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Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 17:26:00 - [1] Yo I've just read the black hawk down book twice in a row this week, and am looking for stories similar to it, describing a post-WW2 armed conflict in the same raw style as mark bowden did. I've seen a fair share of movies about the subject and I particularly liked Three Kings, but when it comes to BHD the movie doesn't come close to the book. (even tho its a decent film all by itself) I don't mind if its films or books, recommendations are welcome :) - Sok.
Drunk Driver Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2010.01.14 17:33:00 - [2] Three Kings is a crybaby anti-war movie. Watch Full Metal Jacket. It's a vulgar stomp your guts out anti-war movie.
Calvin Firenze Minmatar Nex Exercitus IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.01.14 17:51:00 - [3] I can't think of many post-WW2 films, but Platoon and We Were Soldiers come to mind. Also, I agree with Full Metal Jacket, loved that movie. "This is my rifle, this is my gun. This is for fighting this is for fun!" Originally by: Xanos Blackpaw some people need to have the stupid beaten out of them
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:02:00 - [4] Originally by: Drunk Driver Three Kings is a crybaby anti-war movie. Watch Full Metal Jacket. It's a vulgar stomp your guts out anti-war movie. I know FMJ and yes, it's great, but I would consider it a raw anti-war movie in exactly the same sense as Three Kings, so why the hate?
karma militia	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:04:00 - [5] Originally by: Sokratesz Yo I've just read the black hawk down book twice in a row this week, and am looking for stories similar to it, describing a post-WW2 armed conflict in the same raw style as mark bowden did. I've seen a fair share of movies about the subject and I particularly liked Three Kings, but when it comes to BHD the movie doesn't come close to the book. (even tho its a decent film all by itself) I don't mind if its films or books, recommendations are welcome :) - Sok. Well i don't know what to recommend to you, since i generally despise the glorification of war. But i just read this book called "Shantaram". It's high quality stuff, about an educated ex-con with a guilt complex and a mild death-wish, and his adventures in India. And if your lucky, you might even get a little bit of war action in there. Originally by: Corwain The human race is going extinct soon and you all ****ing deserve it.
Magnus Nordir Caldari Nordir Industries	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:06:00 - [6] If you don't mind non-American ones, -9 Рота (9th company) -Lepa sela lepo gore (Pretty village, pretty flame) --------------------------- Only those who surrender are lost
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:30:00 - [7] Originally by: karma militia Well i don't know what to recommend to you, since i generally despise the glorification of war. I'm looking for the exact opposite of glorification. (something that the BHD book makes more clear than the film) I'll have a look at those mentioned, thanks.
Jin Nib Resplendent Knives	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:37:00 - [8] Generation Kill, both the mini series and the book are excellent. -Jin Nib Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since: 2009.03.02 03:53:00
Malaclypse Muscaria	Posted - 2010.01.14 18:37:00 - [9] You asked for post-WWII stuff, but I'm nonetheless going to plug something I've been watching and reading about over the last days: the Battle of Stalingrad. The interest started after catching on NatGeo an excellent WWII documentary called "Apocalypse", which features a lot of impressive newly uncovered footage on the war. While it hasn't featured much on western culture / media (given the Cold War and the animosity towards the Soviets), Stalingrad was by large the bloodiest most brutal battle know to mankind, as well as the turning point of WWII and the Third Reich's beginning of the end. For comparison, while on the Invasion of Normandy the Allied casualties were around 120.000 and Nazi around 113.000, on Stalingrad the Axis sustained 841.000 casualties, while the Red Army 1.130.000. I've been re-watching the movie "Stalingrad" (pretty good, and although I had seen already many years ago, it was without the historical background, which has made it more interesting), and even "Enemy At The Gates" (ok movie, even though a lot of it is fictionalized to fit standard film drama, it's based on a real historical figure, the Soviet sniper-hero Visily Zaytsev). Fascinating stuff and an exceptional testament to the brutality of war. After reading things online and watching those movies, I'm looking now for a good book on the subject.
