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Renting a 0.0 system

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Lilly Tiger Minmatar Megalith Heavy Industries	Posted - 2009.11.19 13:14:00 - [1] Hi. Our corp would like to rent a 0.0 system from an alliance. This would be after Dominion comes out, so we would upgrade it ourselves (no need for a high value system in other words). Preferably the system should be deep in the alliance space with 1 or 2 gates, prefereably dead end with 1 gate leading through multiple alliance protected systems. Is this something alliances will start to offer after december the 1st, and if so, how much would it cost?
SpeakerForTheDad Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:46:00 - [2] Lily - Consider this a friendly bump from someone looking for a similar gig. If you get any takers and would like some company, let me know. Speaker The Dad Abides
ThePoPo28	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:11:00 - [3] Let me just give you a frame of reference, with the disclaimer that this is pre-dominion: PL currently will rent the use of space (not claiming sov) for around 5 billion every 3 months, and only to alliances (not individual corps). And this is among the cheaper I've heard of. I've seen that number thrown around per month in other places. If you want to rent the use of 0.0 systems, I'd recommend you look for alliances already renting in 0.0. It will certainly be a hell of a lot cheaper, though you have to get more involved with 0.0 politics. Will also be a lot easier to find.
Lilly Tiger Minmatar Megalith Heavy Industries	Posted - 2009.11.20 09:24:00 - [4] Originally by: SpeakerForTheDad Lily - Consider this a friendly bump from someone looking for a similar gig. If you get any takers and would like some company, let me know. Thanks. Could you let me know ingame or on the forums(this post) if you find it?
Lilly Tiger Minmatar Megalith Heavy Industries	Posted - 2009.11.20 09:36:00 - [5] Originally by: ThePoPo28 Let me just give you a frame of reference, with the disclaimer that this is pre-dominion: PL currently will rent the use of space (not claiming sov) for around 5 billion every 3 months, and only to alliances (not individual corps). And this is among the cheaper I've heard of. I've seen that number thrown around per month in other places. If you want to rent the use of 0.0 systems, I'd recommend you look for alliances already renting in 0.0. It will certainly be a hell of a lot cheaper, though you have to get more involved with 0.0 politics. Will also be a lot easier to find. Thanks I guess. I've seen at least 2 alliances doing this before (ive been playing since 2004), at much lower prices. You basically rented living rights in a system. But I will take your information into consideration, its almost a year since I last read about renting in 0.0 so my knowledge is a bit out of date. Here's to hoping its gonna be easier (and cheaper) to rent a no-good dead end system in 0.0 after Dominion comes out :)
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 14:08:00 - [6] Edited by: RD Hooker on 20/11/2009 14:09:21 Hi, I am the CEO of a corporation that is also interested in this. The problem with the PL route is the current invasion from IT - it is far from a good idea to rent PL space right now. My corp is willing to pay between 1 and 2 billion per month for station docking access, a couple deadend systems, station or systems near ice, and the option to come pewpew. Edit: My thread: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1217195
Chi'kote	Posted - 2009.11.20 14:19:00 - [7] I agree, I'd stay away from PL and fountain right now. I myself just left the area. From what I hear, ATLAS could be a good choice. Try contacting one of their diplos. Of course, you could always consider providence and CVA / Paxton Federation.
Dannerkongen Lootex	Posted - 2009.11.20 14:30:00 - [8] contact Aegis Militia
NightCrawler 85 Phoibe Enterprises	Posted - 2009.11.20 14:33:00 - [9] Try contacting Solar Wing.They all speak Russian but they have a ratehr good system going.We rented from them for about a year or so.But exept a rather high fee depending on what systems you want.
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 14:36:00 - [10] Isn't Solar Wing's space drone space?

KrakizBad Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:08:00 - [11] Yeah they are over drone regions, i would be careful about heading to solar as for the space they hold they are really small, with dominion its hard to say what will happen with thier renters and stuff. Another option is all the small corps merge into mine and we can join a nice size allaince without issue then :P
Dannerkongen Lootex	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:10:00 - [12] Edited by: Dannerkongen on 20/11/2009 16:10:02 Originally by: KrakizBad Another option is all the small corps merge into mine and we can join a nice size allaince without issue then :P this guy figured it out!
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:16:00 - [13] Merging isn't something my corp is very interested in. :) Renting, on the other hand, is very appealing.
