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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.01 15:49:00 -
[1]
people always moan that there mission has been ninja'd or mission runners are making too much profit. i have an easy win win solution or rather loose loose.
it simple:
1 - lock of all mission dungeons so only fleet member may enter.
2 - despawn all loot and wrecks when the mission is turned in.
3 - decrease time limit for bonus for mission runners
what this does is if a mission runner wants his salvage he has to give up his bonus.if he wants his bonus he has to give up his loot/salvage. this also promotes fleet missions as it will be the only way to collect the max ammount of profit howether this is then split between multiple characters instead of 1.
as a by product this will clean up all those abandoned mission wrecks which cause servor problems.
this also opens up the avenue of selling your mission areas to local salvagers to salvage. this way ninja salvagers become legitimate workers just out there doing there job. tie it in with making it a proper profession and the whole ninja argument goes away completaly
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Flying ZombieJesus
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Posted - 2009.10.01 15:51:00 -
[2]
I agree. Current mechanics of ninja salvaging are working as intended.
Also did not read your post.
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Velocity Prime
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.10.01 16:00:00 -
[3]
Wow, another ninja salvaging thread, awesome! 
From another thread I just posted in:
Welcome to EVE, my friends, where the universe is not always on your side, contrary to what your mother may have told you. There are realities that you are going to have to get used to if you want to play with the rest of us, and frankly that suits me just fine. I enjoy a game (we are still playing a game, right?) where things are competitive and people's assets and well-being are not always safe.
There are several options available to you if you wish to deter high sec ninja salvagers. They are:
Ignore them.
Shoot them.
Mission in lowsec.
Don't run missions in a mission hub.
Wardecs. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*)
Hire mercs. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*)
Split the profits with salvager. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*)
Get a buddy to help you salvage a mission. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*)
We're Recruiting! |
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
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Posted - 2009.10.01 16:02:00 -
[4]
So you want the game to be instanced?
Why do you bother playing an MMO?
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Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer
"I've got a couple of Strippers on my ship... and they just love to dance!"
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.01 18:27:00 -
[5]
what im suggesting is some common scence. most missions have gates. gates can be locked and in the case of alowing someone else to salvage your wrecks unlocked. carebares can carebare but for less profit. salvagers can salvage but for a cost. in eve everyone has to work for their isk even pirates so its about time ninja salvagers have to too.
plex's and anomiliys and other sites will still be the same so if you like harrasing people you still can do.
this should make missions less profitable and salvaging more profitable
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XXSketchxx
Gallente
Remote Soviet Industries
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Posted - 2009.10.01 19:20:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Flying ZombieJesus
I agree. Current mechanics of ninja salvaging are working as intended.
Also did not read your post.
I read this post.
_____________________________________________
-Sketch, Certified Pharmacist
Need a Boost?
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Fullmetal Jackass
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Posted - 2009.10.02 09:38:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Velocity Prime
There are several options available to you if you wish to deter high sec ninja salvagers. They are:
Ignore them. - Doesn't solve the problem.
Shoot them. - Only if you want concord assisted suicide
Mission in lowsec. - Not really an option. The risk is too high vs reward. Unless you can find some deserted corner of low sec you'll lose more then you make. KM *****s see to that.
Don't run missions in a mission hub. - probably a good idea anyway but it doesn't solve the problem. They just show up were ever you move to eventually.
Wardecs. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*) - Empires wars are a joke. Complete fail.
Hire mercs. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*) - This goes along with empires wars but adds a large cost.
Split the profits with salvager. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*) Yeah right. Why would they pay you for something they can steal for free?
Get a buddy to help you salvage a mission. (Yes you'll have to interact with others to do this. *GASP!*) Unless you have a new buddy that can't run lvl 4s, he's gonna want to run his own missions. The other option is a salvage alt on another accout. Double the cost to play and you can still have your salvage stolen.
Ninja salvage really is a total win for the ninja. No risk. Lots of tears. High isk payout.
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Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2009.10.02 09:53:00 -
[8]
no boost for missions required.
nerf required.
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nafiy gnaw
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Posted - 2009.10.02 12:01:00 -
[9]
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 02/10/2009 12:06:49
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 02/10/2009 12:06:15
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 02/10/2009 12:02:39
Originally by: Fullmetal Jackass
Originally by: Velocity Prime
There are several options available to you if you wish to deter high sec ninja salvagers. They are:
Don't run missions in a mission hub. - probably a good idea anyway but it doesn't solve the problem. They just show up were ever you move to eventually.
