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R'onen
Minmatar
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:07:00 -
[1]
Can I PVP effectively in T1 ships and guns and missiles? I'm a newer character in a PVP corp, I feel like I'm nothing more than an easy target. |
Mystical Dawn
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:08:00 -
[2]
I heard that Revelation is quite effective. |
R'onen
Minmatar
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:09:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Mystical Dawn
I heard that Revelation is quite effective.
Please, only helpful posts please. I'm new to PVP, not a troll. |
Commander Yassir
Dirt Nap Squad
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:23:00 -
[4]
Yes. |
Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2009.07.23 22:28:00 -
[5]
T1 hulls are effective, but if you ask me t1 fittings are not.
But if you cant use t2 fittings yet just fly frigates, they're cheap anyway. |
smurfslayor
Minmatar
Ugly 5tick
SUBLIME CREATIONS ALLIANCE
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Posted - 2009.07.24 04:23:00 -
[6]
rifter is good and t2 fittings at least guns will take no time, or go t1 best named if you have the isk.Stabber and hurricane both****llent pvp boats, i`m assuming of course that you fly mimm as your char is. |
soldieroffortune 258
Gallente
Trinity Council
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.07.24 04:40:00 -
[7]
Edited by: soldieroffortune 258 on 24/07/2009 04:42:21
Solo? Probably not, in a small group though? probably yeah, get 2 or 3 Rifters, and you could take on anything cruiser sized and below for the most part (except id avoid drone boats like the Arbitrator and Vexor)
oh, and as a few people have said, small T2 fittings are really not that far away, I promise, 2 weeks you could have an entirely T2 fit Rifter guranteed (well, maybe not t2 web and scram, those require Prop Jamming IV, which could take a week in itself)
but yeah, T2 guns and T2 AB/maybe MWD, but i usually go with named MWD anyway since T2 mwd's are so goddamned expensive these days . . . . . . |
Jared D'Uroth
Universal Peace Operation
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Posted - 2009.07.24 05:07:00 -
[8]
I think I probably have something like 200+ solo kills. The only tech 2 ships I've flown are AFs and Inties, and I hardly ever solo in those.
You should be fine.
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TraininVain
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Posted - 2009.07.24 05:40:00 -
[9]
Originally by: R'onen
Can I PVP effectively in T1 ships and guns and missiles? I'm a newer character in a PVP corp, I feel like I'm nothing more than an easy target.
Yeah, you can to an extent.
The ships part is less of a problem than the guns and missiles part tbh but it really depends on what your job is.
In some areas T2 gear boosts your performance a lot. A BC with T1 guns for example is less than ideal because a BC is basically a big cruiser spanking damage platform so it's job is DPS. The significant boost to damage T2 guns and damage mods (along with support skills) provide to DPS aren't something it makes a lot of sense to do without.
OTOH there's plenty of other places where it makes less of a difference and you can still be effective.
I'd say work out what you want to be doing and try and focus on that area. |
Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.24 05:49:00 -
[10]
600+ kills (>5-to-1 kill ratio) my first year playing EVE (started in 19 Jul 08) just using T1 ships, mostly battlecruisers and battleships.
frigate->frigate with T2 guns->cruiser->BC->BC with T2 guns->BS->BS with T2 guns
this is basically what I did and it was a decent progression.
you may want to get to battlecruiser and battleship as soon as you can if you want to be a decent contribution to your gang or fleet.
t1 frig and cruisers fine for starting out but are usually not tough enough to face serious opposition.
my 2 ISK anyway |
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yani dumyat
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.07.24 07:40:00 -
[11]
T1 hulls are fine but as has been said the T2 modules especially guns make a big difference.
Originally by: R'onen
I feel like I'm nothing more than an easy target.
I'm going to guess that you've tried to fight higher SP players on a pure tank n gank level and had your ass handed to you?
The truth of having low sp is that you can't fight gank with gank against high SP players so you need to be a bit more sneaky and use speed, falloff and ewar to its maximum effect to get kills. |
Kessiaan
Minmatar
MicroFunks
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Posted - 2009.07.24 08:34:00 -
[12]
The majority of my kills are with T1 hulls.
As was said, a T2 fitted ship will massively outperform a T1 fitted ship. You can partially offset this by fitting best named but best named tends to be more expensive than T2 and the skills you need for T2 tend to be what makes the biggest impact on that module anyway.
