I donno, do L4s count?

I mine.

Only if you do ones that simply require you to shoot everything, and if you only do them for the LP, and if you don't cash in that LP, and if you do them in a newbie ship with newbie weaponsGǪ

GǪanything more than that, and you've engaged in plenty competitive activities. Sure, the actual GÇ£accept missionGÇ¥ and GÇ£complete missionGÇ¥ buttons can't really be out-competed GÇö you're all alone with the game for those two button presses. Anything before, after, and in-between on the other handGǪ

i'm sorry you feel that way and we're not playing the game by your standards of e-bushido

i will proceed to commit seppuku as i have disgraced my family

actually no i'm just laffoin at u

Wait, you can use quest given destroyers and rat dropped loot, I think - that would still suffice.

Where the premise of this writer sees "growing and dangerous" from the perspective of someone in "goonswarm", there are several debatable premises here.

[list=1]

If "they" (whoever that is) wish to destroy the philosophy behind eve... what is that exactly? Doesnt the strictest interpretation of the sandbox so acclaimed in these threads imply that there should be a place int he sandbox for people who want to play in that other corner of the sandbox this writer is not interested in?

I noticed you add World of Warcraft as an exception, but it really isn't. Blizzard cares more about lost profit than any other company.

So where's the risk for the suicide-ganker?

WoW is losing players, but Blizzard is actively trying to stem the exodus; I'm referring specifically to companies that are forced by their corporate managers to rush a half-finished game to market simply because it's a holiday season and people will be buying lots of computer games.

I'm guessing you never played it at release... but yes, topic. Above post.

Ganking a Hulk (a non-combat ship) with your destroyer is NOT PVP. The people who do this "professionally" in eve are the ones who are actually avoiding PVP because that miner has no means to combat the gank situation... It's equivalent to someone coming up behind you on the street and punching you head.

words

Are you serious? Ganking a Hulk IS PvP. We can argue about the required skill or morals to do it, but it's undeniably PvP.

I'M sorry but you are wrong. PVP refers to 2 or more players actively competing against each other. How is a ganker competing against some guy afk mining veldspar?

The ganker is actually competing against the game mechanics and trying to kill a third party befor his competition (CONCORD) kills him. This is PVE... So grow a pair carebear

Are you serious? Ganking a Hulk IS PvP. We can argue about the required skill or morals to do it, but it's undeniably PvP.

It's not specially risky, some would argue it's not "fair" (a curious concept), but it's a form of PvP. And when ganking, the only one SURE to lose their ship is the GANKER.

People fails to understand that it's a sandbox...MMORPG. There are ways for players to inflict misery with consequences to other players.

High sec allows for players to be able to raise their heads until they understand the mechanics of the game. It allows new players to develop certain resources and skills in an environment where the potential gankers would LOSE something and ganking irrelevant things comes at a loss.

High sec does not offer protection. Only consequences. It's up to everybody to avod becoming a target, and for that, I'm glad it exists.

However, I agree that it should be MUCH SMALLER. Less systems.

We hear the same old flawed logic coming from the same people day after day...

In his latest Ten Ton Hammer article, The Mittani writes about many players' entitlement to "opt out" of PvP. Some even believe that this game does allow you to "opt out" by living in hisec, where the game's tutorial taught them how to shoot an NPC and mine an asteroid. Many believe that suicide ganking is an exploit, that CONCORD exists to protect them from all harm, and that nonconsensual PvP does not have a place in hisec. Many seem to agree with this notion - "suicide ganks drive away new players," they say. Or "it's bad for subscriptions." Whatever the reason, one thing is clear - they wish to destroy the philosophy behind the design of EVE, that competition is not optional, and the niche of the MMO world where it reigns - the PvP-centric MMO.

You know, I would argue there's really nothing competitive about EVE. Not really. A character with 500 SP cannot compete, in any way, shape or form, with a character who has 50 million SP. It is like putting a 4 year old girl into a ring with Mike Tyson and hoping to see a good fight - not gonna happen. The same notion extends to all facets of EVE. A new player will not mine as fast. A new player cannot trade as much, as broadly or as efficiently. A new player can't manufacture as fast. Etc., etc. And when a large group of older characters comes after newer players, the problem is further exacerbated.

If EVE was indeed a competitive MMO, there should be no skill queue training, and everything would depend on player skill, not character skills. Nobody would call Starcraft a competitive game, or an ESport, if one player had access to a full tech tree and the other could only make marines. Yes that's precisely what is happening in EVE, relatively speaking.

How does it apply to EVE? 60% or more live in high sec. There's a reason they chose to do it. If a faction of players makes it their mission in life to destroy that, guess what happens to those 60%? The assumption of the gankers is, these people will HTFU and move to low sec, wormholes, 0.0, etc. The reality is, as soon as it becomes too difficult to do what the player wants to do in a game, he'll quit that game and move on to the next. The question is, what will gankers do when that happens? They gather around the fire and sing kumbayah? For how long?

[quote=Richard Desturned]

The question is, what will gankers do when that happens? They gather around the fire and sing kumbayah? For how long?

The Miner profession is in better shape than ever.

Now the AFK Miner, BOT Miner and Theme Parker Miner is having trouble.

Subscribers have been leaving EVE for for a decade and yet it has been growing every single year. I wonder why.