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Captain IQ
Innocent Traders Ltd
7
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Posted - 2012.06.26 00:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
The MenGÇÖs GÇÿSterlingGÇÖ Dress Shirt (Ishukone Special Edition) was trading for between 800 and 2.2billion before DT today, there was only about 20 floating around on the markets at the time, so they were much rarer than monocles, (I know one single trader was buying and selling about 6) anyway after DT today I noticed that CCP had placed these supposedly GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ shirts on the Noble exchange for a paltry 500 Aur each!
Based on this well thought out adjustment each would now be value (based on Aurum Tokens) at about 50million each tops. This trader was placing buy orders at around 800mil in Jita so whichever way you look at it heGÇÖs lost 4.5billion but probably more since all the buy orders were filled within minutes of the servers going up by the first traders that realised the mistake, I don't think he logged on in time to cancel them, lol.
Recently some of the shirts had actually been bought in Jita for around the 2.2bil mark so I suspect that those fashionistas are now less than happy when they soon see every other scrub wearing the same shirts at a fraction of the original comparable cost.
The original shirts were given out as part of a Plex promotion and the implication from CCP at the time was that these shirts were GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ and I guess some people thought that also meant GÇÿLimitedGÇÖ it now appears they were never GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ or 'Limited at all.
And no I wasnGÇÖt GÇÿthatGÇÖ trader but it has made me realise that the Noble Exchange is already messed up with the original launch items costing a ton more than these recently added items and I do wonder if this will be reflected eventually in their market value, since CCP cannot now devalue them for fear of upsetting those who bought some of the Noble Exchanges launch apparel?
The weird thing is that when WiS finally happens the richest players will actually be walking around wearing the oldest rags, nice one CCP.
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iskflakes
Magnets Inc. Imperial Auxiliares Regiment
5
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Posted - 2012.06.26 01:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
CCP seriously screwed up with the Ishukone shirt. People bought these for 13 PLEX, as a "special edition" item, and now they're next to worthless.
The people who bought these shirts for 13 PLEX will be pissed off. The people who bought these shirts on the market for 2 billion isk will be pissed off. The traders such as myself who held these shirts as a long term investment (after all, "special edition", right?) are pissed off. The traders who had buy orders up and wern't able to cancel them before they got shafted will also be pissed off.
I personally have lost about 3 billion due to this mess. Another trader friend of mine lost 7 billion. What a joke.
Edit: Forgot to mention the "guarantee" CCP gave that the price of existing clothing would not be changed. Just goes to show what CCP's promises are worth... |
Lord Jita
Lord Jita's Big Gay Corp
35
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Posted - 2012.06.26 01:20:00 -
[3] - Quote
I have been watching these shirts rise to ridiculous prices for some time now and laughed my ass off today when I checked the price this morning and realized they were in the NEX store now. Somebody really got the screws put to them. I've never seen a price graph as completely vertical as the one for these shirts. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
497
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Posted - 2012.06.26 01:45:00 -
[4] - Quote
As someone else who has been screwed by the illusion of a sandbox, you have my sympathies. . |
Dramaticus
Goonswarm Federation
156
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Posted - 2012.06.26 01:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
Clothing futures, not such a secure market. |
Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
432
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Posted - 2012.06.26 02:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dramaticus wrote:Clothing futures, not such a secure market.
Much like banked LP |
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
179
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Posted - 2012.06.26 02:14:00 -
[7] - Quote
I had a gut feeling about the NEX store when it opened up, Now it seems like their bringing down the prices to actually realistic levels, perhaps items will start selling now, perhaps their paving the way to micro transactions when our guard is down.
Perhaps I should keep my trap shut and not be the first.. but whatever still just a game at the end of the day. |
stoicfaux
1153
|
Posted - 2012.06.26 02:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Captain IQ wrote: Recently some of the shirts had actually been bought in Jita for around the 2.2bil mark so I suspect that those fashionistas are now less than happy when they soon see every other scrub wearing the same shirts at a fraction of the original comparable cost.
Yeah... because so many forum/evegate portraits show off what the user is wearing. =/
Quote:The original shirts were given out as part of a Plex promotion and the implication from CCP at the time was that these shirts were GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ and I guess some people thought that also meant GÇÿLimitedGÇÖ it now appears they were never GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ or 'Limited at all.
