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Doddy
Excidium. Executive Outcomes
73
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:45:00 -
[61] - Quote
Freighter logistics is already pretty game breaking for trade and industry, why remove the only real control? |
Copine Callmeknau
Kangaroos With Frickin Lazerbeams Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
200
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:48:00 -
[62] - Quote
Blastcaps Madullier wrote:the only use for a cargo scanner in high-sec is to scan ships to see if what their carrying is worth ganking them for it aka piracy.
No that's not quite right. This is better The only use for a cargo scanner is to scan ships in high-sec to see if what their carrying is worth ganking them for it
So no don't remove it, it's working exactly as intended There should be a rather awesome pic here |
Simetraz
State War Academy Caldari State
415
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:49:00 -
[63] - Quote
Alaya Carrier wrote:
Excuse me, but low sec and 0.0 sec already got an infallible scanner for freigthers.
They pop them and then check what's inside.
Therefore moving the scanner out of hi sec is redundant and inefficient.
Passive Targeting and Cargo Scanners Both are only used in High-sec and both are used for ganking.
And who says CCP doesn't support gankers, otherwise they would have been removed a long time ago. EVERYBODY KNOWS |
Hiram Alexander
Seraphim Securities
241
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:55:00 -
[64] - Quote
Blastcaps Madullier wrote:the only use for a cargo scanner in high-sec is to scan ships to see if what their carrying is worth ganking them for it aka piracy. I disagree. There are certainly other applications for its use, by anyone with enough imagination.
A couple off of the top of my head might be...
Trying to cut-in on someone else's inter-region trade route... Trying to catch/identify the alt-hauler of a corp thief who's still in your corp... Monitoring deployment shipments of an enemy's known npc-alt-haulers...
There's probably tons I haven't thought of, but piracy is just a great use of it, so I vote 'no.' |
Kimmi Chan
Illuminatus Reforged The Revenant Order
165
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Posted - 2012.06.26 22:56:00 -
[65] - Quote
If you have to ask CCP to change something that other people who are engaging in the same activity don't seem to have a problem with, maybe the problem is you. -á"Miners mine so I don't have to." ~Metal Icarus |
Flakey Foont
166
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Posted - 2012.06.26 23:02:00 -
[66] - Quote
So without cargo scanners, pirates would have to gank EVERYBODY to see what they are carrying....
Posting in butthurt thread. |
Daedalus II
The Oasis Group Combat Mining and Logistics
130
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Posted - 2012.06.26 23:13:00 -
[67] - Quote
As someone who have flown my share of freighters I must say that I definitely want the cargo scans to still exist. I'd much rather see the small number of high value hauls being at high risk, than ANY haul being at risk, including pure repositions with empty cargo bay. As it is today it's at least possible to know which risk level you're at. It would be impossible with a bunch of crazies popping freighters to the left and right without knowing what's in them.
I'd rather have an option to booby-trap the cargo (resulting in reduced cargo space which is taken up by the explosives). Then if someone tries to steal any cargo that drops the cargo explodes taking the loot-ship with it. That at least gives you a valid chance to defend your cargo.
There is not much else you can do in a freighter. It WILL take forever to align, even when manually flown and it is impossible to fit a tank, WCSs, or anything at all on it. The absolutely safest thing I know you can do with freighters is to fly manually, have another character webbing you for warp and a second freighter coming after to snatch up any dropped cargo. But come on, that's 3 characters for a job only one should be needed for! Those two others (even if alts) could have been doing something much more useful, such as taking one load each for example. Compared with a PvP fleet it would be the equivalent of always letting 2/3 of the fleet standing by doing nothing. Yeah... that would be effective. No one in their right mind would do that. |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
438
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Posted - 2012.06.26 23:13:00 -
[68] - Quote
Notsureiftroll In irae, veritas. |
Kimmi Chan
Illuminatus Reforged The Revenant Order
165
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Posted - 2012.06.26 23:17:00 -
[69] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Notsureiftroll
We could burn it with fire just to be sure.*
CCP: I in no wish to insinuate that the the person that started this thread nor any other individual on any thread or for that matter any other human being should be burned with fire. Fire is Bad! This post was made to be humorous and should not be taken literally. Thank you.
-á"Miners mine so I don't have to." ~Metal Icarus |
Dr Frust
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
20
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Posted - 2012.06.27 00:57:00 -
[70] - Quote
Be carefull what you wish for. Gankers are a balancing risk/reward factor for haulers. Remove them and ya change the whole profession.
Massive amounts transported due to near 0 risk. Less items destroyed.(Both gankers and haulers) People will savely go afk while making money. Massive impact on economy due to first 3 reasons. All that leads to a boring and increasingly less profitable hauling profession while almost destroying the ganking profession. If ya wanna change something it either needs to add to the game or have noticable effect on ccps wallet.
Gankers already risk getting no loot because of a chance that the victim survives or the loot gets destroyed. Haulers have a nice repertoire of measures to not get caught. Adding 'this' will destroy suicide ganking as we know it.