KrakizBad Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:26:00 - [14] When you all of a sudden have options to mine ABC ores, get in fleets with FC who actually know how to FC, and can join good allainces with a solid history/leadership. Well these types of things can change viewpoints on mergers sometimes :P
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:34:00 - [15] This is true. However, we have decided that such a thing is something we want to grow into, and renting nullsec space would facilitate that quite well.
Chagal Civ Caldari Silver Snake Enterprise Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2009.11.20 16:41:00 - [16] i am unsure if we will rent some of our space but you can ask : liam fremen , if , when , where and at what price. there were talks about it earlier in alliance. Join us : Recruitment thread Our Corp forum link
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 17:08:00 - [17] Will do, thank you. For those interested, Atlas is also renting space - talk to ookke
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 17:53:00 - [18] Systematic-Chaos IS going to start renting space AFTER dominion launches.
SpeakerForTheDad Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.11.20 18:13:00 - [19] Originally by: Dannerkongen Edited by: Dannerkongen on 20/11/2009 16:10:02 Originally by: KrakizBad Another option is all the small corps merge into mine and we can join a nice size allaince without issue then :P this guy figured it out! Maybe for some folks, but not for me. It may be that I am simply ignorant - which can be cured, I assure you - but I simply do not understand why a small corp that is willing to pay its own way (alliance fees, rental fees, contributions of mining and manufacturing and research efforts, etc.) is not a valuable resource. It seems to me that the accumulation of like-minded corps is what alliances are for. If there is a reason that small (or tiny) corps cannot objectively contribute, someone please let me know. Lilly - I will try to catch you IG to talk a bit. For others who have responded here, look for me IG and let's talk further. Speaker The Dad Abides
KrakizBad Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.20 18:22:00 - [20] Their are alot of concerns when you let a small corp into a allaince. Will they grow? Will they actually be worth 2 **s? Will they be active? You have to understand, thier are THOUSANDS of small corps that ALL say yes to those, and do nothing. So allainces have learned to only let in bigger corps with alot of times a proven track record. A small corp looking to get involved will mostly likely have to Rent, or join a small allaince and hope it works out. Now Renting can be a good investment in a corp but its a dangerous line, as most renters arent going to give 2 **s about your corp, so you move your corp to 0.0 and get WTF pwnt. Lots of corps go this route and break up after 2-3 months if that long. Joining a small allaince can be more fun, but can also have drastic draw backs. Most times the lack of expience in true 0.0 situations dooms most small allainces before they even get off teh ground. This results in corps joining and getting shot to hell till they leave and head back to empire, most times much smaller then when they joined. Small corps also tend to die out. Maybe thier is 1 key person that really is the blood of the corp and if that person goes away, the corp vanishes as well. larger corps tend to have larger dynamics, so losing 1 person doesnt doom the corp. Also larger corps tend to be much further developed as a corp. This includes corp assets, cap pilots, ect. All the things that a bigger more secure allaince would be wanting. End result is it can be VERY hard for smaller corps to get off the ground. And alot of times they are only successful when they have people who devote asstons of time to building them. And having patience to get over teh recruiting humps. Anyway just my 2 pennies im sure its all wrong :P Now anyone want to merge into my corp? :P

SpeakerForTheDad Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.11.20 18:40:00 - [21] Actually, let me throw out an idea here: Could we form an alliance of small corps and present ourselves as a combination to improve one or more systems in 0.0? Again, the idea is that we would each maintain our corporate autonomy, but by presenting a blob of 50-100 toons we might be taken more seriously. Am I correct that everyone is in almost the same boat: 1) mostly mining/manufacturing/research with a bunch of missioning thrown in; 2) living almost exclusively in highsec, but lowsec/WH-curious [maybe even experimented a bit already]; 3) just don't know how to begin PvP, but willing to serve in any capacity to learn (burn 100 frigates in the process. I don't care.)? FWIW, I think this describes exactly the player that Dominion is supposed to pull into 0.0. The problem is that we have too much stuff to just turn it over to the ceo of another corp - and it is too much stuff to manage without a full complement of hangars and our own POSes. Have I described you accurately? I think that what the alliances are missing is our willingness to contribute to a team effort. They think that, because we want control of our assets, we won't show up when it's time to fight - or that we'll hoard the the increased ores, minerals, loot or ISK that come to us from our association with the alliance and the (relatively) secure home in 0.0 that comes with the alliance. How do we convince them that they are mistaken. Sure, I'd like to get more stuff, but I am after the expanded opportunities for game play - new ores, new rats, new challenges (especially learning to PvP in groups), different complexes - but mostly the opportunity to play the team game, combining to build a dread or a Titan, supplying, researching the T2's that are most popular with one corp in the alliance, hauling stuff to market from 0.0 - hell, making a local market from scratch. Again, if I have accurately described your situation and your goals, let's talk about combining in such a way that we make ourselves much more attractive to a sov-holding alliance. Lilly - thanks for getting this going. Speaker The Dad Abides
KrakizBad Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.20 18:55:00 - [22] Quote: [maybe even experimented a bit already] I did that with girls in highschool was good times. For my corp we are pure pvp with little in corp industry. 9 caps in corp, and have lived in 0.0 almost exclusively. After some issues with past corp we decided it was no longer the place we needed to call home. So we are now building our own, again. I built my prior corp to 100 members before we left. I have built and ran allainces in the past, so while we wouldnt be interested in joining ill be glad to chip in my 2 cents and help give you guys some ideas and suggestions. I can also create allainces if you guys do decide to go that route just drop me a line and we can work it out.