Caveat emptor... "All investments involve different degrees of risk. You should be aware of your risk tolerance level and financial situations at all times. Furthermore, you should read all transaction confirmations, monthly, and year-end statements. Read any and all prospectuses carefully before making any investment decisions. You are free at all times to accept or reject all investment recommendations made by the Foo, Inc. All products sold by Foo, Inc. are subject to market risk and may result in the entire loss to the client's investment. (For example: market conditions may result in the depletion of your equity.) Please understand that any losses are attributed to market forces beyond the control or prediction of Foo, Inc. As you know, a recommendation, which you are free to accept or reject, is not a guarantee for the successful performance of an investment and we are expressly prohibited from guaranteeing against losses arising from market conditions."
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head.
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corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
498
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Posted - 2012.06.26 02:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kara Books wrote:I had a gut feeling about the NEX store when it opened up, Now it seems like their bringing down the prices to actually realistic levels, perhaps items will start selling now, perhaps their paving the way to micro transactions when our guard is down.
Perhaps I should keep my trap shut and not be the first.. but whatever still just a game at the end of the day.
No one who was outraged about Incarna was outraged about microtransactions, they were outraged at the possibility of microtransactions for any sort of "play to win" scenario - "gold ammo" or what have you.
So basically who cares if they bring in other microtransactions, so long as they're limited to cosmetic **** only. . |
Charles Baker
Federal Mineral Acquisition
1
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Posted - 2012.06.26 02:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
I for one love my 500 point Ishukone jacket. |
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iskflakes
Magnets Inc. Imperial Auxiliares Regiment
5
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Posted - 2012.06.26 03:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Maybe it's time to sell my monocle stockpile before CCP brings out a tech 2 monocle that sells for 300 AUR and is slightly shinier than the existing one. |
Asura Kai
Khanid Astrogeology Consortium The Empiric Fleet Coalition
7
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Posted - 2012.06.26 03:37:00 -
[12] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:Captain IQ wrote: Recently some of the shirts had actually been bought in Jita for around the 2.2bil mark so I suspect that those fashionistas are now less than happy when they soon see every other scrub wearing the same shirts at a fraction of the original comparable cost.
Yeah... because so many forum/evegate portraits show off what the user is wearing. =/ Quote:The original shirts were given out as part of a Plex promotion and the implication from CCP at the time was that these shirts were GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ and I guess some people thought that also meant GÇÿLimitedGÇÖ it now appears they were never GÇÿSpecialGÇÖ or 'Limited at all.
Caveat emptor... "All investments involve different degrees of risk. You should be aware of your risk tolerance level and financial situations at all times. Furthermore, you should read all transaction confirmations, monthly, and year-end statements. Read any and all prospectuses carefully before making any investment decisions. You are free at all times to accept or reject all investment recommendations made by the Foo, Inc. All products sold by Foo, Inc. are subject to market risk and may result in the entire loss to the client's investment. (For example: market conditions may result in the depletion of your equity.) Please understand that any losses are attributed to market forces beyond the control or prediction of Foo, Inc. As you know, a recommendation, which you are free to accept or reject, is not a guarantee for the successful performance of an investment and we are expressly prohibited from guaranteeing against losses arising from market conditions."
This......
Investment can go up and can go bust so, no amount of tears will invoke sympathy from me. Instead, I can't stop laughing reading about some poor scrub making some poor judgements and lost billions !!!
On the other hand, kudos to the CCP for the introduction of the new clothing. And at reasonable price too. However i proposes CCP should bring previous older Nexgear items price down to current standard. If worried about devaluation of previous purchases, just refund the difference in Aurum to owner and I'm sure most will be happy camper. And introduce more clothings/Accessories please. Handbag and hat will be nice. And some bling as well. Do it right, it might even work as a good ISK sink. |
Coresone
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2012.06.26 04:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
Asura Kai wrote: On the other hand, kudos to the CCP for the introduction of the new clothing. And at reasonable price too. However i proposes CCP should bring previous older Nexgear items price down to current standard. If worried about devaluation of previous purchases, just refund the difference in Aurum to owner and I'm sure most will be happy camper. And introduce more clothings/Accessories please. Handbag and hat will be nice. And some bling as well. Do it right, it might even work as a good ISK sink.
