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Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
23
   |
Posted - 2011.09.17 12:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
I can't help but notice that in other game (I will use League of Legends as an example) there is balancing updates ever couple of weeks.
One can't help but wonder; if they can do it, why can't CCP?
These are not huge changes mind you. Just small tweaks here and there. To help fill a role, to fix something that is over powered, under-powered. You get the idea.
I for one would love if CCP would make minor tweaks on ships here and there every couple of weeks. You know, instead of every couple of years...
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
68
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 12:09:00 -
[2] - Quote
But EVE is perfectly balanced and there are no bugs to fix.
"Why can't I be different and original, like everybody else?" |
Pattern Clarc
Aperture Harmonics
15
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 12:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
I'd be happy with every 6 months.
We haven't had a rebalance in almost 24 months.
Ex CSM member and Designer of the Tornado. -á
Pilot satisfaction --áNew Ships |
Cyzlaki
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
126
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 12:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
Constant steady balancing is a bad thing. |
DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
36
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 13:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
Exectation: Give hybrid boats a 1.5% increase to powergrid every week until things start looking brighter.
Reality: Give hybrid boats a 15% increase to powergrid every week until a frigate can fit XL guns. Upon realising this, reduce their powergrid by 1.5% every week. |
Mr LaForge
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
50
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 13:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
The planets haven't aligned right for a balance change in anything. |
ColdCutz
Pwny Nation
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 19:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
But the planets don't move at all in EVE. |
Y U NO
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2011.09.17 19:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP
Y U NO BALANCE SHIP!?
|
Shadowsword
The Rough Riders
Ares Protectiva
5
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Posted - 2011.09.17 21:08:00 -
[9] - Quote
While I agree that CCP should be much more active on ship balancing (one exemple among many, the Dramiel nerf is already set in stone, yet it isn't applied, and won't be for a while), taking LoL as a model isn't a good thing to do.
Because 90% of LoL's balancing is made of totally negligibles changes, like "Nocturne's Indicible Horror range reduced from 550 to 525". LoL is full of cosmetic and psychological changes.
When you're serious about balance, you nerf something significantly, or you don't touch it. |
Digital Messiah
N7 Corporation
10
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 21:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
Shadowsword wrote:While I agree that CCP should be much more active on ship balancing (one exemple among many, the Dramiel nerf is already set in stone, yet it isn't applied, and won't be for a while), taking LoL as a model isn't a good thing to do.
Because 90% of LoL's balancing is made of totally negligibles changes, like "Nocturne's Indicible Horror range reduced from 550 to 525". LoL is full of cosmetic and psychological changes.
When you're serious about balance, you nerf something significantly, or you don't touch it.
I don't see how that is true. To much change will cause for something to be re-evaluated once again "drastically". Not to mention all the effects for which such an action would cause while waiting for further changes. Small and gradual changes that are made to meet a goal always end with a happier player base.
Don't believe me? Look at the difference in companies who do slow and gradual to the ones that make flavor of the months.
"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn" |
Bane Necran
42
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
League of Legends? Really? All they do is churn out cartoon characters, at a rate of something like 5 a month. Of course they have to constantly go back and correct mistakes. If you're over 25 and play that game, it might be time to take a good look at your life.
As far as constant steady balancing goes in other MMOs, the first one that comes to mind is Blizzard, who gave up trying to balance classes a number of years ago, and no one seems to care. |
Large Collidable Object
morons.
207
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
I wouldn't say FOTMs are necessarily a bad thing - they encourage older players to try something new every once in a while and provide new players with new goals to train for. Imbalance adds flavour.
Having that said, there should be regular rebalances - 3 years of playing Dramiels online when it comes to frig combat, Minmatar online when it comes to smallscale/medscale roams or Supercaps online in 0.0 is boring.
I really don't know what is taking them so long - I can see the reason with Supercaps, as there are quite some assets involved, but who cares if e.g. The dramiel is entirely useless after the nerf? It had its ~3 years of playing in an entirely different league than 90% of the other frigs and it could always be buffed back in 5 years.
morons-áare recruiting. We're good at breeding! |
Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:League of Legends? Really? All they do is churn out cartoon characters, at a rate of something like 5 a month. Of course they have to constantly go back and correct mistakes.
If you're over 25 and play that game, it might be time to take a good look at your life.
Way to miss the point you of the thread you half-witted noob.
The point is they are constantly looking at how things work and make adjustments as needed. An example that people keep bringing up is the Dramiel. If CCP payed attention, once they noticed it getting out of hand effectively replacing frigate after frigate as the go-to ship for a frigate pilot, they could have made some tweaks to keep it in its intended role.
Do you honestly think CCP thought, "Hey, lets change the Dramiel so it replaces all interceptors, assault frigates and tackle." You really think that?
Do you smell that?
Yeah, it's the coffee. NOW WAKE THE **** UP!