Cupdeez Out of Order Cult of War	Posted - 2009.11.20 19:00:00 - [23] Originally by: Lilly Tiger Originally by: ThePoPo28 Let me just give you a frame of reference, with the disclaimer that this is pre-dominion: PL currently will rent the use of space (not claiming sov) for around 5 billion every 3 months, and only to alliances (not individual corps). And this is among the cheaper I've heard of. I've seen that number thrown around per month in other places. If you want to rent the use of 0.0 systems, I'd recommend you look for alliances already renting in 0.0. It will certainly be a hell of a lot cheaper, though you have to get more involved with 0.0 politics. Will also be a lot easier to find. Thanks I guess. I've seen at least 2 alliances doing this before (ive been playing since 2004), at much lower prices. You basically rented living rights in a system. But I will take your information into consideration, its almost a year since I last read about renting in 0.0 so my knowledge is a bit out of date. Here's to hoping its gonna be easier (and cheaper) to rent a no-good dead end system in 0.0 after Dominion comes out :) With the new patch the alliance has to pay about 2-4 billion isk a month for each system it controls. This is the reason PL is one of the cheaper ones renting out systems at 5 billion a month. The upgrades must be done by the alliance holding the space. With this kind of price tag you will not see alliance renting space to single corps but probably smaller alliance. The price tag is just to much for a small corp to be able to make the space worth wild. Thanks, Cupdeez
SpeakerForTheDad Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.11.20 19:12:00 - [24] Originally by: KrakizBad Their are alot of concerns when you let a small corp into a allaince. Will they grow? Will they actually be worth 2 **s? Will they be active? You have to understand, thier are THOUSANDS of small corps that ALL say yes to those, and do nothing. So allainces have learned to only let in bigger corps with alot of times a proven track record. Grow? Not likely in my case - unless my kids decide to become active again. Active? Definitely and consistently for 1.5 years. Worth 2 hsits? No less likely than the largest corp you can take in. No more likely either. But it is a much smaller bet with a very small loss if it does not work out. Quote: A small corp looking to get involved will mostly likely have to Rent, or join a small allaince and hope it works out. Now Renting can be a good investment in a corp but its a dangerous line, as most renters arent going to give 2 *s about your corp, so you move your corp to 0.0 and get WTF pwnt. Lots of corps go this route and break up after 2-3 months if that long. Well, until the Alzheimers sets in, my corp is unlikely to break up. My previous post in this thread addresses the possibility of creating an alliance of like-minded and like-positioned corps. It's good to see that you endorse that approach. But I don't think that there is any chance that I - or the other voices I hear in this thread - will just run off to 0.0 and set up shop. We are aware of our limitations, and we'd like to learn the 0.0 ropes while we contribute the considerable skills and assets that we do* have already. Quote: Joining a small allaince can be more fun, but can also have drastic draw backs. Most times the lack of expience in true 0.0 situations dooms most small allainces before they even get off teh ground. This results in corps joining and getting shot to hell till they leave and head back to empire, most times much smaller then when they joined. This is the reason that we want to join an existing 0.0 alliance. We recognize that we lack essential skills for living in 0.0. We are more than willing to commit our highly desirable skills in payment - even as we commit to learning the essential skills from the ground up. Quote: Small corps also tend to die out. Maybe thier is 1 key person that really is the blood of the corp and if that person goes away, the corp vanishes as well. larger corps tend to have larger dynamics, so losing 1 person doesnt doom the corp. My corps have been around for well over a year - online almost every day. Quote: Also larger corps tend to be much further developed as a corp. This includes corp assets, cap pilots, ect. All the things that a bigger more secure allaince would be wanting. I think that I have plenty of assets and skills to make my corp worthwhile (see below). I don't know the exact situation of the other small corps in this thread, but I suspect they are similar. Quote: End result is it can be VERY hard for smaller corps to get off the ground. And alot of times they are only successful when they have people who devote asstons of time to building them. And having patience to get over teh recruiting humps. My corps come from a year and a half of solo play - using different toons to enable different play trajectories. So the corp is very tight and very stable. Quote: Anyway just my 2 pennies im sure its all wrong :P Now anyone want to merge into my corp? :P I really appreciate you comments, and I think I understand all you have said. Explain to me how do I keep control of all of my stuff when I join your corp? I have four active POSes and hundreds of BPOs (and ships and guns and ammo and modules) and half a dozen offices. This is for three toons that share a single brain and ten fingers. What happens if I put all of these assets into your corp, and you sell them or move them into a hangar that I cannot access? \|\| Post length limit reached \|\| Speaker The Dad Abides