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 19:17:00 - [10] Edited by: Sokratesz on 14/01/2010 19:18:09 I've seen the (german made) movie stalingrad a few years back with my cousin (who is a history MSc and WW2 fanatic, and I remember it as pretty good, but after the flood of WW2 movies and series of the past decade and a recent personal interest in the present-day military I'm looking for something more recent. I have seen a few bits of the apocalypse series on natgeo and while most of it was good stuff, it also contained some major, easily verifiable errors and felt one-sided in many occasions. I think enemy at the gates was one of the first war movies I ever saw and I liked it better before I learned much more about the conflict ;)
Zubenelgenubi Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2010.01.14 19:45:00 - [11] Edited by: Zubenelgenubi on 14/01/2010 19:50:50 Ripcord Not a very well known battle in the vietnam war but will make you say WTF?! and ZOMG! very often. Keep an eye out for subtle comments relating to the media and the exit strategy from FSB ripcord....... WWSOAY We were soldiers, nuff said book > film as always. Phase Line Green Good narrative style from the author really keeps you going on, the battle for Hue was a ridiculous meatgrinder. Another Wowfilled read Six Silent men series 3 books, based on the ridiculouslydaring escapades of the Long Range recon patrol guys in the 101st, written by vets. Very entertaining. Dak To Very good book, bit heavy on the leadup to the battle but it shows what kind of a bond existed in a unit specifically created to fight a totally new type of warfare and the difficult they faced keeping the team together with such great losses. Unheralded Victory Interesting revisionist history that everyone should read if they are bored of hearing how slabbered the yanks got in Vietnam and how everything they touched went to poo. (sick of that myself tbh) Khe Sanh Khe Sanh, nuff said, EPIC battle EPIC EPIC. "...Thus began what many considered the most concentrated application of aerial firepower in the history of warfare. On an average day 350 tactical fighter- bombers, 60 B-52 Stratofortress, and 30 observation aircraft operated near the base..." "operation Niagara" "operation Igloo White" MACVSOG Secret service CIA type stuff. Some of the things they spent money on, Incredible! That is a selection of my vietnam era book collection. I tried to steer away from the academic doorstops as I dont think that is your style. many of these are real page turners though. The reason I dont read any fiction is that the truth, i.e. things that actually happened are often even more fantastic than fiction. I've read about 50+ books on vietnam alone and I haven't read as much as a sentence that glorifies war..... quite the opposite. I think some of these books might be your thing. Could also recommend books on WW2 but they are more grand in their scope and not nearly as raw. Best place to start is hit wikipedia with any of the battle names or operations above. I had to stop reading this stuff so I could pass exams for my job hehe. oooh also... Hurt Locker the film is very good! ______________________________________________ Improvise, Adapt, Overcome & Annihilate
Grimpak Gallente Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2010.01.14 19:53:00 - [12] wtf where's Apocalypse Now? --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 20:05:00 - [13] ty zub! oh and, I once sat througfh the entire apoc now redux extended cut thing that lasted 4+ hours - i dont remember much from it tho i was stoned at the time
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2010.01.14 21:09:00 - [14] "Dispatches" by Michael Herr.
Daphne Mezereum Caldari	Posted - 2010.01.14 21:24:00 - [15] Stalingrad? Das Boot?
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.14 22:25:00 - [16] Originally by: Daphne Mezereum Stalingrad? Das Boot? Das boot was a great film but somehow I just <3 infantry and helicopters.
Intense Thinker Minmatar	Posted - 2010.01.15 03:40:00 - [17] Battle for Terra Originally by: a51 duke1406 The girls just dont understand that sunday is pvp night, not cuddle on the couch watching tv night.
