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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.27 14:39:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Najenna on 27/11/2009 14:40:08
Just wondering affter all these years that carriers and motherships have been in game as to why they don't have "AA" guns on them? I am not complaining or anything just a true honest question.
I only ask this cause due to the fact that in real life most if not all Naval ships have "AA". I know Eve is not a real life game so I will say in in the SciFi world ( Space movies and cartoon movies such as Star wars, Robotech, Macross, ect ect had some type of "AA" on thier carriers and motherships.) Yes I know we have frighter drones and smart bombs but As what was seen in the new Dominion video that carrier was shooting off "AA". I would like to see in the futrue that carriers and motherships would have this as a defense.
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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
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Posted - 2009.11.27 14:42:00 -
[2]
Game balance.
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CCP StevieSG
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Posted - 2009.11.27 14:46:00 -
[3]
Moved to Ships and Modules from EVE General.
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.27 14:48:00 -
[4]
I understand game balance. The idea i am having is that the "AA" would only attack other fighter drones and regular drones that got within distance of the Carrier or morthership. The "AA" would not attack player space craft. I can also understand that it might have to do with graphics and lag.
It could be where it is something that is already on the ship not a module add-on. Skill based to where you get a 5% increase to dmg of "AA" and tracking. But not so ubber that it would kill every drone or fighter drone that comes against it. Just a little added defense is all.
Even in the Movies,Cartoons, and real life "AA" was not ubber at shooting everthing down but it did add more defense and ablility to survive attacks.
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.27 14:55:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: CCP StevieSG
Moved to Ships and Modules from EVE General.
This is bullcrap Stevie. You moved a perfactly legitimate conversation that belongs in the General discussion forum index to here. This is not about fitting a ship. This thread belongs back in the general conversation cause it has to deal with Eve in whole. Now you moved to where no one is going to read it and I will not get any feed back on it. I am glad to see Gm's and forum devs moving posts but yet don't respond to players questions. Shame on you Stevie 
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Lubomir Penev
Dark Nexxus
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Posted - 2009.11.27 15:16:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Najenna
I understand game balance. The idea i am having is that the "AA" would only attack other fighter drones and regular drones that got within distance of the Carrier or morthership.
The smartbombs that are part of any decent carrier setup do a far better job for your specific purpose.
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081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner
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Nick Curso
Black Nova Corp
IT Alliance
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Posted - 2009.11.27 15:33:00 -
[7]
Well carriers/moms fit Smartbombs. Why not remove them and have something that does similar damage at a similar range that is a carrier/mothership module only but looks cook as fak i would be up for that.
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Gieron
Middleton and Mercer LLP
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Posted - 2009.11.27 16:08:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Najenna
Just wondering affter all these years that carriers and motherships have been in game as to why they don't have "AA" guns on them? I am not complaining or anything just a true honest question.
I think the real answer is because no one has implemented it. It's not like CCP took the blueprints of a real carrier and removed the AA guns.
It's the same reason industrial ships don't have cargo doors. Or why Moa's don't have cow bells.
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.27 19:12:00 -
[9]
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
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Aurorae Andromedae
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Posted - 2009.11.27 19:14:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
Stop referring EVE to REAL LIFE, please.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2009.11.27 19:25:00 -
[11]
I have to admit, the trailer looked pretty, kind of like the point defence that big ships had in Homeworld II
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.27 19:33:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Najenna on 27/11/2009 19:33:38
Originally by: Aurorae Andromedae
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
Stop referring EVE to REAL LIFE, please.
Please stop being a forum troll. If you would have read the rest of my post you would have seen I was compairing to Real life, Movies , Cartoons and Science fiction.
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Haxfar Portlaind
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Posted - 2009.11.27 19:47:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
IMO that looked more like AC fired on the carrier by other ships, after all, the only difference on the trailer and real eve, is their grafic setings, and that it's staged.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.11.27 23:46:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Najenna
Edited by: Najenna on 27/11/2009 19:33:38
Originally by: Aurorae Andromedae
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
Stop referring EVE to REAL LIFE, please.
Please stop being a forum troll. If you would have read the rest of my post you would have seen I was compairing to Real life, Movies , Cartoons and Science fiction.
stop referring eve to anything that isn't eve then.
but why do titans only have 8 slots, they are huge they should have like 1023020 slots!!!
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superteds
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Posted - 2009.11.27 23:51:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
it was incoming AC tbqfh
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CrazySpaceHobo
Caldari
Mysterys Inc.
Clandestine Encounters
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Posted - 2009.11.28 00:22:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
I'm sorry, when is this, I only see incoming autocannon fire.
It's quite interesting how CCP can make something like that and people immediately think "OMGWTF CCP IS TOTALLY ADDING AA FIRE FROM CARRIERS OMG CCP WHEN ARE YOU ADDING THIS LOLOLOLOL" Instead of thinking (like the rest of us) "That looks like some pimped out autocannon graphics, but it's a trailer after all, so we'll let it ride."
If CCP are planning to add something, they'll probably tell us about it in advance, dont think you might have stumbled upon something magically new because you're much clever than everyone else.