SpeakerForTheDad Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2009.11.20 19:22:00 - [25] Originally by: Cupdeez With the new patch the alliance has to pay about 2-4 billion isk a month for each system it controls. This is the reason PL is one of the cheaper ones renting out systems at 5 billion a month. The upgrades must be done by the alliance holding the space. With this kind of price tag you will not see alliance renting space to single corps but probably smaller alliance. The price tag is just to much for a small corp to be able to make the space worth wild. My experience is very different. My tiny corp would gladly pay the entire 2-4 billion a month to rent a system AND share it with other corps in order to fully exploit and improve the space. Anybody here want to sub-let? Pool our resources to make the rental fee? Seems cheap to me even at that price. You have to understand that we are looking for new forms of game play. The ISK will come with the natural activity of committed players. Speaker The Dad Abides
Dexster916 Blackwater USA Inc. Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2009.11.20 20:28:00 - [26] Gentlemen's Club has options avaliable as well which aren't based on flat cost but based on member count. I will not speak to alts about it either, please message me with your main account with the corp your interested in having come out. :p Convo me for details.
adriaans Amarr Ankaa. Nair Al-Zaurak	Posted - 2009.11.20 20:52:00 - [27] Originally by: SpeakerForTheDad Originally by: Cupdeez With the new patch the alliance has to pay about 2-4 billion isk a month for each system it controls. This is the reason PL is one of the cheaper ones renting out systems at 5 billion a month. The upgrades must be done by the alliance holding the space. With this kind of price tag you will not see alliance renting space to single corps but probably smaller alliance. The price tag is just to much for a small corp to be able to make the space worth wild. My experience is very different. My tiny corp would gladly pay the entire 2-4 billion a month to rent a system AND share it with other corps in order to fully exploit and improve the space. Anybody here want to sub-let? Pool our resources to make the rental fee? Seems cheap to me even at that price. You have to understand that we are looking for new forms of game play. The ISK will come with the natural activity of committed players. My alliance is based somewhat upon that, we are currently 3 groups who are slowly building up for 0.0, most likely a renting of a system approach in the start. What we have that many others don't have is several members with good pvp experience and our own fc's, what we lack that others have however is financial and somewhat logistical resources. We are patient and co-operative and would gladly share with others through a mutual beneficial teamwork! Should anyone be interested in working together with us (in any way), feel free to contact me and yeah, once you have a decent upgraded 0.0 system, the isk for monthly coverage should come a lot easier. -sig- Support the introduction of Blaze crystals for Amarr! Originally by: UMEE if ure another fotm re-roller, then dont pvp. you'll fail. QFT!
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 20:54:00 - [28] SpeakerForTheDad, I like that idea. Forming an alliance of smaller corps looking to make a home for ourselves in nullsec... I'm game. If we're able to successfully make use of whatever nullsec space we get, it could be quite beneficial to both us and whatever alliance we're renting from / living with. I would certainly be interested in this. I'll get a channel started up for the discussion of this in-game.
RD Hooker	Posted - 2009.11.20 20:59:00 - [29] I have started the channel Small Corps with Grand Plans for discussion of a possible alliance of small, more industrial-focused corps such as ours with the goal of getting settled in nullsec space.
Dannerkongen Lootex	Posted - 2009.11.20 22:04:00 - [30] yo Krakiz i might chat u up sometime soon when i bother logging on we should talk more



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