So here is a clear no from me. Though I'd be ok with shuttles, frigs and destroyers beeing unscannable, because everyday I see a rookie getting blown up with a bunch of plex in the cargohold, poor souls. |
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Kimmi Chan
Illuminatus Reforged The Revenant Order
168
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Posted - 2012.06.27 01:31:00 -
[71] - Quote
Dr Frust wrote:Be carefull what you wish for. Gankers are a balancing risk/reward factor for haulers. Remove them and ya change the whole profession.
Massive amounts transported due to near 0 risk. Less items destroyed.(Both gankers and haulers) People will savely go afk while making money. Massive impact on economy due to first 3 reasons. All that leads to a boring and increasingly less profitable hauling profession while almost destroying the ganking profession. If ya wanna change something it either needs to add to the game or have noticable effect on ccps wallet.
Gankers already risk getting no loot because of a chance that the victim survives or the loot gets destroyed. Haulers have a nice repertoire of measures to not get caught. Adding 'this' will destroy suicide ganking as we know it.
So here is a clear no from me. Though I'd be ok with shuttles, frigs and destroyers beeing unscannable, because everyday I see a rookie getting blown up with a bunch of plex in the cargohold, poor souls.
Actually I see the consequences of a change like this encouraging the gankers to shoot EVERYTHING. Those gankers are a crafty and bold bunch - if you take away the tool that lets them be sure about the target then EVERYTHING becomes a target.
-á"Miners mine so I don't have to." ~Metal Icarus |
RAP ACTION HERO
116
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Posted - 2012.06.27 01:52:00 -
[72] - Quote
heh look at the gank victims using risk vs rewards and you know in RL blah blah |
Delen Ormand
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2012.06.27 01:59:00 -
[73] - Quote
Blastcaps Madullier wrote:Morganta wrote:I don't see this as a valid solution to your problem
you could try any number of things people do to make it harder on the scanner like not APing around with expensive cargo
while you try and level the risk playing field you actually lessen your risk at the expense of the other player what problem? I dont fly a freighter so I dont have a problem lol, and changing cargo scanners to NOT be usable in HS means the gankers have to take the risk the freighter they gank might not have anything or enough to cover their losses as apposed to the almost gurrentied payout from using a cargo scanner, locating a freighter carrying not only enough to cover their losses but also make them a profit.
Lots of no. The mechanics around suicide ganking need a change, but this isn't the way to do it. The fix won't be found in denying people options, it 'll be found in making ganks require more skill. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
161
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:02:00 -
[74] - Quote
I think it would be better to lower the base cargohold on freighters and add low slots, so that the resulting max cargohold size is the same as before, as is the max HP, but if you are willing to give up some room, you can take more damage.
Cargo scanners are great pirate tools to decide who's worth ganking. It's up to the hauler to not carry enough to be worth ganking in whatever they're flying. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
161
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:05:00 -
[75] - Quote
Doddy wrote:Freighter logistics is already pretty game breaking for trade and industry, why remove the only real control? Care to explain just how it's game breaking? You can't even raise a freighter's resistances. It'll take damage faster than anything else, even a shuttle. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens |
Delen Ormand
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:05:00 -
[76] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I think it would be better to lower the base cargohold and add low slots, so that the resulting max cargohold size is the same as before, as is the max HP, but if you are willing to give up some room, you can take more damage.
You already have the option to trade expanded cargoholds for armor. Unless there's a problem caused by having all current slots filled with expanders or all with armor, I don't see why adding more lows is necessary?
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Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
15
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:07:00 -
[77] - Quote
Speaking as a member of an alliance often seem as the spearhead of carebears in highsec and being myself forbidden any form of ganking I say....
hell no.
Ganking is part of the game and i do not currently see an imbalance between risk/reward. |
Stukkler Tian
Haggis Humpers
6
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:14:00 -
[78] - Quote
Blastcaps Madullier wrote: IRL if the police saw a group of people sat outside a bank in a car and their all known and have records for violent armed robberys of banks they'd take action to remove said bank robbers, so again WHY do faction navys and concord allow known gankers to sit on gates with impunity doing nothing to move them on etc? :)
Because most people playing a game would rather be the bank robber and not the bank teller. nothing is broken here. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
161
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:16:00 -
[79] - Quote
Delen Ormand wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I think it would be better to lower the base cargohold on freighters and add low slots, so that the resulting max cargohold size is the same as before, as is the max HP, but if you are willing to give up some room, you can take more damage. You already have the option to trade expanded cargoholds for armor. Unless there's a problem caused by having all current slots filled with expanders or all with armor, I don't see why adding more lows is necessary? Freighters don't have low slots. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
973
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:27:00 -
[80] - Quote
Hey pubbies, you know how in those other threads, you claim to not "get" why people gank highsec players?
It's threads like this. I don't even PVP that much and even I want to ram a Talos down the op's throat just out of principal. |
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Delen Ormand
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:43:00 -
[81] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Delen Ormand wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I think it would be better to lower the base cargohold on freighters and add low slots, so that the resulting max cargohold size is the same as before, as is the max HP, but if you are willing to give up some room, you can take more damage. You already have the option to trade expanded cargoholds for armor. Unless there's a problem caused by having all current slots filled with expanders or all with armor, I don't see why adding more lows is necessary? Freighters don't have low slots.