Ninja salvage really is a total win for the ninja. No risk. Lots of tears. High isk payout.
Point 1: Nope, moving out of mission hubs DO work. Ninja-salvagers requires a system where there is a constant flow of large-number of lvl 4 mission runners. Yes, there will be ninjas in less populated systems but your chance of being salvaged is also lower.
Of course, moving out of dodixie and into Aunia dosent work......
Point 2: Maybe, the income of ninja-salvage can get quite high if the ninja is lucky enough to struck several lucrative mission in a row. This may need balance but thats also linked with rig prices.
I'd offer a one more methods of avoid being ninjaed:
1. "The ninja mission-running":
Set your directional scanner to 5AU and 360 degrees, untick "use overview settings" Click the "name" column twice so it rearranges into reverse-alphabetical order, scroll down and you'll see "scanner probes" if there are any within 5 AU.
Scan every time you pop a rat BS and if you see 4 "combat scanner probe" or "sisters combat scanner probe", it indicates that you're within 1 minute of being pinned down and therefore its time to warp out in your BS and warp in your speed-tanked salvaging ship (of course, I assume you always kill the scram frigate rat first).
Note: Both "combat scanner probe" and "sisters combat scanner probe" will come with the name "scanner probe" in overview (unless its possible to change the name of a probe...), these are the probes capable of probe you down. the "core scanner probe" and "sisters core scanner probe" wont be able to probe a mission runner and will show up as "core scanner probe" in the directional scanner. Ignore these. In fact, just scroll down to somewhere between a "S" and a "R" and if there are no scanner probes, you're fine. If there are 1, fine, 2, fine, 3, fine, 4, gtfo.
The scan frequency actually can vary. In a quiet system that has less than 50 in local, it can actually be never (since ninjas really never go to quiet systems as there are just not enough regular runners), in medium-hubs such as Zorrabed or Cat, it can be about 3-4 minutes where in major hubs such as dodi or motsu it will have to be very frequently if you dont want a ninja coming in salvaging and looting and griefing and harvesting your tears.
Yes, yes, some ninja will tell you "that way you never finish a mission", dont listen to those nosense, in EvE, lvl 4 mission runners outnumber ninja salvagers by far, and your battleship in mission will just be one of the 50 dots that shows up on the ninja's scanner, and actually, it will annoy the ninjas very much as for some odd reason some juicy mission-bear they're about to pin down just suddenly 'ninja puffed' into thin-air.
Even better: train astrometric 4, astrometric pinpointing/rangefinding to 3 (which takes a very short time) and pratice probe scanning yourself, then you will understand how you would potentially be scanned down and how to avoid that happening to you.
Oh, last thing that can be useful: equip a (appropriate) ECCM, especially if you are running in a marauder, ECCM increases your sensor strength, thus decrease the scan-probe signature (which is calculated by sensor strength / signature radius). This can buy you more time as the prober have to get their probes even closer in order to obtain a warpable 100% hit on you.
Hope it helps
-former ninja, current merc pilot, nafiy
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Stealnutz
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.10.02 12:42:00 -
[10]
Originally by: kongking wang
Edited by: kongking wang on 01/10/2009 18:41:53
Edited by: kongking wang on 01/10/2009 18:10:03
people always moan
A single gleaming truth in a bunch of other stuffs.
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Mad Maulkin
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Posted - 2009.10.02 13:01:00 -
[11]
Also like to point out that salvaging does not take houres, takes a couple of minutes in a good boat, so you wont loose your bonus...
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world
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kyrieee
Brutal Deliverance
Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:14:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Fullmetal Jackass
Mission in lowsec. - Not really an option. The risk is too high vs reward. Unless you can find some deserted corner of low sec you'll lose more then you make. KM *****s see to that.
Have you tried it? I'm pretty sure you haven't
Guess what though: I have, and it works great 
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:27:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Robert Caldera
no boost for missions required.
nerf required.
i did suggest a nerf. decreasing time for bonus so that you have to choose it over salvaging/looting.
Originally by: Mad Maulkin
Also like to point out that salvaging does not take houres, takes a couple of minutes in a good boat, so you wont loose your bonus...
salvaging time would tie into the top reply. if it is worked out just right then unless you have a dedicated salvager you loose out on something.
missions is nerfed because you dont get either your salvage or bonus and ninja salvaging is nerfed because they loose out on mission salvage.
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Traidor Disloyal
Private Nuisance
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:37:00 -
[14]
Originally by: kongking wang
this also opens up the avenue of selling your mission areas to local salvagers to salvage.
No.