T2 hulls will perform much better than their T1 counterparts at whatever role they're designed for, but this is offset by the fact that T2 ships are much, much more expensive than their T1 counterparts. On frigs the difference is so massive there's little reason to ever fly the T1 version again barring certain specific circumstances (such as minor p****s in Factional Warfare) but on larger ships cost effectiveness becomes a major concern - basically in a T2 hull you have to play more conservatively unless you want to go broke or have bad KB stats. T1 hulls, even when fully T2 fit, and even when rigged (BC and up) are much more disposable than the T2 variants and still very effective when flown by a competent pilot who knows what he's doing. |
Sexual Healing
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2009.07.24 10:57:00 -
[13]
Being in a gang makes flying T1 less of an issue in my mind, because there are more targets for the opposition to shoot at, unless ofc everyone is in a T1 ship. In a gang situation T2 ships more often than not will be called primary. If you think about it some of the most popular pvp ships are T1 especially within the BC and frig classes.
When it comes to soloing target selection is probably more important than anything. Of course not all T1 hulls are created equal when it comes to soloing.
In some cases FC's will "demand" that you fly a T2 ship, what does your corp say?
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Pascal Almaric
Agony Unleashed
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Posted - 2009.07.24 11:20:00 -
[14]
Originally by: R'onen
Can I PVP effectively in T1 ships and guns and missiles?
It's not guns and missiles, but T1 ECM is pretty effective for the Isk and SP invested. Meta 3 modules are a real bargain, and the ships aren't that hard to fit. ECM is especially good if you have a regular battlefield that you can cover with bookmarks for jamming -- preparation gives an ECM pilot a big edge. Be prepared to lose a bunch of ships until you get the hang of reading the battlefield and manoeuvring for effectiveness/safety/escape. This is a niche where player skill trumps character skill more than most.
I've never had an FC ask me to switch from a Blackbird to something else. The downside is that you might get asked to switch out of your shiny new Rupture with T2 guns that you just spent months training, and get back in the 'bird. Also, you just might not like flying ECM.
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Von Kroll
Caldari
Paxton Industries
Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.07.24 11:32:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Kessiaan
The majority of my kills are with T1 hulls
Your experience is not representative. Most of your targets are T1 ships.
@ the OP: No, not really. There are a couple of specific matchups that can allow a T1 ship to effectively PvP, but usually they are based on a mismatchh in class. For example, a Caracal specifically fit to take on interceptors can be lethal, if the Cara pilot has high skills, and the inty is not a Taranis. Certainly T1 Battlecruisers and Battleships are more cost-effective than their T2 counterparts--the Command Ship and Marauder/Black Ops. So really, the only T1 ships that will always be competitive are BC and BS. Otherwise, concentrate on getting into AF, Inties, Recons, and HACs. But, don't fly T2 until you have the skills to maximize their advantages and the isk to support losing them occasionally.
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Wensley
Minmatar
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.07.24 12:02:00 -
[16]
Hi R'onen. I've been running around the Amamake area in a T1 fit Rifter and having a lot of fun as well as getting some good kills. Because you don't have Barrage I'd be careful of engaging older Rifter pilots but other than that its lots of fun. I've heard that T1 Incursuses are a lot of fun and I can't see why Punishers and Kestrels wouldn't be fun either. To give you an idea here's the Rifter I've been using:
[Rifter, T1 MWD]
Damage Control I
400mm Reinforced Titanium Plates I
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Initiated Harmonic Warp Scrambler I
'Langour' Drive Disruptor I
150mm Light Carbine Repeating Cannon I, EMP S
150mm Light Carbine Repeating Cannon I, EMP S
150mm Light Carbine Repeating Cannon I, EMP S
'Limos' Rocket Launcher I, Gremlin Rocket
[empty rig slot]
[empty rig slot]
[empty rig slot]
If you want some inspiration check out these videos: Crapage, Crapage2, and Got Cooch? All have some excellent T1 PvP in them.
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Havohej
Minmatar
Du'uma Fiisi Integrated Astrometrics
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Posted - 2009.07.24 17:29:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Von Kroll
Originally by: Kessiaan
The majority of my kills are with T1 hulls
Your experience is not representative. Most of your targets are T1 ships.
So? Part of learning to PvP is learning what your ship can do and learning to pick your battles.
Originally by: Von Kroll
@ the OP: No, not really. There are a couple of specific matchups that can allow a T1 ship to effectively PvP, but usually they are based on a mismatchh in class. For example, a Caracal specifically fit to take on interceptors can be lethal, if the Cara pilot has high skills, and the inty is not a Taranis. Certainly T1 Battlecruisers and Battleships are more cost-effective than their T2 counterparts--the Command Ship and Marauder/Black Ops. So really, the only T1 ships that will always be competitive are BC and BS. Otherwise, concentrate on getting into AF, Inties, Recons, and HACs. But, don't fly T2 until you have the skills to maximize their advantages and the isk to support losing them occasionally.