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Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer
Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.11.28 00:43:00 -
[17]
Since we're on the topic, why are they called smrt bombs?
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.28 00:57:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: Najenna
Edited by: Najenna on 27/11/2009 19:33:38
Originally by: Aurorae Andromedae
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
Stop referring EVE to REAL LIFE, please.
Please stop being a forum troll. If you would have read the rest of my post you would have seen I was compairing to Real life, Movies , Cartoons and Science fiction.
stop referring eve to anything that isn't eve then.
but why do titans only have 8 slots, they are huge they should have like 1023020 slots!!!
Go away little nooblet. Your words mean nothing here.
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Najenna
Minmatar
Minmatar and Gallente Association
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Posted - 2009.11.28 01:04:00 -
[19]
Originally by: CrazySpaceHobo
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
I'm sorry, when is this, I only see incoming autocannon fire.
It's quite interesting how CCP can make something like that and people immediately think "OMGWTF CCP IS TOTALLY ADDING AA FIRE FROM CARRIERS OMG CCP WHEN ARE YOU ADDING THIS LOLOLOLOL" Instead of thinking (like the rest of us) "That looks like some pimped out autocannon graphics, but it's a trailer after all, so we'll let it ride."
If CCP are planning to add something, they'll probably tell us about it in advance, dont think you might have stumbled upon something magically new because you're much clever than everyone else.
No I am sorry mate but if you download the trailer and play it in slow motion you will see that its coming off the carrier and not onto the carrier.
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Madner Kami
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.11.28 01:37:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Najenna
No I am sorry mate but if you download the trailer and play it in slow motion you will see that its coming off the carrier and not onto the carrier.
[Subliminal Message]Maybe the carrier had ACs fitted...[/Subliminal Message]
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Adamai
Gallente
Naval Protection Corp
True Intentions
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Posted - 2009.12.07 03:11:00 -
[21]
huh a new trailer... what ya on about new trailer, we dont get new trailers in eve your havin a laugh mate.
and we dont get nerfs glitchs or exploits and come to think of it no lag too.
its all just a bunch of conspiracy theories.
but yea i would like to see carriers with some kind of point defence and there was a mention of it a while back a point defence module for carriers and moms oops i mean super carriers.
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.12.07 03:18:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Aurorae Andromedae
Originally by: Najenna
But yet in thier trailer they show a carrier using Flak or AA to shoot at drones. Yes I am not argueing the fact of a smart bomb. But CCP should show a smart bomb going off instead of using flak or AA. It misleading. Also what I am saying is that instead of fitting a smart bomb the carriers and motherships could already have the Flak guns or AA guns on the ships. Meaning no module slot required. Like I said previously stated that these guns would not be ubber strong but something cool to have a nd alittle more realistic.
But I guess thats just me and how I think. But CCP should not advertise of show such things in a trailer. My 2 cents.
Stop referring EVE to REAL LIFE, please.
How about we start by referring EvE to Common Sense. Reality be damned.
Originally by: CCP Oveur
The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Athar Mu
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.12.07 04:19:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Haniblecter Teg
Since we're on the topic, why are they called smrt bombs?
There not they are called smartbombs.
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Sky Burner
Gallente
Rainbow Sky Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.12.07 10:00:00 -
[24]
I think it is a frame-rate issue of some kind. Like when you watch a car wheel spinning at certain speed and it looks like it is spinning backwards. If you look closely at the alliance tournament videos it often looks like the ship that is actually shooting the ACs is being shot at.
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Arturo Vetronas
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Posted - 2009.12.07 22:12:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Arturo Vetronas on 07/12/2009 22:13:12
in either case we are talking about something that doesn't exist, i'm pretty sure whatever it is, its coming FROM the carrier...
1) if they're autocannon graphics, carriers have no turret slots
2) if they're point defense/flak/AA, well it doesn't exist in game yet
i for one would not have a single problem with a Flak/Point Defense/AA Module in game.
Make it have enough damage to put the hurt on orbiting drones, be able to engage maybe 2-3 targets at a time (or one per geometric face of the ship, aka front, rear, top, bottom, side, side = 6), uber tracking, zero falloff, enough optimal to reach all drones base optimal ranges so that drone users have a choice of buffing their drones optimal to be safe by using a rig (btw this would still be less than typical orbit range of even short range inties/afs so they aren't broken and will only be engaged as they pass by), apply generous amounts of ooey gooey awesome special effects, mess with the fitting requirements/cap usage so that it fits into the game (by the way it could even be set up so that bs and bc could equip it at high pg cost or something to serve as flak escort)
TBH with fighter-bombers on the horizon for carriers/moms EVE could benefit in a number of ways from a well-implemented AA/Flak/Point Defense Module
Additionally there could be race variants so that minnie looks like tracers from a gatling gun, amarr look like little beams (pref blue haha), maybe be a little creative with gallente/caldari with maybe one option being a generic cannon with maybe a flak explosion on impact for both, and the other being that only gallente get that while caldari get miniature rockets as an effect that have a flak burst on the end
then we can all equip whichever race variant we like best visually or whatever. of course there could be a bonus to damage or a bonus to the number of targets engaged or optimal if you use the version that goes with the ship you're driving...
i for one heartily endorse the addition of such a module to the game, usable on capitals right down to BC or even lower at the cost of filling all fitting space.