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:I really don't know what is taking them so long - I can see the reason with Supercaps, as there are quite some assets involved, but who cares if e.g. The dramiel is entirely useless after the nerf? It had its ~3 years of playing in an entirely different league than 90% of the other frigs and it could always be buffed back in 5 years.
You are the ugliest thing I have ever seen on the internet, but you're right. If it was nerfed to nothingness at least it opens back up a ton of options for the frigate class.
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Bane Necran
42
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think you missed my point.
Literally, all they do, is churn out characters. Nothing else has been done to the game for years now. They just keep rushing new characters out the door, so players can use them on the same maps which have existed since beta.
If all you're doing is making new characters as fast as possible, then all you're going to be doing, aside from making more characters, is adjusting those characters.
You can't even compare it to EVE, because CCP do much, much, more than just create new ships, and EVE is many times more complex. |
Sofia Bellard
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
24
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 22:50:00 -
[16] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:I think you missed my point.
Literally, all they do, is churn out characters. Nothing else has been done to the game for years now. They just keep rushing new characters out the door, so players can use them on the same maps which have existed since beta.
If all you're doing is making new characters as fast as possible, then all you're going to be doing, aside from making more characters, is adjusting those characters.
You can't even compare it to EVE, because CCP do much, much, more than just create new ships, and EVE is many times more complex.
Congratulations. Yet again, you totally miss the point of the thread.
Poor sad little pirates, -áwhy you so mad? |
Addrake
Origin.
Black Legion.
5
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 23:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:League of Legends? Really? All they do is churn out cartoon characters, at a rate of something like 5 a month. Of course they have to constantly go back and correct mistakes. If you're over 25 and play that game, it might be time to take a good look at your life.
As far as constant steady balancing goes in other MMOs, the first one that comes to mind is Blizzard, who gave up trying to balance classes a number of years ago, and no one seems to care.
This man is correct. If you're over 25 and playing LoL you have problems. On the other hand, Hello Kitty Online is fun for people of all ages. What it lacks in Ponies and Unicorns it makes up for with Kittens and Rainbows.
Note: Narcen Enab is a douche. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
15
|
Posted - 2011.09.17 23:38:00 -
[18] - Quote
Sofia. Have you forgotten that Eve players are generally quite clever people. It's a demographic metric we enjoy.
Quite often, when all scenarios are presumed accounted for by devs, some clever little player works out something that was not accounted for.
Our sandbox environment really does fall victim to the "Butterfly Effect" and even the slightest change of abilities could tip the game very rapidly to positive things and just as rapidly into negative things.
Players in scaps for example have enjoyed relative impunity. The fact that they cost so much should have been enough of a limiting factor. It turns out it isn't. But if you owned a scap and were told it's abilities were being "adjusted" every week, 2 weeks ad infinitum, you'd be a a bit peed off. The forward investment for corps/alliances is staggering and even smaller class vessels are relative to players wealth.
SP training alone to fly class X of ship is measured in months (sometimes years) and if I was 10 days from flying X ship after 7 months of training and then told it was being nerfed, I'd be emoragequtting all over the universe!
Cause and Effect is a very fine line to tread in Eve. Caution is an absolute.
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. |
Havak Kouvo
State War Academy
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.18 00:33:00 -
[19] - Quote
Maybe they could try to commit to an update once per month with a few balancing and bug fixes. So almost 6 updates between expansions for that purpose. These minor updates would only touch on balancing, and any major changes to balancing that would really effect tactics would only come with expansion, to not tick of the player base TOO much with too much change, but often enough as to keep tactics and strategies changing.
Maybe each expansion is designed to change stratetgy and tactics to favor a specific kind of playing.. like a covert-ops expansion, then the next is a frigate expansion, etc. |
Tuggboat
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
2
|
Posted - 2011.09.18 02:30:00 -
[20] - Quote
Balance is always transitory, the player bases fits and tactics evolve to fit whats available with little change by CCP. I seen like the drake go from underpowered to overpowered to littering the universe and now I barely hear about them and nothing has changed except the people using them's assumptions.
WHats needed are stealth nerfs and not public nerfs. We need to suspect they are going on so that we constantly retest our assumptions and rework fits and tactics.
Everybody likes to balance but they do it with all 5 stats and eft stuff but in reality the playerbase skill points evolve allowing new capabilities in actual practice. I seem to see much more t2 in the last year but If the Goons goo gets nerfed or wormholes or even drone space gets adjusted, you could see lots of changes without any ship rebalancing.
Super caps could be adjusted just by erasing the prints so there is no new production. People wouldn't bring them out as easily if they can't be replaced. Maybe only allowing one per region at a time. Real carriers don't need heavy density to project power. Here's another change without adjusting the ship.
I'm all for any ship changes being boosts to make them more fun and other changes to hold them back. |
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