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Suhayla
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Posted - 2009.06.30 17:23:00 -
[1]
Have anyone seen signs of the recent Hulk suicide ganking campaign being part of a planned manipulation of the mineral/Hulk market?
I mean, manipulating the C&P crowd (most of them not being the sharpest crayons in the box) into repeatedly attacking Hulks and other mining vessels should drive up the prices a bit in both minerals and mining vessels, right? I'm not quite sure this is the case, but I always felt that the initial posts starting up the Gankorama felt a bit ... fishy ...
Anyway, making violent anti-social fools into tools for your agenda has been a time-honoured tradition since long before brown shirts and goose-stepping were invented, so why would EVE be different.
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Callista Omenswarm
Astronautical Engineering
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Posted - 2009.06.30 17:33:00 -
[2]
I think you're giving them far too much credit. It is entirely about tears, hitting easy targets and profit.
They'll get bored and move on. It happened before and I'm sure the fad will return in the future.
For now, stockpile your mineral loads, or cache 10% of what you sell. That'll help drive up prices, increasing the insurance loss and hopefully work as an increasing discouragement against future attacks.
AE's T1 BPC Store - Rigs, Ammo, Modules and Ships |
Suhayla
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Posted - 2009.06.30 17:49:00 -
[3]
Oh, I'm sure that for the PvPaths it all about "tears, hitting easy targets and profit", but what I wonder is if there is someone else, with a more "financial" preference, who is pulling their strings ... |
Billia
Deadlock Systems Incorporated
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Posted - 2009.06.30 18:07:00 -
[4]
u got to remember that one of the main reasons why ore prices are so low are because people get so many minerals running missions and reprossessing the stuff they find.
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Borun Tal
Minmatar
Virtual Rock Industries
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Posted - 2009.06.30 18:22:00 -
[5]
I'm convinced the BS started as more than just "tears for carebears" kind of thing, although all the expected hanger-ons are doing it for just that reason. Alleged "carebears" like Perkone suddenly start ganking because they don't like people playing the game their own way? Not likely.
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Callista Omenswarm
Astronautical Engineering
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Posted - 2009.06.30 18:31:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Callista Omenswarm on 30/06/2009 18:32:13
 Originally by: Borun Tal
Alleged "carebears" like Perkone suddenly start ganking because they don't like people playing the game their own way? Not likely.
To what end, QEN showed ship losses from last year's ganking never came close to outstripping production and returned to normal almost immediately after it ended.
At best you're looking at a modest and short lived rise in prices and that's just going to encourage everyone with a couple of bil to buy a Covetor print and start inventing.
On an unlreated note, anyone got a Covetor BPO for sale? 
AE's T1 BPC Store - Rigs, Ammo, Modules and Ships |
Governor LePetomane
Rock Ridge Brokerage Solutions
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Posted - 2009.06.30 18:48:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Callista Omenswarm
To what end, QEN showed ship losses from last year's ganking never came close to outstripping production and returned to normal almost immediately after it ended.
This. At this point there may be some people doing this as market manipulation but that would be limited exclusively to "the clueless." This is now the third hulk ganking fad I've seen blow through and I'm here to tell you, it's got nothing to do with the market and everything to do with attention oldestprofessionage (swear filter ftl).
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Reapeat Offender
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.06.30 19:21:00 -
[8]
I dare you mock our holy Jihad against these unclean machines.
-----------------------------------------------
Are GoonSwarm ever going to be allowed to build up in any way in 0.0 space again?
No.
-DB Preacher |
Drakan290
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Posted - 2009.06.30 19:29:00 -
[9]
This was the original thread:
Thread
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sir gankalot
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Posted - 2009.06.30 20:26:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Reapeat Offender
I dare you mock our holy Jihad against these unclean machines.
Pfffft, you don't even have that nifty Jihadswarm killboard anymore. PHAIL!!
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Sabriele
Amarr
H.I.V.E.
Lone Star Defense League
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Posted - 2009.06.30 20:29:00 -
[11]
It's funny. End of. 
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.06.30 21:16:00 -
[12]
Some of it is ganks under contract tied to a few systems, some simply for the tears and some is indeed market manipulation- a suprising number of ebil griefers pirate gankers etc... have industrial alts. |
De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Special Projects Executive
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Posted - 2009.06.30 23:53:00 -
[13]
Originally by: RedSplat
Some of it is ganks under contract tied to a few systems, some simply for the tears and some is indeed market manipulation- a suprising number of ebil griefers pirate gankers etc... have industrial alts.