I agree. I feel naked without my hat. |
Mouse-Fitzgerald en Cedoulain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.06.26 05:00:00 -
[14] - Quote
Poor judgment implies the ability to foresee the outcome, yeah? How exactly could one foresee such a change? Expecting the unexpected isn't really a valid answer - we should not have to expect some kind of artificial price rigging. That said, this thread is all I know about the issue, so I could be totally off base. |
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
32
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Posted - 2012.06.26 05:44:00 -
[15] - Quote
I logged on as soon as DT in time to cancel a few buy orders, but couldn't dump my inventory so got stuck with a ton of stuff that dropped in value in mere minutes. Despite being a new player and having a good chunk of my ISK from a small stack of cash bought PLEX I am not upset.
I bought PLEX specifically for apparel items, and while I am not sure if some ISK leaked into my other spending I don't have any fancy Navy or faction versions of ships and only have a couple of "01" hardwire implants since I don't want to pay to win, but love the fashion side of the game.
While my Executioner R/G dropped from about a PLEX in value to almost nothing I didn't feel all that bad, since I wasn't intending on selling it more the ISK and was more than willing to spend 400m ISK on it for its value to me, instead of any investment or rarity value. I actually didn't even buy it until I had completed my NEX collection (minus the monocle) and Quafe shirts. The actual ISK value of an item once you have bought it is only a factor if you want to sell it, or think it as a status symbol.
The new pricing schemes are actually great even if my stuff is less valuable. There is no way I could have afforded the ten new items available for my character if they were released at about 3000 AUR a piece, Rather than barely being able to afford a couple items, I ended up buying all ten NEX items for about the price of what I "lost" on the Executor. I understand how this could suck if you bought apparel for the purpose of making money, or if you horded stacks of items, but a general drop in apparel prices should have been anticipated with all the announcements of lower NEX prices.
With 200 items ready to roll I don't know why CCP decided to recycle already released items, and their pricing schemes are cryptic, I still don't know why a Navy colored shirt costs as much as a stack of Olive colored ones, or why the amazing leather skirt wasn't part of the 500 AUR bracket while the Avenue shirts were not in the 100 AUR bracket. Either way I am sure that the skirt will end up selling for more ISK than the Avenues even if more players buy (with AUR) the skirts.
I think what it comes down to is that you shouldn't invest in something that you can't directly enjoy. The apparel market I believe will always be a volatile one especially if things go out of print, and as WiS develops or doesn't. It will always be risky to buy a stack of clothing items for cash reasons especially since graphics can even change and usage might increase or not. Buy clothes to wear, especially the new stuff which is affordable and looks great! |
Tom Hagen
Twilight Empire Blazing Angels Alliance
75
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Posted - 2012.06.26 05:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
One can argue that just by adding a bigger selection of apparel CCP are eroding the value of already existing stock. We can assume the clients that do look for new apparel will remain basically the same, with an increased selection and the fact that new and shiny stuff always will have an attraction there will be fewer people around to buy your cloth.
Same goes for modules and ships. Let say they will tweak or nerf or release a new ship as an alternative to the Drake. Should they compensate every trader that have a stockpile of those?
I hope CCP never will stop to change and improve EVE just because some people would want to preserve it as it is, so that becomes more predictable. It is well with in CCP's right to change and add new content, and yes. Some will be between a rock and a hard place, sorry to say.
In hindsight to have orders up and investing in apparel during a well known patch with changes to the item base in the NEX store, might not have been a good idea. But if one wants to speculate on game changes it is a well known practice. To bad it didn't work out for some of you. In retrospect I missed out on the technetium race, I want a compensation from CCP... |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
819
|
Posted - 2012.06.26 05:51:00 -
[17] - Quote
Mouse-Fitzgerald en Cedoulain wrote:Poor judgment implies the ability to foresee the outcome, yeah? How exactly could one foresee such a change? Expecting the unexpected isn't really a valid answer - we should not have to expect some kind of artificial price rigging. That said, this thread is all I know about the issue, so I could be totally off base. One could foresee this outcome based on what happened with the NEX rollout.
Amazing there is people who weren't expecting a price adjustment and devaluation once the NEX issue was out of player's minds. Keeping the old NEX store items at previous prices was the bigger surprise here.