You have three characters per account. You can skill up one of those characters to salvage wreaks very easily. You can then sell the mission area to yourself. Win Win for mission runner.
You need to go back to drawing board. Not so simple now is it?
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I have three characters. One has Cov Ops V along with all the bells and whistles that goes with it. |
Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2009.10.02 14:53:00 -
[15]
Originally by: kongking wang
i did suggest a nerf. decreasing time for bonus so that you have to choose it over salvaging/looting.
no, its a boost. While nobody is looting hours after mission completing, you add a timer where nobody may salvage. You're practically protecting salvage from third parties for your loot-timeframe.
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Fullmetal Jackass
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:11:00 -
[16]
Originally by: kyrieee
Originally by: Fullmetal Jackass
Mission in lowsec. - Not really an option. The risk is too high vs reward. Unless you can find some deserted corner of low sec you'll lose more then you make. KM *****s see to that.
Have you tried it? I'm pretty sure you haven't
Guess what though: I have, and it works great
Yeah actually I have, and the little bit extra payout aint worth it. Eventually you lose your mission ship (even with a scout alt that not everyone has), and quite frequently you end up in a SS or station waiting for a hostile to leave.
Lvl 3s are doable easy enough, but they don't make much isk do they?
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.02 15:55:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Traidor Disloyal
You have three characters per account. You can skill up one of those characters to salvage wreaks very easily. You can then sell the mission area to yourself. Win Win for mission runner.
You need to go back to drawing board. Not so simple now is it?
you do realise you cannot use more than 1 characters on the same account at the same time. to switch characters part way through will add even more time to your mission running as you have to first log out your combat character then log in you alt and fly him there do the job relog to combat character and then turn in the mission. this in effect has the same problem as flying bk to base and getting into a salvager. by the time you do all this with my idea your bonus timer would have run out.
not so simple for you now is it. get your facts right before you relpy.
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:02:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Robert Caldera
Originally by: kongking wang
i did suggest a nerf. decreasing time for bonus so that you have to choose it over salvaging/looting.
no, its a boost. While nobody is looting hours after mission completing, you add a timer where nobody may salvage. You're practically protecting salvage from third parties for your loot-timeframe.
it is a nerf. if you read my post properly you will see that if you salvage your timer will run out for bonus but if you turn in the mission to claim bonus the whole site including wrecks and loot despawns. once again if CCP calculates the times properly then this idea will work.
if a mission runner is doing it for lp/isk then they will always turn in there missions for bonus loosing all salvage but if they are doing it for salvage then they loose out on lp and isk bonus.
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Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:06:00 -
[19]
lol several hours of a L4 mission is not enough for salvaging??
You're kidding, arent you?
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.02 16:12:00 -
[20]
Edited by: kongking wang on 02/10/2009 16:13:55
Originally by: Robert Caldera
lol several hours of a L4 mission is not enough for salvaging??
You're kidding, arent you?
this promotes fleet activities.
its not going to be hard for ccp to work out an average time for people to run lvl4 missions for instance. they then use that time as a guide for bonus.
now if you decide to do your own salvaging then you will go over this time and therfore loose bonus unless you have a dedicated salvager with you. this now means a split of the profit. if you have 2 accounts then you are entitled to 2 splits of the profit.
on the other hand if you are not interested in the salvage as some arent then you will finnish on time and turn in the mission. on completion the whole site including wrecks and loot despawns freeing up space in that system.
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BeanBagKing
Ch3mic4l Warfare
Gypsy Nation
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Posted - 2009.10.02 19:17:00 -
[21]
Edited by: BeanBagKing on 02/10/2009 19:20:18
Edit: ignore this, don't care enough for form a proper response to yet another one of these.
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Panzram
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.10.02 20:47:00 -
[22]
remove salvage from mission wrecks completely.
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kongking wang
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Posted - 2009.10.02 20:49:00 -
[23]
Edited by: kongking wang on 02/10/2009 20:53:59
Originally by: Panzram
remove salvage from mission wrecks completely.
that could work howether it would probably ruin the rig market as majority of salv comes from missions
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Kahega Amielden
Minmatar
Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2009.10.02 22:07:00 -
[24]
Quote:
Yeah actually I have, and the little bit extra payout aint worth it. Eventually you lose your mission ship (even with a scout alt that not everyone has), and quite frequently you end up in a SS or station waiting for a hostile to leave.
Lvl 3s are doable easy enough, but they don't make much isk do they?
Then you're bad at it. The tools are available to dodge gankers, and there are areas with virtually no pirate activity.
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