Toshiro GreyHawk	Posted - 2010.01.15 04:13:00 - [18] OK ... There are two kinds of books which lie about war. The books which glorify war and the plethora of anti-war books. The works which glorify war are mostly written for political ends - by such as the Communists and the National Socialists. So - these aren't really "war" books persay - but political works designed to send the authors message and promote their agenda. Actual Anti-war books are just as bad - though ironically, some of the best works have been termed "anti-war" so you really can't use that as a guide line. Here, essentially, war is horrible, therefore a book that accurately depicts war is going to depict it as being horrible - and will be termed an "anti-war" book for depicting war as horrible. It's kind of like saying novels about the ocean are about how water is wet. War - is a fact of human existence. Human beings kill each other. They always have and they probably always will. The works which tell the truth about war - often glorify human courage, resourcefulness and persistence but also depict human stupidity, brutishness and their ability to be deluded. It is a sad fact that some of the bravest human actions have been taken by people who were in fact deluded in their thinking. Here - you have occasions where there was no good side - such as the war between the National Socialists and the Communists. Just two groups of people striving to kill each other - each in the name of an evil society. Stalin and Adolf (I can't write ****** <- see) both killed millions of Russians it just depends on who you read as to who killed more. War is fascinating because it is humanity at it's best and at its worst. It also brings forth the utmost in human effort. The thing about war that is really impressive - is the scale of it. To have all those human beings and all that machinery focused on one collective effort is when human beings most commonly reach their greatest potential. The fact that this potential is focused on killing each other - is just a comment on our species - but is more understandable if you focus on the fact that they are killing other people trying to avoid being killed by those people. shrug Trying to think of novels I've read on post WWII conflicts ... Sand in the Wind by Robert Roth - Vietnam A Sense of Dark by William Malliol- Korea Both of these are very well done but out of print. Look them up on Amazon and you can find some used copies cheap. I've read a number of novels on Vietnam but ... to many of them are filled with the self pity you find in German novels about WWII. Which is what happens when you have terrible sacrifices - but lose the war. shrug I can't say that any Vietnam novel is immune to that but some are worse than others. For myself, having served in the military during that war - though not in it - I tend to stay away from the subject ... as ... people with political motives - **** me off ... and there are ... a lot of books about Vietnam with political axes to grind. With WWII or earlier wars - you don't have as much political slant to the books. It's just hard to be objective about something that happened to YOU ... so ... often times it's later historians who are able to write objectively about a subject, free of the emotional involvement the participants have. They need first hand accounts of what happened from the participants but can weight what they read without reliving the trauma the participants experienced. Eh ... Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools
Jago Kain Amarr Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2010.01.15 04:17:00 - [19] In before the rash of 12 year olds pretending to be irl Special Forces and all the usual "semper fi mofo" blathering. ___________________________________________________ The game will never be over, because we're keeping the meme alive.
Athanasia Samsa Amarr Institute for Mental Hygiene	Posted - 2010.01.15 08:44:00 - [20] Originally by: Jin Nib Generation Kill, both the mini series and the book are excellent. this.
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.01.15 09:06:00 - [21] Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk War - is a fact of human existence. Human beings kill each other. They always have and they probably always will. The works which tell the truth about war - often glorify human courage, resourcefulness and persistence but also depict human stupidity, brutishness and their ability to be deluded. Cormack McCarthy: 'War was always here. Before man was, war waited for him. The ultimate trade awaiting its ultimate practitioner.' That feels 100% right when thinking of BHD and Three Kings - Originally by: Jago Kain In before the rash of 12 year olds pretending to be irl Special Forces and all the usual "semper fi mofo" blathering. A friend of mine got quoted on a major site once after trolling a discussion by saying 'I know a lot about firearms, you see, I played call of duty 4' Want to test a supercap on SISI but don't have one?
JordanParey Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2010.01.15 11:08:00 - [22] World War Z. Chosen Soldier by **** Couch.
Stratio Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.01.15 11:48:00 - [23] Edited by: Stratio on 15/01/2010 11:52:38 Not post-WWII, but "All quiet on the western front" is a classic. _____________________ For Tribe and Honour!
Daphne Mezereum Caldari	Posted - 2010.01.15 11:54:00 - [24] Catch 22?