This is the worst PvP advice noobs give to other noobs every day. The idea that 'more expensive hull = better every time' is patently ridiculous. An inexperienced player in a Jaguar will get molested by an experienced player in a Rifter. That truism can be scaled up for every class of ship in EVE. You tell a noob to get into the most expensive hull he can get as soon as he can get it, all you're going to do is cost him a lot of ISK as he dies repeatedly from comedy fits (which do nothing to help his mediocre support skills) or simple pilot error born of inexperience.
Protip: You proviblob guys don't get kills because you're in T2 ships, you get kills because you've got numbers.
"You can still steal their stuff." - CCP Explorer
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X Gallentius
MicroFunks
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Posted - 2009.07.24 17:46:00 -
[18]
Edited by: X Gallentius on 24/07/2009 17:46:40
Originally by: Von Kroll
Originally by: Kessiaan
The majority of my kills are with T1 hulls
Your experience is not representative. Most of your targets are T1 ships.
Not representative of what?
To the OP, you can effectively PvP in any ship - just pick appropriate targets. And no you won't be able to right now because your skills suck (unless you fight an equally new character). Very few guys can effectively pvp right out of the box. Lose ships, have fun, learn, and bide your time while you're training appropriate skills.
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Pater Peccavi
Minmatar
Cadre Assault Force
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Posted - 2009.07.24 19:21:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Darthewok
-You may want to get to battlecruiser and battleship as soon as you can if you want to be a decent contribution to your gang or fleet.
Uh...this is extremely bad advice for PvP. When someone has low skillpoints, that makes a huge difference on battleships and battlecruisers compared to a higher SP character. On smaller ships, the difference isn't quite as visible. Add in the fact that the player hasn't really learned to PvP yet, and you're just sending a person into a disaster.
When learning to PvP, you're going to lose a lot of ships. This is why people generally start out as tacklers in T1 frigs, they're easy to replace and help the gang out by holding the target down. T1 cruisers can provide extra dps, or in the case of the Blackbird, keep the opponent from firing back. In PvP, bigger isn't better, at least not until you have enough skills and experience to handle the ship.
______
Why has the number of players online dropped from 50k to 25k?
BECAUSE OF SWINE FLU |
Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.25 02:51:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Darthewok
-frigate->frigate with T2 guns->cruiser->BC->BC with T2 guns->BS->BS with T2 guns
yup, skills are important before you get into the ship.
on each step try to train up the certificates recommended for each ship.
just saying BCs and BS are the more decent ships in the T1 line so train and get into those ASAP if you want to do only T1 first but want to be somewhat competitive with T2 ships.
blackbird is an exception, competitive even at higher skillpoints because ECM rocks.
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MrNuby
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Posted - 2009.07.25 03:19:00 -
[21]
Edited by: MrNuby on 25/07/2009 03:20:59
Edited by: MrNuby on 25/07/2009 03:20:48
Try this little roadrunner. Cheap, fully insureable and your gang will love you, assuming they can keep up spamming warp to player. Can be made cap stable with some half decent skills. Around 3500-4000 m/s depending on your skills.
[Vigil, beep beep]
Capacitor Power Relay I
Capacitor Power Relay I
Nanofiber Internal Structure I
1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Small Capacitor Battery I
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty rig slot]
[empty rig slot]
[empty rig slot]
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The AEther
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
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Posted - 2009.07.25 06:00:00 -
[22]
Members of my corp pvp in T1 ships quite a bit resulting in some hilarious kills like a Vaga taken down by two Ospreys. There is a lot of satisfaction in being able to kill T2 with T1.
You're feeling like an easy target not because of your ship. Don't think that upgrading to T2 ship will suddenly make others fear and avoid you. To the contrary, a T2 kill looks much better on the killboard and gives more satisfaction than a T1 kill and an inexperienced player in T2 ship is an easy T2 kill at that.
Link to PVP University |
Lee Dalton
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2009.07.25 08:51:00 -
[23]
As long as the other person is T1 fit. :P
***
You're only as good as your last fight. |
R'onen
Minmatar
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2009.07.25 20:31:00 -
[24]
Thanks all. Most of you were helpful. To the guy who assumed I fly minmatar ships because I am min, you were right!:)
So far I got my cruiser and bc up to lvl 3. I'm liking my new Rupture. Only has T1 guns so far, but they serve me well.
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Stil Harkonnen
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Posted - 2009.07.26 00:56:00 -
[25]
It works, just not as well as t2. Just use it all and replace your t1 stuff with t2 as soon as you can use it
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