Note entirely sure why Ishukone cloths would somehow become limited edition, it's not like faction ships BPC's are limited. Something like Pax Ammar on the other hand... 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
32
|
Posted - 2012.06.26 06:03:00 -
[18] - Quote
Yes to those that say it should be foreseen, especially since you can see the images of the 200 if you turn off the filter. Most of the new designs are very similar with a minor color change being the key difference. I have a feeling that the launch NEX items will never be worth their relative AUR prices even if CCP tells us they are worth more. I really doubt any more will actually enter circulation and wouldn't be surprised if classic clothes like the 4000AUR Navy Sterling Blouse drops closer to the much cooler 500 AUR leather version.
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Danari
Invictus Australis Northern Coalition.
3
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Posted - 2012.06.26 07:06:00 -
[19] - Quote
The only successful speculator is the speculator who hasn't yet lost his bankroll. Like visiting the craps table, you succeed until you fail. Fundamentally, there's no way to beat a zero sum game.
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Vaerah Vain
Vahrokh Heavy Industries
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.26 09:24:00 -
[20] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote: Caveat emptor... "All investments involve different degrees of risk. You should be aware of your risk tolerance level and financial situations at all times. Furthermore, you should read all transaction confirmations, monthly, and year-end statements. Read any and all prospectuses carefully before making any investment decisions. You are free at all times to accept or reject all investment recommendations made by the Foo, Inc. All products sold by Foo, Inc. are subject to market risk and may result in the entire loss to the client's investment. (For example: market conditions may result in the depletion of your equity.) Please understand that any losses are attributed to market forces beyond the control or prediction of Foo, Inc. As you know, a recommendation, which you are free to accept or reject, is not a guarantee for the successful performance of an investment and we are expressly prohibited from guaranteeing against losses arising from market conditions."
Excellent. I will add a bit that you'll see in every serious broker's TOS that specifically covers this:
corestwo wrote:As someone else who has been screwed by the illusion of a sandbox, you have my sympathies.
Alpari.co.uk wrote: Risk warning: Forex, spread bets and CFDs are leveraged products. They may not be suitable for you as they carry a high degree of risk to your capital and you can lose more than your initial investment. You should ensure you understand all of the risks.
Your group used Forex-alike strategies and price went your way for a while, then it came back against you in the form of some annoyed CCP personnel. You may still get out with your full stuff but you could also lose it all plus the additional confiscated stuff.
Mouse-Fitzgerald en Cedoulain wrote:Poor judgment implies the ability to foresee the outcome, yeah? How exactly could one foresee such a change? Expecting the unexpected isn't really a valid answer - we should not have to expect some kind of artificial price rigging. That said, this thread is all I know about the issue, so I could be totally off base.
Patches create a lot of shocks, they are akin to RL trading "news releases". All the smart traders close any positions 10 minutes before to 10 minutes past those news. The others usually are left holding the a very short, lighted match. |
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Gregory Brunswick
Flashpoint Industries Imperial Hull Tankers
4
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Posted - 2012.06.26 12:18:00 -
[21] - Quote
It happens. I lost billions in inferno patch after ccp increased meta 4 items after they said there would be no such increase (and have yet to have confirm the increase) |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
501
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Posted - 2012.06.26 13:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
Quote:
Your group used Forex-alike strategies and price went your way for a while, then it came back against you in the form of some annoyed CCP personnel. You may still get out with your full stuff but you could also lose it all plus the additional confiscated stuff.
You are incapable of recognizing jokes, aren't you? . |
Captain IQ
Innocent Traders Ltd
7
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Posted - 2012.06.26 13:51:00 -
[23] - Quote
Vaerah Vain wrote: Patches create a lot of shocks, they are akin to RL trading "news releases". All the smart traders close any positions 10 minutes before to 10 minutes past those news. The others usually are left holding the a very short, lighted match.
ItGÇÖs ok for trading in Eve to sometimes fall foul of CCP tweaks "news releases", if it was too predictable then the rewards wouldnGÇÖt be so great but a direct devaluation of any item without any warning or reason shouldnGÇÖt be ignored especially if youGÇÖre more speculator than trader, we're as much an in-game profession as anyone else.
Thanks but IGÇÖd rather my hard earned ISK wasnGÇÖt washed away down one of CCPGÇÖs ISK Sinks or clumsily thought out patches.
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Tom Hagen
Twilight Empire Blazing Angels Alliance
75
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Posted - 2012.06.26 14:07:00 -
[24] - Quote
And what do people believe would happen to your hard earned ISK if CCP went out and said that they are planning to make changes that will severely devalue your goods?