Ah yeah, apologies, I was thinking of my industrial rather than a freighter. Almost 4am here, I'll take this as my cue to go sleep :)
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Pix Severus
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:53:00 -
[82] - Quote
I actually find it quite exciting to know that a pirate may or may not be scanning my cargohold, and then assessing whether it's worth attacking me or not.
It's little things like this that add a little extra spice to the game, and it's something I would definitley not want to see removed. |
Tobias Durandal
Wings of Redemption Black Flag Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.06.27 04:31:00 -
[83] - Quote
I feel like a broken record here.
Hire security or recruit some.
There are loads of dudes with guns out there who'd love to get paid to make you a really unappealing target.
See how easily I fixed your problem for you without changing mechanics?
__________ |..Where......| |...You.........| |....Make......| ----> Where you really should be coming up with ideas. |....Ideas......| ------------------ |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1129
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Posted - 2012.06.27 04:49:00 -
[84] - Quote
Pix Severus wrote:I actually find it quite exciting to know that a pirate may or may not be scanning my cargohold, and then assessing whether it's worth attacking me or not.
It's little things like this that add a little extra spice to the game, and it's something I would definitley not want to see removed. And when a freighter with far too many plex gets blown up as you're warping away, it's a nice reminder that EVE is dangerous if you are a moron. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
139
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:00:00 -
[85] - Quote
Blastcaps Madullier wrote:Morganta wrote:I don't see this as a valid solution to your problem
you could try any number of things people do to make it harder on the scanner like not APing around with expensive cargo
while you try and level the risk playing field you actually lessen your risk at the expense of the other player what problem? I dont fly a freighter so I dont have a problem lol, and changing cargo scanners to NOT be usable in HS means the gankers have to take the risk the freighter they gank might not have anything or enough to cover their losses as apposed to the almost gurrentied payout from using a cargo scanner, locating a freighter carrying not only enough to cover their losses but also make them a profit. If you don't fly freighters then one would have to ask wtf do you care for?
One would have to come to the conclusion that an individual would only be bringing this up if they were actually effected by it. It would seem rather moronic to have issue with something that doesn't effect effect you.
And no. Stupid idea is whining. |
InternetSpaceship
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:09:00 -
[86] - Quote
That's the ticket! More nerfs! Make Highsec pvp free! CCP, I don't want to play this ******* game, so please, just nerf everyone else who does. Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.
If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.-á If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you. |
InternetSpaceship
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:25:00 -
[87] - Quote
Jonni Favorite wrote:THE L0CK wrote:Blastcaps Madullier wrote: WHY do faction navys and concord tolerate KNOWN gankers sitting on gates? IRL if the police saw a group of people sat outside a bank in a car and their all known and have records for violent armed robberys of banks they'd take action to remove said bank robbers, so again WHY do faction navys and concord allow known gankers to sit on gates with impunity doing nothing to move them on etc? :)
Really? I've never seen police just take down people for sitting somewhere. I mean if that were the case I would never be able to stop my vehicle as I'm a repeat parking ticket offender. But then again maybe you live in Russia or something where they just steal you off the streets. Just how often do the police sit around a bank taking photographs of people in cars, downloading the picture to their computer, and running a scan? Do they do this for other crimes as well? Maybe scope out the old man sitting at a bench in the park because he just may be a child molester rather than somebody who is just enjoying a day in the park. Better watch that person at the gas station who is buying a snickers because he could have made a counterfeit bill there. Whats it like living in Minority Report? You need to get out more, this happens all the time in US.
He also failed to take into account that bank robbers are very rarely in possession of nuclear weaponry and FTL drives. Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.
If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.-á If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you. |
InternetSpaceship
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:38:00 -
[88] - Quote
[quote=reamau]Quote:
I have no problem with "hi-sec isn't safe", but I'd like kill rights for a month on every pilot that looted my wreck as well.
You know, that actually does seem reasonable, aside from the looter part. Some day old rookie is just as likely to loot your wreck, and they'd have no idea why you were attacking them.
It would make ganking more dangerous with longer lasting consequences. I'd even go so far as to agree that serial gankers should be attackable without provocation or CONCORD recourse in highsec systems. Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.
If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.-á If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you. |
InternetSpaceship
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:46:00 -
[89] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote: People engaging in unsanctioned, murderous violence for violence's sake wouldn't be welcome in a sane society except as entertainment or as a cash cow for therapists and psychologists to milk.
On Earth, yes. New Eden is intended to be untamed and wild. Even Highsec is dangerous and full of a lot of unsavory types. A lot of things fly there that wouldn't on Earth, because the system is inherently more loose and thus less stable than what we have here on Earth.
Apples and Oranges. Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.
If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.-á If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you. |
Steve Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
2
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Posted - 2012.06.27 05:52:00 -
[90] - Quote
THE L0CK wrote:Blastcaps Madullier wrote:
Really? I've never seen police just take down people for sitting somewhere.
unfortunatly I have. Its still way too comon around here that you get pulled over for the offence of Driveing while Black/Hispanic. the alfabet soup of police departments IA units still has its hands full trying to weed that crap out even now. |
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