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2010.01.15 16:30:00 - [25] I recall there being a movie about the spanish civil war called For Whom The Bell Tolls, check that out, I will as soon as I find a download. Also Children of Men has some realistic gunplay in it, or so I've been told. Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav! Also Known As
Malaclypse Muscaria	Posted - 2010.01.15 19:08:00 - [26] Originally by: Danton Marcellus I recall there being a movie about the spanish civil war called For Whom The Bell Tolls, check that out, I will as soon as I find a download. based on one of Ernest Hemingway's best books by the same name, and which he wrote based on first-hand experiences, as he got himself directly involved into the Spanish Civil War fighting against Franco's fascist insurgency. Speaking of the Spanish Civil War, a book I recommend is "The Battle For Spain" by Anthony Beevor (I liked it so much I just bought another history book he wrote on Stalingrad). Aside from the aspect the Civil War played in being a rehearsal for WWII (where Hitler's Luftwaffe honed and fined-tuned their skills at fire-bombing civilians on behalf of Franco, for instance), the bloodthirsty brutality and mass-executions it devolved into cannot be understood without knowing about the animosity, tension and conflicts that had been going on for a couple centuries between the two sides of Spain: the catholics, conservatives, nationalists, and landlords on one hand, versus the atheists, progressives, internationalists, and working classes on the other. Beevor does a good job in providing this historical background that eventually culminated into the Civil War. My grandfather had a few horror stories of the war and its aftermath, such as the nationals going village after village rounding up and executing on the spot any and every single person that even remotely smelled of being a godless leftist.
Joo Jah	Posted - 2010.01.15 19:31:00 - [27] What about TV series? I quite enjoyed "Over There".
Lt Forge Pilots From Honour Aeternus.	Posted - 2010.01.15 19:36:00 - [28] My great-uncle had his tongue shot off in the war. He never talked about it.
Haxfar Portlaind	Posted - 2010.01.16 20:23:00 - [29] if you can danish there is "De danske tigre" (the danish tigers) about fighting in the helmand provins, and the relief of British troops in musa quala. Dunno if there should exist a english version
Slade Trillgon Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.01.16 20:49:00 - [30] Many I know do not care for it, but I thoroughly enjoyed A Thin Red Line the one time I saw it. This is due to the director/writers angle on character development or lack there of and the imagery personally blew my mind. I saw the newest rendition of the movie which the original was done in 1964. I have not read the book by the same name though. Slade Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat! ≡v≡
Malaclypse Muscaria	Posted - 2010.01.16 23:18:00 - [31] Edited by: Malaclypse Muscaria on 16/01/2010 23:18:34 Originally by: Slade Trillgon Many I know do not care for it, but I thoroughly enjoyed A Thin Red Line the one time I saw it. This is due to the director/writers angle on character development or lack there of and the imagery personally blew my mind. I watched it in the movie theater when it came out, and it liked it a lot too. Very powerful imagery indeed, with its juxtapositions of the zen-like beauty of nature and the ugly carnage of human destruction. The first edit of the film was nearly 6 hours though, and it was brought down to nearly three after numerous cuts and edits, which explains its patchwork feel and why a lot of characters pop-up and disappear seemingly at random. Some big-name performances where entirely removed from the final cut, and others so trimmed they became merely cameos (personally, I would've really liked to see Gary Oldman's one). I've been wishing since then that they would someday release that original six hour version of the film.
Shinobi Jonin NorCorp Enterprise	Posted - 2010.01.17 03:45:00 - [32] For movies although it is WWII not after I would highly recommend Max Manus and heroes of telemark both films are true stories and about Norwegian Resistance movement during ** occupation with some bits about the Finnish/Russian war. so not all out war but resistance movements. Max Manus especially delves into the mentality of soldiers and how they get so accustomed to being soldiers that when the war is over they're lost Quite a common theme in wars it seems For war I would say Battle of Stalingrad is absolutly amazing "The man without the rifle follows the man with the rifle when the man with the rifle is killed the one without picks up the rifle" And then they kill their own fleeing soldiers Nothing else covers the astonishing mentality with which Russia defended itself and more or less wiped the **s off the map leaving only the clean up operation than that film in my experience.
Natasja Podinski	Posted - 2010.01.17 09:25:00 - [33] Bravo Two Zero by Andy Mcnab!! noobs the best internetbride for sexy katalog send 1KK ISK
XenoPagan	Posted - 2010.01.18 12:09:00 - [34] Originally by: Magnus Nordir If you don't mind non-American ones, -9 Рота (9th company) this movie was okay, except the ending battle. chechens charging the hill en masse 1st world war style? please. Behind Enemy Lines had _some_ good moments (balkans war) Talvisota - it is 2nd world war, but not another normandy, instead a very good movie about finnish-russian war

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