It would be the exact same effect, but maybe some one else would read the patch note first and cash in, but someone would be stuck with the bill...
I happen to sit on a few thousand modules that currently goes for around a million, if CCP said that they gonna make changes that would make them worth half or a third of its current value. I would panic sell to buy orders, if I was first otherwise someone else would sell to my buy order. It's sucks to be that guy. But its a part of the game and sorry to say not CCP's fault. Unless they decide to not change anything anymore to EVE this will happen again.
Don't invest what you cant afford to lose! |
GreenSeed
61
|
Posted - 2012.06.26 14:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
corestwo wrote:Kara Books wrote:I had a gut feeling about the NEX store when it opened up, Now it seems like their bringing down the prices to actually realistic levels, perhaps items will start selling now, perhaps their paving the way to micro transactions when our guard is down.
Perhaps I should keep my trap shut and not be the first.. but whatever still just a game at the end of the day. No one who was outraged about Incarna was outraged about microtransactions, they were outraged at the possibility of microtransactions for any sort of "play to win" scenario - "gold ammo" or what have you. So basically who cares if they bring in other microtransactions, so long as they're limited to cosmetic **** only. Exactly, the original prices were outrageous, and we all knew they would eventually adjust them (the devblog on incarna actually explained that they would revisit the prices)
I hope they continue to add more cosmetic crap; itGÇÖs fun to buy so long the price tag isnGÇÖt stupid. Clothes, paintjobs, decals, itGÇÖs all good.
But personally, before continuing to add stuff they should add the cosmetic add-ons to killmails and podmails.
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Vaerah Vain
0
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Posted - 2012.06.26 16:39:00 -
[26] - Quote
corestwo wrote:Quote:
Your group used Forex-alike strategies and price went your way for a while, then it came back against you in the form of some annoyed CCP personnel. You may still get out with your full stuff but you could also lose it all plus the additional confiscated stuff.
You are incapable of recognizing jokes, aren't you?
If you would write them in my native tongue I would. Else I don't recognize them, sorry. |
Vaerah Vain
0
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Posted - 2012.06.26 16:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
Captain IQ wrote: but a direct devaluation of any item without any warning or reason shouldnGÇÖt be ignored especially if youGÇÖre more speculator than trader, we're as much an in-game profession as anyone else.
Thanks but IGÇÖd rather my hard earned ISK wasnGÇÖt washed away down one of CCPGÇÖs ISK Sinks or clumsily thought out patches.
Speculators are those who willingly put themselves at huge risk for great rewards. Speculators are supposed to take nasty hits along with the big opportunities. Else they would not be speculators to begin with. |
lafforet
Amarr Royal Trust Bank
13
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:38:00 -
[28] - Quote
When you read this in dev blog: "Existing items from before June 19th will remain in the store, for now, at the current prices so that we donGÇÖt devalue the investment that some players have already made." you would expect that at least after Inferno 1.1. investments in clothing are safe. Well, it was not exactly true.
I personaly did not invest anything in clothing, but I bought some more expensive clothing and I will never buy that stuff again. |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
824
|
Posted - 2012.06.27 06:54:00 -
[29] - Quote
lafforet wrote:When you read this in dev blog: "Existing items from before June 19th will remain in the store, for now, at the current prices so that we donGÇÖt devalue the investment that some players have already made." you would expect that at least after Inferno 1.1. investments in clothing are safe. Well, it was not exactly true. No you wouldn't.
Read the statement carefully, then you'll realize why dumping Ishukone cloths would be the first thing any sane investor would do after reading the dev blog. 84,000 AUR ($420) spent on NeX store for Troll and Profit. |
Private Pineapple
Rifterlings Damu'Khonde
114
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Posted - 2012.06.27 14:25:00 -
[30] - Quote
Rakshasa Taisab wrote:lafforet wrote:When you read this in dev blog: "Existing items from before June 19th will remain in the store, for now, at the current prices so that we donGÇÖt devalue the investment that some players have already made." you would expect that at least after Inferno 1.1. investments in clothing are safe. Well, it was not exactly true. No you wouldn't. Read the statement carefully, then you'll realize why dumping Ishukone cloths would be the first thing any sane investor would do after reading the dev blog.
...? I can't see anything that would be a good signal to dump Ishukone clothes except for the two words: "for now".
You should explain it to us. I am the Kingpin of the Crime and Punishment forum. |
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