to get to level 6 (in your plan), all I'd have to do is go out to an asteroid belt and hurl missiles at it endlessly.
It's a good idea in theory, but I don't think it has a place in Eve. |
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