Why not? The ISK all spends, even if you make it honestly.
--Vel
Experience is what you get right after you need it.
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Ozone71
Caldari
The Dark Ic3y LIfe
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Posted - 2009.07.01 03:59:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Billia
u got to remember that one of the main reasons why ore prices are so low are because people get so many minerals running missions and reprossessing the stuff they find.
So ... by getting people to stop mission running and attack exhumers, mining barges, Orca's and the like, you decrease both the primary mineral supply (mining), and the secondary source (missions) - not bad for a single act.
Although ... you'd need a real jihad with a huge percentage of the missioners to down tools and attack miners to have a real market swing.
"Ozone is blue and smells faintly of geraniums." (Qi, BBC TV) |
lucifers widow
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Posted - 2009.07.01 11:31:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ozone71
So ... by getting people to stop mission running and attack exhumers, mining barges, Orca's and the like, you decrease both the primary mineral supply (mining), and the secondary source (missions) - not bad for a single act.
Although ... you'd need a real jihad with a huge percentage of the missioners to down tools and attack miners to have a real market swing.
Hmm, people talking of what next for Eve now Bob vs Goons is over, Missioners Vs Miners could be the next "great war " ?
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Moose Balzak
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Posted - 2009.07.01 17:04:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Moose Balzak on 01/07/2009 17:10:00
This is absolutely true.
Hands down I have made staggering amounts of cash everytime these jackass Jihads kick off.
This is macro/meta-gaming at its finest and the real instigators know this.
Markets affected:
ICE (regional)
Low end minerals (usually fairly localized)
To some degree: High end moon mins.
Anyone who tells you it is just for the lols is an idiot -- or worse, they are not in on the market manipulation "take".
If you have bought in at low prices, the mere threat of a gankfest can significantly change the price. This is most pronounced with ice products -- since mackinaws are so easily popped.
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Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy
Black Sun Alliance
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Posted - 2009.07.02 06:07:00 -
[17]
The trouble is that so many people are sitting on huge stockpiles of minerals that when such an "event" does happen they all rush to flood the market with their overpriced supply. Then prices drop rapidly back in line. Hulks are replaced as quickly as they are destroyed as well.
Then too, because there is a finite amount of ore in the game, at least in empire when one corps hulks go down another corps hulks move in. The easily available ore is mined up nearly every day.
You might argue that those making hulks might gain some for a few days... but not as much as you might think.
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.07.02 13:13:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Barbara Nichole
The trouble is that so many people are sitting on huge stockpiles of minerals that when such an "event" does happen they all rush to flood the market with their overpriced supply. Then prices drop rapidly back in line. Hulks are replaced as quickly as they are destroyed as well.
Then too, because there is a finite amount of ore in the game, at least in empire when one corps hulks go down another corps hulks move in. The easily available ore is mined up nearly every day.
You might argue that those making hulks might gain some for a few days... but not as much as you might think.
Its Regional markets being manipulated and by the sounds of it you have missed the signs and missed the boat.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep.
I am always here.
Watching.
Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
it does get progressively longer.
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Governor LePetomane
Rock Ridge Brokerage Solutions
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Posted - 2009.07.02 18:24:00 -
[19]
Originally by: RedSplat
Its Regional markets being manipulated and by the sounds of it you have missed the signs and missed the boat.
If you swing a dead cat around your head 3 times down at the crossroads at two minutes to midnight under a full moon, the ghost of Commodore Vanderbilt will appear and reveal TeH mArKaT mAnIpUlIzAsHuN 2 u.
Yeah, I remember when the goons told everybody that line of crap about how they wouldn't gank in Minnie space because they were trying to manipulate the ice market too. This was obvious hokum a pretty transparent attempt to defuse any charges of "griefing" that CCP might be inclined to give an audience to.
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Moose Balzak
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Posted - 2009.07.02 23:14:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Governor LePetomane
Originally by: RedSplat
Its Regional markets being manipulated and by the sounds of it you have missed the signs and missed the boat.