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Madner Kami
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.12.07 22:51:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Madner Kami on 07/12/2009 22:54:11
Originally by: Arturo Vetronas
1) if they're autocannon graphics, carriers have no turret slots
As well as Capsules have no fitting options (there was a thread on here earlier today, where someone has a capsule-fitting layout with Titan-weapons and whatnot and I believe I also have a cruise missle-fitting layout somewhere, with GM Smartbombs and MWDs and GM Beams). As well as Abaddons don't have an ancient superweapon from Earth, which inverts shields so, that they destroy the shield-projecting ship. As well as a Damnation will never come out of warp, turn and speed up like an interceptor. As well as a Titan fleet is rather unlikely to be missed, when entering the grid or even the system. As well as Concord would never get their asses handed to the dark and cold void by a mix of Thukker Tribe and Republic ships. As well as a ship of the size of an EVE-battleship will only have 7-8 large guns and no smaller guns at all. As well as...
I think you get the point. Trailers are there to inspire some awe and show what the game-world is imagined as, in a large scheme of things. Ingame, however, immersion and realism are not even remotely as important as balance is. As cool, helpfull and logical PDWs for larger ships would be, it's just as equally game-breaking (as sad, as it may be, I need to admit  ).
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Arturo Vetronas
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Posted - 2009.12.07 23:02:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Arturo Vetronas on 07/12/2009 23:02:19
Originally by: Madner Kami
Edited by: Madner Kami on 07/12/2009 22:54:11
Originally by: Arturo Vetronas
1) if they're autocannon graphics, carriers have no turret slots
As well as Capsules have no fitting options (there was a thread on here earlier today, where someone has a capsule-fitting layout with Titan-weapons and whatnot and I believe I also have a cruise missle-fitting layout somewhere, with GM Smartbombs and MWDs and GM Beams). As well as Abaddons don't have an ancient superweapon from Earth, which inverts shields so, that they destroy the shield-projecting ship. As well as a Damnation will never come out of warp, turn and speed up like an interceptor. As well as a Titan fleet is rather unlikely to be missed, when entering the grid or even the system. As well as Concord would never get their asses handed to the dark and cold void by a mix of Thukker Tribe and Republic ships. As well as a ship of the size of an EVE-battleship will only have 7-8 large guns and no smaller guns at all. As well as...
I think you get the point. Trailers are there to inspire some awe and show what the game-world is imagined as, in a large scheme of things. Ingame, however, immersion and realism are not even remotely as important as balance is. As cool, helpfull and logical PDWs for larger ships would be, it's just as equally game-breaking (as sad, as it may be, I need to admit ).
yes indeed, I get the point, already knew the point, was well aware of the point, technically i backed up the point which you made in my first statement that the whole idea is pretty much imagination at this point, however i then proceeded to state my vision for how such a concept could be practically implemented into eve, do you agree? or not? why?
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Madner Kami
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.12.07 23:08:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Madner Kami on 07/12/2009 23:11:15
Originally by: Arturo Vetronas
yes indeed, I get the point, already knew the point, was well aware of the point, technically i backed up the point which you made in my first statement that the whole idea is pretty much imagination at this point, however i then proceeded to state my vision for how such a concept could be practically implemented into eve, do you agree? or not? why?
I think I already said: I expect it to be game-breaking in terms of capital/anti-capital warfare. Ships can only hold a very limited amount of drones and even carriers and supercarriers would run out of the little ones more sooner then later, especially if you take into account, that they can only field a limited amount of drones at first anyways. Similar things apply to frigates and possibly even cruisers, too. They'd just be overwhelmed and had absolutely no use anymore, as soon as a ship with such a module is on the grid.
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Arturo Vetronas
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Posted - 2009.12.07 23:17:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Madner Kami
Edited by: Madner Kami on 07/12/2009 23:11:15
Originally by: Arturo Vetronas
yes indeed, I get the point, already knew the point, was well aware of the point, technically i backed up the point which you made in my first statement that the whole idea is pretty much imagination at this point, however i then proceeded to state my vision for how such a concept could be practically implemented into eve, do you agree? or not? why?
I think I already said: I expect it to be game-breaking in terms of capital/anti-capital warfare. Ships can only hold a very limited amount of drones and even carriers and supercarriers would run out of the little ones more sooner then later, especially if you take into account, that they can only field a limited amount of drones at first anyways. Similar things apply to frigates and possibly even cruisers, too. They'd just be overwhelmed and had absolutely no use anymore, as soon as a ship with such a module is on the grid.
maybe, but as has already been said, its not a very big step to make from smartbombs to point defense, and they could be balanced such that it had fitting requirements that would force any non capital ship that fit it to substantially sacrifice from the typical fits...
i for one wouldn't mind just replacing smartbombs with this concept altogether... its barely different
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