If you swing a dead cat around your head 3 times down at the crossroads at two minutes to midnight under a full moon, the ghost of Commodore Vanderbilt will appear and reveal TeH mArKaT mAnIpUlIzAsHuN 2 u.
Yeah, I remember when the goons told everybody that line of crap about how they wouldn't gank in Minnie space because they were trying to manipulate the ice market too. This was obvious hokum a pretty transparent attempt to defuse any charges of "griefing" that CCP might be inclined to give an audience to.
Yes, I remember all of this as well. I made 21.3 Bil on Ice Market price increases during that jihad. So ruse or not, it was very profitable for those working the markets. Additionally, while this may not count as a manipulation... it can also be used to maintain prices near where they are at, i.e. a price control effect on markets already sagging under the weight of oversupply, while those capable of taking advantage of it dump their stocks.
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Joe Starbreaker
Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2009.07.02 23:19:00 -
[21]
It's deliberate social engineering, yes, but not of the market. For Goonfleet's leaders, it's a way to maintain an identity and a Goonfleet mystique, to keep people committed to the corp. If they didn't regularly have campaigns of some mischievous design or another, people would get bored and leave. Whats-his-name the CEO has got to be a little worried about what Goonfleet stands for, now that BOB is gone.
- / buy my alt / - |
Rip Minner
Gallente
Freewind Ventures
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Posted - 2009.07.03 02:08:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker
It's deliberate social engineering, yes, but not of the market. For Goonfleet's leaders, it's a way to maintain an identity and a Goonfleet mystique, to keep people committed to the corp. If they didn't regularly have campaigns of some mischievous design or another, people would get bored and leave. Whats-his-name the CEO has got to be a little worried about what Goonfleet stands for, now that BOB is gone.
There toying at picking sides in other allance fights and helping the side they like kick alot of ass.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.07.03 09:41:00 -
[23]
Remember who control a large percentage of the high end moons today and will like for T2 production to increase.
Goonswarm lower tier pilots will not profit for that, but the CEOs of the moon controlling alliances will like an increase in the use of moon minerals to replace lost hulks.
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Robin Plunder
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Posted - 2009.07.03 16:25:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Robin Plunder on 03/07/2009 16:25:52
1) It is summer. Kids are out of school and adults have vacation time.
2) Goons lost a lot of sleep grinding POS/Sov wars. They need a break and some recreation that requires much less dedication. Ganking is their PREFERRED play-style.
3) Goons are attention *****s, and are grievously wounded that their "Great War" was a yawn to 98% of players. (The Mittani's latest propaganda greatly underestimates it at 80%).
CCP's economist saw no economic effect from the last Jihad.
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Ronos
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Posted - 2009.07.03 20:12:00 -
[25]
I agree with Robin. It's summer and a Jihad by eve's resident terrorists should be expected.
Frankly, I love crap like this... it keeps the game interesting, and gives more people reasons to hate the "Blob Bees".
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Dr Silkworth
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Posted - 2009.07.03 21:13:00 -
[26]
It seems to be unfolding like a classic speculation instead of a manipulation. Lots of press, little real action.
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Caelum Mortuos
Gallente
Zero G Research and Development
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Posted - 2009.07.03 22:53:00 -
[27]
You're right! Everybody is conspiring against you!
:tinfoil:
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Governor LePetomane
Rock Ridge Brokerage Solutions
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Posted - 2009.07.03 23:09:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Moose Balzak
Yes, I remember all of this as well. I made 21.3 Bil on Ice Market price increases during that jihad.
1. Speculation != manipulation.
2. Correlation != causation.
3. "Ruse" is an awfully lofty descriptor for Karttoon's obfuscation and sandbagging.
4. I too can pull large, unverifiable numbers out of my butt. The number of hot Canadian girls I banged in high school, for instance, is unimaginably huge.
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namelesses
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Posted - 2009.07.04 02:20:00 -
[29]
well lets face it goons couldnt beat bob in a fare fight so it doesnt surprise me there ganking hulks to increase prices now they have a decent region.
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Lord Fitz
Project Amargosa
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Posted - 2009.07.04 02:57:00 -
[30]
Considering the rise in T2 materials lately, Hulks are still incredibly cheap, when you look at how the rise has effected other T2 ships. There are a heap of Hulk inventors not making much if any profit.
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